1 00:00:00,280 --> 00:00:03,880 Speaker 1: This podcast is recorded on gaddigal Land Always was, always 2 00:00:03,880 --> 00:00:13,960 Speaker 1: will be Aboriginal Land. Hey chicks, I'm sal and I'm 3 00:00:13,960 --> 00:00:15,760 Speaker 1: out and this is two broad chicks to show that 4 00:00:15,800 --> 00:00:18,160 Speaker 1: shares life lessons and tips to help make you rich 5 00:00:18,320 --> 00:00:22,400 Speaker 1: in life. And oh my fucking god, today we are 6 00:00:22,440 --> 00:00:25,960 Speaker 1: chatting with writer, podcast day, illustrator and all around queen 7 00:00:26,360 --> 00:00:27,400 Speaker 1: Florence Given. 8 00:00:28,400 --> 00:00:29,320 Speaker 2: Thank you so. 9 00:00:29,280 --> 00:00:33,280 Speaker 3: Much for coming on. Oh my gosh, this is morning. 10 00:00:33,680 --> 00:00:34,760 Speaker 3: It's evening for you there. 11 00:00:35,040 --> 00:00:37,559 Speaker 1: Yeah, we need to talk about everything. 12 00:00:38,120 --> 00:00:41,400 Speaker 3: Actually at this point it does a whole the same ring. 13 00:00:41,360 --> 00:00:43,199 Speaker 1: To it, does it. 14 00:00:43,240 --> 00:00:44,280 Speaker 3: But we'll make a wife. 15 00:00:44,360 --> 00:00:45,040 Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah. 16 00:00:45,080 --> 00:00:48,279 Speaker 2: And we were saying off air, we were just you know, 17 00:00:48,800 --> 00:00:51,800 Speaker 2: being really chill and cool and fangirling, saying that we've 18 00:00:51,840 --> 00:00:55,600 Speaker 2: been huge fans of you for years and we haven't 19 00:00:55,640 --> 00:00:58,440 Speaker 2: even started. But it's an absolute pleasure to have you on. 20 00:00:58,960 --> 00:01:02,080 Speaker 2: And we have you on because we're going to talk 21 00:01:02,120 --> 00:01:06,399 Speaker 2: about how to live deliciously, because you're about to drop 22 00:01:06,440 --> 00:01:09,080 Speaker 2: your new book, Women Living Deliciously. 23 00:01:09,600 --> 00:01:12,760 Speaker 3: Yes, I needed to just get this book out of me. 24 00:01:12,880 --> 00:01:16,200 Speaker 4: I actually told my publishers a couple of years ago 25 00:01:16,240 --> 00:01:20,120 Speaker 4: that I was so burnt out and stressed that I 26 00:01:20,160 --> 00:01:23,720 Speaker 4: told everyone in my life, my team, everyone, my assistant. 27 00:01:23,720 --> 00:01:26,440 Speaker 4: I was like, I can't do anything for another two years. 28 00:01:26,520 --> 00:01:28,440 Speaker 4: I'm so burnt out. 29 00:01:29,440 --> 00:01:30,160 Speaker 5: And I. 30 00:01:31,720 --> 00:01:32,840 Speaker 3: Took one month off. 31 00:01:32,880 --> 00:01:34,840 Speaker 4: I was going to take the whole two years out, 32 00:01:34,959 --> 00:01:37,800 Speaker 4: and I took one month of rest off and then, 33 00:01:38,080 --> 00:01:41,559 Speaker 4: in that complete stillness, I've never done that in my life, 34 00:01:41,720 --> 00:01:44,480 Speaker 4: just a month and then I got the gudea in 35 00:01:44,520 --> 00:01:46,880 Speaker 4: for this book, and then I reached out to all 36 00:01:46,920 --> 00:01:49,120 Speaker 4: of my team and I was like, I have to 37 00:01:49,160 --> 00:01:49,520 Speaker 4: write this. 38 00:01:49,560 --> 00:01:51,640 Speaker 3: I just have to do it. I have to execute it. 39 00:01:52,840 --> 00:01:56,760 Speaker 4: And it's been the most beautiful journey of my life. 40 00:01:56,880 --> 00:01:58,240 Speaker 3: To like it a complete understatement. 41 00:01:58,320 --> 00:02:02,640 Speaker 4: It's transformed me completely, and I feel like before I 42 00:02:02,680 --> 00:02:04,560 Speaker 4: had written this book, one of the main reasons I 43 00:02:04,680 --> 00:02:09,480 Speaker 4: was so burnt out was because I was exhausted from 44 00:02:09,520 --> 00:02:14,680 Speaker 4: being what I thought Florence Given was. And I think 45 00:02:14,840 --> 00:02:19,040 Speaker 4: everyone experiences that on a personal level. We all have 46 00:02:19,160 --> 00:02:24,240 Speaker 4: expired identities. But when you're a public figure, people become 47 00:02:24,240 --> 00:02:27,680 Speaker 4: attached to an idea of you. And it wasn't that 48 00:02:27,760 --> 00:02:31,800 Speaker 4: I was being fake or inauthentic. I can't be fake 49 00:02:31,919 --> 00:02:34,200 Speaker 4: or inauthentic. I cannot do it. I cannot do it 50 00:02:34,200 --> 00:02:36,040 Speaker 4: to my face I can't laugh at jokes that I 51 00:02:36,080 --> 00:02:41,119 Speaker 4: find funny. It causes this internal like schism where it's 52 00:02:41,240 --> 00:02:45,680 Speaker 4: just too uncomfortable for me to bear. And so I 53 00:02:45,720 --> 00:02:49,480 Speaker 4: just stopped sharing myself. I stopped sharing myself online, I 54 00:02:49,520 --> 00:02:54,720 Speaker 4: stopped sharing my opinions. I stopped being the vibrant, self 55 00:02:54,720 --> 00:02:56,240 Speaker 4: expressive person that. 56 00:02:56,240 --> 00:02:59,959 Speaker 3: I am, and I just I hid for a while. 57 00:03:00,760 --> 00:03:05,280 Speaker 4: And what I learned in that space of cocooning myself 58 00:03:05,960 --> 00:03:11,760 Speaker 4: was that I'd lost confidence in my ability to handle change, 59 00:03:12,360 --> 00:03:15,000 Speaker 4: and I'd got too caught up in this is all 60 00:03:15,040 --> 00:03:16,760 Speaker 4: sounding so fucking vague, isn't it not? 61 00:03:17,600 --> 00:03:19,640 Speaker 1: Life that sounds incredibly relatable. 62 00:03:19,960 --> 00:03:22,200 Speaker 3: There's something about when you say something. 63 00:03:22,600 --> 00:03:25,280 Speaker 4: The thing you say becomes sticky because you don't just 64 00:03:25,320 --> 00:03:27,240 Speaker 4: say it once in a room with a few people, 65 00:03:27,720 --> 00:03:30,000 Speaker 4: thousands of people here. You say it and then that 66 00:03:30,080 --> 00:03:33,320 Speaker 4: becomes a version of you that people have in their heads. 67 00:03:33,560 --> 00:03:37,040 Speaker 4: And I, basically I just realized that what anyone thinks 68 00:03:37,040 --> 00:03:39,920 Speaker 4: of you is a complete and utter fucking fiction anyway, 69 00:03:40,200 --> 00:03:42,880 Speaker 4: And so I might as well just boom and have 70 00:03:42,920 --> 00:03:45,600 Speaker 4: the courage to expand into the woman I know I 71 00:03:45,680 --> 00:03:48,440 Speaker 4: am and kind of shake off this image that other 72 00:03:48,440 --> 00:03:51,320 Speaker 4: people had of me. Before, and it's been a very 73 00:03:51,360 --> 00:03:55,920 Speaker 4: slow and subtle rebellion against like this idea I had 74 00:03:55,960 --> 00:03:58,600 Speaker 4: of myself of needing to be perfect and needing to 75 00:03:58,640 --> 00:04:00,520 Speaker 4: always do the right thing and be seen as a 76 00:04:00,520 --> 00:04:03,520 Speaker 4: good girl in the public eye and do what everyone 77 00:04:03,560 --> 00:04:05,280 Speaker 4: told me, and it. 78 00:04:05,400 --> 00:04:08,720 Speaker 1: Is impossible, Like that is impossible. 79 00:04:08,920 --> 00:04:12,120 Speaker 4: But as a feminist, as a feminist, what we know 80 00:04:12,240 --> 00:04:15,200 Speaker 4: this as women, we know that. 81 00:04:15,200 --> 00:04:18,120 Speaker 3: It's impossible to be everything for everyone. 