1 00:00:05,921 --> 00:00:07,281 Speaker 1: Approache production. 2 00:00:10,201 --> 00:00:15,161 Speaker 2: This podcast contains descriptions of sexual assault and psychological trauma. 3 00:00:15,521 --> 00:00:19,561 Speaker 2: It's not recommended for younger listeners and discretion is advised. 4 00:00:24,961 --> 00:00:27,081 Speaker 2: Welcome to Real Crime with Adam Shand. I'm your host, 5 00:00:27,161 --> 00:00:30,001 Speaker 2: Adam Shand. If you like our content, please hit the 6 00:00:30,121 --> 00:00:32,601 Speaker 2: like and subscribe buttons and share it far and wide. 7 00:00:33,040 --> 00:00:37,321 Speaker 2: Support independent crime journalism. This episode comes to you after 8 00:00:37,361 --> 00:00:42,240 Speaker 2: some soul searching. I don't believe everyone deserves a platform, 9 00:00:42,361 --> 00:00:45,241 Speaker 2: and if I afford someone the opportunity to speak, I 10 00:00:45,321 --> 00:00:49,481 Speaker 2: have to justify it. Today's guest falls very squarely into 11 00:00:49,521 --> 00:00:53,561 Speaker 2: this difficult category. Peter Atos has been described as one 12 00:00:53,601 --> 00:00:56,281 Speaker 2: of the worst sex offenders in Australia's history. 13 00:00:57,081 --> 00:01:00,441 Speaker 3: The man dubbed the Silver Gun Rapist has been sentenced 14 00:01:00,481 --> 00:01:02,281 Speaker 3: to twenty eight years in prison. 15 00:01:02,881 --> 00:01:06,121 Speaker 2: The copy locked him up recently described him. 16 00:01:06,161 --> 00:01:11,280 Speaker 1: A merciless offender, an evil piece of trash for Sikh units. 17 00:01:12,161 --> 00:01:16,121 Speaker 2: The Silver Gun Rapist, as Vetos, was known, rigged terror 18 00:01:16,161 --> 00:01:19,081 Speaker 2: on Victoria during a fifteen month period in the late 19 00:01:19,200 --> 00:01:24,881 Speaker 2: nineteen seventies, when he committed at least sixteen rapes at gunpoint. 20 00:01:25,161 --> 00:01:28,721 Speaker 1: Police are hunting a massed gunman targeting women in Melbourne's Southeast. 21 00:01:28,881 --> 00:01:31,560 Speaker 4: Authorities say no community can feel safe tonight. 22 00:01:32,441 --> 00:01:35,681 Speaker 2: Captured in nineteen seventy nine, Beethos was sentenced to a 23 00:01:35,721 --> 00:01:39,161 Speaker 2: maximum of twenty eight years jail, the heaviest sins for 24 00:01:39,200 --> 00:01:42,521 Speaker 2: sexual assault since the death penalty was abolished for rape 25 00:01:42,761 --> 00:01:47,041 Speaker 2: in nineteen forty eight. He was released in September nineteen 26 00:01:47,161 --> 00:01:51,401 Speaker 2: ninety six, seventeen years into his sentence. He's never spoke 27 00:01:51,481 --> 00:01:55,160 Speaker 2: into the media, but now facing his mortality, he wants 28 00:01:55,201 --> 00:01:58,801 Speaker 2: to get something off his chest. He has information that 29 00:01:58,881 --> 00:02:02,800 Speaker 2: he believes could help solve two of the Frankston Taynong murders, 30 00:02:03,241 --> 00:02:07,361 Speaker 2: and it came from the killer. Another notorious sex offender, 31 00:02:07,721 --> 00:02:11,041 Speaker 2: Raymond Edmonds, known as mister Stinky. 32 00:02:11,201 --> 00:02:15,761 Speaker 5: Edmunds, defetied killer who terrorized Shepperton, serving life without. 33 00:02:15,441 --> 00:02:17,840 Speaker 4: Parole for two murders and multiple rapes. 34 00:02:18,841 --> 00:02:21,881 Speaker 2: Athos didn't come to me directly. The approach came from 35 00:02:21,960 --> 00:02:25,041 Speaker 2: his daughter. When I spoke to Stacy, had to ask 36 00:02:25,121 --> 00:02:28,721 Speaker 2: her why she would stand by her notorious father, let 37 00:02:28,761 --> 00:02:32,201 Speaker 2: alone do it in public as she proposed. That was 38 00:02:32,240 --> 00:02:35,680 Speaker 2: an important reason for doing this interview, to acknowledge her 39 00:02:35,800 --> 00:02:38,361 Speaker 2: courage and try to make the authorities act on the 40 00:02:38,401 --> 00:02:43,280 Speaker 2: information her father is sharing before he dies. I agreed 41 00:02:43,321 --> 00:02:47,000 Speaker 2: to speak to Peter Atos on that basis, but this 42 00:02:47,041 --> 00:02:50,681 Speaker 2: one act of redemption does not, and cannot ever excuse 43 00:02:50,721 --> 00:02:54,441 Speaker 2: the depray of acts he committed against his victims. There's 44 00:02:54,520 --> 00:02:55,761 Speaker 2: no coming back from that. 45 00:02:58,401 --> 00:03:00,641 Speaker 3: Let's just stop by identifying yourself. Could you tell me 46 00:03:00,680 --> 00:03:02,840 Speaker 3: what your name is and what your history is? 47 00:03:02,921 --> 00:03:08,201 Speaker 1: Peter, Oh, Peter Aidos got charged by the media. 48 00:03:08,401 --> 00:03:12,201 Speaker 6: I'm the silver gun rapist. They charged me with a 49 00:03:12,281 --> 00:03:12,961 Speaker 6: variety of. 50 00:03:13,001 --> 00:03:17,401 Speaker 1: Different charges concerning rape and assault, and about a dozen 51 00:03:17,481 --> 00:03:20,001 Speaker 1: or something or whatever it is, right, it's on me raptured. 52 00:03:20,001 --> 00:03:21,120 Speaker 6: I can't remember everything. 53 00:03:21,841 --> 00:03:26,001 Speaker 5: My name is Stacy Fatos. It's not my legal last name, 54 00:03:26,041 --> 00:03:28,241 Speaker 5: but it's what I'm using for the purposes of this. 55 00:03:29,081 --> 00:03:29,240 Speaker 1: Yeah. 56 00:03:29,321 --> 00:03:31,921 Speaker 5: I'm a thirty six year old and this is my dad, 57 00:03:31,960 --> 00:03:35,161 Speaker 5: and I met him as an adult at twenty seven, 58 00:03:35,201 --> 00:03:37,961 Speaker 5: and we've been in touch over the years since then. 59 00:03:39,241 --> 00:03:41,601 Speaker 4: Why did you seek him out? What did you know 60 00:03:41,681 --> 00:03:43,161 Speaker 4: of his story before you did that. 61 00:03:44,001 --> 00:03:46,801 Speaker 5: I found out when I was about fourteen or fifteen 62 00:03:46,841 --> 00:03:50,241 Speaker 5: that he was my father, and my mum had been 63 00:03:50,281 --> 00:03:52,961 Speaker 5: one of the women that testified against him because he 64 00:03:53,041 --> 00:03:56,081 Speaker 5: had several girlfriends she was a girlfriend, had no idea 65 00:03:56,721 --> 00:04:02,321 Speaker 5: what he was doing, and because of Mum's role in that, 66 00:04:02,441 --> 00:04:05,401 Speaker 5: I never had anything to do with my dad growing up, 67 00:04:06,241 --> 00:04:09,521 Speaker 5: and I needed to meet him. I used to look 68 00:04:09,561 --> 00:04:13,321 Speaker 5: in the mirror and judge myself, and meeting him at 69 00:04:13,321 --> 00:04:14,601 Speaker 5: the end of the day was the best thing I 70 00:04:14,601 --> 00:04:17,241 Speaker 5: ever did for myself, because no one is all the 71 00:04:17,241 --> 00:04:20,681 Speaker 5: way through evil, I think, and I could see things 72 00:04:20,721 --> 00:04:24,241 Speaker 5: that made me feel better about myself, if that makes sense. 73 00:04:25,241 --> 00:04:26,161 Speaker 6: Yeah, you see. 74 00:04:26,161 --> 00:04:28,161 Speaker 4: I'm also very conscious of you, Stacy. 75 00:04:28,681 --> 00:04:31,281 Speaker 3: You're an innocent party in all of this, and you're 76 00:04:31,361 --> 00:04:35,681 Speaker 3: very brave to have this conversation in my opinion, okay, 77 00:04:35,880 --> 00:04:38,081 Speaker 3: because she is the one that made me come and 78 00:04:38,161 --> 00:04:41,121 Speaker 3: I understand, and she's doing this. There's something in your 79 00:04:41,161 --> 00:04:45,121 Speaker 3: relationship that needs to be dealt with, obviously, and you've 80 00:04:45,161 --> 00:04:48,001 Speaker 3: been going through a process I'd understand, is that right? 81 00:04:48,641 --> 00:04:52,241 Speaker 3: And you stuck by your dad and many others wouldn't. 82 00:04:52,401 --> 00:04:55,801 Speaker 1: Ryan and mirror for the first twelve months, and then 83 00:04:55,801 --> 00:04:57,681 Speaker 1: I got her in a relationship when she found me 84 00:04:57,721 --> 00:05:01,721 Speaker 1: at twenty seven, you found your dad, right, They tried 85 00:05:01,721 --> 00:05:02,401 Speaker 1: and good day. 86 00:05:02,320 --> 00:05:04,880 Speaker 5: I did that. My mum said, who had testified against 87 00:05:05,161 --> 00:05:07,761 Speaker 5: try to do shit. I'm never talking to you again. 88 00:05:08,361 --> 00:05:10,801 Speaker 5: So if that hadn't happened, maybe I wouldn't have had 89 00:05:10,801 --> 00:05:14,081 Speaker 5: this great relationship with my dad. But because that happened, 90 00:05:14,681 --> 00:05:16,641 Speaker 5: I did have a relationship with him, and I got 91 00:05:16,721 --> 00:05:19,520 Speaker 5: to learn that he's not all bad and he's a 92 00:05:19,521 --> 00:05:22,801 Speaker 5: good dad, and there's more to him than just his 93 00:05:22,961 --> 00:05:23,561 Speaker 5: rap sheet. 94 00:05:25,081 --> 00:05:28,080 Speaker 2: Vetos's rap sheet shows he was convicted of ten counts 95 00:05:28,121 --> 00:05:31,601 Speaker 2: of rape and many burglaries, but some police believe he 96 00:05:31,641 --> 00:05:35,520 Speaker 2: committed many more sexual assaults, citing a boast he made 97 00:05:35,561 --> 00:05:38,561 Speaker 2: to one victim that she was number twenty one. 98 00:05:39,361 --> 00:05:42,801 Speaker 3: Can I ask one really important question? Are you confident 99 00:05:43,801 --> 00:05:45,601 Speaker 3: that his rap sheet covers everything? 100 00:05:47,401 --> 00:05:49,481 Speaker 5: I have asked him the same question. 101 00:05:51,521 --> 00:05:52,561 Speaker 6: My shory hadn't changed. 102 00:05:54,081 --> 00:05:56,961 Speaker 5: He's asking, is your rap sheet. 