1 00:00:01,520 --> 00:00:05,480 Speaker 1: Look money cops. The extra money's black money, going out, 2 00:00:06,920 --> 00:00:10,800 Speaker 1: spending money in e glips. You have enough money, you 3 00:00:10,800 --> 00:00:13,600 Speaker 1: can do what you want. Then you're for yourself a king. 4 00:00:18,040 --> 00:00:21,200 Speaker 2: This world, the underworld, has a different set of standards 5 00:00:21,200 --> 00:00:26,040 Speaker 2: and morals. Sometimes it can get a little bit dodgy. 6 00:00:26,480 --> 00:00:28,440 Speaker 2: I think that's the best way to describe it. 7 00:00:30,120 --> 00:00:33,800 Speaker 3: I'm in the Netherlands, where vout Allowman's one of the 8 00:00:33,840 --> 00:00:37,200 Speaker 3: top Dutch crime reporters, has been explaining in the last 9 00:00:37,240 --> 00:00:41,120 Speaker 3: episode how the cocaine business made his country a very 10 00:00:41,200 --> 00:00:46,600 Speaker 3: violent place for a time. In twenty twenty, his contacts 11 00:00:46,600 --> 00:00:49,640 Speaker 3: in the criminal underworld gave him a tip it would 12 00:00:49,720 --> 00:00:52,199 Speaker 3: lead him to break one of the darkest stories of 13 00:00:52,240 --> 00:00:57,400 Speaker 3: his career. It's about a man called Roger p better 14 00:00:57,440 --> 00:00:59,880 Speaker 3: known by his nickname Pete Costa. 15 00:01:02,240 --> 00:01:05,480 Speaker 2: We don't know that much about him. He was a 16 00:01:05,560 --> 00:01:09,399 Speaker 2: regular kind of guy. He was born in nineteen seventy one. 17 00:01:09,440 --> 00:01:12,200 Speaker 2: He's a guy who grew up in Rotterdam, and he's 18 00:01:12,240 --> 00:01:16,040 Speaker 2: a flyer, a the arraider kind of guy, an average joe. 19 00:01:16,880 --> 00:01:19,440 Speaker 4: But that was a facade. 20 00:01:20,160 --> 00:01:24,040 Speaker 2: He went to call for a few robberies in the past, 21 00:01:24,040 --> 00:01:26,959 Speaker 2: and people in the criminal world say he was making 22 00:01:27,080 --> 00:01:32,440 Speaker 2: speed like amphetamines, but he wasn't like a big drug 23 00:01:32,520 --> 00:01:36,400 Speaker 2: figure until in the Naughtiest That's when his star kind 24 00:01:36,400 --> 00:01:37,280 Speaker 2: of grew. 25 00:01:39,040 --> 00:01:42,880 Speaker 3: Roger P eventually served jail time for armed robbery and 26 00:01:42,959 --> 00:01:46,039 Speaker 3: assault in two thousand and six, but he was released 27 00:01:46,080 --> 00:01:49,520 Speaker 3: a few years later and began to travel regularly to 28 00:01:49,640 --> 00:01:50,480 Speaker 3: Latin America. 29 00:01:51,960 --> 00:01:56,720 Speaker 2: He settles in Costa Rica, where he's involved in pineapple trade, 30 00:01:57,320 --> 00:02:02,160 Speaker 2: and that's how he got his nickname pic Costa because 31 00:02:02,160 --> 00:02:07,160 Speaker 2: it was in Costa Rica, and that's where he started 32 00:02:07,240 --> 00:02:11,880 Speaker 2: sending large quantities of cocaine to the port of Rotterdam. 33 00:02:13,320 --> 00:02:17,160 Speaker 3: Soon, Rotterdam would become one of the main gateways through 34 00:02:17,160 --> 00:02:21,440 Speaker 3: which cocaine was smuggled into Europe and Roger P's operation 35 00:02:21,840 --> 00:02:34,680 Speaker 3: would expand into planned kidnappings, murder and torture. I'm Fiona 36 00:02:34,680 --> 00:02:38,680 Speaker 3: Hamilton and from The Times, The Sunday Times and News 37 00:02:38,680 --> 00:02:52,000 Speaker 3: Corp Australia. This is Cocaine Inc. Episode four, The Pineapple Trader. Okay, 38 00:02:52,600 --> 00:02:55,000 Speaker 3: so far in this series you've only heard from me 39 00:02:55,160 --> 00:02:58,320 Speaker 3: at the start and the end of each episode. But 40 00:02:58,400 --> 00:03:01,799 Speaker 3: it's time I properly introduced myself and tell you why 41 00:03:01,880 --> 00:03:08,560 Speaker 3: I care about this investigation. I've been a reporter for 42 00:03:08,560 --> 00:03:11,720 Speaker 3: more than twenty years, covering crime for more than half 43 00:03:11,760 --> 00:03:15,760 Speaker 3: that time. I was actually born in England, but brought 44 00:03:15,840 --> 00:03:18,760 Speaker 3: up in Australia, where I started out working on regional 45 00:03:18,760 --> 00:03:24,080 Speaker 3: newspapers in beautiful coastal areas near Brisbane in Queensland. I 46 00:03:24,200 --> 00:03:25,920 Speaker 3: made the move to the UK to try and get 47 00:03:25,960 --> 00:03:28,720 Speaker 3: a job on Fleet Street stay here for a few years. 48 00:03:29,560 --> 00:03:33,560 Speaker 3: Fifteen years later, I'm still at the Times. One of 49 00:03:33,600 --> 00:03:35,760 Speaker 3: the first big pieces I wrote for The Times was 50 00:03:35,800 --> 00:03:39,760 Speaker 3: about a cocaine dealer in London. He spoke so casually 51 00:03:39,920 --> 00:03:43,200 Speaker 3: about fighting over territory and his chances of getting what 52 00:03:43,280 --> 00:03:46,880 Speaker 3: he called wetted up which means knife in the process. 53 00:03:47,760 --> 00:03:51,280 Speaker 3: This young lad, Michael, he won strength of being a firefighter, 54 00:03:51,760 --> 00:03:55,000 Speaker 3: but now aged nineteen, he wanted to make enough money 55 00:03:55,080 --> 00:03:57,560 Speaker 3: to put him in the director's seat, as he called it, 56 00:03:58,040 --> 00:04:01,480 Speaker 3: you know, being the top dog run other kids dealing coke. 57 00:04:02,840 --> 00:04:06,640 Speaker 3: I've reported on so many Michaels since then. I've written 58 00:04:06,720 --> 00:04:10,280 Speaker 3: about record drug bus Government promises to crack down on 59 00:04:10,360 --> 00:04:14,280 Speaker 3: Class A drugs and community initiatives to offer more activities 60 00:04:14,280 --> 00:04:18,359 Speaker 3: and diversions for those involved in selling them, but it 61 00:04:18,440 --> 00:04:23,640 Speaker 3: all feels like a bit of a broken record. Privately, 62 00:04:24,160 --> 00:04:26,400 Speaker 3: some of the police chiefs I talk to say it's 63 00:04:26,440 --> 00:04:30,360 Speaker 3: like an arcade game. One dealer gets arrested, but another 64 00:04:30,400 --> 00:04:33,000 Speaker 3: pops up in their place, and it's a game that 65 00:04:33,040 --> 00:04:38,000 Speaker 3: we are badly losing. I don't know what Michael's doing 66 00:04:38,040 --> 00:04:42,080 Speaker 3: these days, if he's even alive. But of course there 67 00:04:42,080 --> 00:04:45,840 Speaker 3: are hundreds and thousands of Michaels across the world, all 68 00:04:45,880 --> 00:04:48,640 Speaker 3: of them looking to sell cocaine. So how do they 69 00:04:48,680 --> 00:04:49,120 Speaker 3: get it? 70 00:04:50,000 --> 00:04:50,360 Speaker 5: Well? 71 00:04:50,720 --> 00:04:53,280 Speaker 3: That brings us to the next part of the multinational 72 00:04:53,320 --> 00:04:55,599 Speaker 3: business model, distribution. 