WEBVTT - I Fix The Problem | Jay Malkoun

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<v Speaker 1>Approache Production. Welcome to Secrets of the Underworld. I am

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<v Speaker 1>Neil the Muscle comments and in this episode I speak

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<v Speaker 1>with former Underweld figure and standover man Jay mal Kuhn.

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<v Speaker 2>We preferred not to kill you. We will do it,

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<v Speaker 2>but we won't be happy about it. But you know

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<v Speaker 2>the consequences being in jail to you, I said, committee,

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<v Speaker 2>you must pay. It isn't a fucking around him. I'm

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<v Speaker 2>not leaving without my money. But to get a taser

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<v Speaker 2>and knife, some gaffer tape, and I had to turn

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<v Speaker 2>nothing into a weapon. So if anyone was going to

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<v Speaker 2>have a problem, that would have been there, not me.

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<v Speaker 2>There's nothing more rewarded than not in some.

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<v Speaker 3>Jay, thank you for coming in.

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<v Speaker 1>Thanks having me when I when I seen your book

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<v Speaker 1>come out, I wanted to approach you, and I thought

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<v Speaker 1>I'd let you do your thing first because you are

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<v Speaker 1>promoting it and I'm glad. I was reached out by

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<v Speaker 1>one of your friends and he wanted to get me

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<v Speaker 1>to get you on my show, and I was.

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<v Speaker 3>I was keen as to get you on. But we'll

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<v Speaker 3>start off.

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<v Speaker 1>With you as a person before all all the heavy

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<v Speaker 1>ship that happened, but you growing up and tell me

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<v Speaker 1>about you, and then we'll get into the nitty gritty

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<v Speaker 1>of everything.

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<v Speaker 2>Oh it's not that exciting, believe me, it will be.

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<v Speaker 2>But you know, we grew up in the housing commision area.

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<v Speaker 2>All the parents were all the kids were left to

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<v Speaker 2>run a mark. Most families had four to six to

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<v Speaker 2>ten kids, predominantly boys, and I know we all played up.

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<v Speaker 2>I wasn't any I wasn't unique. I was just one

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<v Speaker 2>of many. I used to have to run home when

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<v Speaker 2>I was younger to avoid getting bashed. So I discovered

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<v Speaker 2>that you can bash back. Wow. Yeah, And it happened

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<v Speaker 2>one day. There were two of us running and avoid

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<v Speaker 2>a little gang, and he got left behind. Go on.

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<v Speaker 2>I think that must have been about nine. So I

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<v Speaker 2>ran back and picked up it. They used to have

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<v Speaker 2>house These have trees in front of every home, and

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<v Speaker 2>these pickets told them together and there was one lane

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<v Speaker 2>on the ground. So I just slipped that up and

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<v Speaker 2>fucking attacked him with it. I got an amazing response.

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<v Speaker 2>They shot himselves and around. I discovered that you can

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<v Speaker 2>fight back.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it was great, very liberating.

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<v Speaker 1>What did you grow?

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<v Speaker 2>Reservoir? Patridge Prison was full of kids from Reservoir and

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<v Speaker 2>Coburg literally full of them. Valley Street, Winter Crescent was

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<v Speaker 2>all always banging on. You know. My dad used to

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<v Speaker 2>stand at the front of the at that gate, waiting

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<v Speaker 2>for us to come home, to see if we had

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<v Speaker 2>fights and torn clothes and bloodied and if we were

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<v Speaker 2>we were in trouble. If we came home normal, we

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<v Speaker 2>were okay. He didn't like, he didn't condone us playing up.

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<v Speaker 2>But no, it was just it was just the environment

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<v Speaker 2>schooling for you. I struggled. I started when I went

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<v Speaker 2>to school when I started schooling and speak English, so

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<v Speaker 2>I struggled, always struggled. But I mean I enjoyed it.

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<v Speaker 2>I went to every class even though I couldn't really

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<v Speaker 2>read well, I'd still stood up in the class and

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<v Speaker 2>did my best. I was never embarrassed to humiliated. I

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<v Speaker 2>just did my best. I guess I didn't know any better.

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<v Speaker 2>What was it?

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<v Speaker 1>What was your goal when your left school?

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<v Speaker 3>What did you want?

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<v Speaker 2>To be a policeman?

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<v Speaker 1>Really?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah?

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<v Speaker 1>Fuck me?

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah that doesn't saying around.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah No, I actually applied to be a cup when

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<v Speaker 2>I was seventeen and I couldn't fill up the phone properly,

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<v Speaker 2>so I was rejected.

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<v Speaker 1>So that's that's all stopped you. Otherwise would have been

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<v Speaker 1>a cop.

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<v Speaker 2>Probably would have been a crup cup. That would have

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<v Speaker 2>been a cop. I would have fucked that ship up right,

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<v Speaker 2>give me your money, don't tell me.

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<v Speaker 1>One fucked up. I didn't know that.

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<v Speaker 2>No, I don't know. It's a vass. But that was

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<v Speaker 2>actually my first application. It was like the when when

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<v Speaker 2>you were at that age, there wasn't many options. Was

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<v Speaker 2>if you're academically not right, you can't you know, you're

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<v Speaker 2>not going to be an accountant or a lawyer, or

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<v Speaker 2>you're they're going to drive a fucking bus or apply

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<v Speaker 2>for something that you may you maybe be good at.

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<v Speaker 2>So I thought just trying the police force that I

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<v Speaker 2>think I was just seventeen at the time. That paperwork,

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<v Speaker 2>and I was promptly rejected, and.

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<v Speaker 3>You didn't want to apply again. You just forgot it.

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<v Speaker 2>That Nah, that was just tick that box and move on.

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<v Speaker 1>Is that was that what you thought after that?

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<v Speaker 2>Not at all? Look, I never I was. I was

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<v Speaker 2>really a good kid mate like became My parents were

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<v Speaker 2>really good without religious people and right from wrong and

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<v Speaker 2>don't steal and don't take what's not your usual. That

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<v Speaker 2>was that's how we all were. Yeah, I fell into

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<v Speaker 2>crime because I just did you know, it happened to

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<v Speaker 2>be at the right place or the wrong place at

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<v Speaker 2>the right time, at the wrong time, and I made

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<v Speaker 2>a decision. I went that way.

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<v Speaker 1>How how did your parents feel when they when they

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<v Speaker 1>know that you were involved in the underworld and that

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<v Speaker 1>kind of stuff, did they did they change towards you?

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<v Speaker 2>No? No, they didn't know you kept a secret phone.

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<v Speaker 2>It wasn't It wasn't a regular activity. It was very rare.

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<v Speaker 2>It wasn't like, but.

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<v Speaker 3>Where do we get around that?

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<v Speaker 1>What you know, what your son's doing? This is who

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<v Speaker 1>your son's hanging around with?

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<v Speaker 2>That there wasn't. I wasn't hanging out with anyone. I

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<v Speaker 2>was hooked in with the triads. Rides were overseas. My

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<v Speaker 2>contacts were in Sydney. I lived in Melbourne. I drove

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<v Speaker 2>lumpy cars. Because I developed a property at the edge

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<v Speaker 2>of twenty, I entus strayed at twenty one. I I

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<v Speaker 2>validated what I was my spending. I justified it so sweet.

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<v Speaker 2>I was a little fucking on entrepreneur. My parents are

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<v Speaker 2>very proud.

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<v Speaker 1>So okay, so you've got them back from police. So

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<v Speaker 1>what what? What was your next line to go down? Where

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<v Speaker 1>did you go from me?

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<v Speaker 2>At that time I was I had started doing training

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<v Speaker 2>take one day, at the edge of five. We were

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<v Speaker 2>like they were the Bruce Ley days. Me and the

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<v Speaker 2>rest of the world were taken about Bruce Ley. We

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<v Speaker 2>all wanted to be Bruce Lay. I wanted to be

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<v Speaker 2>band Wow. Yeah, of course younger than me. That So

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<v Speaker 2>when I was sixth day and I met the Lacey brothers.

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<v Speaker 2>There were twin brothers from Hong Kong and they had

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<v Speaker 2>an academy in Perth. They wanted to open up in

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<v Speaker 2>Melbourne and somebody introduced me to them. We started training

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<v Speaker 2>in the park every day. So at that age I

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<v Speaker 2>was right into martial arts and I was training to

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<v Speaker 2>fight in the sixth International Martial Arts Invitation Tournament in Macau,

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<v Speaker 2>so that that totally consumed me. So we did that.

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<v Speaker 2>That's when I when I turned Just before I turned

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<v Speaker 2>out in there was a bit of a hiccup with

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<v Speaker 2>a gun and some lebows and some bouncers that I diffused.

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<v Speaker 2>Just that I just happened to be there and the

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<v Speaker 2>security offered me a job and so I started doing

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<v Speaker 2>store work, which was great. Yourself, there's nothing more rewarding

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<v Speaker 2>than looking some catch out.

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<v Speaker 1>I usually go to work to hope and I was

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<v Speaker 1>going to knock somebody up. That's what you used to

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<v Speaker 1>go to work for it. It was like he'll give

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<v Speaker 1>you a high.

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<v Speaker 3>You know what I mean, You're to be trouble.

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<v Speaker 2>I loved it. I was like, fuck girls and fucking

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<v Speaker 2>comes out. I'd go home and play in bed under

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<v Speaker 2>we live it in my head. I did by public.

