Speaker 1: I get a team. It's a you project. It's doctor Rebecca.
Speaker 1: We're going to formal doctor Rebecca hart Hie, I should say,
Speaker 1: And Tiffany and Cook who's not a doctor, but you
Speaker 1: could be one day. Tiff I don't reckon.
Speaker 2: I could not WITHHD no way.
Speaker 1: What would you like to be a doctor of? What
Speaker 1: about a doctor of punching people in the face? You
Speaker 1: could do that?
Speaker 2: Let me be a doctor of that.
Speaker 3: Well there you go. I'm sure there's a degree awarded
Speaker 3: for that.
Speaker 1: Well, she's a boxer, so you and I don't want
Speaker 1: to give her any cheek, you.
Speaker 3: Know what, but respect much respect absolutely, Now I know
Speaker 3: why you're captain lying Craig. This makes sense, doctor Craig,
Speaker 3: Doctor Harper.
Speaker 1: Excuse well, no, not really. I'm actually about three months away,
Speaker 1: so you can hopefully call me that in three months.
Speaker 1: But I'm just stumbling towards submission. Hey, thanks for coming
Speaker 1: on the show. How are you.
Speaker 3: I'm wonderful, Thanks so much for having me. I am Yeah,
Speaker 3: I'm super excited to be here. Well, you are a
Speaker 3: lot of stress. Got a lot of stress in my
Speaker 3: life right now.
Speaker 1: I've heard about It's a good thing.
Speaker 3: It's a good thing.
Speaker 1: I'm here to help.
Speaker 3: Yeah, well, good good, I always need help. I am
Speaker 3: in Greenville, South Carolina, us.
Speaker 1: Of A Yeah, perfect. What time is it there? So
Speaker 1: it's o seven hundred is here? What is it over there?
Speaker 3: It is a semmenteen hunderd hours? So yeah, perfect, Yeah,
Speaker 3: just the evening rolling into the evening.
Speaker 1: Give us a little bit of a snapshot. So for
Speaker 1: my listeners who are just meeting you for the first time,
Speaker 1: give us a little bit of a snapshot. Rather than
Speaker 1: me read something off a screen which will bore people
Speaker 1: to death, not because of your actual bio, but because
Speaker 1: of my voice, give us a bit of insight into
Speaker 1: who you are and a little bit of your backstory,
Speaker 1: if you would.
Speaker 3: Yeah. Sure, grew up in a really small town of St.
Speaker 3: New York and was a farm girl. Didn't really know
Speaker 3: what she was doing with her life. Loved the theater,
Speaker 3: but you know, as an eight year old, not really
Speaker 3: a steady career in the theater. So I'd stuck to
Speaker 3: what I was good at, which was science, and earned
Speaker 3: a whole bunch of degrees in science. I have a
Speaker 3: master's in Ornithology random facts Birds, a bird nerd, and
Speaker 3: a master's degree in evolution human behavior. And then I
Speaker 3: did a PhD in stress physiology and I've now used
Speaker 3: that degree and a lot of the research since then
Speaker 3: to help people transform their stress to serve them. And
Speaker 3: now I'm a keynote speaker and an author and live
Speaker 3: in large love to serve Hike. Got two dogs, Guinness
Speaker 3: and Murphy. That's me.
Speaker 1: That's hilarious. That's hilarious. Using stress to serve them is
Speaker 1: not something that most people think about, right. Most people
Speaker 1: think stress is doing me a disservice, not a service.
Speaker 1: What does that mean? How can stress service? Let's die?
Speaker 3: I love it. I love it. I mean I like
Speaker 3: to think of myself as the pr agent of stress. Right,
Speaker 3: stress really needs a pr agent here. It's got to
Speaker 3: get a better spin. Yeah, it's got to get a
Speaker 3: better spin. So, like my best analogy probably is I
Speaker 3: think think about Olympic athole. You know, they're not breaking
Speaker 3: world records at practice. They're breaking world records when the
Speaker 3: pressure of the stress is that it's peak and we
Speaker 3: all have that opportunity. It's about how we think about
Speaker 3: stress and use stress for our advantage. Because stress is
Speaker 3: just energy. It's our body producing this energy to move
Speaker 3: us through a challenge, and we don't get to control
Speaker 3: the energy that we receive. What we do get to
Speaker 3: control is how we utilize it. And so instead of saying, oh,
Speaker 3: stress is debilitating, how can it be enabling to us?
Speaker 3: And that's what I help people do.
Speaker 1: I feel like a lot of people say stress as
Speaker 1: an external thing with an internal consequence, like there's something
Speaker 1: happening out there which creates something happening in here.
Speaker 3: Yeah, love that, And I think that's true, right, something
Speaker 3: happens externally, we have an internal response. And then there's
Speaker 3: two pieces to that, the first of which I think
Speaker 3: is the funniest because humans are the only animal on
Speaker 3: the planet that we're aware of that actually creates stress
Speaker 3: of our own minds. So, you know, Robert Sapalski, famous
Speaker 3: stress physiologists, wrote, wrote, why zebras don't get ulcers? Because
Speaker 3: you know, zebra gets chased, they don't die, They go
Speaker 3: back to eating grass lyon missus. The hunt doesn't sit
Speaker 3: there and go oh, I'm a failure. I suck at life.
Speaker 3: You know, like this is terrible. It doesn't create more stress.
Speaker 3: Humans do that. We create our own stress in our brains.
Speaker 3: We could tastrify as we sit there just like, oh,
Speaker 3: grinding ourselves down, and that's that's not healthy, not a
Speaker 3: useful use of stress. And the other piece, the second
Speaker 3: piece that I'll say, is yes, sometimes you don't have
Speaker 3: control over the external factors the stresser, So stop trying
Speaker 3: to fight against that. Like I say, invite the tiger
Speaker 3: in for teaue, have come have the SEBT with me.
