1 00:00:05,920 --> 00:00:07,920 Speaker 1: Welcome to Fear and Greed Q and A, where we 2 00:00:07,960 --> 00:00:11,560 Speaker 1: ask and answer questions about business, investing, economics, politics and more. 3 00:00:11,600 --> 00:00:14,160 Speaker 1: I'm Michael Thompson, and good morning Sean, Ailmar. 4 00:00:14,400 --> 00:00:15,520 Speaker 2: Good morning Michael. 5 00:00:15,840 --> 00:00:19,360 Speaker 1: Sean. Today the Coalition, it seems, has hit rock bottom 6 00:00:19,440 --> 00:00:22,599 Speaker 1: or somewhere near that. Where to from here? So yesterday 7 00:00:22,720 --> 00:00:24,639 Speaker 1: a little bit of context of this one. Yesterday the 8 00:00:24,640 --> 00:00:29,080 Speaker 1: federal Coalition recorded its lowest primary vote in Newspoll history, 9 00:00:29,560 --> 00:00:33,320 Speaker 1: at just twenty seven percent on a two party preferred basis. 10 00:00:33,440 --> 00:00:37,440 Speaker 1: Labor continues to lead at fifty eight to forty two percent, 11 00:00:37,520 --> 00:00:41,640 Speaker 1: so well well well ahead. And instead it seems voters 12 00:00:41,680 --> 00:00:46,519 Speaker 1: now are going to the minor parties Resolve. Polling in 13 00:00:46,680 --> 00:00:49,640 Speaker 1: nine newspapers that came out at the same time as 14 00:00:49,720 --> 00:00:53,960 Speaker 1: Newspoll shows that one nation in particular is benefiting. They've 15 00:00:54,000 --> 00:00:58,080 Speaker 1: hit a record high of twelve percent. So it appears 16 00:00:58,120 --> 00:01:02,880 Speaker 1: perhaps that voters disaffected coalition voters leaving the coalition, perhaps 17 00:01:02,920 --> 00:01:07,640 Speaker 1: going to one nation instead, Sean, A broad question to 18 00:01:07,760 --> 00:01:12,240 Speaker 1: begin with here. Obviously, Labor has just such a commanding lead, 19 00:01:12,800 --> 00:01:15,880 Speaker 1: they had that from the moment the polls closed on 20 00:01:16,000 --> 00:01:19,959 Speaker 1: election day. Why is it so important to have a 21 00:01:20,000 --> 00:01:21,360 Speaker 1: strong opposition. 22 00:01:22,280 --> 00:01:25,800 Speaker 2: Well you get better policy. In the end, no side 23 00:01:25,840 --> 00:01:28,959 Speaker 2: of politics has all the answers. So if you get 24 00:01:29,000 --> 00:01:32,920 Speaker 2: a great debate, a great political debate, you'll end up 25 00:01:33,240 --> 00:01:37,480 Speaker 2: with better outcomes without trying to be partisan in any way. 26 00:01:38,840 --> 00:01:42,240 Speaker 2: You know, Australia's first minority government was the Gillard government. 27 00:01:43,440 --> 00:01:47,840 Speaker 2: She had to govern without a majority in the House 28 00:01:47,840 --> 00:01:52,680 Speaker 2: of Representatives. Yet that government passed some really important legislation, 29 00:01:52,960 --> 00:01:56,520 Speaker 2: nothing more important than the National Disability Insurance Scheme, and 30 00:01:56,840 --> 00:02:00,280 Speaker 2: that is through negotiation between the two sides. So if 31 00:02:00,320 --> 00:02:04,440 Speaker 2: you don't have a strong opposition, government isn't as good 32 00:02:04,440 --> 00:02:07,800 Speaker 2: because the side in power just doesn't really have to 33 00:02:07,800 --> 00:02:10,960 Speaker 2: negotiate at the moment. I suppose Labour has to negotiate 34 00:02:11,000 --> 00:02:13,760 Speaker 2: in the Senate with the Greens, but they're a left 35 00:02:13,760 --> 00:02:16,040 Speaker 2: wing party like Labor, and say, if you're in the 36 00:02:16,040 --> 00:02:18,240 Speaker 2: conservative side of politics, you just haven't got much say 37 00:02:18,240 --> 00:02:20,280 Speaker 2: at the moment, and that's not a good thing no 38 00:02:20,280 --> 00:02:22,600 Speaker 2: matter what side of politics you support. 