1 00:00:04,170 --> 00:00:08,129 Sean Aylmer: Welcome to the Fear & Greed Daily Interview. I'm Sean Aylmer. It's been 2 00:00:08,130 --> 00:00:11,970 Sean Aylmer: a pretty nervous week or so for global financial markets 3 00:00:11,970 --> 00:00:14,700 Sean Aylmer: from the collapse of Silicon Valley Bank to the rescue 4 00:00:14,700 --> 00:00:18,900 Sean Aylmer: of Credit Suisse by UBS. The banking sector, I think, 5 00:00:18,900 --> 00:00:21,060 Sean Aylmer: is in turmoil right now. So what does it mean 6 00:00:21,060 --> 00:00:24,510 Sean Aylmer: for investors? Remember, this is general information only. You should 7 00:00:24,510 --> 00:00:28,290 Sean Aylmer: get professional advice before making any investment decisions. Daniel Moss 8 00:00:28,290 --> 00:00:32,430 Sean Aylmer: is a market analyst at Vantage Markets. Daniel, welcome to 9 00:00:32,430 --> 00:00:33,150 Sean Aylmer: Fear and Greed. 10 00:00:33,540 --> 00:00:34,380 Daniel Moss: Thanks for having me, Sean. 11 00:00:35,220 --> 00:00:37,979 Sean Aylmer: Did you expect this two weeks ago? It's been pretty crazy. 12 00:00:39,840 --> 00:00:42,270 Daniel Moss: No, I don't think anyone really expected it unless you 13 00:00:42,270 --> 00:00:44,909 Daniel Moss: were paying attention to the footnotes on the Silicon Valley 14 00:00:44,909 --> 00:00:48,090 Daniel Moss: Bank's 4K. But I think this is what you see 15 00:00:48,090 --> 00:00:50,430 Daniel Moss: happen when the rate of change in terms of the 16 00:00:50,430 --> 00:00:53,190 Daniel Moss: rate tightening cycle out of the Federal Reserve and out 17 00:00:53,190 --> 00:00:56,670 Daniel Moss: of the majority of other developed global central banks. When 18 00:00:56,670 --> 00:00:59,220 Daniel Moss: you push this hard, it's not like touching a break 19 00:00:59,220 --> 00:01:02,280 Daniel Moss: as it were when you're trying to slow down economic 20 00:01:02,280 --> 00:01:05,069 Daniel Moss: growth or economic activity. It really is kind of that 21 00:01:05,069 --> 00:01:07,500 Daniel Moss: sort of slingshot where you keep going, you keep going, 22 00:01:07,500 --> 00:01:10,200 Daniel Moss: and then eventually something breaks. And here we have, we've 23 00:01:10,200 --> 00:01:13,170 Daniel Moss: seen two banks collapse and then another having to get 24 00:01:13,170 --> 00:01:16,679 Daniel Moss: some emergency assistance as well. I mean, is it something 25 00:01:16,680 --> 00:01:18,840 Daniel Moss: that I thought was going to happen? Not this early 26 00:01:18,900 --> 00:01:21,810 Daniel Moss: in the tightening cycle, but I mean it was kind of 27 00:01:21,810 --> 00:01:22,710 Daniel Moss: inevitable at the end of the day. 28 00:01:23,700 --> 00:01:28,050 Sean Aylmer: I suppose as you were talking there, what really became 29 00:01:28,050 --> 00:01:31,470 Sean Aylmer: clear to me it's the speed of rate rises that 30 00:01:31,470 --> 00:01:34,410 Sean Aylmer: triggers this sort of thing. I mean rate rises triggers 31 00:01:34,410 --> 00:01:37,770 Sean Aylmer: failures, that's just life and let's forget the specifics, but 32 00:01:37,770 --> 00:01:40,649 Sean Aylmer: the speed of rate rises kind of means this stuff 33 00:01:40,650 --> 00:01:41,670 Sean Aylmer: happens. Is that right? 