103 00:05:56,761 --> 00:05:59,561 Speaker 6: For like complete my rap sheet? 104 00:05:59,721 --> 00:05:59,921 Speaker 1: Yeah? 105 00:06:00,081 --> 00:06:01,241 Speaker 6: Oh you got me rap sheet? 106 00:06:01,601 --> 00:06:02,520 Speaker 5: Yeah no, but it. 107 00:06:02,921 --> 00:06:08,001 Speaker 3: Is everything that you did on that rap sheet, on 108 00:06:08,761 --> 00:06:10,921 Speaker 3: the one that that charged me with. No, but everything 109 00:06:10,921 --> 00:06:14,601 Speaker 3: you've done nothing since I got out that I have 110 00:06:14,921 --> 00:06:17,520 Speaker 3: ever done for them to quer him on. 111 00:06:18,561 --> 00:06:21,401 Speaker 5: He's pointing out to you, if you've got any secrets 112 00:06:21,481 --> 00:06:24,801 Speaker 5: in your closet pre nineteen seventy nine, they might come 113 00:06:24,841 --> 00:06:25,561 Speaker 5: out from. 114 00:06:25,361 --> 00:06:27,880 Speaker 6: This if I've got something. 115 00:06:29,681 --> 00:06:33,081 Speaker 5: I've asked him and he said he's been concerned about 116 00:06:33,121 --> 00:06:34,241 Speaker 5: you and that nothing's. 117 00:06:33,961 --> 00:06:36,001 Speaker 3: Going to be I wasn't concerned about you, Stacy, because 118 00:06:36,041 --> 00:06:39,801 Speaker 3: you're the innocent party in all of this, and you've 119 00:06:39,841 --> 00:06:42,320 Speaker 3: formed a relationship with your dad based on his honesty 120 00:06:42,361 --> 00:06:46,281 Speaker 3: with you and transparency, you see. So I know this 121 00:06:46,320 --> 00:06:49,440 Speaker 3: is difficult for you, both of you. So I just 122 00:06:49,481 --> 00:06:50,241 Speaker 3: want to be clear. 123 00:06:50,681 --> 00:06:52,601 Speaker 5: I feel like I have to because I feel that 124 00:06:53,361 --> 00:06:56,321 Speaker 5: him having a daughter adds legitimacy to him somehow. And 125 00:06:56,521 --> 00:07:00,121 Speaker 5: it's the fact that I ran grimestoppers twice. I rang 126 00:07:00,161 --> 00:07:01,601 Speaker 5: them the first time, and I rang them back a 127 00:07:01,641 --> 00:07:04,320 Speaker 5: couple of weeks later and said, you haven't even scooped 128 00:07:04,401 --> 00:07:06,681 Speaker 5: him up and talked, and what the hell? 129 00:07:08,281 --> 00:07:08,441 Speaker 1: Hm? 130 00:07:09,521 --> 00:07:11,241 Speaker 4: Did you have a chance to ask him about all 131 00:07:11,281 --> 00:07:14,081 Speaker 4: the things that he did? Yes, I was that conversation. 132 00:07:14,281 --> 00:07:19,201 Speaker 5: He's always been honest with me about that, really honest. 133 00:07:20,921 --> 00:07:24,361 Speaker 2: When Vetos was released in nineteen ninety six, his critics 134 00:07:24,361 --> 00:07:27,361 Speaker 2: believed it was only a matter of time before he reoffended. 135 00:07:28,281 --> 00:07:31,161 Speaker 2: In an article in The Age newspaper titled can Evil 136 00:07:31,241 --> 00:07:34,841 Speaker 2: release its script on a Man? Wetos was described as 137 00:07:34,841 --> 00:07:39,441 Speaker 2: a calculating coward and evil personified. Give him six months 138 00:07:39,521 --> 00:07:40,961 Speaker 2: to a year, he'd be. 139 00:07:40,961 --> 00:07:41,681 Speaker 4: Back in jail. 140 00:07:42,681 --> 00:07:47,801 Speaker 2: However, three decades on, Wetos has not reoffended. He presents 141 00:07:47,881 --> 00:07:53,041 Speaker 2: himself as a rare successful example of rehabilitation behind bars. 142 00:07:53,761 --> 00:07:56,961 Speaker 1: Oh well, I'm sure that because i'd done the sex offender. 143 00:07:57,001 --> 00:08:00,321 Speaker 1: Of course, it was six weeks, six weeks, and I said, 144 00:08:00,561 --> 00:08:03,081 Speaker 1: I think to the psychologist he's John Bestow. 145 00:08:04,401 --> 00:08:07,161 Speaker 6: I said, team him that I'm not a pedophile. 146 00:08:08,161 --> 00:08:10,641 Speaker 1: He said, only I asked that same question about in 147 00:08:10,721 --> 00:08:13,161 Speaker 1: two weeks time of a six weeks cause because they 148 00:08:13,161 --> 00:08:15,801 Speaker 1: reckon I was too good to be true, so I'm 149 00:08:15,881 --> 00:08:20,121 Speaker 1: right to life. And I made a clear in the 150 00:08:20,601 --> 00:08:23,481 Speaker 1: sex depend of course we had to go back. And 151 00:08:23,521 --> 00:08:25,961 Speaker 1: he says, well, I'll ask you that question. He says, 152 00:08:26,361 --> 00:08:28,481 Speaker 1: to see if I was only pulling their legal or whatever. 153 00:08:28,561 --> 00:08:28,761 Speaker 6: You know. 154 00:08:29,281 --> 00:08:32,241 Speaker 1: But because what happened is when I got in there 155 00:08:32,281 --> 00:08:34,761 Speaker 1: and I got my sentence, I was dirty on that. 156 00:08:34,841 --> 00:08:39,201 Speaker 1: And then I realized I was psychoanalyzing myself to find 157 00:08:39,241 --> 00:08:43,921 Speaker 1: out why I'm in jail. And I found out I 158 00:08:43,961 --> 00:08:45,161 Speaker 1: couldn't blame anyone. 159 00:08:45,881 --> 00:08:47,961 Speaker 6: I was the problem, right. 160 00:08:48,041 --> 00:08:51,801 Speaker 1: I kept them coming back to me. Right, So I'd 161 00:08:51,801 --> 00:08:54,401 Speaker 1: done the cause. Well, it was true to his word. 162 00:08:54,441 --> 00:08:57,361 Speaker 1: He asked me two weeks later, and I had the answer. 163 00:08:57,481 --> 00:09:00,121 Speaker 1: He says, what's the difference. I said to him, there's 164 00:09:00,121 --> 00:09:04,681 Speaker 1: no difference. The only difference is that we're all rapists. 165 00:09:04,761 --> 00:09:08,001 Speaker 6: But the only thing that's differing is the target range. 166 00:09:08,681 --> 00:09:11,761 Speaker 1: Did you have something likes old middle age or we 167 00:09:11,801 --> 00:09:15,041 Speaker 1: were very young or in between? You know, I'm in 168 00:09:15,081 --> 00:09:18,881 Speaker 1: sort of. That's the anything different. We're all rapists. That 169 00:09:18,961 --> 00:09:21,041 Speaker 1: was the right answer for so were telling me. If 170 00:09:21,041 --> 00:09:22,961 Speaker 1: I didn't come up with that, I wasn't tuned in. 171 00:09:23,601 --> 00:09:25,761 Speaker 1: But I was tuned in two weeks after I've done 172 00:09:25,841 --> 00:09:26,161 Speaker 1: the course. 173 00:09:26,961 --> 00:09:30,361 Speaker 3: So you just said that you had to tell them 174 00:09:30,481 --> 00:09:33,721 Speaker 3: why you're in jail. You have to understand why you 175 00:09:33,881 --> 00:09:36,521 Speaker 3: in jail. Well, why did this whole thing happen? 176 00:09:36,961 --> 00:09:39,161 Speaker 6: Oh? How it happened is I got married. 177 00:09:39,161 --> 00:09:41,801 Speaker 1: I always wanted to caught a ac pick at fence, 178 00:09:42,521 --> 00:09:44,681 Speaker 1: and I thought, oh, yeah, well I got a nerd 179 00:09:44,721 --> 00:09:48,521 Speaker 1: for a wife, right, A nerd. A nerd is just a. 180 00:09:48,521 --> 00:09:51,441 Speaker 6: Normal girl of old fashion, very old fashion. Because her 181 00:09:51,521 --> 00:09:53,321 Speaker 6: name was Brown, right. 182 00:09:54,001 --> 00:09:58,001 Speaker 1: And then what happened was her father was committing violence 183 00:09:58,041 --> 00:09:59,801 Speaker 1: on her mother, and he was a drunk. He was 184 00:09:59,841 --> 00:10:02,201 Speaker 1: always getting drunk, and he wasn't given enough to run 185 00:10:02,241 --> 00:10:04,801 Speaker 1: the house. And the mother was working. That's how I 186 00:10:04,801 --> 00:10:07,601 Speaker 1: met a. She was working at the same if I 187 00:10:07,681 --> 00:10:10,921 Speaker 1: Rest Springs where I started working, right, I was working there. 188 00:10:11,121 --> 00:10:12,121 Speaker 6: That's how I met the daughter. 189 00:10:12,561 --> 00:10:16,281 Speaker 1: And then what happened was she tried to groom me 190 00:10:16,681 --> 00:10:18,401 Speaker 1: into to be the perfect man. 191 00:10:19,081 --> 00:10:21,401 Speaker 2: Ve Tasa's first wife was Shirley. 192 00:10:21,561 --> 00:10:24,161 Speaker 1: And then when she was pregnant with Paul and shed 193 00:10:24,201 --> 00:10:28,521 Speaker 1: by my son, she had him, she kept on trying, 194 00:10:28,561 --> 00:10:31,601 Speaker 1: I was no good and this and that, you know everything, 195 00:10:31,641 --> 00:10:33,081 Speaker 1: and she was going to threaten me she's going to 196 00:10:33,121 --> 00:10:37,201 Speaker 1: have abortion, and I said to her, over my dead body. 197 00:10:37,481 --> 00:10:39,241 Speaker 1: Well she never carried it out, but a thought in 198 00:10:39,361 --> 00:10:43,761 Speaker 1: my head was there. But then I got into another relationship. 199 00:10:44,601 --> 00:10:48,001 Speaker 1: She was a school teacher and she got pregnant. 200 00:10:48,921 --> 00:10:49,561 Speaker 6: And then when I. 201 00:10:49,481 --> 00:10:52,681 Speaker 1: Told her, well, when I come back, we'll talk about it. 202 00:10:52,761 --> 00:10:56,561 Speaker 1: But then she was determined she wanted the career. When 203 00:10:56,561 --> 00:10:58,961 Speaker 1: I come back to talk about it, she says, she's 204 00:10:59,001 --> 00:11:01,881 Speaker 1: already done it. And I said to her, horses yes, 205 00:11:02,481 --> 00:11:05,721 Speaker 1: and then it's all come out into that set vanished. Course, 206 00:11:05,801 --> 00:11:08,481 Speaker 1: right when I was talking and I'm right alive, you know, 207 00:11:08,681 --> 00:11:11,681 Speaker 1: like that blew my brain, you know what I mean? 208 00:11:11,761 --> 00:11:15,281 Speaker 1: And I said, didn't I have a say? She says 209 00:11:16,121 --> 00:11:19,481 Speaker 1: it was her body. I thought I got it in 210 00:11:19,481 --> 00:11:21,921 Speaker 1: my head all women were the same. And then I 211 00:11:22,081 --> 00:11:23,681 Speaker 1: just went on the rampach. You know what I mean, 212 00:11:23,721 --> 00:11:24,041 Speaker 1: don't you? 213 00:11:24,641 --> 00:11:27,641 Speaker 3: So you you took it out on other women. 