73 00:05:00,080 --> 00:05:01,600 Speaker 6: Tell me what you had for breakfast? I can get 74 00:05:01,600 --> 00:05:02,520 Speaker 6: your sound levels. 75 00:05:03,080 --> 00:05:05,360 Speaker 5: Oh, this morning I had to breakfast I take from 76 00:05:05,400 --> 00:05:09,200 Speaker 5: Yochot with Chrisley, so that's normally my breakfast. 77 00:05:09,720 --> 00:05:12,080 Speaker 4: Okay, lovely, this is Hare. 78 00:05:13,160 --> 00:05:15,080 Speaker 5: We have a big problem in the port of Rotterdam 79 00:05:15,120 --> 00:05:15,839 Speaker 5: with cocaine. 80 00:05:16,880 --> 00:05:19,080 Speaker 3: He's the leader of the hit and Run Cargo team 81 00:05:19,160 --> 00:05:24,400 Speaker 3: in Rotterdam, a specialist unit combining customs, police, public prosecutors 82 00:05:24,440 --> 00:05:28,159 Speaker 3: and intelligence. We can only use his first name to 83 00:05:28,200 --> 00:05:33,120 Speaker 3: protect his family's safety. Hair is no stranger to cocaine 84 00:05:33,120 --> 00:05:34,920 Speaker 3: bus it's. 85 00:05:34,839 --> 00:05:40,040 Speaker 5: Every year, about two hundred times, so I think I 86 00:05:40,120 --> 00:05:43,159 Speaker 5: have more than one thy to fifteen hundred times we 87 00:05:43,200 --> 00:05:46,159 Speaker 5: find the drugs in the last years, so for me 88 00:05:46,240 --> 00:05:47,919 Speaker 5: it's quite normal. 89 00:05:48,640 --> 00:05:50,240 Speaker 1: Yeah. 90 00:05:50,320 --> 00:05:53,880 Speaker 3: Last year, almost sixty tons of cocaine was seized across 91 00:05:53,880 --> 00:05:58,479 Speaker 3: the Netherlands, including a single massive eight tons seizure made 92 00:05:58,560 --> 00:06:02,560 Speaker 3: right here at the port in Rotterdam. Officials laid out 93 00:06:02,600 --> 00:06:05,800 Speaker 3: the hall in a warehouse with fat blocks of cocaine 94 00:06:05,880 --> 00:06:09,560 Speaker 3: stacked one on top of the other, wrapped in plastic sacks. 95 00:06:10,000 --> 00:06:13,000 Speaker 3: It looked like it would fill the laurry easily, a 96 00:06:13,160 --> 00:06:14,960 Speaker 3: truly industrial quantity. 97 00:06:16,520 --> 00:06:18,839 Speaker 5: There are a lot of products who are produced in 98 00:06:18,880 --> 00:06:22,480 Speaker 5: South America, so fruit and vegetables is one of the 99 00:06:22,480 --> 00:06:26,919 Speaker 5: common ways to bring the drugs into containers. Only maybe 100 00:06:26,920 --> 00:06:29,760 Speaker 5: ten or twenty percent of all the cocaine it's coming 101 00:06:29,800 --> 00:06:33,280 Speaker 5: in to port of rotter Image destinated for the Netherlands, 102 00:06:33,640 --> 00:06:37,680 Speaker 5: and the rest of the cocaine is distributed somewhere to Europe, 103 00:06:38,279 --> 00:06:42,320 Speaker 5: for example, to Great Britain. The last few years we 104 00:06:42,360 --> 00:06:45,880 Speaker 5: see a lot of ripoff. A ripoff, it's meaning that 105 00:06:46,320 --> 00:06:49,799 Speaker 5: you have regular goods and somewhere in the logistical chain 106 00:06:50,760 --> 00:06:53,599 Speaker 5: they opened the container, they put in some bags with 107 00:06:53,720 --> 00:06:57,800 Speaker 5: drugs extra, they close the container, again, make a new 108 00:06:57,839 --> 00:07:02,080 Speaker 5: seal on it, send it to Rotterdam, and somebody in 109 00:07:02,160 --> 00:07:05,400 Speaker 5: Rotterdam must open the container and take out the drugs 110 00:07:05,480 --> 00:07:09,000 Speaker 5: before the regular cargo is going to its destination. 111 00:07:14,080 --> 00:07:17,200 Speaker 3: To do that, the correct shipping container needs to be 112 00:07:17,240 --> 00:07:21,640 Speaker 3: located by the drug gang among the thousands of containers. 113 00:07:21,280 --> 00:07:22,720 Speaker 4: Moving through the port daily. 114 00:07:24,080 --> 00:07:28,720 Speaker 3: Rotterdam is the biggest port in Europe. But imagine you're 115 00:07:28,840 --> 00:07:32,560 Speaker 3: part of the cocaine smuggling operation. It's your job to 116 00:07:32,600 --> 00:07:36,360 Speaker 3: find the shipping container with the drugs in it. Everywhere 117 00:07:36,360 --> 00:07:42,080 Speaker 3: you look there's towers of containers, So how do you 118 00:07:42,160 --> 00:07:43,800 Speaker 3: find that needle in a haystack? 119 00:07:45,520 --> 00:07:48,960 Speaker 5: All the people are working somewhere in the port, so 120 00:07:49,280 --> 00:07:53,120 Speaker 5: they need somebody from inside for have information. 121 00:07:59,480 --> 00:08:01,920 Speaker 3: So I've left the hotel in Rotterdam this morning. It's 122 00:08:01,960 --> 00:08:06,760 Speaker 3: a lovely sunny day. Very quickly the city landscape of 123 00:08:06,840 --> 00:08:11,560 Speaker 3: Rotterdam has given way to a massive industrial area, big 124 00:08:11,600 --> 00:08:16,240 Speaker 3: puffs of smoke going into the air from refineries and warehouses. 125 00:08:17,360 --> 00:08:20,760 Speaker 3: There's about eight lanes of traffic going in all sorts 126 00:08:20,800 --> 00:08:25,040 Speaker 3: of different directions, trucks zipping past me every couple of seconds. 127 00:08:26,280 --> 00:08:29,120 Speaker 3: Just getting more and more of a sense of how 128 00:08:29,200 --> 00:08:31,200 Speaker 3: quickly goods. 129 00:08:31,000 --> 00:08:32,400 Speaker 4: Are moved through this port. 130 00:08:41,440 --> 00:08:44,040 Speaker 3: So I've just got out the car and I'm looking 131 00:08:44,080 --> 00:08:49,160 Speaker 3: across a quite large canal to one of the terminals. 