34 00:01:42,330 --> 00:01:45,240 Daniel Moss: Absolutely right. I mean that was essentially what the problem 35 00:01:45,240 --> 00:01:48,990 Daniel Moss: was with Silicon Valley Bank. Let's forget about the fact 36 00:01:48,990 --> 00:01:52,050 Daniel Moss: that they had an undiversified clientele. I mean every single 37 00:01:52,050 --> 00:01:55,440 Daniel Moss: one of their clients essentially had more than $250, 000 in 38 00:01:55,440 --> 00:01:58,830 Daniel Moss: deposits held. That's over the insured limit. So when they 39 00:01:58,830 --> 00:02:01,410 Daniel Moss: start seeing that there's a duration mismatch, of course they're 40 00:02:01,410 --> 00:02:04,350 Daniel Moss: going to pull funds quite quickly. But in reality, if 41 00:02:04,350 --> 00:02:06,900 Daniel Moss: this was a slower rate hiking cycle, this may have 42 00:02:06,900 --> 00:02:09,180 Daniel Moss: given that bank a little bit more leeway with the 43 00:02:09,180 --> 00:02:13,529 Daniel Moss: duration, instead of going 350, 400 basis points within 12 months 44 00:02:13,919 --> 00:02:15,570 Daniel Moss: when you are going to start to see those market 45 00:02:15,570 --> 00:02:17,760 Daniel Moss: to market losses really pile up. And then if you 46 00:02:17,760 --> 00:02:20,370 Daniel Moss: do get an excessive amount of withdrawals, you are in 47 00:02:20,370 --> 00:02:24,959 Daniel Moss: really big trouble. We're looking at an unprecedented rate rise 48 00:02:24,960 --> 00:02:27,600 Daniel Moss: in terms of actual percentage wise. But when you look 49 00:02:27,600 --> 00:02:29,550 Daniel Moss: at basis points, obviously it's going back to the sort of 50 00:02:29,550 --> 00:02:31,919 Daniel Moss: Volcker era where a lot of things broke as well. 51 00:02:31,919 --> 00:02:34,139 Daniel Moss: So it definitely is the rate of change, which is 52 00:02:34,139 --> 00:02:36,360 Daniel Moss: going to be the issue moving forward. And as we 53 00:02:36,360 --> 00:02:38,430 Daniel Moss: can see, the Fed is obviously coming to terms with 54 00:02:38,430 --> 00:02:41,970 Daniel Moss: that. They've implemented this new bank term lending facility and 55 00:02:41,970 --> 00:02:44,790 Daniel Moss: even over the weekend we're looking at coordinated response with 56 00:02:44,790 --> 00:02:47,730 Daniel Moss: five other central banks to ensure that there was ample 57 00:02:47,730 --> 00:02:50,880 Daniel Moss: US Dollar liquidity. So clearly they're starting to see that 58 00:02:51,120 --> 00:02:52,800 Daniel Moss: things are breaking and it's time to put in some 59 00:02:52,800 --> 00:02:55,020 Daniel Moss: stop gaps just in case we get a little bit 60 00:02:55,020 --> 00:02:56,580 Daniel Moss: more deterioration in the banking sector. 61 00:02:57,450 --> 00:02:59,280 Sean Aylmer: Okay, so where do we go from here? As you 62 00:02:59,280 --> 00:03:01,410 Sean Aylmer: just mentioned, we had five central banks over the weekend 63 00:03:01,410 --> 00:03:04,380 Sean Aylmer: talking about liquidity. I mean you need banks to be 64 00:03:04,380 --> 00:03:07,200 Sean Aylmer: able to lend money, you need liquidity in the market. 65 00:03:07,500 --> 00:03:11,700 Sean Aylmer: You had UBS more or less forcibly told to buy 66 00:03:11,730 --> 00:03:14,040 Sean Aylmer: Credit Suisse at a massive discount and with all sorts 67 00:03:14,040 --> 00:03:17,940 Sean Aylmer: of guarantees from the Swiss National Bank, but still it 68 00:03:17,940 --> 00:03:20,790 Sean Aylmer: happened and they were forced to do it. What happens 69 00:03:20,790 --> 00:03:26,220 Sean Aylmer: next? Is this likely to cause a global contagion or 70 00:03:26,220 --> 00:03:28,470 Sean Aylmer: a crisis or do you think that we're in a very 71 00:03:28,470 --> 00:03:30,960 Sean Aylmer: different position to where we were in 2007, so it's 72 00:03:30,960 --> 00:03:33,179 Sean Aylmer: not going to be as bad? What's your take, Daniel? 