214 00:11:28,201 --> 00:11:29,761 Speaker 4: You took out your anger. 215 00:11:29,761 --> 00:11:34,721 Speaker 1: On people that never done or think to me, stupid, 216 00:11:34,801 --> 00:11:37,001 Speaker 1: because that's how it works. You never hurt the one 217 00:11:37,001 --> 00:11:38,601 Speaker 1: that you love or you're with, or you know, when 218 00:11:38,601 --> 00:11:40,801 Speaker 1: you got a tour with someone else, innocent victory. 219 00:11:40,881 --> 00:11:44,121 Speaker 5: Most sex offenders pray on their own children, their own grandchildren, 220 00:11:44,201 --> 00:11:48,681 Speaker 5: their niece, their nephew, whatever, a stranger on stranger sex attackers, 221 00:11:48,681 --> 00:11:54,081 Speaker 5: you're probably aware as much more uncommon. And yeah, that's 222 00:11:54,121 --> 00:11:57,441 Speaker 5: like as far as being a dad who's been a 223 00:11:57,441 --> 00:12:01,921 Speaker 5: good dud to me or over the years and in 224 00:12:01,961 --> 00:12:04,601 Speaker 5: the seventies there was a lot of women feeling in 225 00:12:04,681 --> 00:12:07,281 Speaker 5: power for the first time. That was all the women's 226 00:12:07,321 --> 00:12:09,921 Speaker 5: lib stuff. And I think that it's just a very 227 00:12:09,961 --> 00:12:10,681 Speaker 5: sad story. 228 00:12:10,761 --> 00:12:14,961 Speaker 4: Really, the whole thing is sad. I get sad for you. 229 00:12:15,881 --> 00:12:18,601 Speaker 4: I think it's sad for the women that you write 230 00:12:19,761 --> 00:12:20,121 Speaker 4: it wasn't. 231 00:12:20,161 --> 00:12:23,881 Speaker 1: Therefore, that's why I was saying before I went and 232 00:12:23,881 --> 00:12:25,721 Speaker 1: done to the court, and I was telling me, you're 233 00:12:25,761 --> 00:12:26,641 Speaker 1: too good to be true. 234 00:12:26,681 --> 00:12:27,401 Speaker 6: I had the right. 235 00:12:27,281 --> 00:12:30,121 Speaker 1: Answer because I was saying, there was a psycho analys 236 00:12:30,161 --> 00:12:33,161 Speaker 1: and I said, the problem was me, not anyone else. 237 00:12:33,241 --> 00:12:34,281 Speaker 6: I was hurting victims. 238 00:12:34,361 --> 00:12:35,441 Speaker 4: How did it start though? 239 00:12:35,641 --> 00:12:37,601 Speaker 3: What was the what was the world where you decided 240 00:12:37,641 --> 00:12:39,161 Speaker 3: this was going to be what you were going to do? 241 00:12:39,201 --> 00:12:40,681 Speaker 6: Well, what happened was this? 242 00:12:41,761 --> 00:12:44,321 Speaker 1: It just happened that I got into a place and 243 00:12:44,361 --> 00:12:48,641 Speaker 1: I was robbing, and there was a female in the house, 244 00:12:48,721 --> 00:12:50,161 Speaker 1: and she said, I don't hurt me. You can do 245 00:12:50,161 --> 00:12:52,961 Speaker 1: anything you like. She put the thought in your head. 246 00:12:53,081 --> 00:12:53,561 Speaker 6: You know what I mean. 247 00:12:55,601 --> 00:12:57,521 Speaker 4: These are conversations I presuning you've had with you. 248 00:12:57,761 --> 00:13:00,921 Speaker 5: Yeah, I've heard it, but I don't feel this is 249 00:13:00,961 --> 00:13:01,841 Speaker 5: related to ton. 250 00:13:02,441 --> 00:13:04,601 Speaker 4: Yeah we're going to get there, but I know you're 251 00:13:04,641 --> 00:13:04,801 Speaker 4: doing it. 252 00:13:05,281 --> 00:13:09,841 Speaker 7: Understand offending, but that's what it was, right, And I'm 253 00:13:09,841 --> 00:13:12,281 Speaker 7: all less, said, well, you know they can participate and 254 00:13:12,281 --> 00:13:16,001 Speaker 7: I'll just sit there, I watch, and. 255 00:13:15,881 --> 00:13:16,681 Speaker 6: Now I left. 256 00:13:17,441 --> 00:13:19,881 Speaker 1: That's how I knew there was another person running around 257 00:13:19,921 --> 00:13:20,681 Speaker 1: with a shotgun. 258 00:13:21,161 --> 00:13:24,201 Speaker 4: Right, So you're saying that all the offenses that were linked. 259 00:13:23,921 --> 00:13:26,681 Speaker 6: To you, well go all of them you did. 260 00:13:27,641 --> 00:13:30,201 Speaker 4: Yes, I would have said you did a lot more 261 00:13:30,321 --> 00:13:31,321 Speaker 4: than you were charged with. 262 00:13:31,801 --> 00:13:33,441 Speaker 6: No, no, no, that was burglaries. 263 00:13:33,921 --> 00:13:34,681 Speaker 4: Just burglaries. 264 00:13:34,761 --> 00:13:35,441 Speaker 6: Yeah, burglary. 265 00:13:35,521 --> 00:13:36,201 Speaker 4: He did a lot more. 266 00:13:36,081 --> 00:13:38,801 Speaker 6: Bur and they dropped it down to thirty one thirty two. 267 00:13:38,841 --> 00:13:41,641 Speaker 1: I says, no, I'm not was receiving with something else, 268 00:13:41,761 --> 00:13:44,921 Speaker 1: and I was receiving. And I've got two years each 269 00:13:44,961 --> 00:13:46,881 Speaker 1: one and a year for the other one because I 270 00:13:46,921 --> 00:13:49,281 Speaker 1: told him I was going to get it hurt alls singlely. 271 00:13:50,161 --> 00:13:50,241 Speaker 6: Ye. 272 00:13:50,801 --> 00:13:53,401 Speaker 4: So how many rates were you charged with? Peter? 273 00:13:54,241 --> 00:13:57,041 Speaker 6: I got it on that poon, that form. It's all there, 274 00:13:57,161 --> 00:13:58,321 Speaker 6: everything in there, I've ea charge. 275 00:13:58,361 --> 00:14:01,241 Speaker 1: They can't charge me with anything else because I'm clean. 276 00:14:01,401 --> 00:14:02,121 Speaker 6: I understand that. 277 00:14:02,281 --> 00:14:05,641 Speaker 1: Until now they didn't carry on. I didn't come back 278 00:14:05,681 --> 00:14:09,241 Speaker 1: to Rude who sent a card, because I sent a 279 00:14:09,561 --> 00:14:10,321 Speaker 1: Christmas card to the. 280 00:14:10,321 --> 00:14:12,801 Speaker 4: Mother for we'll get there. I want to finish with 281 00:14:13,401 --> 00:14:15,001 Speaker 4: your issues. So that's want of work out. 282 00:14:15,521 --> 00:14:17,721 Speaker 1: They got me for all the one because all mine. 283 00:14:17,641 --> 00:14:19,481 Speaker 6: Was you need with a firearm? 284 00:14:20,081 --> 00:14:22,601 Speaker 3: How did the silver gun come into your offending? Because 285 00:14:22,761 --> 00:14:23,841 Speaker 3: that's what you were known as. 286 00:14:24,041 --> 00:14:27,281 Speaker 6: I had found it you've hit a house. Yeah, I 287 00:14:27,321 --> 00:14:31,001 Speaker 6: was robbing a house, But what sort of gun was it? 288 00:14:31,641 --> 00:14:35,681 Speaker 1: Young American ear Little twenty two. 289 00:14:35,281 --> 00:14:38,041 Speaker 5: Buy in large. As far as the media has been concerned, 290 00:14:38,441 --> 00:14:41,121 Speaker 5: my dad's been flying under the Raidar'm mostly forgotten for 291 00:14:41,161 --> 00:14:45,001 Speaker 5: the last thirty years. As you're probably aware now, Adrian 292 00:14:45,041 --> 00:14:48,481 Speaker 5: Patterson did a story about him last year that was 293 00:14:48,521 --> 00:14:52,401 Speaker 5: not factual, said that he arrested him and he found 294 00:14:52,481 --> 00:14:54,921 Speaker 5: him through a nineteen eighty seven car, and I'm like, well, 295 00:14:54,921 --> 00:14:56,641 Speaker 5: how can he do that? When he was arrested in 296 00:14:56,681 --> 00:15:00,241 Speaker 5: seventy nine, I was in job. 297 00:15:00,161 --> 00:15:01,761 Speaker 4: This was the detective. 298 00:15:02,121 --> 00:15:06,561 Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, the podcast, So. 299 00:15:06,841 --> 00:15:10,681 Speaker 5: Why would he risked that being under the radar? Right, 300 00:15:10,841 --> 00:15:13,201 Speaker 5: no one really has ever known who my father is. 301 00:15:13,641 --> 00:15:16,921 Speaker 5: I'm coming out for this because I think it's too important. 302 00:15:17,241 --> 00:15:20,001 Speaker 5: Why we've got stuff to lose? Why would we do 303 00:15:20,041 --> 00:15:21,201 Speaker 5: this if we didn't believe it. 304 00:15:21,921 --> 00:15:24,201 Speaker 4: I'm interested in your motives, Frankly. 305 00:15:24,161 --> 00:15:26,201 Speaker 5: Yeah, I mean I'm a mom and a woman. 306 00:15:26,481 --> 00:15:29,361 Speaker 3: Yes, your dad's done what he's done, and he's paid 307 00:15:29,361 --> 00:15:31,481 Speaker 3: his debt to society. I mean, I think there are 308 00:15:31,521 --> 00:15:33,041 Speaker 3: people who suspect you did. 309 00:15:32,961 --> 00:15:35,601 Speaker 6: More though no, no, they're all firearms more. 310 00:15:35,801 --> 00:15:37,801 Speaker 5: I know who did more and it wasn't my dad. 311 00:15:38,401 --> 00:15:42,001 Speaker 6: No, that's fine. They never dropped anything that they tried 312 00:15:42,001 --> 00:15:42,321 Speaker 6: to believe. 313 00:15:43,401 --> 00:15:46,241 Speaker 4: You didn't stop at one or two. You did know 314 00:15:46,481 --> 00:15:48,681 Speaker 4: that you do well. 315 00:15:48,721 --> 00:15:49,441 Speaker 6: Watch on the thing. 316 00:15:49,961 --> 00:15:51,961 Speaker 4: I think there was no charge with ten. You were 317 00:15:52,041 --> 00:15:52,641 Speaker 4: charged with ten. 318 00:15:52,721 --> 00:15:55,681 Speaker 6: I believe all actually were all on there. They charged me. 319 00:15:55,761 --> 00:15:57,121 Speaker 4: People believe he did sixteen. 320 00:15:57,801 --> 00:16:01,161 Speaker 1: No know who charged him sixteen, okay, but people believe 321 00:16:01,241 --> 00:16:02,081 Speaker 1: that you did success. 