132 00:08:49,400 --> 00:08:54,080 Speaker 3: But there's four or five of these terminals here, leading 133 00:08:54,080 --> 00:08:57,040 Speaker 3: all the way out to the North Sea. I'm looking 134 00:08:57,040 --> 00:09:01,119 Speaker 3: to my right and i can see one, two, three 135 00:09:01,160 --> 00:09:06,920 Speaker 3: of these absolutely gigantic ships filled with thousands of containers. 136 00:09:07,920 --> 00:09:11,000 Speaker 3: And I'm really really getting the sense of the scale 137 00:09:11,040 --> 00:09:13,800 Speaker 3: here of how much product is moved into this port 138 00:09:13,920 --> 00:09:18,760 Speaker 3: every single day. I mean, I've been covering stories on 139 00:09:18,840 --> 00:09:23,240 Speaker 3: drugs for many, many years and speaking about the sometimes 140 00:09:23,280 --> 00:09:26,120 Speaker 3: futile battle, and perhaps I get a new sense of 141 00:09:26,160 --> 00:09:29,719 Speaker 3: the futility of it looking at this place and how 142 00:09:29,840 --> 00:09:30,480 Speaker 3: enormous it is. 143 00:09:33,720 --> 00:09:38,040 Speaker 2: I mean, the best way to get cocaine into a 144 00:09:38,120 --> 00:09:41,559 Speaker 2: country is if you have corrupt guys at customs. 145 00:09:42,480 --> 00:09:46,080 Speaker 3: This is about Allowman's again, the Dutch crime reporter who 146 00:09:46,120 --> 00:09:49,680 Speaker 3: was telling us about Roger p the cocaine dealer who 147 00:09:49,720 --> 00:09:54,400 Speaker 3: made a fortune importing the drug from Latin America. Every year, 148 00:09:54,880 --> 00:10:00,600 Speaker 3: fourteen million containers moved through the port. Unsurprisingly, the authorities 149 00:10:00,640 --> 00:10:04,559 Speaker 3: aren't able to search everyone for illegal drugs and other contraband. 150 00:10:05,320 --> 00:10:08,600 Speaker 3: In fact, they're only able to check about one percent. 151 00:10:09,880 --> 00:10:12,880 Speaker 3: So with the help of someone in the port, it's 152 00:10:13,040 --> 00:10:15,760 Speaker 3: not hard to see how guys like Roger P with 153 00:10:15,840 --> 00:10:20,120 Speaker 3: his pineapple containers can have their shipments missed or wave through. 154 00:10:23,480 --> 00:10:27,080 Speaker 2: There's a department and it's called pre arrival, and that's 155 00:10:27,120 --> 00:10:32,160 Speaker 2: where they decide which container gets checked and which container 156 00:10:32,520 --> 00:10:35,320 Speaker 2: doesn't get checked. If you want to use some jargon, 157 00:10:35,400 --> 00:10:40,640 Speaker 2: that's like putting a container on green. People working there 158 00:10:40,679 --> 00:10:43,440 Speaker 2: for him they knew which containers were coming in and. 159 00:10:43,440 --> 00:10:44,800 Speaker 6: They would put them on green. 160 00:10:46,000 --> 00:10:49,600 Speaker 2: And that was like a lottery that you can't lose 161 00:10:50,160 --> 00:10:54,000 Speaker 2: because then you can just send containers full of drugs 162 00:10:55,000 --> 00:10:58,600 Speaker 2: through customs because you know they're not going to be checked. 163 00:11:00,360 --> 00:11:04,120 Speaker 3: Back in twenty sixteen, authorities managed to intercept three point 164 00:11:04,200 --> 00:11:07,480 Speaker 3: seven tons of cocaine, which they trace back to Roger P, 165 00:11:08,360 --> 00:11:12,720 Speaker 3: also known by his nickname Pete Costa. In fact, Vouter 166 00:11:13,040 --> 00:11:17,800 Speaker 3: uses the name interchangeably. What really matters here, though, is 167 00:11:17,800 --> 00:11:20,679 Speaker 3: that three point seven tons of cocaine. 168 00:11:20,559 --> 00:11:23,480 Speaker 4: Is probably enough to fill a decent sized truck from 169 00:11:23,480 --> 00:11:25,200 Speaker 4: the floor to the ceiling. 170 00:11:27,960 --> 00:11:31,679 Speaker 2: To smuggle an amount of cocaine that big, you have 171 00:11:31,760 --> 00:11:35,439 Speaker 2: to be very sure of yourself, because that's a lot 172 00:11:35,679 --> 00:11:40,400 Speaker 2: of money. 173 00:11:40,559 --> 00:11:43,040 Speaker 3: So are you able to introduce yourself for the purpose 174 00:11:43,080 --> 00:11:44,040 Speaker 3: of this podcast and. 175 00:11:44,000 --> 00:11:44,839 Speaker 4: Tell me who you are? 176 00:11:45,080 --> 00:11:48,319 Speaker 3: Yes, of course, and we're not using your real name, 177 00:11:48,320 --> 00:11:49,880 Speaker 3: we're giving you the pseudonym case. 178 00:11:50,760 --> 00:11:52,760 Speaker 4: Are you able to say why that is. 179 00:11:54,520 --> 00:11:54,800 Speaker 1: My own? 180 00:11:54,840 --> 00:12:01,240 Speaker 3: Chiefly I'm in a hotel room in Rotterdam. Case is 181 00:12:01,280 --> 00:12:05,840 Speaker 3: an ex harbor worker. He's hunched over. He seems a 182 00:12:05,840 --> 00:12:09,600 Speaker 3: little nervous because he wants helped smuggle cocaine through this 183 00:12:09,800 --> 00:12:13,960 Speaker 3: very port, now retired. Case was twenty six when he 184 00:12:14,000 --> 00:12:17,040 Speaker 3: first started his transport company back in the eighties. 185 00:12:17,840 --> 00:12:19,240 Speaker 4: Although they never worked together. 186 00:12:19,840 --> 00:12:22,560 Speaker 3: I'm hoping that case can help me understand how someone 187 00:12:22,640 --> 00:12:26,440 Speaker 3: like Roger p could build up such a profitable operation. 188 00:12:31,960 --> 00:12:34,520 Speaker 3: Were you were aware that the port of Rotterdam was 189 00:12:34,840 --> 00:12:37,200 Speaker 3: a point for which there was a lot of illicit 190 00:12:37,280 --> 00:12:38,360 Speaker 3: drug smuggling? 191 00:12:38,960 --> 00:12:42,720 Speaker 1: Yes, but nothing both so I didn't care. 192 00:12:43,000 --> 00:12:48,280 Speaker 4: How did you know? Hey, so it's really in plain 193 00:12:48,320 --> 00:12:49,640 Speaker 4: so it's obvious it. 194 00:12:49,640 --> 00:12:51,079 Speaker 1: Was in plain Sat at that time. It was a 195 00:12:51,080 --> 00:12:54,040 Speaker 1: plain Sat. Yes, can you give me everybody who was 196 00:12:54,120 --> 00:12:57,760 Speaker 1: working in the port knows it. You're here, that's coming in. 197 00:12:58,360 --> 00:13:03,120 Speaker 1: You see some companies growing like hell, this is impossible 198 00:13:03,360 --> 00:13:05,600 Speaker 1: that they were growing so quickly because you were in 199 00:13:05,600 --> 00:13:08,160 Speaker 1: the same business. So you know what the prophets I 200 00:13:08,440 --> 00:13:10,360 Speaker 1: and yeah, what you can spend. 