1 00:00:00,280 --> 00:00:02,200 Speaker 1: I get a team at Craig Anthony, half of the 2 00:00:02,240 --> 00:00:05,600 Speaker 1: You project, Kerry Volun, Tiffany and Cook asks you the 3 00:00:05,640 --> 00:00:08,840 Speaker 1: whole fucking thing. T let's start up in the top 4 00:00:08,920 --> 00:00:12,399 Speaker 1: left hand corner. Tiffany and Cook, Hi, top of the 5 00:00:12,480 --> 00:00:13,320 Speaker 1: morning Harps. 6 00:00:13,360 --> 00:00:13,880 Speaker 2: How are you? 7 00:00:14,520 --> 00:00:16,880 Speaker 1: Oh? Look, I'm so good. I'm bursting out of my flannel. 8 00:00:16,920 --> 00:00:18,479 Speaker 1: In fact, I've burst out of it. I'm in a 9 00:00:18,480 --> 00:00:21,520 Speaker 1: black Everlass T shirt. The flannel's been discarded. That's our 10 00:00:21,600 --> 00:00:22,200 Speaker 1: fucking pump. 11 00:00:22,640 --> 00:00:23,720 Speaker 2: Really dressed up? 12 00:00:23,840 --> 00:00:27,320 Speaker 1: You really dressed up? Yeah. Karen Vaughan's amazing. You've got 13 00:00:27,320 --> 00:00:31,800 Speaker 1: to get her on. She's funny, she's just all the time. 14 00:00:32,640 --> 00:00:33,880 Speaker 2: We like peas in a pot. 15 00:00:33,960 --> 00:00:37,000 Speaker 1: I feel like you're just going to be like she's 16 00:00:37,040 --> 00:00:40,080 Speaker 1: the best? Am I? All right? Hi? Karen? 17 00:00:40,760 --> 00:00:41,800 Speaker 2: Hi, Craig, how are you? 18 00:00:42,440 --> 00:00:47,519 Speaker 1: Oh my dear, I'm so good, Thank you? How are you? Yeah? 19 00:00:47,560 --> 00:00:50,160 Speaker 2: I'm fantastic. It's buddy windy up here. I'm in Sale 20 00:00:50,200 --> 00:00:53,160 Speaker 2: in gibbs Land and the buddy trees are blowing a gale. 21 00:00:53,240 --> 00:00:54,600 Speaker 2: What's it like down in Melbourne? 22 00:00:55,440 --> 00:00:58,520 Speaker 1: It's about twenty five there's no wind at so shit. 23 00:00:59,080 --> 00:01:02,880 Speaker 1: I just came in for the hammock bullshit. I've been 24 00:01:02,960 --> 00:01:05,200 Speaker 1: lined by the pool. I just wiped the zinc off 25 00:01:05,240 --> 00:01:08,920 Speaker 1: my nose. It's going to be now. It's fucking freezing, 26 00:01:09,040 --> 00:01:12,880 Speaker 1: and it's windy and it's cold. And when I went 27 00:01:12,920 --> 00:01:16,960 Speaker 1: to the cafe this morning at stupid o'clock, it was 28 00:01:17,400 --> 00:01:19,160 Speaker 1: I was going to say my wiz and Nelly fell off, 29 00:01:19,200 --> 00:01:21,840 Speaker 1: but I can't say that because that's inappropriate. But let's 30 00:01:21,880 --> 00:01:27,160 Speaker 1: just say it was cold. It was very cold. It 31 00:01:27,280 --> 00:01:30,880 Speaker 1: was very cold. Yeah, saleh. I used to live up 32 00:01:30,920 --> 00:01:32,759 Speaker 1: in that direction. I lived up in the tro Valley. 33 00:01:33,000 --> 00:01:36,479 Speaker 1: We used to play footy against Sale. That's pretty good. 34 00:01:37,040 --> 00:01:39,760 Speaker 2: Yeah, I've only lived here for about eight years. But 35 00:01:39,920 --> 00:01:43,639 Speaker 2: you know, I'm a Warrigal girl. But Warrigal and trough. 36 00:01:43,800 --> 00:01:47,280 Speaker 2: But yeah, the valley, that's it's a place. 37 00:01:47,640 --> 00:01:51,080 Speaker 1: Gide up, gide up, all right. So what do you 38 00:01:51,200 --> 00:01:53,480 Speaker 1: do up there? What do you? What do you? What 39 00:01:53,640 --> 00:01:58,760 Speaker 1: is the amazing fabulous Kerry Karn sorry Vaughan do in Sale? 40 00:01:58,960 --> 00:02:01,360 Speaker 2: Yeah? I reckon, I've been rated a little bit, thanks 41 00:02:01,440 --> 00:02:05,320 Speaker 2: very much, Tiff. Give me So. I'm a leadership code, 42 00:02:05,400 --> 00:02:10,360 Speaker 2: leadership facilitator and coach. I do team building, so I 43 00:02:10,520 --> 00:02:13,520 Speaker 2: work for myself and I go into organizations and you know, 44 00:02:13,639 --> 00:02:17,799 Speaker 2: try and get people a bit excited about working together, 45 00:02:17,840 --> 00:02:21,079 Speaker 2: building relationships and that kind of stuff. So I've I've 46 00:02:21,120 --> 00:02:25,280 Speaker 2: got two books plus a gratitude journal. I run Girls 47 00:02:25,280 --> 00:02:30,919 Speaker 2: with Hammers, which is not woodwork. It's a women's empowerment initiative. 48 00:02:31,080 --> 00:02:36,200 Speaker 2: And oh there's something else I'm missing anyway, that kind 49 00:02:36,200 --> 00:02:37,320 Speaker 2: of thing you do? 50 00:02:37,360 --> 00:02:38,280 Speaker 1: You do a podcast? 51 00:02:38,520 --> 00:02:41,600 Speaker 2: Oh, that's it. That's the other thing, Yeah, which. 52 00:02:41,440 --> 00:02:43,440 Speaker 1: Is also called what's it called something with? 53 00:02:43,720 --> 00:02:44,400 Speaker 2: Get off the Bench? 54 00:02:45,160 --> 00:02:47,720 Speaker 1: Get off the Bench, the bloody come on, you need 55 00:02:47,760 --> 00:02:49,520 Speaker 1: to learn to do your pr better than that. 56 00:02:50,040 --> 00:02:51,800 Speaker 2: I'm not very good. I'm not very good at that 57 00:02:51,880 --> 00:02:54,960 Speaker 2: stuff at all. I'm a bit organic. So yeah, Get 58 00:02:54,960 --> 00:02:57,560 Speaker 2: Off the Bench. The podcast. It's like, because I wrote 59 00:02:57,600 --> 00:02:59,519 Speaker 2: the book Get Off the Bench, which helps people to 60 00:02:59,600 --> 00:03:03,280 Speaker 2: kick stuff projects and ideas, I decided to do a 61 00:03:03,320 --> 00:03:06,280 Speaker 2: podcast that would showcase people who are already doing that 62 00:03:06,720 --> 00:03:10,520 Speaker 2: so hopefully inspire people to believe in themselves. That's not 63 00:03:10,600 --> 00:03:13,280 Speaker 2: an easy gig, getting people to believe in themselves. 64 00:03:13,720 --> 00:03:16,000 Speaker 1: What do you reckon? That's about Why do you reckon? 65 00:03:16,040 --> 00:03:20,079 Speaker 1: There's so much doubt, self doubt, self loathing, and even 66 00:03:20,440 --> 00:03:22,520 Speaker 1: kind of self sabotage in a way. 67 00:03:22,960 --> 00:03:24,639 Speaker 2: Well, I'm probably going to take that all the way 68 00:03:24,639 --> 00:03:27,120 Speaker 2: back to childhood and school because I think that we're 69 00:03:27,160 --> 00:03:31,400 Speaker 2: born bloody, wonderfully, magnificently and everyone praises us, you know, 70 00:03:31,440 --> 00:03:35,160 Speaker 2: every minute we speak, we're like dad, mama, and they're like, oh, yeah, 71 00:03:35,360 --> 00:03:37,840 Speaker 2: you know, little Johnny or whatever. And then we start 72 00:03:37,920 --> 00:03:41,120 Speaker 2: walking and then we start touching the TV and its smack, 73 00:03:41,160 --> 00:03:44,119 Speaker 2: your bloody hands, don't touch this, don't touch that, sit down, 74 00:03:44,240 --> 00:03:46,240 Speaker 2: shut up, you know. And then we get to school 75 00:03:46,840 --> 00:03:48,800 Speaker 2: and it's kind of like, oh, even kinder and the 76 00:03:48,840 --> 00:03:51,280 Speaker 2: kids are going, my mom says, your mum's fat. I 77 00:03:51,320 --> 00:03:53,160 Speaker 2: don't want to play with you today. We don't like 78 00:03:53,200 --> 00:03:55,440 Speaker 2: your hair, all that bullshit. And then we get into 79 00:03:55,520 --> 00:03:58,880 Speaker 2: school and it's just compete, compete, compete, you know, and 80 00:03:58,880 --> 00:04:02,320 Speaker 2: if you're not you can't shine. Like nobody can turn 81 00:04:02,400 --> 00:04:07,320 Speaker 2: up as themselves and I don't know, be appreciated and 82 00:04:07,680 --> 00:04:10,640 Speaker 2: celebrated for who they truly are. And I reckon that 83 00:04:10,720 --> 00:04:13,320 Speaker 2: really bloody sucks. So we get it beaten out of us. 84 00:04:13,440 --> 00:04:15,800 Speaker 2: This is just my theory, might not be right, but 85 00:04:15,880 --> 00:04:17,640 Speaker 2: we get a beaten out of us, you know, And 86 00:04:17,760 --> 00:04:20,159 Speaker 2: unless we can form and unless we fit in with 87 00:04:20,240 --> 00:04:24,320 Speaker 2: a gang, we don't want to be ejected from the tribe. 88 00:04:24,360 --> 00:04:28,159 Speaker 2: So we just buddy, we become something we're not, just 89 00:04:28,240 --> 00:04:31,520 Speaker 2: so so that we don't get rejected. And I reckon, 90 00:04:32,040 --> 00:04:33,960 Speaker 2: I've done it. I'm going to say, I reckon, it 91 00:04:34,040 --> 00:04:37,880 Speaker 2: sucks and it's bullshit. But of course I've been victim 92 00:04:37,960 --> 00:04:40,560 Speaker 2: to that bullshit, you know, And now I don't. But 93 00:04:40,720 --> 00:04:44,040 Speaker 2: I do notice occasionally things that I feel like, God, 94 00:04:44,080 --> 00:04:45,760 Speaker 2: I've got no choice, you know, I'm going to have 95 00:04:45,839 --> 00:04:52,760 Speaker 2: to bloody fit into that. But I think, yeah. 96 00:04:51,360 --> 00:04:55,600 Speaker 1: I call it. I call that the enormity of conformity, right, Yeah, 97 00:04:56,520 --> 00:04:59,200 Speaker 1: do you like that? It's just yeah, I mean that 98 00:05:00,760 --> 00:05:03,400 Speaker 1: I agree with you. And but the tough bit is, 99 00:05:04,839 --> 00:05:07,560 Speaker 1: you know, you don't want to be living on an island. 