WEBVTT - The Rita Panahi Show | 16 May 0:00:02.759 --> 0:00:04.439 On Scaring Wilds Australia. 0:00:05.120 --> 0:00:09.600 This is the winder Panety Show. Good evening and welcome 0:00:09.640 --> 0:00:12.879 to the reader. Panicky Show coming up tonight. Further fractures 0:00:12.920 --> 0:00:16.520 in the Albanesi government with a Labor senator defying the 0:00:16.560 --> 0:00:21.320 Prime Minister with inflammatory comments about the Israel Hamas War. 0:00:21.880 --> 0:00:25.600 Douglas Murray joins me shortly to discuss migration rates and 0:00:25.640 --> 0:00:31.000 why the will of the majority is consistently ignored. Hollywood 0:00:31.000 --> 0:00:34.280 A listers come out in support for canceled Oscar winner 0:00:34.440 --> 0:00:38.000 Kevin Spacey. I'll speak to Kinsey Schofield about that shortly 0:00:38.680 --> 0:00:42.200 and what is the most powerful interest group we've seen 0:00:42.600 --> 0:00:45.760 in this country. Nick Kata will join me to discuss that. 0:00:46.520 --> 0:00:50.000 But it's time to bring in Sky News contributor Kosher 0:00:50.040 --> 0:00:53.400 Gata for the day's big stories. Kosher Albia talking to 0:00:53.479 --> 0:00:58.080 Douglas Murray shortly about migration numbers. It's a massive issue 0:00:58.120 --> 0:01:02.080 across Europe, in the US, here in Australia and the 0:01:02.120 --> 0:01:05.840 ob and Easy government is under intense pressure to drastically 0:01:05.920 --> 0:01:09.480 cut net overseas migration from the record five hundred and 0:01:09.480 --> 0:01:13.000 twenty eight thousand we had last year to a promise 0:01:13.120 --> 0:01:17.280 two hundred and sixty thousand next year. But as Pauline 0:01:17.280 --> 0:01:20.959 Hanson noted on x, Labor doesn't have a great track 0:01:21.040 --> 0:01:25.800 record in predicting net migration numbers accurately. Over the past 0:01:25.840 --> 0:01:29.520 two years, migration has reached a record nine hundred and 0:01:29.600 --> 0:01:32.720 twenty three thousand, which is two hundred and eight thousand 0:01:32.880 --> 0:01:39.920 more than Labor anticipated. Hanson wrote two questions kosher I, 0:01:39.959 --> 0:01:44.160 can labor quit their high migration habit? They've seemed to 0:01:44.200 --> 0:01:47.040 have relied on that, and they're not allowing Coalition governments 0:01:47.120 --> 0:01:51.080 have also indulged in that activity. And can we trust 0:01:51.080 --> 0:01:53.760 their figures? Are their predictions so far out that it's 0:01:53.800 --> 0:01:56.960 almost a fantasy number at the moment. 0:01:57.320 --> 0:02:00.800 Probably a little bit of both. So the discrepancy in 0:02:01.080 --> 0:02:04.120 the numbers just fits what we've seen with government. They 0:02:04.120 --> 0:02:06.360 haven't exactly covered themselves in glory in terms of their 0:02:06.400 --> 0:02:10.119 ability to report numbers accurately and model as we've seen 0:02:10.160 --> 0:02:12.760 in many venues. The more cynical interpretation would be that 0:02:12.880 --> 0:02:15.639 maybe they well knew, but this is a very unpopular topic, 0:02:15.720 --> 0:02:18.920 so it's easier to, you know, sort of dampen the 0:02:18.960 --> 0:02:21.799 expectation a little bit and then say, ooh, sorry, even miscalculated. 0:02:22.000 --> 0:02:25.080 But be that as it may. Senator Hanson's point is 0:02:25.200 --> 0:02:27.440 very well taken. This is an issue all around the world. 0:02:27.520 --> 0:02:29.520 As you said, it's the issue of our time. And 0:02:29.560 --> 0:02:32.519 those numbers nine hundred and twenty three thousand is roughly 0:02:32.560 --> 0:02:35.160 the population Canberra. So a whole canbra is going to 0:02:35.200 --> 0:02:37.680 be hosted in Sydney and in Melbourne, and that's kind 0:02:37.680 --> 0:02:40.400 of where these migrants concentrate and all the stress that 0:02:40.520 --> 0:02:43.760 puts on infrastructure, on everything else, not to mention the 0:02:43.760 --> 0:02:46.720 fabric of the culture. And this is another topic that's 0:02:46.840 --> 0:02:49.080 very timely right now in terms of how these different 0:02:49.080 --> 0:02:51.519 groups come in. And then there's this more strife between 0:02:51.560 --> 0:02:54.080 groups ethnically as well. So all of that is a 0:02:54.120 --> 0:02:56.919 predictable consequence of this. Constituents don't want it, and yet 0:02:56.960 --> 0:02:57.639 it continues. 