201 00:13:11,679 --> 00:13:14,480 Speaker 3: Although he knew it was happening. For ten years or so, 202 00:13:15,040 --> 00:13:18,720 Speaker 3: Case ran his company legally. He earned good living and 203 00:13:18,880 --> 00:13:24,400 Speaker 3: enjoyed the work. But one day a friend came asking 204 00:13:24,440 --> 00:13:25,079 Speaker 3: for a favor. 205 00:13:26,320 --> 00:13:29,800 Speaker 1: He had some problems with the import of an container, 206 00:13:30,760 --> 00:13:34,040 Speaker 1: and he asked me to help him be imported to 207 00:13:34,040 --> 00:13:37,160 Speaker 1: contain it for him. Later on they came to the 208 00:13:37,200 --> 00:13:41,920 Speaker 1: office and they put a bag of money here for 209 00:13:42,080 --> 00:13:45,959 Speaker 1: the success. And well then I knew it was a 210 00:13:46,040 --> 00:13:50,040 Speaker 1: rug transport, of course, and from that time on that 211 00:13:50,160 --> 00:13:55,600 Speaker 1: was EU money, big money, how much mm more than 212 00:13:55,720 --> 00:13:56,480 Speaker 1: enough to buy a house. 213 00:13:58,600 --> 00:13:59,600 Speaker 4: And from that moment you. 214 00:13:59,600 --> 00:14:02,000 Speaker 6: Were in, and from that moment I was in. 215 00:14:03,840 --> 00:14:07,360 Speaker 3: Once in Case's experience of moving goods legally through the 216 00:14:07,360 --> 00:14:11,360 Speaker 3: port made him increasingly useful to his criminal business partners. 217 00:14:12,920 --> 00:14:16,360 Speaker 1: You know how the customs are working. That was kind 218 00:14:16,360 --> 00:14:19,400 Speaker 1: of containers. They will check, they will not check, and 219 00:14:19,440 --> 00:14:22,840 Speaker 1: then tell them how to do it. And you were imported. 220 00:14:24,000 --> 00:14:27,760 Speaker 1: I had my own lawes transported to this wherever they wanted. 221 00:14:28,720 --> 00:14:32,080 Speaker 1: Nobody who was in the business from from Dorgs. She 222 00:14:32,280 --> 00:14:38,520 Speaker 1: it as something criminal, just a cargo, just something to 223 00:14:38,560 --> 00:14:39,480 Speaker 1: buy and sell. 224 00:14:41,200 --> 00:14:45,840 Speaker 3: Business was booming, and eventually cases associates in the Netherlands 225 00:14:45,960 --> 00:14:48,520 Speaker 3: told him there was somebody who wanted to meet him, 226 00:14:48,760 --> 00:14:50,600 Speaker 3: somebody in Latin America. 227 00:14:53,960 --> 00:14:57,840 Speaker 1: So you go over there, meet the real people over 228 00:14:57,840 --> 00:15:02,600 Speaker 1: there and making agreement. How much you get for it? 229 00:15:02,960 --> 00:15:04,160 Speaker 4: Yeah. 230 00:15:04,240 --> 00:15:06,600 Speaker 3: Do you feel comfortable saying where exactly you traveled to 231 00:15:07,200 --> 00:15:13,480 Speaker 3: meet people Mexico Columbia. Did you feel intimidated or fear 232 00:15:13,560 --> 00:15:14,040 Speaker 3: them when. 233 00:15:13,920 --> 00:15:14,400 Speaker 4: You met them? 234 00:15:15,080 --> 00:15:18,880 Speaker 1: No? No, one business men, their own company is over there. 235 00:15:19,240 --> 00:15:22,080 Speaker 1: It's not like what you see on television. 236 00:15:22,600 --> 00:15:24,760 Speaker 3: Very much a business model in the same way that 237 00:15:24,800 --> 00:15:26,000 Speaker 3: other commerce works. 238 00:15:26,120 --> 00:15:27,880 Speaker 1: Yeah. Correct, Correct. 239 00:15:28,440 --> 00:15:31,880 Speaker 3: Were you feeling any financial pressure too? Did you need 240 00:15:31,880 --> 00:15:32,800 Speaker 3: a little bit more money? 241 00:15:33,160 --> 00:15:34,280 Speaker 1: No? 242 00:15:34,280 --> 00:15:39,040 Speaker 4: No, not really, but once you realized how easy. 243 00:15:38,800 --> 00:15:44,280 Speaker 1: It was, It was so easy to import without any problems, 244 00:15:44,480 --> 00:15:45,840 Speaker 1: and then yeah, right not. 245 00:15:47,480 --> 00:15:51,040 Speaker 3: For twenty five to thirty years, Case lived two lives, 246 00:15:51,480 --> 00:15:54,480 Speaker 3: one with his legitimate business and the other running his 247 00:15:54,520 --> 00:15:55,440 Speaker 3: illicit operation. 248 00:15:56,800 --> 00:15:59,600 Speaker 1: Look and money corrects. The extra money is black money 249 00:16:00,240 --> 00:16:05,960 Speaker 1: going out spending money in the eclipse. You have enough money, 250 00:16:06,000 --> 00:16:08,520 Speaker 1: you can do what you want. Then you're for yourself 251 00:16:08,520 --> 00:16:08,840 Speaker 1: a king. 252 00:16:12,360 --> 00:16:16,200 Speaker 3: But even a king knows nothing last forever. In time, 253 00:16:16,440 --> 00:16:19,720 Speaker 3: the police caught up with him. Case was arrested and 254 00:16:19,800 --> 00:16:23,360 Speaker 3: served six years in jail. He says he actually felt 255 00:16:23,400 --> 00:16:27,200 Speaker 3: good about it because although he'd been making money, he'd 256 00:16:27,240 --> 00:16:30,920 Speaker 3: also been feeling unable to escape the cocaine business. 257 00:16:32,440 --> 00:16:35,760 Speaker 1: It looks stupid. Bit at the moment the police get you, 258 00:16:35,760 --> 00:16:39,080 Speaker 1: you get all through your freedom back when you start. 259 00:16:39,800 --> 00:16:43,960 Speaker 1: There is only one end. It could take one year, 260 00:16:44,000 --> 00:16:47,040 Speaker 1: could take ten years, can take twenty years. Within the 261 00:16:47,200 --> 00:16:48,280 Speaker 1: end you lose. 262 00:16:53,600 --> 00:16:56,640 Speaker 5: You see a corruption everywhere in the public partners and 263 00:16:56,680 --> 00:17:01,640 Speaker 5: the private partners, also by customs. That's not good. That's true. 264 00:17:02,800 --> 00:17:05,879 Speaker 3: This is Hair again, who leads a specialist unit tackling 265 00:17:05,880 --> 00:17:09,360 Speaker 3: corruption in Rotterdam. But he's not just dealing with low 266 00:17:09,440 --> 00:17:13,280 Speaker 3: level corrupt workers like Case. There's also corruption within the 267 00:17:13,280 --> 00:17:14,919 Speaker 3: customs authority itself. 