Speaker 1: Hi, I'm Britney Saunders and welcome to Big Business, the
Speaker 1: place where business is far from boring. And today I'm
Speaker 1: recording on gaddig or Land. Now I somehow manage to
Speaker 1: build an empire from the garage underneath my house and
Speaker 1: I'm here to share it all with you, from the wins,
Speaker 1: the mistakes, the challenging times and funny moments in between. So,
Speaker 1: whether you're in business already, perhaps you're not in the
Speaker 1: game at all, Maybe you're just looking for some inspiration,
Speaker 1: or you simply just want to hear the tea, this
Speaker 1: is the podcast for you. Coming up on today's episode,
Speaker 1: I'm going to be talking all things making that first hire,
Speaker 1: or if you've already got your first hire, making the
Speaker 1: next higher, knowing when to take the leap to make
Speaker 1: your first hire, or knowing and being able to recognize
Speaker 1: when you're ready for that next role to come into
Speaker 1: the business. Hiring people is the scariest and one of
Speaker 1: the biggest. I was going to say the riskiest, but
Speaker 1: is that really a word. The riskiest things, most risky
Speaker 1: things things in business. It's petrifying and when you're starting out,
Speaker 1: you have no idea what you're doing and it all
Speaker 1: seems so scary, and I'm right there with you. It
Speaker 1: doesn't matter if you're hiring your first or your second employee,
Speaker 1: or hiring year seventieth. It's never not scary, and there's
Speaker 1: a lot of risks involved. So let's just jump into
Speaker 1: it and talk all things hiring, what to do, what
Speaker 1: not to do, and all the mistakes that I've made
Speaker 1: in the years of hiring people at FATE. So let's
Speaker 1: just get down to business. I've said this before and
Speaker 1: I'll say it again. Hiring people and dealing with staff
Speaker 1: is the hardest part of business. I've said it a
Speaker 1: billion times and I'll sing it from the rooftops, and
Speaker 1: I think every business owner out there will agree with me.
Speaker 1: Staffing in general, dealing with real people in your business,
Speaker 1: in their day to day lives, their feelings, their thoughts.
Speaker 1: You have to be mindful of everything. It is the
Speaker 1: hardest part of business. I will take going missing, having
Speaker 1: to pay huge tax bills, you know, logistics, things going wrong.
Speaker 1: I will take all of that any day over staffing.
Speaker 1: It's the hardest part of business. And the thing with
Speaker 1: it is it's you can't avoid it. If you're wanting
Speaker 1: to start a business and you're wanting it to grow,
Speaker 1: You're gonna have to deal with staffing, and it's never
Speaker 1: gonna be easy for anyone. You are always going to
Speaker 1: have issues no matter what business you're running. And I
Speaker 1: so vividly remember when I started Fate, and you all
Speaker 1: know surely by this point, I started it in the
Speaker 1: garage at the bottom of my house. I say that.
Speaker 1: I literally say that at the start of every episode.
Speaker 1: Underneath the house. Yeah, like it was like a townhouse thing,
Speaker 1: you know how the garage is like the bottom floor.
Speaker 1: I started Fate in there, and we had the double
Speaker 1: garage and Aj was my new boyfriend at the time, right,
Speaker 1: and so he'd moved in with me because he was
Speaker 1: living at home at the time because he just moved
Speaker 1: back from working in the mines or whatever, and he
Speaker 1: moved in with me, and so we both had a
Speaker 1: car spot under my house. And when I started FAT,
Speaker 1: I said, sorry, but you're gonna have to park on
Speaker 1: the street because I wanted to keep my car spot.
Speaker 1: And then I set up Fate in his car spot,
Speaker 1: and like he was like a really big shed for
Speaker 1: a townhouse. So I set up the whole thing in there.
Speaker 1: I had my packing table with a little stool at it.
Speaker 1: I had some plastic tubs on the ground with my
Speaker 1: stock in it. And then I had a little photo
Speaker 1: shoot backdrop and I would quite literally just get girls
Speaker 1: that I knew that lived in Newcastle to come and
Speaker 1: I'd take all the photos. I did everything from there,
Speaker 1: and then we had a spare bedroom as well, like upstairs,
Speaker 1: and that's where we would do like more office admin
Speaker 1: kind of stuff. But it was just all at home.
Speaker 1: And I hired my first employee to work at my
Speaker 1: house with me. And now do I think about it,
Speaker 1: Like was I even allowed to have a business set
Speaker 1: up in my garage? I never even looked up, Like
Speaker 1: if I was legally allowed to do that, who knows,
Speaker 1: But I fucking did it anyway. Don't tell the government,
Speaker 1: like I don't know if he's roos to get some
Speaker 1: sort of special license like I got insurance, but who knows. Anyway,
Speaker 1: I did it anyway. And so I hired my first
Speaker 1: employee to come and can you imagine me explaining that
Speaker 1: to her, like, yeah, she's just going to be coming
Speaker 1: to my house a few days a week to help
Speaker 1: me pack the orders. And that's exactly how it went.