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<v Speaker 2>I worked at very rough places, so it was on

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<v Speaker 2>all night. It would be fucking You'd have at least

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<v Speaker 2>three or four dust ups, probably be up to eight.

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<v Speaker 2>And it was really good. We loved it. And I

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<v Speaker 2>worked with really good blokes, really good solid blakes that

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<v Speaker 2>could bang it on.

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<v Speaker 3>Yeah, some working the How long did you went the doors.

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<v Speaker 2>For until I discovered money? Eighten to twenty?

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<v Speaker 3>So what came first?

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<v Speaker 2>You like?

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<v Speaker 1>Did did the motorcycle game come first?

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<v Speaker 3>After this? What came from? Where? Where did that come from?

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<v Speaker 2>Now? The minorcycle came way after this? Like we had

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<v Speaker 2>bouncing coat dealing person for ten years, got out, then

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<v Speaker 2>we had the underworld killings for about ten years. Then

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<v Speaker 2>I got hooked into some mining groups. Seen that has

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<v Speaker 2>some big problems. So it was resolving, and they they

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<v Speaker 2>kept me on full time and then we did the

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<v Speaker 2>biking stuff. I was up with them for five years

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<v Speaker 2>and then I jumped up with the commos. Yeah, well

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<v Speaker 2>I still looked after the mining goes.

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<v Speaker 3>You went to the corporate world of money for what.

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<v Speaker 2>Okay, So this is what happened. A friend of mine

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<v Speaker 2>is in the book. He had a little problem with

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<v Speaker 2>some coffin cheatters in perth Yep. So he called me

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<v Speaker 2>up and said, ah, what do we do. I said,

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<v Speaker 2>let's get on a plane and go and see him. Brother.

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<v Speaker 2>So he rang out there mutual in Perth ye and

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<v Speaker 2>said we're coming in the morning, going to sort this

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<v Speaker 2>shit out because I wanted their way to break his

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<v Speaker 2>legs apparently and anyway, and then you know, I got

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<v Speaker 2>involved and it was diffused quite quickly, and he was

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<v Speaker 2>very he's very successful dude, and he's very willing too.

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<v Speaker 2>By the way, he didn't he didn't actually need me.

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<v Speaker 2>He could stand on his own two feed, but was

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<v Speaker 2>a lot easier with me. And he's back in this corner.

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<v Speaker 2>So from there he wanted me to go on tour

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<v Speaker 2>with him, because although the problem was solved, that wasn't

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<v Speaker 2>completely solved. He wanted to be close by, so we

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<v Speaker 2>went to London where we met his partner. His partner

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<v Speaker 2>had a similar problem with the coffin cheaters, but this

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<v Speaker 2>was a two hunch, a mean dollar problem, right, and

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<v Speaker 2>my mother may goes, well, let ja sort it out.

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<v Speaker 2>And this is my first exposure to this sort of money.

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<v Speaker 2>And these kinds were getting fucking drunk one hunter old

0:09:05.641 --> 0:09:07.721
<v Speaker 2>Scotch and to be honest that there wasn't paying that

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<v Speaker 2>much fucking attention. But you know, my mate said, let

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<v Speaker 2>him sort of that. He goes, oh, can he do it?

0:09:13.121 --> 0:09:15.041
<v Speaker 2>He goes, yeah, of course you can. And then my

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<v Speaker 2>mate asked me, got draw up a little one pager

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<v Speaker 2>saying for services as requested a million dollars cash or

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<v Speaker 2>US dollars and sixteen million shares and sixty men uppies

0:09:27.721 --> 0:09:30.121
<v Speaker 2>to resolve this issue. The shares were training at seventy

0:09:30.161 --> 0:09:32.481
<v Speaker 2>two cents at the time. It was about a seven

0:09:32.521 --> 0:09:35.521
<v Speaker 2>eight million dollars deal. Said quickly, taps up in the

0:09:35.521 --> 0:09:38.521
<v Speaker 2>business center, hands it to him. He fucking through it

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<v Speaker 2>out the window. He was drunk at The window was

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<v Speaker 2>a balcony, so my mate jumped out the window and

0:09:44.601 --> 0:09:46.041
<v Speaker 2>grabbed it and gave it back to him, so he

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<v Speaker 2>signed it and off he went. He transferred the me

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<v Speaker 2>into his account, which I saw part of. By the way,

0:09:53.521 --> 0:09:55.761
<v Speaker 2>he was getting half everything. And then I flew the

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<v Speaker 2>Perth and caught up with the cheats who are mate's

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<v Speaker 2>of mine, and another fellow over there, junk is On,

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<v Speaker 2>and we worked it out. It was all resolved. I

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<v Speaker 2>got paid.

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<v Speaker 1>So so now have you already got that reputation already

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<v Speaker 1>for who you you are?

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<v Speaker 2>Well? The thing is, I was incarcerated in Pantridge for

0:10:14.681 --> 0:10:18.921
<v Speaker 2>ten years. It's a make some security for yeah. Out

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<v Speaker 2>of that ten years, I probably did nine months out

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<v Speaker 2>in other jails. They couldn't they couldn't have come at

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<v Speaker 2>me anywhere else. So I did have and know I

0:10:28.121 --> 0:10:31.321
<v Speaker 2>was known. I was known. You know, we did things.

0:10:31.761 --> 0:10:33.481
<v Speaker 2>You'd have to do things. You know, you got to

0:10:33.521 --> 0:10:35.921
<v Speaker 2>tool up and you gotta you can't sit on the fence.

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<v Speaker 2>If someone sucking around, you just have to put a

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<v Speaker 2>hold on them, you know how it is. Right, So

0:10:40.881 --> 0:10:42.401
<v Speaker 2>by the time I got out of prison, I was

0:10:42.561 --> 0:10:45.481
<v Speaker 2>very well known. So it was it wasn't hard for

0:10:45.481 --> 0:10:48.001
<v Speaker 2>me to get things, get people to agree or comply.

0:10:48.801 --> 0:10:51.321
<v Speaker 3>It's still not yeah, you still got that power.

0:10:51.841 --> 0:10:52.601
<v Speaker 2>We do all right now.

0:10:54.641 --> 0:10:58.521
<v Speaker 1>When you were in Penbridge jail, there is there is

0:10:58.721 --> 0:11:01.121
<v Speaker 1>a kind of quote there that you did some deal

0:11:01.961 --> 0:11:02.721
<v Speaker 1>with chop a read.

0:11:03.281 --> 0:11:04.641
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, it wasn't a deal. It was going to knock

0:11:04.721 --> 0:11:08.681
<v Speaker 2>some can some deal. It's just doing work, bro So

0:11:09.121 --> 0:11:11.721
<v Speaker 2>who you going to know? We're at war for about

0:11:11.721 --> 0:11:14.481
<v Speaker 2>seven years with a different team. And yeah, they come

0:11:14.521 --> 0:11:16.081
<v Speaker 2>and they go. When you can get your hands on him,

0:11:16.081 --> 0:11:19.881
<v Speaker 2>to get your hands on them. Like one particular time,

0:11:19.921 --> 0:11:23.121
<v Speaker 2>I was in another prison, another maximum security prison, and

0:11:23.121 --> 0:11:25.041
<v Speaker 2>one of them came back through the system, and I

0:11:25.041 --> 0:11:27.441
<v Speaker 2>had a friend of mine in that division. So I

0:11:27.521 --> 0:11:31.041
<v Speaker 2>rang my lawyer, the PA, I said, ring the prison

0:11:31.201 --> 0:11:33.761
<v Speaker 2>and ask him to give Lenny a message to call

0:11:33.801 --> 0:11:37.281
<v Speaker 2>this lawyer at one o'clock and give your number, which

0:11:37.321 --> 0:11:39.401
<v Speaker 2>she did, and then I drank at one o'clock and

0:11:39.441 --> 0:11:41.321
<v Speaker 2>she joined us, and I said, Lenny, this counts in

0:11:41.361 --> 0:11:44.801
<v Speaker 2>your division, broke and sort him out. So lennenly promptly

0:11:45.041 --> 0:11:47.321
<v Speaker 2>went and got a big fucking bit of steal and

0:11:47.401 --> 0:11:49.201
<v Speaker 2>ran in the cell and iron barred him. You get

0:11:49.241 --> 0:11:51.681
<v Speaker 2>shit done. This other count who was in the system,

0:11:51.681 --> 0:11:54.481
<v Speaker 2>but he was in Chopper's water h division can't get

0:11:54.481 --> 0:11:57.241
<v Speaker 2>to him, impossible to get to him. They get one

0:11:57.241 --> 0:12:01.641
<v Speaker 2>hour exercise a day. But I had a plan. I

0:12:01.721 --> 0:12:05.241
<v Speaker 2>wanted to muck this camp chopper gives him their milk

0:12:05.281 --> 0:12:06.921
<v Speaker 2>in their breakfasts and their food every day. He was

0:12:06.961 --> 0:12:10.001
<v Speaker 2>the billet so and I need the kitchen staff. So

0:12:10.041 --> 0:12:12.841
<v Speaker 2>we got some poison to put in the milk to

0:12:12.921 --> 0:12:16.241
<v Speaker 2>deliver to him. They can't have relied on to get

0:12:16.281 --> 0:12:19.201
<v Speaker 2>the poison. Got us a dad. So the whole thing

0:12:19.201 --> 0:12:21.241
<v Speaker 2>didn't work. But we did it. We actually we actually

0:12:21.601 --> 0:12:26.321
<v Speaker 2>did it. Just didn't work, you know as it well

0:12:26.361 --> 0:12:28.041
<v Speaker 2>as a way blood.

