WEBVTT - Unlocking Human Potential: The Power of Play 0:00:02.360 --> 0:00:02.560 Yes. 0:00:03.760 --> 0:00:06.400 Now this is going to be very confusing because we 0:00:06.480 --> 0:00:08.520 are all based in Melbourne. 0:00:08.520 --> 0:00:09.479 Well, you two in Melbourne. 0:00:09.480 --> 0:00:12.280 I'm down in the Mornington Peninsula. But anybody listens to 0:00:12.320 --> 0:00:17.000 this is going they're not natives. So just give us 0:00:17.040 --> 0:00:19.599 a bit of both of your background, kind of where 0:00:19.640 --> 0:00:24.400 you're from and your cold kind of educational professional background. 0:00:25.200 --> 0:00:26.480 We'll go ladies first. Why not? 0:00:27.120 --> 0:00:31.840 Thanks? So I am originally from Miami, Florida. I have 0:00:31.920 --> 0:00:35.320 been in Australia for fifteen years. I make the joke 0:00:35.400 --> 0:00:37.879 that I identify as Australian and my pronouns are yeah, 0:00:37.960 --> 0:00:48.400 nah and yeah. The reason the reason I came to 0:00:48.440 --> 0:00:50.960 Australia was because I won an all expenses paid trip 0:00:51.000 --> 0:00:54.200 to Tasmania in a video competition. So I drove in 0:00:54.280 --> 0:00:57.200 a bright orange Camebra van around Tasmania for six weeks 0:00:57.680 --> 0:01:02.320 filming and capturing all of our our kind of excursions 0:01:02.360 --> 0:01:04.320 and things like that. This was back before YouTube was 0:01:04.360 --> 0:01:07.800 sort of a thing. It was in twenty ten, two 0:01:07.800 --> 0:01:11.840 thousand and nine. So yeah, I came to Tazzy. I 0:01:11.880 --> 0:01:14.240 did a working holiday visa for a year in Melbourne 0:01:14.240 --> 0:01:17.319 and then figured out a sneaky way to get myself 0:01:17.640 --> 0:01:18.360 here for good. 0:01:18.560 --> 0:01:22.039 So did that involve marrying a local. 0:01:22.440 --> 0:01:24.600 No, I am here on my own accord. 0:01:24.880 --> 0:01:28.640 Yes, unlike me exactly. 0:01:28.440 --> 0:01:30.960 Most people there their ticket is someone else me. I 0:01:31.400 --> 0:01:33.600 snuck in there and figured out how to get sponsored 0:01:33.600 --> 0:01:37.640 through my work. So yeah, I have a PR and 0:01:37.680 --> 0:01:40.520 marketing background originally, but I've always been very obsessed with 0:01:40.640 --> 0:01:44.080 human behavior and just the way the mind kind of works, 0:01:44.120 --> 0:01:48.160 and our own levels of consciousness and self awareness. And 0:01:48.200 --> 0:01:49.960 so when I did come to Australia at the ripe 0:01:49.960 --> 0:01:52.760 page of twenty five, I was thinking to myself, what 0:01:52.840 --> 0:01:55.320 am I doing here? Who am I? And I ended 0:01:55.400 --> 0:01:58.400 up having a coach who I did some great work with, 0:01:58.480 --> 0:02:00.480 just kind of landing and who I wanted to be 0:02:00.520 --> 0:02:03.240 in this new space. And he one day said to me, 0:02:03.320 --> 0:02:05.520 you should be a coach. You really, you really get 0:02:05.520 --> 0:02:07.920 this stuff. And I said, okay, sure. I was kind 0:02:07.920 --> 0:02:09.560 of done with I was kind of done with PR 0:02:09.560 --> 0:02:11.760 and marketing, so I went and got my coaching certification. 0:02:11.880 --> 0:02:14.400 I set up a successful coaching business. I worked outside 0:02:14.440 --> 0:02:17.600 of different wellness centers, and then I just was getting 0:02:17.600 --> 0:02:19.960 this itch of the one on one thing for me. 0:02:20.000 --> 0:02:22.120 I'm super extroverted and I always wanted to be an 0:02:22.120 --> 0:02:24.080 actress when I was a kid. So I was like, 0:02:24.120 --> 0:02:26.320 this is this work is rewarding, but I want to 0:02:26.360 --> 0:02:28.240 like reach more people. I want to kind of have 0:02:28.280 --> 0:02:30.880 a little bit of a stage. So I started crafting 0:02:31.320 --> 0:02:33.520 workshops that were about mental health and well being. But 0:02:33.560 --> 0:02:36.480 I would bring a character in or I would dress 0:02:36.600 --> 0:02:38.320 up as like, you know, how to tame I would 0:02:38.320 --> 0:02:40.200 do how to Tame your inner critic, and I would 0:02:40.240 --> 0:02:42.640 dress up as a lion tamer just to create a 0:02:42.639 --> 0:02:48.320 little bit more kind of levity and lightness around heavier topics. 