WEBVTT - 'What happens if the US goes batshit crazy?'

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<v Speaker 1>I'm Daniel James and you're listening to seven Am. Anthony.

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<v Speaker 1>Albanese have recently returned from a major overseas trip, rubbing

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<v Speaker 1>shoulders with royalty and sharing the stage with world leaders.

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<v Speaker 1>But behind the scenes there was also quiet discussions about

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<v Speaker 1>a possible plan B for Orcus. With Parliament about to

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<v Speaker 1>sit again, his government faces pressure from the cross bench

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<v Speaker 1>over defense and foreign policy, while the Opposition is consumed

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<v Speaker 1>by internal divisions and power plays. Today, contributing editor at

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<v Speaker 1>the New Daily, Amy remikuz or what Alberanzi really brought

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<v Speaker 1>back from his overseas tour and how the coalition's implosion

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<v Speaker 1>is reshaping politics in Canberra. It's Saturday, October four. Anthony

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<v Speaker 1>Alberzi has been on a massive overseas trip. So let's

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<v Speaker 1>talk about the itinerary. Of course in New York, where

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<v Speaker 1>he've got a lot of coverage as he recognized Palestine

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<v Speaker 1>at the UN but he had another meeting there which

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<v Speaker 1>got less attention. Can you tell me about that.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, So he had about forty minutes with Emmanuel Macron,

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<v Speaker 2>the President of France, which is not insignificant, and it

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<v Speaker 2>does show that while we have been focused domestically on

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<v Speaker 2>the US alliance, Australia's alliance with certain European countries, including France,

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<v Speaker 2>who have a lot of sway in things like NATO

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<v Speaker 2>and the direction of the EU have kind of gone

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<v Speaker 2>under reported, but are no less important. And so in

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<v Speaker 2>that discussion we know that they talked about recognition of Palestine,

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<v Speaker 2>but we also know that they would have talked about

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<v Speaker 2>Europe's strategic future that includes the future of NATO, which

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<v Speaker 2>Australia is not part of but does partner with. And

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<v Speaker 2>I think we can also surmise that Macron would have

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<v Speaker 2>reiterated a recent offer that he made to Anthony Albanizi,

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<v Speaker 2>which is that the friend submarines are still on the

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<v Speaker 2>table if Australia needs them.

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<v Speaker 3>Now.

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<v Speaker 2>That hasn't got a lot of attention either, but not

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<v Speaker 2>so long ago, Emmanuel Macron.

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<v Speaker 3>Said that yes, he had reiterated that.

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<v Speaker 2>Under the Albanese government, if Orcus fell over, France was

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<v Speaker 2>still willing and able to set up Australia with submarines

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<v Speaker 2>in the future.

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<v Speaker 3>That was politely declined.

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<v Speaker 2>But I think that given the two way conversation that's

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<v Speaker 2>going on between Australia and France, that there is a

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<v Speaker 2>little bit of a signal that a Plan B if

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<v Speaker 2>Orcust falls over is in the works.

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<v Speaker 1>We'll get to that Plan B a little bit later.

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<v Speaker 1>But from New York the Prime Minister flew to the UK.

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<v Speaker 1>What was on the agenda there.

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<v Speaker 2>So the UK trip was also a bit of a whirlwind.

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<v Speaker 2>So it was meeting with care Starmer, the Labor Prime Minister.

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<v Speaker 3>There.

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<v Speaker 2>He also got to meet with Charlie Boy with King

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<v Speaker 2>Charles and basically kissed the ring. And he had other

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<v Speaker 2>meetings with politicians, but not with Nigel Fara, which the

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<v Speaker 2>UK polls tell us would be prime minister if an

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<v Speaker 2>election was held today or tomorrow, which you know, if

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<v Speaker 2>you're UK Labor and you're only a year or so

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<v Speaker 2>into your government, that has to make you feel great.

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<v Speaker 2>And he also went to the Labor conference, So the

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<v Speaker 2>UK Labor conference.

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<v Speaker 3>Here in Liverpool.

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<v Speaker 4>We're ten thousand miles from where I joined the Labor Party.

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<v Speaker 4>A long and winding road. Got that in early.

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<v Speaker 3>He called care Starmer a dear friend of he's a

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<v Speaker 3>dear mate.

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<v Speaker 4>Thank you to my mate and your leader, Prime Minister Kirstar.

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<v Speaker 2>And he said things like, you know, being a part

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<v Speaker 2>of the labor movement is always very difficult, but we

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<v Speaker 2>have to remember that at the root of it is

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<v Speaker 2>fairness and that's what we're all fighting for.