Speaker 1: For me, I have a lot of people ask me
Speaker 1: when you are making your first hire for your business.
Speaker 1: If you've started a business yourself and you're doing everything yourself,
Speaker 1: what is the first position that you hire for? What
Speaker 1: is their job? My advice is always that first hire
Speaker 1: needs to come on board as an all rounder. That's
Speaker 1: how I would describe my first hire, almost like an
Speaker 1: assistant to everything that you're doing, and they're just coming
Speaker 1: on to do an extremely broad role. So my first
Speaker 1: hire was a casual and her role was an all rounder.
Speaker 1: She was going to help me pack orders, she was
Speaker 1: going to help me with customer service emails, she was
Speaker 1: going to help me processing returns, she was going to
Speaker 1: help me writing Instagram captions. She was going to help
Speaker 1: me when we're going out and about in the streets
Speaker 1: and Newcastle doing our photoshoots for the social media. She
Speaker 1: came on board as an all rounder. And that is
Speaker 1: always depending on what kind of business you've started up, obviously,
Speaker 1: but if you've got a business where you're just doing
Speaker 1: everything yourself, your first hire is just going to be
Speaker 1: someone that's going to help you do all those things. Now,
Speaker 1: I remember being so petrified when I was making my
Speaker 1: first hire that I didn't know who to hire, and
Speaker 1: I don't know how it came about, but AJ's mom,
Speaker 1: AJ's mum's friend had a daughter who was looking for
Speaker 1: a job, so that's how it came about. And I
Speaker 1: feel like a lot of people with their first hire,
Speaker 1: they will always hire someone they know, their friend's friend, family,
Speaker 1: friend's cousin, whatever. And that's fine. I wouldn't advise hiring
Speaker 1: people that you know now in twenty twenty five, but
Speaker 1: that's because I've done it. Like I've been there, done that.
Speaker 1: We all do it. We hire people that we know.
Speaker 1: So I had AJ's mum's friend's daughter come and work
Speaker 1: with me, like three days a week, casual, and my
Speaker 1: fears at that time were number one, I'm not what
Speaker 1: if I run out of money and I can't pay
Speaker 1: her one week? And number two, what if I run
Speaker 1: out of tasks for her to do. But my advice
Speaker 1: on that is you've got to see hiring your first employee,
Speaker 1: especially as an asset and not like a cost. Because
Speaker 1: my first thoughts were this is going to cost me money,
Speaker 1: what if I don't have enough to pay her kind
Speaker 1: of thing. But what I didn't think at the time
Speaker 1: because I was so new to business and young and
Speaker 1: didn't know what I was doing. Is by having her
Speaker 1: come in and take tasks away from me and help
Speaker 1: me do things that would take up normally my whole day,
Speaker 1: I could then spend my time doing different tasks that
Speaker 1: would bring in more revenue into the business. So instead
Speaker 1: of me having to reply to our customer service emails
Speaker 1: all day, I could maybe spend that time while she's
Speaker 1: replying to them, maybe making some more Instagram reels, which
Speaker 1: might get us more sales and bring more money in.
Speaker 1: And that's what you have to see staff as is
Speaker 1: it's an asset to your company. It's not a cost, like, yes,
Speaker 1: it's going to cost you, but they're essentially going to
Speaker 1: generate you more revenue. And if they're not generating revenue
Speaker 1: directly through their job, you know, if they're not the
Speaker 1: one posting all the content that's getting all the sales,
Speaker 1: they're going to be doing tasks so that you can
Speaker 1: generate more money for your business. And that's something I
Speaker 1: didn't think back then because I was young and stupid
Speaker 1: and didn't know what I was doing. I know, I
Speaker 1: say that, but it's true, like I had no idea
Speaker 1: I remember saying to a j I'm my god, what
Speaker 1: do I get her to do? And like this is
Speaker 1: before we had like any of the platforms that we
Speaker 1: use now. And I went to kmart and I bought
Speaker 1: a little a little whiteboard like no bigger than I
Speaker 1: don't know, three laptops put together, just precise reference, all
Speaker 1: this screen in front of me. And every day that
Speaker 1: she was coming in and it was like a Monday
Speaker 1: and a Thursday or whatever, I'd get a whiteboard marker
Speaker 1: and in dot points, I would write her daily tasks.
Speaker 1: And I always think of that and I just can
Speaker 1: still see that little whiteboard and I'd be like, right
Speaker 1: back to emails, go to the po box and collect
Speaker 1: our returns, do the returns. And that's how I would
Speaker 1: write out her day to day to do list because
Speaker 1: it was so simple back then, and that's all it
Speaker 1: really has to be. I think when it comes to
Speaker 1: getting your first employee, and if you're looking up online
Speaker 1: and you're reading all about workplaces, it can feel really overwhelming,
Speaker 1: you know, like needing to have everything like perfect and amazing.