0:02:48.520 --> 0:02:51.720 And then yeah, I started to just kind of delve 0:02:51.760 --> 0:02:54.880 more into more in this idea of play, and I 0:02:54.919 --> 0:02:58.280 tried to run Australia's first ever adult summer camp, which 0:02:58.320 --> 0:03:01.680 was unfortunately the first of my business and quite a flop. 0:03:01.680 --> 0:03:05.600 I had, I think three people three people book. But 0:03:05.639 --> 0:03:07.359 then I really was trying to get to my core. 0:03:07.400 --> 0:03:09.480 I was doing my Simon sink Why and I was like, 0:03:09.480 --> 0:03:11.799 all right, I really want to connect adults to their playfulness. 0:03:11.800 --> 0:03:14.320 And I had a friend say, oh, why don't you 0:03:14.320 --> 0:03:16.400 look at doing it from a personal sorry from a 0:03:16.400 --> 0:03:19.079 professional perspective then personal, So I kind of pivoted from 0:03:19.200 --> 0:03:22.480 play for personal into play for professional did a real 0:03:22.520 --> 0:03:24.840 big deep dive around what was happening in Silicon Valley 0:03:24.840 --> 0:03:26.760 and things like that, and then started iterating on that, 0:03:26.840 --> 0:03:30.040 and that was This year is my tenth year in 0:03:30.400 --> 0:03:32.760 really diving into this world of play at work and 0:03:33.000 --> 0:03:36.320 all of the benefits that it creates around innovation, creativity, 0:03:36.320 --> 0:03:39.160 psychological safety. I mean, the list goes on and on 0:03:39.200 --> 0:03:42.680 from mental health and well being. For me, play is 0:03:42.720 --> 0:03:46.880 such this incredible conduit with which we can enter into 0:03:46.960 --> 0:03:50.280 our full potential as human beings. And I think, you know, 0:03:50.280 --> 0:03:51.600 we can talk more about that in a bit. I 0:03:51.600 --> 0:03:54.240 want to give Tana a chance to give his origin story, 0:03:54.280 --> 0:03:56.760 But yeah, I think you know, play is a real 0:03:57.120 --> 0:04:00.440 opportunity to unlock so much of our own internal b allions, 0:04:00.680 --> 0:04:08.920 which is very much buried under achievement, success, mortgages, responsibility, conformity, risk, aversion. 0:04:09.080 --> 0:04:11.160 So yeah, I think there's a lot to be said 0:04:11.160 --> 0:04:13.160 about how do we sort of excavate that part of 0:04:13.200 --> 0:04:16.240 ourselves to arrive in this kind of crazy time of 0:04:16.240 --> 0:04:18.080 technological change and disruption. 0:04:18.880 --> 0:04:20.760 That is very cool, And you know what, I've got 0:04:20.760 --> 0:04:25.840 a big takeaway from this already. I think I'm going 0:04:25.880 --> 0:04:30.159 to use your iMX Military. I'm a corporate speaker X military. 0:04:30.200 --> 0:04:33.080 I love fancy dress. I'm going to start dressing up 0:04:33.120 --> 0:04:35.599 on stage. I'm going to try and find a way 0:04:36.480 --> 0:04:43.360 to weave in being a smurf, for sure. I've been 0:04:43.400 --> 0:04:46.159 a smurf so many times. You would not believe it, 0:04:46.440 --> 0:04:47.040 could you not? 0:04:47.120 --> 0:04:49.159 But anyway, that's a different. 0:04:48.880 --> 0:04:51.719 Podcast where I probably need to lie down on the 0:04:51.760 --> 0:04:56.880 couch tane over to you. Let's talk about you. You 0:04:56.880 --> 0:05:00.080 bet you better be good after that one. 0:05:00.360 --> 0:05:05.200 So I'm originally from rural New Mexico, on the border 0:05:05.200 --> 0:05:11.600 between the US and Mexico. I like cats and dogs equally, 0:05:11.960 --> 0:05:14.800 long walks on the beach, and I am an all 0:05:14.960 --> 0:05:17.279 round nerd. So I really had a love affair with 0:05:17.360 --> 0:05:20.240 biology and the way the world works for as long 0:05:20.279 --> 0:05:24.520 as I can remember. But I'm also an intense adrenaline drunkie. 