0:12:28.121 --> 0:12:31.201
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, So the times that you've been in there, the

0:12:31.361 --> 0:12:33.081
<v Speaker 1>likes of like Chop I Red. You just spoke about

0:12:33.121 --> 0:12:35.081
<v Speaker 1>Carl when he was in the mccallo. Were you around

0:12:35.121 --> 0:12:37.361
<v Speaker 1>it and when all the all the ship was happening

0:12:37.441 --> 0:12:40.161
<v Speaker 1>at that time in Melbourne or you were you out

0:12:40.201 --> 0:12:41.441
<v Speaker 1>of there and doing other things?

0:12:42.161 --> 0:12:45.081
<v Speaker 2>We mean when they're all the births getting knocked. Yeah,

0:12:45.401 --> 0:12:47.681
<v Speaker 2>but that was the ti tat thing going on. But

0:12:47.761 --> 0:12:50.281
<v Speaker 2>didn't involve you, No, No, he kept out of it. Well,

0:12:50.441 --> 0:12:51.081
<v Speaker 2>nothing to do with me.

0:12:51.361 --> 0:12:53.401
<v Speaker 1>Yeah, if you didn't get no one tried to draw

0:12:53.441 --> 0:12:53.761
<v Speaker 1>you in.

0:12:55.961 --> 0:12:58.961
<v Speaker 2>I look someone asked me to do something, to get involved,

0:12:58.961 --> 0:13:01.081
<v Speaker 2>but I knew both sides. Yeah, so I just stayed

0:13:01.201 --> 0:13:03.721
<v Speaker 2>sat on the fence, but not my business. I knew

0:13:03.761 --> 0:13:06.161
<v Speaker 2>a lot of those guys that were and we're good blogs,

0:13:06.641 --> 0:13:09.321
<v Speaker 2>I mean most of them. But that is what it is.

0:13:09.441 --> 0:13:10.761
<v Speaker 2>You know, you live by the swords.

0:13:11.921 --> 0:13:15.201
<v Speaker 1>You've seen Sydney and you've seen Melbourne. You've been probably

0:13:15.241 --> 0:13:18.321
<v Speaker 1>over states too. Who do you think I'm gonna I'm

0:13:18.361 --> 0:13:20.921
<v Speaker 1>gonna say this the real deal, the real you've got.

0:13:20.961 --> 0:13:21.561
<v Speaker 3>You've got a lot of.

0:13:21.601 --> 0:13:25.161
<v Speaker 1>Underworld in different states here, all right, who's the real deal?

0:13:26.601 --> 0:13:30.081
<v Speaker 2>This is a tricky question because anyone could pay someone

0:13:30.121 --> 0:13:30.921
<v Speaker 2>of these unber.

0:13:31.201 --> 0:13:33.521
<v Speaker 1>Yeah I understand that, but but that But you know,

0:13:33.721 --> 0:13:35.481
<v Speaker 1>you see what's going on in Melbourne, you see what's

0:13:35.521 --> 0:13:37.841
<v Speaker 1>going on Sydney. You can see what goes on in

0:13:37.921 --> 0:13:40.561
<v Speaker 1>over States. But you know, I look at it and

0:13:40.561 --> 0:13:42.601
<v Speaker 1>go like, fuck, Melbourne's.

0:13:42.481 --> 0:13:44.481
<v Speaker 2>Pretty harsh, you know what I mean, We bang it on,

0:13:45.001 --> 0:13:46.681
<v Speaker 2>bang it on here. I mean they're very quick to

0:13:46.721 --> 0:13:50.081
<v Speaker 2>react here. If I have to compare, i'd say Sydney

0:13:50.281 --> 0:13:54.321
<v Speaker 2>more reactive, definitely, most Like they don't fuck around here

0:13:54.881 --> 0:13:57.081
<v Speaker 2>in Melbourne. Nine times out of tennant can be resolved

0:13:57.721 --> 0:14:00.761
<v Speaker 2>again is probably the last option. But here they're just

0:14:01.961 --> 0:14:03.081
<v Speaker 2>sure they don't fuck around here.

0:14:03.121 --> 0:14:05.361
<v Speaker 1>But you think you think, you think the old school

0:14:05.361 --> 0:14:05.961
<v Speaker 1>system's gone.

0:14:05.961 --> 0:14:09.361
<v Speaker 2>Now everything evolves, you know, we've gone from black and

0:14:09.401 --> 0:14:12.601
<v Speaker 2>white to color. Yeah, everything evolves even now, Like the

0:14:12.641 --> 0:14:16.321
<v Speaker 2>amount of money evolved is massive as the how do

0:14:16.321 --> 0:14:18.841
<v Speaker 2>you resist that? Yeah, the earth of these young guys

0:14:18.881 --> 0:14:22.881
<v Speaker 2>that are you know, come from not much offered a

0:14:22.961 --> 0:14:25.081
<v Speaker 2>men or two to do it quicker, and I mean

0:14:25.121 --> 0:14:27.121
<v Speaker 2>it's very hard to and all these kids are willing

0:14:27.641 --> 0:14:29.921
<v Speaker 2>for some real I think all this exposure to the

0:14:29.961 --> 0:14:33.441
<v Speaker 2>Internet and all this exposure of violence on your phone,

0:14:33.641 --> 0:14:37.161
<v Speaker 2>they're sort of numbing people to consequences and the reality

0:14:37.161 --> 0:14:39.361
<v Speaker 2>of what's going on. I was never exposed to that,

0:14:40.041 --> 0:14:42.121
<v Speaker 2>so I can't imagine what this youth are going through

0:14:42.121 --> 0:14:44.001
<v Speaker 2>and how they're dealing with it. I suppose you they

0:14:44.081 --> 0:14:47.281
<v Speaker 2>embrace it where you shy away from it. But Sydney

0:14:47.321 --> 0:14:50.121
<v Speaker 2>is definitely a very serious date. I'd have to say,

0:14:50.361 --> 0:14:52.681
<v Speaker 2>if you're going to compare to answer that question, the

0:14:52.761 --> 0:14:55.761
<v Speaker 2>real the realer deal would have to be Sydney. You

0:14:55.801 --> 0:15:02.601
<v Speaker 2>go to the Winners West. We admit it. We prefer

0:15:02.761 --> 0:15:05.401
<v Speaker 2>not to kill you. We will do it. We won't

0:15:05.401 --> 0:15:06.281
<v Speaker 2>be happy about it.

0:15:08.881 --> 0:15:10.441
<v Speaker 3>You also liked God Honor.

0:15:10.641 --> 0:15:13.921
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. Yeah, my first club when I was twenty twenty

0:15:14.361 --> 0:15:18.201
<v Speaker 2>three was that I loved it a lot of fun. Yeah.

0:15:18.441 --> 0:15:19.881
<v Speaker 1>Was it just that, I think at the time to

0:15:20.361 --> 0:15:23.841
<v Speaker 1>get into the night life scene or would you not

0:15:23.841 --> 0:15:24.561
<v Speaker 1>get into it now?

0:15:24.881 --> 0:15:28.121
<v Speaker 2>No, the thing was because I started security today changing anything.

0:15:28.161 --> 0:15:31.081
<v Speaker 2>I actually knew anything. I understood well, I understood the door,

0:15:31.361 --> 0:15:32.921
<v Speaker 2>comparing it under there was money out of the bar,

0:15:33.041 --> 0:15:35.201
<v Speaker 2>and you could make money from night club so I'd

0:15:35.241 --> 0:15:37.121
<v Speaker 2>worked in them for a couple of years, so there

0:15:37.161 --> 0:15:40.001
<v Speaker 2>was a natural progression for us. And it wasn't it.

0:15:40.441 --> 0:15:42.241
<v Speaker 2>I wasn't just me as my brothers and we all

0:15:42.281 --> 0:15:44.401
<v Speaker 2>chipped in. We didn't have It wasn't big money. It

0:15:44.441 --> 0:15:46.921
<v Speaker 2>was like us eighty ninety thousand dollars for a club.

0:15:46.921 --> 0:15:49.241
<v Speaker 2>We spent about fifty renovating it. But back then it

0:15:49.321 --> 0:15:51.041
<v Speaker 2>was a lot of money, but not like here now

0:15:51.081 --> 0:15:52.601
<v Speaker 2>now you couldn't even get a fucking front door for

0:15:52.601 --> 0:15:55.601
<v Speaker 2>that money. But for us it was good. I mean,

0:15:55.681 --> 0:15:57.561
<v Speaker 2>like you have to appreciate we didn't come from anything.

0:15:57.561 --> 0:16:00.361
<v Speaker 2>We had no money, so to have a couple hundred

0:16:00.361 --> 0:16:03.321
<v Speaker 2>grand was significant when we worked. But we worked hard

0:16:03.361 --> 0:16:08.281
<v Speaker 2>even after I played for eighteen months two years on

0:16:08.361 --> 0:16:12.321
<v Speaker 2>occasion whenever was available. We didn't We didn't make millions

0:16:12.361 --> 0:16:14.961
<v Speaker 2>of dollars. We made money, but then we worked that

0:16:15.001 --> 0:16:17.161
<v Speaker 2>money and made more money. So I'm saying that I

0:16:17.201 --> 0:16:19.681
<v Speaker 2>told you earlier. I owned the street. I used my

0:16:19.721 --> 0:16:22.361
<v Speaker 2>forty thousand dollars that I earned as a deposit, and

0:16:22.401 --> 0:16:24.441
<v Speaker 2>I pre sold some of the sales some of the

0:16:24.481 --> 0:16:27.321
<v Speaker 2>land to develop it, and that's how and then I

0:16:27.361 --> 0:16:31.281
<v Speaker 2>sold some wine paid the remainderud and that's how I

0:16:31.321 --> 0:16:35.921
<v Speaker 2>developed it. I didn't go and pay five hundred thousand cash.