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<v Speaker 4>When they grasped that for Labor to continue to be

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<v Speaker 4>the party of fairness and justice, we had to become

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<v Speaker 4>a party for the elimination of discrimination and prejudice.

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<v Speaker 2>Which I think, you know, anyone who's watching UK politics

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<v Speaker 2>and indeed Australian politics, would probably raise their eyebrows at

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<v Speaker 2>because we're not seeing a lot of progressive fairness from

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<v Speaker 2>either Labor government in twenty twenty five, and that is

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<v Speaker 2>one of the issues that both prime ministers are facing,

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<v Speaker 2>not just in their base, but in the people who

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<v Speaker 2>have given them a chance.

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<v Speaker 1>I can tell us a bit about the discussions Albanezi

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<v Speaker 1>and Starma we're having about defense.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, this is really interesting and I think this pulls

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<v Speaker 2>into some of that Plan B that we've been talking

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<v Speaker 2>about with Orcus, which is not really being reported at

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<v Speaker 2>the moment. Starma, i think, is looking at the Orchist

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<v Speaker 2>deal and having the same questions that many within Australia,

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<v Speaker 2>including the government, are having about whether the US can

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<v Speaker 2>be trusted to feel their part of the deal. And

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<v Speaker 2>so we're starting to see Australia and the United Kingdom

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<v Speaker 2>come together and start to strengthen their part of the deal.

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<v Speaker 3>So if the US.

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<v Speaker 2>Continues to go off the deep end, we are not

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<v Speaker 2>left holding the can here with no submarines. And that's

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<v Speaker 2>where France comes in again, because if they do continue

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<v Speaker 2>to make the offer for Australia to have those submarines,

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<v Speaker 2>which is important for Australia to have some strategic capacity

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<v Speaker 2>to defend itself. That means that there is opportunity for

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<v Speaker 2>Australia to still have submarines if they get out of ORCAS.

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<v Speaker 2>And we do know, or we can at least surmise

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<v Speaker 2>that the UK and Australia are having these conversations about

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<v Speaker 2>what happens if the US goes completely batshit crazy.

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<v Speaker 1>There was report in Nicoasia that the Longer Way to

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<v Speaker 1>Trump review into ORCUS has labeled that deal safe. What

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<v Speaker 1>do we know about that?

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<v Speaker 2>So we don't have any more details in terms of

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<v Speaker 2>like what safe actually means and whether that's going to

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<v Speaker 2>come with any additional conditions. We do know that they've

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<v Speaker 2>given it the tick and flick, so it will continue

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<v Speaker 2>going to the next stage. And honestly, there's no reason

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<v Speaker 2>why it wouldn't because this stage of the Orcist program

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<v Speaker 2>is Australia giving billions of dollars to the United States

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<v Speaker 2>for the United States to increase their own capacity to

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<v Speaker 2>build the submarines, because the US has to meet its

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<v Speaker 2>own needs before it gets started. In Australia, we know

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<v Speaker 2>they are not meeting their own needs and so the

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<v Speaker 2>actual logic that they're going to be able to trevel

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<v Speaker 2>production to ensure that Australia also gets theirs is just

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<v Speaker 2>it's not on the table at the moment.

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<v Speaker 3>Now.

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<v Speaker 2>The UK have done a review, the US have done

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<v Speaker 2>a review. Australia, who is handing money hand over fist

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<v Speaker 2>to the United States, and the United Kingdom are the

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<v Speaker 2>only people involved in this deal who have not ordered

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<v Speaker 2>a review into Orcus, and that is something that the

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<v Speaker 2>Crossbench are really starting to push that we really want

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<v Speaker 2>to see a parliamentary review into Orcus, which makes sense

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<v Speaker 2>because this was a deal that was cooked up by

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<v Speaker 2>Boris Johnson and Scott Morrison.

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<v Speaker 3>It didn't go to Cabinet, it didn't go.

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<v Speaker 2>To Treasury, and I think that what the Crossbench is

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<v Speaker 2>saying is that Australians really deserve to understand what this

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<v Speaker 2>deal means and to understand and have a say in

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<v Speaker 2>whether this deal is something that is good for us.

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<v Speaker 1>Coming up, how long will Susan Lee keep her job?

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<v Speaker 1>I mean, it's going to be a big week in

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<v Speaker 1>Canberra next week with Senate estimates. What are we likely

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<v Speaker 1>to see the government grilled on?