82 00:04:18,360 --> 00:04:21,720 Speaker 4: But when you're a public feminist and you quite literally 83 00:04:22,240 --> 00:04:25,440 Speaker 4: have people constantly requesting you to talk about things every 84 00:04:25,480 --> 00:04:29,400 Speaker 4: single day, it's hard to say no because these things 85 00:04:29,520 --> 00:04:32,640 Speaker 4: all have value. Everything that everyone wants you to talk 86 00:04:32,680 --> 00:04:37,479 Speaker 4: about have so much value. And so it's been a 87 00:04:37,520 --> 00:04:40,640 Speaker 4: complete reverse engineering of how I use my platform to 88 00:04:40,640 --> 00:04:43,960 Speaker 4: be honest with you, because I needed to re engineer 89 00:04:43,960 --> 00:04:46,920 Speaker 4: my relationship with my audience. It was it was almost 90 00:04:46,960 --> 00:04:51,360 Speaker 4: like codependent really, like it was not unlike a relationship 91 00:04:51,560 --> 00:04:55,159 Speaker 4: where I felt I had to perform a version of 92 00:04:55,200 --> 00:04:56,760 Speaker 4: myself that was in service to them. 93 00:04:56,800 --> 00:04:59,520 Speaker 3: But what is best in service to my audience is 94 00:04:59,520 --> 00:05:02,839 Speaker 3: that our I fucking love my life. Because if you don't, 95 00:05:03,360 --> 00:05:03,720 Speaker 3: you don't. 96 00:05:03,800 --> 00:05:07,279 Speaker 4: If they don't get that, then they're just going to 97 00:05:07,279 --> 00:05:11,040 Speaker 4: get this authentic, stressed out, exhausted version of myself that's 98 00:05:11,080 --> 00:05:15,400 Speaker 4: not sustainable and burns out every year. So women Living 99 00:05:15,400 --> 00:05:20,640 Speaker 4: Deliciously has been this audacious reclaiming of my joy, which 100 00:05:20,800 --> 00:05:24,480 Speaker 4: as a feminist I didn't realize I had so much 101 00:05:24,520 --> 00:05:25,239 Speaker 4: guilt around. 102 00:05:25,640 --> 00:05:28,640 Speaker 3: I didn't realize I had so much guilt around. Even 103 00:05:28,680 --> 00:05:31,640 Speaker 3: writing a book about joy felt frivolous to me. 104 00:05:31,960 --> 00:05:34,279 Speaker 4: So the thing with Living Deliciously, where that came from 105 00:05:34,760 --> 00:05:36,840 Speaker 4: was me and my best friend a few years ago. 106 00:05:37,240 --> 00:05:40,719 Speaker 4: We were just having dinner and everything around me was beautiful. 107 00:05:40,720 --> 00:05:43,440 Speaker 4: There were flowers, there was cakes, and we were just 108 00:05:43,800 --> 00:05:46,000 Speaker 4: we were dressed head to toe and color, and I 109 00:05:46,080 --> 00:05:48,080 Speaker 4: was like, oh my god, this is living deliciously. 110 00:05:48,120 --> 00:05:51,359 Speaker 3: I'm living deliciously right now, and it was for me. 111 00:05:51,600 --> 00:05:55,480 Speaker 4: Living deliciously it's just the complete opposite of self objectification. 112 00:05:56,160 --> 00:05:58,640 Speaker 4: So it's not asking yourself. And I didn't even realize 113 00:05:58,680 --> 00:06:02,039 Speaker 4: this until I've finished writing the book. Living Deliciously is 114 00:06:02,080 --> 00:06:05,239 Speaker 4: the opposite of self objectification because it's not asking yourself 115 00:06:05,240 --> 00:06:07,800 Speaker 4: how do I look while I have this experience. 116 00:06:08,120 --> 00:06:11,440 Speaker 3: It's saying how do I feel while I have this experience? 117 00:06:12,000 --> 00:06:14,800 Speaker 3: And so it's romanticizing your life, of course, but it's 118 00:06:14,800 --> 00:06:18,279 Speaker 3: so much more than that, because it actually takes courage 119 00:06:18,880 --> 00:06:22,320 Speaker 3: to pursue a life as you joy when the default 120 00:06:22,360 --> 00:06:27,919 Speaker 3: setting of your life is to please, because it's like 121 00:06:28,040 --> 00:06:29,159 Speaker 3: romanticizing it. 122 00:06:29,320 --> 00:06:34,760 Speaker 1: I feel like that there's still potentially the ingrained habit 123 00:06:34,960 --> 00:06:37,919 Speaker 1: to think of how it looks to other people, Like 124 00:06:37,920 --> 00:06:40,960 Speaker 1: when we romanticize our life, it's all it still has 125 00:06:41,000 --> 00:06:45,320 Speaker 1: that little bit of like romanticizing it for the aesthetic 126 00:06:45,560 --> 00:06:48,400 Speaker 1: of like whatever it is, whereas loving deliciously it's like 127 00:06:48,920 --> 00:06:52,599 Speaker 1: it's yummy, it's delicious, Like it's that taste and that 128 00:06:52,760 --> 00:06:56,480 Speaker 1: feel of your life, like filling your fucking cup and 129 00:06:56,560 --> 00:07:00,400 Speaker 1: just being like studying amazing, sparkly and the bed thing 130 00:07:01,360 --> 00:07:05,240 Speaker 1: for yourself. So you mentioned that you came up with 131 00:07:05,440 --> 00:07:10,680 Speaker 1: living deliciously with your bestie on a dinner, But what 132 00:07:10,760 --> 00:07:13,840 Speaker 1: does it mean to live deliciously? 133 00:07:14,480 --> 00:07:17,720 Speaker 4: So simply put, it is romanticizing your life, and it's 134 00:07:17,760 --> 00:07:20,760 Speaker 4: placing yourself. What's having the audacity to place yourself at 135 00:07:20,800 --> 00:07:24,960 Speaker 4: the center of your own life and embodying that through 136 00:07:25,000 --> 00:07:29,119 Speaker 4: making choices that please you, even when that is uncomfortable 137 00:07:29,600 --> 00:07:32,840 Speaker 4: because you're imagining this like line up in your head 138 00:07:32,840 --> 00:07:35,239 Speaker 4: of people that it's going to disappoint, And I think 139 00:07:35,040 --> 00:07:39,360 Speaker 4: we have this idea that our joy is so selfish 140 00:07:39,680 --> 00:07:42,680 Speaker 4: or to even talk about I've always loved life. I've 141 00:07:42,680 --> 00:07:45,800 Speaker 4: always had such a like a deep gratitude and appreciation 142 00:07:45,840 --> 00:07:47,960 Speaker 4: for life ever since I was a kid, and I 143 00:07:48,000 --> 00:07:50,880 Speaker 4: almost felt like it was illegal that I could feel 144 00:07:50,920 --> 00:07:54,960 Speaker 4: this happy, such small pleasures like I would just be 145 00:07:55,040 --> 00:07:56,800 Speaker 4: going on a walk and feel the sun and be 146 00:07:56,880 --> 00:08:00,720 Speaker 4: close to tears and just be like, Wow, what the. 147 00:08:00,600 --> 00:08:02,400 Speaker 3: Fuck I can't believe to experience this. 148 00:08:03,000 --> 00:08:05,000 Speaker 4: Or I would listen to Fleetwood Mac and feel like 149 00:08:05,080 --> 00:08:08,000 Speaker 4: I was like seeing God or something like what the 150 00:08:08,120 --> 00:08:09,920 Speaker 4: fuck is more common experience? 151 00:08:14,560 --> 00:08:17,720 Speaker 3: And I would I would never dare say that out loud. 152 00:08:17,880 --> 00:08:22,240 Speaker 4: Too cringey, too embarrassing, too ernest, too vulnerable to I 153 00:08:22,240 --> 00:08:24,960 Speaker 4: don't know what it's like in Australia, but it's I 154 00:08:25,040 --> 00:08:28,520 Speaker 4: realized lately it's actually not cool to be seen as 155 00:08:28,560 --> 00:08:30,280 Speaker 4: someone who really loves their life. 156 00:08:30,320 --> 00:08:31,280 Speaker 3: It's a lot more. 157 00:08:31,240 --> 00:08:33,000 Speaker 4: You get, like a lot more call points for being 158 00:08:33,120 --> 00:08:37,400 Speaker 4: really visibly miserable and cynical, deprecating. 