268 00:17:16,040 --> 00:17:18,680 Speaker 5: I was on a department where one of the colleagues 269 00:17:18,680 --> 00:17:23,720 Speaker 5: was corrupt. It's about six seven years ago, and this 270 00:17:23,840 --> 00:17:27,720 Speaker 5: colleague give information to a criminal organization about the containers 271 00:17:27,880 --> 00:17:30,160 Speaker 5: we want to control and we want not to control. 272 00:17:31,359 --> 00:17:35,320 Speaker 3: After an investigation, Hair's colleague was exposed and ended up 273 00:17:35,359 --> 00:17:38,080 Speaker 3: going down for between eight and ten years. 274 00:17:38,760 --> 00:17:43,959 Speaker 5: I was angry because, together with your team, you try 275 00:17:44,000 --> 00:17:46,879 Speaker 5: to stop the drugs, and when there is one of 276 00:17:47,000 --> 00:17:50,160 Speaker 5: your colleagues who is corrupt, and then you are looking 277 00:17:50,200 --> 00:17:53,720 Speaker 5: also to the other colleagues, Hey, what's happening over here? 278 00:17:55,160 --> 00:17:58,680 Speaker 5: Are you trustworthy or are you also corrupt? So that's 279 00:17:58,720 --> 00:18:00,399 Speaker 5: also very difficult. 280 00:18:01,320 --> 00:18:02,280 Speaker 4: Speaking to her. 281 00:18:02,800 --> 00:18:05,679 Speaker 3: You can see how much this bothers him, how the 282 00:18:05,720 --> 00:18:09,120 Speaker 3: cocaine trade even corrupts those in the top law enforcement 283 00:18:09,240 --> 00:18:13,439 Speaker 3: teams who he should be able to rely on now 284 00:18:13,720 --> 00:18:17,760 Speaker 3: vout Allowmans. The crime reporter says Roger p had a 285 00:18:17,840 --> 00:18:20,880 Speaker 3: lot of corrupt people on his payroll in his cocaine 286 00:18:20,920 --> 00:18:21,920 Speaker 3: smuggling operation. 287 00:18:23,640 --> 00:18:26,679 Speaker 2: He was working with all these guys and some of 288 00:18:26,720 --> 00:18:31,359 Speaker 2: them were responsible for stashing the cocaine, Others were protecting 289 00:18:31,480 --> 00:18:35,719 Speaker 2: money stashes, others were selling the cocaine. To have an 290 00:18:35,720 --> 00:18:37,879 Speaker 2: operation like that, you have to be a clever manager 291 00:18:37,920 --> 00:18:40,919 Speaker 2: as well. You can't just fuck about. You have to 292 00:18:41,160 --> 00:18:45,200 Speaker 2: know what you're doing in the underworld. He wasn't known 293 00:18:45,280 --> 00:18:48,320 Speaker 2: as a very violent guy. I think it was smart 294 00:18:48,440 --> 00:18:52,800 Speaker 2: enough to understand that violence breeds attention, and the thing 295 00:18:52,840 --> 00:18:55,160 Speaker 2: you don't want is attention. 296 00:18:56,200 --> 00:18:59,720 Speaker 3: But being smart isn't always enough in the drug business. 297 00:19:00,920 --> 00:19:03,840 Speaker 3: Like any chief exec, there's some things you can predict 298 00:19:04,160 --> 00:19:09,000 Speaker 3: and some things you can't, like workplace conflicts when two 299 00:19:09,080 --> 00:19:10,400 Speaker 3: colleagues suddenly fall out. 300 00:19:12,200 --> 00:19:16,600 Speaker 2: In around two thousand and twenty, he gets in a 301 00:19:16,640 --> 00:19:20,000 Speaker 2: massive conflict with somebody who used to work with and 302 00:19:20,040 --> 00:19:23,199 Speaker 2: he says, this guy, I made him a millionaire. He 303 00:19:23,280 --> 00:19:26,280 Speaker 2: went to Dubai, he spent all this money, and then 304 00:19:26,320 --> 00:19:29,480 Speaker 2: he decided to steal money from me. That's what Roger 305 00:19:29,520 --> 00:19:33,960 Speaker 2: P says in intercepted messages. Roger P says, this guy 306 00:19:34,080 --> 00:19:37,879 Speaker 2: stole money that was about one hundred million worth of 307 00:19:37,960 --> 00:19:39,439 Speaker 2: real estate and other stuff. 308 00:19:41,080 --> 00:19:44,400 Speaker 3: So Roger P launches an investigation into this former colleague. 309 00:19:45,240 --> 00:19:49,200 Speaker 3: He tells his employees to deal with it, but this 310 00:19:49,280 --> 00:19:52,120 Speaker 3: is no ordinary hr disciplinary process. 311 00:19:53,600 --> 00:19:54,680 Speaker 6: They kidnapped the guy. 312 00:19:55,520 --> 00:19:58,639 Speaker 2: The guy is obviously very scared and he promises to 313 00:19:58,680 --> 00:19:59,600 Speaker 2: make everything right. 314 00:20:01,040 --> 00:20:05,480 Speaker 3: So Pete Coster's associates release him. And that's a mistake 315 00:20:06,119 --> 00:20:10,159 Speaker 3: because rather than making everything right, someone very close to 316 00:20:10,240 --> 00:20:12,040 Speaker 3: Roger P ends up dead. 317 00:20:13,920 --> 00:20:19,520 Speaker 2: In May twenty twenty, a guy named Ibrahim Azaim his 318 00:20:19,680 --> 00:20:23,240 Speaker 2: nickname is Ebo, gets murdered in Rotendam. He gets shot 319 00:20:24,480 --> 00:20:29,480 Speaker 2: and he was like Roger PAS's son. From what I heard, 320 00:20:29,560 --> 00:20:34,280 Speaker 2: it was very close to Roger P. So now Pete 321 00:20:34,320 --> 00:20:39,639 Speaker 2: Costa is involved in a violent conflict revolving around one 322 00:20:39,680 --> 00:20:43,920 Speaker 2: hundred million euros worth of real estate that. 323 00:20:44,000 --> 00:20:49,040 Speaker 6: Was stolen from him and somebody he loved very much 324 00:20:49,240 --> 00:20:49,760 Speaker 6: got shot. 325 00:20:53,240 --> 00:20:57,479 Speaker 2: So when Roger p finds out, he drives from Spain 326 00:20:57,520 --> 00:21:04,320 Speaker 2: where he lives, to the Netherlands and there he gets 327 00:21:04,359 --> 00:21:09,840 Speaker 2: into contact with a guy and they decide that they 328 00:21:09,840 --> 00:21:20,280 Speaker 2: are going to retaliate. In the summer of twenty twenty, 329 00:21:20,320 --> 00:21:24,080 Speaker 2: I was working for a national newspaper. I was writing 330 00:21:24,080 --> 00:21:28,120 Speaker 2: about organized crime together with a Colleguemannon Mayus. We heard 331 00:21:28,240 --> 00:21:31,640 Speaker 2: stories that encro had fallen. 