322 00:16:02,081 --> 00:16:04,721 Speaker 5: There's a lot of misinformation. I've read things that have 323 00:16:04,801 --> 00:16:08,081 Speaker 5: said seventeen sixteen. I've read constantly that he has a 324 00:16:08,081 --> 00:16:10,561 Speaker 5: middle name John, and it's just not true. But for 325 00:16:10,601 --> 00:16:13,721 Speaker 5: some reason, everyone always causing Peter John. He doesn't have 326 00:16:13,761 --> 00:16:14,281 Speaker 5: a middle name. 327 00:16:14,361 --> 00:16:17,601 Speaker 3: So many factual things. But this is something that you've 328 00:16:17,601 --> 00:16:20,681 Speaker 3: already dealt with between each other. Okay, tell me, how 329 00:16:20,721 --> 00:16:23,041 Speaker 3: did you broach this conversation? Surely you'd want to know. 330 00:16:23,841 --> 00:16:27,081 Speaker 3: You want to trust your dad. You're establishing a relationship 331 00:16:27,081 --> 00:16:30,881 Speaker 3: with him at age twenty seven. Did you say to him, Dad, 332 00:16:30,921 --> 00:16:32,121 Speaker 3: you've got to be honest with me. 333 00:16:32,841 --> 00:16:33,761 Speaker 6: I have that happened? 334 00:16:34,361 --> 00:16:36,761 Speaker 5: Yeah? Well, I didn't know anything about him except for 335 00:16:36,801 --> 00:16:39,721 Speaker 5: what i'd heard from others or read in the media, 336 00:16:40,401 --> 00:16:45,041 Speaker 5: and I decided that, yeah, I needed to know him myself. 337 00:16:45,121 --> 00:16:48,681 Speaker 5: I couldn't remember him. And when I did actually meet him, 338 00:16:48,721 --> 00:16:51,201 Speaker 5: I realized that the first trauma in my life was 339 00:16:51,281 --> 00:16:53,921 Speaker 5: my dad getting taken away when I was an infant. 340 00:16:54,281 --> 00:16:58,521 Speaker 5: And I don't think anybody explained it to me, and 341 00:16:59,881 --> 00:17:04,120 Speaker 5: it was I had a stepdad that I believed was 342 00:17:04,121 --> 00:17:10,600 Speaker 5: my real dad for some time that passed away. And yeah, 343 00:17:10,681 --> 00:17:14,640 Speaker 5: I didn't expect really to have a lasting relationship with 344 00:17:14,681 --> 00:17:16,161 Speaker 5: my dad when I met him. 345 00:17:17,160 --> 00:17:19,521 Speaker 4: What was the purpose of it? Do you you saw it? 346 00:17:19,521 --> 00:17:20,761 Speaker 4: How did you find him? By the way? 347 00:17:21,001 --> 00:17:23,161 Speaker 5: I you utilized an investigator? 348 00:17:23,481 --> 00:17:24,641 Speaker 4: And how long did it take? 349 00:17:25,360 --> 00:17:26,041 Speaker 5: Not long at all? 350 00:17:26,360 --> 00:17:28,801 Speaker 4: So how did that come about for you? Peter? You 351 00:17:28,840 --> 00:17:30,641 Speaker 4: were contacted by the investigator? 352 00:17:31,041 --> 00:17:34,961 Speaker 5: No, I rocked up at his house when I rocked 353 00:17:35,001 --> 00:17:37,241 Speaker 5: up at your house the first time, and I said 354 00:17:37,281 --> 00:17:40,480 Speaker 5: to you, Peter, yeah, he thought I was a police officer. 355 00:17:41,400 --> 00:17:44,441 Speaker 1: I know who she is. She call me right, And 356 00:17:44,761 --> 00:17:46,321 Speaker 1: I said yeah, She said, what did you want me 357 00:17:46,360 --> 00:17:49,881 Speaker 1: to call you? I said, God, I'm your fucking dad, right, 358 00:17:49,921 --> 00:17:51,281 Speaker 1: I acknowledge is straight away. 359 00:17:51,880 --> 00:17:53,281 Speaker 4: How many children do you have? 360 00:17:54,080 --> 00:17:54,160 Speaker 1: Me? 361 00:17:56,321 --> 00:17:56,841 Speaker 6: Throw it there? 362 00:17:57,441 --> 00:17:59,521 Speaker 4: And how many of them speak to you? 363 00:18:00,441 --> 00:18:01,600 Speaker 6: The other two. You are to shamed. 364 00:18:02,241 --> 00:18:06,521 Speaker 3: So how important was it to you when Stacy knocked. 365 00:18:06,281 --> 00:18:06,881 Speaker 4: On your door? 366 00:18:07,921 --> 00:18:10,361 Speaker 6: She's the love on your life, and of. 367 00:18:10,321 --> 00:18:14,400 Speaker 4: Course we're honest with people that we love. And have 368 00:18:14,521 --> 00:18:15,681 Speaker 4: you been honest with her? 369 00:18:15,921 --> 00:18:16,880 Speaker 6: Yeah? The all the time. 370 00:18:17,880 --> 00:18:19,160 Speaker 4: Do you think he's been honest with you? 371 00:18:20,080 --> 00:18:23,321 Speaker 5: I cannot think why he wouldn't be. I don't know 372 00:18:23,400 --> 00:18:28,361 Speaker 5: why he would fuck with me when I'm his only family. 373 00:18:28,441 --> 00:18:30,441 Speaker 5: I'm the only child that talks to him. I don't 374 00:18:30,441 --> 00:18:33,321 Speaker 5: think he's spending the end of his life messing with 375 00:18:33,360 --> 00:18:36,321 Speaker 5: me for shits and giggles. I think it's real, and 376 00:18:37,001 --> 00:18:40,001 Speaker 5: I have concerns and until someone can come up to 377 00:18:40,001 --> 00:18:44,041 Speaker 5: me and say, Stacy, I need to explain to me. 378 00:18:44,360 --> 00:18:47,121 Speaker 5: And I think there's something there. I think that it's 379 00:18:47,160 --> 00:18:50,801 Speaker 5: worth others hearing. I think that there's something in it, 380 00:18:51,041 --> 00:18:52,080 Speaker 5: and that's bigger than him. 381 00:18:52,681 --> 00:18:55,961 Speaker 4: You live the double life. You live the life of deception. 382 00:18:57,481 --> 00:18:58,401 Speaker 4: You see everybody. 383 00:18:58,441 --> 00:19:01,561 Speaker 3: You're having false names, you're having girlfriends on the side, 384 00:19:01,600 --> 00:19:04,840 Speaker 3: you're having all these Tell me, how do you reflect 385 00:19:05,441 --> 00:19:08,680 Speaker 3: on your level of honesty with the people that were important. 386 00:19:08,120 --> 00:19:09,360 Speaker 4: To you before. 387 00:19:11,241 --> 00:19:12,201 Speaker 6: A good bad boy? 388 00:19:13,321 --> 00:19:21,201 Speaker 1: I say I had girl friends, not girl friend saying 389 00:19:21,241 --> 00:19:22,241 Speaker 1: when I broke off. 390 00:19:22,241 --> 00:19:25,400 Speaker 3: I just wanted to get back to this issue of trust, okay, 391 00:19:25,441 --> 00:19:30,760 Speaker 3: because Stacy's taken a substantial risk in her life to 392 00:19:30,840 --> 00:19:31,321 Speaker 3: trust you. 393 00:19:31,761 --> 00:19:34,041 Speaker 4: Yeah, you can't deceive her. 394 00:19:34,640 --> 00:19:37,120 Speaker 6: I'm not deceiving her, or you can't know I'm muilty 395 00:19:37,160 --> 00:19:38,441 Speaker 6: as shell. Well what do I've done? 396 00:19:40,001 --> 00:19:43,761 Speaker 3: What do you say to the women that you raped? 397 00:19:44,041 --> 00:19:44,721 Speaker 4: The victims? 398 00:19:45,080 --> 00:19:46,801 Speaker 6: Well, I'm can I explain it? 399 00:19:48,120 --> 00:19:51,880 Speaker 1: I'm so shi like you know that I've devastated them 400 00:19:52,360 --> 00:19:56,521 Speaker 1: because I wasn't in me right mind at a time, 401 00:19:56,600 --> 00:19:59,521 Speaker 1: because I blamed. I got it in my head that 402 00:19:59,561 --> 00:20:02,600 Speaker 1: they were all the same, whether or not or women. 403 00:20:02,640 --> 00:20:06,761 Speaker 1: I've never met a woman that had the same personality 404 00:20:06,961 --> 00:20:07,400 Speaker 1: or anything. 405 00:20:07,681 --> 00:20:08,161 Speaker 6: They're all. 406 00:20:09,441 --> 00:20:12,241 Speaker 1: They've got perfection, they've got their own individuality. 407 00:20:12,400 --> 00:20:13,041 Speaker 6: All women. 408 00:20:13,640 --> 00:20:15,761 Speaker 1: They're not what you called but I put them on 409 00:20:16,321 --> 00:20:19,041 Speaker 1: They're all the same. I couldn't put it, really do 410 00:20:19,160 --> 00:20:22,440 Speaker 1: words what the drama I've put the victims in? But 411 00:20:22,521 --> 00:20:24,480 Speaker 1: I know it was my fault. You know, I just 412 00:20:24,521 --> 00:20:26,160 Speaker 1: kept on coming. That's why I've done the course to 413 00:20:26,241 --> 00:20:29,721 Speaker 1: better myself. And I don't know anger management or don't 414 00:20:29,761 --> 00:20:32,161 Speaker 1: pursuit of excellence because you. 415 00:20:32,080 --> 00:20:35,200 Speaker 3: Were very angry because the thing about those attacks was 416 00:20:35,321 --> 00:20:40,001 Speaker 3: you were angry and terrifying and you threatened to kill them. 417 00:20:40,561 --> 00:20:45,681 Speaker 1: No, No, I never threatened them. That's something I might 418 00:20:45,600 --> 00:20:47,480 Speaker 1: appointed that he's done, and I told them, you're going 419 00:20:47,561 --> 00:20:48,360 Speaker 1: to do what I want. 420 00:20:48,241 --> 00:20:48,641 Speaker 6: You to do. 421 00:20:50,120 --> 00:20:53,961 Speaker 3: So how do you feel about your state of mind 422 00:20:54,080 --> 00:20:56,480 Speaker 3: back then when you were doing these things? 423 00:20:56,721 --> 00:20:57,921 Speaker 4: How do you feel about it now? 424 00:20:58,880 --> 00:21:01,561 Speaker 1: Well, I was terrible for me, like for me to 425 00:21:01,600 --> 00:21:04,120 Speaker 1: do all these things, you know, I mean, like I 426 00:21:04,201 --> 00:21:07,561 Speaker 1: take before his onsibility of all I heard and pain 427 00:21:07,681 --> 00:21:10,961 Speaker 1: or I've done. And it's just not it's not just 428 00:21:11,041 --> 00:21:14,240 Speaker 1: a victim. It's got to do with the whether it's 429 00:21:14,321 --> 00:21:16,321 Speaker 1: a partner and all their family. 430 00:21:16,721 --> 00:21:20,080 Speaker 5: Collateral damage, all the collateral damage. 431 00:21:19,840 --> 00:21:21,241 Speaker 1: And you know I'm part of that. 432 00:21:21,400 --> 00:21:22,401 Speaker 5: Yere aren't their children? 433 00:21:22,880 --> 00:21:23,200 Speaker 6: Everyone? 