0:02:58.080 --> 0:03:00.840 Well you can say why the abes the government is 0:03:00.880 --> 0:03:04.640 pledging to drastically cut these numbers. They are getting prepared 0:03:04.680 --> 0:03:06.880 for the next federal election and they know this is 0:03:06.919 --> 0:03:12.120 an enormous issue out there. Now, let's talk about labor. 0:03:12.160 --> 0:03:17.440 Senator Fatima Payman, who is calling on the Alberanza government 0:03:17.480 --> 0:03:21.480 to sanction and disinvest from Israel, accusing the country of 0:03:21.800 --> 0:03:24.280 genocide against the Palestinian people. 0:03:25.600 --> 0:03:29.160 How many mass graves need to be uncovered before we 0:03:29.200 --> 0:03:34.400 say enough? How many images of bloody limbs of murdered 0:03:34.520 --> 0:03:40.040 children must we see? How many horrors need to be 0:03:40.080 --> 0:03:45.080 repeated before we feel that this should end. How many 0:03:45.120 --> 0:03:50.160 Palestinian lives are enough to call this violence against them terrorism? 0:03:52.040 --> 0:03:55.480 Koshasha also use the phrase from the river to the sea, 0:03:55.560 --> 0:04:00.080 which the Prime Minister has been clear to condemn, to 0:03:59.840 --> 0:04:03.640 say that it's a statement that promotes violence. And here 0:04:03.720 --> 0:04:05.400 has got a senator saying it. 0:04:05.720 --> 0:04:07.920 He's got a problem on his hands, as do his 0:04:08.040 --> 0:04:10.920 counterparts everywhere. So I look at the senator, the same 0:04:10.960 --> 0:04:14.000 thing with the United States Congress with Shida Tali bilan Omar. 0:04:14.600 --> 0:04:17.440 It comes downstream from immigration, that topic we talked about again. 0:04:17.480 --> 0:04:21.479 This is some of those longer term consequences, whether intended 0:04:21.520 --> 0:04:25.200 or unintended, coming home to roost in many ways, but 0:04:25.520 --> 0:04:28.080 right within the left side of politics and liberal democracies, 0:04:28.120 --> 0:04:30.680 it's really coming home to roost because there's a huge 0:04:30.680 --> 0:04:33.559 refracturing and realignment of the fault lines in that party. 0:04:33.560 --> 0:04:35.680 And I think that colors what you see in terms 0:04:35.680 --> 0:04:38.040 of their positions with respect to Israel with respect to 0:04:38.080 --> 0:04:40.640 protesters with all of that, because they're kind of speaking. 0:04:40.760 --> 0:04:42.400 They've become a two headed beast in their way and 0:04:42.440 --> 0:04:44.720 they're speaking to two factions that don't agree on this 0:04:44.760 --> 0:04:45.839 issue that's there. 0:04:45.880 --> 0:04:49.240 The Biden administration has got these issues as well and 0:04:49.360 --> 0:04:52.080 talking about the left of politics that it Ilyidia Thorpe 0:04:52.120 --> 0:04:55.480 has posted this image of herself with the message got 0:04:55.600 --> 0:04:58.680 my cafear on for Parliament today. Power to all the 0:04:58.800 --> 0:05:02.080 students camped down and everyone that's been coming to rallies 0:05:02.520 --> 0:05:06.440 and standing up for justice. Seamewondovic Labor for banning affairs 0:05:06.480 --> 0:05:12.800 in Parliament. There a real gammon lot. They are free Palestine. Really, 0:05:12.839 --> 0:05:16.280 the Australian Upper House is disgracing itself. What did Paul 0:05:16.320 --> 0:05:19.880 Keating call them an unrepresentative swell? I think it was 0:05:19.920 --> 0:05:24.719 being kind. Now let's move on to Albo evicting one 0:05:24.720 --> 0:05:28.560 of his tenants from one of his investment properties. This 0:05:28.640 --> 0:05:32.279 is an incredible story. Jim Flanagan was handled an eviction 0:05:32.440 --> 0:05:35.200 notice on the eighth of May to vacate the three 0:05:35.200 --> 0:05:38.279 bedroom townhouse where he's lived for four years. The PM 0:05:38.320 --> 0:05:41.320 has said I've had him in the property with the 0:05:41.360 --> 0:05:45.000 rent being about half. What is the market rent to 0:05:45.120 --> 0:05:49.360 keep him in for longer. So this is very interesting. Indeed, 0:05:49.360 --> 0:05:51.800 the PM must be a saint just giving away free 0:05:51.800 --> 0:05:57.039 rent there essentially. But I do question the wisdom of 0:05:57.120 --> 0:06:00.839 evicting a tenant during his prime minister ship. You would 0:06:00.880 --> 0:06:04.120 just think, yeah, sure, if you were an everyday ordinary 0:06:04.160 --> 0:06:08.160 person who wasn't in public office, you may make this decision. 