332 00:21:33,320 --> 00:21:37,520 Speaker 3: Vouters talking about Anchor Chat, a company that made sophisticated 333 00:21:37,720 --> 00:21:43,720 Speaker 3: encrypted devices disguised though like ordinary phones, the user could 334 00:21:43,760 --> 00:21:47,960 Speaker 3: access a secret messaging system. Set up in twenty sixteen, 335 00:21:48,320 --> 00:21:52,159 Speaker 3: It soon became the way criminals communicated across countries and 336 00:21:52,200 --> 00:21:57,159 Speaker 3: between continents. They all basically thought it was impenetrable, but 337 00:21:57,280 --> 00:22:01,520 Speaker 3: then in early twenty twenty, French and authorities began to 338 00:22:01,560 --> 00:22:06,560 Speaker 3: hack the system. A gigantic cyber investigation led to eight 339 00:22:06,640 --> 00:22:08,480 Speaker 3: hundred arrests across Europe. 340 00:22:08,920 --> 00:22:11,800 Speaker 2: The encrypted communication in which criminals thought that they were 341 00:22:11,960 --> 00:22:14,760 Speaker 2: free to speak, was intercepted in a legal way by 342 00:22:14,800 --> 00:22:16,119 Speaker 2: the French authorities. 343 00:22:16,400 --> 00:22:18,560 Speaker 4: Nique A police in Korchet. 344 00:22:19,240 --> 00:22:22,960 Speaker 7: So far, they've arrested seven hundred and forty six suspects, 345 00:22:23,000 --> 00:22:26,400 Speaker 7: seized more than fifty four million pounds in cash, two 346 00:22:26,440 --> 00:22:31,400 Speaker 7: tons of cocaine, seventy seven firearms, and fifty five luxury cars. 347 00:22:33,840 --> 00:22:37,040 Speaker 2: So everywhere is like, oh fuck, what if this guy 348 00:22:37,119 --> 00:22:38,000 Speaker 2: talked about me? 349 00:22:38,160 --> 00:22:41,399 Speaker 6: Or what have I sent? So it wasn't like panic, 350 00:22:41,480 --> 00:22:42,320 Speaker 6: but it was unrest. 351 00:22:44,800 --> 00:22:47,240 Speaker 2: I was talking to this guy who was like a 352 00:22:48,040 --> 00:22:51,639 Speaker 2: high up somebody who knows what's what in the underworld. 353 00:22:54,000 --> 00:22:57,040 Speaker 3: Because it's during the pandemic, Vowder has to go and 354 00:22:57,080 --> 00:23:01,359 Speaker 3: meet his source outside. They end up in an industrial estate. 355 00:23:03,920 --> 00:23:07,040 Speaker 2: So we were standing at a parking area at one 356 00:23:07,080 --> 00:23:10,760 Speaker 2: of those places where you can buy like tools and 357 00:23:10,800 --> 00:23:13,919 Speaker 2: equipment and wood and stuff like that, and we were 358 00:23:13,960 --> 00:23:18,280 Speaker 2: talking about what was going on, and somebody got arrested, 359 00:23:18,800 --> 00:23:21,600 Speaker 2: and we were talking about the arrest and very casually 360 00:23:21,760 --> 00:23:24,199 Speaker 2: the guy says, all right, so if they found this, 361 00:23:24,280 --> 00:23:26,040 Speaker 2: they know about the torture seller. 362 00:23:26,640 --> 00:23:28,720 Speaker 6: And I'm like, torture seller, what are you talking about? 363 00:23:29,040 --> 00:23:29,200 Speaker 1: You know? 364 00:23:30,200 --> 00:23:32,080 Speaker 6: So I was like, what the fuck a torture seller. 365 00:23:32,640 --> 00:23:35,159 Speaker 2: I go back to my then colleague, Young Mays, and 366 00:23:35,200 --> 00:23:40,320 Speaker 2: I asked I tell him the story, And he goes 367 00:23:40,400 --> 00:23:47,240 Speaker 2: to a source high up in the justice department and 368 00:23:47,280 --> 00:23:50,640 Speaker 2: he says, right, we hear stories about some torture chambers. 369 00:23:51,840 --> 00:23:55,000 Speaker 2: And the guy replies, how the hell do you guys 370 00:23:55,040 --> 00:23:59,920 Speaker 2: know that? So a few days after that, the police 371 00:24:00,080 --> 00:24:02,679 Speaker 2: releases a video where you see how they raid the place. 372 00:24:09,240 --> 00:24:12,600 Speaker 3: The video shows heavily armed police ram down the door 373 00:24:12,640 --> 00:24:19,240 Speaker 3: to a brick building as a helicopter hovers overhead. Inside, 374 00:24:19,400 --> 00:24:27,360 Speaker 3: they smash open door after door, they find a row 375 00:24:27,359 --> 00:24:31,200 Speaker 3: of shipping containers. Opening them, the police find that one 376 00:24:31,280 --> 00:24:35,960 Speaker 3: is lined with plastic, empty except for a single dentist's chair. 377 00:24:37,000 --> 00:24:40,880 Speaker 3: There are belts tied to the arms and handcuffs secured 378 00:24:40,920 --> 00:24:41,680 Speaker 3: to the foot rest. 379 00:24:45,520 --> 00:24:48,720 Speaker 2: It looked like something out of a horror movie, like 380 00:24:48,840 --> 00:24:49,600 Speaker 2: Saw or something. 381 00:24:49,760 --> 00:24:54,080 Speaker 6: It was totally crazy. 382 00:24:54,280 --> 00:24:54,560 Speaker 4: Feeling. 383 00:24:56,240 --> 00:24:59,480 Speaker 3: In this video, released on the Dutch Police's YouTube channel, 384 00:25:00,040 --> 00:25:03,440 Speaker 3: head of the National Investigation Department explains that police found 385 00:25:03,560 --> 00:25:08,920 Speaker 3: seven containers. Six of those were holding cells. The seventh 386 00:25:09,520 --> 00:25:12,679 Speaker 3: the one with the dentist's chair was the torture chamber 387 00:25:12,760 --> 00:25:14,280 Speaker 3: Wouter had heard about. 388 00:25:14,280 --> 00:25:16,959 Speaker 4: In containers off of a four hand if. 389 00:25:18,320 --> 00:25:22,840 Speaker 3: The officer says, the Dutch police found tools including hammers, pliers, 390 00:25:23,160 --> 00:25:25,080 Speaker 3: scalpels and blow tortures. 391 00:25:26,640 --> 00:25:32,080 Speaker 2: The containers were soundproof, so when the police found the containers, 392 00:25:32,119 --> 00:25:34,320 Speaker 2: they put in an officer or an agent in the 393 00:25:34,359 --> 00:25:36,320 Speaker 2: container and they closed the container and they told them 394 00:25:36,359 --> 00:25:40,000 Speaker 2: to scream as loudly as possible, and from the outside 395 00:25:40,000 --> 00:25:42,480 Speaker 2: she couldn't hear it because it was very well isolated. 