434 00:21:23,840 --> 00:21:25,920 Speaker 5: My mother was part of that. She was a twenty 435 00:21:25,961 --> 00:21:29,920 Speaker 5: two year old woman that you know, had no idea 436 00:21:30,840 --> 00:21:33,960 Speaker 5: and there's been a lot of collateral damage. 437 00:21:34,681 --> 00:21:39,241 Speaker 3: And you had to cease relations with your mother in 438 00:21:39,400 --> 00:21:41,201 Speaker 3: order to have any relationship with your father. 439 00:21:41,441 --> 00:21:45,001 Speaker 5: Well, look, when I had children, I was back in 440 00:21:45,120 --> 00:21:47,001 Speaker 5: touch with my mom, but I just feel like it 441 00:21:47,201 --> 00:21:50,761 Speaker 5: never went back the same. After that time, I initially 442 00:21:50,840 --> 00:21:56,840 Speaker 5: contacted my dad. She's scared of him, like she's she testified. 443 00:21:58,281 --> 00:21:59,961 Speaker 6: This is really another question you asked. 444 00:22:00,001 --> 00:22:01,880 Speaker 5: I was brought up to be scared of him, and 445 00:22:03,441 --> 00:22:04,721 Speaker 5: I guess that was part of why I had to 446 00:22:04,801 --> 00:22:05,281 Speaker 5: meet him. 447 00:22:05,761 --> 00:22:06,920 Speaker 4: Why are you not scared now? 448 00:22:08,400 --> 00:22:14,801 Speaker 1: Ah, I don't know, because I'm softness butter, and I warned, 449 00:22:15,001 --> 00:22:20,160 Speaker 1: what if she means a person? It's the tour motive. 450 00:22:20,561 --> 00:22:23,640 Speaker 1: And I've been proven right with the things I've said 451 00:22:23,681 --> 00:22:26,001 Speaker 1: to her about what could happen to her? 452 00:22:27,481 --> 00:22:31,041 Speaker 3: Tell me was it became like a big deal in 453 00:22:31,160 --> 00:22:33,680 Speaker 3: the papers these things were going on. How did you 454 00:22:33,761 --> 00:22:36,521 Speaker 3: feel when you read about what you've done? 455 00:22:38,201 --> 00:22:40,120 Speaker 6: Well, there's nothing I can do about it. I just 456 00:22:40,201 --> 00:22:41,521 Speaker 6: had at the time. 457 00:22:41,600 --> 00:22:42,641 Speaker 4: They did give you pleasure. 458 00:22:43,481 --> 00:22:48,521 Speaker 1: No, no, no, no, it didn't because I knew I 459 00:22:48,600 --> 00:22:50,241 Speaker 1: screwed up because I already done the course. 460 00:22:51,321 --> 00:22:52,480 Speaker 6: And I was saying, while you. 461 00:22:52,521 --> 00:22:54,481 Speaker 3: Were doing this, in that period of time where you 462 00:22:54,561 --> 00:22:59,201 Speaker 3: committed ten rapes, this was making the papers, the people 463 00:22:59,241 --> 00:23:00,801 Speaker 3: you were terrorizing Melbourne. 464 00:23:01,241 --> 00:23:04,441 Speaker 5: At that time, everyone in Melbourne was scared. I don't 465 00:23:04,521 --> 00:23:07,840 Speaker 5: remember it, but from people who do, the whole city 466 00:23:07,961 --> 00:23:08,481 Speaker 5: was on edge. 467 00:23:09,001 --> 00:23:11,801 Speaker 4: And how did you feel when you read about the 468 00:23:11,880 --> 00:23:13,321 Speaker 4: way these events were. 469 00:23:13,241 --> 00:23:13,961 Speaker 6: Well, I got bad. 470 00:23:14,360 --> 00:23:16,521 Speaker 1: I felt real bad, you know, I felt bad because 471 00:23:16,521 --> 00:23:17,920 Speaker 1: so I knew it wasn't their fault. 472 00:23:18,241 --> 00:23:20,160 Speaker 3: So why didn't you stop when you felt bad at 473 00:23:20,160 --> 00:23:22,001 Speaker 3: the time, when you were doing these things? 474 00:23:22,521 --> 00:23:27,400 Speaker 1: Until I didn't shop after the first one. Then it 475 00:23:27,521 --> 00:23:30,200 Speaker 1: was just a continuation, you know, like I think. And 476 00:23:30,321 --> 00:23:33,360 Speaker 1: then I'd say to himself, I shouldn't be doing this, 477 00:23:33,561 --> 00:23:35,041 Speaker 1: you know what I mean, right, why. 478 00:23:35,001 --> 00:23:36,160 Speaker 4: Did you say you shouldn't be doing this? 479 00:23:36,400 --> 00:23:40,041 Speaker 1: Well, well, I knew that I shouldn't be hurting people 480 00:23:40,041 --> 00:23:41,281 Speaker 1: because they haven't done anything to me. 481 00:23:42,761 --> 00:23:43,721 Speaker 6: That's the bottom line. 482 00:23:43,840 --> 00:23:48,321 Speaker 1: I can't explain anything else, right, that's because I knew 483 00:23:48,521 --> 00:23:51,440 Speaker 1: I was at fault, and there's nothing I could change it. 484 00:23:51,481 --> 00:23:55,001 Speaker 1: There's no words I can express to take the hurt 485 00:23:55,080 --> 00:23:58,160 Speaker 1: feel and I give him the victim and her family 486 00:23:58,681 --> 00:24:01,160 Speaker 1: other than saying listen, I'm truly truly sorry. 487 00:24:01,721 --> 00:24:05,880 Speaker 6: And by this shattered me when who was talking about 488 00:24:05,921 --> 00:24:06,921 Speaker 6: all this bloody start? 489 00:24:07,160 --> 00:24:07,321 Speaker 4: Right? 490 00:24:07,441 --> 00:24:07,961 Speaker 6: You know what I mean? 491 00:24:09,160 --> 00:24:14,041 Speaker 1: And I can't change all that just happened, You know 492 00:24:14,080 --> 00:24:14,401 Speaker 1: what I mean? 493 00:24:15,001 --> 00:24:15,600 Speaker 4: Then you can't. 494 00:24:15,681 --> 00:24:17,840 Speaker 1: You can't know, so I had to just cop that. 495 00:24:18,360 --> 00:24:21,600 Speaker 1: But I've been the whipping boy and she's been the 496 00:24:21,681 --> 00:24:25,561 Speaker 1: whipping girl. Coppying Schlak right, because you know when people 497 00:24:25,640 --> 00:24:27,201 Speaker 1: take it out on her, because she's my the order. 498 00:24:29,801 --> 00:24:33,360 Speaker 2: In nineteen eighty six, Vetos was in Pantridge Prison and 499 00:24:33,481 --> 00:24:40,400 Speaker 2: began to associate with an even more henous offender, Raymond Edmunds. Edmunds, 500 00:24:40,481 --> 00:24:43,920 Speaker 2: known as mister Stinky for his vile body odor, was 501 00:24:44,001 --> 00:24:47,721 Speaker 2: serving life without parole for two murders and multiple sexual 502 00:24:47,761 --> 00:24:52,321 Speaker 2: assaults against women. Weetos claims that Edmunds made admissions to 503 00:24:52,441 --> 00:24:57,961 Speaker 2: him about the Frankston Tinyl murders. Between May nineteen eighty 504 00:24:58,241 --> 00:25:02,241 Speaker 2: and October nineteen eighty one, six girls and women were murdered, 505 00:25:03,201 --> 00:25:07,321 Speaker 2: their bodies dumped in bushland in the Tonelong North and 506 00:25:07,441 --> 00:25:13,281 Speaker 2: Frankston areas southeast of Melbourne. Among the victims were fourteen 507 00:25:13,360 --> 00:25:17,160 Speaker 2: year old Katherine Headland and seventy three year old Bertha Miller. 508 00:25:18,160 --> 00:25:21,881 Speaker 2: According to Vatos, Edmonds had told him information about these 509 00:25:22,001 --> 00:25:25,680 Speaker 2: murders that only the killer could have known. He was 510 00:25:25,801 --> 00:25:27,001 Speaker 2: determined to act on this. 511 00:25:28,721 --> 00:25:32,840 Speaker 3: You're in jail and then on May first, nineteen eighty nine, 512 00:25:33,721 --> 00:25:37,201 Speaker 3: a letter is sent to the then Victoria Police Deche 513 00:25:37,321 --> 00:25:41,321 Speaker 3: Commissioner at Kelblaire talking about Catherine Headland. 514 00:25:42,521 --> 00:25:43,241 Speaker 4: Did you write that. 515 00:25:43,801 --> 00:25:47,041 Speaker 6: Yes, type, I'll borroing a typewriter, that's right. 516 00:25:47,080 --> 00:25:48,921 Speaker 4: But why did you write that letter? 517 00:25:49,880 --> 00:25:56,601 Speaker 1: Because before that I sent a Christmas card to Headland's mother. 518 00:25:58,481 --> 00:25:59,241 Speaker 4: Why would you do that? 519 00:26:00,041 --> 00:26:06,801 Speaker 1: Because I realize the conversation I was having with this bloke, 520 00:26:08,521 --> 00:26:10,521 Speaker 1: a man I just look at dislike to him, you 521 00:26:10,600 --> 00:26:11,160 Speaker 1: know what I mean? Like? 522 00:26:11,281 --> 00:26:12,001 Speaker 4: Who is that man? 523 00:26:13,241 --> 00:26:13,401 Speaker 1: By? 524 00:26:13,521 --> 00:26:17,400 Speaker 6: Itman? All right, mister stinky heesh. 525 00:26:20,160 --> 00:26:23,561 Speaker 2: The Christmas card, sent in December nineteen eighty eight contained 526 00:26:23,561 --> 00:26:26,801 Speaker 2: a handwritten note from Vetos which read, I hope in 527 00:26:26,880 --> 00:26:28,920 Speaker 2: writing to you, I do not cause you or your 528 00:26:29,001 --> 00:26:32,920 Speaker 2: family any stress. I can comprehend the pain, the agony 529 00:26:32,961 --> 00:26:36,801 Speaker 2: you've endured to lose a loved one, Catherine. Not knowing 530 00:26:36,880 --> 00:26:40,281 Speaker 2: when or if the perpetrator singular or plural, will ever 531 00:26:40,400 --> 00:26:43,441 Speaker 2: be caught, well, the new year may be a good 532 00:26:43,521 --> 00:26:47,440 Speaker 2: one for you. Things may unfold, including the name of 533 00:26:47,521 --> 00:26:50,761 Speaker 2: the perpetrator whose deeds make Trua look like kids. 534 00:26:50,801 --> 00:26:51,120 Speaker 6: Stuff. 535 00:26:52,360 --> 00:26:55,281 Speaker 2: I'll keep in touch sometime in the new year, signed 536 00:26:55,481 --> 00:27:00,440 Speaker 2: anonymous friend. Vetos sent the card after talking with Edmunds. 537 00:27:02,241 --> 00:27:05,121 Speaker 4: Tell me where were you when you began. 538 00:27:05,160 --> 00:27:08,200 Speaker 1: Speaking to Edmunds when he first came into h division. 