159 00:08:37,679 --> 00:08:38,760 Speaker 3: Yeah, of course, and. 160 00:08:38,720 --> 00:08:41,160 Speaker 4: We love that with women. The world needs more women 161 00:08:41,200 --> 00:08:43,720 Speaker 4: who love their lives. But we don't like women who 162 00:08:43,720 --> 00:08:47,720 Speaker 4: love their lives, Like culturally we don't we we we 163 00:08:47,760 --> 00:08:49,800 Speaker 4: don't like to see women succeed. And if we do, 164 00:08:49,880 --> 00:08:52,280 Speaker 4: if she does it long enough, she'll be tear down. 165 00:08:52,720 --> 00:08:57,480 Speaker 4: There's this inclination we have to It's like you can't 166 00:08:57,520 --> 00:09:02,240 Speaker 4: be too anything, to have, too beautiful, too intelligent, too 167 00:09:03,040 --> 00:09:07,839 Speaker 4: and anything. And I couldn't write a book about how 168 00:09:07,840 --> 00:09:09,960 Speaker 4: to live a delicious life and how to get more 169 00:09:10,040 --> 00:09:13,800 Speaker 4: joy out of your life without talking about those barriers 170 00:09:13,840 --> 00:09:14,839 Speaker 4: that we face. 171 00:09:14,720 --> 00:09:17,640 Speaker 3: Because it feels like this invisible structure. Everyone wants to 172 00:09:17,679 --> 00:09:22,600 Speaker 3: be happy, everyone everyone wants to be happy, but there 173 00:09:22,760 --> 00:09:25,439 Speaker 3: it's almost like, you know, I'll speak for myself. When 174 00:09:25,480 --> 00:09:30,440 Speaker 3: I was at the pit of my mental exhaustion, I 175 00:09:30,480 --> 00:09:32,560 Speaker 3: didn't know, I didn't know why, I didn't know what 176 00:09:32,640 --> 00:09:34,840 Speaker 3: to do. It just felt like I was covered in 177 00:09:34,920 --> 00:09:38,440 Speaker 3: this smog and I was irritated by everything. 178 00:09:38,760 --> 00:09:40,640 Speaker 4: I didn't love my life and I didn't know how 179 00:09:40,640 --> 00:09:44,319 Speaker 4: I got there, And it was so unbelievably overwhelming. And 180 00:09:44,400 --> 00:09:47,320 Speaker 4: if someone dared tell me to just like meditate or 181 00:09:47,320 --> 00:09:49,000 Speaker 4: be mindful, I would have told them to fuck off, 182 00:09:50,080 --> 00:09:55,800 Speaker 4: shut up. It is so overwhelming right now. And it 183 00:09:55,880 --> 00:10:00,960 Speaker 4: wasn't one thing. It was this almost like maximum in 184 00:10:01,120 --> 00:10:04,640 Speaker 4: every area of my life. I was taking on so 185 00:10:04,840 --> 00:10:08,679 Speaker 4: much work, taking on so many responsibilities, and trying to 186 00:10:08,720 --> 00:10:10,920 Speaker 4: spin all of the plates at once in a way 187 00:10:10,960 --> 00:10:14,000 Speaker 4: that just wasn't sustainable, and it caused me this deep 188 00:10:14,040 --> 00:10:16,320 Speaker 4: stress and resentment and my life didn't feel like it 189 00:10:16,360 --> 00:10:19,000 Speaker 4: belonged to me. But I was the one that had 190 00:10:19,040 --> 00:10:22,280 Speaker 4: taken all of that stuff on. And So to come 191 00:10:22,320 --> 00:10:25,200 Speaker 4: back to your question about what is living deliciously for me, 192 00:10:25,480 --> 00:10:27,959 Speaker 4: it is having the courage to put yourself at the 193 00:10:28,000 --> 00:10:31,560 Speaker 4: center of your life and asking yourself, in every single moment, 194 00:10:31,800 --> 00:10:35,400 Speaker 4: what can I do right now that feels beautiful to me? 195 00:10:36,080 --> 00:10:39,800 Speaker 4: And it's reaching for these these small little anchors and 196 00:10:39,840 --> 00:10:42,440 Speaker 4: moments in your day. So I've had like a pretty 197 00:10:42,480 --> 00:10:44,920 Speaker 4: good mental health run for the last few weeks. But 198 00:10:45,040 --> 00:10:47,000 Speaker 4: last night I was crying my fucking eyes out and 199 00:10:47,040 --> 00:10:51,560 Speaker 4: I have no idea why, and there's there's don't I 200 00:10:51,559 --> 00:10:53,679 Speaker 4: can't even I was like, I'm not going to intellectualize this. 201 00:10:54,080 --> 00:10:55,719 Speaker 4: I have no idea why I want to crime my 202 00:10:55,720 --> 00:10:57,559 Speaker 4: eyes out right now. Also, my period's coming to me, 203 00:10:57,720 --> 00:11:01,600 Speaker 4: so who knows. But it was like a real like 204 00:11:02,160 --> 00:11:06,040 Speaker 4: deeper also like just sadness and loneliness and all of 205 00:11:06,080 --> 00:11:10,240 Speaker 4: this like mixture in my body and I just it's 206 00:11:10,320 --> 00:11:13,320 Speaker 4: so it's this is going to sound so frivolous and silly. 207 00:11:13,720 --> 00:11:16,440 Speaker 4: But the thing I was telling myself was, it's okay, 208 00:11:16,520 --> 00:11:19,040 Speaker 4: I'm going to wake up tomorrow and I'm gonna go 209 00:11:19,040 --> 00:11:20,040 Speaker 4: get a nice coffee. 210 00:11:20,160 --> 00:11:24,599 Speaker 1: We have sleepovers and exactly, I like sleep over with 211 00:11:24,640 --> 00:11:27,920 Speaker 1: the men, boring sleeve, over with your best friend gorgeous. 212 00:11:28,000 --> 00:11:30,520 Speaker 1: But we'll be like, I'm really excited to go get 213 00:11:30,520 --> 00:11:35,360 Speaker 1: coffee tomorrow morning. And that's like I love that you reset. 214 00:11:35,640 --> 00:11:38,559 Speaker 2: It is a reset, and it's like an immediate and 215 00:11:38,720 --> 00:11:43,200 Speaker 2: such an easy way to experience joy and take a 216 00:11:43,280 --> 00:11:46,360 Speaker 2: pause and just savor in something basically as soon as 217 00:11:46,400 --> 00:11:49,120 Speaker 2: you wake up. Yeah, and something you can do every day. 218 00:11:49,360 --> 00:11:55,679 Speaker 4: And the thing is that is a legitimate form of optimism, mindfulness, gratitude. 219 00:11:55,960 --> 00:12:00,559 Speaker 4: But to say it it sounds like frivolous, It sounds silly. 220 00:12:00,840 --> 00:12:04,080 Speaker 4: But I needed to write a book that get like 221 00:12:04,200 --> 00:12:07,720 Speaker 4: legitimize those things. But basically I spoke about it online. 222 00:12:07,720 --> 00:12:09,160 Speaker 4: I asked my audience a couple of years ago, like, 223 00:12:09,200 --> 00:12:11,120 Speaker 4: how do you like to live deliciously? What does that 224 00:12:11,160 --> 00:12:13,680 Speaker 4: mean to you, and I wanted to see if people 225 00:12:13,920 --> 00:12:16,000 Speaker 4: knew that it was the same thing, like how do 226 00:12:16,080 --> 00:12:19,480 Speaker 4: other people feel about it? And people were sending me 227 00:12:19,600 --> 00:12:21,360 Speaker 4: like all sorts of things like, oh my god, I 228 00:12:21,400 --> 00:12:23,760 Speaker 4: have five minutes in the morning where the birds start 229 00:12:23,840 --> 00:12:27,960 Speaker 4: chirping before my partner wakes up, or when I see 230 00:12:27,960 --> 00:12:30,719 Speaker 4: the sun glisten on the pond like that collects. 