396 00:25:43,800 --> 00:25:47,560 Speaker 3: Police got there just in time. The chamber was ready, 397 00:25:48,000 --> 00:25:49,320 Speaker 3: but it hadn't been used. 398 00:25:50,600 --> 00:25:53,440 Speaker 2: In the police investigation, they found out that the guy 399 00:25:53,440 --> 00:25:56,119 Speaker 2: who ordered to build or who paid for the building 400 00:25:56,119 --> 00:25:58,000 Speaker 2: of the containers was Becassa. 401 00:26:01,280 --> 00:26:04,480 Speaker 3: So why did Roger p or Pete Costa build this 402 00:26:04,560 --> 00:26:08,639 Speaker 3: torture chamber. It goes back to his cocaine empire. The 403 00:26:08,680 --> 00:26:11,800 Speaker 3: dispute over money and the shooting of the man who 404 00:26:11,880 --> 00:26:12,880 Speaker 3: was like a son. 405 00:26:14,359 --> 00:26:17,679 Speaker 2: One had started with the theft of one hundred million 406 00:26:18,280 --> 00:26:21,080 Speaker 2: euros worth of real estate and jewelry and stuff like 407 00:26:21,119 --> 00:26:25,840 Speaker 2: that ended with the police finding these seven torture chambers 408 00:26:25,880 --> 00:26:28,439 Speaker 2: in Brabant, which is in the south of Danellas, and 409 00:26:28,480 --> 00:26:31,040 Speaker 2: the Justice Department was always convinced that they were going 410 00:26:31,080 --> 00:26:34,320 Speaker 2: to be used. The only thing that happened was the 411 00:26:34,400 --> 00:26:38,240 Speaker 2: encro hack that got in between those plans, that jammed 412 00:26:38,240 --> 00:26:39,160 Speaker 2: those plans. 413 00:26:41,040 --> 00:26:44,360 Speaker 3: In twenty twenty two, Roger P was sentenced to fifteen 414 00:26:44,440 --> 00:26:48,919 Speaker 3: years in prison for leading a cocaine smuggling operation. For 415 00:26:48,960 --> 00:26:52,000 Speaker 3: his role in building the torture chambers, he was given 416 00:26:52,040 --> 00:26:53,719 Speaker 3: an additional thirty three months. 417 00:27:04,040 --> 00:27:07,879 Speaker 8: I live in the vost Pontage for a few years 418 00:27:08,680 --> 00:27:19,639 Speaker 8: and the biggest dreamer of all and and they had. 419 00:27:17,320 --> 00:27:18,440 Speaker 4: This is Yoch Gottmers. 420 00:27:19,040 --> 00:27:22,199 Speaker 3: He has long gray hair, piercing eyes, and he's a 421 00:27:22,200 --> 00:27:26,680 Speaker 3: friendly chap who was once a European boxing champion in 422 00:27:26,680 --> 00:27:29,359 Speaker 3: his youth. Yop was also one of the biggest drug 423 00:27:29,400 --> 00:27:33,080 Speaker 3: gangsters in the whole of the Netherlands these days, though 424 00:27:33,320 --> 00:27:37,680 Speaker 3: he's reformed handily. He also lives near to where Roger 425 00:27:37,680 --> 00:27:41,080 Speaker 3: P built his torture chamber, which is where we're driving to. 426 00:27:42,440 --> 00:27:45,160 Speaker 3: I want to see the chambers for myself to get 427 00:27:45,160 --> 00:27:48,400 Speaker 3: a better understanding of just how violent those people involved 428 00:27:48,400 --> 00:27:52,080 Speaker 3: in the cocaine business have become. I'd met Yop at 429 00:27:52,080 --> 00:27:56,120 Speaker 3: his home where something caught my eye, so. 430 00:27:56,119 --> 00:28:00,720 Speaker 4: I noticed I saw the camera outside the house. So 431 00:28:00,880 --> 00:28:03,359 Speaker 4: is that you have to be vigilant all the time? 432 00:28:04,080 --> 00:28:05,440 Speaker 4: What's the big worry now. 433 00:28:05,840 --> 00:28:08,960 Speaker 3: That they kill me still people that you were dealing 434 00:28:09,000 --> 00:28:13,080 Speaker 3: with back in the day. Or We continue to drive 435 00:28:13,200 --> 00:28:16,080 Speaker 3: through the countryside in the region of Brabon on the 436 00:28:16,160 --> 00:28:17,280 Speaker 3: Dutch Belgian border. 437 00:28:18,520 --> 00:28:24,919 Speaker 8: I believe bra BoNT is one of the most criminal 438 00:28:26,440 --> 00:28:33,160 Speaker 8: place of all land. Only in bra Bant. We're twenty 439 00:28:33,520 --> 00:28:35,600 Speaker 8: liquidations in the drutt. 440 00:28:35,400 --> 00:28:41,400 Speaker 4: World and over what time period twenty hits? 441 00:28:42,560 --> 00:28:46,200 Speaker 3: Gosh, So if you look by liquidation, your means a 442 00:28:46,280 --> 00:28:50,720 Speaker 3: hit or assassination. And looking outside the car window, it's 443 00:28:50,760 --> 00:28:54,280 Speaker 3: hard to imagine all those killings. It just seems so 444 00:28:54,480 --> 00:28:58,360 Speaker 3: peaceful and idyllic. The country roads are lined with fields 445 00:28:58,400 --> 00:29:01,880 Speaker 3: and pockets of forest, and past large farmhouses and barns. 446 00:29:02,960 --> 00:29:04,760 Speaker 3: At one point, Yo slows down. 447 00:29:06,240 --> 00:29:10,120 Speaker 8: I lift this house, which won that one on the 448 00:29:10,440 --> 00:29:13,760 Speaker 8: corner with the flag out in the front, and this 449 00:29:14,440 --> 00:29:21,880 Speaker 8: I lift only on the first because on the ground 450 00:29:22,320 --> 00:29:26,240 Speaker 8: they're gonna get me with machine guns to kill me. 451 00:29:27,560 --> 00:29:29,440 Speaker 8: I live only upsided. 452 00:29:32,960 --> 00:29:35,480 Speaker 3: As we drive, we see groups of cyclists and he 453 00:29:35,600 --> 00:29:37,600 Speaker 3: tells me we're in a popular tourist region. 454 00:29:39,680 --> 00:29:45,680 Speaker 8: And here are the chambers, or just here. 455 00:29:47,400 --> 00:29:48,520 Speaker 1: The cameras. 456 00:29:51,200 --> 00:29:54,000 Speaker 3: Yeah, there's a camera on the wall every few meters, 457 00:29:54,080 --> 00:29:54,560 Speaker 3: isn't it? 458 00:29:56,800 --> 00:29:59,080 Speaker 4: And what's this? This is a dilapidated house. 459 00:30:01,080 --> 00:30:04,120 Speaker 3: Soon we arrive in the village of wauser Plontage, which 460 00:30:04,120 --> 00:30:07,960 Speaker 3: is where the torture chambers were discovered. And suddenly Yop is. 461 00:30:08,000 --> 00:30:10,600 Speaker 8: Spooked the cameras. 462 00:30:11,680 --> 00:30:13,520 Speaker 6: It's too dangerous. 