100 00:05:07,720 --> 00:05:10,560 Speaker 1: You do want connection, you do want to be you know, 101 00:05:10,640 --> 00:05:13,320 Speaker 1: you want to belong, you want to be needed, Valu'd wanted. 102 00:05:14,440 --> 00:05:16,640 Speaker 1: Most of us want to be part of something bigger 103 00:05:16,640 --> 00:05:19,200 Speaker 1: than us, which means being part of a group or 104 00:05:19,240 --> 00:05:24,880 Speaker 1: a tribe or whatever, a family or a social construct. Yeah. 105 00:05:24,920 --> 00:05:29,960 Speaker 1: I think the challenge is not belonging to a group 106 00:05:32,120 --> 00:05:35,680 Speaker 1: that where you have to think a certain way, be 107 00:05:35,800 --> 00:05:39,839 Speaker 1: a certain way, you know, where the power to disagree 108 00:05:39,920 --> 00:05:45,679 Speaker 1: or think critically or be you know, somewhat atypical, where 109 00:05:45,720 --> 00:05:49,080 Speaker 1: that's not taken away from you. You know, it's like 110 00:05:49,760 --> 00:05:52,360 Speaker 1: if you belong to a group where if you don't 111 00:05:52,400 --> 00:05:54,919 Speaker 1: think like us, talk like us, behave like us, and 112 00:05:55,120 --> 00:05:58,680 Speaker 1: advocate our philosophy, then you're not part of us. You 113 00:05:58,800 --> 00:06:02,400 Speaker 1: can't belong. Well, that's that's a fucking cult. 114 00:06:03,160 --> 00:06:03,359 Speaker 2: You know. 115 00:06:03,400 --> 00:06:05,760 Speaker 1: It does have to be religious to be a cult, right, 116 00:06:05,800 --> 00:06:08,280 Speaker 1: there are a lot of cults that are they're basically 117 00:06:08,480 --> 00:06:11,960 Speaker 1: thought cults, Like this is how you have to think 118 00:06:12,000 --> 00:06:17,400 Speaker 1: to belong. Yeah, And I think that's the I think 119 00:06:17,440 --> 00:06:20,960 Speaker 1: that's the challenge is you know, some like for me, 120 00:06:21,240 --> 00:06:23,920 Speaker 1: I've always been a little bit weird, you know, don't drink, 121 00:06:23,960 --> 00:06:27,200 Speaker 1: don't smoke, han't had a job for nearly forty years, 122 00:06:27,240 --> 00:06:31,560 Speaker 1: like an actual employee job. I've avoided work very fucking 123 00:06:31,640 --> 00:06:35,560 Speaker 1: successfully and not better or worse than anyone, and not 124 00:06:35,640 --> 00:06:40,040 Speaker 1: drastically different, but just thinking how can I be me 125 00:06:40,279 --> 00:06:44,159 Speaker 1: but also still have connection with others? And I reckon 126 00:06:44,200 --> 00:06:46,800 Speaker 1: One of the great questions is how can I have 127 00:06:46,880 --> 00:06:48,960 Speaker 1: friends and people that I love and that love me, 128 00:06:49,360 --> 00:06:54,320 Speaker 1: that are fucking nothing like me maybe, and that's okay, yeah, yeah. 129 00:06:54,360 --> 00:06:56,200 Speaker 2: And I think it's about having the guts in the 130 00:06:56,200 --> 00:06:58,359 Speaker 2: first place to stand up and say, well, this is 131 00:06:58,360 --> 00:07:01,480 Speaker 2: who I am, knowing that you're going to lose people, 132 00:07:01,560 --> 00:07:03,960 Speaker 2: you know, knowing that there's a risk of being ejected. 133 00:07:04,360 --> 00:07:07,200 Speaker 2: But I think that if you can stand this strong 134 00:07:07,320 --> 00:07:10,960 Speaker 2: enough for long enough, the right people are attracted to that. 135 00:07:11,320 --> 00:07:13,640 Speaker 2: You know. It's kind of like being a glow worm, 136 00:07:14,040 --> 00:07:18,160 Speaker 2: you know, and you just, I don't know, it's buty scary. 137 00:07:18,280 --> 00:07:20,520 Speaker 2: I think that people won't take that first step and 138 00:07:20,600 --> 00:07:23,400 Speaker 2: actually slam their stake into the ground and say this 139 00:07:23,440 --> 00:07:26,840 Speaker 2: is who I am, like me or not because they 140 00:07:26,840 --> 00:07:28,800 Speaker 2: don't want to be alone. And I get, I completely 141 00:07:28,840 --> 00:07:31,920 Speaker 2: understand and agree with you that we all need connection, 142 00:07:32,040 --> 00:07:34,080 Speaker 2: we all need belonging, you know, we've got to be 143 00:07:34,680 --> 00:07:37,600 Speaker 2: part of something. But do we have the guts to 144 00:07:37,640 --> 00:07:41,440 Speaker 2: say what I currently belong to is toxic and cult like, 145 00:07:41,560 --> 00:07:44,320 Speaker 2: you know, because it's forcing me to wear a Maskt's 146 00:07:44,320 --> 00:07:45,920 Speaker 2: forcing me to be who I don't want to be. 147 00:07:46,440 --> 00:07:49,600 Speaker 2: And how do I find that group where I actually 148 00:07:49,640 --> 00:07:52,200 Speaker 2: can have a voice and be authentic and be me? 149 00:07:52,760 --> 00:07:55,240 Speaker 2: And I think you can't find that until you actually 150 00:07:55,720 --> 00:08:00,040 Speaker 2: take the step and be authentic and then hope that 151 00:08:00,080 --> 00:08:03,840 Speaker 2: the right people are attracted to you. You know, like 152 00:08:04,000 --> 00:08:05,920 Speaker 2: I look at I look at Tiff, and I like 153 00:08:06,480 --> 00:08:10,360 Speaker 2: we're attracted to each other. You know, I think you're gorgeous. No, 154 00:08:10,520 --> 00:08:15,040 Speaker 2: not like that, you know, well I did, now, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. 155 00:08:15,640 --> 00:08:17,280 Speaker 1: If I'm getting in there, if you two want me 156 00:08:17,320 --> 00:08:19,320 Speaker 1: to leave and just switch off the light as I go, 157 00:08:19,560 --> 00:08:20,440 Speaker 1: just fucking let me know. 158 00:08:22,400 --> 00:08:23,880 Speaker 2: Yeah, you have big spunked ive. 159 00:08:24,120 --> 00:08:24,280 Speaker 1: No. 160 00:08:24,320 --> 00:08:28,080 Speaker 2: But because because I always say that TIFF's one of 161 00:08:28,080 --> 00:08:30,640 Speaker 2: the most courageous, vulnerable people I know. Do you know 162 00:08:30,720 --> 00:08:33,960 Speaker 2: that she's really really put a heart on the table 163 00:08:33,960 --> 00:08:36,520 Speaker 2: out there to be stabbed and kind of said, well, 164 00:08:36,559 --> 00:08:40,120 Speaker 2: this is who I am and I'm not perfect. I suck, 165 00:08:40,240 --> 00:08:42,920 Speaker 2: but I'm trying my hardest, you know, and I really 166 00:08:43,040 --> 00:08:45,800 Speaker 2: admire that. So I'm attracted to that kind of thing. 167 00:08:46,080 --> 00:08:48,160 Speaker 2: You know, TIFF's obviously attracted to the same thing, and 168 00:08:48,200 --> 00:08:49,800 Speaker 2: you're like that, HAPs you know, it's kind of like, 169 00:08:50,000 --> 00:08:52,200 Speaker 2: this is who I am, and if you don't like it, 170 00:08:52,480 --> 00:08:55,480 Speaker 2: I'm sorry. I Actually I have this mantra I want 171 00:08:55,520 --> 00:08:57,800 Speaker 2: you to like me, but I don't need you to 172 00:08:58,000 --> 00:09:00,880 Speaker 2: like me, do you you know? It's kind and I 173 00:09:00,920 --> 00:09:04,240 Speaker 2: think we've got to have the guts to actually stand 174 00:09:04,280 --> 00:09:09,000 Speaker 2: in that space first. And I reckon, that's really bloody 175 00:09:09,040 --> 00:09:12,480 Speaker 2: hard because we've been told all our lives. Don't you 176 00:09:12,600 --> 00:09:15,960 Speaker 2: dare step out of line? You know you won't have 177 00:09:15,960 --> 00:09:17,679 Speaker 2: a job, no one will marry you, no one will 178 00:09:17,679 --> 00:09:20,480 Speaker 2: love you. Do you know you won't have friends? All 179 00:09:20,520 --> 00:09:24,920 Speaker 2: of that kind of bullshit that people that have got 180 00:09:25,000 --> 00:09:28,560 Speaker 2: filled with fear tell us, you know, to protect them, 181 00:09:28,679 --> 00:09:31,440 Speaker 2: or that they think they're protecting us. I'm not sure, 182 00:09:31,480 --> 00:09:35,000 Speaker 2: but I think it's tough. I feel sorry for people 183 00:09:35,000 --> 00:09:36,560 Speaker 2: who can't be themselves. 184 00:09:37,240 --> 00:09:40,520 Speaker 1: I had a lecturer at university my first time at UNI, 185 00:09:40,679 --> 00:09:44,280 Speaker 1: my first degree, and he doctor Paul Callery, who played 186 00:09:44,280 --> 00:09:47,080 Speaker 1: football also and kilderr and Melbourne. He used to say 187 00:09:47,080 --> 00:09:49,360 Speaker 1: to me, mister Harper, I don't know way on me that, 188 00:09:49,840 --> 00:09:53,160 Speaker 1: mister Harper. He goes, if you don't want to offend anyone, 189 00:09:53,280 --> 00:09:57,600 Speaker 1: then say nothing, do nothing, be nothing, and stand for nothing. Yeah, 190 00:09:57,760 --> 00:10:01,240 Speaker 1: you know that's what I'm like. That's pretty fucking accurate. 