Speaker 3: Let's sit down, let's figure this out. How can I
Speaker 3: get curious in that moment and begin to use this
Speaker 3: energy that I'm getting from this thing I can't control
Speaker 3: to appoint me in a direction that actually is useful.
Speaker 1: Yeah. So there's the stuff that's in our control and
Speaker 1: the stuff that's out of our control. And I feel
Speaker 1: like for many of us anyway, not all of us,
Speaker 1: but the stuff that's out of our control gets way
Speaker 1: too much attention and focus and energy.
Speaker 3: Absolutely absolutely. And what typically happens then is our response
Speaker 3: to that is to sit in it without seating action. Yes,
Speaker 3: and we procrastinate, or we sit and go, well, I
Speaker 3: don't have any control, and we have this like learned
Speaker 3: helplessness response instead of saying, what is the smallest step
Speaker 3: that I can take to run directly at that tiger
Speaker 3: to run directly at that stressor to run directly and
Speaker 3: give ourselves agency back to say well, I may not
Speaker 3: be able to control that, but I can control my
Speaker 3: response to it. So yeah, that action piece is huge.
Speaker 1: I feel like in a lot of ways, stress is
Speaker 1: a story that we tell ourselves, or you know, it's
Speaker 1: an individual response based on a story. Because you know,
Speaker 1: so my main job is not podcasting, so it's you know,
Speaker 1: I do a lot of podcasting three hundred and sixty
Speaker 1: five years, so it's obviously a big part of my life.
Speaker 1: But it's corporate speaking, and so I'm always in front
Speaker 1: of corporates and groups and teams and working everywhere from
Speaker 1: university theaters to you know, like big stages to construction
Speaker 1: sites to all that stuff. And people people always talk
Speaker 1: about how stressful public speaking is. Right, as you've heard,
Speaker 1: I've seen you on stage. Your great Tiff also gets
Speaker 1: on stage, right, so all three of us do it.
Speaker 1: But and you think, well, I try to get people
Speaker 1: to think about the space between like the actual objective
Speaker 1: thing of walking on a stage and talking to a
Speaker 1: bunch of people versus your story about that, and you go, well,
Speaker 1: when people go, that's such a stressful situation, and I go, well,
Speaker 1: how come Rebecca is up on stage with no stress
Speaker 1: or maybe very low level stress, but more excitement and anxiety,
Speaker 1: more excitement and enthusiasm and curiosity. I know when I'm
Speaker 1: on stage, like, I don't have Maybe I should have,
Speaker 1: but I've done it for so long. I don't have
Speaker 1: any fear. I just have excitement. Yeah, so it's not
Speaker 1: so much about what's going on, It's about my story
Speaker 1: or individual response to what's going on.
Speaker 3: Right, Yeah, you nailed it. I mean, so we don't
Speaker 3: have control over the heightened arousal response that we get.
Speaker 3: Like you can't look at your adrenal glands and say, hey, guys,
Speaker 3: please don't don't release adrenaline in this moment, right, you don't.
Speaker 3: You'll get to control that. What you do get control
Speaker 3: is what you're talking about. You know, emotions, you can't
Speaker 3: control that you get heightened, but you can control their valance.
Speaker 3: Like what does this mean? Okay, so my body's having
Speaker 3: this response? What does this mean? And you know, excitement
Speaker 3: and stress and anxiety and fear, they all have that
Speaker 3: same heightened state. The difference is what you choose to
Speaker 3: interpret that as. And so there's a great Harvard study
Speaker 3: that had people do this public speaking exercise where they
Speaker 3: asked one group to say I'm excited and the other
Speaker 3: group try to calm down. Which, right, that's the advice
Speaker 3: we give people, just calmed down, yeah, which first of
Speaker 3: all is terrible advice for so many reasons. But like,
Speaker 3: you can't physiologically do that. And what they found is
Speaker 3: the group that simply told themselves they were excited. Now
Speaker 3: they didn't feel any less anxious. Yes, but they presented
Speaker 3: to this group that rated them more confident, more confident,
Speaker 3: they were better presenters, they like all of those things
Speaker 3: as a result of simply telling themselves the story that
Speaker 3: this response they were having was excitement. And so often,
Speaker 3: you know, to your point, what I tell people is
Speaker 3: if I'm out on stage and I'm not having butterflies.
Speaker 1: That's not good.
Speaker 3: That's a that's a bad sign because it means I'm
Speaker 3: disengaged or that I stopped caring. And the day that
Speaker 3: I don't get nervous about going on stage, I need
Speaker 3: to quit because I no longer care.
Speaker 1: I think it's a really curious thing. Over time, how
Speaker 1: like you spoke about, we can't control the adrenal response.
Speaker 1: And and yeah, it just hap like it's so funny
Speaker 1: how fear and all the associated physiological responses can hijack
Speaker 1: our body. You know, blood pressure, adrenaline, cortisol, all the stuff,
Speaker 1: you know, sympathetic nervous system. Right. But then over time,
Speaker 1: we can I think, downregulate that response, right, because the
Speaker 1: thing that you used to terrify me doesn't terrify me anymore.
Speaker 1: So I'm the same guy doing the same thing with
Speaker 1: a different physiology or a different physiological response. And so
Speaker 1: what you're not saying is you don't need to be
Speaker 1: terrified every time you do that thing. Over time you
Speaker 1: can downregulate that response, right, yes, And now I.