0:06:08.600 --> 0:06:10.680 But the optics here are not great. 0:06:11.160 --> 0:06:15.279 That's a very interesting point. You could say that it's principled, 0:06:15.320 --> 0:06:16.880 and he's saying, hey, if you know, I want to 0:06:16.880 --> 0:06:18.560 evict my turn, and I'm going to do that, and 0:06:18.640 --> 0:06:20.560 I guess that's right. You could say it would be 0:06:20.640 --> 0:06:23.920 nice if Earlider showed principle consistency on all sorts of 0:06:24.000 --> 0:06:26.440 other issues, including ones that don't directly affect them. But 0:06:27.040 --> 0:06:28.599 you know, I think it's a fair argument on the 0:06:28.640 --> 0:06:30.560 facts of the case. It's as right as a landlord 0:06:30.600 --> 0:06:32.880 to do that. But the optics are interesting, and he's 0:06:32.880 --> 0:06:36.680 injected something that becomes a proxy story for all sorts 0:06:36.720 --> 0:06:39.839 of issues people have with housing and rent prices and 0:06:39.880 --> 0:06:41.760 cost of living and all of that. They can project 0:06:41.800 --> 0:06:44.919 onto those pain points, and he's invited that upon himself. 0:06:44.960 --> 0:06:47.320 And this is very different to that image of himself 0:06:47.360 --> 0:06:49.640 that is cultivated. You know, he grew up in a 0:06:49.640 --> 0:06:54.440 commission house. Yeah, he's Labour's socialist left faction, and yet 0:06:54.880 --> 0:06:59.080 he's got multimillion dollar investment properties. I'm not saying there's 0:06:59.080 --> 0:07:02.159 anything wrong with that. I'm just saying when you fight 0:07:02.279 --> 0:07:06.919 the culture wars and also you know, pay this image 0:07:06.920 --> 0:07:09.880 of fighting the Tories and the rich don't do this 0:07:09.960 --> 0:07:11.200 and the rich don't do that, and. 0:07:11.160 --> 0:07:13.520 You're part of the parlor around the world. The zip 0:07:13.520 --> 0:07:15.640 code outside DC is the wealthy a ship code in 0:07:15.640 --> 0:07:16.400 the world, one of them. 0:07:16.560 --> 0:07:18.960 It's the same same point absolutely Now. 0:07:19.080 --> 0:07:23.080 Liberals Senator Alex Antik has called out big tech companies 0:07:23.120 --> 0:07:28.120 who employ former intelligence employees and conspire with governments to 0:07:28.280 --> 0:07:30.080 censor and ban speech. 0:07:31.400 --> 0:07:34.680 Big tech is the perfect intersection between government, the ruling 0:07:34.680 --> 0:07:37.080 class and the intelligence services along with their mates in 0:07:37.120 --> 0:07:40.080 big business. You see what they want you to see. 0:07:40.360 --> 0:07:42.320 Australia is at the tip of the sphere of a 0:07:42.360 --> 0:07:45.240 global censorship movement, and I suspect that many who are 0:07:45.240 --> 0:07:48.000 involved are blissfully unaware and think that they're doing the 0:07:48.040 --> 0:07:50.360 right thing by shutting down and deleting so called miss 0:07:50.360 --> 0:07:53.400 and disinformation. But let's be clear, the government isn't thinking 0:07:53.440 --> 0:07:56.880 about your safety and it doesn't care about misinformation. What 0:07:56.920 --> 0:07:59.600 it cares about is making sure that you see in 0:07:59.640 --> 0:08:02.760 approved message at all times. 0:08:05.520 --> 0:08:09.040 What is said in Parliament this week has been established 0:08:09.040 --> 0:08:13.280 by investigative journalist Kosher, including Michael Schellenberger, who we've interviewed 0:08:13.280 --> 0:08:16.720 on this program. This is a huge issue because these 0:08:17.000 --> 0:08:20.680 platforms are now the digital public square. This is where 0:08:20.680 --> 0:08:23.400 people discuss issues, but this is where they find out information. 