231 00:12:30,400 --> 00:12:32,480 Speaker 3: Near my house when it's been raining, and. 232 00:12:32,400 --> 00:12:36,079 Speaker 4: People mentioning all of these small moments in their day 233 00:12:36,120 --> 00:12:39,240 Speaker 4: that top them up, and I wanted to write a 234 00:12:39,240 --> 00:12:42,400 Speaker 4: book about them because it's funny because now there's only 235 00:12:42,440 --> 00:12:44,160 Speaker 4: like even a few chapters in the books that even 236 00:12:44,200 --> 00:12:46,880 Speaker 4: talk about romanticizing your life. It's now become this entire 237 00:12:46,960 --> 00:12:51,679 Speaker 4: philosophy about how to become your most authentic self and 238 00:12:52,200 --> 00:12:54,480 Speaker 4: put yourself at the center of your own life. And 239 00:12:54,559 --> 00:12:56,400 Speaker 4: for all of the reasons I mentioned before, that takes 240 00:12:56,440 --> 00:12:58,560 Speaker 4: so much courage, because if there's a little voice in 241 00:12:58,600 --> 00:13:02,520 Speaker 4: your head telling you that you're selfish for taking those 242 00:13:02,559 --> 00:13:05,200 Speaker 4: five minutes, or you're selfish for setting boundaries, you just 243 00:13:05,200 --> 00:13:08,360 Speaker 4: don't even believe that you deserve joy. And that was 244 00:13:08,360 --> 00:13:10,559 Speaker 4: one of my main driving forces for writing it was 245 00:13:10,600 --> 00:13:13,200 Speaker 4: that so many women just don't feel that they deserve it, 246 00:13:13,600 --> 00:13:17,280 Speaker 4: not to mention so many women suffer. If you're a 247 00:13:17,280 --> 00:13:20,440 Speaker 4: woman who's never even considered that you may have a 248 00:13:20,480 --> 00:13:25,439 Speaker 4: relationship with your body where you are constantly observing yourself 249 00:13:26,200 --> 00:13:30,200 Speaker 4: and watching yourself while you live your life. 250 00:13:30,400 --> 00:13:31,680 Speaker 3: You know the male gaze theory. 251 00:13:31,679 --> 00:13:34,679 Speaker 4: If you've never even thought about that, it's like an entire, invisible, 252 00:13:34,720 --> 00:13:37,840 Speaker 4: phantom structure that exists in your head that is stopping 253 00:13:37,880 --> 00:13:40,840 Speaker 4: you from living your fullest life. And the whole book 254 00:13:40,960 --> 00:13:43,400 Speaker 4: Women Living Deliciously is all about all of those barriers 255 00:13:43,440 --> 00:13:46,000 Speaker 4: that are in the way that stop us from experiencing joy. 256 00:13:46,400 --> 00:13:50,040 Speaker 4: And I just want, I want love themselves and love 257 00:13:50,080 --> 00:13:52,040 Speaker 4: other women, because it can be hard when you're in 258 00:13:52,080 --> 00:13:57,040 Speaker 4: that exhausted place to be happy for yourself and other women. 259 00:13:57,160 --> 00:13:59,760 Speaker 4: It just you can't. And you can be a feminist. 260 00:13:59,760 --> 00:14:02,679 Speaker 4: You can be feminist in your head and still resent 261 00:14:02,720 --> 00:14:05,720 Speaker 4: other women for their success and still be a feminist 262 00:14:05,760 --> 00:14:09,080 Speaker 4: and still hate your body, and you need to. It's 263 00:14:09,080 --> 00:14:11,440 Speaker 4: all good knowing the theory and knowing what's right to do, 264 00:14:11,840 --> 00:14:14,280 Speaker 4: but you need to actually feel it. 265 00:14:14,840 --> 00:14:16,760 Speaker 3: And I think with women don't know you pretty. 266 00:14:16,760 --> 00:14:19,600 Speaker 4: In my first book, it was a lot about the theory, 267 00:14:19,760 --> 00:14:22,800 Speaker 4: and it was a lot about Look, this is like feminism, 268 00:14:22,800 --> 00:14:25,320 Speaker 4: one O one, this is what's been going on. This 269 00:14:25,360 --> 00:14:27,120 Speaker 4: is why a lot of us hate our fucking bodies. 270 00:14:27,160 --> 00:14:28,840 Speaker 4: This is why a lot of us betray our own 271 00:14:28,880 --> 00:14:30,880 Speaker 4: boundaries and betray our own desires to be with the 272 00:14:30,880 --> 00:14:35,600 Speaker 4: most hideous and awful men that you've been trained trying 273 00:14:35,600 --> 00:14:37,760 Speaker 4: to add them to the point where lesbians don't even 274 00:14:37,760 --> 00:14:40,240 Speaker 4: come out in their till their fifties and their forties 275 00:14:40,240 --> 00:14:43,320 Speaker 4: because they've been so convinced to love men like that. 276 00:14:43,400 --> 00:14:46,320 Speaker 4: We have all been convinced and coerced in these ways, 277 00:14:46,360 --> 00:14:48,960 Speaker 4: and that's what women don't know you pretty was and 278 00:14:49,000 --> 00:14:51,520 Speaker 4: with women living deliciously, it was like I'd realized for 279 00:14:51,560 --> 00:14:54,480 Speaker 4: the first time, like you can't just know this in 280 00:14:54,520 --> 00:14:57,240 Speaker 4: your head. You have to embody that. And for me, 281 00:14:57,400 --> 00:15:02,000 Speaker 4: the reverse of self objectification is to prioritize the experience 282 00:15:02,160 --> 00:15:04,800 Speaker 4: of your body. I had, really I hated my body. 283 00:15:05,400 --> 00:15:10,640 Speaker 4: And it wasn't until I started to intentionally seek out 284 00:15:10,720 --> 00:15:13,840 Speaker 4: moments of joy and integrate it into my life and 285 00:15:13,920 --> 00:15:17,280 Speaker 4: literally pack it into the cake from fucking scratch and. 286 00:15:17,200 --> 00:15:20,160 Speaker 3: Not leave it joy as this last minute thing that 287 00:15:20,160 --> 00:15:22,040 Speaker 3: I would get around. You wants the to do list, 288 00:15:22,360 --> 00:15:24,640 Speaker 3: that's the thing You've got to find it. 289 00:15:24,760 --> 00:15:27,880 Speaker 1: I think one of the tricky things is realizing what 290 00:15:28,160 --> 00:15:31,040 Speaker 1: those things are in our life that are stopping us 291 00:15:31,080 --> 00:15:34,440 Speaker 1: from living deliciously, Like what are the things that we 292 00:15:34,520 --> 00:15:40,040 Speaker 1: maybe don't realize sabotaging our deliciously beautiful lives. 293 00:15:40,440 --> 00:15:42,720 Speaker 4: I'll speak for myself and what I've spoken about in 294 00:15:42,720 --> 00:15:46,680 Speaker 4: the book, which is perfectionism. And I think perfectionism gets 295 00:15:46,720 --> 00:15:49,280 Speaker 4: in the way as this thing where we feel like 296 00:15:49,720 --> 00:15:53,520 Speaker 4: we should do things this way, we have to do 297 00:15:53,600 --> 00:15:56,760 Speaker 4: things this way, we have to do this amount of favors, 298 00:15:56,800 --> 00:16:00,480 Speaker 4: because it's like, you know, you have a drive force 299 00:16:00,560 --> 00:16:02,560 Speaker 4: that you don't even know as ruling your life. There 300 00:16:02,560 --> 00:16:07,680 Speaker 4: were so many things I would commit to out of obligation, favors, events, 301 00:16:08,040 --> 00:16:13,680 Speaker 4: work opportunities, just social life obligations, just like calling them obligations. 302 00:16:13,720 --> 00:16:13,880 Speaker 3: You know. 303 00:16:14,360 --> 00:16:17,600 Speaker 4: These were like people in my life that I loved, 304 00:16:18,080 --> 00:16:20,720 Speaker 4: but again seeing them felt like an errand because I 305 00:16:20,760 --> 00:16:24,720 Speaker 4: didn't actually have the time or the space to see them. 306 00:16:25,040 --> 00:16:27,680 Speaker 4: And it was this false idea I had in my 307 00:16:27,720 --> 00:16:30,920 Speaker 4: head that these people would I don't know, hate me 308 00:16:31,080 --> 00:16:33,280 Speaker 4: if I said no, or hate me if I canceled, 309 00:16:33,320 --> 00:16:36,000 Speaker 4: and so things just piled up up in my life 310 00:16:36,640 --> 00:16:38,040 Speaker 4: until I burn out. And so I think one of 311 00:16:38,080 --> 00:16:41,720 Speaker 4: the invisible barriers for me was this driving force of 312 00:16:41,760 --> 00:16:44,880 Speaker 4: needing to be a good girl, of needing to be perfect, 313 00:16:45,640 --> 00:16:47,680 Speaker 4: and of needing. 314 00:16:47,360 --> 00:16:49,840 Speaker 3: To bee, of needing to be seen as a good person. 