Speaker 3: Mean okay, yes, like that exposure therapy of like, okay,
Speaker 3: I'm an exposure to the same stressor again and again
Speaker 3: and again. And because our stress response really evolved to
Speaker 3: life and death situations, Yep, when you don't get eaten
Speaker 3: by the tiger for the twentieth time you go on stage,
Speaker 3: when the people don't kill it eto, you're like, oh,
Speaker 3: I can downregulate a little bit, right, And so that
Speaker 3: is kind of an exposure therapy type of thing. One
Speaker 3: of the things I talk about, though, is that the
Speaker 3: stress response because it's so singular. Whether you're getting shot
Speaker 3: at it's like a literal life in that situation, or
Speaker 3: whether you're stepping on stage, or you're asking somebody for
Speaker 3: a discount, or you know, trying to sell somebody, all
Speaker 3: of these uncomfortable situations, you have a singular response. Yeah,
Speaker 3: And so the objective shouldn't be to try and tamp
Speaker 3: down that response for every situation. The objective, as I
Speaker 3: see it, should be to train your brain that the
Speaker 3: response doesn't mean it's life and death. Yes, it simply
Speaker 3: means there's something happening that I have the opportunity to
Speaker 3: use to my advantage. And that's a different approach in
Speaker 3: trying to calm down or trying to repeat all the
Speaker 3: possible outcomes that could happen to try and tamp down
Speaker 3: the response.
Speaker 1: Does that makes sense, Yeah, yeah, absolutely, that's great. So,
Speaker 1: so we know that, you know, stress and fear and anxiety,
Speaker 1: you know, they're all in the same kind of swimming pool.
Speaker 1: But we also know that there's an inverse correlation between
Speaker 1: really elevated fear and our ability to think clearly and execute,
Speaker 1: Like cognitive function goes down under extreme pressure. Yeah, you know,
Speaker 1: so what's that. Is there a sweet spot where I'm nervous,
Speaker 1: I feel stressed, but my brain's still working optimally. I
Speaker 1: can still share my thoughts and ideas and be articulate
Speaker 1: and read the room and be, in this public speaking example,
Speaker 1: read the room and create connection and tell a funny
Speaker 1: story and be fucking hilarious without losing much.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and I mean, so what you're talking about is
Speaker 3: the classic York stats and curve right this upside down.
Speaker 3: You were like a little bit of stress increases your capacity,
Speaker 3: and then you fall off the end where you're like,
Speaker 3: oh my god, this is too much and I'm losing
Speaker 3: my mind. And the my research says it doesn't. You
Speaker 3: don't have you don't have to fall off. You actually
Speaker 3: don't have to fall off. And I'll share I'll share
Speaker 3: the question that I ask people that I think is
Speaker 3: probably most important to this in a second. But really
Speaker 3: the question is is there a sweet spot? Probably not,
Speaker 3: because if you just treat stress as energy rather than
Speaker 3: labeling it this is good, this is bad, this is distress,
Speaker 3: this is you stress and just say okay, I'm having
Speaker 3: a response, then there doesn't become a point where it's like, oh,
Speaker 3: I'm no longer functioning, and you can tell yourself the
Speaker 3: story of Okay, this is actually opening my blood bessels
Speaker 3: to help the blood flow to get to my brain
Speaker 3: so I can think more clearly. And when you tell
Speaker 3: that story, your physiology actually changes. When you believe that
Speaker 3: stress is enhancing, your body responds as if which is
Speaker 3: pretty remarkable. Even if, even and this is the closet part,
Speaker 3: even if you don't believe yourself like you can lie
Speaker 3: to yourself and your body is still those changes. So
Speaker 3: the question that I've asked people to think about is this.
Speaker 3: I want you to think of a project or an
Speaker 3: accomplishment that you're most proud of.
Speaker 1: You at it.
Speaker 3: Yeah, now, go back in time to when you were
Speaker 3: in the middle of that project. What was your stress
Speaker 3: level scale of zero to one hundred?
Speaker 1: Zero, two hundred, Yeah, yeah, it wasn't.
Speaker 3: Were you going to say, like a thousand?
Speaker 1: No, no, no, it didn't really stress me when I
Speaker 1: explained to you what it was. It's not. At the
Speaker 1: very start the I guess the stress level was relatively high. Yeah, okay,
Speaker 1: so yeah out of one hundred maybe, uh well, at
Speaker 1: the very very start, before I knew what the outcome
Speaker 1: would be it would have been a ninety five out
Speaker 1: of one hundred.
Speaker 3: There it is, so the outcome, This is what people
Speaker 3: like cling to is when we are our most stress,
Speaker 3: we don't know what the outcome is and so we're
Speaker 3: only kind of looking for control. And again it comes
Speaker 3: back to this cost of inaction, like yes, I know
Speaker 3: if I say and I do nothing, I know the outcome. Yes,
Speaker 3: And that's what people want so much under fear and
Speaker 3: uncertain and they want to know the outcome. And it
Speaker 3: keeps people in this like state of fear and isolation
Speaker 3: and settledness instead of taking that small step toward and
Speaker 3: forward and into that into that great future that is
Speaker 3: terrifying but unknown because we don't control that outcome.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's that is so true. Like we so hate
Speaker 1: the unknown, the uncertain, the uncomfortable. I call them all
Speaker 1: the uns right, you know, the uncontrollable. It's out of
Speaker 1: our control. And we love we love certainty and predictability
Speaker 1: and familiarity and the known. We love to know what's coming.
Speaker 1: Whereas you know, real resilience is being okay with not knowing, Right,
Speaker 1: I don't know, it might hurt, might not be fun
Speaker 1: at my not be quick, it might not be pineless,
Speaker 1: and that's okay. I might get embarrassed. I might look silly.
Speaker 1: That's okay too.
Speaker 3: And see that's just it, though, like we measure all
Speaker 3: of the costs of our actions, and those seem really scary,
Speaker 3: Like I might look silly, I might fail, I might
Speaker 3: be rejected. Those are those are things that we can measure,
Speaker 3: and we can look at what we forget to measure
Speaker 3: is the cost of an action. We forget to say
Speaker 3: if I do nothing. And this is why you know
Speaker 3: the concept of adaptive peaks. If you think about like, Okay,
Speaker 3: I'm sitting on this peak and it's a low peak,
Speaker 3: but you know it's fine. I'm settled. I know where
Speaker 3: I am, I know who I am, I know what
Speaker 3: this is all about. Yes, and there's another peak like
Speaker 3: just a mile away, and I can get to it
Speaker 3: and it's higher and I know it's going to be better.