73 00:03:34,080 --> 00:03:38,250 Daniel Moss: Well, I hope it's a completely different scenario to 2007, 2008. I hope 74 00:03:38,460 --> 00:03:40,530 Daniel Moss: we don't have to do that again. And I think you 75 00:03:40,530 --> 00:03:43,080 Daniel Moss: would look at the regulations that have come in, especially 76 00:03:43,080 --> 00:03:45,450 Daniel Moss: in Europe. I mean you have the liquidity cover ratios 77 00:03:45,600 --> 00:03:48,390 Daniel Moss: of the average of those banks sitting at about 160% 78 00:03:48,750 --> 00:03:51,210 Daniel Moss: in comparison to what in the US is about 110%. 79 00:03:51,210 --> 00:03:54,000 Daniel Moss: So they are adequately capitalised. I think we are starting 80 00:03:54,000 --> 00:03:56,010 Daniel Moss: to see some of the more risky banks that had 81 00:03:56,010 --> 00:03:59,280 Daniel Moss: risky clientele and were doing not adequate risk management, not 82 00:03:59,280 --> 00:04:02,130 Daniel Moss: even hedging their interest rate exposure. I think that is 83 00:04:02,130 --> 00:04:04,950 Daniel Moss: the key issue here and they will fall away. In 84 00:04:04,950 --> 00:04:07,530 Daniel Moss: terms of a contagion, again, I think we are in 85 00:04:07,530 --> 00:04:10,290 Daniel Moss: a different position now. I think there is adequate stop 86 00:04:10,290 --> 00:04:13,560 Daniel Moss: gaps in there to prevent a more sort of systemic 87 00:04:13,680 --> 00:04:16,890 Daniel Moss: collapse as what we saw in 2008. But it is, again, 88 00:04:16,950 --> 00:04:19,290 Daniel Moss: early days. We're not too sure of the health of 89 00:04:19,290 --> 00:04:21,570 Daniel Moss: the balance sheets of a lot of these different banks 90 00:04:21,570 --> 00:04:25,650 Daniel Moss: because they're able to hold to maturity and not really 91 00:04:26,040 --> 00:04:28,680 Daniel Moss: tell shareholders or tell the market what their market to 92 00:04:28,680 --> 00:04:30,990 Daniel Moss: market losses are. So I do think we're in a 93 00:04:30,990 --> 00:04:33,000 Daniel Moss: different position. I don't think we're going to face what 94 00:04:33,000 --> 00:04:36,900 Daniel Moss: we faced in 2008, but for sure we are in 95 00:04:36,900 --> 00:04:38,789 Daniel Moss: a period where I think it's going to be very, 96 00:04:38,790 --> 00:04:42,089 Daniel Moss: very hard for the Federal Reserve to continue hiking rates 97 00:04:42,089 --> 00:04:44,760 Daniel Moss: and fighting inflation if things continue to break and if 98 00:04:44,760 --> 00:04:48,150 Daniel Moss: we start to see some more dysfunction and dislocation within 99 00:04:48,150 --> 00:04:48,930 Daniel Moss: financial markets. 