Speaker 1: Hello, and welcome to Something to Talk About, the Stellar podcast.
Speaker 1: I'm Sarah Lamarquin, your host, and every week I sit
Speaker 1: down with some of the biggest names in the country
Speaker 1: because when Australia's celebrities are ready to talk, they come
Speaker 1: to Something to talk about. Being investigated by the Australian
Speaker 1: Electoral Commission was not on Abby Chatfield's BINGO card for
Speaker 1: twenty twenty five, but after interviewing Anthony Albanesi and former
Speaker 1: Green's leader Adam Bant on her podcast HiT's a Lot,
Speaker 1: Abby found herself at the center of several conversations about
Speaker 1: the recent federal election campaign.
Speaker 2: In fact, some.
Speaker 1: Days at scene there were more headlines written about Abby
Speaker 1: than they were about either the Prime Minister or then
Speaker 1: Opposition leader Peter Dutton.
Speaker 3: When women do more than one thing, they're deemed as
Speaker 3: inft at all the.
Speaker 4: Things they do.
Speaker 3: But when men do more than one thing, it's like, wow,
Speaker 3: he's a footed player, can read an autocube.
Speaker 4: Whereas women.
Speaker 3: If I am on reality TV show, I host a
Speaker 3: reality TV show, I have a podcast, I do radio,
Speaker 3: I do all these things, then I must be good
Speaker 3: at nothing. Because if I'm a reality TV show host,
Speaker 3: I can't only think about politics. If I think I
Speaker 3: don't have politics, how could I be funny enough to
Speaker 3: have a radio show. If I have a radio show,
Speaker 3: I'll be actually this influencer. And it feels like people
Speaker 3: think it's a zero sum game.
Speaker 1: Today Abby sits down with me in the Something to
Speaker 1: Talk About studio to unpack her decision to speak out
Speaker 1: about politics and the double standards in play when it's
Speaker 1: a young, famous woman on the Internet who dares to
Speaker 1: do so. We also talk about life and love as
Speaker 1: she prepares to turn thirty, what it's like to be
Speaker 1: in the middle of a very public feud, whether or
Speaker 1: not we might see her mum on The Golden Bachelor.
Speaker 1: Abby Chatfield, Welcome back to the Stellar podcast.
Speaker 4: Thank you back again for our yearly catch up.
Speaker 1: I was gonna say this is how I get to
Speaker 1: catch up with you once a year.
Speaker 2: It seeks down.
Speaker 1: We have a little conversation with annoying microphones in the way,
Speaker 1: but then it's the cover of Stellar. So it has
Speaker 1: been almost a year between Stellar covers. A lot has
Speaker 1: been going on, a lot to unpack you and me.
Speaker 1: But I want to actually throw forward a little bit
Speaker 1: because later this month June you've a milestone birthday coming.
Speaker 2: Up, thirty thirty.
Speaker 1: Oh my goodness, how are you feeling about the Big
Speaker 1: three zero?
Speaker 3: So excited. I've never been one to be scared about aging.
Speaker 3: I've never really understood people that are freaked out about it.
Speaker 3: I actually I've even tried to because of societal pressure
Speaker 3: and expectations. Everyone's like, oh, don't ask my age. I
Speaker 3: go why, I'm happy that I've made it to thirty.
Speaker 3: Very exciting, And I don't know. I love aging because
Speaker 3: every year you look back and how they say, if
Speaker 3: you cringe it yourself a year ago, then you're making progress.
Speaker 3: Like every year, I think that I get better and smarter,
Speaker 3: as everyone does. I think you learn more, you understand more,
Speaker 3: and you look back at things you did a year
Speaker 3: ago and you go, wow, what basic thought or what
Speaker 3: a basic thing that I did, or you know, even emotionally,
Speaker 3: what an awful relationship I was in four years ago
Speaker 3: because I hadn't done.
Speaker 4: The work or whatever.
Speaker 3: And I'm excited to be thirty. I'm everyone in my
Speaker 3: lives is their thirties are the best.
Speaker 4: So I can't wait.
Speaker 2: Thirties are great.
Speaker 1: And I think something else that happens with a lot
Speaker 1: of people when you have a birthday is apart from that,
Speaker 1: particularly for women, it's like, oh my goodness, I'm running
Speaker 1: out of time of getting old or where's the time gone?
Speaker 1: Is that a lot of people think what have I
Speaker 1: been doing? But for you, Abby, I know it always
Speaker 1: looks different from the outside, but they're surely that couldn't
Speaker 1: be one of the when you have that cringe, god.
Speaker 2: Cringe moment.
Speaker 1: I would imagine one of the things for you, surely
Speaker 1: is not I haven't done enough stuff.
Speaker 3: Yes, definitely not that. That definitely is not a thought
Speaker 3: that crosses my mind. Because his whole career was kind
Speaker 3: of an accident.
Speaker 4: You know.
Speaker 3: I was a property analyst and then I went on
Speaker 3: The Bachelor as a joke and then this all kind
Speaker 3: of happened. So it's sort of like when you and
Speaker 3: this might say depressing, but when you have no goals
Speaker 3: to reach, you can't really fail at those goals. Not
Speaker 3: in that you should do nothing, but in that everyone
Speaker 3: you know, people ask me, what are you going to
Speaker 3: do in five years?
Speaker 4: What's next? Ta da da, and I go, I'd love
Speaker 4: to know.
Speaker 3: I have no idea, And yeah, I've been so lucky
Speaker 3: to do so many different things just for yapping.
Speaker 1: Because you would never have been able to brew Dick
Speaker 1: five years ago if somebody had said that to you.
Speaker 2: Where are you going to be in five years?
Speaker 3: Because five years ago was when The Bachelor was I
Speaker 3: just finished airing was covid?
Speaker 4: Oh my god, it was covid five years ago?
Speaker 3: And I just started the podcast and I thought, you know,
Speaker 3: maybe I got a hundred listens whatever something to do
Speaker 3: in lockdown and yeah, now it's going really well, and
Speaker 3: I interviewed the Prime Minister. It's crazy and the formula
Speaker 3: of the Greens Adam band and it's just a very yeah,
Speaker 3: I'm very happy with all that I've done, and I'm
Speaker 3: very excited for a holiday in between all that I've done.
Speaker 4: To come back and possibly do more.
Speaker 1: Let's see, good way to spend a thirtieth birthday, I
Speaker 1: think is a holiday? Yes, But that partly why I
Speaker 1: wanted to speak to you today was because of a
Speaker 1: lot of issues that came up during the federal election
Speaker 1: and I thought I'd really love to sit down and
Speaker 1: chat to Abby about some of this. And I've got
Speaker 1: a few headlines here that came up, for instance, during
Speaker 1: the election, and Abby when you just said, couldn't.
Speaker 2: Have predicted anything.
Speaker 1: When you look back to your unexpected career and being
Speaker 1: catapulted into the spotlight after being the runner up on
Speaker 1: the Bachelor in the twenty nineteen series, very few people,
Speaker 1: I imagine yourself included, would have predicted that I would people
Speaker 1: like me would want to sit down with you in
Speaker 1: twenty twenty five, and the first thing I want to
Speaker 1: talk about is politics, your.
Speaker 2: Role and commentary around the federal election.
Speaker 3: I I mean, very exciting that we get to talk
Speaker 3: about this, but I just want to say before anyone
Speaker 3: has to go with me, everyone is acting like I think.
Speaker 4: I'm a political expert.