39 00:02:22,919 --> 00:02:24,720 Speaker 1: I'm going to come back to that in a little 40 00:02:24,720 --> 00:02:26,120 Speaker 1: bit because i want to ask you how that then 41 00:02:26,200 --> 00:02:32,080 Speaker 1: applies to almost the lack of appetite for reform from 42 00:02:32,120 --> 00:02:35,359 Speaker 1: the Prime Minister because there was an opportunity here off 43 00:02:35,360 --> 00:02:37,320 Speaker 1: the back of the reform round table to do some 44 00:02:37,360 --> 00:02:40,360 Speaker 1: big things, but there doesn't appear to necessarily be that appetite. 45 00:02:40,440 --> 00:02:43,440 Speaker 1: But let's focus on the coalition the opposition just for 46 00:02:43,480 --> 00:02:46,680 Speaker 1: the minute, because it hasn't been a good couple of 47 00:02:46,680 --> 00:02:49,560 Speaker 1: weeks has it for Susan Lee the opposition leader. Actually 48 00:02:49,560 --> 00:02:52,400 Speaker 1: it hasn't been good since she started. Really, it's been 49 00:02:52,520 --> 00:02:55,640 Speaker 1: rocky right from the very beginning because had the split 50 00:02:55,840 --> 00:02:59,080 Speaker 1: between the Liberal Party and the National Party, and that 51 00:02:59,160 --> 00:03:04,040 Speaker 1: was primarily over a few policy areas, but led by 52 00:03:04,280 --> 00:03:07,800 Speaker 1: climate change net zero. In the last week or so, 53 00:03:08,000 --> 00:03:12,639 Speaker 1: we've had Susan Lee forced to sack Senator just into 54 00:03:12,720 --> 00:03:15,720 Speaker 1: numbergin for Price, and that was over comments that she 55 00:03:15,800 --> 00:03:20,160 Speaker 1: had made over immigration, and then Senator Price refused to 56 00:03:20,200 --> 00:03:25,680 Speaker 1: support her leader. After that sacking, their leadership tensions just 57 00:03:25,760 --> 00:03:30,920 Speaker 1: bubbled to the surface where we had potential candidates for 58 00:03:31,160 --> 00:03:34,640 Speaker 1: leader ruling themselves out but still mentioning that they do 59 00:03:34,680 --> 00:03:38,120 Speaker 1: still have ambitions to lead the party. Susan Lee has 60 00:03:38,160 --> 00:03:41,360 Speaker 1: then promoted Conservatives to the front bench, trying to kind 61 00:03:41,360 --> 00:03:44,360 Speaker 1: of shore up support and just ease this tension that 62 00:03:44,480 --> 00:03:48,640 Speaker 1: is permeating throughout the party. Is there a way out 63 00:03:48,920 --> 00:03:52,560 Speaker 1: here or is this just is this terminal? And are 64 00:03:52,560 --> 00:03:56,160 Speaker 1: we just going to see the coalition continue to deteriorate 65 00:03:56,320 --> 00:03:59,480 Speaker 1: and decline and eventually just almost disappear. 66 00:04:00,120 --> 00:04:02,160 Speaker 2: I don't think you can put this at Susan Lee's 67 00:04:02,200 --> 00:04:05,640 Speaker 2: feet here. I mean it's probably Peter Dunton. They got 68 00:04:05,720 --> 00:04:08,560 Speaker 2: hammered in that last election. You said, the News poll 69 00:04:08,600 --> 00:04:11,320 Speaker 2: now is fifty eight forty two percent. I think two 70 00:04:11,320 --> 00:04:15,720 Speaker 2: party preferred. I don't in covering politics, I don't remember 71 00:04:15,960 --> 00:04:18,560 Speaker 2: a time when you had that sort of outcome for 72 00:04:18,720 --> 00:04:22,479 Speaker 2: any party. Susan Lee, she is a moderate, she's not 73 00:04:22,520 --> 00:04:25,640 Speaker 2: a conservative. She's, as you mentioned, put conservatives in the 74 00:04:25,680 --> 00:04:28,640 Speaker 2: front bench hoping to quiet in that Angus Taylor, who 75 00:04:28,720 --> 00:04:32,760 Speaker 2: was her opponent when she ran, He is a conservative. 