WEBVTT - QANTAS crash: How Alan Joyce lost a $9 million bonus

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<v Speaker 1>From Schwartz Media. I'm Ruby Jones. This is seven am.

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<v Speaker 1>Alan Joyce was once hailed as a savior of one

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<v Speaker 1>of Australia's most beloved icons. The former CEO of Quantus

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<v Speaker 1>was championed by his board and well known in the

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<v Speaker 1>Australian business community for his supportive social justice causes during

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<v Speaker 1>his fifteen years in the job. So it's been a

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<v Speaker 1>dramatic fall from grace. Alan Joyce has now left his

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<v Speaker 1>successes with a reputational mess after a series of bad

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<v Speaker 1>decisions that left customers furious, and has had his bonus

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<v Speaker 1>cut by millions. Today reporter Mark Montcrief on what Joyce

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<v Speaker 1>did wrong and whether his punishment will do anything to

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<v Speaker 1>rebuild Australia's trust in Quantus. It's Wednesday, August twenty one.

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<v Speaker 1>So Mark, there was this headline in the Daily Mail

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<v Speaker 1>last week that read the face of a man who

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<v Speaker 1>just lost his nine million dollar bonus, and there were

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<v Speaker 1>these photos of Alan Joyce, the former CEO of Quantus,

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<v Speaker 1>looking pretty dejected. So can you put that nine million

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<v Speaker 1>dollars in perspective for me?

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<v Speaker 2>I know it's never going to be a great day

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<v Speaker 2>when you find out you're not getting nine million dollars

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<v Speaker 2>you thought was coming your way, But he's going to

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<v Speaker 2>be okay. Initially his bonus was going to be worth

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<v Speaker 2>something like sixteen million dollars, and the amount that they

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<v Speaker 2>brought back is a little bit more than nine million dollars.

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<v Speaker 2>I think he made something north of one hundred million

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<v Speaker 2>dollars out.

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<v Speaker 3>Of Quantis during his fifteen years there.

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<v Speaker 2>So he does have some money left over in this

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<v Speaker 2>whole process, and we should keep that in mind.

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<v Speaker 3>He's not going to go brook anytime soon.

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<v Speaker 1>Right, So Mark, when did things begin to go wrong

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<v Speaker 1>for Joyce?

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<v Speaker 2>So the place to start really is in May last year.

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<v Speaker 2>That's when Joyce announced that he was going to be

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<v Speaker 2>leaving Quantus after fifteen years as its chief executive. And

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<v Speaker 2>initially his plan was that he was going to be

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<v Speaker 2>leaving in November, So we're talking about November of twenty

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<v Speaker 2>twenty three, and he was going to be handing over

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<v Speaker 2>to Vanessa Hudson, who was at the time the chief

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<v Speaker 2>financial officer.

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<v Speaker 3>Of the company. That June, he got.

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<v Speaker 2>Special permission from the board to sell almost all of

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<v Speaker 2>his shares in the company. It wasn't too scandalous, it

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<v Speaker 2>wasn't the sort of thing that nobody ever does, but

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<v Speaker 2>it does become a little bit more interesting later. This

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<v Speaker 2>show sell now in August, two things happen, kind of

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<v Speaker 2>right on top of each other. The first thing that

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<v Speaker 2>happens is that company announces its profit for twenty twenty

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<v Speaker 2>three will be about two and a half billion dollars,

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<v Speaker 2>which is the largest profit Quantus's ever booked.

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<v Speaker 4>A record profit for quantas will put more aeroplanes back

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<v Speaker 4>in the sky.

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<v Speaker 5>At one point four to three billion Azzie dollars. That's

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<v Speaker 5>about nine hundred and fifty million yures, just shy of expectation.

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<v Speaker 6>A record half yearly profit, the first the airline has

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<v Speaker 6>recorded after seven billion dollars in losses during COVID.

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<v Speaker 2>This is coming after a couple of pretty tough years.

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<v Speaker 3>Twenty twenty one and twenty twenty two were not great

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<v Speaker 3>years for airlines.

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<v Speaker 2>Prices skyrocketed, staff were cut to the bone, and so

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<v Speaker 2>this massive profit in twenty twenty three, to some it

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<v Speaker 2>felt a little bit like a company that was robbing

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<v Speaker 2>from its workers and its customers to pay out its

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<v Speaker 2>investors and its executives.

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<v Speaker 4>This profit is dirty money. It's been reaped off the

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<v Speaker 4>back of exploiting labor hire loopholes, illegally sacking workers, making

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<v Speaker 4>customers and taxpayers feel ripped off.

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<v Speaker 2>Now, the other thing that had happens in August is

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<v Speaker 2>that the Australian Competition and Consumer Commission announces that it's

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<v Speaker 2>got this suit that it's going to bring in the

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<v Speaker 2>Federal Court.

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<v Speaker 7>We've just had word through confirmation from the a Triple

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<v Speaker 7>C Virus statement that it has launched legal action in

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<v Speaker 7>the Federal Court alleging that Quantus engaged in false, misleading

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<v Speaker 7>and deceptive conduct.