Speaker 3: Everyone's like she thinks she's she thinks she's she gonna
Speaker 3: get to politics at it.
Speaker 4: And it's just it's not that I think I'm a
Speaker 4: political expert.
Speaker 3: It's that I have a big platform and I have
Speaker 3: certain beliefs and I just voiced those beliefs. So everyone
Speaker 3: holds me to the standard of being a political expert
Speaker 3: or a political commentator quote unquote. If I wanted to
Speaker 3: do that, I would get into a newsroom, or I
Speaker 3: would I would get into politics.
Speaker 4: I would try to get into politics.
Speaker 3: I just wanted to use my platform to talk about
Speaker 3: politics because it was a very important time and currently
Speaker 3: globally with the far right movement getting bigger and bigger.
Speaker 3: Although it's at the time, let's say at the time
Speaker 3: earlier this year, it wasn't looking good in terms of
Speaker 3: far right fascist movements overtaking the world.
Speaker 4: And now slowly like Canada has rejected it. We've rejected it.
Speaker 3: I think it was Romania, so another slowly we're seeing
Speaker 3: a rejection of it. But at the time it was
Speaker 3: more panic induced. It wasn't that I thought I was
Speaker 3: some political expert. Just before we get into this, I
Speaker 3: just want to clarify that because everyone seems to, oh,
Speaker 3: you're an expert on everything.
Speaker 4: Now it's like, no, I just have ADHD and talk
Speaker 4: a lot well.
Speaker 1: When I just introduced you for this episode of the
Speaker 1: Stellar podcast, I did not identify you as political commentator.
Speaker 1: When people listen to it's a lot the artwork is
Speaker 1: not shot with Parliament Housing Canberra in the background, but
Speaker 1: you are daring to weigh into these issues. I will
Speaker 1: just touch upon some of those headlines I mentioned a
Speaker 1: few minutes ago. Here just a sample, because quite frankly,
Speaker 1: you generated probably more headlines than Anthony Alperansi or Peter
Speaker 1: Dudd and put together. Abbi Chatfield joins Green's push to
Speaker 1: keep Dunn out in new ad. Abbi Chatfield post to
Speaker 1: be probed by Australian Electoral Commission. Abbi Chatfield cleared of
Speaker 1: wrongdoing by AEC after interviewing Anthony Albanesi on her podcast.
Speaker 1: Abbi Chatfield despairs as her political hero, Greens leader Adam
Speaker 1: Bant faces election defeat. ABC believe Abbi Chatfield is the
Speaker 1: way to go for Australia's political debates.
Speaker 2: I mean, as I say.
Speaker 1: The fact that you became a player, not because you
Speaker 1: were saying Okay, here's political commentator, here's political heavyweight.
Speaker 2: Abby Chatfield's verdict on it.
Speaker 1: You were using a platform to interview people, make commentary.
Speaker 1: No one's saying that anyone has to agree with anyone,
Speaker 1: but the oxygen.
Speaker 2: That it created. How did that sit with you?
Speaker 4: Oh?
Speaker 3: It's so annoying because what happens is, as you probably
Speaker 3: know more than anyone, I feel as though there's this
Speaker 3: thing with me, in particular with the mainstream Australian media
Speaker 3: where I do anything and suddenly it's as though like
Speaker 3: I was saying before I think that I'm an expert,
Speaker 3: when it's actually just.
Speaker 4: Journalists.
Speaker 3: Is that term lightly when it comes to daily mail
Speaker 3: people who are writing articles knowing that we'll get engagement,
Speaker 3: because if there's a headline saying that I seem to
Speaker 3: think that I know anything about politics, it'll get negative
Speaker 3: engagement and maybe positive engagement as well for people that
Speaker 3: like me and follow me, but mainly negative engagement. And
Speaker 3: there's this flooding of headlines about me, then people think
Speaker 3: that I'm an expert about They think that I think
Speaker 3: that I'm an expert actor, so I'm there writing all
Speaker 3: the articles about myself, when in reality, I just wanted
Speaker 3: for my audience to understand the literal basics of the election,
Speaker 3: like how preferential voting works, or.
Speaker 4: The difference between labor and liberal.
Speaker 3: Because around this time I was also doing Married at
Speaker 3: First Sight recaps, so I had this whole new audience.
Speaker 3: And I would have done it regardless, but I think
Speaker 3: it was really good to bring an audience that hadn't
Speaker 3: ever thought about the election that were coming for pop
Speaker 3: culture stuff and for them to realize, oh, I shouldn't
Speaker 3: just do I don't know a throw I shouldn't do
Speaker 3: a throwaway vote. I shouldn't just go, oh, labor and
Speaker 3: liberal the same, it doesn't matter. I should think about independence.
Speaker 3: I shouldn't listen to American oric saying that it's a
Speaker 3: wasted vote if you go it from an independent or
Speaker 3: Greens or a smaller party, a minor party. So it
Speaker 3: was me just trying to get my audience to understand
Speaker 3: basics and understand even just that there is a vote compass,
Speaker 3: very basic stuff, and then suddenly it's turned into this
Speaker 3: and the AEC stuff was just a whole other level
Speaker 3: of I believe discrediting smaller voices, but also discrediting outspoken
Speaker 3: young women. And it seems to be in media. When
Speaker 3: women do more than one thing, they're deemed as inept
Speaker 3: at all the things they do, but when men do
Speaker 3: more than one thing, it's like, wow, he's a footy
Speaker 3: player and he can read an AUTOQ, whereas women. If
Speaker 3: I am on reality TV show, I host a reality
Speaker 3: TV show, I have a podcast, I do radio, I
Speaker 3: do all these things, then I must be good at nothing.
Speaker 3: Because if I'm a if I'm a reality TV show host,
Speaker 3: I kin't only think about politics. If I think I
Speaker 3: don't even have politics. How could I be funny enough
Speaker 3: to have a radio show. If I have a radio show,
Speaker 3: i'll be Actually it's an influencer. And it feels like
Speaker 3: people think it's a zero sum game. And this is
Speaker 3: why these headlines frustrate me so much, because it's positioning
Speaker 3: me as having an ego about politics, but also as oh,
Speaker 3: she's trying to be an expert on something new. It's like,
Speaker 3: I just I'm literally asking questions. I'm interviewing people as
Speaker 3: you are now. I'm literally inquiring, And yeah, it's quite frustrating.
Speaker 3: And like I said, the AEC thing was the most
Speaker 3: frustrating and made me very feel really targeted, as I
Speaker 3: feel that I'm oft an a scapegoat for a lot
Speaker 3: of these center right or right wing or conservative or
Speaker 3: older audiences in terms of the media because of how
Speaker 3: the media portrays me as being the spokesperson on things
Speaker 3: and they go, oh, she's talking again, you know what
Speaker 3: I mean, it's this weird cycle. So that's how I
Speaker 3: felt about the certain line.
Speaker 1: There's a lot of fascinating threads of that chat that
Speaker 1: I'd like to pursue. One of them would be the
Speaker 1: gender aspect that you raised there and Hannah Ferguson, the
Speaker 1: founder of Cheek Media. She recently addressed the National Press
Speaker 1: Club and she said influenza has been the dirtiest word
Speaker 1: of this campaign. The agenda is clear to undermine our intelligence,
Speaker 1: to pain us as untrustworthy. There's nothing wrong with being
Speaker 1: an influencer, but the label is intended to cause significant
Speaker 1: reputational damage. The impact is deeply misogynistic. Would you agree
Speaker 1: with that gender aspect of it? Do you think there
Speaker 1: is a sexist or potentially even misogynistic component to the response? Yeah.