Speaker 3: But in order to get there, you got to go
Speaker 3: down that valley, and that valley is scary and unknown,
Speaker 3: and then you got to climb up this new mountain.
Speaker 3: And it's it's it keeps people. It keeps people in
Speaker 3: the positions that don't serve them because they're scared of
Speaker 3: that that first step.
Speaker 1: Rebecca, what do people miss understand about stress? Do people
Speaker 1: use like stress and anxiety interchangeably? Like do they go, oh,
Speaker 1: I'm stressed, Oh I'm anxious? Sign Yeah.
Speaker 3: I mean I think I think we do that a lot,
Speaker 3: and it doesn't It doesn't bother me as much as
Speaker 3: other people, Like I use stress, fear, anxiety, all of
Speaker 3: these heightened, heightened emotions. Yes, there are technical differences, and
Speaker 3: we can get into it if you want. You know,
Speaker 3: anxiety is more like fear about the future and the
Speaker 3: unknown stresses that immediate challenge. Sure, there's differences, but I
Speaker 3: think I think it's okay because it's all just energy.
Speaker 3: And when we learn how to channel that and use
Speaker 3: it to our advantage, and rather than sitting there and
Speaker 3: in this state of constant concern and worry, we can
Speaker 3: point it in a direction to move forward into action,
Speaker 3: toward the tiger, toward the stress, or toward that roar,
Speaker 3: rather than away from it, which is not helpful.
Speaker 1: Stress sign you yeah, yeah, one hundred percent. The idea
Speaker 1: of being comfortable in discomfort. You know, as a physiologist,
Speaker 1: you would know that. Me. I've most of my background
Speaker 1: was working with or a lot of it was working
Speaker 1: with teams and athletes at an elite level, so you know,
Speaker 1: getting paid to hurt people in a good way, so
Speaker 1: much fun, so much fun, you know, and teaching people
Speaker 1: about the benefits of you know, the physiological and emotional
Speaker 1: and psychological and performance benefits of doing stuff that in
Speaker 1: the moment is fucking horrible. You know, it's like, yeah,
Speaker 1: I know, this sucks. I get it. But what we're
Speaker 1: trying to do is create a positive outcome, which is
Speaker 1: so you can run faster, jump hi, lift more, punch
Speaker 1: harder in TIFF's case, you know, whatever it is. But
Speaker 1: in order to build that strength and competence and level
Speaker 1: of performance, whether or not it's standing on a stage
Speaker 1: or running in a race or being in the middle
Speaker 1: of a gunfight in war, you know, the principle is
Speaker 1: the same. We need to do hard to kind of
Speaker 1: get hard. In a way, that's so true.
Speaker 3: I mean, like even even the very it's not even
Speaker 3: an analogy, Like in order to get muscles, you gotta
Speaker 3: rip them. You actually have to rip your muscle for
Speaker 3: them to grow, and I feel like the same is
Speaker 3: true for our brain. You have to rip it apart.
Speaker 3: You have to get into that like really uncomfortable unknown
Speaker 3: space to create new neural connections to say, oh, this
Speaker 3: isn't bad. This is just unknown, and I can be
Speaker 3: okay in the unknown, and I can actually grow in
Speaker 3: the unknown. But man, is that a scary place for
Speaker 3: our brains to go because our brain's number one thing
Speaker 3: is to keep us safe.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that is that is the number one.
Speaker 3: Thing that our brain wants to do. And we have
Speaker 3: to override millions of years of evolution to say, actually,
Speaker 3: I'm pretty safe right now and it's not serving me. Yes,
Speaker 3: let's see what we can do.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Probably, Notice cyber tooth targ are going to be
Speaker 1: in my field vision anytime soon.
Speaker 3: I mean, we pay people like you don't make us uncomfortable.
Speaker 3: What does that say about us people to make us uncomfortable?
Speaker 3: That's great.
Speaker 1: Here's a little bit of my backstory that you don't
Speaker 1: need to know, but I'll tell you just quickly. So
Speaker 1: I set up the first personal training center in Australia
Speaker 1: in nine ninety and so I trained thousands of people,
Speaker 1: and I had tens of thousands of sessions, and I
Speaker 1: had five hundred trainers work for me over the years.
Speaker 1: But when my client sho is to win or complain,
Speaker 1: I'd say, so, here's here's what happens. You come here,
Speaker 1: you give me money, and then I hurt you for
Speaker 1: an hour or so, and then you go away. This
Speaker 1: is the protocol.
Speaker 2: This is what we do.
Speaker 1: If you don't want that, that's cool. You can just
Speaker 1: join a gym and do your own thing. But how
Speaker 1: this works is I make you do things you won't
Speaker 1: do on your own. Ergo my job, ergo this relationship.
Speaker 1: So don't come here and complain. And it's just like
Speaker 1: it was like military after a while, where they would
Speaker 1: just come in that they did not complain. They'd go,
Speaker 1: this is why I'm doing this. And you know there
Speaker 1: was a bit of fun in that, of course, but
Speaker 1: but like helping people to embrace things that in the
Speaker 1: moment are not fun or not comfortable or not even familiar,
Speaker 1: but there's such great benefits moving forward.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean this is but did you die?
Speaker 1: Right, there's there's this that could be the show that
Speaker 1: could be.
Speaker 3: But did you die?
Speaker 1: I love writing I'm writing that down, but did you die?
Speaker 3: Did you die?
Speaker 1: No?