191 00:10:01,320 --> 00:10:04,679 Speaker 1: It's like and even then someone's still going to find 192 00:10:04,679 --> 00:10:08,400 Speaker 1: a reason. I did a workshop on so we're recording 193 00:10:08,440 --> 00:10:11,679 Speaker 1: this Tuesday. I did a workshop on Sunday, Karen, and 194 00:10:11,760 --> 00:10:15,200 Speaker 1: it was just a private, twenty people, small group. Five 195 00:10:15,240 --> 00:10:19,920 Speaker 1: hours though, and this lady came up to me. I 196 00:10:19,960 --> 00:10:22,040 Speaker 1: remember her name, but I won't say her name. And 197 00:10:22,080 --> 00:10:24,520 Speaker 1: she's like, because I was talking about it doesn't matter 198 00:10:24,559 --> 00:10:26,360 Speaker 1: what you do, even if you've got the best intentions, 199 00:10:26,360 --> 00:10:28,680 Speaker 1: you're the best person. You're coming from a platform of 200 00:10:28,720 --> 00:10:31,320 Speaker 1: love and kindness and care. One, you're going to fuck 201 00:10:31,400 --> 00:10:34,079 Speaker 1: things up. Of course I fuck things up every hour. 202 00:10:34,800 --> 00:10:38,800 Speaker 1: But two, there will also be people who don't like you, 203 00:10:38,840 --> 00:10:41,520 Speaker 1: don't resonate with you, and potentially fucking hate you, right 204 00:10:41,640 --> 00:10:45,640 Speaker 1: despite the fact that you are trying to be compassionate, 205 00:10:45,640 --> 00:10:48,720 Speaker 1: aware and all of those things. And anyway, this lady 206 00:10:48,720 --> 00:10:50,280 Speaker 1: comes up to me and she goes, oh, it's funny 207 00:10:50,320 --> 00:10:53,240 Speaker 1: you say that. She goes, my first husband hates you. 208 00:10:53,800 --> 00:10:57,520 Speaker 1: And this was in the break and I said, oh, 209 00:10:57,559 --> 00:11:01,920 Speaker 1: well that's a pretty big club, so welcome, and I said, 210 00:11:02,280 --> 00:11:05,000 Speaker 1: has he ever met me? She goes, no, she hates 211 00:11:05,040 --> 00:11:09,559 Speaker 1: you because I came home from a workshop, and she said, 212 00:11:09,720 --> 00:11:13,280 Speaker 1: and not the same day, but pretty much the result 213 00:11:13,400 --> 00:11:16,040 Speaker 1: of me coming home from what your workshop was realizing 214 00:11:16,080 --> 00:11:18,720 Speaker 1: a whole lot of things, making decisions and leaving him 215 00:11:19,160 --> 00:11:23,520 Speaker 1: so like he doesn't blame himself, he blames me, like 216 00:11:23,640 --> 00:11:27,800 Speaker 1: he's got no part, he didn't do anything wrong, Like 217 00:11:28,040 --> 00:11:31,040 Speaker 1: I'm the I caused the demise of his I'm like 218 00:11:31,240 --> 00:11:35,640 Speaker 1: fucking talk about lack of awareness, ownership, you know, courage, 219 00:11:35,800 --> 00:11:37,800 Speaker 1: all that, but it's that's the thing, you know. And 220 00:11:38,600 --> 00:11:40,560 Speaker 1: I mean, we have thousands of people listen to this 221 00:11:40,679 --> 00:11:44,040 Speaker 1: every day in a bunch of countries. And and if 222 00:11:44,080 --> 00:11:48,160 Speaker 1: I thought about if I went, all, gee, how do 223 00:11:48,200 --> 00:11:50,320 Speaker 1: I have this conversation with Karen, how do I ask 224 00:11:50,320 --> 00:11:52,920 Speaker 1: this question? How do I respond if I did all 225 00:11:52,960 --> 00:11:57,400 Speaker 1: of that from the premise of not wanting to or 226 00:11:57,520 --> 00:12:02,400 Speaker 1: not being okay at least with the possibility that I'm 227 00:12:02,440 --> 00:12:06,120 Speaker 1: going to offend someone, even that I'll put a asterisk 228 00:12:06,240 --> 00:12:09,400 Speaker 1: next too, because me offending one seems that like I 229 00:12:09,440 --> 00:12:13,440 Speaker 1: am responsible for other people's feelings. We can talk about that. Yeah, 230 00:12:13,600 --> 00:12:15,920 Speaker 1: but I'd never do a fucking episode. I'd never have 231 00:12:16,040 --> 00:12:18,360 Speaker 1: a conversation. I'd never write a book. I'd never do 232 00:12:18,440 --> 00:12:21,839 Speaker 1: a workshop, because that's just part of it, you know. 233 00:12:21,920 --> 00:12:25,360 Speaker 1: And So if you want a platform anyone listening, if 234 00:12:25,360 --> 00:12:27,440 Speaker 1: you want to run workshops, you want a podcast, you 235 00:12:27,480 --> 00:12:29,840 Speaker 1: want to do workshops, seminars, you want to be a 236 00:12:29,880 --> 00:12:34,000 Speaker 1: front facing person with a public audience, and you don't 237 00:12:34,080 --> 00:12:37,680 Speaker 1: want to get hurt, offended, disler, Well pick another job. 238 00:12:38,160 --> 00:12:40,680 Speaker 1: I can go and become a gardener and work for yourself, 239 00:12:40,720 --> 00:12:43,800 Speaker 1: and don't because it's it doesn't matter who you are, 240 00:12:43,920 --> 00:12:46,440 Speaker 1: how you are, someone's going to fucking hate you. Welcome 241 00:12:46,440 --> 00:12:47,920 Speaker 1: to the club, right one. 242 00:12:48,960 --> 00:12:51,720 Speaker 2: And I think an extension of that also is you 243 00:12:51,800 --> 00:12:54,320 Speaker 2: have to actually be willing to be vulnerable and say 244 00:12:54,320 --> 00:12:56,439 Speaker 2: I don't know. Because if you're going to have any 245 00:12:56,559 --> 00:12:59,240 Speaker 2: kind of platform, somebody's going to approach you or come 246 00:12:59,280 --> 00:13:01,920 Speaker 2: back at you with a question or a statement that 247 00:13:02,000 --> 00:13:04,040 Speaker 2: you actually don't know the answer to all, or you 248 00:13:04,040 --> 00:13:06,520 Speaker 2: don't have a response to the You have to actually 249 00:13:06,559 --> 00:13:09,559 Speaker 2: be able to say, I freaking don't know. I actually 250 00:13:09,600 --> 00:13:11,320 Speaker 2: I don't even know what to say with that, you know, 251 00:13:11,360 --> 00:13:14,360 Speaker 2: because we try to be a big pompous know it all, 252 00:13:14,440 --> 00:13:16,960 Speaker 2: none of us do. None of us know everything. So 253 00:13:17,520 --> 00:13:20,440 Speaker 2: there's both sides. Yes, don't get a if you're going 254 00:13:20,480 --> 00:13:22,480 Speaker 2: to you're going to offend people. People are going to 255 00:13:22,559 --> 00:13:24,640 Speaker 2: hate you, and you're not always going to know the answers, 256 00:13:24,840 --> 00:13:27,800 Speaker 2: and if you pretend to people call you out, people 257 00:13:27,800 --> 00:13:28,320 Speaker 2: can see it. 258 00:13:29,080 --> 00:13:32,760 Speaker 1: And I think part of that, Karen and tiff et 259 00:13:33,040 --> 00:13:36,640 Speaker 1: l is that we get our sense of self worth 260 00:13:36,679 --> 00:13:40,680 Speaker 1: and value from knowing. And I agree with you. I 261 00:13:40,679 --> 00:13:44,160 Speaker 1: wrote something recently like we are Basically I wrote that 262 00:13:44,200 --> 00:13:48,360 Speaker 1: we are addicted to being right yep, because I don't 263 00:13:48,400 --> 00:13:52,200 Speaker 1: want because especially think about this, Karen, when when you've 264 00:13:52,240 --> 00:13:56,640 Speaker 1: believed something for a long time, then that belief is 265 00:13:56,679 --> 00:14:01,160 Speaker 1: intertwined with you. It's your identity, your sense of self. 266 00:14:01,200 --> 00:14:03,600 Speaker 1: Because I know I'm right now, there's a couple of 267 00:14:03,640 --> 00:14:06,960 Speaker 1: interesting things in that. One is I know that I'm right, 268 00:14:07,840 --> 00:14:10,840 Speaker 1: wink wink, nudgs nudge. I know that I'm right. Therefore 269 00:14:10,920 --> 00:14:14,480 Speaker 1: everyone in the world who doesn't agree with me is 270 00:14:14,520 --> 00:14:19,000 Speaker 1: fucking wrong? Or how BIG's your ego? Harps right? So 271 00:14:19,080 --> 00:14:24,600 Speaker 1: there's that, and then just the idea, like the awareness 272 00:14:24,640 --> 00:14:27,280 Speaker 1: that oh, maybe me saying, look, I don't actually know 273 00:14:27,440 --> 00:14:29,560 Speaker 1: by the way, I fucked up one hundred things. I 274 00:14:29,640 --> 00:14:32,960 Speaker 1: still get trapped in ego. I'm still an overthinker, I 275 00:14:33,000 --> 00:14:36,520 Speaker 1: still have self doubt and I want you to love 276 00:14:36,600 --> 00:14:39,920 Speaker 1: me other than that, I'm a fucking warrior. I'm an alpha, 277 00:14:40,640 --> 00:14:43,720 Speaker 1: you know. But the funny thing is that that hopefully, 278 00:14:44,880 --> 00:14:49,040 Speaker 1: like I get more positive feedback, the more raw, real 279 00:14:49,200 --> 00:14:51,920 Speaker 1: and vulnerable I am, even when I'm talking about my 280 00:14:52,120 --> 00:14:56,200 Speaker 1: monumental fuck ups and flaws, like it actually creates more 281 00:14:56,280 --> 00:15:01,080 Speaker 1: connection than disconnection. But chest beating and brag an arrogance 282 00:15:01,200 --> 00:15:03,400 Speaker 1: creates the opposite of what people want. 283 00:15:03,960 --> 00:15:09,680 Speaker 2: Yep, yep, I do. I did a keynote on last Thursday, 284 00:15:09,760 --> 00:15:13,440 Speaker 2: and they actually wanted me. Like, the reason they wanted 285 00:15:13,480 --> 00:15:16,320 Speaker 2: me was because I admit my fuck ups. Do you know? 286 00:15:16,360 --> 00:15:18,720 Speaker 2: They wanted someone to stand on that stage and say, 287 00:15:18,880 --> 00:15:22,400 Speaker 2: I have fucked up over and over and over, but 288 00:15:22,480 --> 00:15:24,600 Speaker 2: I've still come through. Do you know? You know I've 289 00:15:24,600 --> 00:15:28,400 Speaker 2: still managed to overcome the screw ups. But that's that's 290 00:15:28,440 --> 00:15:31,080 Speaker 2: what they were looking for. They said, we want someone 291 00:15:31,080 --> 00:15:35,120 Speaker 2: who's real and honest, and who is who has stuffed up? 292 00:15:35,280 --> 00:15:37,440 Speaker 2: Do we want? People want to show people that if 293 00:15:37,480 --> 00:15:40,480 Speaker 2: you have courage and you admit you're wrong, you know 294 00:15:40,800 --> 00:15:42,840 Speaker 2: you can actually achieve stuff. 