0:16:35.961 --> 0:16:37.961
<v Speaker 1>But was it hard for you because of your name

0:16:38.761 --> 0:16:41.641
<v Speaker 1>not to get harassed by the police?

0:16:42.161 --> 0:16:42.361
<v Speaker 2>You know?

0:16:42.521 --> 0:16:44.721
<v Speaker 1>And to show where you got things from? Were they

0:16:44.761 --> 0:16:45.601
<v Speaker 1>always on your case?

0:16:46.201 --> 0:16:48.201
<v Speaker 2>Not a lot? Back in the day. No, there was

0:16:48.241 --> 0:16:52.401
<v Speaker 2>no technology. When I went for the liquor license, I

0:16:52.441 --> 0:16:56.001
<v Speaker 2>had to go and be interviewed by the guy that

0:16:56.161 --> 0:16:58.001
<v Speaker 2>was in charge of that. He was an attain who

0:16:58.161 --> 0:17:01.281
<v Speaker 2>spoke broken English and the Batam. He said to me,

0:17:01.721 --> 0:17:05.360
<v Speaker 2>have you killed anyone in the past six months? I

0:17:05.361 --> 0:17:08.201
<v Speaker 2>said it was joking, I said, I said, no, you guys,

0:17:08.241 --> 0:17:11.640
<v Speaker 2>granted I'm not even joking. That's how easy it was.

0:17:12.281 --> 0:17:14.640
<v Speaker 2>Hell yeah, now, good luck.

0:17:14.681 --> 0:17:16.481
<v Speaker 1>Okay, we're going to get I want to I want

0:17:16.481 --> 0:17:19.521
<v Speaker 1>to talk about because you just you brought your brother

0:17:19.640 --> 0:17:21.840
<v Speaker 1>up and that and I've seen that there was a

0:17:22.160 --> 0:17:25.201
<v Speaker 1>there was a few cutouts in the papers that back

0:17:26.041 --> 0:17:30.840
<v Speaker 1>in the nineties, nineteen nineties that you were convicted for

0:17:30.961 --> 0:17:33.721
<v Speaker 1>Victoria's largest heroin bust back then.

0:17:34.001 --> 0:17:37.241
<v Speaker 2>Yeah. Now, back then it was huge. Yeah, that's one

0:17:37.241 --> 0:17:40.281
<v Speaker 2>point five killers. There was significant back then.

0:17:40.561 --> 0:17:42.761
<v Speaker 1>What made you get into that? Like into that did?

0:17:43.041 --> 0:17:43.160
<v Speaker 2>It?

0:17:43.201 --> 0:17:45.321
<v Speaker 3>Was just money? You wanted to make dollars? What was

0:17:45.321 --> 0:17:45.640
<v Speaker 3>it now?

0:17:45.801 --> 0:17:48.120
<v Speaker 2>I was fighting in Hong Kong and before I landed,

0:17:48.561 --> 0:17:50.201
<v Speaker 2>I was sick as I took off, and I think

0:17:50.241 --> 0:17:52.321
<v Speaker 2>the altitude name me really really out well by the

0:17:52.360 --> 0:17:54.281
<v Speaker 2>time I landed and I was staying with my Grandmaster,

0:17:54.721 --> 0:17:56.881
<v Speaker 2>who was head of the triads back the Yeah, very

0:17:56.880 --> 0:17:59.480
<v Speaker 2>significant person, and they because I was sweating and shivering,

0:17:59.521 --> 0:18:00.961
<v Speaker 2>I thought I was a heroin addict and the awfered

0:18:01.001 --> 0:18:03.281
<v Speaker 2>me heroin. So when I came back to Melbourne, I

0:18:03.281 --> 0:18:05.480
<v Speaker 2>was with the boys saying why I couldn't fight and

0:18:05.801 --> 0:18:08.120
<v Speaker 2>told the story just as I told you. One of

0:18:08.201 --> 0:18:10.801
<v Speaker 2>them popped up, So can you get some? I said,

0:18:10.801 --> 0:18:13.321
<v Speaker 2>I don't know, I'll ask, So next time my tongue,

0:18:13.400 --> 0:18:15.961
<v Speaker 2>I asked, And then I get a phone call A

0:18:16.041 --> 0:18:18.920
<v Speaker 2>few months later someone was pounds. It wasn't leaving Killows

0:18:19.321 --> 0:18:21.281
<v Speaker 2>had a pound and he had a price, and I

0:18:21.321 --> 0:18:23.241
<v Speaker 2>told him. He said, yes, I got it, and I

0:18:23.360 --> 0:18:25.241
<v Speaker 2>gave it to him. I'd never been exposed to drugs

0:18:25.241 --> 0:18:28.121
<v Speaker 2>prior to that. I mean, I knew that naughty, yeah,

0:18:28.441 --> 0:18:30.760
<v Speaker 2>but I didn't appreciate the significance of how bad they

0:18:30.801 --> 0:18:34.521
<v Speaker 2>were and the actual consequences. Plus you, now, I thought

0:18:34.561 --> 0:18:37.600
<v Speaker 2>you if you caught red handed and didn't understand this

0:18:37.600 --> 0:18:41.760
<v Speaker 2>whole conspiracy ship. So I packed it in, fucked off

0:18:41.801 --> 0:18:43.881
<v Speaker 2>the perth, I board the club went away from that ship.

0:18:44.400 --> 0:18:50.240
<v Speaker 2>But apparently there's not enough. Do you ever regret that

0:18:50.640 --> 0:18:51.200
<v Speaker 2>packing it in?

0:18:51.441 --> 0:18:51.921
<v Speaker 3>Yeah?

0:18:52.041 --> 0:18:54.921
<v Speaker 2>I don't know what would have happened if I wasn't

0:18:54.921 --> 0:18:57.600
<v Speaker 2>exposed to it. Like it's a That really was the

0:18:57.640 --> 0:18:59.921
<v Speaker 2>beginning of my success financially, and it was a huge

0:18:59.961 --> 0:19:02.241
<v Speaker 2>learning curve for me, and even being incarcerated, I learned

0:19:02.281 --> 0:19:04.881
<v Speaker 2>a lot being in jail. So I regret the actions

0:19:04.880 --> 0:19:08.321
<v Speaker 2>of my crime, but you know, the consequences being in

0:19:08.360 --> 0:19:11.481
<v Speaker 2>jail ten yures. Now, couldn't you a fact? Like, it's

0:19:11.521 --> 0:19:14.561
<v Speaker 2>just it's just life. We're still alive, We're still doing ship.

0:19:14.840 --> 0:19:15.481
<v Speaker 2>You know what I'm saying?

0:19:15.721 --> 0:19:17.761
<v Speaker 3>Going back to jail, Like, what was it?

0:19:17.840 --> 0:19:18.001
<v Speaker 2>How?

0:19:18.080 --> 0:19:20.201
<v Speaker 1>How was that going in for the when you first

0:19:20.201 --> 0:19:22.521
<v Speaker 1>went into jail? How was that for you? You're you're working

0:19:22.521 --> 0:19:24.521
<v Speaker 1>your way up to be somebody and you ask somebody.

0:19:24.561 --> 0:19:27.721
<v Speaker 1>You're known on the streets, you're knowing it, where you're living.

0:19:27.521 --> 0:19:28.041
<v Speaker 2>Who you are.

0:19:29.001 --> 0:19:31.041
<v Speaker 1>But to go into jail for the first time in

0:19:31.080 --> 0:19:35.281
<v Speaker 1>your life, how did that feel to you? It was

0:19:35.281 --> 0:19:37.720
<v Speaker 1>it scared? You give a fuck? Were you known as

0:19:37.761 --> 0:19:39.920
<v Speaker 1>you walked in? Were you greeted by people that you

0:19:40.041 --> 0:19:42.120
<v Speaker 1>mat in it? How? What was the time like in

0:19:42.281 --> 0:19:43.440
<v Speaker 1>it for the first time you went in?

0:19:43.521 --> 0:19:47.080
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, like the fucking welcoming reception When I got there,

0:19:49.041 --> 0:19:50.761
<v Speaker 2>it was a big It was a big deal. There's

0:19:50.761 --> 0:19:53.640
<v Speaker 2>a lot of news coverage, and like I said, Coburger

0:19:53.681 --> 0:19:56.841
<v Speaker 2>metz Or, most of the tenants were from my area,

0:19:56.840 --> 0:19:58.360
<v Speaker 2>so I knew a lot of people that was in jail.

0:19:58.600 --> 0:20:00.840
<v Speaker 2>I wasn't scared. There's nothing to be scared of unless

0:20:00.840 --> 0:20:04.241
<v Speaker 2>you're a fuck with You really have nothing to fear

0:20:04.761 --> 0:20:07.241
<v Speaker 2>carry self, well, mind your own business. Don't have to

0:20:07.241 --> 0:20:10.000
<v Speaker 2>fear with anyone's business. You're going to be okay. But

0:20:10.160 --> 0:20:12.721
<v Speaker 2>you know, if you're an idiot, you're going to fall

0:20:12.761 --> 0:20:15.680
<v Speaker 2>into a whole. But no, I was it definitely wasn't scared.