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<v Speaker 2>By Acts and the suitor letters that Quantus sold tickets

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<v Speaker 2>to place that it had already canceled when it sold

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<v Speaker 2>the tickets.

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<v Speaker 5>So selling tickets on flights that have already been canceled

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<v Speaker 5>eight thousand scheduled flights between May and June and twenty

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<v Speaker 5>twenty two, and the Quantus kept on selling them for

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<v Speaker 5>an average of two weeks after it knew internally that

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<v Speaker 5>those flights were never going to leave the ground and

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<v Speaker 5>then delayed.

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<v Speaker 2>In August in twenty twenty three, when this news becomes public,

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<v Speaker 2>that's the final straw for Joyce. He announces that he's

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<v Speaker 2>going to bring forth the November Archer that he had

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<v Speaker 2>already planned by two months. And this is when that

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<v Speaker 2>share sale starts to become interesting to people, because it

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<v Speaker 2>turns out when he sold those shares, the company already

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<v Speaker 2>knew that it was under investigation by the atriple C.

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<v Speaker 2>In retrospect, that share sale looks really bad and feels

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<v Speaker 2>really bad for other investors because it turns out that

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<v Speaker 2>that share sale was allowed to happen at a peak

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<v Speaker 2>in the market.

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<v Speaker 1>Okay, So Quantus's problems began with the pandemic, but really

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<v Speaker 1>just got worse over the next few years, and eventually

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<v Speaker 1>shareholders had enough they commissioned a review into what's happening

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<v Speaker 1>at the company. So tell me about that review.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so this review really came about after a shareholder

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<v Speaker 2>revolt when the company announced its last financial results. What

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<v Speaker 2>it found was that it puts Joyce right at the

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<v Speaker 2>middle of many problems going on at the airline, and

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<v Speaker 2>it really blames the board for having put too much

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<v Speaker 2>faith in Joyce.

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<v Speaker 3>Now Joyce had been that fifteen years.

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<v Speaker 2>He had been a stall worked at the airline and

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<v Speaker 2>really a prominent.

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<v Speaker 3>Businessman in the Australian landscape.

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<v Speaker 2>So the review said the Quantas had a command and

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<v Speaker 2>control leadership.

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<v Speaker 3>Style operating inside of it.

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<v Speaker 2>A lot of the decision making just highly centralized in

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<v Speaker 2>Joyce and that made it difficult for people to speak

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<v Speaker 2>up whenever bad things were happening. The review makes thirty

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<v Speaker 2>two recommendations, including changes to executive pay and ways that

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<v Speaker 2>communications are.

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<v Speaker 3>Done with stakeholders, and those are really typical.

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<v Speaker 2>Sorts of recommendations that you get whenever these sorts of

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<v Speaker 2>reviews are conducted.

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<v Speaker 3>Directors who are on the board.

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<v Speaker 2>They'll get a thirty three percent cut to their base

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<v Speaker 2>pay this year, so there are some repercussions that are

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<v Speaker 2>to be felt at the board level. But really the

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<v Speaker 2>review says that the primary failure was that there was

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<v Speaker 2>just too much power sitting in Alan Joyce's office.

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<v Speaker 1>So can Quantus repair its reputation as the national airline

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<v Speaker 1>that's after the break? So mark Quantus. It is one

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<v Speaker 1>of Australia's most iconic companies, but as you say, its

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<v Speaker 1>reputation has taken several hits over the past few years

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<v Speaker 1>and especially in the last twelve months. A review has

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<v Speaker 1>now placed blame squarely for that on the former CEO,

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<v Speaker 1>Alan Joyce, So he's left the company with a reduced payout.

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<v Speaker 3>What is the.

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<v Speaker 1>Plan now for Quantus to try and win back the

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<v Speaker 1>trust of people in Australia.

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<v Speaker 2>The new board is taking a very different direction to

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<v Speaker 2>the one that was charted under Richard Gord and Alan Joyce.

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<v Speaker 2>I think it's fair to say that Alan Joyce really

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<v Speaker 2>put his personality on this airline.

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<v Speaker 8>As a gay ARJ man running this amazing company. I'm

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<v Speaker 8>also very passionate about LGBT diversity within the group.

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<v Speaker 2>He spearheaded a number of campaigns at the airline that

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<v Speaker 2>sided with progressive politics.

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<v Speaker 8>This is an amazing country. I came to Australia in

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<v Speaker 8>nineteen ninety six.

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<v Speaker 2>As a gay man and a very out and vocal

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<v Speaker 2>gay man. He gave those campaigns a sort of personal

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<v Speaker 2>legitimacy that could be identified with him.

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<v Speaker 8>It was still illegal to be gay in Ireland. Homosexuality

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<v Speaker 8>was illegal. I left that country, came here, and I

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<v Speaker 8>always thought Australia was one of the most amazing open places.

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<v Speaker 2>To be The new board has said that they like

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<v Speaker 2>those campaigns may have been a misstep, and the new

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<v Speaker 2>chief executive has not been yet such a public figure

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<v Speaker 2>associating her personality with the brand. Vanessa Hudson is an accountant.