Speaker 3: I wrote an article about this in twenty twenty, actually
Speaker 3: about how influencer is. At the time, I felt as
Speaker 3: though it was a very gendered insult, almost as times
Speaker 3: gone on. Personally, if someone wants to call me influencer
Speaker 3: and as an insult, I don't personally care, but I
Speaker 3: do care about the impact on other women and on
Speaker 3: the industry as a whole. So it's kind of like
Speaker 3: the whole idea of slutshaming. This is how I see it.
Speaker 3: I don't personally care if someone calls me a slut
Speaker 3: because I go, well, I don't have any shame in
Speaker 3: sleeping with lots of people, right I personally have no shame,
Speaker 3: but I don't like slut shaming in terms of how
Speaker 3: it impacts women and how it is a patriarchal idea
Speaker 3: that's really enforced. Same with influencing, it seems to be
Speaker 3: throughout time whenever women dominate industries, it's then discredited and undermined,
Speaker 3: even things like teaching and nursing, incredibly important industries the
Speaker 3: backbone of our society really that is continue undermined in
Speaker 3: terms of their pay package, in terms of where they're
Speaker 3: treated by patients and parents, and the disrespect they get.
Speaker 4: And I believe.
Speaker 3: That's because it's predominantly women that are doing it, and
Speaker 3: it's also assumed that women should be the natural caretakers
Speaker 3: when it comes to influencing. I don't think that just
Speaker 3: discrimination is as intense as it is towards women who
Speaker 3: are literally saving lives and literally educating in the future.
Speaker 3: I'm not going to claim that I'm on the same
Speaker 3: level as a teacher or nurse, but I do think
Speaker 3: it's a similar repeated notion that women are dominating. We
Speaker 3: earn more money than men in this industry. We have
Speaker 3: a louder voices, we have bigger platforms. Women are the
Speaker 3: main spenders and the main engagers in podcasting and in
Speaker 3: social media, so then it's seen as lesser value.
Speaker 4: It's also funny.
Speaker 3: I think Hanna said it's on her podcast or it
Speaker 3: may be in her press club, and it is also
Speaker 3: my friend so love her so much. She I think
Speaker 3: she was saying maybe it was over dinner with me.
Speaker 3: I can't remember when she was saying this.
Speaker 4: Because she's the same all the time. She's wonderful at
Speaker 4: the time.
Speaker 3: But Mark Boris, for example, he would never be called
Speaker 3: an influencer. He's a business owner first, for sure. But
Speaker 3: there are many business owners. For example, Brittany Lee Saunders,
Speaker 3: she has that incredible business fate. I think think women
Speaker 3: call her the business owner, but I think everyone sees
Speaker 3: her as an influencer or a YouTuber. It's kind of
Speaker 3: like that's the lowest common denominator. And I think in
Speaker 3: this election that was even more so the case. These
Speaker 3: far right men who are posting about restricting abortion access,
Speaker 3: or these men that are doing mocking videos of me
Speaker 3: which was all over my for you page, that are
Speaker 3: far right, and they're blatantly openly misogynistic. They openly don't
Speaker 3: want women to have rights and immigrants to have rights
Speaker 3: and people who are pressed have rights, First nations people,
Speaker 3: Yet they're not called influencers. They called commentators, they called
Speaker 3: media personalities. Yet me, someone who's hosted TV shows, radio,
Speaker 3: I've done every medium you can do, Yet I'm an
Speaker 3: influencer when it comes to politics. So it is quite
Speaker 3: reductive and dismissive. But personally, my theory is anyone that
Speaker 3: has an issue with influences for a sexist reason, I think, well,
Speaker 3: if you're offered money to post on the Internet, you
Speaker 3: would take it and you would then be an influencer.
Speaker 4: So I think with a.
Speaker 3: Lot of these men it comes from jealousy of not
Speaker 3: being able to hone in on that aspect. Obviously, others
Speaker 3: don't like influences for other reasons whatever. When it comes
Speaker 3: to the sexism and misogyny, I think that it's a
Speaker 3: very easy way to discredit women and also undermines how
Speaker 3: much intelligence and full thought and planning and kind of
Speaker 3: business mind it takes to have a following that is
Speaker 3: dedicated and engaged enough to monetize or a podcast, and
Speaker 3: we're talking about before how much effort it takes it
Speaker 3: in the podcast people. Actually, so you rock up and
Speaker 3: you yap and you go home, and it's hours and
Speaker 3: hours and hours of work, and it's work that.
Speaker 4: We enjoy doing, but it's not just nothing.
Speaker 3: And then I think, sorry, I'm going I'm going on,
Speaker 3: but I have so many thoughts about this.
Speaker 4: Then I think about, you.
Speaker 3: Know, the whole idea of we'll influencing isn't a real
Speaker 3: job and it should be dismissed because you could quote
Speaker 3: don't work, which okay, I've had a nine to five job.
Speaker 3: I've done radio, TV, everything that I could do, and
Speaker 3: I would say I will. I personally work more hours
Speaker 3: doing this job. That doesn't mean that I work more
Speaker 3: hours than everyone else has a normal job. Personally, how
Speaker 3: I operated in a nine to five I would sleep
Speaker 3: on night boss's desk and I would go for lunch
Speaker 3: from one till four. So personally, my work ethic is
Speaker 3: better doing influencing. That doesn't mean it's a harder job,
Speaker 3: but I do work. But also if someone thinks I
Speaker 3: didn't work, that's fine. My issue then comes with why
Speaker 3: do we then have to work ourselves to a bone
Speaker 3: to prove the way worthy of having a platform or
Speaker 3: having a voice. I think it's fine to think the
Speaker 3: influencers don't work enough because the pay is completely out
Speaker 3: weighs the actual hour's input.
Speaker 4: Absolutely.
Speaker 3: But when you say that influencing isn't a real job,
Speaker 3: even though I mean the ATO fucking thinks it does.
Speaker 4: Jesus Christ, the ATO is on my back all the time.
Speaker 3: But it really makes out like our only worth comes
Speaker 3: in a real job, only exists if you're working yourself
Speaker 3: to the bone.
Speaker 4: Which is a whole other conversation about capitalism.
Speaker 3: But I'll let you ask me other question because I've
Speaker 3: been talking for forty five minutes.
Speaker 1: Well, everything you say, there's like five other things that
Speaker 1: I want to ask about.
Speaker 2: But I'll go back actually to.
Speaker 1: When you was saying you wrote about this five years ago,
Speaker 1: about the sexism inherent in the way that we dismiss
Speaker 1: women or try to put labels on Well, you're getting
Speaker 1: a little bit too.
Speaker 2: Big for your boots.
Speaker 1: There as somebody that feels sometimes closer to one hundred and.
Speaker 2: Thirty than turning thirty.
Speaker 1: I remember when Julia Gillard became Prime Minister in twenty ten,
Speaker 1: and in that time she would sometimes she had a
Speaker 1: morning tea where there were god, I mean, race yourselves
Speaker 1: people from women's media quote unquote there who were being
Speaker 1: called mummy bloggers at the time. So fifteen years ago
Speaker 1: that was the parlance blogger, is this mummy blogers that?
Speaker 1: And I remember writing about it thinking well, why is
Speaker 1: that any different to you previous prime ministers like John
Speaker 1: Howard going and having mourning tea with the Australian cricket team.