0:20:15.681 --> 0:20:18.321
<v Speaker 2>I was a bit frustrated. Look, this is the thing.

0:20:18.360 --> 0:20:21.440
<v Speaker 2>You don't have time to feel sorry for yourself or

0:20:21.521 --> 0:20:23.761
<v Speaker 2>to worry about shit. You've got a big battle ahead

0:20:23.801 --> 0:20:27.801
<v Speaker 2>of you. It's you against them, the public prosecution, and

0:20:27.801 --> 0:20:30.201
<v Speaker 2>you have to sort through all your fucking paperwork, which

0:20:30.241 --> 0:20:35.281
<v Speaker 2>was mine was tenfolders. It was ridiculous, right, So you

0:20:35.400 --> 0:20:38.161
<v Speaker 2>just focused on the battle ahead of you. Yeah, Jael's cool,

0:20:38.160 --> 0:20:40.801
<v Speaker 2>man like, it's not cool, but it's a reflection on

0:20:40.880 --> 0:20:43.561
<v Speaker 2>society with blokes. You have a laugh, your ege, you sleep,

0:20:43.600 --> 0:20:46.120
<v Speaker 2>your work, you get on with it like it's not

0:20:46.160 --> 0:20:46.840
<v Speaker 2>the end of the world.

0:20:47.041 --> 0:20:48.640
<v Speaker 3>How did your parents react to it?

0:20:49.400 --> 0:20:51.641
<v Speaker 2>Yeah they were devastated, of course, but I mean they're

0:20:51.681 --> 0:20:54.520
<v Speaker 2>called that their reaction there is a reflection of my reaction.

0:20:55.441 --> 0:20:59.001
<v Speaker 2>As long as I was cool, they were cool, It

0:20:59.080 --> 0:21:04.680
<v Speaker 2>was okay. The screws were fucking terrified of us, rightly, so,

0:21:04.681 --> 0:21:08.321
<v Speaker 2>so they get greeted with respect. They were never disrespected,

0:21:08.360 --> 0:21:10.600
<v Speaker 2>and it was all good. If they ever played up

0:21:10.721 --> 0:21:13.521
<v Speaker 2>they got We went on with it inside and outside,

0:21:13.521 --> 0:21:15.960
<v Speaker 2>and they fucking knew that. We didn't interfere with anyone.

0:21:16.321 --> 0:21:19.400
<v Speaker 2>There's nothing to run, bro, you have problems with people,

0:21:20.160 --> 0:21:23.000
<v Speaker 2>you sort them out. You know what is there to run?

0:21:23.080 --> 0:21:25.120
<v Speaker 2>Unless you're fucking trafficking in jail, which I was not.

0:21:25.561 --> 0:21:28.561
<v Speaker 2>What is that to fucking run? Yeah? The objective he has

0:21:28.561 --> 0:21:31.921
<v Speaker 2>to get through every day without being cut. That's it.

0:21:32.441 --> 0:21:36.440
<v Speaker 2>There's lots of crews. There's this handful of proper alpha

0:21:36.481 --> 0:21:41.881
<v Speaker 2>men and they all mind their own business. The rest

0:21:41.880 --> 0:21:44.561
<v Speaker 2>of the little fucking runners go stab that come. I

0:21:44.681 --> 0:21:45.000
<v Speaker 2>get that.

0:21:45.880 --> 0:21:47.641
<v Speaker 1>So when you when you got when you got out,

0:21:47.961 --> 0:21:49.481
<v Speaker 1>what was your objective when you got out?

0:21:49.640 --> 0:21:53.720
<v Speaker 2>Make money? Money's power. I was very lucky when I

0:21:53.721 --> 0:21:55.961
<v Speaker 2>got out. Within weeks, I got a phone call from

0:21:56.201 --> 0:21:58.360
<v Speaker 2>It's like a gift from God. I got a phone

0:21:58.360 --> 0:22:01.440
<v Speaker 2>call from some company saying that we go through dormant

0:22:01.481 --> 0:22:04.521
<v Speaker 2>companies that have been forgotten and when they have assets

0:22:04.521 --> 0:22:07.281
<v Speaker 2>in them, for a fee, we'll recover them for you

0:22:08.321 --> 0:22:10.640
<v Speaker 2>a spy, and then you're the director of this company.

0:22:10.640 --> 0:22:12.640
<v Speaker 2>I said, yeah, I am. They said well, that's a

0:22:12.681 --> 0:22:15.120
<v Speaker 2>significant amount of money there, which like has to recovered us. Yes,

0:22:15.201 --> 0:22:19.080
<v Speaker 2>I would, and I did, and I already had a

0:22:19.120 --> 0:22:21.921
<v Speaker 2>few hundred thousand dollars off the bat and from there

0:22:22.281 --> 0:22:25.561
<v Speaker 2>a friend of mine from Perth, Charlie Jiglio and Jack

0:22:25.640 --> 0:22:28.561
<v Speaker 2>Regal had secured the tour of Andrea per Chari the

0:22:28.561 --> 0:22:31.441
<v Speaker 2>first time in Australia, the blind oper singer. Yeah, muked

0:22:31.441 --> 0:22:34.200
<v Speaker 2>to the conductor and tea a la scala at the ballet.

0:22:34.880 --> 0:22:37.481
<v Speaker 2>But before they would sign contracts, they wanted to tour

0:22:37.561 --> 0:22:39.680
<v Speaker 2>the country to check out the hotels and the venues

0:22:40.120 --> 0:22:42.440
<v Speaker 2>I think predominantly for Andre. And then needed eighty grand

0:22:43.360 --> 0:22:46.440
<v Speaker 2>and Charlie said, would you be interested? I like Charlie,

0:22:46.561 --> 0:22:49.240
<v Speaker 2>Charlie is as honest as the day is long. I

0:22:49.241 --> 0:22:51.880
<v Speaker 2>said sure, he said, but it's not guaranteed. That's no problem.

0:22:52.120 --> 0:22:54.961
<v Speaker 2>So I transferred to eighty thousand. They did their business

0:22:55.001 --> 0:22:57.200
<v Speaker 2>and we secured the tour. Then we on sold that

0:22:57.241 --> 0:22:59.841
<v Speaker 2>to IMG because it was too big for us, too

0:22:59.840 --> 0:23:02.761
<v Speaker 2>big for them, Yeah, and we retained thirty three percent

0:23:02.840 --> 0:23:06.200
<v Speaker 2>or thirty six percent, so I retained twelve percent. And

0:23:06.241 --> 0:23:08.601
<v Speaker 2>then they did the tours very successful, and then Jack

0:23:08.721 --> 0:23:11.201
<v Speaker 2>regally attain ran off with the money to Monte Carlo.

0:23:12.241 --> 0:23:15.761
<v Speaker 2>I check you right, fucking hell, you have the bulls

0:23:15.761 --> 0:23:18.120
<v Speaker 2>to do that. No, I got it, well, you got it.

0:23:18.160 --> 0:23:27.840
<v Speaker 2>Of course he was going nowhere. I jumped on the plane.

0:23:29.001 --> 0:23:31.201
<v Speaker 2>When we first had to deal with imj we recovered.

0:23:31.281 --> 0:23:34.761
<v Speaker 2>I recovered the money that I invested, everyone had recovered instantly,

0:23:34.840 --> 0:23:37.240
<v Speaker 2>and then the profit share he took he ran away with.

0:23:37.400 --> 0:23:40.841
<v Speaker 2>So I said to Charlie, we're in Jack and tell

0:23:40.880 --> 0:23:42.961
<v Speaker 2>him I've got a couple of men that I want

0:23:42.961 --> 0:23:46.280
<v Speaker 2>to put the park somewhere. I had to flush him

0:23:46.281 --> 0:23:49.201
<v Speaker 2>out discount and to book my hotel. I'm coming over

0:23:49.441 --> 0:23:52.720
<v Speaker 2>to Monte Carlo, I said, yeah, So he did. So

0:23:52.761 --> 0:23:54.360
<v Speaker 2>I flew in there and he had two bodyguards and

0:23:54.360 --> 0:23:59.041
<v Speaker 2>attained an English guy and they buckled really quick. So

0:23:59.080 --> 0:24:02.201
<v Speaker 2>he got a big smack and then he disappeared. When

0:24:02.201 --> 0:24:04.400
<v Speaker 2>I got his English bodyguard to take me to his house,

0:24:05.640 --> 0:24:08.801
<v Speaker 2>and I jumped the fence, broke in, checked it all out.

0:24:08.840 --> 0:24:13.000
<v Speaker 2>He wasn't there, just you know, a little map, bedroom, kitchen,

0:24:13.281 --> 0:24:16.441
<v Speaker 2>excess entries, weapons in and out, the usual ship. They're

0:24:16.441 --> 0:24:17.840
<v Speaker 2>not going to take me up the road to like

0:24:17.880 --> 0:24:24.080
<v Speaker 2>a store, to get a taser, a knife, some gaffe tape, right.