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<v Speaker 2>So we're going to see questions over some of the

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<v Speaker 2>changes to Australia's democracy. That includes the bill that was

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<v Speaker 2>passed in the last parliament that essentially makes it very

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<v Speaker 2>difficult financially for anybody who is not part of a

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<v Speaker 2>major party to enter the parliament in coming elections that

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<v Speaker 2>ticks in. I think at the next election we're going

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<v Speaker 2>to see major questions about that. We're going to see

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<v Speaker 2>major questions about the FOI laws that the government wants

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<v Speaker 2>to introduce, which makes it very very difficult for people

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<v Speaker 2>to be able to get information that the government does

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<v Speaker 2>not want you to have. We're going to have questions

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<v Speaker 2>about the Climate Target, which is understandable because it's a

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<v Speaker 2>range and we don't know what exactly the government is

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<v Speaker 2>considering when they talk about that range and what actions

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<v Speaker 2>they're going to be put in. We're also going to

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<v Speaker 2>start seeing a little bit more about energy policy, infrastructure spending,

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<v Speaker 2>all of those things that are not very sexy in

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<v Speaker 2>political terms but actually need to have some scrutiny. But

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<v Speaker 2>what I find interesting is we have seen a shift

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<v Speaker 2>since the May election where the cross Bench are really

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<v Speaker 2>starting to take these issues even more seriously. Because we

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<v Speaker 2>don't really have an opposition in Australia in the way

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<v Speaker 2>that we're used to having it. The coalition is in

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<v Speaker 2>such disarray, they're not focusing on any of the policy

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<v Speaker 2>issues that you would expect an opposition to be elevating

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<v Speaker 2>in public discourse. And what that means is that the

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<v Speaker 2>government gets to kind of skate through a lot of things.

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<v Speaker 1>If we look at the coalition, Susan Lee survived another

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<v Speaker 1>week as leader, but the beef in the coalition seems

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<v Speaker 1>to be spilling out all over the place. How long

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<v Speaker 1>do you expect her to be able to hold on?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, survive another week is a really good way of

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<v Speaker 2>putting it. I mean, I think Susan Lee is going

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<v Speaker 2>to last for as long as the coalition pretends that

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<v Speaker 2>it's doing all of these policy reviews. Because none of

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<v Speaker 2>the people who want the leadership want ownership over those reviews.

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<v Speaker 2>They don't want ownership over the policy mess, and there

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<v Speaker 2>is an absolute policy mess happening within the coalition at

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<v Speaker 2>the moment. We've had Dan Tee and who's just returned

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<v Speaker 2>from being wined and dined in the United States and

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<v Speaker 2>other places talking about nuclear again and how that's absolutely

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<v Speaker 2>going to have.

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<v Speaker 3>To be on the agenda.

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<v Speaker 5>What I've been hearing and what I saw while I

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<v Speaker 5>was over in the US visiting large national laboratories at

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<v Speaker 5>Idaho and Oakringe is basically a nuclear renaissance, the amount.

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<v Speaker 2>Of So you have a party that's talking about the

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<v Speaker 2>need to lower energy costs is their number one issue,

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<v Speaker 2>and their answer to that is choosing the most expensive

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<v Speaker 2>form of energy that you could possibly imagine, and they're

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<v Speaker 2>willing to die on that hill. So we know that

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<v Speaker 2>it's getting bad enough that the tensions for the leadership

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<v Speaker 2>are starting to spill into the public.

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<v Speaker 6>Go out there and listen to the punters. People are

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<v Speaker 6>crying out for a new leader in the Liberal Party.

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<v Speaker 6>I'm sorry, Susan.

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<v Speaker 2>So you have Andrew Hasty who is mobilizing to either

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<v Speaker 2>set himself up as the leader of the Liberal Party

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<v Speaker 2>or whatever emerges from the wreckage of the Liberal Party.

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<v Speaker 6>The federal Liberal MP Andrew Hasty, he has quit the

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<v Speaker 6>shadow cabinet because of a disagreement about immigration policy. He

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<v Speaker 6>had been appointed the shadow Home Affairs Minister under the

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<v Speaker 6>Opposition leader Susan Lee.

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<v Speaker 2>Because history would say that this coalition probably won't see

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<v Speaker 2>out the decade as the coalition as we're all used

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<v Speaker 2>to seeing it in post war Australia, they have a

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<v Speaker 2>very low representation in the House of Representatives, they have

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<v Speaker 2>no authority over the branches their own members the Parliament

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<v Speaker 2>or the Executive. They have no policy platform and they

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<v Speaker 2>have no cohesiveness. So you see the Nationals freelancing on

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<v Speaker 2>policy that is not going to stop. You see the

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<v Speaker 2>Liberals starting to freelance on policy that is not going

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<v Speaker 2>to stop. And honestly, I think we should probably just

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<v Speaker 2>put all of that mess back in the cupboard and

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<v Speaker 2>then just continue on as if they weren't there, because

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<v Speaker 2>they have zero impact on public policy at this point

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<v Speaker 2>in time.