315 00:16:49,880 --> 00:16:53,400 Speaker 4: And so once I relinquished my grasp on needing to 316 00:16:53,400 --> 00:16:56,640 Speaker 4: be seen as a good girl, and allowing myself to 317 00:16:56,680 --> 00:17:00,200 Speaker 4: feel guilt for canceling things and for saying I can't 318 00:17:00,240 --> 00:17:01,880 Speaker 4: do this at the moment, I can't take this on, 319 00:17:02,880 --> 00:17:05,320 Speaker 4: it's completely freed me up, and most people are perfectly 320 00:17:05,359 --> 00:17:08,560 Speaker 4: fucking happy with you rescheduling and event I think before 321 00:17:08,560 --> 00:17:11,480 Speaker 4: I thought that boundaries setting boundaries supposed to feel good 322 00:17:11,960 --> 00:17:14,639 Speaker 4: and boundary. You can't live a delicious life if you 323 00:17:14,680 --> 00:17:19,119 Speaker 4: don't make those uncomfortable choices, because otherwise you're letting everyone 324 00:17:19,119 --> 00:17:21,359 Speaker 4: else around you with their hands at the driving seat 325 00:17:21,359 --> 00:17:23,120 Speaker 4: of your life and you're in the passenger seat while 326 00:17:23,119 --> 00:17:24,480 Speaker 4: it's kind of being directed. 327 00:17:24,080 --> 00:17:24,760 Speaker 3: Around for you. 328 00:17:25,240 --> 00:17:26,760 Speaker 4: And one of the things I write in the book 329 00:17:27,240 --> 00:17:29,080 Speaker 4: is that if you don't design your life, your life 330 00:17:29,119 --> 00:17:32,000 Speaker 4: will be designed for you by other people, by the 331 00:17:32,040 --> 00:17:35,560 Speaker 4: need to please and so I think one of yeah, 332 00:17:35,600 --> 00:17:39,960 Speaker 4: possibly the biggest invisible barrier between women and living an 333 00:17:39,960 --> 00:17:43,480 Speaker 4: authentic life is that urge to please other people. I 334 00:17:44,000 --> 00:17:46,959 Speaker 4: just think it's like we're culturally ingrained to do it, 335 00:17:47,000 --> 00:17:48,879 Speaker 4: to please not just with our appearance, but to make 336 00:17:48,920 --> 00:17:51,960 Speaker 4: ourselves smaller, to not make anyone envious, to not be 337 00:17:52,040 --> 00:17:54,880 Speaker 4: too great, to not be too successful. Even when you're 338 00:17:54,880 --> 00:17:57,800 Speaker 4: like a little girl in school raising your hand in class, 339 00:17:58,320 --> 00:18:00,920 Speaker 4: or like trying a little bit too hard in lessons 340 00:18:00,960 --> 00:18:04,359 Speaker 4: or something, you can receive social isolation and punishment just 341 00:18:04,440 --> 00:18:05,800 Speaker 4: for trying a little bit too hard. 342 00:18:05,880 --> 00:18:07,959 Speaker 3: That was me. That was me the whole time. 343 00:18:08,000 --> 00:18:09,399 Speaker 1: Now, like please out like stuff, and I was like 344 00:18:09,440 --> 00:18:10,520 Speaker 1: I can't. Yeah. 345 00:18:10,600 --> 00:18:13,479 Speaker 2: I think what's interesting, though, is that you're definitely like 346 00:18:13,760 --> 00:18:16,400 Speaker 2: a lot of what you're talking about is definitely societal 347 00:18:16,440 --> 00:18:21,040 Speaker 2: pressures and expectations of other people, but it's also expectations 348 00:18:21,040 --> 00:18:24,280 Speaker 2: that we are putting on ourselves a lot of the 349 00:18:24,320 --> 00:18:27,280 Speaker 2: time due to these societal pressures and this inner monologue 350 00:18:27,280 --> 00:18:30,040 Speaker 2: that we have and these theories and discussions that we're 351 00:18:30,080 --> 00:18:32,840 Speaker 2: having in our own heads. But how can you tell 352 00:18:32,840 --> 00:18:37,000 Speaker 2: the difference between your intuition and what's good and will 353 00:18:37,040 --> 00:18:41,080 Speaker 2: help you live deliciously and maybe the unhelpful in a 354 00:18:41,160 --> 00:18:43,800 Speaker 2: dialogue in your head, and how do you talk back 355 00:18:44,320 --> 00:18:45,439 Speaker 2: to that voice. 356 00:18:45,760 --> 00:18:48,879 Speaker 3: It's so funny because that is like the million dollar question, 357 00:18:49,040 --> 00:18:49,359 Speaker 3: isn't it? 358 00:18:49,440 --> 00:18:51,840 Speaker 4: Like I wish I'm not going to sit here fucking 359 00:18:51,840 --> 00:18:56,280 Speaker 4: pretend I have the answer to my question. Is it intuition? 360 00:18:56,440 --> 00:18:59,840 Speaker 4: Is it anxiety? Like, oh my god, I wish I 361 00:18:59,880 --> 00:19:02,960 Speaker 4: had the answer to that question. The only thing I 362 00:19:03,000 --> 00:19:07,479 Speaker 4: can I can speak to that is anxiety feels like 363 00:19:07,680 --> 00:19:12,160 Speaker 4: urgency and it feels like a tightening of my stomach. 364 00:19:12,880 --> 00:19:18,760 Speaker 4: And intuition feels a lot more calm. It feels like, oh, 365 00:19:18,800 --> 00:19:22,679 Speaker 4: I just know, and it feels I don't know. Sometimes 366 00:19:22,680 --> 00:19:24,400 Speaker 4: it makes me want to like pull to my chest. 367 00:19:24,160 --> 00:19:25,199 Speaker 3: Like I just know. 368 00:19:26,040 --> 00:19:29,080 Speaker 4: It's like a bodily It's almost like it doesn't nag 369 00:19:29,080 --> 00:19:32,080 Speaker 4: at me. It's like this, it's just this feeling of 370 00:19:32,520 --> 00:19:35,560 Speaker 4: it's not calm. It's like a almost like a ping, 371 00:19:35,920 --> 00:19:39,640 Speaker 4: like a ping, and it's a lot quieter. And anxiety 372 00:19:39,920 --> 00:19:42,479 Speaker 4: is it creates this feeling of urgency and I need 373 00:19:42,520 --> 00:19:43,760 Speaker 4: to do this now and I need to speak to 374 00:19:43,840 --> 00:19:46,480 Speaker 4: this person now. It feels like, you know, and like 375 00:19:46,520 --> 00:19:49,480 Speaker 4: a conspiracy theory almost in your head and you have 376 00:19:49,520 --> 00:19:51,920 Speaker 4: to almost just like take a little beat and wait 377 00:19:51,920 --> 00:19:56,480 Speaker 4: for that feeling to pass. In terms of intuition and 378 00:19:56,520 --> 00:19:58,679 Speaker 4: how it feels in your body, I've actually got a 379 00:19:58,680 --> 00:20:00,719 Speaker 4: lot more comfortable with not knowing. 380 00:20:01,040 --> 00:20:02,200 Speaker 3: So if it is my. 381 00:20:02,240 --> 00:20:07,640 Speaker 4: Anxiety and I do need reassurance from a friend, from 382 00:20:07,680 --> 00:20:10,119 Speaker 4: someone that I'm working with, or I need to have 383 00:20:10,240 --> 00:20:14,040 Speaker 4: that reassured, or I act on an anxietary act on 384 00:20:14,080 --> 00:20:19,480 Speaker 4: a fear, I'm okay with acting on that and learning 385 00:20:19,640 --> 00:20:23,000 Speaker 4: from a mistake that it was my anxiety, because that 386 00:20:23,040 --> 00:20:27,080 Speaker 4: will find you my intuition and it was my perfectionism 387 00:20:27,240 --> 00:20:30,280 Speaker 4: that held me back from making those mistakes. That's part 388 00:20:30,320 --> 00:20:33,400 Speaker 4: of being human. So I was almost too afraid of 389 00:20:33,840 --> 00:20:36,960 Speaker 4: not knowing whether something was an intuitive decision or whether 390 00:20:37,040 --> 00:20:38,960 Speaker 4: it was fear and anxiety in my head that I 391 00:20:38,960 --> 00:20:41,399 Speaker 4: wouldn't make any moves. And I've kind of learned that 392 00:20:41,680 --> 00:20:44,640 Speaker 4: the best, most courageous thing you can do, the only 393 00:20:44,680 --> 00:20:47,600 Speaker 4: way you can get wisdom, which is what intuition is. Really, 394 00:20:47,720 --> 00:20:50,720 Speaker 4: it's wisdom. The only way you can get wisdom and 395 00:20:50,760 --> 00:20:54,880 Speaker 4: become a wise person is through making mistakes. Even if 396 00:20:54,920 --> 00:20:57,760 Speaker 4: you like you read something beautiful and wise on social media, 397 00:20:57,800 --> 00:21:01,240 Speaker 4: and it reverberates in your mind. Is this like wisdom 398 00:21:01,680 --> 00:21:04,679 Speaker 4: until you embody that wisdom, it's not wisdom, it's just 399 00:21:04,760 --> 00:21:07,000 Speaker 4: knowledge and it just sits in your head. You need 400 00:21:07,040 --> 00:21:10,439 Speaker 4: to actually act on and embody that wisdom. Then it 401 00:21:10,480 --> 00:21:12,919 Speaker 4: becomes wisdom and it almost adds. 402 00:21:13,160 --> 00:21:16,680 Speaker 3: I imagine it, like there's just this intuition. 