Speaker 3: Great? It means that needs you must have grown, I mean,
Speaker 3: and so I talk sometimes about PTSD, and you know
Speaker 3: about eight percent of Americans. I'm not sure what the
Speaker 3: number is globally, but about eight percent of Americans experienced
Speaker 3: post traumatic stress disorder after after a major stressor I
Speaker 3: think that number is probably low. I think probably all
Speaker 3: of us have some form of PTSD. And I want
Speaker 3: to label anything, but like going through life is traumatic,
Speaker 3: period and of discussion is traumatic. But what we don't
Speaker 3: talk about is post traumatic growth. We're so f I'm like,
Speaker 3: this is what's wrong. This is the bad that comes
Speaker 3: from stress. Post Traumatic growth happens naturally for about fifty
Speaker 3: percent of people that go through trauma. Fifty percent of
Speaker 3: people that go through trauma experience a deeper connection to purpose,
Speaker 3: to community, to like higher power, to their place on earth,
Speaker 3: a deeper like foundation of wanting to live. Post traumatic
Speaker 3: growth is massive. But do we talk about it not
Speaker 3: because we're fixating on the negative and so so much
Speaker 3: of this I think is getting that messaging now around
Speaker 3: stress of like no, no, no, we need stress. The
Speaker 3: only people that don't have stress, they're dead, Like your
Speaker 3: aim should not be to be a dead person. Let's
Speaker 3: use it differently.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's so true. I mean the interesting thing I
Speaker 1: think about all of I mean, there's many interesting things
Speaker 1: we're going to talk about. Your book, by the way,
Speaker 1: I Rebecca's book is called Springboard Transform Stress to Work
Speaker 1: for You. Yeah, coming at you. Well, it's out now,
Speaker 1: as you guys, listen to this. It's out now. So
Speaker 1: god buy fifteen because you're welcome only fifteen. Yeah. Well,
Speaker 1: we'll start with fifteen, and then we'll think about Christmas gifts. Right,
Speaker 1: I love it. But the funny thing is, like with
Speaker 1: all all the human experience, right, you go, Well, Tiff
Speaker 1: can eat a handful of almonds and it's a healthy snack.
Speaker 1: Someone else does, they have an anaphylactic reaction and nearly die. Right,
Speaker 1: you know, somebody goes for talk therapy. It's amazing. Somebody
Speaker 1: else that just reignites the stress. Right on every Tuesday
Speaker 1: at three o'clock, they get stressed and then they're worse
Speaker 1: for three days. By the way, I'm not saying talk
Speaker 1: therapy is bad. I'm saying it's not perfect for everyone.
Speaker 2: Right.
Speaker 1: Somebody does a job where they work up, they rock
Speaker 1: up nine to five, they sit in their cubicle, they
Speaker 1: have lunch with Dan every day, and they fucking love it.
Speaker 1: Because it's a pretty good job and pretty good pay
Speaker 1: and pretty good security. If I had to do that job,
Speaker 1: no disrespect to anyone, I'd hate my life, right yep.
Speaker 1: So it's not like, oh, you're rest here's the three
Speaker 1: step plan or here's that deal. Like I think with
Speaker 1: all of the you know, it's nuanced. There are so
Speaker 1: many variables and factors. It's trying to understand that, like
Speaker 1: with any variable that affects a human, you know that
Speaker 1: it's not like, oh, there's three ways to get out
Speaker 1: of this predicament, or there's two steps to create in
Speaker 1: a piece or the absence of anxiety or not that
Speaker 1: we want that well kind of, but so like people
Speaker 1: have got to figure it out personally as well.
Speaker 3: Right, Yeah, thank you for saying that, because I think
Speaker 3: for so long it's that sweet spot that you're talking
Speaker 3: about that people are trying to figure out how do
Speaker 3: I hit the sweet spot? Well, what's too much stress
Speaker 3: for some person is going to be too little for
Speaker 3: somebody else, And so instead of trying to find this
Speaker 3: like perfect sweet spot for everybody, Yeah don't. It's not
Speaker 3: a formula. It is a mindset shift it and that
Speaker 3: can be individualized, that can work for you as in
Speaker 3: individual with all of your unique traits and abilities. It's
Speaker 3: about thinking differently. And so like one of those studies
Speaker 3: that I found most fascinating in this work is looking
Speaker 3: at a cross section of about thirty thousand people for
Speaker 3: eight years, thirty thousand people for eight years, and looking
Speaker 3: at their different levels of stress. And the most important
Speaker 3: question they asked was do you believe that stress is
Speaker 3: bad for your health? And the people who had very
Speaker 3: high levels of stress who believed that stress was bad
Speaker 3: for their health had a exorbitantly high mortality rate, like
Speaker 3: forty three percent increase in mortality rate. But the people
Speaker 3: who had very high levels of stress who didn't believe
Speaker 3: that stress was bad for their health had the lowest
Speaker 3: mortality rate of the entire study, so lower than the
Speaker 3: people who reported very little stress in their life. So
Speaker 3: what that means, right, It's not about the stress. It's
Speaker 3: not about your perceived amount of stress in your life.
Speaker 3: It's about your mindset around what that stress means.
Speaker 1: Is it good? Is it bad?
Speaker 3: Is it energy? Is it? And so you know, one
Speaker 3: hundred and eighty two people and I study died not
Speaker 3: because of stress, but because of what they believed about stress,
Speaker 3: and that to me is so powerful.
Speaker 1: Now you've opened the door, right right, But no, I
Speaker 1: just think that you know, understanding that our body can't
Speaker 1: tell the difference between what is real and what we
Speaker 1: believe is real. You know, So that if I think,
Speaker 1: and I've said this too many times, if i think
Speaker 1: that I'm in danger right now, even if I'm completely safe,
Speaker 1: like the reality totally safe, the thought and the belief
Speaker 1: and the physiological response is all aligned with me being
Speaker 1: in imminent danger. So now all the you know, art right, breathing,
Speaker 1: nervous system, everything's going nuts, blood pressure, and now I'm
Speaker 1: elevated in this state. Now, if I'm a person who
Speaker 1: does that five to ten times a day, which is
Speaker 1: lots of people I speak to, I'm just putting my
Speaker 1: body in this not very good position or state multiple
Speaker 1: times a day with my own mind, my own thoughts,
Speaker 1: my own beliefs, my own stories.