0:08:24.120 --> 0:08:27.080 It is He's one of the few elected leaders direct 0:08:27.160 --> 0:08:29.080 enough and brave enough to say that it really is 0:08:29.080 --> 0:08:31.480 a convergence of all these power structures. As he mentioned, 0:08:31.520 --> 0:08:34.240 it's a big tech. It's government people who eat in 0:08:34.280 --> 0:08:37.120 a bedit like the E Safety Commissioner and others, and 0:08:37.160 --> 0:08:40.120 just other people at the top the ruling class. I think, 0:08:40.160 --> 0:08:42.120 as he put it, is the issue. We've called it 0:08:42.160 --> 0:08:44.640 the battlefield of the century. In a way, it's another 0:08:44.720 --> 0:08:46.959 day in that movement. The problem is that for a 0:08:47.000 --> 0:08:49.600 country like Australia, certainly we shouldn't be eating in a 0:08:49.600 --> 0:08:51.880 betting things like with the E Safety Commissioner, but there's 0:08:52.000 --> 0:08:55.120 little recourse, little remedy. We really have in terms of 0:08:55.480 --> 0:08:57.720 trying to break up that power that big tech plays 0:08:57.720 --> 0:09:00.160 in it, since they're all headquartered in the United States, 0:09:00.200 --> 0:09:02.040 the belluy of the Beast, where something has to happen 0:09:02.360 --> 0:09:04.440 along the lines of anti trust law, along the lines 0:09:04.480 --> 0:09:07.079 of Section two thirty, where they're not penalized. 0:09:07.120 --> 0:09:10.000 Problem is, we seem to be among some of the 0:09:10.040 --> 0:09:15.520 worst in the free world in suppressing free speech. So 0:09:15.679 --> 0:09:18.080 not only are we not fighting it, we seem to 0:09:18.120 --> 0:09:23.600 be one of the worst in aiding and abetting it. Koshagator, 0:09:23.640 --> 0:09:26.600 thank you so much for your time. Nexs Evening. Joining 0:09:26.640 --> 0:09:29.920 me now is the author of international best sellers The 0:09:29.960 --> 0:09:32.520 Strange Death of Europe, The Madness of Crowds, and his 0:09:32.640 --> 0:09:36.640 latest work, The War on the West. Douglas Murray. Let's 0:09:36.640 --> 0:09:40.080 start with immigration. It's a big issue in Australia. We're 0:09:40.080 --> 0:09:43.720 seeing record numbers of migrants coming in despite polls showing 0:09:44.080 --> 0:09:47.600 the majority of Australians want to see immigration numbers drop. 0:09:48.000 --> 0:09:51.120 And that is also the overwhelming sentiment across Europe, with 0:09:51.200 --> 0:09:53.760 a recent poll taken in March and April this year 0:09:53.880 --> 0:09:58.400 showing great opposition to not only illegal immigration but also 0:09:58.440 --> 0:10:02.319 the current volume of migrants coming into Europe, more than 0:10:02.360 --> 0:10:06.040 seventy percent said their country takes in too many migrants, 0:10:06.040 --> 0:10:10.720 and that includes countries as diverses are Sweden to Spain 0:10:10.800 --> 0:10:14.120 to Austria. The Greeks are the most opposed to their 0:10:14.200 --> 0:10:18.040 migration numbers. Ninety percent there say that country takes too 0:10:18.080 --> 0:10:22.320 many And yet Douglas, the will of the majority seems 0:10:22.360 --> 0:10:27.120 to be completely ignored, whether it's Australia or Europe, when 0:10:27.120 --> 0:10:31.120 it comes to migration policy, majority opinion doesn't seem to 0:10:31.160 --> 0:10:31.760 matter much. 0:10:33.520 --> 0:10:38.160 Absolutely reach and these latest findings in Australia and across 0:10:38.240 --> 0:10:42.480 Europe are replicated of course in America. I mean most 0:10:42.600 --> 0:10:45.480 people in the developed world, most people in the countries 0:10:45.520 --> 0:10:48.960 that people want to come to, are aware that we 0:10:49.160 --> 0:10:51.800 just can't take in all of the people who would 0:10:51.840 --> 0:10:56.040 like to come to our countries. I mean, Australia is 0:10:56.080 --> 0:11:01.360 in a much better position societally, financial, socially, and much 0:11:01.400 --> 0:11:06.280 more than most countries in the region. And it's the 0:11:06.320 --> 0:11:11.680 same with Europe. Europe's more prosperous, infinitely more prosperous, even 0:11:11.679 --> 0:11:13.880 at the lowest rung of the ladder than most of 0:11:13.920 --> 0:11:16.200 the countries that people come to therefrom and it's the 0:11:16.240 --> 0:11:20.079 same with America, with Central America and Southern America. And 0:11:21.280 --> 0:11:26.560 so the publics know this, but the political response, as 0:11:26.559 --> 0:11:29.439 you just refer to it, seems to always be, whoever 0:11:29.480 --> 0:11:32.320 you have in power, more of the same. I mean, 0:11:32.360 --> 0:11:35.160 there are occasionally prime ministers who and presidents who are 0:11:35.200 --> 0:11:38.640 able to slow down the flow, but even then it's 0:11:38.679 --> 0:11:43.400 to a barely manageable level. And what these political leaders 0:11:43.440 --> 0:11:46.200 don't realize is that the public know more than them. 0:11:46.960 --> 0:11:50.320 We the public sense in the decline in trust, in 0:11:50.360 --> 0:11:53.440 the decline in safety, in all sorts of things. We 0:11:53.640 --> 0:11:57.800 sense what the changes are that happen not when migration happens, 0:11:57.840 --> 0:12:01.400 but when too much migration happens, too fast, and often 0:12:01.640 --> 0:12:04.880 of the wrong kind. And I think you know, this 0:12:05.000 --> 0:12:08.360 is the big challenge of the twenty first century. So far, 0:12:08.480 --> 0:12:11.679 we haven't really thrown up politicians capable of dealing with it. 0:12:14.160 --> 0:12:17.800 And it seems those who screamed the loudest about threats 0:12:17.840 --> 0:12:21.800 to democracy very silent when it comes to the will 0:12:21.840 --> 0:12:24.520 of the majority here being ignored. In fact, they seem 0:12:24.559 --> 0:12:26.840 to be doing a lot to obstruct the will of 0:12:26.880 --> 0:12:30.960 the majority. Now let's talk about President Joe Biden, who 0:12:31.000 --> 0:12:36.000 is repeating a verifiable lie about inflation. He's repeated a 0:12:36.040 --> 0:12:39.559 lot of verifiable lies over the years. Is saying that 0:12:39.600 --> 0:12:42.360 it was nine percent when he came to office, when 0:12:42.360 --> 0:12:46.320 it was actually one point four percent. Karine Jean Pierre 0:12:46.480 --> 0:12:50.160 was asked to explain why the presidents repeated this lie. 0:12:51.480 --> 0:12:53.560 We got a lot of incoming on this yesterday, and 0:12:53.600 --> 0:12:56.120 look what the president was. The point that he was 0:12:56.200 --> 0:13:00.880 making is that the factors that caused inflation was in 0:13:00.960 --> 0:13:04.440 place when he walked in into the administration when he 0:13:04.480 --> 0:13:08.600 took office. As you know, the pandemic caused inflation around 0:13:08.600 --> 0:13:09.040 the world. 0:13:10.920 --> 0:13:14.120 Douglas. I know the US has much bigger issues to 0:13:14.120 --> 0:13:17.480 deal with right now, the border crisis, cost of living, crime, 0:13:17.600 --> 0:13:22.800 But a president who can't stop lying about verifiable data, 0:13:23.400 --> 0:13:25.160 I mean, it's not something to be overlooked. 0:13:26.360 --> 0:13:28.080 Well, I would just say that, you know, the point 0:13:28.120 --> 0:13:30.920 of the White House spokesperson is meant to be to 0:13:30.960 --> 0:13:35.920 sort of be the mouthpiece of the president. Joe Biden 0:13:36.679 --> 0:13:41.000 has found a mouthpiece in Queen Jean Pierre, which I 0:13:41.000 --> 0:13:43.800 think even he must wonder at times whether what she's 0:13:43.840 --> 0:13:49.679 saying isn't gobbledegook or not. She's by no means the 0:13:49.679 --> 0:13:53.839 best interpreter of Joe Biden's statements, and goodness known, sometimes 0:13:53.920 --> 0:13:57.439 Joe Biden could do with a good interpreter. Yes, I mean, 0:13:57.559 --> 0:14:00.839 this is the sort of behavior which if it happened 0:14:00.920 --> 0:14:04.440 under a Republican president, it would all be you know, 0:14:04.600 --> 0:14:07.880 fact checking, the fact checkers and the Washington Posts to 0:14:07.920 --> 0:14:10.960 be explaining to everyone how democracy dies in darkness, and 0:14:11.000 --> 0:14:14.960 the BBC's Verify fact check would be on to it. 0:14:15.280 --> 0:14:19.120 But you know, old Joe Biden, Oh, it doesn't matter, 0:14:19.200 --> 0:14:22.600 and it can all be explained away incoherently by his 0:14:22.960 --> 0:14:24.240 by his spokesperson. 