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<v Speaker 2>She was the chief financial officer before Alan Joyce departed,

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<v Speaker 2>and so far the way that she's run the business

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<v Speaker 2>seems to be, for lack of a better term, much

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<v Speaker 2>more business like.

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<v Speaker 6>A few people know their way around the flying Kangaroo.

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<v Speaker 6>As well as Vanessa Hudson, she's managed in flight services,

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<v Speaker 6>commercial planning, sales distribution, even catering and the lounges.

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<v Speaker 2>The board is asserting that the social justice direction of

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<v Speaker 2>the company is not going to be such a large

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<v Speaker 2>part of their branding, and it sounds like what they

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<v Speaker 2>want to do is just to repair the core relationships

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<v Speaker 2>that they have between them and their customers and their regulators.

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<v Speaker 2>Really seems like down to brass tax kind of business approach.

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<v Speaker 9>My focus when I step into the role in November

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<v Speaker 9>is going to be focused on delivering for our customers,

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<v Speaker 9>delivering for our people and also shareholders in the communities

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<v Speaker 9>we serve.

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<v Speaker 1>I suppose the other way of looking at this, though,

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<v Speaker 1>is to question how important trust and reputation really is

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<v Speaker 1>for a company like Quantus given the state of the

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<v Speaker 1>airline market in Australia and the dominance that Quantus has.

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<v Speaker 1>I mean, does it matter if people don't like Quantus

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<v Speaker 1>because they're going to have to use them anyway.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, that is an interesting question, and certainly Quantus is

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<v Speaker 2>trying its very best to maintain that position for itself.

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<v Speaker 2>We have had, of course, Regional Express going under, We've

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<v Speaker 2>had the Bonds Airline going under, and we've also had

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<v Speaker 2>this additional aspect of this story that was happening in

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<v Speaker 2>concert with the Hriplec's investigations and with Alan Joyce stepping down.

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<v Speaker 2>Qatar Eras was trying to increase its presence in Australia,

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<v Speaker 2>and Quantas advocated very strongly with the Albanesi government to

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<v Speaker 2>reject that push, and the Albanesi government did just that.

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<v Speaker 2>So there is certainly a lot of work being done

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<v Speaker 2>by Quantas to keep its position atop the Australian aviation industry.

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<v Speaker 2>Whether or not it's able to do that and rebuild

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<v Speaker 2>its reputation with its customers, that's a balancing act that's

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<v Speaker 2>going to be one that we should be watching over

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<v Speaker 2>the next couple of years.

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<v Speaker 1>It is quite a fall from grace, isn't it, For

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<v Speaker 1>Alan Joyce but also for the entire company. When you

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<v Speaker 1>think about the goodwill that Quantus used to have, I

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<v Speaker 1>mean some of it was marketing the famous I Saw

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<v Speaker 1>Australia Home song, but I remember flying Quantus as a

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<v Speaker 1>kid and it did feel special hearing the Australian accents

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<v Speaker 1>and experiencing that Australian friendliness after being away. They used

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<v Speaker 1>to be something in it.

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<v Speaker 2>Absolutely, the fall from grace has been remarkable, and I

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<v Speaker 2>think that there is a sense that the company has

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<v Speaker 2>that they can regain that position, but it's really up

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<v Speaker 2>to the customers whether they can return to that place

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<v Speaker 2>in the Australian psyche. And I think even if we

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<v Speaker 2>just go back to say the campaign for marriage equality

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<v Speaker 2>or the campaign for the Yes vote on the Voice referendum,

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<v Speaker 2>there was a sense that Quantus had an affirmative space

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<v Speaker 2>inside the Australian culture and the Australian policy debate. And

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<v Speaker 2>I think people felt after the pandemic that Quantus didn't

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<v Speaker 2>regain that position, points wasn't in that cultural role of

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<v Speaker 2>being four Australians in the way that they had before.

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<v Speaker 2>So it has been a really extraordinary dissent reputationally, but

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<v Speaker 2>I think that they are squarely focused on repairing that relationship.

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<v Speaker 1>Mark, thank you so much for vir Tank.

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<v Speaker 3>Thank you very much.

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<v Speaker 1>Also in the news today, Prime Minister Anthony Albanesi has

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<v Speaker 1>met with Indonesia's incoming president Praboo Subianto in Canberra. The

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<v Speaker 1>two leaders have finalized negotiations on a new defense still

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<v Speaker 1>but do not give any specific details. In the coming days,

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<v Speaker 1>the Australian Defense Minister Richard Miles is expected to travel

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<v Speaker 1>to Indonesia to sign the agreement. And The twenty twenty

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<v Speaker 1>four Democratic National Convention is underway in the United States.

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<v Speaker 1>The first day included speeches from current President Joe Biden

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<v Speaker 1>and Hillary Clinton. Hillary Clinton used her speech to highlight

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<v Speaker 1>Donald Trump's thirty four felony convictions, as the crowd chanted

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<v Speaker 1>lock him up. The event will run until August twenty two.

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<v Speaker 1>If you enjoyed today's episode, we would appreciate you sharing it.

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<v Speaker 1>I'm Ruby Jones. This is seven am.