0:24:24.600 --> 0:24:26.480
<v Speaker 2>I knew he was going to report to Jack. And

0:24:26.521 --> 0:24:28.441
<v Speaker 2>then I get a phone call from New York from

0:24:28.481 --> 0:24:32.520
<v Speaker 2>another retain, Sam bar. He's invested, We've got a lot

0:24:32.521 --> 0:24:34.241
<v Speaker 2>of money and tied up with his caunt. He really

0:24:34.241 --> 0:24:36.881
<v Speaker 2>can't do what you're going to do. I said, yes,

0:24:36.961 --> 0:24:39.561
<v Speaker 2>I can. I guess can you just wait until tomorrow.

0:24:39.561 --> 0:24:43.400
<v Speaker 2>I'm going to fry in. This is Peter. Yeah. So

0:24:43.561 --> 0:24:45.880
<v Speaker 2>Peter flew in and we had a chat and he

0:24:46.120 --> 0:24:48.361
<v Speaker 2>he said he'll pay it. I said, he shure, Pete.

0:24:48.761 --> 0:24:53.681
<v Speaker 2>I was like, no, will pay it? I said, but committee,

0:24:53.681 --> 0:24:55.680
<v Speaker 2>he must pay it. Here's no fucking around him. I'm

0:24:55.721 --> 0:24:58.241
<v Speaker 2>not leaving without my money. He has now will paid

0:24:58.321 --> 0:25:00.600
<v Speaker 2>come to Perth next week. He's from Perth and before

0:25:00.721 --> 0:25:03.400
<v Speaker 2>and he did. So I went to Perth and got paid.

0:25:04.080 --> 0:25:07.761
<v Speaker 2>That's you know that story? What hell? But you say

0:25:07.801 --> 0:25:09.760
<v Speaker 2>what I did there? That was theater. I was never

0:25:09.840 --> 0:25:12.721
<v Speaker 2>going to kill him. I wasn't gonna do job for

0:25:12.761 --> 0:25:15.241
<v Speaker 2>this camp. Who was theater for the bodyguard. I knew

0:25:15.241 --> 0:25:17.400
<v Speaker 2>the bodyguard is going to report the camp and I

0:25:17.400 --> 0:25:19.120
<v Speaker 2>was very serious about it. And that's very aggressive.

0:25:19.360 --> 0:25:20.321
<v Speaker 3>Did you always go alone.

0:25:20.561 --> 0:25:23.321
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, always around solid. You did not have to get

0:25:23.360 --> 0:25:26.641
<v Speaker 2>rid of any witnesses. So I was very aggressive, very sincere.

0:25:27.441 --> 0:25:29.481
<v Speaker 2>You know, a lot of it was theater, So I

0:25:29.561 --> 0:25:30.961
<v Speaker 2>knew he was going to report back to this count.

0:25:30.961 --> 0:25:32.561
<v Speaker 2>He was going to assumemself either it was going to pay,

0:25:32.561 --> 0:25:34.840
<v Speaker 2>who was going to fucking pay? Or never come back again.

0:25:35.561 --> 0:25:38.401
<v Speaker 2>And that's how I got my result in that particular instance.

0:25:38.681 --> 0:25:40.240
<v Speaker 1>How do you know what you're getting yourself into. If

0:25:40.241 --> 0:25:41.720
<v Speaker 1>you're going over to another country, or you going to

0:25:41.721 --> 0:25:44.240
<v Speaker 1>find someone you don't know who's there, you just you

0:25:44.281 --> 0:25:46.001
<v Speaker 1>do you stake out you just know them, or you're

0:25:46.080 --> 0:25:48.921
<v Speaker 1>just you're going by instin I knew.

0:25:48.961 --> 0:25:50.600
<v Speaker 2>I was surprised you had two bodyguards, to be honest

0:25:50.600 --> 0:25:52.360
<v Speaker 2>to do but it's such a flop his bodyguards or

0:25:52.360 --> 0:25:55.521
<v Speaker 2>flops as well. But you know, you just got I

0:25:55.561 --> 0:25:58.720
<v Speaker 2>knew my environment. I had a fair understanding of what

0:25:58.761 --> 0:26:02.400
<v Speaker 2>I was getting into, and my capacity back then was

0:26:02.561 --> 0:26:05.960
<v Speaker 2>far superior to their. You know, I lived in the

0:26:06.001 --> 0:26:08.400
<v Speaker 2>jungle for ten years, but you know, I know how

0:26:08.400 --> 0:26:10.121
<v Speaker 2>to get it on. I don't know what to look for.

0:26:10.521 --> 0:26:14.200
<v Speaker 2>I know how to turn nothing into a weapon. So

0:26:14.481 --> 0:26:16.041
<v Speaker 2>if anyone was gonna have a problem. Would have been

0:26:16.080 --> 0:26:16.521
<v Speaker 2>damned not me.

0:26:17.201 --> 0:26:20.080
<v Speaker 1>Tell me about the time you came to because I

0:26:21.041 --> 0:26:23.120
<v Speaker 1>had a little giggle when I've seen this one when

0:26:23.160 --> 0:26:26.201
<v Speaker 1>he came to Double Bai and there's a security contract

0:26:26.201 --> 0:26:27.201
<v Speaker 1>off for grabs.

0:26:27.521 --> 0:26:29.521
<v Speaker 2>Yes, I get a call from kids on I think

0:26:29.561 --> 0:26:32.120
<v Speaker 2>there was a big fight on in said at the time,

0:26:32.600 --> 0:26:34.801
<v Speaker 2>he said this a couple of boys whenever chat listen

0:26:34.801 --> 0:26:39.400
<v Speaker 2>nearing that problem, and it was twenty five John B

0:26:39.640 --> 0:26:43.440
<v Speaker 2>mcanty and Copper. I'd rudge them made if there was.

0:26:43.921 --> 0:26:46.360
<v Speaker 2>If we were being watched, that was a very colorful table.

0:26:46.400 --> 0:26:47.481
<v Speaker 2>So I had no idea what I was going to

0:26:47.521 --> 0:26:49.321
<v Speaker 2>getting into. So I had another guy with me. I

0:26:49.481 --> 0:26:51.400
<v Speaker 2>had dropped me here and stay here. But you can

0:26:51.441 --> 0:26:53.840
<v Speaker 2>see the line aside, and he was toold up obviously.

0:26:54.360 --> 0:26:56.441
<v Speaker 2>I said, if I start scratching my head, just coming

0:26:56.481 --> 0:26:57.721
<v Speaker 2>shooting right, and.

0:26:58.160 --> 0:27:01.041
<v Speaker 1>I for sure you yeah, yeah, if.

0:27:01.001 --> 0:27:02.761
<v Speaker 2>I scratched my head, that made just guns involved on

0:27:02.801 --> 0:27:04.160
<v Speaker 2>my arms. I just come in and just wave that

0:27:04.201 --> 0:27:05.680
<v Speaker 2>around and lit if you're going out, and then we'll

0:27:05.721 --> 0:27:07.281
<v Speaker 2>work it out as we go. So he stayed, he

0:27:07.321 --> 0:27:10.640
<v Speaker 2>sat off and just watched. Anyway, so we get there

0:27:10.761 --> 0:27:12.561
<v Speaker 2>meet great. I didn't know any of those guys except

0:27:12.561 --> 0:27:16.761
<v Speaker 2>for John. I had met Troy before. Actually, when I

0:27:16.801 --> 0:27:18.520
<v Speaker 2>first got out of jail, I was in Perth with

0:27:18.840 --> 0:27:21.241
<v Speaker 2>Gregory Roberts and they threw a knight on for us.

0:27:21.561 --> 0:27:24.120
<v Speaker 2>He was he was only a non back then before

0:27:24.120 --> 0:27:27.481
<v Speaker 2>he grew the ranks, and he ran the ball for

0:27:27.561 --> 0:27:29.160
<v Speaker 2>him a lot. You know. It turned out there was

0:27:29.201 --> 0:27:31.321
<v Speaker 2>all they just because we're gonna havepen up Strip club

0:27:31.360 --> 0:27:34.120
<v Speaker 2>in Queensland and they ran they ran security there and

0:27:34.120 --> 0:27:35.841
<v Speaker 2>they want to know if that they can get the security.

0:27:38.880 --> 0:27:40.440
<v Speaker 2>We didn't. We didn't end up taking it. We're going

0:27:40.481 --> 0:27:42.201
<v Speaker 2>to buy one there and turn into a spermit rhiner.

0:27:43.001 --> 0:27:45.041
<v Speaker 2>We had the one in Melbourne. I was involved in

0:27:45.041 --> 0:27:47.160
<v Speaker 2>the one in Melbourne. I took that.

0:27:49.281 --> 0:27:50.521
<v Speaker 1>Is there anything you haven't taken?

0:27:51.801 --> 0:27:54.321
<v Speaker 2>That rude? But you got to can't be disrespectful. And

0:27:54.360 --> 0:27:57.201
<v Speaker 2>I think you come in my fucking world and carry

0:27:57.281 --> 0:27:58.920
<v Speaker 2>like a count, you're gonna get treated like a count.

0:27:59.160 --> 0:28:01.041
<v Speaker 2>I didn't treat them like account They treated men like

0:28:01.080 --> 0:28:05.000
<v Speaker 2>a count. So come in here we go. So they

0:28:05.160 --> 0:28:07.160
<v Speaker 2>to pay him and I had cans ringing me. I

0:28:07.241 --> 0:28:09.721
<v Speaker 2>was in London one day the count NaN's fucking Lamborghini

0:28:09.801 --> 0:28:12.120
<v Speaker 2>and Melbourne is a fucking coronk brang me, he said.