0:14:26.320 --> 0:14:28.560 Yeah. I even I felt a little bit sorry for 0:14:28.640 --> 0:14:31.480 her because I had you defend that. And yet but 0:14:31.520 --> 0:14:35.480 her explanation did not help the president or herself in 0:14:35.520 --> 0:14:36.000 any way. 0:14:36.880 --> 0:14:40.360 It could have been worse, could explained. It could have 0:14:40.400 --> 0:14:43.080 been explained by Kamala Harris, who would have who would 0:14:43.120 --> 0:14:47.000 have explained that the thing is that that the past 0:14:47.400 --> 0:14:49.640 has just gone before the present and the future is 0:14:49.720 --> 0:14:51.560 yet to come. And in a very real sense, the 0:14:51.600 --> 0:14:56.480 present is before the future and that's why inflation is there. 0:14:59.160 --> 0:15:01.680 And then we'll just have mad cackling for about sixty 0:15:01.720 --> 0:15:06.080 seconds after that. But let's stick with the Biden White House. 0:15:06.520 --> 0:15:12.440 They're in coherent and inconsistent decision making. Douglas, you've written 0:15:12.480 --> 0:15:16.360 about this about how the president says something that's very 0:15:16.400 --> 0:15:19.840 sound one minute and the next day he does something 0:15:19.880 --> 0:15:24.040 that's completely at odds with that. You talked about the 0:15:24.040 --> 0:15:28.400 wise words he said last week about Israel, and then 0:15:28.440 --> 0:15:32.200 within hours he was attempting to prevent Israel's victory in 0:15:32.280 --> 0:15:36.680 Gaza by withholding arm shipments. How do you explained this 0:15:37.600 --> 0:15:38.720 erratic behavior. 0:15:39.760 --> 0:15:42.880 Well, it's very strange. I mean, the best interpretation of 0:15:42.920 --> 0:15:44.720 it is for some time, and you and I have 0:15:44.720 --> 0:15:47.760 discussed this before, read it for sometime. The President has 0:15:47.880 --> 0:15:51.720 talked a bit of one talk and acted in another way. Now, 0:15:51.920 --> 0:15:54.640 those of us who want Israel to win in guards 0:15:54.680 --> 0:16:00.720 and against Hamas, sometimes you know that's the red has 0:16:00.760 --> 0:16:04.320 been unpleasant, but the actions have been supportive. So, for instance, 0:16:04.320 --> 0:16:08.640 at various times President Biden, we presume, has sent out, 0:16:08.640 --> 0:16:11.640 for instance, Chuck Schumer to be critical of the Israeli reaction. 0:16:11.960 --> 0:16:15.960 Occasionally Joe Biden has been critical himself, but he's done 0:16:16.000 --> 0:16:18.280 that in order it seems to plicate a bit of 0:16:18.320 --> 0:16:21.200 the base in his own party keep the students from 0:16:21.200 --> 0:16:24.240 going bananas all the time on campus and hope to 0:16:24.280 --> 0:16:27.120 get in in November, whilst at the same time supporting 0:16:27.200 --> 0:16:31.040 America's ally Israel. The thing that was different this past 0:16:31.120 --> 0:16:35.560 week has been that it flipped exactly the other way around. 0:16:36.520 --> 0:16:41.040 The rhetoric from the President on the day was very good, 0:16:41.240 --> 0:16:43.880 very supportive, all about standing by our allies and all 0:16:43.880 --> 0:16:47.040 that sort of thing, and then in the evening here 0:16:47.080 --> 0:16:50.640 he stopped the delivery of armed supplies to Israel. Now 0:16:51.200 --> 0:16:53.680 that is that is a very serious development because a 0:16:53.680 --> 0:16:56.480 lot of a lot of the sort of the talk, 0:16:56.640 --> 0:17:01.480 the chaff of the media cycle in America, you know, 0:17:01.760 --> 0:17:04.560 is performative. It's for the base, it's for a certain 0:17:04.600 --> 0:17:06.720 bit of the base. It's for the three or four 0:17:06.760 --> 0:17:10.080 people watching some of the smaller left wing networks. But 0:17:11.359 --> 0:17:13.719 the really difficult thing here, as I say, is that 0:17:13.720 --> 0:17:17.080 