Speaker 1: This is a photo opportunity. They're talking about serious issues.
Speaker 1: They're going on speaking to different high profile figures and
Speaker 1: as you say, that's an exchange of ideas. Is that
Speaker 1: this not what we want from our elected representatives. We
Speaker 1: want them to be representing the entire country, which by
Speaker 1: the way includes a few women. Maybe what everyone will
Speaker 1: you may want to remember, So mummy blogger, I feel
Speaker 1: was weaponized in the way that the phrase influencer has
Speaker 1: been during this recent federal election.
Speaker 4: That's really interesting.
Speaker 3: I was in grade ten when that was happening, so
Speaker 3: I didn't know about this bummy blogger era. You're so
Speaker 3: right about politicians need to speak to the everyday Australian
Speaker 3: and we put a threshold on who was allowed to
Speaker 3: be engaged in political conversation that only allows a certain
Speaker 3: group of people to be engaged and aware of politics,
Speaker 3: and I think that's what mainstream media want and what
Speaker 3: the two major parties want. And when we have people
Speaker 3: like quote unquote mummy bloggers or influencers speaking to their audiences,
Speaker 3: people get threatened because then the public can understand how
Speaker 3: much their vote actually counts. And it feels like when
Speaker 3: we exclude certain groups people, particularly women in this instance,
Speaker 3: but all different marginalized groups, and we exclude them where
Speaker 3: making their vote count a little bit less. Because the
Speaker 3: way that a lot of young people vote, I do't
Speaker 3: know if it still happens, but when I mean fifteen
Speaker 3: years ago, is that long ago. But things have changed
Speaker 3: very rapidly with social media in terms of what the
Speaker 3: kids do in these days, and I love it. I
Speaker 3: think they're slightly more engaged. But I think when I
Speaker 3: was a teenager and even in my early twenties, all
Speaker 3: my friends voted how their parents voted, and how their
Speaker 3: parents voted is how their dad voted, So really a
Speaker 3: household was almost led by the male corporate vote, which
Speaker 3: is what these press conferences usually were filled with people
Speaker 3: that read the Financial Review or you know.
Speaker 4: The Australian.
Speaker 3: And now we have more engagement so I feel like
Speaker 3: it's distributing that power of the vote more so to
Speaker 3: every single person. And the reality is everyone had an
Speaker 3: issue with me talking about the election, but no one
Speaker 3: could say anything that I said that was wrong. It
Speaker 3: was very like I said, it was preferential voting, it
Speaker 3: was year four, the government stuff, you.
Speaker 4: Know that not everyone remembers or knows.
Speaker 3: I had to do a little refresher to make sure
Speaker 3: all my worting was correct, obviously with like minority government
Speaker 3: and hung Parliament and making sure it's all correct.
Speaker 4: But the reality is everyone.
Speaker 3: Should have access to this information and everyone should understand
Speaker 3: how much the policies actually tangibly affect them, rather than
Speaker 3: just thinking that politicians are for that middle aged, corporate
Speaker 3: group of people. Because the reality is the actions of
Speaker 3: politicians and political parties impact everyone, but they impact young
Speaker 3: people the most because we're going to be here for
Speaker 3: the longest time out of everyone here. So I think
Speaker 3: it's very interesting the way that it makes me suspicious
Speaker 3: when there is a resistance to having every day Australians
Speaker 3: being involved in politics.
Speaker 1: And coming up is getting married something Abby and her
Speaker 1: partner Adam Hyde is starting to think about.
Speaker 2: As you and I are speaking. It's June.
Speaker 1: Next month the newly formed Anthony Albanezi government will see it.
Speaker 1: Parliament will resume for the first time in July. So
Speaker 1: obviously in the recent weeks has been a lot of
Speaker 1: very closely contested seats and one of the high profile
Speaker 1: casualties was somebody that you just mentioned, Green's leader, Adam
Speaker 1: bann Abby. What I actually wanted to ask you about
Speaker 1: was the way that some people would respond to that news,
Speaker 1: whether that's great news or bad news for them personally,
Speaker 1: dependent on their political allegiances, rather than thinking about that
Speaker 1: would go oh great, Abby, Chatfield's going to be devastated,
Speaker 1: and that's their first reaction.
Speaker 4: Yeah, they're obsessed.
Speaker 3: It's really sad, But I think it's really funny because
Speaker 3: Adam bent is a lovely man. He's so great, he's wonderful.
Speaker 3: In Australia, we don't have a system like the US.
Speaker 3: It isn't like this cult of personality thing with Trump,
Speaker 3: for example, even sometimes Democrats, even Harris to a certain degree,
Speaker 3: had that and Obama had that for sure, but not
Speaker 3: as insidious as Trump. But people have a really touchment
Speaker 3: to individuals. We're in Australia. You know, when I was
Speaker 3: in that era with Gillard and Abbott and all of
Speaker 3: all of this chaos. I remember when I was there
Speaker 3: was a year we had three prime ministers in a
Speaker 3: year or something. We don't have that attachment to individuals.
Speaker 3: So it is funny people will go and crying about
Speaker 3: Adam Bent still a comment still today anything I got
Speaker 3: a dancing video cry about Adam Bant. I think Adam
Speaker 3: Ban was a great leader of the Greens. Adam Bent
Speaker 3: lost his seat. That's that's upsetting for him. The Greens
Speaker 3: aren't non existent, and my main motivation is to deter people,
Speaker 3: not deterbeoble is too. People think about the impacts of
Speaker 3: the major parties and I would hope that a minority
Speaker 3: government would exist soon so that could also come in
Speaker 3: the form of supporting independence. I'm not and this is
Speaker 3: the mistake I think a lot of people on the
Speaker 3: right make is because they are particularly Trump supporters, Australian
Speaker 3: Trump supporters. They are in they are under the influence
Speaker 3: of a cult like personality. Some of them are actually
Speaker 3: in a cult and they think that everyone else exists
Speaker 3: that way with politicians. I'm not a fan girl of
Speaker 3: Adam Bant. I like the Greens policies and he was
Speaker 3: the leader at the time, so I have no personal
Speaker 3: feelings about it. Even the headline then it's is Abby
Speaker 3: show's despair. I think I uploaded an Instagram story going
Speaker 3: guys on freaking out. It's all I did, in between
Speaker 3: four hundred other stories, and then telled on too like
Speaker 3: I'm some overly emotional again, overly emotional, hysterical woman who's
Speaker 3: sobbing about Adam Bant.
Speaker 4: That sucks.
Speaker 3: Larisa Waters is an incredible Greens leader. She has been
Speaker 3: a lawyer, she's a woman, she is a single parent,
Speaker 3: I believe currently and I met her.
Speaker 4: And she's from Queensland. Like May, I think it's fabulous.
Speaker 3: So having new leadership isn't something of the Greens, isn't
Speaker 3: something that makes me cry or upset. I was trying
Speaker 3: to get progressive policies on the table for Australians. It
Speaker 3: wasn't that I had a sports team that was going
Speaker 3: to win. And it's not the NROL Grand it's not
Speaker 3: the side of Origin. It's I felt as though Green's
Speaker 3: policies would help and the Greens did well in the
Speaker 3: Senate considering, and I'm not crying about it as much
Speaker 3: as they'd love. It's bizarre that the first thought is
Speaker 3: I'm going to get Abby Chatfield. That's because of headlines
Speaker 3: like this. It reinforces their ideas that I am emotionally
Speaker 3: invested in things. Both sides think that I think that
Speaker 3: I'm an expert and that I'm emotionally invested in the outcome.