0:05:25.360 --> 0:05:27.560 So my way to get in touch with biology was 0:05:27.600 --> 0:05:29.839 to get out into nature through mountain biking. And my 0:05:29.920 --> 0:05:34.000 first real job was professional mountain biker, cross country mountain biker. 0:05:33.680 --> 0:05:35.160 In the US. Wow. 0:05:35.200 --> 0:05:39.000 And that was going smoothly until I broke my back. 0:05:39.080 --> 0:05:43.960 Didn't yeah until it finally got the better of my body. 0:05:44.720 --> 0:05:46.000 But I focused back. 0:05:46.920 --> 0:05:51.119 Yeah, so, but when one door closes, many more open. 0:05:51.240 --> 0:05:55.240 So I refocused on academics and finished my undergrad in 0:05:55.320 --> 0:05:58.839 bio kem and then decided to have an opportunity to 0:05:58.920 --> 0:06:03.520 go sailing with my Kiwi father and Tasmanian mother, and 0:06:03.600 --> 0:06:06.600 so we sailed across the South Pacific to New Zealand. 0:06:07.240 --> 0:06:10.279 And on that journey I actually came across a whale 0:06:10.320 --> 0:06:14.200 dissection a Cuvier beaked weal, which is the deepest diving 0:06:14.240 --> 0:06:19.719 mammal and the really interesting and I can't smell, so 0:06:19.760 --> 0:06:23.000 I'm in anosmiac so good. I'm a good partner to have. 0:06:23.080 --> 0:06:26.320 You can fight around me and not shower and I 0:06:26.360 --> 0:06:32.680 am unaware. But on this whale dissection, I really love 0:06:32.760 --> 0:06:35.480 marine biology and I wanted to be a marine biologist. 0:06:35.560 --> 0:06:38.800 And this woman from Harvard Medical School, Darling Kenton, who 0:06:38.839 --> 0:06:41.760 was leading the dissection which I got to help with, 0:06:42.960 --> 0:06:47.080 told me this marine biology is a saturated field, but 0:06:47.160 --> 0:06:50.240 if you can understand the code of life itself DNA, 0:06:50.760 --> 0:06:54.120 you can apply it to any field within biology. So 0:06:54.160 --> 0:06:57.440 that's out with me for a while. And landed in 0:06:57.480 --> 0:07:00.960 New Zealand and first started house painting because I was 0:07:01.040 --> 0:07:05.440 broke as and then got a job doing how hospitalities 0:07:05.440 --> 0:07:08.680 founded up, managing wineries and making wine on Wayhiki and 0:07:08.720 --> 0:07:11.840 New Zealand. And then my brain was atrophying, and because 0:07:11.840 --> 0:07:14.160 I'm a nerd, I went back to academia and I 0:07:14.200 --> 0:07:18.600 went to the University of Melbourne for bioinformatics, basically using 0:07:18.920 --> 0:07:22.520 AI machine learning to read DNA and figure out what 0:07:22.600 --> 0:07:26.480 genetic changes are causing cancer and working with clinicians to 0:07:26.560 --> 0:07:29.880 improve patient outcomes. So my PhD research was at Peter 0:07:30.000 --> 0:07:34.920 McCollum Cancer Center and during this time I love science, 0:07:34.960 --> 0:07:39.400 I love technology, but I think it lacks good communication. 0:07:40.280 --> 0:07:43.400 So formed a company called future Crunch, which is science 0:07:43.440 --> 0:07:48.800 communication explores the frontiers of science and technology and really 0:07:49.040 --> 0:07:53.280 seeks out stories of human progress, stories of incredible people 0:07:53.320 --> 0:07:56.240 around the world doing great stuff to make the world 0:07:56.280 --> 0:07:59.400 a better place, because I think one people really suffer 0:07:59.440 --> 0:08:05.120 from is negative information, a torrent of negative news, and 0:08:05.160 --> 0:08:08.000 that doesn't lead to pathways forward and a belief that 0:08:11.000 --> 0:08:15.400 lotions are available. So that for the last thirteen years 0:08:15.480 --> 0:08:18.200 have been working with organizations and individuals to help foster 0:08:18.680 --> 0:08:22.080 intelligent optimism with the Reverend Humor and fancy colorful jackets 0:08:22.080 --> 0:08:25.200 on stage, so that's pretty much me and ended up 0:08:25.240 --> 0:08:29.640 in Melbourne, Love Australia and ran across Darra and a 0:08:29.680 --> 0:08:33.880 plain nerd and a science tech nerd collided and we 0:08:34.040 --> 0:08:36.800 now work together in a more I would say human 0:08:36.840 --> 0:08:40.200 holistic approach. So we're both nerds from different angles. 