539 00:27:09,241 --> 00:27:12,041 Speaker 1: I was a billet and they'd be putting him in 540 00:27:12,080 --> 00:27:15,321 Speaker 1: a separate yard. Shame as when I come in. So 541 00:27:15,921 --> 00:27:18,561 Speaker 1: you're the billet in h Division and that's where I 542 00:27:18,721 --> 00:27:20,160 Speaker 1: talked to him, and no one's talking to him. And 543 00:27:20,160 --> 00:27:23,281 Speaker 1: I said, you wanted something to rude And I said, 544 00:27:23,281 --> 00:27:26,241 Speaker 1: I've got something over you want something? 545 00:27:27,761 --> 00:27:30,921 Speaker 2: Five months after send him the Christmas card, Bethos wrote 546 00:27:30,921 --> 00:27:34,761 Speaker 2: to then police Commissioner Kel Blair with information about Headland 547 00:27:34,880 --> 00:27:38,321 Speaker 2: and Bertha Miller, whose bodies were found close together in 548 00:27:38,400 --> 00:27:42,120 Speaker 2: a quarry at Taynong North in November nineteen eighty. 549 00:27:42,681 --> 00:27:46,161 Speaker 8: Is the TIONG file gathering dust? Have you run into 550 00:27:46,201 --> 00:27:49,400 Speaker 8: a dead end? Do you need help? With a multitude 551 00:27:49,441 --> 00:27:52,360 Speaker 8: of questions but very few answers. Did you know you 552 00:27:52,441 --> 00:27:54,561 Speaker 8: were dealing with a mass murder and a scale never 553 00:27:54,640 --> 00:27:58,281 Speaker 8: seen in this country? Only the top American serial killers 554 00:27:58,321 --> 00:28:00,241 Speaker 8: surpassed this cold blooded killer. 555 00:28:00,921 --> 00:28:02,080 Speaker 4: Did you know Edwin A. 556 00:28:02,160 --> 00:28:07,321 Speaker 8: Boyle was another victim and others across three states? Did 557 00:28:07,360 --> 00:28:09,521 Speaker 8: you find the approach that Bertha was wearing on the 558 00:28:09,600 --> 00:28:12,360 Speaker 8: day of a murder? All the pair of silver Sterling 559 00:28:12,441 --> 00:28:14,361 Speaker 8: bluebird earrings belonging to Catherine. 560 00:28:16,001 --> 00:28:18,440 Speaker 2: Vetos wrote the letter after talking to Edmonds on the 561 00:28:18,521 --> 00:28:23,441 Speaker 2: question of taking souvenirs from sexual assault victims. Now seventy 562 00:28:23,481 --> 00:28:26,120 Speaker 2: seven years of age, Vetos is a bit vague on 563 00:28:26,201 --> 00:28:29,801 Speaker 2: the details after all these years, so Stacy prompts him. 564 00:28:30,681 --> 00:28:34,521 Speaker 5: The police talk to you about souvenirs, and they said, 565 00:28:34,640 --> 00:28:37,721 Speaker 5: you had a fucking souvenir from a rape that was 566 00:28:37,801 --> 00:28:41,761 Speaker 5: a bluebird? No, no necklace? 567 00:28:42,721 --> 00:28:43,960 Speaker 4: Did you take souvenirs? 568 00:28:45,321 --> 00:28:45,361 Speaker 1: No? 569 00:28:46,201 --> 00:28:46,881 Speaker 4: Why not that? 570 00:28:48,241 --> 00:28:50,401 Speaker 6: I wasn't what do you call it? 571 00:28:50,601 --> 00:28:54,401 Speaker 1: That I was in there treating him like shitgirls, rapingham, 572 00:28:54,641 --> 00:28:56,401 Speaker 1: you know what I mean, not taking him shut. 573 00:28:56,681 --> 00:29:00,281 Speaker 5: If he took anything, I believe it was as a thief, 574 00:29:00,441 --> 00:29:02,761 Speaker 5: not as a memento. Does that make sense? 575 00:29:03,081 --> 00:29:06,561 Speaker 1: Yeah, and that's what that's sub did come up in 576 00:29:06,841 --> 00:29:10,321 Speaker 1: one of my trials, a victim that I've been a 577 00:29:10,321 --> 00:29:15,601 Speaker 1: convicted of said that the bluebird ear rings was hers necklace. 578 00:29:15,921 --> 00:29:16,321 Speaker 6: Necklace. 579 00:29:16,401 --> 00:29:17,480 Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, exactly. 580 00:29:17,601 --> 00:29:21,041 Speaker 1: So how I got him to tell him about the 581 00:29:21,121 --> 00:29:23,961 Speaker 1: bluebird earring it was? I was telling him about the 582 00:29:24,041 --> 00:29:28,721 Speaker 1: necklace in my case that the girls said that was 583 00:29:28,841 --> 00:29:31,960 Speaker 1: hers and it wasn't right. And I says, if they 584 00:29:32,081 --> 00:29:36,921 Speaker 1: find the ear rings jewelry and he says no, he says, 585 00:29:37,641 --> 00:29:39,321 Speaker 1: he says they have to get a head first. 586 00:29:40,281 --> 00:29:44,721 Speaker 5: Hang on, did he first tell you anything about anyone 587 00:29:44,841 --> 00:29:48,161 Speaker 5: having bluebird earrings like the necklace that your victim had. 588 00:29:48,881 --> 00:29:53,641 Speaker 6: Yeah, yeah, well it was in the headline. So yeah, 589 00:29:53,801 --> 00:29:54,201 Speaker 6: you're talking. 590 00:29:54,761 --> 00:29:58,641 Speaker 3: Let's take a step back. Yeah, so forget this right. 591 00:29:59,521 --> 00:30:01,841 Speaker 3: You were accused of taking a necklace, which you did 592 00:30:01,961 --> 00:30:02,241 Speaker 3: not do. 593 00:30:03,481 --> 00:30:03,801 Speaker 4: Correct. 594 00:30:03,841 --> 00:30:06,481 Speaker 6: Yeah, the family guilt, they found it guilty. 595 00:30:06,201 --> 00:30:09,241 Speaker 4: Of him anyway. But then you're talking to Raymond Edmunds. 596 00:30:09,481 --> 00:30:12,001 Speaker 1: Yes, and I told him the story about that, said, 597 00:30:12,041 --> 00:30:15,201 Speaker 1: if you've ever taken any jewelry from those things, ray 598 00:30:15,561 --> 00:30:19,561 Speaker 1: I said to him, I wasn't calling him thinking that 599 00:30:19,961 --> 00:30:21,441 Speaker 1: you're gone if. 600 00:30:21,361 --> 00:30:24,601 Speaker 6: They find him. And then that's when he said, they 601 00:30:24,681 --> 00:30:27,681 Speaker 6: have to get her head first, they have to get out. 602 00:30:28,361 --> 00:30:32,881 Speaker 5: He said, my dad's told me. He said that the 603 00:30:33,041 --> 00:30:34,761 Speaker 5: girl still has the ear rings. 604 00:30:34,921 --> 00:30:36,521 Speaker 6: Yes, but they got something. 605 00:30:36,801 --> 00:30:42,441 Speaker 1: There was a brooch that the broach was that Miller had, 606 00:30:42,641 --> 00:30:46,681 Speaker 1: so Edmunds, what she mentioned was what he called it 607 00:30:46,761 --> 00:30:49,081 Speaker 1: had a broach and the other one had ear rings, 608 00:30:49,121 --> 00:30:51,601 Speaker 1: but the young one had ear rings. 609 00:30:51,961 --> 00:30:53,881 Speaker 4: And he said, he said this to you. 610 00:30:54,681 --> 00:30:58,761 Speaker 1: Yeah, he said that two of his victims had one 611 00:30:58,801 --> 00:31:01,681 Speaker 1: had a brooch and the other one had bluebird earrings and. 612 00:31:01,721 --> 00:31:02,441 Speaker 4: He'd taken those. 613 00:31:03,041 --> 00:31:04,681 Speaker 1: You're gone if they found him. I'm telling him he 614 00:31:04,761 --> 00:31:06,881 Speaker 1: was gone, and he says, I have to get her 615 00:31:06,961 --> 00:31:07,481 Speaker 1: head first. 616 00:31:08,921 --> 00:31:12,521 Speaker 2: Police took the information in the letter very seriously, believing 617 00:31:12,601 --> 00:31:15,561 Speaker 2: it could have come from the killer himself, because it 618 00:31:15,641 --> 00:31:19,561 Speaker 2: contained information only the killer would know. However, by this 619 00:31:19,721 --> 00:31:24,481 Speaker 2: time police did have Catherine's bluebird earrings, but not Miller's brooch. 620 00:31:25,601 --> 00:31:29,281 Speaker 5: We've only just put that together. And I read something 621 00:31:29,361 --> 00:31:35,041 Speaker 5: about head shad well, that makes that makes sense in 622 00:31:35,121 --> 00:31:37,281 Speaker 5: the context of you saying the girl still has earrings, 623 00:31:37,281 --> 00:31:39,881 Speaker 5: because if the head was missing, they're still with the girl. 624 00:31:40,761 --> 00:31:44,801 Speaker 6: Unfortunately, that's just to get him talking about it, you 625 00:31:44,881 --> 00:31:45,240 Speaker 6: know what I mean. 626 00:31:45,881 --> 00:31:48,121 Speaker 4: And did he did he say Catherine Headland? 627 00:31:49,001 --> 00:31:49,201 Speaker 6: Good? 628 00:31:49,361 --> 00:31:51,601 Speaker 4: Did he say the name Katherine Headland? 629 00:31:53,081 --> 00:31:54,761 Speaker 6: You just said the fourteen year old? 630 00:31:55,321 --> 00:31:57,521 Speaker 3: He said the fourteen Raymond Edward said to you the 631 00:31:57,641 --> 00:32:01,401 Speaker 3: fourteen year old. They'll find the earrings if they find 632 00:32:01,481 --> 00:32:01,921 Speaker 3: her head. 633 00:32:02,081 --> 00:32:09,200 Speaker 5: Effectively, Yeah, that's with hindsight, that's with hig the miller you. 634 00:32:09,241 --> 00:32:13,321 Speaker 4: Were saying that he admitted, but he didn't take none 635 00:32:13,361 --> 00:32:13,521 Speaker 4: of that. 636 00:32:13,921 --> 00:32:16,121 Speaker 1: He didn't he didn't take the jewelry. You know, my 637 00:32:16,241 --> 00:32:17,881 Speaker 1: don't jump. He just said they'd had to get a 638 00:32:18,081 --> 00:32:23,081 Speaker 1: head first. Yeah, but he mentioned they had jewelry, trying 639 00:32:23,121 --> 00:32:26,041 Speaker 1: to rattle them off. But he says about the miller. 640 00:32:26,601 --> 00:32:29,281 Speaker 5: Nobody in the public knew about the jewelry at the time, 641 00:32:29,481 --> 00:32:32,921 Speaker 5: So when his letter got into the media, it caused 642 00:32:33,561 --> 00:32:36,321 Speaker 5: this big thing. Well, who wrote this letter? Because they 643 00:32:36,441 --> 00:32:39,681 Speaker 5: know that the victim had bluebird ear rings? And they 644 00:32:39,761 --> 00:32:43,561 Speaker 5: know that another victim had approach And I know who 645 00:32:43,721 --> 00:32:47,161 Speaker 5: didn't commit those murders because he was arrested in nineteen 646 00:32:47,201 --> 00:32:50,760 Speaker 5: seventy nine, and that's this guy here, So how did 647 00:32:50,841 --> 00:32:54,721 Speaker 5: he know? And until someone tells me how he knew? 648 00:32:55,481 --> 00:32:56,921 Speaker 5: That's why I will never shut up. 649 00:32:58,361 --> 00:33:02,281 Speaker 6: Have you told anybody else this before about the bluebird earrings? 