Speaker 3: But the reality is I'm trying to reduce harm during
Speaker 3: an election year that I think was really pivotal in
Speaker 3: our history.
Speaker 1: I think it is also emblematic of the fact that
Speaker 1: we are living in hyperpartisan times where there is often
Speaker 1: a lack of humanity or grace shown for anyone that
Speaker 1: has a different view, and I think that you can
Speaker 1: see that bubble up at election times and election nights
Speaker 1: and in the days after, where people will go ha
Speaker 1: ha ha, your side loss, like it is a football
Speaker 1: game example, that you just gave what about for you?
Speaker 1: Then on the other sides, So I watched, I was
Speaker 1: glued to all of the media platforms on election night,
Speaker 1: and when Peter Duddan conceded, I thought there were a
Speaker 1: lot of great speeches that night on all sides of
Speaker 1: the political divide, and I personally thought that Peter Dunn's
Speaker 1: concession speech was fantastic, Yes, and I'd love to ask
Speaker 1: you about that, Abby, how you feel about that And
Speaker 1: do you think that we as a society show enough
Speaker 1: grace when the other side doesn't win. Whoever we feel
Speaker 1: because we all saw globally what happened in twenty twenty
Speaker 1: in the US when Donald Trump wouldn't concede. I think
Speaker 1: you know, I was never necessarily huge Bill Shorten fan,
Speaker 1: but I thought his concession speech in twenty nineteen against
Speaker 1: Scott Morrison was incredibly gracious. I just think I'm just
Speaker 1: trying to make it quite partisan. Yes, it's important in
Speaker 1: a leader, even if they're about to pack out the door.
Speaker 1: So again, very long adhd worded question here, but I
Speaker 1: did want to ask you about that notion about it
Speaker 1: being a football game and about this hyperpartisanship, because I
Speaker 1: definitely think that the two sides can.
Speaker 2: Give as ugly as each other.
Speaker 3: Yes, I think that the concession speech from Dutton was good, great, wonderful,
Speaker 3: and as you said, it's very important that there is
Speaker 3: a calm and dignified exit for the sake of that
Speaker 3: party in particular.
Speaker 4: No matter which side of the island is.
Speaker 3: I do think though of this idea that both sides
Speaker 3: can be as bad as each other is interesting and
Speaker 3: quite frustrating for me, to be honest, because one side
Speaker 3: is saying they want to restrict women's access to abortion,
Speaker 3: they don't want to care about climate change, they don't
Speaker 3: think that they should be welcome to country. They think
Speaker 3: that we shouldn't give any assistance or mine to our
Speaker 3: First Nations people as a systemically oppressed. They want to
Speaker 3: get rid of trans writes there's.
Speaker 4: A real need.
Speaker 3: It feels like far right, far far right people is
Speaker 3: who I'm talking about, Not people who are liberal voters,
Speaker 3: center right, you know, but far right people come into,
Speaker 3: for example, my comments and say the most horrific things.
Speaker 3: I'll reply with saying this is disgusting, and I'll get
Speaker 3: told that I'm fueling the war between the two sides,
Speaker 3: or that I'm making the divide greater, when the reality
Speaker 3: is there is often it's often provocation from people who
Speaker 3: are trolling on the internet and who are harassing people online,
Speaker 3: and they believe that their.
Speaker 4: View is as equal as someone else's.
Speaker 3: I don't believe that someone who was transphobic or someone
Speaker 3: who thinks at First Nations people don't deserve equal rights.
Speaker 3: I don't think their view is equal to the view
Speaker 3: of someone that does believe people deserve equal rights.
Speaker 4: I don't believe it's someone.
Speaker 3: I don't think that that is a crazy thing for
Speaker 3: me to feel, particularly when it comes to Maga. In
Speaker 3: the I think there's much more of a partisan divide.
Speaker 3: I think Australia because of our preferential voting, I think
Speaker 3: and I hope, and even from my point of view,
Speaker 3: I think everyone that is still supporting Trump is genuinely
Speaker 3: I think they are a deeply bad person. I think
Speaker 3: it is at this point not acceptable. I think people
Speaker 3: who are supporting Dutton are not that way.
Speaker 4: I don't think that.
Speaker 3: I think that they have regular ways of voting. They
Speaker 3: may have their own self as interest. I don't agree
Speaker 3: with some of the things, a lot of the Liberal
Speaker 3: Party policies, but there are some policies that I was like, yeah, sure,
Speaker 3: Like they're increasing the mental health medicare sure. There were
Speaker 3: some policies that I was like, yeah, sure, that's fine.
Speaker 3: It isn't as extreme in Australia, and I think it
Speaker 3: is because of preferential voting, because in the States they
Speaker 3: can kind of get away with going, well, you have
Speaker 3: to choose between these two, that's all you've got, and
Speaker 3: neither you're going to be on the woke left or
Speaker 3: are you going to be on a maga. In Australia,
Speaker 3: we can kind of, I mean, by definition to our preferences.
Speaker 4: So it's kind of.
Speaker 3: I don't think that both sides are as bad as
Speaker 3: each other, because one side is if we' talk about
Speaker 3: far right extremists, I'm not talking about people like I
Speaker 3: said that a CenTra center right or you know, things
Speaker 3: like that in Australia. But I think at this point
Speaker 3: people that are Maga or maga esque in their thinking.
Speaker 3: At this stage, they're supporting mass deportations of US citizens,
Speaker 3: they are anti the constitution, they I have elected a
Speaker 3: convicted felon. It's I think it's very different. And the
Speaker 3: hate quote unquote, the hateful left is always reactionary to
Speaker 3: someone saying something that is genuinely dangerous. But I do
Speaker 3: think there's more middle ground and gray area in Australia
Speaker 3: than the US.
Speaker 4: I think the US is it's not going to go well.
Speaker 1: To be honest, if someone will was listening to this
Speaker 1: and they said, oh no, no, no, I've been completely.
Speaker 2: Booted off Twitter.
Speaker 1: Back in the day, which is now known as x
Speaker 1: I'm mentioning that because that became somewhere that I think
Speaker 1: really just it's.
Speaker 2: An absolute cess pit now.
Speaker 1: But I think there was a time going back to
Speaker 1: even those gillardeas I was talking about, where I saw
Speaker 1: a lot of people that were center left that became
Speaker 1: very disenfranchised and disillusioned with the progressive side of politics,
Speaker 1: because that was a lot of trolling and a lot
Speaker 1: of what we would now demonize as quote unquote woke.
Speaker 2: Just for the record, I actually hate.
Speaker 1: The phrase woke, and I hated the phrase politically correct.
Speaker 2: I think it's just a way of silencing people. Yes,
Speaker 2: are trying to stand up for issues.
Speaker 1: But I definitely do know that there will be a
Speaker 1: lot of people that go, no, no, no, I've been
Speaker 1: victimized by progressives. So that's why I just always think
Speaker 1: it's interesting the humanity of it. Yes, in the US,
Speaker 1: there was during the US presidential combat, which I agree
Speaker 1: with you, Aby, I think, thank god it is very
Speaker 1: different here.
Speaker 2: Yes, but there were our peds being.
Speaker 1: Written by people saying I went on a blind date,
Speaker 1: turned out that he was a Trump voter, and I
Speaker 1: left the blind Date, and I remember thinking, oh gosh, like,
Speaker 1: I personally don't think me as a person at this
Speaker 1: point in my life would ever feel that there's not
Speaker 1: more to a person than that.