Speaker 1: But just keep it simple with your first employee. Don't
Speaker 1: overcomplicate it for you. Don't over complicate it for them.
Speaker 1: And my advice would be, especially if you're wanting to
Speaker 1: grow your business, hire someone who is open to change.
Speaker 1: A lot of people hate change. I've learned I even
Speaker 1: years ago, Oh this could be another fucking video if
Speaker 1: you really want to just keep it in the bank.
Speaker 1: If there's one thing that I've learned being an employer
Speaker 1: for so many years now is whilst there are a
Speaker 1: lot of people who are open to change, a lot
Speaker 1: of people hate change. A lot of people hate change.
Speaker 1: And if you're going to work for a company that
Speaker 1: is growing, there's going to be so much change and
Speaker 1: some people aren't going to know how to deal with it.
Speaker 1: I'll never ever forget when I was, like when Fate
Speaker 1: was really smaller, I only had a couple of staff members.
Speaker 1: I had one person working for me, and they came
Speaker 1: out of their way to come up to me and say, like,
Speaker 1: I don't remember what we were having a conversation about,
Speaker 1: but they said, I don't deal well with change, and
Speaker 1: I hate change. And I just remember being gobsmacked because
Speaker 1: like we'd moved warehouse, and like the company was changing
Speaker 1: and we were hiring more people, and she was upset
Speaker 1: with all the changes. That were happening, and I was like, well,
Speaker 1: why don't you just go work somewhere where nothing changes,
Speaker 1: like go work at a bank. People need to be
Speaker 1: mindful when they're applying to work with companies that are growing,
Speaker 1: especially if it's like a small business that like, for example,
Speaker 1: when I started Fate, I'm going to grow this thing.
Speaker 1: So I think people need to be mindful when they're
Speaker 1: applying for jobs in companies where shit is changing. But
Speaker 1: my advice would be when you are looking for that
Speaker 1: first hire, look for someone who's willing to grow with you,
Speaker 1: especially if your mindset is you want to grow your company,
Speaker 1: if you don't want things to stay the same. And
Speaker 1: you'd be surprised how many people don't like change. People naturally,
Speaker 1: I think, like routine and they like everything feeling the
Speaker 1: same and just showing up every day and doing same thing.
Speaker 1: Whereas in those early days of Fate, everyone that came
Speaker 1: on board with me, I was like, you're coming on
Speaker 1: on board as an all rounder and you're gonna have
Speaker 1: to We're doing whatever the day throws at us, because
Speaker 1: that's what a startup is like. It doesn't have the structure,
Speaker 1: it doesn't have XYZ and this is exactly what we
Speaker 1: do every day, and if people are after that, they
Speaker 1: need to go and work somewhere that is really big
Speaker 1: and established. Another question I get is like when do
Speaker 1: I know when to hire my first employee? Like at
Speaker 1: what point? Because there's no right and wrong, Like no
Speaker 1: one says at this point this is when you need
Speaker 1: to hire an employee. There's no book that says exactly
Speaker 1: when you need to hire someone. But my advice would
Speaker 1: be do everything yourself in the beginning, or if you
Speaker 1: know that when you start your business you're going to
Speaker 1: be busy straight off the bat, maybe you've got an
Speaker 1: audience or whatever. Sure you can get an employee straight away,
Speaker 1: but if you're doing everything yourself at the start, you
Speaker 1: need to get the employee when you feel like you
Speaker 1: can't do it anymore or you're at like your capacity
Speaker 1: when it comes to the tasks. And I would say
Speaker 1: as well, another sign of needing to get that person
Speaker 1: in is when you have other things that you want
Speaker 1: to get to but you never get to them, Like
Speaker 1: where you've got these tasks that you'd like to focus on.
Speaker 1: Maybe it's something more creative or product development or whatever.
Speaker 1: I have a major DJA V right now. I don't
Speaker 1: know why, by the way, I just thought i'll throw
Speaker 1: that out there. But when you're kind of so tied
Speaker 1: up in all the day to day tasks and you're
Speaker 1: pushing aside, like those things that you're passionate about, that's
Speaker 1: when you need an employee because you need them to
Speaker 1: come in and take those smaller tasks off you. You
Speaker 1: delegate to them, and you've got to become good at that,
Speaker 1: by the way, because it's really hard to let go
Speaker 1: of things when you feel like you're so in control.
Speaker 1: But when you feel like you're pushing important stuff aside,
Speaker 1: that's when you need a staff member. And I know
Speaker 1: how scary it is. And take your time with hiring us.
Speaker 1: Say this all the time. Take your time, ask questions,
Speaker 1: get to know them. Don't just jump into the first
Speaker 1: person that seems fun and like you'd be friends, because
Speaker 1: that's what I did back in the day. But I
Speaker 1: feel like again, we all do that when we're first
Speaker 1: time business owners. We just hire someone after speaking them
Speaker 1: for five minutes because we think they're fun. And I've
Speaker 1: been there and done that and I've never do it again.