403 00:21:16,800 --> 00:21:20,359 Speaker 4: It's like this straight shooting vibration, and you're always it's 404 00:21:20,400 --> 00:21:22,480 Speaker 4: almost like you have this little device inside of you 405 00:21:22,920 --> 00:21:26,479 Speaker 4: and you're just constantly waiting for it to like and 406 00:21:26,520 --> 00:21:29,399 Speaker 4: the only way you can get closer is by trying, 407 00:21:29,520 --> 00:21:32,119 Speaker 4: trying and failing. Right, So it's by like going this 408 00:21:32,280 --> 00:21:32,600 Speaker 4: it no? 409 00:21:32,680 --> 00:21:32,880 Speaker 2: Okay? 410 00:21:33,040 --> 00:21:33,560 Speaker 3: Is this it no? 411 00:21:33,680 --> 00:21:36,800 Speaker 4: And you do that by daring to be vulnerable even 412 00:21:36,840 --> 00:21:39,560 Speaker 4: with acting on your ideas and your and your experiments 413 00:21:39,680 --> 00:21:42,000 Speaker 4: or your content ideas or your or your posts, or 414 00:21:42,040 --> 00:21:45,600 Speaker 4: you're even in a conversation like saying something that you 415 00:21:45,600 --> 00:21:47,480 Speaker 4: don't think is going to sound perfect, but just fucking 416 00:21:47,520 --> 00:21:50,480 Speaker 4: going for it anyway, because otherwise you'll just never do anything. 417 00:21:50,640 --> 00:21:52,720 Speaker 1: Yeah, it's too boring to be right all the time. 418 00:21:52,880 --> 00:21:55,680 Speaker 1: Like it's really that I've been doing lately that even 419 00:21:55,720 --> 00:21:58,119 Speaker 1: in like the smallest of things. When someone says a 420 00:21:58,160 --> 00:22:01,760 Speaker 1: word and I don't know it, like I reckon maybe 421 00:22:01,760 --> 00:22:03,920 Speaker 1: two years ago I would have pretended. I would have 422 00:22:04,080 --> 00:22:07,640 Speaker 1: pretended I knew what that word was, whereas now I'm like, oh, 423 00:22:07,680 --> 00:22:10,680 Speaker 1: what does that mean? Like it's just it's so much 424 00:22:10,720 --> 00:22:14,320 Speaker 1: more fun when you realize you don't know everything because 425 00:22:14,359 --> 00:22:17,000 Speaker 1: there's so much more to learn, Like I actually I 426 00:22:17,080 --> 00:22:22,680 Speaker 1: feel sad that there are people that feel the need 427 00:22:23,640 --> 00:22:25,960 Speaker 1: that they have to know everything, or even that people 428 00:22:26,040 --> 00:22:29,600 Speaker 1: genuinely do believe they know everything, because that is so boring, 429 00:22:30,359 --> 00:22:32,800 Speaker 1: Like to think that you know that there's everything there 430 00:22:32,920 --> 00:22:35,480 Speaker 1: is to know in the world and that you're done. 431 00:22:35,640 --> 00:22:40,159 Speaker 4: It sounds it soft in values, like you used to 432 00:22:40,280 --> 00:22:44,080 Speaker 4: value knowing everything and now you value curiosity. Yes, Like 433 00:22:44,119 --> 00:22:47,240 Speaker 4: you're like, oh, actually curiosity is my value. Then me 434 00:22:47,440 --> 00:22:49,960 Speaker 4: asking what does this mean? It's like it's an alignment. 435 00:22:50,080 --> 00:22:52,959 Speaker 1: Yeah, that is great, but it's like an insecurity as well. 436 00:22:53,080 --> 00:22:55,000 Speaker 1: It's like that thing of being like I don't want 437 00:22:55,000 --> 00:22:56,879 Speaker 1: to look dumb. I don't want people to think that 438 00:22:57,040 --> 00:22:59,440 Speaker 1: I is this a word that I should know, or 439 00:22:59,520 --> 00:23:03,480 Speaker 1: like that it's stupid of me. And it's that expectation 440 00:23:03,560 --> 00:23:04,880 Speaker 1: of being like, I don't want to look this way. 441 00:23:04,920 --> 00:23:07,159 Speaker 1: I don't want to look that way, but really, no 442 00:23:07,240 --> 00:23:08,240 Speaker 1: one actually cares. 443 00:23:08,520 --> 00:23:08,600 Speaker 3: No. 444 00:23:09,000 --> 00:23:11,359 Speaker 4: That's what kept me caged for so not posting on 445 00:23:11,440 --> 00:23:14,280 Speaker 4: social media, and I was thrust up on a pedestal. 446 00:23:14,280 --> 00:23:16,760 Speaker 4: I wrote a book about feminism because I fucking wanted to, 447 00:23:16,800 --> 00:23:19,600 Speaker 4: and I love talking about feminism, and I genuinely think 448 00:23:19,600 --> 00:23:21,840 Speaker 4: my life's purpose is to help women understand themselves so 449 00:23:21,880 --> 00:23:25,160 Speaker 4: they can just unshackle themselves from fear and just live 450 00:23:25,200 --> 00:23:28,480 Speaker 4: their best fucking lives. Like I've never felt more called 451 00:23:28,520 --> 00:23:30,600 Speaker 4: to do something ever, and I'll do it forever because 452 00:23:30,600 --> 00:23:33,800 Speaker 4: I love women and I had this I had this purpose. 453 00:23:33,840 --> 00:23:35,760 Speaker 4: But I started judging myself the way I was showing 454 00:23:35,840 --> 00:23:39,160 Speaker 4: up because I was put on a massive pedestal. It's 455 00:23:39,240 --> 00:23:45,040 Speaker 4: funny when you talk about things online, people think that 456 00:23:45,280 --> 00:23:49,160 Speaker 4: you think you know everything even though you're just saying something. 457 00:23:49,200 --> 00:23:49,960 Speaker 3: You're just speaking. 458 00:23:50,160 --> 00:23:52,920 Speaker 4: Yeah, but yeah, I'm just speaking, and people think that 459 00:23:53,000 --> 00:23:57,800 Speaker 4: you think you know everything and you're just speaking, and 460 00:23:58,119 --> 00:24:00,520 Speaker 4: there is there's also not a lot of room nuance 461 00:24:00,560 --> 00:24:03,800 Speaker 4: on social media also, and so I just stopped myself 462 00:24:03,800 --> 00:24:09,040 Speaker 4: from sharing anything because the absolute it was soul stroying 463 00:24:09,200 --> 00:24:11,960 Speaker 4: the soul destroying the idea for me of being taken 464 00:24:11,960 --> 00:24:14,160 Speaker 4: out of context and have my words taken out of context. 465 00:24:14,200 --> 00:24:16,640 Speaker 4: So I just I stopped sharing myself for a very 466 00:24:16,640 --> 00:24:17,160 Speaker 4: long time. 467 00:24:18,119 --> 00:24:20,879 Speaker 3: That breaks my heart. Yeah, but I think. 468 00:24:21,040 --> 00:24:22,719 Speaker 4: I think it's important for me to talk about that 469 00:24:22,760 --> 00:24:24,800 Speaker 4: because so many people see me on social media now 470 00:24:24,840 --> 00:24:28,879 Speaker 4: and must think, like, God, this girl so effortlessly expresses herself. 471 00:24:29,480 --> 00:24:33,840 Speaker 4: And I went through so much mental stuff in my 472 00:24:33,920 --> 00:24:37,440 Speaker 4: head to even become like this vibrant, fucking butterfly now 473 00:24:37,560 --> 00:24:39,760 Speaker 4: like it was, It didn't always come easy to me, 474 00:24:40,359 --> 00:24:43,040 Speaker 4: and it's a skill you have to build. 