he actually he actually did something which he had always 0:17:17.080 --> 0:17:20.520 said he wouldn't do. He's always held himself out as 0:17:20.520 --> 0:17:23.399 a great ally of Israel in its fight for survival 0:17:23.440 --> 0:17:26.880 and its fight for victory over its enemies, and here 0:17:26.960 --> 0:17:30.240 he is in charge in the White House with holding 0:17:30.400 --> 0:17:33.399 arms at a time when Israel is pretty close to 0:17:33.560 --> 0:17:36.560 victory against him. As how you can say you're an 0:17:36.560 --> 0:17:39.240 ally and you're with someone til the bitter end, only 0:17:39.280 --> 0:17:42.040 to drop out at about last orders. I just do 0:17:42.160 --> 0:17:42.520 not know. 0:17:45.000 --> 0:17:47.600 And that's what worries me, because, as we know, actions 0:17:48.200 --> 0:17:53.679 are more important than words, and he has flipped that dynamic. 0:17:54.080 --> 0:17:57.800 And what would happen to Israel if they don't have 0:17:57.920 --> 0:18:02.520 made defeat her mass after seven months of this war, 0:18:02.760 --> 0:18:06.960 if if in the end Hamas isn't completely eradicated. 0:18:08.160 --> 0:18:11.120 Well, my view is, and I think it's a view 0:18:11.119 --> 0:18:14.680 that a lot of Israeli politicians and others feel, a 0:18:14.720 --> 0:18:17.600 lot of the Israeli public feel, is that you cannot 0:18:17.640 --> 0:18:20.960 destroy eighty percent of Hamaz. You cannot leave them in 0:18:21.119 --> 0:18:24.440 you cannot take them out of Gaza City, and you 0:18:24.480 --> 0:18:27.800 cannot take them out of a set of other towns 0:18:27.840 --> 0:18:31.600 and so on and leave them intact in Raffa. And 0:18:31.720 --> 0:18:34.480 Raffa is reckoned to be, not just where the remaining 0:18:34.560 --> 0:18:37.600 Israeli hostages are held, hostages who the rest of the 0:18:37.640 --> 0:18:40.000 world seems to have forgotten about, but the Israeli people 0:18:40.080 --> 0:18:44.000 quite rightly haven't. And there's no point in leaving that 0:18:44.240 --> 0:18:47.560 there and leaving the leaving those people there and leaving 0:18:47.600 --> 0:18:50.800 the heads of Hamaz, including it seems Sinoir, the mastermind 0:18:50.840 --> 0:18:54.080 of the seventh in Raffa. All it means is like 0:18:54.160 --> 0:18:56.960 putting out eighty percent of the fire, that you will 0:18:57.080 --> 0:19:01.440 that the Israelis will withdraw from Gaza and Hamas will 0:19:01.440 --> 0:19:05.600 grow back, will continue to subjugate the Palestinian population in Gaza, 0:19:05.800 --> 0:19:08.280 will continue to enrich themselves and will prepare for the 0:19:08.320 --> 0:19:11.720 next attack against Israel. And my prediction is that these 0:19:11.960 --> 0:19:15.320 you know, every other year wars that Hamaz has been 0:19:15.359 --> 0:19:18.800 provoking since it took control of the Gaza, would just 0:19:18.880 --> 0:19:21.040 go on. In that scenario, I think it is much 0:19:21.119 --> 0:19:25.200 better for the Israelis public and indeed for the Palestinian 0:19:25.240 --> 0:19:29.080 public in Gaza, that Hamas are done for, that it's over, 0:19:29.600 --> 0:19:33.280 and that other partners in the region can help in 0:19:33.359 --> 0:19:36.159 whatever way they can to rebuild the society there. It 0:19:36.240 --> 0:19:38.119 is not going to be an easy job, but it 0:19:38.200 --> 0:19:42.200 will be infinitely harder if Hamaz still have any kind 0:19:42.240 --> 0:19:46.640 of a stronghold. So preventing Israeli victory once again would 0:19:46.720 --> 0:19:49.679 lead only to another set of cycles of conflict, and 0:19:49.880 --> 0:19:51.240 I don't think that's desirable. 0:19:53.560 --> 0:19:57.159 No, it's not desirable for either party. Is As you explained. 0:19:57.920 --> 0:20:00.560 One thing we have seen in Israel though, is the 0:20:00.760 --> 0:20:04.000 willingness of its people to fight for the country. Young 0:20:04.040 --> 0:20:07.680 people are willing to risk their lives to defend their country. 