Speaker 1: But you'll know when it's time for you to hire
Speaker 1: that first employee, because you'll even be thinking about it,
Speaker 1: you'll be talking about it to people. If you're like,
Speaker 1: I'm thinking of getting a staff member, that's the universe
Speaker 1: telling you, yes, this is the time that you need
Speaker 1: a staff member. If it's on your mind, if you're
Speaker 1: thinking about it, if you're thinking about what their role
Speaker 1: would be, that's the universe telling you, Yep, you need
Speaker 1: an employee now, and you'll thank yourself for it. Obviously,
Speaker 1: do your numbers, make sure you do have enough to
Speaker 1: pay them, you know, make sure the business is earning
Speaker 1: enough that you're going to be able to afford to
Speaker 1: pay them, and it will probably be one of the
Speaker 1: best things that you ever did. And then in terms
Speaker 1: of growing your team, like going from that one employee
Speaker 1: to then maybe the second one, and third and fourth.
Speaker 1: The crazy thing is like businesses predictable, but then again
Speaker 1: like so not predictable at all. I just can think
Speaker 1: back so vividly to when Fate first started and I
Speaker 1: had that first employee, and then within six months we
Speaker 1: moved out of the garage into our first little warehouse
Speaker 1: and it was at that warehouse and I then hired
Speaker 1: my second and third and fourth like casual employee, my
Speaker 1: first full timer, and business can just catch you off
Speaker 1: guard because like I never planned any of that, Like
Speaker 1: it just kept growing and I kept doing what felt
Speaker 1: right and just looking back now, like I can't believe
Speaker 1: I did all that because it was not a plan.
Speaker 1: And I think there's so much pressure, especially now, like
Speaker 1: being able to see all these businesses on social media.
Speaker 1: People can feel pressured to need to be doing the
Speaker 1: most and having all these team members. But my advice
Speaker 1: to anyone out there is just do what feels like
Speaker 1: the right decision for you and your business at the time.
Speaker 1: That's all I ever did with fate. And as for
Speaker 1: me when it came to getting that next employee and
Speaker 1: the next one after that, again, like I could just
Speaker 1: feel it in me waters Kidney, I could feel it
Speaker 1: in my waters. I know that's really weird Kathin King reference,
Speaker 1: but you can just sense when you know you need
Speaker 1: the next person, when you and that first all rounder
Speaker 1: are at your capacity again and maybe you're getting more orders,
Speaker 1: or you're getting more clients, or you just you can
Speaker 1: just tell when you need the help, and like that's
Speaker 1: when you make that plunge. And my advice always is
Speaker 1: especially if you're new, or you're hesitant, or you're worried
Speaker 1: about funds, hire them as a casual to begin with,
Speaker 1: say look, I can give you three days work definitely.
Speaker 1: Like remember that's what I would do. I'd write down
Speaker 1: what I could get them to help with. Look, I
Speaker 1: think I can definitely give you three days, and if
Speaker 1: there's someone that's wanting more, you can say, look, I'm
Speaker 1: gonna start you off on three days just to be safe, like,
Speaker 1: but then you might pick up a fourth day, you know,
Speaker 1: because with casual workers, you can be like, do you
Speaker 1: want to pick up another day tomorrow? And they're like sure,
Speaker 1: like if they're free. And then what I would do
Speaker 1: is hire those casual staff. And then if we got busier,
Speaker 1: busier and busier, and they just all of a sudden,
Speaker 1: we're working five days as a casual anyway, then I
Speaker 1: might look into putting them on full time. And that's
Speaker 1: exactly how I did it with Fate. Now, some of
Speaker 1: the scary things, I mean, I've said this a thousand
Speaker 1: billion times. Hiring people is so scary. And you'll have
Speaker 1: to listen to my episode with the interview Boss Girls
Speaker 1: if you haven't already, because we spoke about it a lot.
Speaker 1: That's a recent episode of Mind Just go find it.