0:08:40.679 --> 0:08:44.280 Yeah, absolutely, Wow, fascinating backgrounds. And are you still in 0:08:44.320 --> 0:08:48.320 academia tany or are you just in the company now 0:08:48.880 --> 0:08:52.199 doing stuff with organizations. 0:08:51.559 --> 0:08:54.080 Future corunch has become a full time thing. But I 0:08:54.120 --> 0:08:59.480 call myself a recovering academic. I like the Ivory Towers, 0:08:59.559 --> 0:09:03.040 but comes with its problems, and so I like getting 0:09:03.040 --> 0:09:07.440 research out and science and tech innovations to the general public. 0:09:08.280 --> 0:09:10.440 We have all, I believe we have most of the 0:09:10.480 --> 0:09:12.600 tools in our tool build to get out of the 0:09:12.640 --> 0:09:15.960 mess we've created. It's just about inspiring and educating people 0:09:16.600 --> 0:09:17.319 to get out. 0:09:17.120 --> 0:09:23.400 There and do it. Yeah. Cool, quite similar. 0:09:23.440 --> 0:09:26.360 I call myself a procademic, so I like to read 0:09:26.400 --> 0:09:29.920 all the geeky academic research and go how does this 0:09:30.040 --> 0:09:32.920 apply and then talk to talk to people about how 0:09:32.960 --> 0:09:35.640 they can use it to improve their lives. So, now, 0:09:36.960 --> 0:09:40.079 in that that intro from both of you, obviously we're 0:09:40.440 --> 0:09:43.880 we're pointing towards and your book as well, is that 0:09:44.240 --> 0:09:45.839 today we're. 0:09:45.440 --> 0:09:47.200 Really not doing very well. 0:09:48.440 --> 0:09:51.560 You know, we are, as I often say, we are 0:09:51.760 --> 0:09:56.239 the most overweight, most depressed, most medicated, and most addictive 0:09:56.320 --> 0:09:59.640 cohort of adults that there's ever been. Yet life has 0:09:59.679 --> 0:10:02.440 never being so good, right, we got it easier than 0:10:02.480 --> 0:10:05.560 all of our ancestors. Yet we are struggling physically and mentally, 0:10:06.160 --> 0:10:10.839 and often that manifests in burnout, and and your your 0:10:10.840 --> 0:10:14.760 book is is kind of what we can do about this. 0:10:14.960 --> 0:10:18.199 But but let's just let's just talk about burnout. I mean, 0:10:18.280 --> 0:10:20.600 what what what are you guys seeing out there? I mean, 0:10:20.640 --> 0:10:23.440 you're you're at the cold face, you're interrupted and interacting 0:10:23.520 --> 0:10:24.520 with with companies. 0:10:24.559 --> 0:10:26.559 I mean I can come at it from an academic. 0:10:26.120 --> 0:10:28.360 Perspective, but what do you what are you actually seeing 0:10:29.000 --> 0:10:31.040 in the organizations that you're working with. 0:10:32.840 --> 0:10:36.680 I think what we kind of general theme is just 0:10:36.800 --> 0:10:45.080 this blanket of exhaustion, this blanket of overwhelm, this intensity 0:10:45.080 --> 0:10:50.120 around uncertainty around job security. Obviously, like the conversation around AI, 0:10:50.480 --> 0:10:54.040 you know, AI and jobs is I think creating so 0:10:54.120 --> 0:10:57.440 much fear within people. I think for both of us, 0:10:57.480 --> 0:11:00.400 we've been entrepreneurs for over a decade, and it was 0:11:00.440 --> 0:11:03.959 always that uncertainty around when's the next paycheck going to come? 0:11:03.960 --> 0:11:06.880 But now even with that, with a full time job 0:11:06.920 --> 0:11:09.600 with a company, you have no job security. The amount 0:11:09.640 --> 0:11:13.840 of redundancies and transformations and restructuring that are happening is 0:11:13.880 --> 0:11:17.960 just causing people so much distress. And so I think, 0:11:18.200 --> 0:11:21.960 you know, one thing that isn't necessarily explicit in the book, 0:11:22.040 --> 0:11:24.480 but what is basically the general gist of what we're 0:11:24.520 --> 0:11:27.880 trying to talk about is really looking at conditions. Because 