Speaker 2: Yep.
Speaker 1: So, so, doctor, how do we begin to unravel that shit?
Speaker 1: Answered that?
Speaker 3: Yeah, well, okay, Well let's go back to what you
Speaker 3: do for a living. This is really interesting because you
Speaker 3: put people under tremendous stress. You are stressing their bodies.
Speaker 3: Their heart rate is increasing, they're sweating, their mouth is
Speaker 3: drying up, they're having a full on stress response when
Speaker 3: they work out. So why the hell is that good?
Speaker 3: M Yeah, because they think it's good the story. Yeah,
Speaker 3: it's the story that they tell. So like that stress
Speaker 3: is good and getting stuck in traffic is bad. Yeah,
Speaker 3: what's the difference? The only difference in the stress that
Speaker 3: you're experience is is that story that you're telling. And
Speaker 3: so this is this is so much power powerful than
Speaker 3: people recognize. Like there's so many stories around mindset and
Speaker 3: and the power of the placebo or the no cibo effect.
Speaker 3: And I really wish people would pay more attention to
Speaker 3: this because it's all within your reach, within your grasp,
Speaker 3: within your power. You don't get to control the stressors
Speaker 3: or the outcomes, but you have every control about how
Speaker 3: you move through them. You have every point of control
Speaker 3: of how you let them affect you.
Speaker 1: Yeah. What's the name of that professor from Harvard that
Speaker 1: we've had on Jeffrey? Professor Jeffrey Jeffrey ready to go. Yeah,
Speaker 1: he's a gun. He works in this space. We've had
Speaker 1: him on two or three times, probably not for a
Speaker 1: year or.
Speaker 3: So, but yeah, do you talk about the housekeeper study. Paton,
Speaker 3: did you tell you about the housekeeper study? No, tell us,
Speaker 3: go oh, this is one of my favorites. All right,
Speaker 3: So two groups of housekeepers split to two different conditions.
Speaker 3: The first condition is told.
Speaker 1: I can kill us.
Speaker 3: Yeah, second condition is simply told that they're meeting the
Speaker 3: Surgeon General's requirement for exercise when they're cleaning. That's it.
Speaker 3: That's the only difference. They all measure the like the
Speaker 3: heart rate, how hard they work, they measure their diets.
Speaker 3: Everything's kept the same. And after four weeks time four weeks,
Speaker 3: they found a significant difference in their body fat, their
Speaker 3: waists of hip ratio, their weight. Like the people that
Speaker 3: simply were told that they were meeting the surgeon General's
Speaker 3: requirement had this lower body fat, lower wayte hip ratio,
Speaker 3: lower body mass index. All of these measures decrease and
Speaker 3: they can't change anything but their belief. Yeah, and again
Speaker 3: like this is the kind of stuff I'm like.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's the that's the ship that lots my far.
Speaker 1: I'm with you. We could bang on about this, well,
Speaker 1: the Milkshyke study, I'm sure you know about it.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's great one.
Speaker 1: There's another we want to talk about it. Again because
Speaker 1: we've banged on about that. There's another one that I
Speaker 1: can't remember which university, But they got all these dudes.
Speaker 1: I think it was all guys. It wasn't a massive study.
Speaker 1: It was like, I don't know, twenty four people twelve
Speaker 1: and twelve and they had twelve guys that they I'm
Speaker 1: getting the numbers wrong a little bit, but anyway, they
Speaker 1: put them on a strength training program. It's over eight weeks,
Speaker 1: and then then they put yeah, yeah, well then they
Speaker 1: put then they put the one of the groups on
Speaker 1: nudge nudge, wink wink, anabolic steroids, which they didn't really
Speaker 1: but they told them they were, and they made these
Speaker 1: phenomenal gains compared to the first block where they thought
Speaker 1: they were undrugged with a natural It's like.
Speaker 3: If we multivitamins, I don't know if they work, but
Speaker 3: in my head they're working. I'm telling you right now,
Speaker 3: I'm going to keep taking them.
Speaker 1: Yeah, all right, So let's talk about your book. So
Speaker 1: it's called Springboard Transform Stress to Work for you. Give
Speaker 1: us Yeah, I can sider in the background and it's beautiful. Head. Fine,
Speaker 1: give us a little bit of a snapshot of the book,
Speaker 1: and like, what are the k ideas and themes.
Speaker 2: Sure.
Speaker 3: Sure, So the idea of the book is exactly what
Speaker 3: we've been talking about today, that stress is religious energy.
Speaker 3: And I think for so long the health and wellness
Speaker 3: space has gotten this really backwards, telling people that have
Speaker 3: to get rid of stress, and we're fighting these fights
Speaker 3: against stress and anxiety and fear, and then we feel
Speaker 3: more broken because we can't get rid of it. Yeah,
Speaker 3: and instead of trying to get rid of it, I'm
Speaker 3: trying to say, it's yours to use. So here's how
Speaker 3: you harness it. First of all, you recognize that it's
Speaker 3: not a tiger. Second of all, you invite that tiger
Speaker 3: that stress are in for a cup of tea. You
Speaker 3: get curious because curiosity and fear can't coexist. So when
Speaker 3: we're curious, we begin to transfer this energy into excitement,
Speaker 3: into adventure, into something that we can use. And then
Speaker 3: the third step is trajectory. Where do we point that?
Speaker 3: Where do we point now that we have all of
Speaker 3: our sort of butterflies and alignment, where do we point
Speaker 3: all of that stress energy to serve us in the
Speaker 3: best way. And it turns out, if you really want
Speaker 3: to mitigate your stress, all of the things that we're
Speaker 3: told to do, like meditation and massage and one to
Speaker 3: one coaching. All of that it doesn't work. The only
Speaker 3: intervention that actually works to help mitigate stress is service
Speaker 3: to others. So when we serve other people, we actually
Speaker 3: relieve our own stress, which is pretty powerful. So the
Speaker 3: snapshot of the book is a way to utilize your
Speaker 3: stress energy in a way that begins to both serve
Speaker 3: you other people and help you through both personal and
Speaker 3: professional stressors.