Speaker 1: We spoke about just like how scary hiring people is,
Speaker 1: and you hear it all the time, and I say
Speaker 1: it all the time, like an employee, just one single
Speaker 1: employee can completely make your business. They can come in
Speaker 1: and just flip it on its head and turn it
Speaker 1: into the most amazing business ever and they can do
Speaker 1: wonders for you. But also someone can come in and
Speaker 1: completely ruin the entire business and workplace. And if that
Speaker 1: isn't petrifying, I don't know what is. It's a risk
Speaker 1: every time we hire someone. My advice is, especially as
Speaker 1: you're growing a team from two people to three to four,
Speaker 1: is you need it even start thinking beyond what the
Speaker 1: person is coming in to do. You know, we're always
Speaker 1: looking for people that can do the job and have
Speaker 1: the skills and whatever, But when you're adding more and
Speaker 1: more personalities into the mix, you've got to start thinking
Speaker 1: about personality hires. You've got to think of your current team,
Speaker 1: how they all work together, and then if you're adding
Speaker 1: someone else in, how are they going to fit into
Speaker 1: the team. Are they going to get along? Are they
Speaker 1: going to clash? Heads. And this is one of the
Speaker 1: really hard things actually about having a small business that
Speaker 1: is growing. You know, it's one thing to be a
Speaker 1: big corporate company where you've got two hundred people in
Speaker 1: an office and people don't even know each other kind
Speaker 1: of thing. But when you've got a small team working
Speaker 1: together every day closely, you've got to be so mindful
Speaker 1: with personalities when you're hiring. And it's just another part
Speaker 1: of business that I just never expected, and then it's
Speaker 1: turned out to be, like, such a big crucial part
Speaker 1: of our business now is team dynamics and who's going
Speaker 1: to get along with who? And is that person going
Speaker 1: to get upset by that person because that person comes along,
Speaker 1: comes across a lot more strong, whereas that person is
Speaker 1: more submissive. Like you've just got to think of all
Speaker 1: these things, and it's it's a lot, but I would
Speaker 1: be careful when your team is growing beyond that two, three,
Speaker 1: four and you're turning into a small team, you've got
Speaker 1: to be so selective with who you're hiring, because you
Speaker 1: could have an amazing team. Let's say, of there's four
Speaker 1: of you, you could bring in a new fifth person
Speaker 1: because you're getting so busy and everyone needs help, and
Speaker 1: that fifth person could fuck up the four of yours,
Speaker 1: like a new person can just walk in and ruin
Speaker 1: the whole team dynamic. I've witnessed it myself. People come
Speaker 1: in and screw up the whole team. Then you've got
Speaker 1: to figure out how you're gonna remove that person from
Speaker 1: the workplace and fix everything that they left behind. And
Speaker 1: it's not nice, and this is so real and it happens,
Speaker 1: and it's an unspoken reality of business. And I even
Speaker 1: get scared talking about this kind of stuff on like
Speaker 1: my Instagram and TikTok because I don't know, like you
Speaker 1: don't want to upset anyone, but it's such a big
Speaker 1: and real part of business. And I can tell you
Speaker 1: now there wouldn't be a business owner out there that
Speaker 1: has teams that hasn't dealt with stuff like that. The
Speaker 1: other thing that you've got to be super mindful of.
Speaker 1: And I think this is a phase that I'm in
Speaker 1: now with fate when our company has grown and grown
Speaker 1: and grown and grown, and luckily, like I'm not in
Speaker 1: that position, but I have spoken with business owner friends
Speaker 1: who have been in the position where your business has
Speaker 1: grown so astronomically, like over a couple of years or
Speaker 1: over twelve months where you over hire and where you've
Speaker 1: hired too many people. And then if you've just experienced
Speaker 1: this massive growth period and everything's going amazing, like nothing
Speaker 1: in business is guaranteed, like next week fate could plummet,
Speaker 1: like that's another petrifying thing about business. But what's even
Speaker 1: scarier is if you have an amazing year and let's
Speaker 1: say you go into twenty twenty five, and then all
Speaker 1: of a sudden, you know, you lose some relevancy or
Speaker 1: you know, people aren't shopping as much anymore. It's scary
Speaker 1: enough that your business can and kind of go into
Speaker 1: a flop era. But what's even scarier is if you've got,
Speaker 1: you know, twenty full time employees and your business is
Speaker 1: going quiet. And I've spoken to business owners, oh name names,
Speaker 1: but I've spoken to business owners who have reached out
Speaker 1: to me where they've been doing amazingly and they've hired
Speaker 1: a heap of people, and then they go into a
Speaker 1: quiet patch or a quiet year, a quiet period. We
Speaker 1: all go up and down in business in terms of
Speaker 1: our sales and finances. And I've had friends reach out
Speaker 1: going I'm doing fucking redundancies. At my workplace because they've
Speaker 1: you know, stopped making the revenue that they were making.
Speaker 1: They didn't need the roles that they had anymore. And
Speaker 1: I can't imagine how terrible having to lay people off
Speaker 1: would be, to be like, hey, like our business is
Speaker 1: not doing as well as it did last year, Like,
Speaker 1: you know, do you want to take a pay card
Speaker 1: or do you want to be made redundant? And that
Speaker 1: is a scary reality for so so many business owners
Speaker 1: as well, and touchwood something that I never have to do.
Speaker 1: But that's another thing where you don't want to grow
Speaker 1: too quickly as a business and get all up in
Speaker 1: your head. People always say to me, like, stop growing
Speaker 1: so quick, and I'm like, I'm doing everything and I'm
Speaker 1: being mindful, but I think now, like being the size
Speaker 1: that we're at where we do have like seventy odd
Speaker 1: people in the company, I'm like, all right, let's just
Speaker 1: coast here for a little bit. That's why I'm hesitant
Speaker 1: to keep opening more stores, because you're just adding more
Speaker 1: and more and then what if we do go into
Speaker 1: a quiet period, what do I do then if we've
Speaker 1: got all these team members so at the same time, yes,
Speaker 1: you want to make those highs when you need them,
Speaker 1: especially if you're growing, but you want to be completely
Speaker 1: mindful with it as well and think of the bigger
Speaker 1: picture and all the things that could go wrong and
Speaker 1: the risks. There's just so much to think of, isn't there.