Speaker 2: What about for you?
Speaker 1: Do you?
Speaker 2: As you say, Dunne was a different character.
Speaker 4: Yeah, Dunne was different.
Speaker 3: I think with Trump supporters, people who support Trump, he
Speaker 3: has bragged about sexually assaulting women. If you could look
Speaker 3: past that, he is an incredibly racist, misogynistic man. He
Speaker 3: took out a whole ad in the New York Times,
Speaker 3: I believe, with the Central Park five calling for their
Speaker 3: execution five innocent black men. He refused to lease out
Speaker 3: his properties to black people in the US. So there
Speaker 3: is history of very clear racism. Sexy and we said
Speaker 3: that all Mexicans are rapists. He's currently deporting children who
Speaker 3: are are without any safety, and there are ice frays
Speaker 3: going on and US citizens are being sent without due
Speaker 3: process to al Salvador. I think that is I don't
Speaker 3: think that's a safe person to be around. I would
Speaker 3: not want to be around someone that supports a felon
Speaker 3: proven to be liable for rape, brags about sexual assault.
Speaker 3: I don't that's not someone that I think is safe
Speaker 3: for women to be around. I don't think women should
Speaker 3: date Trump supporters. I think it's or I don't think
Speaker 3: you can have or people that support Andrew Tape, people
Speaker 3: that support uh I mean Jordan.
Speaker 4: Peterson, I mean yeah, Jordan Peterson.
Speaker 3: At this stage, I think these far right people people
Speaker 3: are actively dangerous to women, and I don't think that
Speaker 3: anyone should be dating someone who's a misogynists. I don't
Speaker 3: think you should be if they're a woman. It's like
Speaker 3: you wouldn't ask a trans person data transphobe. You wouldn't
Speaker 3: ask a gay person to date a homophobe. You wouldn't
Speaker 3: ask a person of color data racist. So why are
Speaker 3: we okay with women dating misogynists. It's not okay. It's
Speaker 3: very dangerous in fact, So I would definitely navidate someone
Speaker 3: who even was a political personally. I think that's a
Speaker 3: huge privilege to be a political But if you're a
Speaker 3: Trump supporter, you're either incredibly uneducated or you're a bad person.
Speaker 4: That's my personal opinion. I don't think it's okay.
Speaker 3: In terms of Dutton, though, I think a lot of
Speaker 3: like I said, a lot of Australians vote the way
Speaker 3: their parents vote, and with mandatory voting. There are a
Speaker 3: lot of people in Australia and mistiffers from the US
Speaker 3: as well. People vote passionately. In the US, we vote obligatory,
Speaker 3: which I think is wonderful. I think it's good that
Speaker 3: we're forced to be involved in this. In terms of
Speaker 3: Dutton supporters, it's a similar thing, but.
Speaker 4: Not as extreme.
Speaker 3: I think that everyone should date whoever they want to,
Speaker 3: and political voting is an indication of moral values, and
Speaker 3: I think that if you differ on certain policies. I mean,
Speaker 3: someone could say I'm going to vote for Dutton because
Speaker 3: I think that's super policy, taking super out as good,
Speaker 3: but I don't believe anything else. I'd say, Okay, so
Speaker 3: you don't understand that policy or how that could impact
Speaker 3: housing prices, and you're super in the future, that's workable,
Speaker 3: you know what I mean.
Speaker 4: But I yeah, I think it's.
Speaker 3: Completely reasonable to not want to date someone who is
Speaker 3: politically dangerous to you.
Speaker 2: I am conscious of times. So there's so many other
Speaker 2: things I.
Speaker 4: Wanted to ask you about.
Speaker 1: It's right, there are just so many other political questions
Speaker 1: I wanted to ask, But I did want to also
Speaker 1: move on to something else that's made news recently with yourself,
Speaker 1: which is actually just with Clement time forward. Oh yes,
Speaker 1: the writer who recently went after you on her newsletter,
Speaker 1: I think and said, this is why we have Australian
Speaker 1: influences like Abby Chatfield profiting from the performance of being
Speaker 1: politically engaged and presenting herself as a voice of feminist
Speaker 1: and political authority while railing against anyone who demands more
Speaker 1: from her than shallow aphorisms and platforming genocide supporters. Unquote,
Speaker 1: you responded on TikTok, I don't really need to rehash
Speaker 1: what you said, you well, because you will obviously give
Speaker 1: me a more updated version.
Speaker 2: Now.
Speaker 1: With all of those headlines and the way that's something
Speaker 1: like that, there's so much hate around it from a
Speaker 1: public point of view, what's a light for you being
Speaker 1: in the middle of a story like that.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean I feel like I'm in the middle
Speaker 3: of stories like that all the time, so it's kind of,
Speaker 3: unfortunately my norm, but it's never enjoyable or pleasant. The
Speaker 3: reason why I felt the reason why I started talking
Speaker 3: about what Clement tin have been saying was kind of
Speaker 3: by accident.
Speaker 4: I was talking about something.
Speaker 3: Else in general, the way that there is this expectation
Speaker 3: of if you are speaking about one topic, for example,
Speaker 3: the election or something political, then it seems to make
Speaker 3: people have this I don't want to say in fighting
Speaker 3: because that feels like again, like a right wing It's
Speaker 3: kind of like the way that the quote unquote woke
Speaker 3: thing where you go that feels like a catchup that
Speaker 3: isn't really right. But there's this idea that if you
Speaker 3: aren't doing everything, then you're performing. If you aren't, if
Speaker 3: you aren't all day, every day talking about every single
Speaker 3: topic there's possible, then you're performative. And that then discourages
Speaker 3: people from speaking about political issues. And people can say
Speaker 3: that isn't true. I know influencers, I know musicians, I
Speaker 3: know actors.
Speaker 4: I'm sure you do as well.
Speaker 3: People are too scared to speak about things even as
Speaker 3: basic as climate change because there will be people that
Speaker 3: are saying that it isn't good enough, and they'll go
Speaker 3: through with the fine tooth com and find all the
Speaker 3: reasons why you're performative. And there seems to be more
Speaker 3: focus on finding if someone is performative verse focusing on
Speaker 3: people that aren't doing anything at all, aren't speaking at all,
Speaker 3: or are being outright dangerous and the reason why the
Speaker 3: Clementines Clementines comments were so distressing to me. It wasn't
Speaker 3: that she had the opinion that I shouldn't have had
Speaker 3: Anthony Apaneese in the podcast. I understand that opinion. The
Speaker 3: reason I had him on the podcast, like I was
Speaker 3: saying before, was to give my audience access to his policies.
Speaker 4: I asked the questions.
Speaker 3: I had an hour with the Prime Minister to cover
Speaker 3: every single election topic, and I am very proud of
Speaker 3: how I did that podcast. People have demanded that I
Speaker 3: apologize for it. I am proud of how I did
Speaker 3: the podcast. I think the podcast did what I wanted
Speaker 3: to do, and that was convert people who either didn't
Speaker 3: vote at all, who said I'll just cop the fine,
Speaker 3: people who voted liberal, or people who were so a
Speaker 3: political they would just go I guess I like the
Speaker 3: look of this person's poster.
Speaker 4: Whatever.
Speaker 3: The point was to engage you more politically, not for
Speaker 3: me to debate the Prime Minister.
Speaker 4: But I understand the criticisms. I totally hear it. I
Speaker 4: get it.