Speaker 1: Is this your first book?
Speaker 3: It's my second book. It's my favorite. Don't tell the
Speaker 3: first book, but it's definitely my favorite book. Oh, it's definitely.
Speaker 1: I would not dream of it. I would not blame
Speaker 1: of it. Yeah, so do you have so for people
Speaker 1: who are listening to this thinking like this makes sense,
Speaker 1: I like the stories, I like the I just don't
Speaker 1: know where to start though, And I know there's no
Speaker 1: as we already identified, there's no three step plan, there's
Speaker 1: no universally appropriate or effective protocol. But for people who
Speaker 1: are you know, long time I was going to say suffers,
Speaker 1: wrong word, but been dealing with stress and anxiety and
Speaker 1: not in a healthy way for a long time. Any idea,
Speaker 1: any suggestions for them? Rebecca.
Speaker 3: Yeah, here's where I start. Set a three minute timer
Speaker 3: and instead of trying to avoid the stressor invaded in,
Speaker 3: so for three minutes, I want you to stress out
Speaker 3: of your gourd. Maybe it's like doing push ups. Maybe
Speaker 3: it's punching something. Maybe it's journaling and catastrophizing it in
Speaker 3: and going this is you know, I have a phone
Speaker 3: call come in during this podcast. A now that everybody's
Speaker 3: gonna hate me, the podcast is gonna bump. I'll never
Speaker 3: get invaded again, I'll never speak again. My husband's going
Speaker 3: to divorce me, and I'm going to die in a
Speaker 3: ditch like that. That's what we do. We get tastrifize, right,
Speaker 3: So allow yourself to go there, set that timer for
Speaker 3: three minutes. What that does is going to move you
Speaker 3: through that first three minutes of screaming terror that we
Speaker 3: engage with in our stress. And then when the timer dings,
Speaker 3: take a deep breath. You not trying to calm down,
Speaker 3: but I want you to ask yourself a series of questions.
Speaker 3: This is where curiosity comes in. How can I grow
Speaker 3: from this? What will I learn from this? What's the
Speaker 3: best case scenario? What if it works out? And this
Speaker 3: series of questions is meant to transfer you to a
Speaker 3: space where this becomes an adventure. How do I begin
Speaker 3: to choose adventure? And the third piece I'll ask anybody
Speaker 3: to do it. And this again, this whole protocol takes
Speaker 3: under five minutes. Is to sit straight, put a smile
Speaker 3: on your face, maybe like punch a little like, get
Speaker 3: a little confident about it, get a little cocky in
Speaker 3: the moment. Because what your body does is it's feeding
Speaker 3: your brain, and your brain is looking to your body
Speaker 3: to try and understand the signals that are happening. When
Speaker 3: we get scared, when we get anxious, we're like, we
Speaker 3: just like get really protected, and we put a frown
Speaker 3: on our face and we're not smiling because we're happy, y'all.
Speaker 3: We're happy because we smile. Our brain is getting feedback
Speaker 3: from our body to understand the signals that are happening.
Speaker 3: And so when we throw our shoulders back, we put
Speaker 3: a smile on our face and we're like, in this moment,
Speaker 3: going how can this work out? What will I learn?
Speaker 3: How will I grow? Our brain is getting the signal
Speaker 3: that we're acting as if this is an adventure, and
Speaker 3: as a result, it becomes more of an adventure rather
Speaker 3: than an ordeal, and we start running towards the thing
Speaker 3: that is going to bring us our most meaning and
Speaker 3: purpose in our life, which is actually our stress.
Speaker 1: Yeah is lava? Thank you? That's great?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 1: Sure is so what we call maybe distress and you stress,
Speaker 1: you know, good stuff and bad stuff, like what we
Speaker 1: would go exercise is a good form of stress because
Speaker 1: we're doing a hard thing to create a good outcome,
Speaker 1: and we all know that. And then the other kind
Speaker 1: of distress where I'm feeling terrified and uncomfortable in a
Speaker 1: bad way, and all of that is what's happening physiologically
Speaker 1: in the body and biochemically, is it the same, the
Speaker 1: same chemicals being produced in u stress versus distress.
Speaker 3: Almost. Yeah, So depend upon where you're looking at in
Speaker 3: the stress response. First of all, I want to say, Craig, please,
Speaker 3: all of your listeners throw out you stress and distress.
Speaker 3: Just throw it out. Stop legling your stress good and bad.
Speaker 3: It just is stress. Stop it all. Stress can be
Speaker 3: you stress. That's why I.
Speaker 1: Feel rebuked, Tiff. I feel like I've been reprimanded.
Speaker 3: Do you feel stressed, Craig, I yeah, I'm so stressed.
Speaker 1: I'm going to have to go and eight cake.
Speaker 3: When we do tell ourselves, and this is early on
Speaker 3: in the stress response, if it's a typical distress, like
Speaker 3: something bad is coming, and we tell ourselves that this
Speaker 3: is my body preparing me to rise to the challenge,
Speaker 3: it actually changes our physiology. Instead of constricting our blood vessels,
Speaker 3: it actually opens them. So that's a major shift in
Speaker 3: the way our body responds to what could be a
Speaker 3: bad stressor right. So the more we can get out
Speaker 3: of these labels and just say this is a signal
Speaker 3: that my body is about to rise to a challenge, yeah,
Speaker 3: then stress becomes just a competitive advantage. Honestly, it becomes
Speaker 3: a competitive advantage.