295 00:15:42,880 --> 00:15:46,400 Speaker 1: So yeah, tell us about tell us about one or 296 00:15:46,440 --> 00:15:49,520 Speaker 1: two of those fuck ups and tell us what you 297 00:15:49,640 --> 00:15:52,600 Speaker 1: learned and how you grew well. 298 00:15:52,640 --> 00:15:54,600 Speaker 2: I reckon the best one was I started one Planet 299 00:15:54,640 --> 00:15:58,120 Speaker 2: classrooms and it was so I wrote Magnificent Kids. A 300 00:15:58,120 --> 00:16:00,560 Speaker 2: guy in Africa saw my book and I he wanted 301 00:16:00,600 --> 00:16:03,360 Speaker 2: to start this program. He said, can I start? I 302 00:16:03,360 --> 00:16:07,000 Speaker 2: want to start Magnificent classes And I said fantastic. And 303 00:16:07,000 --> 00:16:09,000 Speaker 2: then he said, will you skype with my class? This 304 00:16:09,040 --> 00:16:11,440 Speaker 2: is back in Scotts yep. Then I said, well, why 305 00:16:11,440 --> 00:16:13,000 Speaker 2: don't I get one of the kids in the book 306 00:16:13,040 --> 00:16:14,840 Speaker 2: to skype with your class? He said yeah, And then 307 00:16:14,840 --> 00:16:17,120 Speaker 2: I went one further, so why don't I get a 308 00:16:17,160 --> 00:16:21,720 Speaker 2: class in Australia to skype with your class in Africa. Anyway, 309 00:16:21,760 --> 00:16:23,560 Speaker 2: it kind of just went out of control and I 310 00:16:23,600 --> 00:16:26,560 Speaker 2: had thirty laptops donated to me and I thought, well, 311 00:16:26,560 --> 00:16:28,160 Speaker 2: I'm going to have to start a business. I don't 312 00:16:28,160 --> 00:16:31,560 Speaker 2: know what to do with all these laptops. Then I 313 00:16:31,600 --> 00:16:34,520 Speaker 2: had forty five schools in Africa signed up to do 314 00:16:34,640 --> 00:16:37,440 Speaker 2: this skyping project. This is in a couple of weeks. Like. 315 00:16:37,520 --> 00:16:40,600 Speaker 2: It just went off like that, and I had this 316 00:16:40,800 --> 00:16:44,520 Speaker 2: great idea, Wow, how fantastic this business? You know, they 317 00:16:44,840 --> 00:16:47,800 Speaker 2: get pen pals online and everything else. It took me 318 00:16:47,880 --> 00:16:51,720 Speaker 2: eighteen months. I finally sent these twenty eight laptops to 319 00:16:52,120 --> 00:16:56,800 Speaker 2: Uganda a long story, but anyway, basically, I sent laptops 320 00:16:56,840 --> 00:17:01,160 Speaker 2: to a country where the kids were sleep when our 321 00:17:01,240 --> 00:17:03,640 Speaker 2: kids were in school, so I hadn't even thought about 322 00:17:03,880 --> 00:17:06,640 Speaker 2: time zones. Spent eighteen months on this, but didn't think 323 00:17:06,680 --> 00:17:09,720 Speaker 2: about time zones once. And not only that, I sent 324 00:17:09,840 --> 00:17:12,000 Speaker 2: laptops to a country ninety five percent of them don't 325 00:17:12,040 --> 00:17:15,320 Speaker 2: even have power, so it was kind of like and 326 00:17:15,720 --> 00:17:17,240 Speaker 2: so they had to take it down to a market, 327 00:17:17,240 --> 00:17:19,679 Speaker 2: trickle feed it for twenty four hours, you know, and 328 00:17:19,720 --> 00:17:24,359 Speaker 2: it was just a fucking nightmare. But what I learned 329 00:17:24,640 --> 00:17:27,760 Speaker 2: was and so I said, well, what about if I 330 00:17:27,800 --> 00:17:30,960 Speaker 2: put in some solar systems into some schools? And that 331 00:17:31,119 --> 00:17:33,200 Speaker 2: was great, but I still couldn't skype, but at least 332 00:17:33,200 --> 00:17:35,240 Speaker 2: they could use the computers. And then what I learned 333 00:17:35,280 --> 00:17:39,119 Speaker 2: from that was that the girls were sleeping over So 334 00:17:39,160 --> 00:17:42,199 Speaker 2: they go to primary school, goes to P seven and 335 00:17:42,240 --> 00:17:44,600 Speaker 2: then they go to high school. But if the girls 336 00:17:44,600 --> 00:17:47,560 Speaker 2: don't pass, they get married off, so and they can't 337 00:17:47,600 --> 00:17:49,960 Speaker 2: pass because they're going and getting all the water, you know, 338 00:17:50,080 --> 00:17:52,720 Speaker 2: and that kind of stuff. So by having the solar system, 339 00:17:52,760 --> 00:17:55,240 Speaker 2: the girls were sleeping at the schools for two weeks 340 00:17:55,280 --> 00:17:58,480 Speaker 2: studying to make sure because they've now got power to 341 00:17:58,520 --> 00:18:01,800 Speaker 2: make sure that they pass for to go to secondary 342 00:18:01,840 --> 00:18:05,359 Speaker 2: so essentially saving all these girls, well really saving their 343 00:18:05,400 --> 00:18:10,320 Speaker 2: lives because their marriages are often result in death, murder 344 00:18:10,920 --> 00:18:14,080 Speaker 2: and then But what I also learned from this was 345 00:18:14,119 --> 00:18:16,399 Speaker 2: that I'm like, well, why the girls getting water? Like 346 00:18:16,600 --> 00:18:19,520 Speaker 2: what's happening here? And there's not a shortage of water 347 00:18:19,560 --> 00:18:22,920 Speaker 2: in Uganda, but this is a lot of African countries, 348 00:18:23,119 --> 00:18:26,480 Speaker 2: but a shortage of infrastructure to capture the water. So 349 00:18:26,520 --> 00:18:30,880 Speaker 2: I started putting in water tanks into the schools so 350 00:18:30,920 --> 00:18:32,960 Speaker 2: the kids they could catch the water instead of the 351 00:18:33,000 --> 00:18:37,360 Speaker 2: girls getting them. I put you know, connected water down 352 00:18:37,400 --> 00:18:39,920 Speaker 2: to villagers, put water wells and all that kind of 353 00:18:39,920 --> 00:18:42,879 Speaker 2: stuff in. So what that did is it kept the 354 00:18:42,920 --> 00:18:46,720 Speaker 2: girls in school, and we were doing sanitary pads and 355 00:18:46,760 --> 00:18:49,000 Speaker 2: that kind of stuff, so little girls would go off 356 00:18:49,000 --> 00:18:52,160 Speaker 2: collecting water at lunchtime and missay out on all that school. 357 00:18:52,400 --> 00:18:54,920 Speaker 2: They're getting sexually assaulted and raped all the way. They're 358 00:18:54,960 --> 00:18:57,080 Speaker 2: girls as young as three, do you know this kind 359 00:18:57,119 --> 00:19:01,919 Speaker 2: of stuff. Teenage girls are swapping sex for sanitary items 360 00:19:01,920 --> 00:19:04,000 Speaker 2: so they could stay in school so they won't get 361 00:19:04,000 --> 00:19:09,560 Speaker 2: married off. You know, HIV just bloody rampant. So yeah, 362 00:19:09,600 --> 00:19:14,040 Speaker 2: so that monumental fuck up of sending laptops to a 363 00:19:14,080 --> 00:19:16,280 Speaker 2: country where it was never going to work my initial 364 00:19:16,640 --> 00:19:21,679 Speaker 2: great project. So it turned into saving many, many, many lives, 365 00:19:21,680 --> 00:19:25,280 Speaker 2: and not just the ones directly saved, but the families 366 00:19:25,359 --> 00:19:27,760 Speaker 2: of these people, you know, because the girls could now 367 00:19:27,800 --> 00:19:32,520 Speaker 2: get jobs. And yeah, so I like telling that story 368 00:19:32,560 --> 00:19:34,760 Speaker 2: because I actually liked it. I fucked up, you know 369 00:19:34,960 --> 00:19:39,000 Speaker 2: it great. They could have been skype buddies or zoom 370 00:19:39,000 --> 00:19:42,399 Speaker 2: buddies now and all that. But you know, and I 371 00:19:42,400 --> 00:19:45,360 Speaker 2: didn't know all that, you know, I just thought, I, 372 00:19:45,480 --> 00:19:48,879 Speaker 2: actually it's got there's a think all white man's white 373 00:19:48,880 --> 00:19:50,399 Speaker 2: man's burden or something like that. 374 00:19:50,480 --> 00:19:50,679 Speaker 1: You know. 375 00:19:50,760 --> 00:19:53,720 Speaker 2: Here I was thinking that, you know, it's that typical 376 00:19:53,760 --> 00:19:55,760 Speaker 2: white person sing or I want to help those poor 377 00:19:55,800 --> 00:19:58,200 Speaker 2: people in Africa, do you know that kind of stuff, 378 00:19:58,240 --> 00:20:03,160 Speaker 2: and without much knowledge, with