475 00:24:43,119 --> 00:24:46,480 Speaker 1: That's comforting to know, though, because I think that's that's 476 00:24:46,720 --> 00:24:49,359 Speaker 1: one of the things that it is tricky. I think people, 477 00:24:50,000 --> 00:24:52,840 Speaker 1: you know, they think, because you know, they're burnt out, 478 00:24:52,920 --> 00:24:55,680 Speaker 1: or they're exhausted, or they're just genuinely unhappy, they think 479 00:24:55,720 --> 00:24:57,840 Speaker 1: that's never going to be me. I'm never going to 480 00:24:57,880 --> 00:24:59,879 Speaker 1: be that person that thinks I'm so excited to go 481 00:25:00,280 --> 00:25:03,240 Speaker 1: get my coffee or paint my nails pink or do 482 00:25:04,000 --> 00:25:07,080 Speaker 1: like little things like that, and that's just never going 483 00:25:07,160 --> 00:25:09,440 Speaker 1: to be me. But to know that that's not the case, 484 00:25:09,480 --> 00:25:12,160 Speaker 1: I think is actually really really comforting. And even when 485 00:25:12,200 --> 00:25:15,000 Speaker 1: you said before, I got goosebumps when you said anxiety 486 00:25:15,000 --> 00:25:17,880 Speaker 1: feels like urgency because I've never heard it described like that, 487 00:25:18,240 --> 00:25:20,919 Speaker 1: and I was like, don't cry, because. 488 00:25:20,920 --> 00:25:23,280 Speaker 3: It absolutely hit the nail and tics. 489 00:25:23,359 --> 00:25:27,600 Speaker 4: Yeah, Like the word frazzled is how my mind feels, 490 00:25:27,600 --> 00:25:30,280 Speaker 4: you know, like you get those dish scourers that you 491 00:25:30,440 --> 00:25:37,280 Speaker 4: wash dishes with. It's like a still knotted thing. Yeah, 492 00:25:37,320 --> 00:25:40,000 Speaker 4: And it's like that is how anxiety feels to me. 493 00:25:40,280 --> 00:25:45,439 Speaker 4: That is how my brain feels, and it's you know, 494 00:25:45,960 --> 00:25:48,199 Speaker 4: I always get the people say I can't imagine you 495 00:25:48,200 --> 00:25:50,960 Speaker 4: ever being depressed. I can't ever imagine you feeling like shit. 496 00:25:51,600 --> 00:25:54,199 Speaker 4: And that's obviously because I don't show it online. And 497 00:25:54,240 --> 00:25:56,360 Speaker 4: it's not a case of me not wanting people to. 498 00:25:56,320 --> 00:25:57,440 Speaker 3: Even see me in that way. 499 00:25:57,920 --> 00:26:00,800 Speaker 4: I just I only like to talk about things once 500 00:26:00,800 --> 00:26:03,520 Speaker 4: I've overcome them on social media, you know, with the 501 00:26:03,560 --> 00:26:05,919 Speaker 4: people in my life. It's a vulnerability for me that 502 00:26:05,920 --> 00:26:08,520 Speaker 4: has to be earned. I don't like exposing my audience 503 00:26:08,600 --> 00:26:11,320 Speaker 4: to like the messy middle. It's quite a lot to 504 00:26:11,320 --> 00:26:13,560 Speaker 4: put on because also my audience really care about me. 505 00:26:14,320 --> 00:26:17,360 Speaker 5: And so I don't share those like. 506 00:26:19,119 --> 00:26:20,959 Speaker 4: I'm not going to like hop on social media and 507 00:26:21,040 --> 00:26:23,399 Speaker 4: cry in the middle of something. That's something I'll do 508 00:26:23,440 --> 00:26:26,680 Speaker 4: like with my friends and family and stuff. But I 509 00:26:26,760 --> 00:26:30,080 Speaker 4: do feel, of course, I'm like a human being and 510 00:26:30,119 --> 00:26:31,880 Speaker 4: I feel so much anxiety. The only reason I can 511 00:26:31,920 --> 00:26:36,520 Speaker 4: talk about these management techniques is because I use. 512 00:26:36,400 --> 00:26:38,560 Speaker 3: Them all the time. 513 00:26:39,160 --> 00:26:43,679 Speaker 4: And I've started doing this thing recently just to like 514 00:26:43,800 --> 00:26:46,360 Speaker 4: succuss change the topic a bit, but I've started doing 515 00:26:46,359 --> 00:26:49,240 Speaker 4: this thing recently where you know, like the classical mindfulness 516 00:26:49,240 --> 00:26:51,720 Speaker 4: technique of your thoughts are clouds and you just have 517 00:26:51,800 --> 00:26:52,480 Speaker 4: to imagine them. 518 00:26:52,440 --> 00:26:53,960 Speaker 3: Like pass through from your mind. 519 00:26:54,480 --> 00:26:58,719 Speaker 4: I started just literally going like this and gesturing with 520 00:26:58,800 --> 00:27:02,480 Speaker 4: my hat part in the class and it fucking works, 521 00:27:03,040 --> 00:27:05,560 Speaker 4: and it's like out of my way and just go 522 00:27:05,640 --> 00:27:08,560 Speaker 4: like not today, and just like it will go and 523 00:27:08,600 --> 00:27:13,840 Speaker 4: it's it's it's it's honestly, there is nothing more precious 524 00:27:14,200 --> 00:27:18,800 Speaker 4: then actually living your life and living your life and 525 00:27:18,840 --> 00:27:21,919 Speaker 4: contending with your life the way it actually is and 526 00:27:22,040 --> 00:27:25,320 Speaker 4: not living with your life with that filter of anxiety. 527 00:27:25,800 --> 00:27:26,800 Speaker 3: And it's it's. 528 00:27:27,960 --> 00:27:30,080 Speaker 4: I was thinking the other day that is that this 529 00:27:30,080 --> 00:27:33,000 Speaker 4: this has completely changed my life just even saying these 530 00:27:33,080 --> 00:27:36,680 Speaker 4: words when I'm anxious and it feels like I am 531 00:27:36,760 --> 00:27:39,159 Speaker 4: in the fog and I'm anxious about a person or 532 00:27:39,240 --> 00:27:43,680 Speaker 4: is this I've been through so much like friendship trauma 533 00:27:44,080 --> 00:27:47,359 Speaker 4: with women through my whole life, and so if I could, 534 00:27:47,400 --> 00:27:49,800 Speaker 4: like if I'm getting close to another woman or I'm 535 00:27:49,800 --> 00:27:51,160 Speaker 4: doing something, that. 536 00:27:51,160 --> 00:27:53,439 Speaker 3: Old narrative will pop hum in my head, right, be careful, 537 00:27:53,520 --> 00:27:55,119 Speaker 3: do this, do da da da da da. 538 00:27:55,280 --> 00:27:57,280 Speaker 5: And I literally I just told myself the other day, 539 00:27:57,280 --> 00:28:00,960 Speaker 5: I was like, you are not contending with reality. You 540 00:28:01,000 --> 00:28:04,199 Speaker 5: are viewing reality with this filter. And if you just 541 00:28:04,359 --> 00:28:09,399 Speaker 5: remove this filter, life is beautiful. It's it's literally like 542 00:28:09,600 --> 00:28:12,359 Speaker 5: when you're anxious, it's it's it's a filter in. 543 00:28:12,280 --> 00:28:14,399 Speaker 3: Front of you. It is not you. It is a filter. 544 00:28:14,760 --> 00:28:18,639 Speaker 3: And if you move the filter, life just is. 545 00:28:19,200 --> 00:28:23,119 Speaker 4: It's not even it is and things things don't have 546 00:28:23,160 --> 00:28:26,480 Speaker 4: as you give things in life meaning, and if you 547 00:28:26,520 --> 00:28:29,160 Speaker 4: can remove that meaning, it just is. 548 00:28:29,400 --> 00:28:30,600 Speaker 3: It's not it's not you know. 549 00:28:30,920 --> 00:28:33,560 Speaker 1: Yeah, And I love that because it's it is. It's 550 00:28:33,640 --> 00:28:34,960 Speaker 1: it's almost made up. 551 00:28:35,160 --> 00:28:36,960 Speaker 2: And I think as well, kind of touching on what 552 00:28:37,000 --> 00:28:40,640 Speaker 2: you said before, we're afraid to live deliciously because we 553 00:28:40,640 --> 00:28:43,160 Speaker 2: don't want to be earnest or we don't want to be, 554 00:28:43,920 --> 00:28:48,320 Speaker 2: you know, seen as being emotional or really being vulnerable, 555 00:28:48,360 --> 00:28:52,200 Speaker 2: because it's embarrassing apparently to be those things. But you've 556 00:28:52,240 --> 00:28:55,480 Speaker 2: also said in the past that embarrassment is the price 557 00:28:55,520 --> 00:28:59,920 Speaker 2: that you pay for excellence. So can you elaborate on that, 558 00:29:00,040 --> 00:29:02,600 Speaker 2: and also, I guess give us some tips on how 559 00:29:02,640 --> 00:29:05,600 Speaker 2: to I guess knock away that shame so that we 560 00:29:05,680 --> 00:29:06,960 Speaker 2: can live deliciously. 