0:11:27.920 --> 0:11:31.319 I think when we explore burnout from a systemic perspective, 0:11:31.440 --> 0:11:34.160 it feels very big. And so when we talk about 0:11:34.160 --> 0:11:38.120 how burnout costs businesses trillions of dollars, how does a 0:11:38.240 --> 0:11:42.280 leader actually really see themselves in those numbers, and how 0:11:42.320 --> 0:11:44.080 do we kind of bring it down to a more 0:11:44.120 --> 0:11:47.400 granular level for what they can relate to and see 0:11:47.400 --> 0:11:49.760 in their people and what's happening. And so when you 0:11:49.800 --> 0:11:54.240 think about the conditions, it's actually, you know, a smaller 0:11:54.280 --> 0:11:57.240 subset of what the systemic issue is around work. I mean, 0:11:57.280 --> 0:11:59.800 when you think about the industrial revolution and even the 0:12:00.280 --> 0:12:02.840 in work ethic around play being sorry by work being 0:12:02.880 --> 0:12:06.080 salvation and things like that, that's like five hundred years 0:12:06.120 --> 0:12:09.520 of unprogramming that we need to do around how we 0:12:09.600 --> 0:12:12.560 identify it with work and success and achievement. Right, But 0:12:12.640 --> 0:12:15.880 that's so big, and when we try and approach something 0:12:15.920 --> 0:12:18.480 that's so big, we become paralyzed and we do nothing. 0:12:18.960 --> 0:12:21.840 So for us, especially with the way that we've written 0:12:21.880 --> 0:12:25.160 the book, is really about creating sort of micropractices and 0:12:25.240 --> 0:12:28.880 micro moments around changing the conditions both in the environments 0:12:28.880 --> 0:12:31.600 that we have control over in our own lives and 0:12:31.679 --> 0:12:36.200 also giving leaders the opportunity to think about changing the 0:12:36.240 --> 0:12:39.480 conditions within their realm of and sphere of influence. 0:12:39.559 --> 0:12:39.719 Right. 0:12:40.320 --> 0:12:44.520 And so when we think about burnout, like burnout is 0:12:44.600 --> 0:12:48.040 kind of the holy grail of exhaustion, right, it's like 0:12:48.080 --> 0:12:50.280 when you've actually reached your end where you are having 0:12:50.280 --> 0:12:53.720 a mental and physical or you know, mental or physical breakdown. 0:12:53.800 --> 0:12:56.960 Basically you might become hospitalized, you know, whatever it is. 0:12:57.480 --> 0:13:01.400 But what we discovered in researching what kind of is 0:13:01.440 --> 0:13:05.000 like the presupposition of burnout is something called achievement syndrome, 0:13:05.440 --> 0:13:08.440 which comes from an amazing researcher based in the States 0:13:08.440 --> 0:13:12.040 called Michael Simmons, which is really the slow and steady 0:13:12.280 --> 0:13:17.520 kind of slide towards burnout. And it really happens from 0:13:17.520 --> 0:13:21.319 the moment when we're children and we start to achieve, 0:13:21.720 --> 0:13:25.040 So we get ribbons and trophies and report cards and 0:13:25.120 --> 0:13:30.680 stars and stickers, and you know, we're really awarded for Yeah, 0:13:30.679 --> 0:13:33.640 exactly correct, and so that starts to feel good and 0:13:33.679 --> 0:13:36.000 we really like that, and then that takes us into 0:13:36.040 --> 0:13:41.680 our kind of identity fusion where we're starting to connect 0:13:41.760 --> 0:13:44.840 to success as like who we are, you know, it's 0:13:44.840 --> 0:13:47.920 like I am my achievements, and so we start to 0:13:47.960 --> 0:13:49.840 lose our sense of self and really the kind of 0:13:49.880 --> 0:13:52.880 passion that started us off when we were younger and 0:13:52.920 --> 0:13:57.200 really hungry to learn and grow starts to diminish because 0:13:57.240 --> 0:14:03.000 we become so engulfed in this concept of promotion and 0:14:03.240 --> 0:14:06.559 recognition and validation and all those sorts of things. Then 0:14:06.559 --> 0:14:08.280 we kind of get into this optimization. 