0:20:07.880 --> 0:20:11.639 That's not a sentiment that is shared in the West. 0:20:11.720 --> 0:20:15.160 In the UK, only a quarter of young people twenty 0:20:15.200 --> 0:20:17.679 seven percent said they were willing to be enlisted to 0:20:17.720 --> 0:20:22.000 defend their country. And one doesn't I guess Douglas seek 0:20:22.080 --> 0:20:25.439 to protect what one doesn't value. And there's certainly a 0:20:25.560 --> 0:20:29.639 deep sense of self loathing among many young people for 0:20:29.760 --> 0:20:32.359 their own country, whether we're talking about the UK, the 0:20:32.520 --> 0:20:36.480 US or right here in Australia. What can be done 0:20:36.520 --> 0:20:40.800 to combat that? I feel that's such a destructive force 0:20:40.880 --> 0:20:44.480 with all sorts of long term dangers. 0:20:45.160 --> 0:20:47.560 Well, it has huge long term dangers. And I mean 0:20:47.600 --> 0:20:49.280 I spoke about this a bit when I was in 0:20:49.320 --> 0:20:53.359 Australia recently, but I mean the recent referendum in Australia 0:20:53.440 --> 0:20:57.400 was a very very important blow to the people who 0:20:57.400 --> 0:21:00.760 would like to make all people in West and democracies, 0:21:00.800 --> 0:21:05.360 only in Western democracies feel utterly wretched about everything about us, 0:21:05.760 --> 0:21:09.720 to make everybody in the majority feel that we're usurpers 0:21:09.760 --> 0:21:15.440 and colonizers and genocidists, and all of these other outrageous claims, 0:21:16.240 --> 0:21:19.600 always claims made against the most free and the most 0:21:19.680 --> 0:21:23.040 fair societies on Earth. But this has been done for 0:21:23.400 --> 0:21:26.760 more than a generation. Now. You tell young Australians that 0:21:26.760 --> 0:21:28.880 they have no right to the land. You tell young 0:21:28.920 --> 0:21:32.320 Americans that they're they're just there because they usurped the 0:21:32.440 --> 0:21:35.359 native peoples. You tell Europeans, even when they are the 0:21:35.440 --> 0:21:37.960 native peoples, that although they are the native peoples, they 0:21:37.960 --> 0:21:41.080 should be themselves userped go on and on like that, 0:21:41.119 --> 0:21:43.159 And of course, of course you're going to have a 0:21:43.160 --> 0:21:46.360 lot of young people who think, well, why on Earth 0:21:46.400 --> 0:21:48.879 would I risk my life for a country I've been 0:21:48.880 --> 0:21:51.560 told it's rotten from the beginning. I think we need 0:21:51.600 --> 0:21:53.439 to turn this whole thing around, and I think it 0:21:53.480 --> 0:21:56.000 can be turned around. The young Israelis have shown it 0:21:56.000 --> 0:21:59.960 can be turned around. They've shown that when it really 0:22:00.160 --> 0:22:03.320 comes to brutal reality in your face, you can stand 0:22:03.440 --> 0:22:06.040 up and fight, and the young Israelis have I hope 0:22:06.040 --> 0:22:08.680 that it never comes to that for young Australians and 0:22:08.760 --> 0:22:13.040 Americans and Canadians and British and Europeans. But if it 0:22:13.119 --> 0:22:16.159 did that we would be tested, and I think a 0:22:16.160 --> 0:22:18.560 lot of people would fail that test because they've been 0:22:18.640 --> 0:22:20.119 taught to fail that test. 0:22:22.640 --> 0:22:22.919 They have. 0:22:23.119 --> 0:22:28.800 Man, we've had this poison in academia and elsewhere for decades. 0:22:28.920 --> 0:22:32.119 So I'm glad you you believe it can be turned around. 0:22:32.200 --> 0:22:34.720 I do have my doubts. Now before you go, I've 0:22:34.720 --> 0:22:38.200 got to ask you about this ongoing sham trial of 0:22:38.280 --> 0:22:41.680 former President Donald Trump. It's continuing in Manhattan. We've had 0:22:41.720 --> 0:22:47.119 Stormy Daniels testifyer much of a testimony, salacious details that 0:22:47.160 --> 0:22:51.119 have completely relevant to the case. We've had serial Purjura 0:22:51.160 --> 0:22:55.040 and Michael Cohen understand, and it seems everyone is resigned 0:22:55.119 --> 0:22:56.720 to the fact that this is some sort of a 0:22:56.760 --> 0:23:00.000 show trial. It's a political case as much as anything. 0:23:00.880 --> 0:23:05.119 Former federal prosecutor Andrew C. McCarthy wrote in The New 0:23:05.200 --> 0:23:09.360