Speaker 2: No? Oh no, hello, producer such myself, producer X. That's
Speaker 2: what they used to call me. Oh really yeah, produces
Speaker 2: and yeah, producers Xander on this nova. But I used
Speaker 2: to be producer X. Maybe we should bring it back.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I like it. And also because when we call,
Speaker 1: like when we say Xander, everyone thinks that you're z
Speaker 1: Alexander would but you're ex.
Speaker 2: Yeah, grow up. Anyone that thinks it's zed, I don't
Speaker 2: like it, okay, producer axes. Here in terms of you
Speaker 2: being a business owner, how do you approach like the
Speaker 2: training of new employees as someone who has been extremely
Speaker 2: small to being much larger now in business, how have
Speaker 2: you developed those training strategies and how have you like
Speaker 2: kind of changed your approach from when you.
Speaker 1: Were Yeah, more so, it's changed a lot. Obviously back
Speaker 1: in the day, you know, when I was hiring my
Speaker 1: casuals to come on as all round us, it was
Speaker 1: an extremely hands on process. I would get my new
Speaker 1: all rounder employee in and I would just show them,
Speaker 1: like step by step, how we do absolutely everything. And
Speaker 1: when fate was really small, I wasn't hiring anyone that
Speaker 1: had any kind of experience, but that's because that suited
Speaker 1: me and my business model. Back then, I had the
Speaker 1: time to have someone come into our little warehouse where
Speaker 1: we did everything, and I would say, all right, well,
Speaker 1: this is how we packed the orders, and this is
Speaker 1: how we write back to emails, and they would almost
Speaker 1: just shadow me for the first couple of weeks until
Speaker 1: they felt confident in knowing how to do stuff. Same
Speaker 1: when I hired like my first social media assistant, which
Speaker 1: is Kim, and she's still with us now, she's nearly
Speaker 1: been with us for four years. And so Kim came
Speaker 1: in four years ago as a social media assistant, and again,
Speaker 1: like I'd never really had someone just work on the
Speaker 1: social media. I had the all rounders and we just
Speaker 1: kind of all helped and shared. But I had the
Speaker 1: time back then to run through our entire social media
Speaker 1: with Kim, showing her how to shoot, showing her how
Speaker 1: to do all the things, showing her how to write captions,
Speaker 1: and for those early days of Fate and even four
Speaker 1: years ago, like when everyone kind of started at Fatoway
Speaker 1: say that the first three years of Fate it was
Speaker 1: just a practice run. And when like Kim April Gray
Speaker 1: Sigarett all started four years ago, that's when Fate really began.
Speaker 1: But even back then, it was just I didn't have
Speaker 1: any processes in place because people just came in and
Speaker 1: I was there. I was there eight hours a day
Speaker 1: with them right there, working by their side, so I
Speaker 1: would just quite literally show them here's how we do it.
Speaker 1: You give it a go until they got the confidence.
Speaker 1: But then as the company grew more and more, and
Speaker 1: I would say, when we opened our second Fate store
Speaker 1: and we kind of became bigger than Newcastle, that's when
Speaker 1: we started implementing like training processes. So everything went from
Speaker 1: a physical here's how we do things to here's a
Speaker 1: PDF presentation, we're going to walk you through it.
Speaker 2: And was that something that you outsourced to get help
Speaker 2: with or that's something that you purely sat down together
Speaker 2: and came up with your shade.
Speaker 1: Yeah, So we did it all internally, and we still
Speaker 1: do everything internally, but now we have especially more so
Speaker 1: for the retail side of our business, Like obviously, if
Speaker 1: someone's coming into work in our warehouse, there's going to
Speaker 1: be someone that's going to walk them through the warehouse.
Speaker 1: Because with a warehouse, you know, role, it's it's physical,
Speaker 1: Like we can't say this is how we pack our orders,
Speaker 1: You're going to be shown. So there's still a lot
Speaker 1: of our business where it is quite physical and people
Speaker 1: have physically demonstrated how to do the tasks and they
Speaker 1: copy and shadow. But especially for like our retail stores,
Speaker 1: now you know, we do a staff induction date. Like
Speaker 1: let's say we're opening a new store. Before the store opens,
Speaker 1: we'll do a whole day of induction with our team
Speaker 1: where we're sitting in a boardroom and we've got a
Speaker 1: massive screen up and we walk them through the company,
Speaker 1: We walk them through the product knowledge, we walk them
Speaker 1: through change room language, we walk them through how to
Speaker 1: use point of sale. It's like a visual experience without
Speaker 1: being hands on, and we have that for every area
Speaker 1: of our retail store. So we've definitely upped our training
Speaker 1: over the years to say the least, I.