100 00:04:49,710 --> 00:04:53,849 Sean Aylmer: So just taking that further, if the Fed Reserve decides 101 00:04:53,850 --> 00:04:55,710 Sean Aylmer: that it can't afford to keep putting up interest rates 102 00:04:56,100 --> 00:04:59,880 Sean Aylmer: because it risks putting other banks under, it kind of 103 00:04:59,880 --> 00:05:01,710 Sean Aylmer: has to take its eye off inflation a bit though, 104 00:05:01,710 --> 00:05:02,130 Sean Aylmer: doesn't it? 105 00:05:03,120 --> 00:05:05,550 Daniel Moss: Yeah, and I think that's probably the most scary thing 106 00:05:05,550 --> 00:05:07,890 Daniel Moss: for me is we now are facing this sort of 107 00:05:07,890 --> 00:05:10,950 Daniel Moss: stagflationary environment. If the foot has to be taken off 108 00:05:10,950 --> 00:05:13,680 Daniel Moss: the gas by the Federal Reserve, I mean inflation is 109 00:05:13,680 --> 00:05:16,590 Daniel Moss: still three times higher than their mandated target of about 6%. 110 00:05:17,370 --> 00:05:20,099 Daniel Moss: And if you look at some of the Atlanta Fed's 111 00:05:20,100 --> 00:05:22,650 Daniel Moss: gauges that they put out, they actually measure sticky inflation 112 00:05:22,980 --> 00:05:25,950 Daniel Moss: and that's still on the uptrend. So there is a 113 00:05:25,950 --> 00:05:30,359 Daniel Moss: stickiness to this inflation which would necessitate further rate hikes. But, 114 00:05:30,360 --> 00:05:33,240 Daniel Moss: as you said, if we are starting to see things break, 115 00:05:33,510 --> 00:05:35,430 Daniel Moss: does that mean the Fed has to pause here or 116 00:05:35,430 --> 00:05:37,440 Daniel Moss: maybe even just move in smaller increments? And if you're 117 00:05:37,440 --> 00:05:39,990 Daniel Moss: looking at market pricing today, and even if we just 118 00:05:39,990 --> 00:05:42,630 Daniel Moss: go back two weeks ago, Jerome Powell came out and 119 00:05:42,660 --> 00:05:45,359 Daniel Moss: was pretty forcible in saying, " Look, we're not done and 120 00:05:45,450 --> 00:05:47,040 Daniel Moss: we probably have to be a little bit more aggressive 121 00:05:47,040 --> 00:05:50,100 Daniel Moss: moving forward." That sort of markets price in a 50% chance 122 00:05:50,100 --> 00:05:52,919 Daniel Moss: of a 50 basis point hike. Fast- forward three days, we 123 00:05:52,920 --> 00:05:54,810 Daniel Moss: have the collapse of Silicon Valley Bank and now people 124 00:05:54,810 --> 00:05:57,870 Daniel Moss: are betting on a 50/ 50 chance that they won't even hike. 125 00:05:58,589 --> 00:06:01,470 Daniel Moss: So whatever the Fed does this week is going to 126 00:06:01,470 --> 00:06:04,229 Daniel Moss: be extremely volatile. I lean towards the fact that they 127 00:06:04,230 --> 00:06:07,440 Daniel Moss: probably do 25 basis points here to not spook the market. 128 00:06:07,529 --> 00:06:10,950 Daniel Moss: I think if they're seen to pause now, you're sending 129 00:06:10,950 --> 00:06:12,330 Daniel Moss: the signal, now look, we've had to put all these 130 00:06:12,330 --> 00:06:15,839 Daniel Moss: emergency measures in. We are really quite scared about what 131 00:06:15,839 --> 00:06:17,760 Daniel Moss: the impact of our interest rate hikes are going to 132 00:06:17,760 --> 00:06:20,369 Daniel Moss: have on the larger markets and then the economy as 133 00:06:20,370 --> 00:06:23,160 Daniel Moss: a whole. So I don't think they'll stop at this point. 