0:14:08.360 --> 0:14:11.080 Shara, Sorry, I need to just stop because I've just 0:14:11.120 --> 0:14:14.319 had a pop up which I've never seen before, okay, 0:14:14.800 --> 0:14:19.400 which is saying Dara is not being recorded, Okay, stop 0:14:19.440 --> 0:14:21.720 being recorded because of low browser story. 0:14:21.880 --> 0:14:25.240 Yeah, so my my computer is like to the max loaded, 0:14:26.520 --> 0:14:31.120 and so can I Yeah, you know, I have to 0:14:31.280 --> 0:14:35.480 I have eight I have ADHD and my ability to 0:14:35.560 --> 0:14:38.240 keep my computer in check is non existent. 0:14:38.280 --> 0:14:40.720 So let me so it's saying, ask them to free 0:14:40.800 --> 0:14:42.640 up space and then rejoin. 0:14:43.240 --> 0:14:46.080 Yes, okay, I'm going to offer. I'm going to do 0:14:46.200 --> 0:14:48.080 my best to delete a few things here. 0:14:48.480 --> 0:14:50.320 Yeah. Cool, And why do you do that? 0:14:50.720 --> 0:14:53.040 We're just going to keep rolling actually because this is funny, 0:14:53.040 --> 0:14:57.800 because because as you might said, her computer is suffering 0:14:57.840 --> 0:14:59.920 from Bernard overwhelmed syndrome. 0:15:00.240 --> 0:15:00.520 Right. 0:15:00.680 --> 0:15:02.960 So I don't know how how much people caught of 0:15:03.040 --> 0:15:09.000 Dara before her computer shot the bed, but so there's 0:15:09.080 --> 0:15:11.720 this started to mention there, Danny, and maybe you pick 0:15:11.800 --> 0:15:15.960 up on this Tanney side that essentially what she's alluding 0:15:16.000 --> 0:15:19.520 to is this modern world is becoming more and more vooka. 0:15:20.600 --> 0:15:23.240 This is a term from the military from my kind 0:15:23.240 --> 0:15:28.000 of background, a word of volatility, uncertainty, complexity, and ambiguity. 0:15:28.600 --> 0:15:31.080 Right, And how all of that. 0:15:31.240 --> 0:15:35.920 Uncertainty that's now being brought in by tech and actually 0:15:36.200 --> 0:15:39.640 amplifies the stress that people feel of So I kind 0:15:39.640 --> 0:15:41.280 of want to do a bit of a dive on this. 0:15:41.440 --> 0:15:43.720 I mean, I've been an entrepreneur. 0:15:43.760 --> 0:15:47.680 I understand what Dara was was was talking about with 0:15:48.000 --> 0:15:51.240 you know, words, the next paycheck, all of that that uncertainty, 0:15:51.320 --> 0:15:55.400 that stress of being a startup person. Normally people with 0:15:55.440 --> 0:15:56.960 a normal job don't have that. 0:15:57.280 --> 0:16:00.280 Now they have this uncertainty. But can you you. 0:16:00.280 --> 0:16:05.360 Wave that in with achievement syndrome and just how those 0:16:05.440 --> 0:16:10.160 words are actually colliding to push people kind of over 0:16:10.200 --> 0:16:14.600 the edge and that constant information load that we are 0:16:15.040 --> 0:16:17.520 getting and the inembility to switch off. 0:16:17.600 --> 0:16:20.000 Really yes, So to. 0:16:20.000 --> 0:16:23.160 Pick up where there was with achievement syndrome. She was 0:16:23.160 --> 0:16:26.800 talking about early programming, where you know, love and your 0:16:26.840 --> 0:16:31.120 identity becomes sort of conditional on performance, your gold stars, 0:16:31.200 --> 0:16:35.720 your report cards, you're be impressive and you belong. And 0:16:35.800 --> 0:16:39.080 as we grow and move into the workplace, we really 0:16:39.120 --> 0:16:43.240 get this identity fusion where we become our output performance 0:16:43.280 --> 0:16:48.040 in our person It becomes indistinguishable, which leads us into this, 0:16:48.200 --> 0:16:52.880 especially with AI as a layer over everything in the 0:16:53.000 --> 0:16:55.560 world in which we live, work and play, we sort 0:16:55.600 --> 0:16:58.720 of have to enjoy. We get to this thing where 0:16:58.760 --> 0:17:03.360 we start scheduling joy morning routines get hacked. We look 0:17:03.400 --> 0:17:06.560 at a bunch of productivity poor and so every moment 0:17:06.640 --> 0:17:07.400 is optimized. 