76 00:04:33,080 --> 00:04:36,080 Speaker 2: He hasn't really said much, but people have done the 77 00:04:36,160 --> 00:04:40,160 Speaker 2: shouting for him. But the other problem is, I mean, 78 00:04:40,200 --> 00:04:42,680 Speaker 2: will Susan Lee be the leader at the next election. 79 00:04:43,000 --> 00:04:45,200 Speaker 2: That's a fifty to fifty call. But I don't think 80 00:04:45,200 --> 00:04:48,440 Speaker 2: anyone's going to kick her out right now, because what's 81 00:04:48,520 --> 00:04:52,159 Speaker 2: to gain you kick her out? And you are so 82 00:04:52,320 --> 00:04:57,320 Speaker 2: far behind in the polls you almost need a scapegoat 83 00:04:57,680 --> 00:04:59,440 Speaker 2: and that's what Susan Lee will be for a couple 84 00:04:59,480 --> 00:05:03,200 Speaker 2: of years, and potentially they'll power parachute someone in at 85 00:05:03,279 --> 00:05:06,520 Speaker 2: the last minute ahead of the next pole, unless she 86 00:05:06,640 --> 00:05:09,880 Speaker 2: can somehow gain control of her troops, which she has 87 00:05:10,240 --> 00:05:12,040 Speaker 2: shown no sign of doing as yet. 88 00:05:12,360 --> 00:05:14,520 Speaker 1: Now we're going to see the coalition that under a 89 00:05:14,560 --> 00:05:17,200 Speaker 1: whole lot of pressure over the next week or so, 90 00:05:17,240 --> 00:05:20,839 Speaker 1: you'd imagine, because yesterday the federal government released a major 91 00:05:20,880 --> 00:05:25,440 Speaker 1: climate change report really showing the potential damage that can 92 00:05:25,480 --> 00:05:28,200 Speaker 1: be done to Australia more broadly in terms of heat 93 00:05:28,240 --> 00:05:31,760 Speaker 1: related deaths, the huge impact on property prices, the value 94 00:05:31,760 --> 00:05:33,880 Speaker 1: of property around the country over the coming decades if 95 00:05:33,920 --> 00:05:36,760 Speaker 1: global warming isn't brought under control. The government's going to 96 00:05:36,760 --> 00:05:39,960 Speaker 1: announce its new targets for twenty thirty five for emissions 97 00:05:39,960 --> 00:05:43,360 Speaker 1: reduction by the end of the week. The Opposition, though, 98 00:05:43,360 --> 00:05:44,719 Speaker 1: it's going to be under a whole lot of pressure 99 00:05:44,720 --> 00:05:47,839 Speaker 1: because this is something where the coalition do not agree. 100 00:05:48,000 --> 00:05:50,120 Speaker 1: The Liberals and the Nationals do not agree on the 101 00:05:50,160 --> 00:05:53,440 Speaker 1: path forward, and even within the Liberal Party itself there 102 00:05:53,480 --> 00:05:56,960 Speaker 1: isn't agree with. Yesterday we had West Australian MP who 103 00:05:57,040 --> 00:05:59,920 Speaker 1: is the shadow Minister for Home Affairs, So a senior 104 00:06:00,080 --> 00:06:05,040 Speaker 1: member of the Liberal front bench basically saying in an 105 00:06:05,080 --> 00:06:09,680 Speaker 1: ABC interview that he would consider quitting the front bench 106 00:06:09,800 --> 00:06:12,719 Speaker 1: or that he might be sacked by Susan