134 00:06:23,160 --> 00:06:25,950 Daniel Moss: I do think 25 basis points and then start to 135 00:06:26,220 --> 00:06:30,300 Daniel Moss: talk more about data dependency and saying that monetary policy 136 00:06:30,300 --> 00:06:32,640 Daniel Moss: acts with the lag just to see if we can 137 00:06:32,640 --> 00:06:34,860 Daniel Moss: smooth out what's happening in the banking sector and get 138 00:06:34,860 --> 00:06:38,130 Daniel Moss: back to some sort of normality there where everything's functioning 139 00:06:38,130 --> 00:06:41,130 Daniel Moss: well and then they can prioritise inflation. But I mean, 140 00:06:41,130 --> 00:06:43,830 Daniel Moss: if they are forced to sort of stop here, that 141 00:06:43,830 --> 00:06:47,490 Daniel Moss: is when that stagflationary scenario does come to the forefront 142 00:06:47,490 --> 00:06:49,920 Daniel Moss: and we could be heading for what we haven't seen for 20, 143 00:06:50,160 --> 00:06:51,000 Daniel Moss: 30 years. 144 00:06:51,480 --> 00:06:53,490 Sean Aylmer: Stay with me, Daniel, we'll be back in a minute. 145 00:06:53,490 --> 00:07:02,820 Sean Aylmer: My guest this morning is Daniel Moss, market analyst at Vantage 146 00:07:02,820 --> 00:07:07,140 Sean Aylmer: Markets. Okay, so let's bring it back to Australia. What 147 00:07:07,140 --> 00:07:09,299 Sean Aylmer: does it mean, what's going on with Credit Suisse and 148 00:07:09,300 --> 00:07:12,270 Sean Aylmer: UBS? What's going on with the US regional banks? Does 149 00:07:12,270 --> 00:07:14,520 Sean Aylmer: it actually have any impact on Australia? 150 00:07:15,480 --> 00:07:18,270 Daniel Moss: So we're relatively siloed here in Australia. I think we 151 00:07:18,270 --> 00:07:21,090 Daniel Moss: don't have the sheer number of depository institutions that you 152 00:07:21,090 --> 00:07:22,830 Daniel Moss: look at in the US. I mean they have thousands 153 00:07:22,830 --> 00:07:27,570 Daniel Moss: of banks across the entire nation all operating independently. We 154 00:07:27,570 --> 00:07:29,760 Daniel Moss: don't have that sort of mix here. We are less 155 00:07:29,760 --> 00:07:33,900 Daniel Moss: diversified as it were, but also in a better financial situation. Even, 156 00:07:34,290 --> 00:07:36,750 Daniel Moss: I believe one of the RBA members this morning, Kent, was 157 00:07:36,750 --> 00:07:39,840 Daniel Moss: talking about that, that our banks in particular are very 158 00:07:39,840 --> 00:07:42,570 Daniel Moss: well situated to sort of weather this storm even if 159 00:07:42,570 --> 00:07:45,960 Daniel Moss: they do have to continue hiking rates aggressively over the 160 00:07:45,960 --> 00:07:48,690 Daniel Moss: next coming months. Now the RBA is obviously in a 161 00:07:48,690 --> 00:07:50,490 Daniel Moss: different position here. We're starting to see a little bit 162 00:07:50,490 --> 00:07:53,610 Daniel Moss: of weakness in the local market. Unemployment did drop a 163 00:07:53,610 --> 00:07:56,580 Daniel Moss: little bit. Inflation still remains high, but we have consumer 164 00:07:56,580 --> 00:08:00,600 Daniel Moss: confidence coming off and retail sales are not really that robust. 165 00:08:00,600 --> 00:08:02,820 Daniel Moss: So we're seeing some weakness in the consumer and we've 166 00:08:02,820 --> 00:08:05,280 Daniel Moss: also had Governor Lowe sort of flaunt or flirt with 167 00:08:05,280 --> 00:08:08,280 Daniel Moss: the idea that a pause is just around the corner 168 00:08:08,610 --> 00:08:10,560 Daniel Moss: and I think that is kind of what's helped the 169 00:08:10,560 --> 00:08:13,170 Daniel Moss: ASX stay a little bit higher as of late. Yes, 170 00:08:13,170 --> 00:08:16,410 Daniel Moss: it has