0:17:07.920 --> 0:17:08.520 We kind of. 0:17:08.480 --> 0:17:12.280 Forget how to care without producing something and that's a 0:17:12.320 --> 0:17:16.400 diminishing curve which leads to burnout. It's like the more 0:17:16.480 --> 0:17:21.239 success you get, the less satisfaction relationships a road, your 0:17:21.280 --> 0:17:24.440 sleep starts to suffer, winds sort of begin to feel 0:17:24.480 --> 0:17:27.280 hollow and you don't take as much pride in them, 0:17:27.640 --> 0:17:30.760 and then you lead to the break The calendar doesn't 0:17:31.000 --> 0:17:34.560 didn't schedule the breakdown, of course, but we reach this 0:17:34.680 --> 0:17:39.120 threshold and keep hustling unless we sort of get out 0:17:39.119 --> 0:17:45.320 of this achievement syndrome. Because this achievement syndrome, it doesn't 0:17:45.359 --> 0:17:48.760 just hijack our thinking. At hijacks are breathing. We have 0:17:48.840 --> 0:17:52.719 shallow breathing. It activates our nervous system. We sort of 0:17:52.720 --> 0:17:58.240 lose present moment awareness. Cortisol is flooding our system. Our 0:17:58.320 --> 0:18:02.320 jaws locked shoulders live in permanent tension. Our head feels 0:18:02.359 --> 0:18:06.479 like a balloon on a string. And yeah, and I 0:18:06.480 --> 0:18:12.000 think with your information overload as well, going back to 0:18:12.040 --> 0:18:15.800 what darre was talking about with conditions, conditions are really 0:18:15.840 --> 0:18:17.679 the soil, and I think that's where a lot of 0:18:17.720 --> 0:18:22.240 our apathy, fear, and burnout comes from and our disconnection. 0:18:22.880 --> 0:18:27.359 So think of conditions like it's a relationship ecosystem with 0:18:27.440 --> 0:18:34.879 our family, friends, and our organizational culture. It's our information 0:18:35.080 --> 0:18:37.840 diet where we have a torrent of fake news. You 0:18:37.920 --> 0:18:41.040 need to do more of course, with negativity, bias and 0:18:41.080 --> 0:18:45.760 the media system that's predicated on fear and interrational perception 0:18:45.840 --> 0:18:50.600 of risk to get our attention. Nervous systems really overload 0:18:51.520 --> 0:18:55.800 and which reduces We have a triple C conditions, capacity 0:18:55.960 --> 0:19:00.280 and capability. But this reduces our capacity, which is essentially 0:19:00.320 --> 0:19:03.720 the bandwidth and what's growing from the conditions, the conditional 0:19:03.840 --> 0:19:10.840 soil and our base, our foundations, and so capacity is 0:19:10.880 --> 0:19:13.879 not necessarily a skill that your bandwidth. It's the underlying 0:19:13.960 --> 0:19:19.640 resource that makes really everything else possible, and it's dynamic, contextual, 0:19:19.720 --> 0:19:24.760 and it's deeply conditionally dependent. And then what we have 0:19:24.920 --> 0:19:30.200 is called capability, and those are skills that we can develop, exercise, 0:19:31.160 --> 0:19:34.800 and it's what happens when latent human capacity gets enough 0:19:34.960 --> 0:19:39.280 of the right conditions, the enough practice to become to thrive, 0:19:39.600 --> 0:19:44.600 become reliable and accessible under pressure. And once you form 0:19:44.680 --> 0:19:50.080 strong capabilities, they feedback into your capacity. Your bandwidth and 0:19:50.160 --> 0:19:55.439 capacity increases. For example, a person who develops curiosity is 0:19:55.480 --> 0:20:01.440 a capacity. Our capability and their capacity increase. They start 0:20:01.480 --> 0:20:07.680 treating novelty new things as novelty and exciting rather than threatening. 0:20:08.240 --> 0:20:13.399 The energization increases and it increases their capacity. A person 0:20:13.440 --> 0:20:18.200 who's developed hope, for example, strategic cope as a capability, 0:20:18.280 --> 0:20:24.359 finds obstacles that used to be difficult to navigate and 0:20:25.480 --> 0:20:30.560 depleteting are far easier to get around and deal with, 0:20:31.359 --> 0:20:35.679 and developed capacity starts to change fundamentally the conditions around them. So, 0:20:35.720 --> 0:20:39.280 for example, good leaders, once they build capacity and good capability, 0:20:39.480 --> 0:20:43.240 they actually start creating better conditions around them for their ecosystem. 