463 00:30:14,080 --> 00:30:17,680 Speaker 3: But you're worried. It's too dangerous to get out? Are 464 00:30:17,720 --> 00:30:19,000 Speaker 3: you worried about my safety? 465 00:30:19,240 --> 00:30:24,760 Speaker 8: Also? Of course you are my guest. I don't know 466 00:30:24,800 --> 00:30:30,560 Speaker 8: where the owner is. What is more possible that he 467 00:30:30,680 --> 00:30:36,360 Speaker 8: knows me then that I knows him. Sure, I must 468 00:30:37,440 --> 00:30:41,880 Speaker 8: look out a little bit for my safety, okay, and 469 00:30:42,000 --> 00:30:43,120 Speaker 8: your shafety. 470 00:30:43,360 --> 00:30:44,160 Speaker 4: Thank you very much. 471 00:30:46,680 --> 00:30:49,719 Speaker 3: The fact that you're a big, tough ex gangster is 472 00:30:49,800 --> 00:30:53,320 Speaker 3: unwilling to go any further, even after the Dutch police 473 00:30:53,400 --> 00:30:57,640 Speaker 3: raided this property in twenty twenty, suggests just how powerful 474 00:30:57,680 --> 00:31:02,440 Speaker 3: criminal organizations remain in this part of the Netherlands. But 475 00:31:02,880 --> 00:31:04,960 Speaker 3: as a journalist, I'm curious. 476 00:31:05,400 --> 00:31:06,480 Speaker 4: I want to have a look. 477 00:31:13,600 --> 00:31:18,960 Speaker 3: So there's a series of warehouses just offer a very 478 00:31:19,040 --> 00:31:23,000 Speaker 3: quiet rural lane. There's a house opposite, but it's completely 479 00:31:23,080 --> 00:31:27,680 Speaker 3: run down and dilapidated and abandoned. The complex itself has 480 00:31:27,680 --> 00:31:33,520 Speaker 3: a high fence. I've moved a little bit closer. You 481 00:31:33,520 --> 00:31:36,840 Speaker 3: can see that there's three roofs to the building, so 482 00:31:36,880 --> 00:31:42,040 Speaker 3: it's a really large complex. Another group of cyclists have 483 00:31:42,120 --> 00:31:42,640 Speaker 3: just gone by. 484 00:31:42,760 --> 00:31:43,320 Speaker 4: We've got this. 485 00:31:43,360 --> 00:31:47,000 Speaker 3: Lone walker down the country lane, and it just feels 486 00:31:47,040 --> 00:31:51,440 Speaker 3: like a very pleasant place. I think knowing what was 487 00:31:51,480 --> 00:31:53,760 Speaker 3: planned for that building really gives you a sense of 488 00:31:53,800 --> 00:31:56,959 Speaker 3: how roofless the drug smugglers are and the people involved 489 00:31:56,960 --> 00:31:57,920 Speaker 3: in these operations. 490 00:32:00,680 --> 00:32:05,600 Speaker 6: The cocaine trade is a business with a mediation problem. 491 00:32:05,920 --> 00:32:09,080 Speaker 3: Back to Volter again, who broke the story about Roger 492 00:32:09,120 --> 00:32:10,280 Speaker 3: P's torture chamber. 493 00:32:11,480 --> 00:32:13,320 Speaker 2: I mean, these guys make a lot of money, so 494 00:32:13,360 --> 00:32:17,920 Speaker 2: it's easy for them to buy violence. In the old days, 495 00:32:17,920 --> 00:32:21,080 Speaker 2: if you would steal like a few kilograms of ecstasy, 496 00:32:21,520 --> 00:32:24,400 Speaker 2: you would get your head kicked in. But now the 497 00:32:24,400 --> 00:32:27,440 Speaker 2: amounts have gone bigger that the money has gone bigger, 498 00:32:27,480 --> 00:32:30,400 Speaker 2: so the violence has gone bigger as well. In my opinion, 499 00:32:31,280 --> 00:32:34,600 Speaker 2: as long as there's a product which is illegal and 500 00:32:34,720 --> 00:32:38,480 Speaker 2: which people want to use, and which people are willing 501 00:32:38,520 --> 00:32:42,400 Speaker 2: to pay money for, the cocaine trade will thrive. 502 00:32:43,880 --> 00:32:44,880 Speaker 6: So in that. 503 00:32:44,840 --> 00:32:52,160 Speaker 2: Way the future of the cocaine trade looks sweet. Is 504 00:32:52,200 --> 00:32:56,320 Speaker 2: it good for your health? Is it good for violent No? Obviously, 505 00:32:56,320 --> 00:32:59,479 Speaker 2: but if you ask me how will the cocaine trade 506 00:32:59,520 --> 00:33:02,200 Speaker 2: be in like five years, I will promise you it 507 00:33:02,240 --> 00:33:02,840 Speaker 2: will thrive. 508 00:33:03,880 --> 00:33:06,680 Speaker 6: The war on drugs is it's bigger than ever. 509 00:33:08,480 --> 00:33:12,360 Speaker 3: Listening to Vouta, I realized that this investigation also has 510 00:33:12,400 --> 00:33:15,760 Speaker 3: to get bigger, which for me and David and Stephen 511 00:33:16,120 --> 00:33:17,480 Speaker 3: means we can't stop here. 512 00:33:23,480 --> 00:33:29,320 Speaker 9: It's crazy evidence just a play, you know where one 513 00:33:29,400 --> 00:33:33,840 Speaker 9: day someone's windows done or you may gets arrested. There's 514 00:33:33,880 --> 00:33:37,440 Speaker 9: something difference every single day. 515 00:33:38,560 --> 00:33:41,720 Speaker 3: That's next time on Cocaine Nick when we leave the 516 00:33:41,760 --> 00:33:44,840 Speaker 3: Netherlands and follow the cocaine trail to where it's sold 517 00:33:45,120 --> 00:33:48,880 Speaker 3: on the streets of the UK. 518 00:33:50,800 --> 00:33:51,560 Speaker 6: So it's bobvious. 519 00:33:51,680 --> 00:33:55,560 Speaker 2: I'm a Fuller Times newspaper and doing a podcast SNA 520 00:33:55,640 --> 00:33:56,960 Speaker 2: there was a shooting a last year. 521 00:34:00,800 --> 00:34:03,920 Speaker 3: Cocaine Inc. Is a joint investigation from the Times, The 522 00:34:04,000 --> 00:34:08,879 Speaker 3: Sunday Times and News Corp Australia. The reporters are David Collins, 523 00:34:08,920 --> 00:34:13,160 Speaker 3: Stephen Drill and me Fiona Hamilton. The series is produced 524 00:34:13,360 --> 00:34:17,839 Speaker 3: by Sam Chanterassak. The executive producers are Will Row and 525 00:34:17,920 --> 00:34:21,919 Speaker 3: Dan Box. Audio production and editing is by Jasper Leek, 526 00:34:22,280 --> 00:34:26,360 Speaker 3: with original music by Tom Burchell. Additional support on this 527 00:34:26,520 --> 00:34:30,560 Speaker 3: episode from shaw De Freeze and If you want to 528 00:34:30,560 --> 00:34:33,640 Speaker 3: get in touch with any questions or thoughts on the series, 529 00:34:34,080 --> 00:34:35,279 Speaker 3: email Cocaine Inc. 530 00:34:35,520 --> 00:34:37,600 Speaker 4: At the Times dot co dot uk.