that out much information, probably thinking, 379 00:20:03,400 --> 00:20:06,600 Speaker 2: you know, even a degree of prejudice, really and not 380 00:20:06,600 --> 00:20:10,240 Speaker 2: not not racism, but prejudice. I'm better. You know, I've 381 00:20:10,240 --> 00:20:12,600 Speaker 2: got more. You know that I can help because I 382 00:20:12,680 --> 00:20:16,720 Speaker 2: know more. But what a load of shit, because you 383 00:20:16,800 --> 00:20:21,600 Speaker 2: know it's what you know. But the point is, though 384 00:20:21,840 --> 00:20:25,680 Speaker 2: I will say this, so you keep making these assumptions 385 00:20:25,720 --> 00:20:27,920 Speaker 2: about things and unless you actually have the courage to 386 00:20:27,960 --> 00:20:30,320 Speaker 2: put your foot in it, you know, and to put 387 00:20:30,560 --> 00:20:33,359 Speaker 2: take a step forward and go, well, I don't fucking know, 388 00:20:33,440 --> 00:20:35,600 Speaker 2: so let me find out. And then you're probably going 389 00:20:35,680 --> 00:20:37,359 Speaker 2: to get punched in the chest and in the face 390 00:20:37,440 --> 00:20:40,080 Speaker 2: because you were wrong. You know. That takes a lot 391 00:20:40,080 --> 00:20:44,320 Speaker 2: of guts, and without sounding like a wank, ride mine 392 00:20:44,440 --> 00:20:47,479 Speaker 2: myself for having the guts to step up, do you know, 393 00:20:47,640 --> 00:20:50,639 Speaker 2: even though I knew nothing about what I was doing. 394 00:20:50,720 --> 00:20:54,720 Speaker 1: So that's amazing. That's like, now I love you as well. 395 00:20:54,920 --> 00:20:59,360 Speaker 1: Now thanks, No, that's that's incredible. I mean, I've never 396 00:20:59,400 --> 00:21:02,960 Speaker 1: done anything that's fucking important in my whole life, so 397 00:21:02,960 --> 00:21:07,880 Speaker 1: so you're a hero. How I've got so many questions 398 00:21:07,880 --> 00:21:10,679 Speaker 1: out of that. Firstly, why are the girls going and 399 00:21:10,680 --> 00:21:12,800 Speaker 1: getting the water? What the fuck are the boys doing? 400 00:21:12,960 --> 00:21:14,320 Speaker 1: What was that about? 401 00:21:14,760 --> 00:21:17,359 Speaker 2: That's the way they live. The girls are. The girls 402 00:21:17,400 --> 00:21:21,280 Speaker 2: do everything. The boys do nothing. So the girls girls 403 00:21:21,320 --> 00:21:26,080 Speaker 2: go dig for sweet potatoes, they gather the sticks for 404 00:21:26,119 --> 00:21:28,679 Speaker 2: the stove, they do the cooking, they do they go 405 00:21:28,760 --> 00:21:31,520 Speaker 2: to the market. The boys do nothing, and they grow up. 406 00:21:31,560 --> 00:21:33,960 Speaker 2: This is the problem with the men. The men turn 407 00:21:34,040 --> 00:21:37,000 Speaker 2: into just alcoholics and sit around and beat the women up. 408 00:21:37,200 --> 00:21:39,560 Speaker 2: They live in one room huts. This is going to 409 00:21:39,600 --> 00:21:42,960 Speaker 2: sound awful and sorry if this, you know, triggers anyone. 410 00:21:42,960 --> 00:21:45,399 Speaker 2: But they live in one room mud huts and the 411 00:21:45,440 --> 00:21:48,159 Speaker 2: men are coming home beating and raping the wives in 412 00:21:48,200 --> 00:21:50,880 Speaker 2: front of in front of the kids. So the boys think, 413 00:21:51,119 --> 00:21:54,399 Speaker 2: they all think, is this is how it is? You know, 414 00:21:54,480 --> 00:21:57,399 Speaker 2: the girls aren't going Oh no, I think there should 415 00:21:57,440 --> 00:21:59,600 Speaker 2: be a better way to do this, you know, because 416 00:21:59,600 --> 00:22:04,360 Speaker 2: there's the boys grew up thinking. With our school sponsorship program, 417 00:22:04,440 --> 00:22:06,600 Speaker 2: which I've just wrapped up this year, but it went 418 00:22:06,640 --> 00:22:11,000 Speaker 2: for eight years, we put through almost an equal number 419 00:22:11,000 --> 00:22:13,639 Speaker 2: of boys as girls, and I got a lot of 420 00:22:13,680 --> 00:22:16,640 Speaker 2: criticism for that. You know, the girls need to get 421 00:22:16,680 --> 00:22:21,600 Speaker 2: through school and they need to you know, passy, why 422 00:22:21,640 --> 00:22:25,439 Speaker 2: are we supporting boys? And my answer was because if 423 00:22:25,480 --> 00:22:28,560 Speaker 2: the boys go through school with the girls under this program, 424 00:22:28,560 --> 00:22:31,000 Speaker 2: they might respect them. You know, we might actually get 425 00:22:31,040 --> 00:22:34,080 Speaker 2: some respectful men coming out the other side. 426 00:22:34,200 --> 00:22:37,520 Speaker 1: So that must be a challenge. That must be a 427 00:22:37,640 --> 00:22:43,280 Speaker 1: challenge because you've got this cultural kind of norm you know, 428 00:22:43,320 --> 00:22:48,280 Speaker 1: this as horrible and terrible and destructive as it is, 429 00:22:48,880 --> 00:22:51,520 Speaker 1: I mean, for them growing up that was their version 430 00:22:51,560 --> 00:22:55,760 Speaker 1: of normal. Yep, Like they wouldn't have known. It's like, 431 00:22:55,760 --> 00:22:58,680 Speaker 1: like you said, the girls are not sitting around thinking, hey, 432 00:22:58,680 --> 00:23:01,040 Speaker 1: I reckon, we can do better. I reckon we should push, 433 00:23:01,080 --> 00:23:04,680 Speaker 1: but like they just are born into that. Yeah, And 434 00:23:05,320 --> 00:23:09,960 Speaker 1: so I mean what you did is I'm sure there's 435 00:23:10,000 --> 00:23:13,400 Speaker 1: still a way to go, but it's you know, helping 436 00:23:13,640 --> 00:23:19,160 Speaker 1: turn that ship around, that cultural, that thinking, that behavioral 437 00:23:19,240 --> 00:23:23,000 Speaker 1: kind of ship in the opposite direction. I mean that 438 00:23:23,080 --> 00:23:26,400 Speaker 1: must How does that make you feel when you unpack 439 00:23:26,520 --> 00:23:31,479 Speaker 1: that many people's lives where you know that for a 440 00:23:31,640 --> 00:23:33,520 Speaker 1: very long time, that's just how it was. 441 00:23:34,760 --> 00:23:36,879 Speaker 2: It makes me feel good, but I also going to 442 00:23:36,920 --> 00:23:39,119 Speaker 2: it makes me feel great. But I'm also going to 443 00:23:39,160 --> 00:23:42,280 Speaker 2: say that for a long time, I didn't feel like 444 00:23:42,320 --> 00:23:46,760 Speaker 2: it was enough. I had this mentality and I still 445 00:23:47,080 --> 00:23:49,440 Speaker 2: wish I could, but you know, I wanted to save 446 00:23:49,480 --> 00:23:51,240 Speaker 2: the world, you know, I wanted to save everyone. Was 447 00:23:51,320 --> 00:23:53,240 Speaker 2: kind of like, I'm not saving enough people, I'm not 448 00:23:53,280 --> 00:23:57,280 Speaker 2: impacting enough people. But I've really come to you know, 449 00:23:57,280 --> 00:23:59,800 Speaker 2: I now have a keynote about what your puzzle piece do? 450 00:23:59,840 --> 00:24:01,640 Speaker 2: You know? And it's kind of like I've really come 451 00:24:01,680 --> 00:24:04,600 Speaker 2: to the conclusion and understood now that we've all got 452 00:24:04,640 --> 00:24:07,600 Speaker 2: a piece of the puzzle to put in, you know, 453 00:24:07,640 --> 00:24:09,360 Speaker 2: and we all have to do the best we can 454 00:24:09,440 --> 00:24:12,040 Speaker 2: on that piece of the puzzle, and we simply can't 455 00:24:12,440 --> 00:24:15,919 Speaker 2: do everything. And that was a hard lesson for me 456 00:24:15,960 --> 00:24:19,160 Speaker 2: to learn because I was like, well, you know, I've 457 00:24:19,200 --> 00:24:21,520 Speaker 2: never been to Africa, and yet I was making all 458 00:24:21,560 --> 00:24:24,760 Speaker 2: these changes, and I was like seeing, wow, this is 459 00:24:24,800 --> 00:24:27,560 Speaker 2: actually not as hard as people think, you know, to 460 00:24:27,680 --> 00:24:30,160 Speaker 2: really have a big impact. And so therefore you get 461 00:24:30,160 --> 00:24:32,840 Speaker 2: a little bit full of yourself and I don't mean egotistically, 462 00:24:32,920 --> 00:24:36,639 Speaker 2: but kind of like you're not putting a lid on 463 00:24:36,640 --> 00:24:39,000 Speaker 2: your potential, and you go, fucking hell, I can change. 464 00:24:39,400 --> 00:24:42,639 Speaker 2: I can do bigger and bigger and bigger. But the 465 00:24:42,680 --> 00:24:47,200 Speaker 2: truth is you actually end up burnt out with compassion, fatigued, 466 00:24:47,280 --> 00:24:51,680 Speaker 2: you know, because you start to realize that it's too 467 00:24:51,720 --> 00:24:54,040 Speaker 2: big for me, and then you start to feel like 468 00:24:54,080 --> 00:24:57,280 Speaker 2: a failure because now I can't do all the things 469 00:24:57,320 --> 00:25:01,000 Speaker 2: I wish I could. But and then then you've got 470 00:25:01,000 --> 00:25:03,520 Speaker 2: to have a really good hard look that go, well, 471 00:25:03,560 --> 00:25:06,320 Speaker 2: what have you done and how much has that change? 