Speaker 3: But my issue isn't the criticisms. And I think this
Speaker 3: happens a little bit, not too often, but what Clementine
Speaker 3: was doing was It's ironic the way that she is
Speaker 3: assuming malicious intent from an outspoken woman in media. I
Speaker 3: find it very ironic that she's also believing these headlines
Speaker 3: that I'm making myself a feminist voice, I'm making myself
Speaker 3: a political I'm just speaking about my opinions.
Speaker 4: He is my true opinions. I don't know anyone that would.
Speaker 3: Voluntarily get trolled violently all day, every day for a
Speaker 3: fucking Instagram post.
Speaker 4: I could do.
Speaker 3: The most listened to podcast I've ever done was an
Speaker 3: interview with an ex Loveland contestant, and then it comes
Speaker 3: to maths Freecaps.
Speaker 4: I could do that so easily every week.
Speaker 3: I could do Love Island, Married at First Sight Batch,
Speaker 3: I could do all of them all year long, and
Speaker 3: I'd be I own more money than I am now.
Speaker 3: But the reality is my podcast is entirely and you
Speaker 3: get this with ADHD. I can't speak about things unless
Speaker 3: unless I'm obsessed, or I'm interested, or there's something there
Speaker 3: that I want to talk about. So my issue wasn't
Speaker 3: her critique on the podcast with Anthony ALBERNIZI many people
Speaker 3: had the same critique, and I was okay with that,
Speaker 3: but it's when it comes to demanding that I apologize
Speaker 3: with something that I had a reason for doing that podcast,
Speaker 3: but also when it comes to her lying about me.
Speaker 3: That was when I was really frustrated because I didn't
Speaker 3: realize what she'd been saying, and it wasn't just a newsletter,
Speaker 3: it was her sub stack, her newsletter, Instagram stories also
Speaker 3: about Hannah Ferguson as well. She'd called me an idiotic narcissist.
Speaker 3: She said that I didn't prep my own podcast. She'd
Speaker 3: said that I parrot uncredited sound bites or something similar,
Speaker 3: essentially saying that I'm a complete fraud.
Speaker 4: I don't have any thoughts of my own.
Speaker 3: I'm a deeply basic thinker and a very smart self promoter.
Speaker 3: All these things that were attacking my character, which I
Speaker 3: am not okay with. You can take my work all
Speaker 3: you like, but I'm not sure why as a prominent
Speaker 3: feminist voice currently, you're deciding to spend to include me
Speaker 3: in newsletters, substacks, all these things, because I didn't do
Speaker 3: my activism exactly the way that you would like me to.
Speaker 3: The critique is fine, the personal attacks are not, and
Speaker 3: the personal attacks in themselves calling me a narcissist repeatedly
Speaker 3: call me, giving me a personality diagnosis, saying that I
Speaker 3: change my personality every week.
Speaker 4: It's just different podcast topics.
Speaker 3: But okay, it kind of instills this idea of like
Speaker 3: a hysterical, outspoken woman in me. Yeah, and that I
Speaker 3: do too many things again, and it's very ironic, this
Speaker 3: whole thing. And there are things that Clementine has done
Speaker 3: that I don't agree with it all, but I haven't
Speaker 3: said anything about it, and I won't say anything about
Speaker 3: it in depth because I don't have any interest in
Speaker 3: discrediting a woman who most likely experiences.
Speaker 4: And has experience for longer than me.
Speaker 3: The same trolling that I get from right wing weirdos,
Speaker 3: because all you're doing is giving them them more fuel
Speaker 3: in order to troll me people who have genuine critiques,
Speaker 3: is not trolling. But the reality is he got on
Speaker 3: the left and the right control and this idea that
Speaker 3: because I'm not doing things perfectly, that I'm an idiotic nasist,
Speaker 3: I don't know anything, I'm brain dead, I'm a deeply
Speaker 3: basic thinker. All these they're just insults. It's not actually
Speaker 3: critiquing my work, and it's really it was really hurtful
Speaker 3: because then after that the right wing comments come in,
Speaker 3: saying nothing better than a cat fight, climbat clement time
Speaker 3: two feminist fighting. See, you can't even agree with each other.
Speaker 3: And that's why I hadn't spoken about her ever, and
Speaker 3: the things that she's done that I don't agree with,
Speaker 3: and even to this day, she's done things since and
Speaker 3: I've seen that I've gone.
Speaker 4: People have asked me to comment on that. I'm not
Speaker 4: commenting on it.
Speaker 3: I don't want to comment about her work. She can
Speaker 3: comment about mine, but I certainly would never comment about
Speaker 3: her having a personality disorder or anything like that. And
Speaker 3: I think that it's just, yeah, deeply ironic that she
Speaker 3: I also think there's a space in feminism for people
Speaker 3: to have quote unquote basic thoughts, because, as we were
Speaker 3: talking about before, to get people in, you can't start with.
Speaker 4: The finals of agenda studies.
Speaker 3: Course, there are people who don't even know what the
Speaker 3: patriarchy is women or people don't even know what domestic
Speaker 3: labor is, basic basic things, and that isn't their fault.
Speaker 3: It's because society isn't teachers. So personally, if she thinks
Speaker 3: that my thoughts are based, that's okay, but I'm not
Speaker 3: sure why there's so much anger and vitriol behind a
Speaker 3: basic thought. I see influences all the time that are
Speaker 3: fashion influencers or they do other things, and they have
Speaker 3: basic takes on feminism, but they're correct. I'll do a repost.
Speaker 3: I go, reshare, I'm not angry at them for having
Speaker 3: a quote unquote basic thought. I go, how amazing. Now
Speaker 3: we have the women who are engaged in this fashion
Speaker 3: influences post understanding that financial independence is important, for example,
Speaker 3: or that our coercive control exists, or.
Speaker 4: The basics of DV. That makes me happy.
Speaker 3: The more people that are involved in this conversation makes
Speaker 3: me happy if they aren't saying things that are incorrect
Speaker 3: or damaging. And while Clementine would say that me having
Speaker 3: Anthony Abernese in the podcast is damaging, there are two
Speaker 3: different goals that we have. I was trying to bring
Speaker 3: in more people to understand to keep Dutton out, and
Speaker 3: I don't agree with Anthony Auberneze's stance on Gaza or
Speaker 3: the labor Hardi stance on Gaza at all. Peter Dutton's
Speaker 3: stence was much worse, and I just wanted to keep
Speaker 3: Peter Dutton out for a myriad of reasons, and I
Speaker 3: think it's interesting to other than that it's just attacking
Speaker 3: my personality. But everyone then hears those things and they
Speaker 3: assume malice. Even in the language it is used around
Speaker 3: me by some people who believe that I'm a nassist
Speaker 3: on the left and say that I'm performative. Everything that
Speaker 3: I do is over analyzed. Even those stories that I
Speaker 3: posted about Clementine. It was like, there was one comment
Speaker 3: that I saw on someone's post going the way she
Speaker 3: victimized herself and then didn't add the next day proves
Speaker 3: that she's performative. That doesn't prove anything. That proves that
Speaker 3: I had a contractual obligation. And these are the same
Speaker 3: people that would have an issue with influences quotquot not working.
Speaker 4: I have work to do. I have to do work.
Speaker 3: I can't pause that work because I'm feeling incredibly depressed,
Speaker 3: having a PTSD trigger. I have to post the thing.