0:28:12.721 --> 0:28:14.680
<v Speaker 2>At the club, he told the girls to look after me.

0:28:15.120 --> 0:28:18.401
<v Speaker 2>I said yes, so they put him on. I said,

0:28:18.481 --> 0:28:21.961
<v Speaker 2>he's not about bloke, you know, so I just don't

0:28:22.041 --> 0:28:24.201
<v Speaker 2>rape him too much sort of thing. So I came

0:28:24.201 --> 0:28:26.160
<v Speaker 2>back to Melbourne. The girls go bas your for he gels,

0:28:26.681 --> 0:28:28.080
<v Speaker 2>I said, I was in the acquaints, I said, because

0:28:28.080 --> 0:28:30.720
<v Speaker 2>he was, So what do you mean? He said, you're

0:28:30.721 --> 0:28:34.080
<v Speaker 2>a tire kicker or this or that. Ah took me

0:28:34.120 --> 0:28:36.561
<v Speaker 2>three years to find him. I was driving down the

0:28:36.600 --> 0:28:39.441
<v Speaker 2>street in Chapel Street. I thought about him a lot,

0:28:39.721 --> 0:28:42.281
<v Speaker 2>but I'm not even joking. But I wasn't going to

0:28:42.321 --> 0:28:44.480
<v Speaker 2>get Hi my way. And there he was standing on

0:28:44.521 --> 0:28:47.801
<v Speaker 2>the fucking corner right. So I've pulled into the side street.

0:28:47.881 --> 0:28:49.761
<v Speaker 2>I said, bro come up here, here are you going?

0:28:49.801 --> 0:28:52.161
<v Speaker 2>He gets good, cracked him on the jaw, mate, broke

0:28:52.201 --> 0:28:57.361
<v Speaker 2>his fucking jaw, just left him there, dropped in the

0:28:57.401 --> 0:29:01.841
<v Speaker 2>counter buff Two years later, one of our supporters bought

0:29:01.841 --> 0:29:04.201
<v Speaker 2>a Lamborghini from him and they were folding and you've

0:29:04.201 --> 0:29:07.281
<v Speaker 2>given him like a roundred thousand deposits and he was

0:29:07.441 --> 0:29:09.121
<v Speaker 2>getting it back. I said, call and put me on

0:29:09.161 --> 0:29:11.441
<v Speaker 2>the phone. I put him on the phone. I said,

0:29:11.481 --> 0:29:14.881
<v Speaker 2>your fucking Doug. He paid straight away. But the point

0:29:14.921 --> 0:29:17.641
<v Speaker 2>is he came. He came to me. I didn't ring him.

0:29:17.641 --> 0:29:19.721
<v Speaker 2>He rang me. He said, can you sort this out?

0:29:19.721 --> 0:29:22.280
<v Speaker 2>And then he went about so you're in my world now,

0:29:22.281 --> 0:29:24.121
<v Speaker 2>I count This is how we fucking deal with things,

0:29:24.961 --> 0:29:29.361
<v Speaker 2>same as spiermat Rhino. They came to Victoria. They bought

0:29:29.401 --> 0:29:32.760
<v Speaker 2>a club of two brothers that were incarcerated. Inn't pay

0:29:32.801 --> 0:29:35.440
<v Speaker 2>him the last three hundred grand, which was fine. And

0:29:35.521 --> 0:29:37.921
<v Speaker 2>I was at the back in the lane way with

0:29:38.001 --> 0:29:39.440
<v Speaker 2>a couple of boys and I'm a friend of mine

0:29:39.521 --> 0:29:41.240
<v Speaker 2>just got out of child who was incarcerated with me.

0:29:41.321 --> 0:29:45.081
<v Speaker 2>Gary Lewer, world champion bodybuilder, champion bloke. He was looking

0:29:45.121 --> 0:29:46.761
<v Speaker 2>for me, I said, I met the rhine. I said.

0:29:46.761 --> 0:29:48.161
<v Speaker 2>He walked in there and he went to the office

0:29:48.161 --> 0:29:50.601
<v Speaker 2>and asked for me, and then he came. He found me,

0:29:50.641 --> 0:29:53.321
<v Speaker 2>and he was a bit he was really uneasy. I said,

0:29:53.321 --> 0:29:57.001
<v Speaker 2>what's wrong, Gary? Because I know nothing, I said, but

0:29:57.241 --> 0:29:59.281
<v Speaker 2>there's clearly something wrong. Is there something on your mind?

0:29:59.321 --> 0:30:02.200
<v Speaker 2>Like you look a little upset? He said, I'm just

0:30:02.201 --> 0:30:04.681
<v Speaker 2>not we just got out of jail. Because I'm just

0:30:04.681 --> 0:30:09.361
<v Speaker 2>not used people speaking about you in that manner he

0:30:09.521 --> 0:30:11.561
<v Speaker 2>was in maximum. He was im panted with me. When

0:30:11.561 --> 0:30:13.641
<v Speaker 2>Pendroit was closing, I was the last one on the bus,

0:30:13.641 --> 0:30:16.200
<v Speaker 2>and he saw how I rolled screws and fucking business

0:30:16.281 --> 0:30:19.401
<v Speaker 2>bro Like, I ran that shit up. I said, what

0:30:19.441 --> 0:30:20.720
<v Speaker 2>do you mean? He goes, Oh, they were just a

0:30:20.721 --> 0:30:22.921
<v Speaker 2>bit you know. I just didn't like how they spoke.

0:30:23.121 --> 0:30:25.281
<v Speaker 2>I said, not worry about it, bro, They're just fucking civilians.

0:30:25.321 --> 0:30:28.321
<v Speaker 2>But I made a mental note, and then I started

0:30:28.321 --> 0:30:30.921
<v Speaker 2>watching him and they were getting a bit cute. So

0:30:31.561 --> 0:30:35.801
<v Speaker 2>that following Friday, the principal owner was coming into town, right,

0:30:36.801 --> 0:30:40.361
<v Speaker 2>and I've been looking after these because the Crown Caserno.

0:30:40.361 --> 0:30:42.441
<v Speaker 2>I asked BE to look after him, and I said,

0:30:42.441 --> 0:30:44.321
<v Speaker 2>come to my restaurant for lunch. So I'd already pre

0:30:44.401 --> 0:30:47.121
<v Speaker 2>planned to lunch Friday morning, I said. The boys enter

0:30:47.161 --> 0:30:49.881
<v Speaker 2>the club, pistol whip the manager, the one that checkie

0:30:49.921 --> 0:30:53.041
<v Speaker 2>count and the part owner and told the whole place

0:30:53.121 --> 0:30:57.721
<v Speaker 2>upside down as you do, right, they fucking shit, Who

0:30:57.721 --> 0:30:59.960
<v Speaker 2>are they going to get to? They can show to

0:31:00.001 --> 0:31:04.201
<v Speaker 2>me right, they're in my world now. So I saw

0:31:04.361 --> 0:31:07.200
<v Speaker 2>that problem out took them to the I couldn't believe it,

0:31:07.281 --> 0:31:09.481
<v Speaker 2>I said, I said, I go to see the blakes.

0:31:09.481 --> 0:31:13.881
<v Speaker 2>They said, we want to come, said right, not the

0:31:13.881 --> 0:31:16.201
<v Speaker 2>one that got pissed a p himself for John Gray. Yeah,

0:31:16.201 --> 0:31:18.361
<v Speaker 2>he's a bit ballsy. It's got some dashes count. So

0:31:18.401 --> 0:31:22.001
<v Speaker 2>we took him away to fucking Jadnung tooled up. Get there,

0:31:22.401 --> 0:31:26.240
<v Speaker 2>lock it pulled off my jewelry theater. We go in

0:31:26.241 --> 0:31:29.321
<v Speaker 2>there and there's like ten blokes, serious fucking men, and

0:31:29.401 --> 0:31:31.561
<v Speaker 2>we was a throw off. The throw off was the

0:31:31.681 --> 0:31:33.881
<v Speaker 2>consider and jar haven't been paid there three hundred grand.

0:31:34.521 --> 0:31:37.201
<v Speaker 2>You feel me, right, I said, they'll get their money.

0:31:37.241 --> 0:31:39.201
<v Speaker 2>When they get their money, this counts with me. Fuck

0:31:39.281 --> 0:31:42.281
<v Speaker 2>off and they fucked off. So on the way back

0:31:42.681 --> 0:31:45.921
<v Speaker 2>for a lot of silence, Okay, what about this percentage

0:31:45.921 --> 0:31:48.401
<v Speaker 2>by because how point of this is our best to

0:31:48.401 --> 0:31:51.001
<v Speaker 2>buy into the fucking joint? Because yeah, yeah, we've thought

0:31:51.201 --> 0:31:53.121
<v Speaker 2>I'm going to we want you involved, he said, but

0:31:53.121 --> 0:31:55.121
<v Speaker 2>we don't want any money. We're going to pay for it.

0:31:55.161 --> 0:31:57.721
<v Speaker 2>So it was a gift. You see what I'm saying

0:31:58.161 --> 0:32:00.361
<v Speaker 2>the point of this is they've come to me for

0:32:00.441 --> 0:32:03.201
<v Speaker 2>help and they want to pay like cunts. So they

0:32:03.201 --> 0:32:05.321
<v Speaker 2>get you out of like cunts. And then I wrapped

0:32:05.321 --> 0:32:10.401
<v Speaker 2>them for the next seven fucking years. Boyeah, fair enough.