650 00:33:02,601 --> 00:33:04,881 Speaker 4: Were you questioned at the time? Did they did know 651 00:33:05,521 --> 00:33:05,961 Speaker 4: with the letter? 652 00:33:06,241 --> 00:33:09,761 Speaker 1: What happened then was when they come down and raided Pentridge, 653 00:33:10,721 --> 00:33:15,361 Speaker 1: they've gone to located the typewriter. But shortly after that 654 00:33:15,761 --> 00:33:18,521 Speaker 1: I sent the letter, I got into a fight with 655 00:33:18,681 --> 00:33:21,961 Speaker 1: the Kettleton and they shotted me right and I was 656 00:33:22,001 --> 00:33:25,161 Speaker 1: down h Division right. That's when they come down and 657 00:33:25,641 --> 00:33:29,041 Speaker 1: saw me. But they didn't give me an interview like 658 00:33:29,161 --> 00:33:32,961 Speaker 1: you normally would give they said, did I send the 659 00:33:33,081 --> 00:33:37,480 Speaker 1: letter to the commissioner? And I said, yes, it's obvious. 660 00:33:37,921 --> 00:33:41,561 Speaker 5: To go back to a question you asked, why would 661 00:33:41,601 --> 00:33:44,241 Speaker 5: you do that? Well, because he thought he had the 662 00:33:44,321 --> 00:33:46,481 Speaker 5: information that was going to solve the crime. He was 663 00:33:46,681 --> 00:33:49,601 Speaker 5: telling the headlines I think next year is going to 664 00:33:49,601 --> 00:33:52,200 Speaker 5: be a good year for you because he thought that 665 00:33:52,361 --> 00:33:53,521 Speaker 5: he had all the answers. 666 00:33:53,761 --> 00:33:55,601 Speaker 4: So this is in the Christmas car that you wrote 667 00:33:55,681 --> 00:33:57,121 Speaker 4: to family. 668 00:33:57,361 --> 00:34:00,641 Speaker 5: And maybe he thought that because he had certain information, 669 00:34:00,801 --> 00:34:02,241 Speaker 5: it might help him in some way. 670 00:34:02,401 --> 00:34:05,480 Speaker 6: And yes, OK, so. 671 00:34:05,561 --> 00:34:08,081 Speaker 3: You're very clear. Let's just that's up a little bit. 672 00:34:08,441 --> 00:34:12,161 Speaker 3: You're very clear that ray Edmunds, mister Sinky told you 673 00:34:13,001 --> 00:34:17,361 Speaker 3: that effectively he killed Bertha Miller and Catherine Headler. 674 00:34:17,521 --> 00:34:20,081 Speaker 1: Yeah, because he told me he was in a conversation 675 00:34:20,521 --> 00:34:23,001 Speaker 1: that I've had with him a couple of years or 676 00:34:23,041 --> 00:34:26,161 Speaker 1: whatever it is. He's rund the tipping he was. He 677 00:34:26,281 --> 00:34:28,041 Speaker 1: trusted me because I was doing a twenty eight with 678 00:34:28,121 --> 00:34:29,321 Speaker 1: a what he called and then I've got an extra 679 00:34:29,361 --> 00:34:32,201 Speaker 1: six months for cutnoe Blake's right, and that's given me 680 00:34:32,321 --> 00:34:36,601 Speaker 1: seventeen years twenty five and a half. Right, Yeah, Oh, 681 00:34:36,601 --> 00:34:38,921 Speaker 1: I know he made it clear because he was telling 682 00:34:39,001 --> 00:34:42,881 Speaker 1: me that he did it. That's when he he had 683 00:34:42,961 --> 00:34:45,001 Speaker 1: of things that he was very He used to get 684 00:34:45,001 --> 00:34:48,281 Speaker 1: the paper in here, he used to get the missing people. 685 00:34:48,921 --> 00:34:50,841 Speaker 1: That's how the tynand come. 686 00:34:53,641 --> 00:34:56,121 Speaker 2: Edmunds has never been a strong suspect in the Frankston 687 00:34:56,201 --> 00:34:58,681 Speaker 2: tyne On cases because he was living in New South 688 00:34:58,721 --> 00:35:02,281 Speaker 2: Wales at the time. It's possible that Edmunds did return 689 00:35:02,321 --> 00:35:06,281 Speaker 2: to Victoria for the killings. However, police do not believe 690 00:35:06,321 --> 00:35:09,960 Speaker 2: he had the charm and interpersonal skills needed to lure 691 00:35:10,001 --> 00:35:13,121 Speaker 2: the women into a vehicle, as it appears occurred in 692 00:35:13,241 --> 00:35:17,441 Speaker 2: many of these cases. Vetos says Edmonds also gave him 693 00:35:17,481 --> 00:35:21,401 Speaker 2: information about a woman named Edwina Boyle who disappeared in 694 00:35:21,441 --> 00:35:23,001 Speaker 2: October nineteen eighty three. 695 00:35:24,561 --> 00:35:28,601 Speaker 6: He was looking at it another time. Was you know 696 00:35:28,681 --> 00:35:29,081 Speaker 6: the pictures? 697 00:35:29,121 --> 00:35:31,401 Speaker 1: I have a mission girls. He says, I know that 698 00:35:31,561 --> 00:35:33,721 Speaker 1: girl and that was a Duena Boil. 699 00:35:34,521 --> 00:35:36,681 Speaker 4: So Ray Edmonds also new with Wuena Boyle. 700 00:35:36,841 --> 00:35:40,401 Speaker 5: Now Dad claims that he wrote the letter and there's 701 00:35:40,441 --> 00:35:42,921 Speaker 5: a name that's redacted on that letter. As you can see. 702 00:35:43,321 --> 00:35:46,041 Speaker 5: He says that name is a Duena Boyle. However, this 703 00:35:46,241 --> 00:35:48,801 Speaker 5: is where we lose people with this story, because Fred 704 00:35:48,881 --> 00:35:51,681 Speaker 5: Boyle went to prison for a Duena Boyle's murder. 705 00:35:51,761 --> 00:35:55,001 Speaker 3: But how did Dad know he billed his wife and 706 00:35:55,481 --> 00:35:58,801 Speaker 3: put her in a barrel? Yeah, planned and then toted 707 00:35:58,841 --> 00:35:59,841 Speaker 3: this barrel around. 708 00:35:59,681 --> 00:36:01,681 Speaker 1: From Well, the reason why I put that in, the 709 00:36:01,721 --> 00:36:04,881 Speaker 1: reason why I put that in He told me about 710 00:36:05,201 --> 00:36:05,801 Speaker 1: DNA Boil. 711 00:36:06,321 --> 00:36:08,561 Speaker 4: So Edmonds told you that because she was he had 712 00:36:08,561 --> 00:36:08,761 Speaker 4: the thing. 713 00:36:09,921 --> 00:36:12,841 Speaker 5: I believe he told him that she wouldn't be coming back. 714 00:36:14,281 --> 00:36:16,401 Speaker 5: I killed her bit that one way of coming back, 715 00:36:18,081 --> 00:36:21,561 Speaker 5: and Greena Boil was actually later found to have been deceased, 716 00:36:21,641 --> 00:36:24,521 Speaker 5: and Dad knew about it twenty years before she was found. 717 00:36:25,081 --> 00:36:29,521 Speaker 5: How it wasn't him? How if it wasn't Stinky as 718 00:36:29,601 --> 00:36:31,881 Speaker 5: someone that Stinky knew. That's all I can think of, 719 00:36:33,041 --> 00:36:34,121 Speaker 5: and I can't let go of it. 720 00:36:34,201 --> 00:36:34,761 Speaker 6: I'm a mom. 721 00:36:34,881 --> 00:36:38,001 Speaker 5: There was a fourteen year old child, I'm a woman. 722 00:36:39,001 --> 00:36:40,081 Speaker 5: He's done his time. 723 00:36:40,321 --> 00:36:43,681 Speaker 4: Haven't you told police that you call crime stoppers twice? 724 00:36:44,641 --> 00:36:45,841 Speaker 4: Has anybody contacted you? 725 00:36:46,201 --> 00:36:46,241 Speaker 1: No? 726 00:36:46,761 --> 00:36:49,041 Speaker 5: And the second time I rang them back was to 727 00:36:49,161 --> 00:36:52,041 Speaker 5: say you haven't even scooped up Peter to ask him 728 00:36:52,081 --> 00:36:54,281 Speaker 5: about me, saying he's claiming this. 729 00:36:56,521 --> 00:36:57,681 Speaker 4: Of course, there's a reward. 730 00:36:58,121 --> 00:37:01,841 Speaker 3: Yes on the Frankston some people might say, you've only 731 00:37:01,961 --> 00:37:03,561 Speaker 3: saying this to get a reward. 732 00:37:03,681 --> 00:37:07,761 Speaker 5: No, what we've forgotten, what we've left out of this story. 733 00:37:07,881 --> 00:37:10,761 Speaker 5: My father claims that before he got slotted, he went 734 00:37:10,841 --> 00:37:13,761 Speaker 5: to another prisoner and said, I know this about Stinky. 735 00:37:13,921 --> 00:37:16,361 Speaker 5: Let's go and let's tell them and we'll see if 736 00:37:16,401 --> 00:37:18,601 Speaker 5: it helps us out and you with our sentences. This 737 00:37:18,761 --> 00:37:22,481 Speaker 5: is another man by the name of Kerry Andrews, and 738 00:37:22,961 --> 00:37:26,721 Speaker 5: Dad got slotted because of Kettleton. And Andrews went forward 739 00:37:26,761 --> 00:37:28,921 Speaker 5: and pretended that he was the one that had been 740 00:37:28,961 --> 00:37:32,081 Speaker 5: told these things, and he stole Dad's story. 741 00:37:32,841 --> 00:37:35,561 Speaker 1: Yeah, when the cops come down, I can remember they 742 00:37:36,361 --> 00:37:38,161 Speaker 1: I told him that it was mister Stinky. 743 00:37:38,521 --> 00:37:41,601 Speaker 3: Okay, So you don't think the police believed you about 744 00:37:41,641 --> 00:37:42,881 Speaker 3: what you said about Eddence? 745 00:37:44,281 --> 00:37:45,081 Speaker 6: I don't think. 746 00:37:47,601 --> 00:37:47,641 Speaker 1: So. 747 00:37:47,841 --> 00:37:50,801 Speaker 3: Would you give evidence to the police again if they 748 00:37:50,841 --> 00:37:52,641 Speaker 3: were interested in talking to you once more? 749 00:37:52,761 --> 00:37:56,401 Speaker 4: Yeah? But shoot, what it is is theys A simple question, 750 00:37:56,481 --> 00:37:57,801 Speaker 4: yes or no? Would you give evidence? 751 00:37:58,601 --> 00:38:01,561 Speaker 1: Well, I'm a bit what he call with them, because 752 00:38:01,601 --> 00:38:03,801 Speaker 1: they already made up. They've flame and mine. 753 00:38:04,281 --> 00:38:06,561 Speaker 3: Well, these are different police that you're talking about a 754 00:38:06,601 --> 00:38:07,281 Speaker 3: long time ago. 755 00:38:08,401 --> 00:38:12,041 Speaker 6: Well, well, I suppose I would your daughter's. 756 00:38:11,761 --> 00:38:13,801 Speaker 4: Nodding her head. Here, I reckon, she wants you to 757 00:38:13,921 --> 00:38:14,601 Speaker 4: do it correct. 