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<v Speaker 1>And it's also a sitting week for the House of

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<v Speaker 1>Rip in these with Labour absolutely dominating by numbers. So

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<v Speaker 1>while the Independents are the new opposition and the coalition

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<v Speaker 1>is imploding, what are the government's priorities. How are they

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<v Speaker 1>using this runway?

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<v Speaker 2>Well, so far they've basically just been carrying out their

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<v Speaker 2>election mandate, which, if anyone remembers back to May when

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<v Speaker 2>the election was going on, was very small target, very

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<v Speaker 2>narrow boundaries in terms of reform.

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<v Speaker 3>We're seeing some of the fruits of that.

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<v Speaker 2>So we've seen this week the government push forward with

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<v Speaker 2>extending its five percent deposit scheme, which basically means that

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<v Speaker 2>if you only have five percent saved up for a

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<v Speaker 2>house deposit, you don't have to worry about having.

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<v Speaker 3>Lender's mortgage insurance.

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<v Speaker 2>We've had Albanezi and admit that that is going to

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<v Speaker 2>juce house prices. It didn't really get much attention because

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<v Speaker 2>there's not much of a you know, established opposition really

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<v Speaker 2>looking at all of this, and so it just was like, okay, yes, sure,

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<v Speaker 2>house prices are going to continue to go up next,

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<v Speaker 2>which is sort of where we're at. We had interest

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<v Speaker 2>rates where they held the RBA. Hell, despite the fact

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<v Speaker 2>that yes, the economy is slowing down, that we're starting

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<v Speaker 2>to see unemployment tick up again, we're starting to see

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<v Speaker 2>that there is not as much money flowing around in

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<v Speaker 2>the economy as you would like. Again, everyone just kind

0:13:14.200 --> 0:13:16.640
<v Speaker 2>of was like, oh, yep, nope, that's what we expected.

0:13:16.960 --> 0:13:21.079
<v Speaker 2>There's a real political fatigue I feel in Australia at

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<v Speaker 2>the moment because there is a government that is not

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<v Speaker 2>coming through with any major reforms, any big changes that

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<v Speaker 2>are actually going to help people's lives.

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<v Speaker 3>So I think people are starting to really switch.

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<v Speaker 2>Off from politics at the moment, which I think is

0:13:37.960 --> 0:13:41.080
<v Speaker 2>a bad sign. That's how you lead to issues like

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<v Speaker 2>what you're seeing in the UK, where people start turning

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<v Speaker 2>more and more to populist politics who don't have the

0:13:46.679 --> 0:13:49.960
<v Speaker 2>answers but give you permission to be angry. We've seen

0:13:50.000 --> 0:13:53.120
<v Speaker 2>that happen in the United States as well. It's not

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<v Speaker 2>a great place to be in. So I think that

0:13:55.880 --> 0:13:57.480
<v Speaker 2>there's going to get.

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<v Speaker 3>A point a crunch time for labor.

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<v Speaker 2>They have to actually start offering people hope that there

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<v Speaker 2>is going to be changed, that they can and will

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<v Speaker 2>make the bold, brave changes that are necessary for people

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<v Speaker 2>to see improvements to their lives.

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<v Speaker 1>Amy, thank you so much for your time.

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<v Speaker 3>Thank you.

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<v Speaker 1>Thanks for listening to this Saturday edition of seven AM.

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<v Speaker 1>On Monday, we're bringing you an episode about the Parliament

0:14:32.040 --> 0:14:35.920
<v Speaker 1>Sports Club, a casual get together. Are politicians, staffers and

0:14:36.000 --> 0:14:39.720
<v Speaker 1>others who play sport together on Wednesday mornings during sitting weeks.

0:14:40.920 --> 0:14:44.880
<v Speaker 1>But recently that club reregistered as a lobbying organization. Its

0:14:44.960 --> 0:14:48.560
<v Speaker 1>board includes the Prime Minister, its members include representaees from

0:14:48.560 --> 0:14:52.000
<v Speaker 1>the major sporting codes, and one of its sponsors is

0:14:52.040 --> 0:14:56.400
<v Speaker 1>the Gambling Lobbying So is this impacting the government's willingness

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<v Speaker 1>to act on much needed gambling reform? See you on

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<v Speaker 1>Monday for the