0:32:11.121 --> 0:32:12.321
<v Speaker 2>I don't see anything wrong with that.

0:32:12.361 --> 0:32:13.761
<v Speaker 3>Oh no, definitely not.

0:32:14.041 --> 0:32:15.521
<v Speaker 1>With all this going on in your life now, and

0:32:15.561 --> 0:32:17.801
<v Speaker 1>you said that, you know you joined the Mossoun. What

0:32:17.801 --> 0:32:18.401
<v Speaker 1>made you get out?

0:32:19.121 --> 0:32:21.481
<v Speaker 2>It was I had two young children, both going to

0:32:21.521 --> 0:32:23.881
<v Speaker 2>private school, and I was in the paper so often

0:32:24.841 --> 0:32:26.801
<v Speaker 2>anything that happened in Victoria that put a picture of me,

0:32:27.721 --> 0:32:34.841
<v Speaker 2>horrible picture photoshops that have my name in headlines, and

0:32:34.881 --> 0:32:37.121
<v Speaker 2>then they'd referred to me somewhere in the title, but

0:32:37.161 --> 0:32:38.281
<v Speaker 2>it had nothing to do with me. So I was

0:32:38.281 --> 0:32:41.200
<v Speaker 2>getting so much negative press that became a problem for

0:32:41.241 --> 0:32:43.161
<v Speaker 2>my kids. My kids have been nice stated at school,

0:32:43.161 --> 0:32:46.001
<v Speaker 2>they've been invited to parties. Parents are a bit fucking nervous,

0:32:46.001 --> 0:32:49.361
<v Speaker 2>and rightly so. In fact, they were they rallying bring

0:32:49.401 --> 0:32:51.001
<v Speaker 2>out back to try and get the kids expelled from

0:32:51.001 --> 0:32:53.521
<v Speaker 2>the school. So it became a personal problem for my

0:32:53.641 --> 0:32:56.881
<v Speaker 2>personal life. And if you're going to choose family or

0:32:57.001 --> 0:32:59.521
<v Speaker 2>bike World, I always choose family. So I thought it

0:32:59.521 --> 0:33:02.001
<v Speaker 2>was a good time. I'd ground the club to four chapters,

0:33:02.521 --> 0:33:06.241
<v Speaker 2>and there was nothing in Victoria that my number two

0:33:06.321 --> 0:33:08.721
<v Speaker 2>was ready to take over. It wasn't an overnight decision.

0:33:08.721 --> 0:33:11.481
<v Speaker 2>We've been discussing this for like six eight months. I

0:33:11.521 --> 0:33:14.280
<v Speaker 2>don't really know to find the hierarchy that I'm going

0:33:14.281 --> 0:33:16.881
<v Speaker 2>to exit. Shortly, everyone was cool with it and we

0:33:17.041 --> 0:33:18.961
<v Speaker 2>just transitioned. It was time. Look, I did it for

0:33:19.001 --> 0:33:21.161
<v Speaker 2>two years. It was a lot of fun, but it

0:33:21.561 --> 0:33:25.480
<v Speaker 2>became too noisy for me personally, too noisy, So it

0:33:25.561 --> 0:33:26.321
<v Speaker 2>was time to exit.

0:33:26.521 --> 0:33:28.200
<v Speaker 1>Didn't miss it, or it took you a while to

0:33:28.561 --> 0:33:31.841
<v Speaker 1>get you sweet, or you were like you I were.

0:33:31.841 --> 0:33:33.440
<v Speaker 1>You were ready for it, you were ready to get out.

0:33:34.681 --> 0:33:36.521
<v Speaker 2>I wasn't absorbed by the whole thing. It was just

0:33:36.561 --> 0:33:40.121
<v Speaker 2>like it was a you know, we do our weekly meetings,

0:33:41.641 --> 0:33:44.801
<v Speaker 2>organize our runs. We catch up once every month for

0:33:44.841 --> 0:33:48.841
<v Speaker 2>a ride, barely, and it wasn't like it wasn't it

0:33:48.881 --> 0:33:51.801
<v Speaker 2>wasn't the whole lifestyle that we did committ one hundred

0:33:51.801 --> 0:33:54.601
<v Speaker 2>percent of our time to all My members were you

0:33:54.921 --> 0:33:58.041
<v Speaker 2>fathers and employed, so we can really afford to be

0:33:58.121 --> 0:33:59.881
<v Speaker 2>in the club all the time and around the club

0:33:59.881 --> 0:34:02.401
<v Speaker 2>all the time. So for me, exident the club made

0:34:02.401 --> 0:34:05.241
<v Speaker 2>no real difference to me. I still had my associations

0:34:05.241 --> 0:34:05.761
<v Speaker 2>that I kept.

0:34:07.481 --> 0:34:09.121
<v Speaker 3>Do you have any regrets?

0:34:09.921 --> 0:34:13.841
<v Speaker 2>No, Look, everything's a learning curve. Oh my mistakes of

0:34:14.241 --> 0:34:18.201
<v Speaker 2>I'll hope I've learned from But yeah, you know, we

0:34:18.801 --> 0:34:20.961
<v Speaker 2>this is our life. We choose the part that we

0:34:21.081 --> 0:34:24.961
<v Speaker 2>choose and we do our best. Some things work out,

0:34:25.041 --> 0:34:27.881
<v Speaker 2>some don't. Befall, have you touch stuff off, you keep

0:34:27.921 --> 0:34:30.401
<v Speaker 2>plowing that you get back up.

0:34:32.841 --> 0:34:35.801
<v Speaker 1>What would you describe yourself in one.

0:34:35.641 --> 0:34:36.401
<v Speaker 3>Wad or two ways?

0:34:36.401 --> 0:34:38.841
<v Speaker 2>I'll give you now or then, well.

0:34:38.721 --> 0:34:39.440
<v Speaker 1>Let's go with both.

0:34:39.561 --> 0:34:40.921
<v Speaker 3>Let's see, let's see the change in this.

0:34:41.241 --> 0:34:43.041
<v Speaker 2>Well back then when I was, when I was arrested,

0:34:43.601 --> 0:34:45.681
<v Speaker 2>I would say I would be that county you'd fucking

0:34:45.881 --> 0:34:50.561
<v Speaker 2>hate if I if I knew him, I would love

0:34:50.641 --> 0:34:55.641
<v Speaker 2>like him at arrogant cocky thinks he knows everything. They

0:34:55.721 --> 0:34:58.201
<v Speaker 2>just want to punch him. Now, a lot more settled

0:34:58.241 --> 0:35:00.721
<v Speaker 2>I've been. I've got experience. I have a lot more empathy.

0:35:01.121 --> 0:35:03.801
<v Speaker 2>I understand when I do something that's a result or

0:35:03.801 --> 0:35:06.881
<v Speaker 2>a consequence, and you know, you try and be a

0:35:06.921 --> 0:35:10.441
<v Speaker 2>bit more respect for other people's time and space. You know,

0:35:11.161 --> 0:35:12.761
<v Speaker 2>I'm bomb one with you now you.

0:35:12.961 --> 0:35:16.001
<v Speaker 3>Were What's so? What's what's what's the thing now for you?

0:35:16.041 --> 0:35:18.641
<v Speaker 3>In the future? What what? What? What's your plans?

0:35:19.001 --> 0:35:20.961
<v Speaker 2>I'm still going but I haven't stopped.

0:35:22.241 --> 0:35:23.321
<v Speaker 1>Because you brought the book out.

0:35:23.841 --> 0:35:26.881
<v Speaker 2>Yeah, the book's entertainment. Yeah, yeah, we did that. But

0:35:27.161 --> 0:35:28.881
<v Speaker 2>I did that because I had I've been a time

0:35:28.921 --> 0:35:30.721
<v Speaker 2>on my hands. I was stuck on the couch for

0:35:30.761 --> 0:35:34.721
<v Speaker 2>a couple of years, so pushed out a book. No

0:35:34.841 --> 0:35:39.161
<v Speaker 2>TV thing, possibly TV. Can't say too much, but you

0:35:39.201 --> 0:35:41.481
<v Speaker 2>know it's it's generating a lot of interest. I'll just

0:35:41.481 --> 0:35:41.921
<v Speaker 2>say that.

0:35:42.121 --> 0:35:43.361
<v Speaker 3>But you're happy with yourself now.

0:35:43.401 --> 0:35:46.121
<v Speaker 1>You're settled and mature now, as you said, so, you've

0:35:46.481 --> 0:35:48.641
<v Speaker 1>you're happy with the way things are going in life now.

0:35:48.921 --> 0:35:52.641
<v Speaker 2>I've always been happy. I've never been unhappy. Right, Everything

0:35:52.721 --> 0:35:56.440
<v Speaker 2>is good. I like a bit of excitement. Everyone likes

0:35:56.441 --> 0:35:59.001
<v Speaker 2>a bit of excitement. Man, things interesting.

0:36:00.521 --> 0:36:04.001
<v Speaker 1>Well, thanks for coming on, sure, but I'm grateful for

0:36:04.041 --> 0:36:06.761
<v Speaker 1>your time today, and I'm glad you came on to

0:36:06.761 --> 0:36:07.361
<v Speaker 1>show your story.

0:36:07.481 --> 0:36:11.041
<v Speaker 2>Thanks so much, appreciate it. H