758 00:38:15,961 --> 00:38:18,681 Speaker 5: It needs to be done. Hence why we're having this conversation. 759 00:38:19,121 --> 00:38:21,561 Speaker 5: Someone needs to tell us how my dad knew about 760 00:38:21,561 --> 00:38:24,361 Speaker 5: those earrings. It had to have been the person who 761 00:38:24,441 --> 00:38:28,000 Speaker 5: told him, or someone else told that person. How else, 762 00:38:29,521 --> 00:38:33,481 Speaker 5: how else? This is a forty year old girl. They 763 00:38:33,561 --> 00:38:36,121 Speaker 5: run on through that all of the victims were just 764 00:38:36,201 --> 00:38:39,121 Speaker 5: as important, all of them, no matter of age. But 765 00:38:39,321 --> 00:38:44,001 Speaker 5: this was a child. That's, as a mother, horrifying, and 766 00:38:44,521 --> 00:38:47,601 Speaker 5: I can only think about. You know, they say someone 767 00:38:47,641 --> 00:38:51,041 Speaker 5: out there must know something about crimes, right, and they 768 00:38:51,121 --> 00:38:54,641 Speaker 5: want people to come forward. Well, here we are. We 769 00:38:54,721 --> 00:38:56,041 Speaker 5: think we know something. 770 00:38:56,561 --> 00:38:58,561 Speaker 4: Because Peter, you're not a well man. 771 00:38:59,721 --> 00:39:01,801 Speaker 6: No what I'm pried got. 772 00:39:01,681 --> 00:39:06,241 Speaker 3: Cancer, you've got melanomapartments, we've got a model, I'm there. 773 00:39:06,521 --> 00:39:09,081 Speaker 4: So you're not a well man. So time is running 774 00:39:09,121 --> 00:39:10,441 Speaker 4: out for you to tell this. 775 00:39:10,681 --> 00:39:11,601 Speaker 6: That's what I'm frightened of. 776 00:39:11,681 --> 00:39:13,281 Speaker 1: And what I said to my daughter, I was going 777 00:39:13,321 --> 00:39:15,281 Speaker 1: to tell her why I tell us at least someone 778 00:39:15,441 --> 00:39:19,441 Speaker 1: knew what I know, and that had a profound effect 779 00:39:19,521 --> 00:39:22,641 Speaker 1: on her and she couldn't keep the secret no more. 780 00:39:23,321 --> 00:39:24,321 Speaker 6: And she told me about it. 781 00:39:24,641 --> 00:39:29,841 Speaker 1: Now I'm indebted to follow suits me to say, yes, well, 782 00:39:29,881 --> 00:39:31,081 Speaker 1: I did tell her all of these things. 783 00:39:31,121 --> 00:39:31,561 Speaker 6: You know what I mean? 784 00:39:31,641 --> 00:39:34,881 Speaker 3: Right Another A critic might say that you're just saying 785 00:39:34,961 --> 00:39:38,681 Speaker 3: this to please your daughter, who's risked a lot for you. 786 00:39:39,761 --> 00:39:43,201 Speaker 3: I'm sticking by you. But are you doing it because 787 00:39:43,201 --> 00:39:45,801 Speaker 3: it's true? Because you're pleasing your daughter? 788 00:39:46,881 --> 00:39:47,641 Speaker 1: It is true. 789 00:39:48,201 --> 00:39:49,801 Speaker 6: I am worried now. 790 00:39:51,161 --> 00:39:53,361 Speaker 1: That I might die, and that's what I told her 791 00:39:54,561 --> 00:39:58,521 Speaker 1: these things. I might die or he dies. We're not 792 00:39:59,001 --> 00:40:03,081 Speaker 1: he's eighty and I'm not too well. If I die 793 00:40:03,401 --> 00:40:05,161 Speaker 1: or he dies, that's the end of story. That what 794 00:40:05,201 --> 00:40:06,681 Speaker 1: I'm saying, That's what I'm worried about. 795 00:40:07,241 --> 00:40:09,321 Speaker 6: And I do she around. 796 00:40:09,361 --> 00:40:11,841 Speaker 1: You may at fourteen fifteen, at the time when Shaw 797 00:40:11,841 --> 00:40:14,721 Speaker 1: will have happened, and she's got a couple of daughters herself, 798 00:40:15,121 --> 00:40:19,401 Speaker 1: and I've got another daughter too. What I'm saying is 799 00:40:19,481 --> 00:40:22,561 Speaker 1: I'm frightened and I might die, and then that's the 800 00:40:22,681 --> 00:40:25,721 Speaker 1: end of it. Like their cases died. Now, shame that 801 00:40:26,721 --> 00:40:27,881 Speaker 1: whatever they shame. 802 00:40:27,921 --> 00:40:30,761 Speaker 5: You know, no way to explain how he knew about it. 803 00:40:31,201 --> 00:40:34,641 Speaker 5: So people can criticize her what they want, but can 804 00:40:34,721 --> 00:40:37,321 Speaker 5: someone please tell me how he knows about the earrings. 805 00:40:37,361 --> 00:40:40,401 Speaker 5: If there's some other explanation, whether that's vig pole, because 806 00:40:40,481 --> 00:40:43,801 Speaker 5: I'm not going to shut up until i know how 807 00:40:43,921 --> 00:40:45,121 Speaker 5: he knew about those earrings. 808 00:40:45,161 --> 00:40:49,361 Speaker 4: Well, that's sure, that's someone hears about this. Yes, you're 809 00:40:49,521 --> 00:40:50,281 Speaker 4: very courageous. 810 00:40:50,521 --> 00:40:50,801 Speaker 5: Thank you. 811 00:40:51,361 --> 00:40:52,561 Speaker 6: I know I'm proud of it. 812 00:40:53,881 --> 00:40:56,841 Speaker 4: You've saved him and you saved him again. 813 00:40:59,121 --> 00:41:01,881 Speaker 5: There's things that people, there's things that need to come 814 00:41:01,921 --> 00:41:02,241 Speaker 5: to light. 815 00:41:02,481 --> 00:41:06,041 Speaker 1: And she made me realize, wake me up and same 816 00:41:06,161 --> 00:41:06,641 Speaker 1: because you did. 817 00:41:06,721 --> 00:41:10,921 Speaker 4: So let's fay you did some terrible things, go terrible things. 818 00:41:11,441 --> 00:41:14,000 Speaker 4: This is an opportunity to do something good. 819 00:41:14,521 --> 00:41:17,361 Speaker 1: That's why I'm doing it because simple reason is that's 820 00:41:17,401 --> 00:41:19,401 Speaker 1: why I told her all those things. Because I'm worried 821 00:41:19,441 --> 00:41:22,601 Speaker 1: to that I might die with all these complications. That's 822 00:41:23,001 --> 00:41:26,801 Speaker 1: regardless of what they think, right that it's never going 823 00:41:26,841 --> 00:41:30,081 Speaker 1: to get solved after this. This is what I'm saying 824 00:41:30,121 --> 00:41:31,841 Speaker 1: to me in order what i'd have to do with 825 00:41:32,001 --> 00:41:34,641 Speaker 1: you when you come or if I've got to come 826 00:41:34,721 --> 00:41:37,161 Speaker 1: out with something, I'd have to tell you. 827 00:41:37,761 --> 00:41:38,881 Speaker 6: She was only fowardeen. 828 00:41:39,081 --> 00:41:43,201 Speaker 1: She never fell in love, she never got married, she 829 00:41:43,401 --> 00:41:46,841 Speaker 1: never had kids, she never had grand kids. 830 00:41:48,001 --> 00:41:50,721 Speaker 3: Let's hope that I'm going to take this back to 831 00:41:50,801 --> 00:41:53,721 Speaker 3: the homicide squad and tell them in the conversation. We've 832 00:41:53,761 --> 00:41:56,401 Speaker 3: had the people there and we'll see what happens. But 833 00:41:56,441 --> 00:41:59,681 Speaker 3: I appreciate you coming forward, and I appreciate your. 834 00:41:59,881 --> 00:42:02,161 Speaker 1: The only reason I'm coming forward is because I'm worried 835 00:42:02,561 --> 00:42:04,441 Speaker 1: i might die. And that's the end of it. I 836 00:42:04,521 --> 00:42:08,561 Speaker 1: don't care as a way, Well, it's not going to 837 00:42:08,601 --> 00:42:10,921 Speaker 1: be sholved. It's not going to be incholved. 838 00:42:11,681 --> 00:42:16,561 Speaker 5: And to answer the question from before, you know, yeah, 839 00:42:16,601 --> 00:42:18,481 Speaker 5: there is a massive reward on it. There's a million 840 00:42:18,521 --> 00:42:21,761 Speaker 5: dollars per victim. No, we haven't done this to get 841 00:42:21,761 --> 00:42:25,121 Speaker 5: a reward. But is it something that you're aware of 842 00:42:25,281 --> 00:42:27,641 Speaker 5: in the background. Of course you are. It's a lot, 843 00:42:27,681 --> 00:42:29,521 Speaker 5: and that's why they put it out there to try 844 00:42:29,561 --> 00:42:32,641 Speaker 5: to get people to go forward. But how many of 845 00:42:32,721 --> 00:42:35,161 Speaker 5: these rewards actually get paid out in the end. 846 00:42:35,441 --> 00:42:40,321 Speaker 6: Very few, See, That's what I didn't forget to say. 847 00:42:41,521 --> 00:42:43,281 Speaker 1: From the time I sent the letter out and the 848 00:42:43,361 --> 00:42:47,241 Speaker 1: cops come and whatever the things I said, I never 849 00:42:47,361 --> 00:42:48,401 Speaker 1: asked for any reward. 850 00:42:48,481 --> 00:42:49,561 Speaker 6: I was given them for free. 851 00:42:55,481 --> 00:42:57,921 Speaker 2: That was the silver gun rapist Peter Vetos and his 852 00:42:58,081 --> 00:43:01,241 Speaker 2: daughter Stacy. There is a one million dollar reward for 853 00:43:01,321 --> 00:43:03,761 Speaker 2: information leading to an arrest in each of the six 854 00:43:04,201 --> 00:43:08,281 Speaker 2: Frankston Times. If mister Stinking did turn out to be 855 00:43:08,361 --> 00:43:12,001 Speaker 2: the killer of Katherine Hedlund and Bertha Miller, Peter Atos 856 00:43:12,081 --> 00:43:15,441 Speaker 2: could stand to collect. What an moment that would be. 857 00:43:16,321 --> 00:43:18,561 Speaker 2: If you have information about these cases or any others, 858 00:43:18,641 --> 00:43:21,041 Speaker 2: please send me an email at Adam Shand writer at 859 00:43:21,081 --> 00:43:24,681 Speaker 2: gmail dot com, or you can call crime Stoppers on 860 00:43:24,761 --> 00:43:28,401 Speaker 2: one eight hundred, triple three, triple zero. This has been 861 00:43:28,441 --> 00:43:30,841 Speaker 2: real crime with Adam Shand. Thanks for listening.