472 00:25:06,400 --> 00:25:09,960 Speaker 2: And what the bit that you have done has had 473 00:25:09,960 --> 00:25:12,560 Speaker 2: a big impact. You know, and it's and it's it's 474 00:25:12,600 --> 00:25:14,359 Speaker 2: done because you did it, and if you didn't do 475 00:25:14,400 --> 00:25:17,280 Speaker 2: it, it wouldn't be done. So that'll make sense. 476 00:25:17,400 --> 00:25:22,919 Speaker 1: You just gotta so what are the things that what 477 00:25:23,000 --> 00:25:26,560 Speaker 1: are the either whether or not it's educational or experiential 478 00:25:26,800 --> 00:25:33,280 Speaker 1: or you know, sociological meetings, encounters with other people? What 479 00:25:33,359 --> 00:25:37,840 Speaker 1: are the things that informed or influenced like your thinking 480 00:25:38,080 --> 00:25:42,240 Speaker 1: and your philosophy and your ideology, Like where did that 481 00:25:42,359 --> 00:25:47,360 Speaker 1: come from? So this this thinking, this perspective, this worldview 482 00:25:47,400 --> 00:25:50,560 Speaker 1: that you have, how much of that is you DNA 483 00:25:50,800 --> 00:25:56,000 Speaker 1: and how much of that is situation, circumstance, environment, experience, encounter. 484 00:25:57,280 --> 00:26:01,320 Speaker 2: Yeah, it's a mixture. I was my father is a 485 00:26:01,400 --> 00:26:05,520 Speaker 2: really big community contributor, His mother was a really big 486 00:26:05,560 --> 00:26:09,040 Speaker 2: contributor and his father, so I kind of was already 487 00:26:09,240 --> 00:26:13,119 Speaker 2: seeing that, you know, but I went down the path 488 00:26:13,160 --> 00:26:15,680 Speaker 2: of being a rock star, you know, living that kind 489 00:26:15,720 --> 00:26:18,679 Speaker 2: of life, thinking I was in a bit. But because 490 00:26:18,680 --> 00:26:21,600 Speaker 2: that was the personality of me, is I need people 491 00:26:21,640 --> 00:26:23,639 Speaker 2: to like me, you know, and that was kind of 492 00:26:23,680 --> 00:26:25,560 Speaker 2: where and I was a bit of an odd kid, 493 00:26:25,680 --> 00:26:30,320 Speaker 2: you know, very ass bey, you know, gay, that kind 494 00:26:30,359 --> 00:26:31,639 Speaker 2: of stuff, which I didn't know when I was a 495 00:26:31,640 --> 00:26:34,959 Speaker 2: little kid, but I wanted to have friends come around 496 00:26:35,000 --> 00:26:38,000 Speaker 2: and play bands, you know, with tennis records, and they 497 00:26:38,040 --> 00:26:40,520 Speaker 2: just wanted to play with my sisters and play dolls, 498 00:26:40,560 --> 00:26:43,119 Speaker 2: and so I had all these My animals were my 499 00:26:43,200 --> 00:26:46,879 Speaker 2: best friends, and so I kind of wanted someone to 500 00:26:46,920 --> 00:26:48,879 Speaker 2: approve of me and like me. And you know, so 501 00:26:49,320 --> 00:26:53,879 Speaker 2: being a being a muso on stage that was fantastic anyway. 502 00:26:53,880 --> 00:26:57,480 Speaker 2: And then my second younger sister got cancer, and you know, 503 00:26:57,880 --> 00:27:01,480 Speaker 2: I ended up working doing the Real Life for Life 504 00:27:01,480 --> 00:27:07,400 Speaker 2: for the cancer cancel and doing warrigals first event, and 505 00:27:07,520 --> 00:27:10,159 Speaker 2: it was really successful. And then people were sort of 506 00:27:10,280 --> 00:27:16,320 Speaker 2: praising me, and this shifted from ego to altruism. I 507 00:27:17,040 --> 00:27:20,159 Speaker 2: started to realize far out, I've actually got the power 508 00:27:20,440 --> 00:27:24,879 Speaker 2: to have a really big impact on society and be 509 00:27:25,560 --> 00:27:29,480 Speaker 2: approved of or noticed for, you know, for doing good stuff, 510 00:27:29,560 --> 00:27:32,359 Speaker 2: like doing really good stuff for other people. And that 511 00:27:32,480 --> 00:27:36,200 Speaker 2: kind of got me. It really woke me up to 512 00:27:37,320 --> 00:27:40,560 Speaker 2: how much power I had that didn't have to be 513 00:27:40,600 --> 00:27:44,000 Speaker 2: about me. Do you know it actually felt good helping 514 00:27:44,080 --> 00:27:48,119 Speaker 2: other people without even getting the approval. Does that make 515 00:27:48,440 --> 00:27:49,639 Speaker 2: I was getting self. 516 00:27:49,400 --> 00:27:54,080 Speaker 1: Approval, Like it's like you have a purpose bigger than you, right, 517 00:27:54,359 --> 00:27:57,760 Speaker 1: maybe like when it's all about you, your purpose is 518 00:27:57,840 --> 00:28:03,720 Speaker 1: you, your happiness, your ego being to your instant gratification, all 519 00:28:03,760 --> 00:28:08,040 Speaker 1: that shit, right, and then and while that feels temporarily good, 520 00:28:08,240 --> 00:28:11,520 Speaker 1: it still leaves a vacuum. And it's I always say 521 00:28:11,560 --> 00:28:13,840 Speaker 1: to people, I tried selfishness for a lot. I was 522 00:28:13,960 --> 00:28:17,680 Speaker 1: really good at it, Like I'm excellent at selfishness because 523 00:28:17,680 --> 00:28:21,200 Speaker 1: I'm an only child. But it doesn't work, like there's 524 00:28:21,320 --> 00:28:26,080 Speaker 1: no it doesn't feel that spiritual, emotional kind of well, 525 00:28:26,640 --> 00:28:30,399 Speaker 1: like you still feel bankrupt because the things that you 526 00:28:30,440 --> 00:28:33,280 Speaker 1: were doing for yourself is so short lived that then 527 00:28:33,560 --> 00:28:36,080 Speaker 1: you've got to do another thing, you know, and you've 528 00:28:36,080 --> 00:28:38,440 Speaker 1: got to find something else. I need another fix, I 529 00:28:38,520 --> 00:28:43,320 Speaker 1: need more instant gratification. I need, you know, tell me 530 00:28:43,400 --> 00:28:49,880 Speaker 1: about navigating all of this being on the spectrum like 531 00:28:49,920 --> 00:28:54,280 Speaker 1: being aspy as you How is that a superpower? Is that? 532 00:28:54,680 --> 00:28:57,080 Speaker 1: I mean, I know you don't know any other way, 533 00:28:57,160 --> 00:28:58,840 Speaker 1: but it's like it's like when people say to me, 534 00:28:58,920 --> 00:29:01,440 Speaker 1: what's it like not having brothers and sisters, I go, 535 00:29:02,000 --> 00:29:05,040 Speaker 1: I don't know, I've never fucking had them. 536 00:29:05,360 --> 00:29:07,720 Speaker 2: Yeah, well I'm not diagnosed, by the way, but but 537 00:29:08,360 --> 00:29:12,200 Speaker 2: I I think it's great. I think when I was 538 00:29:12,200 --> 00:29:16,080 Speaker 2: a kid, I always felt different, you know, And I 539 00:29:16,080 --> 00:29:18,480 Speaker 2: didn't even realize this until I was in my fifties. 540 00:29:18,520 --> 00:29:22,120 Speaker 2: I honestly didn't even realize. But when I look back 541 00:29:22,160 --> 00:29:25,760 Speaker 2: and I think, wow, you know I did things my way. 542 00:29:25,920 --> 00:29:28,600 Speaker 2: You know, I'm a watch it. I call it a 543 00:29:28,680 --> 00:29:31,320 Speaker 2: multi potential light, you know, jack of all trades. But 544 00:29:31,320 --> 00:29:33,640 Speaker 2: I'm bloody good at nearly everything. You know. I don't 545 00:29:33,680 --> 00:29:35,440 Speaker 2: mean that as a wanky thing, but you know, I 546 00:29:35,440 --> 00:29:39,880 Speaker 2: can just figure out, figure out anything. And I kind 547 00:29:39,960 --> 00:29:43,280 Speaker 2: of I used to punish myself for being like that, 548 00:29:43,400 --> 00:29:45,920 Speaker 2: you know, jack of all trades, master of none. You're 549 00:29:45,920 --> 00:29:48,760 Speaker 2: a bloody dickhead. You know, you haven't got a degree, 550 00:29:48,800 --> 00:29:50,920 Speaker 2: you haven't got this, You've got no expertise in this. 551 00:29:51,600 --> 00:29:54,520 Speaker 2: But an actual fact, when I look back, it's it's 552 00:29:54,640 --> 00:29:58,960 Speaker 2: been wonderful. That aspy thing too. I think, you know, 553 00:29:59,040 --> 00:30:01,720 Speaker 2: I didn't even notice where people criticizing me. When I 554 00:30:01,760 --> 00:30:03,600 Speaker 2: think about it, do you know I've had so many 555 00:30:03,920 --> 00:30:05,840 Speaker 2: When I was a kid, I got my uncle worked 556 00:30:05,840 --> 00:30:08,640 Speaker 2: at Monash in the in the some research lab or whatever, 557 00:30:08,640 --> 00:30:12,120 Speaker 2: and he brought me a stethoscope and home from the lab, 558 00:30:12,200 --> 00:30:15,360 Speaker 2: and I put it round my you know, my neck, 559 00:30:15,400 --> 00:30:17,480 Speaker 2: and I wore it up and down the street proudly, 560 00:30:17,680 --> 00:30:20,120 Speaker 2: do you know. And because I was a tomboy, my 561 00:30:20,160 --> 00:30:23,480 Speaker 2: neighbor called me doctor Tom. And it was a criticism, 562 00:30:23,560 --> 00:30:25,120 Speaker 2: do you know it was It was a kind of 563 00:30:25,160 --> 00:30:28,640 Speaker 2: a you know, take the piss out of me. But 564 00:30:28,760 --> 00:30:31,080 Speaker 2: I thought I was God's gift. I thought I was 565 00:30:31,160 --> 00:30:33,959 Speaker 2: just so bloody special because people think I'm a real doctor, 566 00:30:34,280 --> 00:30:36,400 Speaker 2: you know. And I was walking up down the street 567 00:30:36,440 --> 00:30:38,640 Speaker 2: with this money's there, this go haha. 568 00:30:39,400 --> 00:30:39,600 Speaker 1: You know. 569 00:30:39,800 --> 00:30:43,040 Speaker 2: I may I invented, I invented everything. Invented a guitar 570 00:30:43,120 --> 00:30:46,080 Speaker 2: string stretcher. But when you take the dirty old strings 571 00:30:46,080 --> 00:30:49,479 Speaker 2: off your guitar, you know, two bulldog clips at each end, 572 00:30:49,520 --> 00:30:52,840 Speaker 2: And I actually think it's done me more good than harm. 573 00:30:53,000 --> 00:30:58,600 Speaker 2: You know, I actually think that i've I haven't. I've 574 00:30:58,600 --> 00:31:01,440 Speaker 2: had more interest in the thing that interest me than 575 00:31:01,560 --> 00:31:04,680 Speaker 2: I have had in making friends, if that makes sense. 