561 00:29:07,280 --> 00:29:08,520 Speaker 3: Yeah, so embarrassing. 562 00:29:08,600 --> 00:29:10,360 Speaker 4: So I think a big part of living a delicious 563 00:29:10,360 --> 00:29:11,760 Speaker 4: life is expressing yourself. 564 00:29:11,840 --> 00:29:12,040 Speaker 3: Right. 565 00:29:12,240 --> 00:29:14,560 Speaker 4: So that's why I said that quote embarrassment is the 566 00:29:14,640 --> 00:29:18,160 Speaker 4: price you pay to be fucking excellent at something, because 567 00:29:18,600 --> 00:29:22,160 Speaker 4: I think if you can depersonalize failure and just to 568 00:29:22,200 --> 00:29:24,840 Speaker 4: view it as part of the fucking trajectory to being great, 569 00:29:25,480 --> 00:29:27,760 Speaker 4: it's a lot easier. You no longer view it as 570 00:29:27,840 --> 00:29:31,120 Speaker 4: something something that's happening to you. I'm a failure, right. 571 00:29:31,160 --> 00:29:33,400 Speaker 4: I'm sure with this podcast when you started recording it, 572 00:29:33,440 --> 00:29:35,360 Speaker 4: you were like, who do we think we are doing this? 573 00:29:35,440 --> 00:29:37,440 Speaker 4: I think that every time I write a book, I'm like, 574 00:29:37,480 --> 00:29:39,720 Speaker 4: who am I to write a fucking book? And then 575 00:29:39,760 --> 00:29:41,320 Speaker 4: you just do it, and you keep going, and you 576 00:29:41,400 --> 00:29:45,280 Speaker 4: keep going, and you realize that that feeling of failure, 577 00:29:45,320 --> 00:29:49,000 Speaker 4: that feeling of fraudulence and embarrassing yourself and trying something 578 00:29:49,000 --> 00:29:51,360 Speaker 4: for the first time and being awful at it, because 579 00:29:51,720 --> 00:29:54,160 Speaker 4: of course you are. You're literally doing something for the 580 00:29:54,160 --> 00:29:56,760 Speaker 4: first time. If you can view it as part of 581 00:29:56,800 --> 00:30:01,560 Speaker 4: the process and not who you are and embarrassment failure, 582 00:30:01,840 --> 00:30:04,160 Speaker 4: then it's just part of the process and it's no 583 00:30:04,240 --> 00:30:06,520 Speaker 4: longer something that's happening to you. And I think when 584 00:30:06,520 --> 00:30:08,520 Speaker 4: you just give I made a video about it recently, 585 00:30:08,640 --> 00:30:11,240 Speaker 4: embarrassment is a price you pay for excellence, and I 586 00:30:11,240 --> 00:30:13,800 Speaker 4: think just hearing someone else say that gives you permission 587 00:30:14,240 --> 00:30:19,040 Speaker 4: to fuck up, to make mistakes, to embarrass yourself online. 588 00:30:20,080 --> 00:30:24,280 Speaker 4: And the idea is also you're not actually being embarrassing. Also, 589 00:30:24,320 --> 00:30:28,960 Speaker 4: when I talk about being cringey and embracing your inner cringe, 590 00:30:29,120 --> 00:30:32,120 Speaker 4: you're not intentionally doing things. 591 00:30:31,800 --> 00:30:33,040 Speaker 3: To make people cringe. 592 00:30:33,320 --> 00:30:38,440 Speaker 4: You are just expressing yourself and allowing yourself to view cringe, 593 00:30:38,720 --> 00:30:42,240 Speaker 4: just like embarrassment, as part of that process, because you're 594 00:30:42,280 --> 00:30:45,320 Speaker 4: trying for something, and it's embarrassing to try for things 595 00:30:45,560 --> 00:30:49,520 Speaker 4: because a lot of people shame people who try because 596 00:30:49,560 --> 00:30:52,640 Speaker 4: you're in that middle phase where you're not quite self 597 00:30:52,800 --> 00:30:56,800 Speaker 4: actualized yet, and it's bringing that gap between in my 598 00:30:56,920 --> 00:30:59,880 Speaker 4: experience the woman I was in my head and making 599 00:31:00,080 --> 00:31:01,160 Speaker 4: her a fucking reality. 600 00:31:01,760 --> 00:31:05,520 Speaker 3: And that middle bit is full of embarrassment. That middle 601 00:31:05,560 --> 00:31:08,560 Speaker 3: bit is full of trying all the things. It's trying 602 00:31:08,600 --> 00:31:08,800 Speaker 3: to be. 603 00:31:08,920 --> 00:31:12,320 Speaker 4: The it's it's imitating who you think that woman is, 604 00:31:12,640 --> 00:31:14,200 Speaker 4: and then it's and then it's being like, oh god, no. 605 00:31:14,280 --> 00:31:16,040 Speaker 3: That was so an authentic That wasn't me at all. 606 00:31:16,080 --> 00:31:18,480 Speaker 4: That was I was trying to be the I don't know, 607 00:31:18,520 --> 00:31:20,760 Speaker 4: like this idea of what I thought this oneman was. 608 00:31:20,880 --> 00:31:23,479 Speaker 4: And you just execute and you execute, and you for me, 609 00:31:23,520 --> 00:31:25,840 Speaker 4: it's with my content, right, So I'll make a video 610 00:31:25,880 --> 00:31:28,840 Speaker 4: and I'll be like, Okay, no, that that wasn't That 611 00:31:28,880 --> 00:31:30,760 Speaker 4: wasn't quite what I wanted to say, or there was, 612 00:31:30,840 --> 00:31:33,720 Speaker 4: And you just execute and you execute, and you become 613 00:31:33,760 --> 00:31:36,840 Speaker 4: okay with people looking at you like you're a failure. 614 00:31:36,920 --> 00:31:40,560 Speaker 4: Because if you shift your values from everything I do 615 00:31:40,680 --> 00:31:45,080 Speaker 4: needs to be perfect to everything I do needs to 616 00:31:45,080 --> 00:31:49,360 Speaker 4: be a stepping stone towards fine tuning my skills for 617 00:31:49,400 --> 00:31:53,440 Speaker 4: self expression, then it's no longer a failure. 618 00:31:53,560 --> 00:31:54,800 Speaker 3: You are becoming. 619 00:31:54,920 --> 00:31:59,920 Speaker 4: Closer towards authenticity. Everything I do I want it to 620 00:31:59,960 --> 00:32:03,360 Speaker 4: be bridging that gap between who I was taught to 621 00:32:03,400 --> 00:32:05,600 Speaker 4: be and who I know the fuck I am in 622 00:32:05,600 --> 00:32:06,080 Speaker 4: my heart. 623 00:32:11,000 --> 00:32:12,480 Speaker 3: Hey chicks, just jumping in here. 624 00:32:12,520 --> 00:32:16,320 Speaker 1: We actually ended up yaffing with Florence for so long 625 00:32:16,600 --> 00:32:20,000 Speaker 1: that we've decided to do this in two parts, so 626 00:32:20,280 --> 00:32:22,760 Speaker 1: we will wrap this episode here. Thank you so much 627 00:32:22,760 --> 00:32:24,640 Speaker 1: for having us in your ear holes, and part two 628 00:32:24,680 --> 00:32:28,560 Speaker 1: will drop next Thursday, and we're so excited for you 629 00:32:28,680 --> 00:32:31,840 Speaker 1: to hear the rest of this combo. She is literally 630 00:32:32,440 --> 00:32:35,800 Speaker 1: the most beautiful human in the entire world. Spoiler spoiler, 631 00:32:36,240 --> 00:32:37,840 Speaker 1: and thank you so much for having us in your 632 00:32:37,840 --> 00:32:40,280 Speaker 1: ear holes. We love, love, love to be here, and 633 00:32:40,320 --> 00:32:42,400 Speaker 1: thank you to MK Made for making this episode of 634 00:32:42,400 --> 00:32:43,280 Speaker 1: two broad checks happen.