sold off significantly with the US market, but 171 00:08:16,770 --> 00:08:18,840 Daniel Moss: since the start of 2022, if you were just to 172 00:08:18,840 --> 00:08:21,420 Daniel Moss: do a spread trade, short the US market by the 173 00:08:21,420 --> 00:08:23,850 Daniel Moss: Aussie market, you would've done quite well. Aussie stocks have 174 00:08:24,210 --> 00:08:26,790 Daniel Moss: performed a decent amount more and I think the good 175 00:08:26,790 --> 00:08:29,250 Daniel Moss: thing is we're obviously relying on data out of China. 176 00:08:29,250 --> 00:08:32,550 Daniel Moss: China's continuing to reopen and again, when they are buying 177 00:08:32,550 --> 00:08:35,250 Daniel Moss: the majority are our exports, I think that kind of underpins 178 00:08:35,250 --> 00:08:38,070 Daniel Moss: the ASX a little bit more than what's happening overseas. 179 00:08:38,070 --> 00:08:40,200 Daniel Moss: But in terms of the banking sector, I do think we're 180 00:08:40,200 --> 00:08:43,650 Daniel Moss: relatively siloed, relatively protected and wouldn't be looking at the 181 00:08:43,650 --> 00:08:46,020 Daniel Moss: same sort of issues that have arisen in Europe and 182 00:08:46,020 --> 00:08:46,559 Daniel Moss: in the US. 183 00:08:47,280 --> 00:08:51,000 Sean Aylmer: Okay. What about fixed income markets? One of the parts 184 00:08:51,000 --> 00:08:54,420 Sean Aylmer: of the Credit Suisse deal, which was unusual was hybrid 185 00:08:54,420 --> 00:08:58,170 Sean Aylmer: bonds, which is a form of bond with subordinated... Well, 186 00:08:58,170 --> 00:09:02,670 Sean Aylmer: no, equity holders were subordinated behind hybrid bond holders, which 187 00:09:02,670 --> 00:09:05,760 Sean Aylmer: is slightly unusual in the world of bonds. Mostly equity 188 00:09:05,760 --> 00:09:08,700 Sean Aylmer: holders lose their money before the bond holders do. What 189 00:09:08,700 --> 00:09:10,830 Sean Aylmer: do you think that means for the local market? 190 00:09:11,910 --> 00:09:14,939 Daniel Moss: For us in the local market, I mean, again, it's 191 00:09:14,940 --> 00:09:18,120 Daniel Moss: hard to bring across what the collapse of Credit Suisse, 192 00:09:18,120 --> 00:09:20,340 Daniel Moss: or not the collapse, but the merger between UBS and 193 00:09:20,340 --> 00:09:22,800 Daniel Moss: Credit Suisse is going to have on our local market. 194 00:09:22,800 --> 00:09:25,530 Daniel Moss: I think just looking at bond yields in general, I 195 00:09:25,530 --> 00:09:28,320 Daniel Moss: think what we're seeing, especially in government bonds is that 196 00:09:28,320 --> 00:09:30,780 Daniel Moss: the market is essentially saying that the RBA is going to 197 00:09:30,780 --> 00:09:32,939 Daniel Moss: be done here and will be looking at cutting rates 198 00:09:32,940 --> 00:09:35,280 Daniel Moss: into the backend of this year. And if you look 199 00:09:35,280 --> 00:09:36,960 Daniel Moss: at what that means to the banking sector, I think 200 00:09:37,170 --> 00:09:39,750 Daniel Moss: you're going to see some margin compression there for sure. 201 00:09:40,080 --> 00:09:42,689 Daniel Moss: We do obviously have, even the housing market over here 202 00:09:42,690 --> 00:09:44,849 Daniel Moss: is something we have to focus on when it comes 203 00:09:44,850 --> 00:09:48,390 Daniel Moss: to how far can the RBA actually hike rates. And 204 00:09:48,390 --> 00:09:50,910 Daniel Moss: again, we're looking at weakness there and when we do 205 00:09:50,910 --> 00:09:52,200 Daniel Moss: get to the end of the year, that's when a 206 00:09:52,200 --> 00:09:54,570 Daniel Moss: lot of those variable or those fixed rate mortgages will 207 00:09:54,570 --> 00:09:57,600 Daniel Moss: have to refix at higher rates. So, for me, in 208 00:09:57,600 --> 00:10:01,170 Daniel Moss: just terms of focusing on Australian government bonds, it does 209 00:10:01,170 --> 00:10:03,630 Daniel Moss: look like the market is pricing in cuts at the 210 00:10:03,630 --> 00:10:05,640 Daniel Moss: end of this year and whether or not that is 211 00:10:05,640 --> 00:10:08,010 Daniel Moss: going to overflow into equity markets and see the ASX 212 00:10:08,010 --> 00:10:10,440 Daniel Moss: hold up a little bit stronger, I'm not entirely sure 213 00:10:10,440 --> 00:10:12,870 Daniel Moss: at this point, but I would say that the Aussie 214 00:10:12,870 --> 00:10:14,790 Daniel Moss: Dollar is in a little bit of trouble if this 215 00:10:14,790 --> 00:10:15,480 Daniel Moss: does eventuate. 216 00:10:16,080 --> 00:10:18,300 Sean Aylmer: Daniel, times like this when there's so much going on, 217 00:10:18,360 --> 00:10:19,800 Sean Aylmer: is it fun your job? 218 00:10:21,270 --> 00:10:24,839 Daniel Moss: Oh, it's the best. I think as much as that 219 00:10:25,380 --> 00:10:27,300 Daniel Moss: can be perverse at times when there is obviously a 220 00:10:27,300 --> 00:10:29,160 Daniel Moss: lot of people on the other side of this, I 221 00:10:29,160 --> 00:10:32,970 Daniel Moss: think the puzzle, trying to figure out exactly what's happening, 222 00:10:33,179 --> 00:10:36,360 Daniel Moss: what gyrations or a little bit of a ripple in 223 00:10:36,360 --> 00:10:38,490 Daniel Moss: one market can do on the other side of the 224 00:10:38,490 --> 00:10:40,800 Daniel Moss: world, I think it's absolutely fantastic. You wouldn't want to 225 00:10:40,800 --> 00:10:43,739 Daniel Moss: be anywhere else really than on a desk and just 226 00:10:43,740 --> 00:10:45,390 Daniel Moss: looking at this and trying to figure out what to 227 00:10:45,390 --> 00:10:48,270 Daniel Moss: do next. Even just the debate over whether or not 228 00:10:48,270 --> 00:10:49,710 Daniel Moss: the Federal Reserve is going to hike or are they 229 00:10:49,710 --> 00:10:52,740 Daniel Moss: going to stay or is the RBA going to continue hiking 230 00:10:52,740 --> 00:10:54,809 Daniel Moss: as well, I think it makes it all absolutely fascinating. 231 00:10:55,470 --> 00:10:57,809 Sean Aylmer: Fantastic. Daniel, thank you for talking to Fear and Greed. 232 00:10:58,230 --> 00:10:59,190 Daniel Moss: Thank you so much, Sean. 233 00:10:59,820 --> 00:11:03,090 Sean Aylmer: That was Daniel Moss, market analyst at Vantage Markets. This 234 00:11:03,090 --> 00:11:05,520 Sean Aylmer: is the Fear and Greed Daily Interview. Remember, this information 235 00:11:05,520 --> 00:11:08,160 Sean Aylmer: is general in nature and you should seek professional advice 236 00:11:08,490 --> 00:11:11,370 Sean Aylmer: before making any investment decisions. Join us every morning for 237 00:11:11,370 --> 00:11:14,190 Sean Aylmer: the full episode of Fear and Greed, Australia's most popular 238 00:11:14,190 --> 00:11:17,280 Sean Aylmer: business podcast. I'm Sean Aylmer. Enjoy your day.