576 00:31:04,720 --> 00:31:07,080 Speaker 2: Even though before I said I want people to like 577 00:31:07,160 --> 00:31:10,800 Speaker 2: me and approve of me, yeah, your friends, you know, 578 00:31:10,960 --> 00:31:13,600 Speaker 2: I don't know, I got more enjoyment tinkering. 579 00:31:13,720 --> 00:31:18,480 Speaker 1: And I don't know, maybe that's really interesting because I've 580 00:31:18,520 --> 00:31:21,960 Speaker 1: never thought of this, But like with my research that 581 00:31:22,000 --> 00:31:24,200 Speaker 1: I'm doing, we need to factor in people who are 582 00:31:25,320 --> 00:31:29,320 Speaker 1: on the spectrum because people who are autistic or Asperger's 583 00:31:29,400 --> 00:31:32,560 Speaker 1: or people who you know, they don't always read social 584 00:31:32,640 --> 00:31:35,960 Speaker 1: cues so well. Right, But the way that you just 585 00:31:36,080 --> 00:31:38,720 Speaker 1: explained it, it's almost like that can be an advantage 586 00:31:39,200 --> 00:31:42,640 Speaker 1: because and I think some people who are maybe at 587 00:31:42,640 --> 00:31:46,320 Speaker 1: the other end of the spectrum that are really super 588 00:31:46,480 --> 00:31:50,360 Speaker 1: hyper sensitive, like they get offended. They read things into 589 00:31:50,400 --> 00:31:53,480 Speaker 1: things all the time, and they get offended forty two 590 00:31:53,520 --> 00:31:56,160 Speaker 1: times a day even though no one's trying to offend them, 591 00:31:56,480 --> 00:31:59,160 Speaker 1: you know. So I think that walking up and down 592 00:31:59,240 --> 00:32:02,480 Speaker 1: the street with your stethoscope thinking you're a doctor and 593 00:32:02,520 --> 00:32:04,960 Speaker 1: people I'm sure some people thought it was cute and 594 00:32:04,960 --> 00:32:06,960 Speaker 1: awesome and the odd person hung shit on you, but 595 00:32:07,080 --> 00:32:09,600 Speaker 1: not knowing it's probably not the worst thing. 596 00:32:09,560 --> 00:32:13,520 Speaker 2: Right, No, no, exactly, tell. 597 00:32:13,440 --> 00:32:16,880 Speaker 1: Us, Sorry, tell us about your book, sorry to interrupt 598 00:32:17,320 --> 00:32:20,200 Speaker 1: off the bench, like, tell us about all the thinking 599 00:32:20,280 --> 00:32:21,520 Speaker 1: behind that philosophy. 600 00:32:22,120 --> 00:32:24,440 Speaker 2: Oh, that was just really simple because I'd done one 601 00:32:24,520 --> 00:32:27,400 Speaker 2: Planet classrooms and i'd started Girls with Hammers, and I 602 00:32:27,440 --> 00:32:31,040 Speaker 2: started talking at conferences and the one guy said to me, 603 00:32:33,440 --> 00:32:35,479 Speaker 2: can you do a workshop? And I said, yeah, what on? 604 00:32:35,560 --> 00:32:37,680 Speaker 2: He said, how to start a project, And I'm like, 605 00:32:38,120 --> 00:32:39,640 Speaker 2: I took the piece out of myself. I didn't even 606 00:32:39,680 --> 00:32:41,120 Speaker 2: I said, why are you asking me? I don't know, 607 00:32:41,280 --> 00:32:43,479 Speaker 2: and he's just said, o'h come on. Anyway, I did 608 00:32:44,240 --> 00:32:46,640 Speaker 2: an hour's workshop, and as I was doing it, I 609 00:32:46,640 --> 00:32:49,320 Speaker 2: was thinking, oh shit, you need to know about funding. 610 00:32:49,360 --> 00:32:52,680 Speaker 2: Ah shit, you need to know about this, and having 611 00:32:52,720 --> 00:32:55,680 Speaker 2: this real realization that an hour was not short long 612 00:32:55,800 --> 00:32:58,280 Speaker 2: enough to talk about how to really kick start a project. 613 00:32:58,400 --> 00:33:00,360 Speaker 2: So I said to people, gives your email and I'll 614 00:33:00,360 --> 00:33:02,280 Speaker 2: send you a pdf. I'll write up all this stuff. 615 00:33:03,240 --> 00:33:06,080 Speaker 2: And I came home and started typing it up, and 616 00:33:06,320 --> 00:33:08,280 Speaker 2: before I knew it, I had one hundred pages, you know, 617 00:33:08,320 --> 00:33:11,200 Speaker 2: and I'm like, well, this is a book. Somebody you 618 00:33:11,280 --> 00:33:13,480 Speaker 2: might as well might as well have this as a book. 619 00:33:13,560 --> 00:33:17,640 Speaker 2: And I'd already made magnificent kids that book, and I thought, well, 620 00:33:17,640 --> 00:33:18,920 Speaker 2: I know how to do a book. I might as 621 00:33:18,960 --> 00:33:22,040 Speaker 2: well just do that. And so you know, if I 622 00:33:22,080 --> 00:33:24,000 Speaker 2: look back now, I think, God, there's things I would 623 00:33:24,040 --> 00:33:26,280 Speaker 2: change in that, but I'm not going to because so 624 00:33:26,320 --> 00:33:28,120 Speaker 2: many people have said to me that was the thing. 625 00:33:28,400 --> 00:33:30,600 Speaker 2: That book was the thing that got me over the 626 00:33:30,640 --> 00:33:32,840 Speaker 2: line to kick start my project. And I could hear 627 00:33:32,880 --> 00:33:35,960 Speaker 2: your voice, You could he hear you saying it to me. 628 00:33:36,360 --> 00:33:42,040 Speaker 2: And there's another example of I'm not really bound by perfectionism. 629 00:33:42,680 --> 00:33:46,320 Speaker 2: It's kind of like a lot of people would be 630 00:33:46,400 --> 00:33:49,240 Speaker 2: caught up in oh, I can't really publish letters a book. 631 00:33:49,240 --> 00:33:51,880 Speaker 2: It's not perfect, you know. But my thought was, well, 632 00:33:52,480 --> 00:33:54,360 Speaker 2: why not must well just put it out there and 633 00:33:55,120 --> 00:33:59,440 Speaker 2: you can have it so and that was thinking beyond myself. 634 00:33:59,480 --> 00:34:02,920 Speaker 2: That was just thinking for the people at that conference. 635 00:34:03,080 --> 00:34:05,560 Speaker 2: As long as they've got a book, then that's great. 636 00:34:05,640 --> 00:34:07,800 Speaker 2: But now I. 637 00:34:07,760 --> 00:34:10,680 Speaker 1: Think that's one of the challenges, right, is we all 638 00:34:10,719 --> 00:34:14,600 Speaker 1: go to workshops and conferences and seminars and keynotes, and 639 00:34:15,440 --> 00:34:17,960 Speaker 1: we all listen to podcasts, and we all read books, 640 00:34:17,960 --> 00:34:20,440 Speaker 1: and we all get lots of data and information and 641 00:34:20,480 --> 00:34:24,319 Speaker 1: advice and strategies. But if you're still sitting on the 642 00:34:24,360 --> 00:34:28,200 Speaker 1: metaphoric fucking bench just taking notes and listening, you're not 643 00:34:28,239 --> 00:34:31,920 Speaker 1: getting like, you're not operationalizing anything, you're not you're not 644 00:34:32,040 --> 00:34:35,960 Speaker 1: putting anything the ideas into practice. Well, there's going to 645 00:34:36,040 --> 00:34:39,040 Speaker 1: be no positive change for me. That's one of the 646 00:34:39,640 --> 00:34:42,399 Speaker 1: I say that almost every workshop and every keynote I've 647 00:34:42,400 --> 00:34:46,799 Speaker 1: got another keynote tomorrow, and I'll probably say at the 648 00:34:46,840 --> 00:34:49,080 Speaker 1: end of that, you know, it's like all this stuff is, 649 00:34:50,160 --> 00:34:53,680 Speaker 1: you know, hopefully a little bit informative and inspiring and educational, 650 00:34:53,719 --> 00:34:56,080 Speaker 1: but none of it's worth anything if you don't do 651 00:34:56,280 --> 00:34:59,360 Speaker 1: anything with it. Like knowing what to do is not 652 00:34:59,480 --> 00:35:03,000 Speaker 1: producing results. Now, knowing what to do is not doing 653 00:35:03,040 --> 00:35:06,279 Speaker 1: what you know. So I think there's that. Why do 654 00:35:06,320 --> 00:35:08,560 Speaker 1: you think it is that we have never been more 655 00:35:08,600 --> 00:35:13,520 Speaker 1: informed or educated or well equipped in terms of online resources, 656 00:35:14,239 --> 00:35:17,319 Speaker 1: but so many of us still are basically standing at 657 00:35:17,320 --> 00:35:20,960 Speaker 1: the starting line waiting for some fucking magical sign. 658 00:35:21,400 --> 00:35:24,000 Speaker 2: Well, I reckon, there's five reasons we don't get started, 659 00:35:24,040 --> 00:35:28,319 Speaker 2: and it's one self doubt, two imposter syndrome, three not 660 00:35:28,440 --> 00:35:31,760 Speaker 2: knowing where to start, four overwhelmed by the big picture, 661 00:35:31,840 --> 00:35:35,600 Speaker 2: and five fear so fear of criticism, failure or rejection. 