0:20:43.760 --> 0:20:47.520 And that's one that's our three c's that really get 0:20:47.600 --> 0:20:51.000 to the point of if any of these go offline, 0:20:51.240 --> 0:20:56.080 you lead to burnout, achievement syndrome, and chronic stress because 0:20:56.119 --> 0:20:59.000 in the modern day workforce, it's always high stakes. There's 0:20:59.040 --> 0:21:02.639 always you know, fear of failure and risk aversion. And 0:21:02.720 --> 0:21:05.560 I think that's a lot of what we're suffering despite 0:21:05.600 --> 0:21:08.720 AI coming to steal your jobs and the information overload. 0:21:09.680 --> 0:21:11.640 I think it's really interesting. 0:21:11.920 --> 0:21:14.119 I like these three season I want to do a 0:21:14.160 --> 0:21:16.760 little bit of a deeper dive just so that that 0:21:16.920 --> 0:21:23.200 people understand the impact of conditions on their capacity and 0:21:23.560 --> 0:21:28.960 maybe even their their capability because when we are are 0:21:29.720 --> 0:21:34.080 overwhelmed or overloaded, right, So we're as you guys have 0:21:34.119 --> 0:21:37.120 both said, we're busy, busy, busy at work, right, even 0:21:37.119 --> 0:21:39.719 if AI is coming and we're using AI. The research 0:21:39.760 --> 0:21:42.880 is saying that people are just having to do more, right, 0:21:43.280 --> 0:21:46.120 and so it's actually not really a useful tone. 0:21:46.160 --> 0:21:47.880 You're just expected to do more. 0:21:48.160 --> 0:21:51.280 But I think that the pandemic has had a big 0:21:51.320 --> 0:21:53.400 impact on this, and particularly in Melbourne. 0:21:53.400 --> 0:21:55.960 Were you guys here, You were here during the lockdowns, right. 0:21:55.960 --> 0:21:58.240 The lockdown capital of the world. 0:21:58.359 --> 0:22:01.200 Yes, as we as we we well know, the three 0:22:01.240 --> 0:22:05.040 of us. But that I think, and we're starting to 0:22:05.200 --> 0:22:08.080 see the impact of that more on kids, but I 0:22:08.119 --> 0:22:09.040 think on adults. 0:22:09.119 --> 0:22:09.280 Right. 0:22:09.760 --> 0:22:13.119 You know, the recent data is that the nearly fifty 0:22:13.160 --> 0:22:18.800 percent of Australians are are feeling constantly stressed and on 0:22:18.840 --> 0:22:20.160 the verge of burnout. 0:22:20.320 --> 0:22:22.359 And I think for people. 0:22:22.119 --> 0:22:26.400 To understand, particularly going through that intense period of lockdown, 0:22:27.240 --> 0:22:31.240 and that amplifies any of the burnout that they were feeling, 0:22:31.560 --> 0:22:34.399 that drives it towards clinical burnout where they get a 0:22:34.640 --> 0:22:38.600 large dmygdala, the frontal lobes are shrinking all of a sudden. 0:22:38.760 --> 0:22:42.960 Now I have a negativity bias. I'm starting to scan 0:22:43.119 --> 0:22:47.000 the environment non consciously for bad shit, right, which is 0:22:47.040 --> 0:22:50.000 a brilliant adaptive response if you're living in a dangerous world. 0:22:50.080 --> 0:22:52.320 But if we don't live in a danger world, it's maladaptive. 0:22:52.600 --> 0:22:54.800 Then my frontal lobes aren't working so well. I can't 0:22:54.840 --> 0:22:59.080 regulate my emotions as well. I can't also my self 0:22:59.160 --> 0:23:03.000 controlled hearts of the bri in become diminished, so I'm 0:23:03.000 --> 0:23:06.600 more likely to eat ship food drink alcohol to soothe 0:23:06.640 --> 0:23:07.359 my stress. 0:23:07.520 --> 0:23:07.680 Right. 0:23:07.720 --> 0:23:11.400 So these are the conditions starting to amplify, and they 0:23:11.440 --> 0:23:16.600 and HI work conditions interact with personal conditions and choices 0:23:16.640 --> 0:23:20.800 that then destroy your capacity and further eroad your capabilities. 0:23:20.880 --> 0:23:23.720 Right, So it's almost like modern life. 0:23:23.840 --> 0:23:27.720 And then throw in lockdown on that, and then throw 0:23:27.760 --> 0:23:30.919 in AI over the top. It's like a perfect storm 0:23:31.520 --> 0:23:34.080