Lee because 107 00:06:12,760 --> 00:06:16,719 Speaker 1: he believes the opposition should jump, should dump those targets 108 00:06:17,080 --> 00:06:20,160 Speaker 1: instead of stick with the targets that are being developed 109 00:06:20,240 --> 00:06:25,320 Speaker 1: by the Coalition. I don't see a way here that 110 00:06:25,360 --> 00:06:29,400 Speaker 1: they can almost present any kind of appealing alternative to 111 00:06:29,520 --> 00:06:33,440 Speaker 1: the government when they can't get themselves together, and how 112 00:06:33,480 --> 00:06:35,280 Speaker 1: on earth then they're supposed to try and start appealing 113 00:06:35,360 --> 00:06:37,799 Speaker 1: to the voters who have left them when it feels 114 00:06:37,839 --> 00:06:40,440 Speaker 1: like we're getting back into the bad old days of 115 00:06:40,520 --> 00:06:41,640 Speaker 1: climate politics. 116 00:06:42,880 --> 00:06:45,680 Speaker 2: Yes, I'm not sure what to say to that. I 117 00:06:46,600 --> 00:06:52,400 Speaker 2: totally agree it is a dreadful issue for the coalition 118 00:06:52,839 --> 00:06:55,840 Speaker 2: because there are so many why, I mean, there's a 119 00:06:55,920 --> 00:06:59,160 Speaker 2: wide range of views, but really extremist views as in 120 00:06:59,279 --> 00:07:02,880 Speaker 2: almost climb change denials on one side, through to people 121 00:07:02,920 --> 00:07:05,520 Speaker 2: who totally accept it. And so as a party, and 122 00:07:05,680 --> 00:07:08,159 Speaker 2: I'm talking about the Coalition here, so National Party obviously 123 00:07:08,200 --> 00:07:12,400 Speaker 2: fits into that. Now, climate change affects the Nationals and 124 00:07:12,440 --> 00:07:16,200 Speaker 2: costs the National Party seats probably more than the city seats, 125 00:07:16,560 --> 00:07:19,680 Speaker 2: so you understand why they're so upset about it, and 126 00:07:19,960 --> 00:07:23,720 Speaker 2: they want to ensure that the people of rural Australia 127 00:07:23,840 --> 00:07:29,600 Speaker 2: aren't disadvantaged by climate change politics. But ah, what a 128 00:07:29,760 --> 00:07:34,400 Speaker 2: vexed question for you know, little Proud and Susan Lee 129 00:07:34,560 --> 00:07:38,720 Speaker 2: like I just I don't know, no leader has been 130 00:07:38,760 --> 00:07:42,040 Speaker 2: able to contain the Coalition or the conservative side of 131 00:07:42,040 --> 00:07:45,040 Speaker 2: politics around climate change yet. I just don't see that 132 00:07:45,080 --> 00:07:47,640 Speaker 2: these guys can going forward. And so as you say, 133 00:07:47,720 --> 00:07:49,760 Speaker 2: the next week is going to be very rough for 134 00:07:49,800 --> 00:07:50,400 Speaker 2: the coalition. 135 00:07:50,800 --> 00:07:52,960 Speaker 1: Now, last question, we'll bring it back around to where 136 00:07:53,000 --> 00:07:55,360 Speaker 1: we started when you were talking about the importance of 137 00:07:55,400 --> 00:07:58,480 Speaker 1: having strong opposition because it means the government can basically 138 00:07:59,080 --> 00:08:01,280 Speaker 1: if they don't have that wrong opposition, they can just 139 00:08:01,520 --> 00:08:04,520 Speaker 1: do whatever they want. Is that actually what we're going 140 00:08:04,520 --> 00:08:07,280 Speaker 1: to see Anthony Alberanezi do or is it just it 141 00:08:07,360 --> 00:08:10,120 Speaker 1: feels a little bit And you were away for the 142 00:08:10,880 --> 00:08:15,000 Speaker 1: Economic reform round