Speaker 2: Just heard you you say something change room language. That's
Speaker 2: something I would never think of to be in like
Speaker 2: a training Like yeah, tutorial. Was that something that you
Speaker 2: guys came up with or was that something was that
Speaker 2: was learnt from other retail stores.
Speaker 1: We come up with it ourselves.
Speaker 2: It's just really interesting to hear that side, yes, because
Speaker 2: I'm like, God, is that something that every retail store.
Speaker 1: Every retail store does it? But especially for us, like
Speaker 1: our change rooms is a huge part of our store experience. Yeah,
Speaker 1: and I think especially given like the nature of our
Speaker 1: size range, we deal with a lot of women who
Speaker 1: I guess have been damaged in the past from other
Speaker 1: retail stores. Yeah, where you know they've gone in and
Speaker 1: like haven't even been able to find their size in
Speaker 1: a store, or they've felt excluded. And we know that
Speaker 1: a lot of people that are going into our change
Speaker 1: rooms might be feeling a little bit vulnerable, maybe they
Speaker 1: haven't shopped in store for a long time.
Speaker 2: I personally hate trying things on in stores because I
Speaker 2: always feel the pressure that these people are trying to
Speaker 2: get me to and I don't like it because I mean,
Speaker 2: they're trying on the clothes, trying to feel a certain
Speaker 2: way and trying to feel confident in them. And then
Speaker 2: you've got people and your things saying how's it started,
Speaker 2: do you want this? Or you can get this on
Speaker 2: for an extra twenty dollars as well, do you want
Speaker 2: to take that on? And it's a lot sometimes.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't think many retailers give like guided training
Speaker 1: when it comes to change room language, but just given
Speaker 1: the nature of our brand and you know, we are
Speaker 1: dealing with vulnerable women who you know, maybe haven't shopped
Speaker 1: in store for a really long time because like most
Speaker 1: retail stores don't stock the size as we do, so
Speaker 1: they might be coming in like feeling self conscious or worried,
Speaker 1: and so like, change room language is a big part
Speaker 1: of our training with our teams, like when we get
Speaker 1: a new team member or when we're starting a new store,
Speaker 1: everyone gets it. And actually funny that we're talking about it.
Speaker 1: We're looking at furthering it even more just because we
Speaker 1: feel like the change room experience is something we can
Speaker 1: always like improve.
Speaker 2: I would love to do an episode maybe on this,
Speaker 2: but like you the specific things that you do for training,
Speaker 2: because that as soon as you said that, I was like,
Speaker 2: that's so interesting, and I think that's something that a
Speaker 2: lot of other business owners in fashion and clothing, if
Speaker 2: they hear this, would want to implement. It they own
Speaker 2: stores or if they have at all batiques or whatever.
Speaker 2: I just think that is so valuable.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, at the moment, what we're doing, like interesting
Speaker 1: parts of it, I guess is like a lot of
Speaker 1: people have been excluded from fashion. Like obviously we all
Speaker 1: know that, Like people have been excluded from fashion and
Speaker 1: are still excluded from fashion. And one of the things
Speaker 1: that we're really mindful of is that some of our
Speaker 1: staff members have never experienced being excluded from fashion. And
Speaker 1: so if we've got a staff member, because like we
Speaker 1: don't hire people based on their body size or whatever,
Speaker 1: like that's not a part of what we fucking look at. Like,
Speaker 1: if someone's a size eight, they're a size eight, Like
Speaker 1: just because they're working at FATE doesn't mean that they
Speaker 1: need to be a certain site, Like you can be
Speaker 1: any size to work at FATE. But let's say, for example,
Speaker 1: like a possible scenario that we think about all the
Speaker 1: time is if we do have someone working in our
Speaker 1: store who is a size eight, who has never experienced
Speaker 1: being excluded from fashion, has never felt left out when
Speaker 1: shopping in a retail store, if they have a customer
Speaker 1: coming in who maybe is a size twenty and there
Speaker 1: isn't many stores out there that stock a size twenty,
Speaker 1: and they're coming in and they're feeling bulnerable, and they're
Speaker 1: feeling like, oh there's anything? Am I going to find anything?
Speaker 1: Like you know, they're just feeling all the emotions. They're
Speaker 1: scared about trying clothes on because they've been so rejected
Speaker 1: by other retailers and they are being served by someone
Speaker 1: who is a size eight. How are those two going
Speaker 1: to connect when the size eight has never experienced being
Speaker 1: left out in fashion? And that's something that we're so
Speaker 1: mindful of, so we try to and what we're doing
Speaker 1: at the moment to like better our change room training
Speaker 1: is like West speaking to all different kinds of people
Speaker 1: who are all different shapes of sizes to hear their
Speaker 1: experiences because like some people can't speak from experience when
Speaker 1: it comes to being excluded from fashion, me included. Look,
Speaker 1: I think I could do a whole episode about this,
Speaker 1: because this is something that we're working on bettering and
Speaker 1: improving literally at the moment, changing language. I love it,
Speaker 1: so we need to do a whole other episode about it.