662 00:35:35,880 --> 00:35:38,680 Speaker 2: And I think those five just sit at the bom 663 00:35:38,719 --> 00:35:41,399 Speaker 2: of everything. Fear kind of sits underneath all of it. 664 00:35:41,480 --> 00:35:44,040 Speaker 2: But I just think we just don't do it. I 665 00:35:45,000 --> 00:35:48,120 Speaker 2: run a leadership program called Confident leaders Program, and if 666 00:35:48,160 --> 00:35:50,479 Speaker 2: I called it courageous leaders, no one had fucking come, 667 00:35:51,080 --> 00:35:52,800 Speaker 2: you know, because they think I'll be making them do 668 00:35:52,920 --> 00:35:56,680 Speaker 2: courageous things. But ultimately, what I talk about in that 669 00:35:56,840 --> 00:35:59,000 Speaker 2: is confidence is and a lot of people say, oh, 670 00:35:59,080 --> 00:36:01,759 Speaker 2: have I had your confidence? I wish I had confidence 671 00:36:01,800 --> 00:36:04,600 Speaker 2: and confidence this and that, because I always see confidence 672 00:36:04,719 --> 00:36:07,200 Speaker 2: is a big picture. But I always say, if you can, 673 00:36:07,280 --> 00:36:10,120 Speaker 2: if you've got confidence to take the next step whatever, 674 00:36:10,800 --> 00:36:12,520 Speaker 2: just do it, like if you've got the ability to. 675 00:36:12,880 --> 00:36:15,840 Speaker 2: But I have this metaphoring thing, and it's actually a 676 00:36:15,880 --> 00:36:18,239 Speaker 2: baseball cap. It's not metaphoric. I've got a real one, 677 00:36:18,320 --> 00:36:20,520 Speaker 2: but other people can't. Haven't got it, You'll have to 678 00:36:20,600 --> 00:36:22,960 Speaker 2: use a metaphoric one. And it's a baseball cap with 679 00:36:23,080 --> 00:36:26,520 Speaker 2: c ap on the front. And everyone looks at me, 680 00:36:26,600 --> 00:36:28,520 Speaker 2: and I use it as a gimmick because I put 681 00:36:28,520 --> 00:36:30,520 Speaker 2: it on and people are like, you're fucking for real. 682 00:36:30,760 --> 00:36:33,319 Speaker 2: You've got a cap that says cap like. And I 683 00:36:33,320 --> 00:36:35,839 Speaker 2: think you're good because you remember me standing up here 684 00:36:35,880 --> 00:36:40,399 Speaker 2: like a dickhead with this cap cap or And the 685 00:36:39,880 --> 00:36:42,840 Speaker 2: C is courage, the A is action, and the P 686 00:36:43,040 --> 00:36:45,280 Speaker 2: is practiced. And I say, if you want to get 687 00:36:45,400 --> 00:36:48,840 Speaker 2: anything in life, like anything, and you want to become confident, 688 00:36:49,000 --> 00:36:51,920 Speaker 2: you have to take courageous action and you have to practice, 689 00:36:52,000 --> 00:36:53,960 Speaker 2: and you have to practice and practice and practice and 690 00:36:53,960 --> 00:36:56,080 Speaker 2: practice and practice, and you're going to fuck up and 691 00:36:56,120 --> 00:36:58,879 Speaker 2: fuck the fuck up. But at the bottom of it 692 00:36:58,920 --> 00:37:01,919 Speaker 2: is it's courageous act and practicing it over and over, 693 00:37:02,080 --> 00:37:05,759 Speaker 2: you know, and it's I hope people see me in 694 00:37:05,800 --> 00:37:08,680 Speaker 2: that hat and go what a fucking dickhead, and then 695 00:37:08,719 --> 00:37:11,319 Speaker 2: they remember it and it's bent into their brain. And 696 00:37:11,360 --> 00:37:14,240 Speaker 2: I say, just anything you want to try, just pretend 697 00:37:14,239 --> 00:37:16,719 Speaker 2: think of me and micap and put on your metaphoric caps. 698 00:37:16,760 --> 00:37:19,520 Speaker 2: I've got my confidence gap on and take courageous action 699 00:37:19,719 --> 00:37:22,640 Speaker 2: and I'm just going to get started. And none of 700 00:37:22,680 --> 00:37:25,120 Speaker 2: us know all the steps, Like we just don't know 701 00:37:25,160 --> 00:37:27,800 Speaker 2: all this, but do you know the next step? Yeah, 702 00:37:27,880 --> 00:37:29,319 Speaker 2: if you know the next step, take it. 703 00:37:29,800 --> 00:37:33,880 Speaker 1: So yeah. I think also too, like people think that 704 00:37:34,120 --> 00:37:39,600 Speaker 1: courage is analogous to or synonymous with, fearlessness, and it's 705 00:37:39,640 --> 00:37:43,000 Speaker 1: actually not at all. It's like, no, like those T 706 00:37:43,160 --> 00:37:46,000 Speaker 1: shirts and those posters that say no fear, I'm like, 707 00:37:46,200 --> 00:37:48,799 Speaker 1: fuck those posters and T shirts because I don't know 708 00:37:48,880 --> 00:37:54,400 Speaker 1: anyone who's got zero fear. Yeah right, No, it's dumb, Like, actually, 709 00:37:55,120 --> 00:37:59,440 Speaker 1: courage requires fear. You know, you can't be courageous if 710 00:37:59,520 --> 00:38:03,759 Speaker 1: you're not scared, you know. So it's like, yeah, I 711 00:38:03,800 --> 00:38:06,000 Speaker 1: know that you're scared. I know it's uncomfortable. I know 712 00:38:06,120 --> 00:38:10,080 Speaker 1: it's hard. Guess what that's okay. You're allowed to be scared. 713 00:38:10,120 --> 00:38:12,960 Speaker 1: You're allowed to be uncomfortable, You're allowed to be uncertain, 714 00:38:13,520 --> 00:38:16,040 Speaker 1: and you're still allowed to do those things that you're 715 00:38:16,160 --> 00:38:20,080 Speaker 1: terrified of because how you turn down the volume on 716 00:38:20,120 --> 00:38:23,719 Speaker 1: that fear is by being courageous and leaning in. You 717 00:38:23,800 --> 00:38:27,040 Speaker 1: know you can't I say this too many times, sorry listeners, 718 00:38:27,040 --> 00:38:29,399 Speaker 1: but you can't master what you avoid. You can't get 719 00:38:29,440 --> 00:38:31,799 Speaker 1: good at what you won't do. You know, you're not 720 00:38:31,840 --> 00:38:34,560 Speaker 1: going to get stronger by fucking hiding under the metaphoric 721 00:38:34,640 --> 00:38:37,719 Speaker 1: couch for ten years and waiting for everything to work 722 00:38:37,760 --> 00:38:43,760 Speaker 1: itself out, because it doesn't. You know. So, Hey, you're inspirational. 723 00:38:44,480 --> 00:38:47,200 Speaker 1: We need to get your back. How do people find you? 724 00:38:47,239 --> 00:38:50,480 Speaker 1: Follow you, connect with you? Where do they buy your book? 725 00:38:50,560 --> 00:38:53,080 Speaker 1: Where can they listen to your potty? Give us the 726 00:38:53,200 --> 00:38:53,960 Speaker 1: quick spiel? 727 00:38:54,840 --> 00:38:58,120 Speaker 2: Basically, the website is Karen Vaughan dot com and Vaughn 728 00:38:58,239 --> 00:39:00,719 Speaker 2: is an a lot of people spell it wrong. Kubla 729 00:39:00,880 --> 00:39:02,839 Speaker 2: y n v A U g h A n dot 730 00:39:02,880 --> 00:39:09,760 Speaker 2: com and I'm also on Instagram, Get off the bench, Facebook, LinkedIn. 731 00:39:10,600 --> 00:39:14,000 Speaker 2: You can buy the books through the website. That'll do. 732 00:39:14,160 --> 00:39:16,600 Speaker 2: That's a Karen Vaughan dot com. 733 00:39:16,600 --> 00:39:18,760 Speaker 1: That'll do. Do you ever get down to the thriving 734 00:39:18,800 --> 00:39:19,520 Speaker 1: metropolis of. 735 00:39:19,520 --> 00:39:21,880 Speaker 2: Melbourne occasionally, very rarely? 736 00:39:22,320 --> 00:39:25,440 Speaker 1: Well, come on, come down coffee with Tiff and I. 737 00:39:25,960 --> 00:39:28,040 Speaker 2: All right, I will. It's three hours for me, but 738 00:39:28,120 --> 00:39:30,920 Speaker 2: if I'm coming down, I absolutely will. Actually I'm coming 739 00:39:30,920 --> 00:39:32,960 Speaker 2: down October, but that's a long time away. 740 00:39:33,080 --> 00:39:39,239 Speaker 1: We'll happen in October. Get down before then October. One 741 00:39:39,239 --> 00:39:40,600 Speaker 1: of us could be dead by then. 742 00:39:40,840 --> 00:39:44,799 Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I will. I'd like that. 743 00:39:45,440 --> 00:39:47,719 Speaker 1: We'll say goodbye affair. But Karen, thanks so much that 744 00:39:48,040 --> 00:39:50,680 Speaker 1: you're amazing. You know what you are. Here's a term 745 00:39:50,760 --> 00:39:54,680 Speaker 1: for You've ever heard the term polymath Holly Matt. 746 00:39:54,760 --> 00:39:56,600 Speaker 2: I have heard that, but I can't remember what it is. 747 00:39:56,640 --> 00:39:59,600 Speaker 1: Holly math is a person who knows quite a lot 748 00:39:59,680 --> 00:40:03,040 Speaker 1: about a lot of things. That's you, Yeah, a bit 749 00:40:03,040 --> 00:40:06,040 Speaker 1: of an expert, like semi expert in a bunch of stuff. 750 00:40:07,560 --> 00:40:09,800 Speaker 1: We appreciate you. Thanks for being on the new project. 751 00:40:10,040 --> 00:40:11,480 Speaker 2: Thanks for having me on. Thank you