table when there was a lot of 143 00:08:15,040 --> 00:08:19,520 Speaker 1: stuff discussed, not much action, even though there is the 144 00:08:19,640 --> 00:08:23,080 Speaker 1: potential to do an awful lot of big ticket kind 145 00:08:23,120 --> 00:08:26,000 Speaker 1: of reforms off the back of this tax reform. For one, 146 00:08:26,320 --> 00:08:30,200 Speaker 1: meaningful tax reform and there were polls released that show 147 00:08:31,480 --> 00:08:35,200 Speaker 1: voters don't want the government to take it to another election. 148 00:08:35,280 --> 00:08:37,760 Speaker 1: They just want them to get in there and do it. 149 00:08:37,800 --> 00:08:40,160 Speaker 1: Is the government just going to squander this opportunity? 150 00:08:40,200 --> 00:08:43,680 Speaker 2: Do you think, let's hope not. I mean that last 151 00:08:43,760 --> 00:08:46,080 Speaker 2: term it's not that they didn't do anything. I mean 152 00:08:46,080 --> 00:08:49,080 Speaker 2: they made big changes to the ends. Actually, I mean 153 00:08:49,760 --> 00:08:53,400 Speaker 2: under Bill Shorten that it's still to play out somewhat. 154 00:08:54,080 --> 00:08:56,480 Speaker 2: But it's not as if they did nothing last time. 155 00:08:56,520 --> 00:08:59,360 Speaker 2: But they did have a lot of gab fests, get together, 156 00:08:59,440 --> 00:09:02,280 Speaker 2: let's talk about to see what happens, and nothing really 157 00:09:02,559 --> 00:09:06,520 Speaker 2: came out of it. You know, really reformist governments and 158 00:09:06,679 --> 00:09:09,600 Speaker 2: everyone talks about hawk keating, but you know Howard Castello 159 00:09:09,720 --> 00:09:15,800 Speaker 2: gst really reformist governments reform the economy. These guys have 160 00:09:15,880 --> 00:09:21,240 Speaker 2: the ability to do tax reform, and I just don't 161 00:09:21,280 --> 00:09:22,840 Speaker 2: know that they've got the courage to do it. Though 162 00:09:23,080 --> 00:09:28,160 Speaker 2: they should do it. It's a golden opportunity, but I 163 00:09:28,200 --> 00:09:31,800 Speaker 2: don't hold out high hopes that they will do it. 164 00:09:32,480 --> 00:09:36,880 Speaker 2: And maybe we just don't have a reformist leader in 165 00:09:36,920 --> 00:09:40,160 Speaker 2: Anthony Albanezi or a reformist treasurer in Jim Chalmers. You 166 00:09:40,200 --> 00:09:44,280 Speaker 2: seem to need both of them to get stuff done. 167 00:09:44,520 --> 00:09:48,280 Speaker 2: But I don't hold that much hope. I'm afraid, Michael. 168 00:09:48,480 --> 00:09:51,440 Speaker 1: Yeah either. Anyway, Sean, that's a perfect place to leave it. 169 00:09:51,440 --> 00:09:54,199 Speaker 1: I don't think we've actually answered any questions that we 170 00:09:54,280 --> 00:09:56,480 Speaker 1: set out to answer, but we've had a fun time 171 00:09:56,520 --> 00:09:58,920 Speaker 1: discussing it. Yes, it's been great. I really enjoyed it. 172 00:09:59,080 --> 00:09:59,600 Speaker 1: Thanks Sean. 173 00:09:59,760 --> 00:10:00,360 Speaker 2: Thanks Michael. 174 00:10:00,400 --> 00:10:02,240 Speaker 1: If you've got a question that you'd like us to tackle, 175 00:10:02,960 --> 00:10:04,920 Speaker 1: we may not answer it, but we will discuss it. 176 00:10:05,000 --> 00:10:08,160 Speaker 1: Send it through on LinkedIn, Instagram, Facebook, or at Fearandgreed 177 00:10:08,200 --> 00:10:10,160 Speaker 1: dot com. Today you are Michael Thompson, and this is 178 00:10:10,160 --> 00:10:11,240 Speaker 1: Fear and Greed Q and a