Speaker 2: Have really spooked my interests in my like, I just
Speaker 2: think it's great.
Speaker 1: I'm glad that you find it interesting.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I do, and this is someone I've never felt
Speaker 2: kind of left out exactly, But I think it's.
Speaker 1: Something that everyone can learn from, and I think especially
Speaker 1: for our straight sized team members, who you know, fit
Speaker 1: into your standard sizing. I'm doing like quotes here, like
Speaker 1: they would never think twice about feeling excluded from fashion,
Speaker 1: and I think working at Fate opens their eyes to
Speaker 1: how left out a lot of people can feel. And
Speaker 1: then it's on us and it's our responsibility to train
Speaker 1: our team members to be able to connect with customers
Speaker 1: who have felt left out, even if they don't have
Speaker 1: firsthand experience themselves of being excluded in fashion.
Speaker 2: Look, we went a bit off track, but I just
Speaker 2: it really stood out to me and get.
Speaker 1: Onto this from talking about hiring stuff.
Speaker 2: I talked about what some training techniquity.
Speaker 1: That's how we got onto that.
Speaker 2: I got there, But I think you covered it really
Speaker 2: well and I'm really glad that we touched on that.
Speaker 1: Do that for another episode for sure, and maybe get
Speaker 1: a few other people on to hear their experiences. In opinion,
Speaker 1: love that because I can't speak for everyone else, so
Speaker 1: we need to get some other input. Obsessed back to
Speaker 1: the whole hiring thing. Like I feel we need to
Speaker 1: at least wrap up the episode. As I said in
Speaker 1: the beginning of the episode, like hiring is always scary.
Speaker 1: You're never one hundred percent going to know if you're
Speaker 1: doing the right thing or not. But that's business. If
Speaker 1: you are feeling like you're at that stage where you
Speaker 1: think you need help, you probably do. If you're thinking
Speaker 1: about what you could get someone to do to help
Speaker 1: you free up more time in your day to focus
Speaker 1: on other things you need. That new employee, my advice
Speaker 1: would be to take your time with it. Higher slow.
Speaker 1: That's what they say, higher slow and fire fast. That's
Speaker 1: the saying higher slow, take your time with it. You
Speaker 1: know what you're doing, and if it's on your mind,
Speaker 1: that's the universe telling you. And when it comes to
Speaker 1: making that second and third higher again, you're just going
Speaker 1: to know when you need to do it and if
Speaker 1: you're scared about it, it's the right decision. Because everything
Speaker 1: that I've done in my business journey with fate, I've
Speaker 1: anything that I've done where I'll be like, oh shit,
Speaker 1: should I do this or not? And when it feels
Speaker 1: like a risk, yes, do it, because that's what's going
Speaker 1: to keep your business moving and growing even if it
Speaker 1: is absolutely petrifying. As always, I'm going to end this
Speaker 1: episode with a tip of the week.
Speaker 2: I feel like I'm jumping in with the bloody tips.
Speaker 2: You just said higher, slow, fire, fast, But I would
Speaker 2: also I'm not a business owner, but like, make sure
Speaker 2: they're aligned with your energy and your vision rate on paper. Yeah,
Speaker 2: if you're not jelling yep.
Speaker 1: I always say, if there's like an inkling of doubt
Speaker 1: in your mind when you're interviewing someone, if they're like
Speaker 1: seeming great or maybe if they're seeming way too good
Speaker 1: to be true, maybe they are. And again, go listen
Speaker 1: to my episode with Interview Boss, because we speak about
Speaker 1: all of this in detail. I love and how much
Speaker 1: people can lie in interviews or just say what they
Speaker 1: think you want to hear, and then they can come
Speaker 1: into the workplace and oh my god, you are nothing
Speaker 1: like what you said in your interview.
Speaker 2: And the bonus episode where we talked about some crazy
Speaker 2: hr situations that we've been involved or heard of.
Speaker 1: Yeah, but yeah, go and listen to those episodes if
Speaker 1: you haven't already. And yeah, take your time when it
Speaker 1: comes to hiring, and you know when you need the help,
Speaker 1: so stick with those gut feelings and stick with your
Speaker 1: gut feelings in the hiring process too. Those are my tips. Anyway,
Speaker 1: that's all for another main episode. I'll be back later
Speaker 1: this week with a bonus. In case you didn't know,
Speaker 1: I do a main and a bonus episode every single week,
Speaker 1: and you can catch up with me on socials everywhere.
Speaker 1: Links are in the show notes. And be sure to
Speaker 1: check out my New Slash Old Slash, New Again YouTube
Speaker 1: channel if you haven't already, because I'm back on YouTube
Speaker 1: and I'm sharing all things business and my journey and
Speaker 1: behind the scenes of fate on YouTube. And remember to
Speaker 1: chase after your dreams as if they owe you money.