Speaker 3: I have to do it. It's also scheduled already, so
Speaker 3: I'm not gonna unschedule it. But even the wording of
Speaker 3: like she victimizes herself, rather than saying she's upset about something,
Speaker 3: it's this assumption again, and it comes to the far left,
Speaker 3: and I'm honestly file lift a bit much. It comes
Speaker 3: from a certain part of left. It isn't even on
Speaker 3: the spectrum. It certain people online that I want to
Speaker 3: find evidence that I'm an awful, awful person, and I
Speaker 3: am really beyond sick of it. It feels like because
Speaker 3: I am, I do get this media attention that I'm
Speaker 3: punished for it by all sides, and everyone says, see,
Speaker 3: you're not perfect, and I go, I never said that
Speaker 3: I was. So I'm just posting what I'm interested in
Speaker 3: or what I care about, and I will apologize for
Speaker 3: things if I feel that I need to. But having
Speaker 3: Anthony Alberanezi on the podcast, I know personally changed thousands
Speaker 3: of votes. I got fat thousands of dms from people
Speaker 3: somewhat my friend's dad, who's a truck driver in Queensland
Speaker 3: who's voted Liberal and One Nation his whole life, he
Speaker 3: voted for the Labor Party and in my opinion, voting
Speaker 3: for the Labor Party in this election was preferred over
Speaker 3: the Liberal Party in my opinion and also in the
Speaker 3: opinion of left wing politics. I don't think that I
Speaker 3: have the power to change the liberal voter to vote
Speaker 3: Greens or Victorian Socialists. I wish that I did, but
Speaker 3: I also interviewed a Victorian Socialists. I also interviewed someone
Speaker 3: from the Greens. And the strategy that I had was
Speaker 3: to go from labor to Greens to socialists, to ease
Speaker 3: the minto the water like frogs. And I just felt
Speaker 3: that it was important to this election. Talk to Anthony alberneasy.
Speaker 3: But it is hurtful coming from a prominent feminist because
Speaker 3: then it turns into headlines. I saw a headline on
Speaker 3: Facebook that was like feminist cat fight, and it's like
Speaker 3: very demeaning. And that isn't comn Time's fault, but it
Speaker 3: is something that she should have considered and that I
Speaker 3: have considered when I haven't caught he out. The things
Speaker 3: that I would say are deeply damaging, but I'm not
Speaker 3: going to go into them.
Speaker 1: Last time we spoke, we spoke about your relationship with
Speaker 1: Adam Hyde, your partner.
Speaker 2: You've been together for a while now.
Speaker 1: When we spoke last year, was saying you felt a
Speaker 1: lot more optimistic about it than you had normally in
Speaker 1: a relationship. Sounds like good reason for that, because you're
Speaker 1: still together coming up to thirty. Love to ask you
Speaker 1: about going into thirties. Very old fashioned question here, but
Speaker 1: you will no doubt get it. Are you starting to
Speaker 1: think differently about relationships? So people starting to say, when are.
Speaker 2: You going to put a ring on it?
Speaker 4: Abby and Adam, Well, my friends are not really. My
Speaker 4: first friend got married a couple of weeks ago.
Speaker 3: My friends are all in their mid thirties, normalmen, So
Speaker 3: my friends aren't really adhering to that kind of societal norm.
Speaker 4: So not really. And I have a single mother, so
Speaker 4: my mum isn't really doing it.
Speaker 3: Mum is doing the God my friend Sue's got a grandchild,
Speaker 3: isn't that lovely? She's doing subtle quote unquote subtle hints.
Speaker 3: But I think that I like, I mean, I think
Speaker 3: that I've always been like, if I get married, great,
Speaker 3: if I have kids great, whatever, we'll see what happens.
Speaker 3: And I'm still kind of in that. But if I
Speaker 3: was gonna marry have kids with anyone, it would be Adam.
Speaker 3: He's just been I mean, yeah, it's like a year
Speaker 3: and a half now, a year and a bit, I
Speaker 3: don't know, and he moved in recently, and it's all
Speaker 3: just been so great, and it's really quite jarring in
Speaker 3: a little ways seeing what a healthy relationship is like
Speaker 3: from the inside, Like it's quite makes me go WHOA.
Speaker 4: So I guess I'm thinking of relationships differently.
Speaker 3: In that I see this relationship from the inside and
Speaker 3: I'm like, oh, I shouldn't have ever been with any
Speaker 3: of those losers before, Like that was a big mistake
Speaker 3: on my behalf. So uh, yeah, it's it's been. It's
Speaker 3: been great. I said to Adam, and I said, I'm TikTok.
Speaker 3: I think I was saying that, you know, I had
Speaker 3: an epiphany about our relationship and about relationships in general.
Speaker 4: And I've realized the more that I'm with Adam, the.
Speaker 3: Less that I feel like I need to be with him,
Speaker 3: But it's more that I want to be with him more.
Speaker 4: I want to more.
Speaker 3: But that's something I'd never had in a relationship, And
Speaker 3: in that from that, I know that I mean, hopefully
Speaker 3: Adam night to get the fit ever touch would but
Speaker 3: if we weren't together. This relationship has changed my outlook
Speaker 3: on relationships in that I understand that I should only
Speaker 3: be in a relationship if it's genuinely benefiting me in
Speaker 3: more than one aspect of my life because the amount
Speaker 3: of work I've been able to do and the amount
Speaker 3: of you know, friendships I've been able to dive deeper into,
Speaker 3: and the amount of more time I have having a
Speaker 3: happy relationship first, having this thing that drains you when
Speaker 3: you're talking about it and thinking about and you're anxious
Speaker 3: and it's awful. It's like, I either need to be
Speaker 3: alone or be with Adam. It was kind of my
Speaker 3: two options at this point in a good way. In
Speaker 3: a oh A romantic relationship isn't necessary. It is a
Speaker 3: wonderful odd on, but my value and my actual life
Speaker 3: benefits more when I'm not worrying about the toxic, shitty relationships.
Speaker 3: So the options are a perfect one, none at all,
Speaker 3: and Adam and I are wonderful.
Speaker 4: So that's how it's changed. I love that for you.
Speaker 2: Abby. You mentioned your mom there.
Speaker 1: Yeah, there's been rumors she might be popping up on
Speaker 1: the Golden Bachelor.
Speaker 2: Don't do that to me, but I mean, I'm okay.
Speaker 1: I don't think Abby's going to answer that, but I'm
Speaker 1: just saying, I mean, we've saw what you, being runner
Speaker 1: up on The Bachelor six years ago has done for
Speaker 1: the Australian media.
Speaker 2: It's never been the same since.
Speaker 1: Oh god, love to see that happen again with the
Speaker 1: next generation.
Speaker 4: Oh my god, yeah, time will tell. Don't make me
Speaker 4: do that.
Speaker 3: But I guess that's kind of an answer, isn't it.
Speaker 3: But I work for Warner Brothers, so I'm not going
Speaker 3: to say anything.
Speaker 2: Abby.
Speaker 1: Happy birthday, all the best for your thirtieth.
Speaker 2: I will look forward to seeing you again, mama. And
Speaker 2: we'll do this again in.
Speaker 1: A year, will we in a year one? And I
Speaker 1: turn one hundred and thirty one.
Speaker 2: And you can hear more.
Speaker 1: From the fabulous Abby Chatfield on It's a Lot wherever
Speaker 1: you get your podcasts.
Speaker 4: Thank you for joining us today.
Speaker 1: You can also watch this episode by following the link
Speaker 1: in our show notes, and make sure you're following something
Speaker 1: to talk about, because we'll be back with another exclusive
Speaker 1: guest next week.