Speaker 1: I feel like I'm always talking to people about biofeedeback
Speaker 1: the fact that their body is teaching them and telling
Speaker 1: them or trying to teach them and tell them, and hey,
Speaker 1: there's this thing that's going on. You know. It's like
Speaker 1: I'm gaining weight or I'm losing weight, or I just
Speaker 1: went to the toilet and my wheeze like orange. Maybe
Speaker 1: I should hydrate, or you know, I could go much worse,
Speaker 1: but I feel like I won't for you, you know,
Speaker 1: or I'm not sleeping or you know whatever, and we're
Speaker 1: trying to figure out. I'm always pleading with people to
Speaker 1: try to figure out one what their body is telling
Speaker 1: them too, to pay attention, and three to educate yourself
Speaker 1: on your body, because even though there's a lot of
Speaker 1: you know, similarity and commonality, the truth is that unless
Speaker 1: you're an identical twin, your physiology is unique. Right, So
Speaker 1: what will work for one person, you know, and not
Speaker 1: only what will work for one won't work for the other.
Speaker 1: What might be great eight for one could be fucking
Speaker 1: catastrophic for someone else. And even back I think about
Speaker 1: I was giving a talk recently and I was we're
Speaker 1: talking about this, and I said, also, what will work
Speaker 1: for you when you're twenty might be a major problem
Speaker 1: when you're forty. You know, When I was a kid,
Speaker 1: I grew up in the country drinking milk by the gallon.
Speaker 1: Apart from the fat that I was fat, fact that
Speaker 1: I was a fat kid, which probably wasn't a great outcome,
Speaker 1: but I could drink all the milk I want. Now,
Speaker 1: if I drink this much milk, I'm gagging like a
Speaker 1: cat with a fur ball because I'm not producing as
Speaker 1: much lactase as I did thirty years ago, right, So
Speaker 1: what will work for you you know now might not
Speaker 1: work for you on a emotionally, socially, mentally, physiologically. So
Speaker 1: our body is always evolving, but it's always teaching us.
Speaker 3: Right, Oh, it's so graig. I can't. I can't love
Speaker 3: that comment more. And we have been culturally inductrinated ignore
Speaker 3: our bodies. Right, It's like, well, it's lunchtime, so I
Speaker 3: better eat well, are you hungry? Are you hungry? And
Speaker 3: one of the things that I learned early on is
Speaker 3: your taste buds are always going to lie to you.
Speaker 3: Your stomach won't, but your taste buds will. And so
Speaker 3: it's learning to listen to different parts of your body too,
Speaker 3: because my taste buds will always tell me that crispy
Speaker 3: kremes glazed donuts all day, every day are the thing
Speaker 3: that I want to eat. And the second I gets
Speaker 3: past my taste buds, my stomach is like, oh why
Speaker 3: do you do that to me? That?
Speaker 1: Oh why?
Speaker 3: So just having an awareness of different parts of your body,
Speaker 3: checking in with yourself, and this is key because we
Speaker 3: just talked about pushing beyond our limits as well, so
Speaker 3: it is not just in the moment because in the moment,
Speaker 3: this is going to be uncomfortable and I'm gonna go.
Speaker 3: I don't want to it doesn't feel good. Yeah, okay,
Speaker 3: what does it feel like an hour from now? Yes,
Speaker 3: Because to your point, like I was an athlete growing up,
Speaker 3: and I used to go out and run, like in
Speaker 3: the middle of the heat of the day. It's ninety
Speaker 3: degrees out there right now. If I went out there
Speaker 3: right now and I ran, I would die literally, like
Speaker 3: it's not it's not okay for me anymore. And having
Speaker 3: those discomfort, that discomfort is important to an extent, and
Speaker 3: you need to measure it in the moment, in the
Speaker 3: moment after, in the day after, and then see as
Speaker 3: an individual, what is that level that I can push
Speaker 3: you know, a little bit more, a little bit more,
Speaker 3: a little bit more without it being a negative feedback.
Speaker 3: And that's that's really important, and it's very individual.
Speaker 1: Now tif you've opened the bio feedback door and the
Speaker 1: learning from your body. What's your look at that face?
Speaker 1: What's your blood sugar right now? Will explain to Rebecca
Speaker 1: in a moment, But what's your blood sugar at the moment?
Speaker 2: Three point seven? And last night is the worst night
Speaker 2: I have had it dipped in to what looks like
Speaker 2: probably two.
Speaker 1: Wow. Dude, dude, oh.
Speaker 3: Are you even functional? Good God, woman, are you fascy?
Speaker 2: No, I'm eating more than ever eat before bed the
Speaker 2: last since I've had this, I'm eating before bed. I'm
Speaker 2: trying to stabilize it. How interesting not having any wins.
Speaker 1: The other day we did a podcast, so she's trying
Speaker 1: to figure out her blood sugar. And by the way,
Speaker 1: if you ever round Tiff when she's hungry, don't be
Speaker 1: around Tiff when she's hungry. Like, if Tip's hungry, goes
Speaker 1: somewhere else, that's not it.
Speaker 3: I get hungry, but I don't punch like Tiff.
Speaker 1: So yeah, no, no, she's she's I don't know what's
Speaker 1: one level above hungry, but she is that. So not
Speaker 1: to hijack Rebecca's spotlight, Tiff, but how do you feel
Speaker 1: right now?
Speaker 2: This is an interesting conversation because I don't aside from
Speaker 2: obviously fatigue and crashing and shitty energy, which I've always had,
Speaker 2: I would assume this is a long term thing which
Speaker 2: is getting enhanced by perimenopause and hormone shifts. But the
Speaker 2: since having that awareness, I'm now grappling with the my Yeah,
Speaker 2: my knowledge of what's going on is called utress.
Speaker 3: Yes, this is huge because I have a you know,
Speaker 3: I have a tracking device, and sometimes I'm like I
Speaker 3: wake up and I'm like, oh, I feel great, I
Speaker 3: slept greed, and then I look at my device and
Speaker 3: I'm like, oh, I slept for shit, and then immediately
Speaker 3: I feel terrible. Yeah, so this is an interesting like
Speaker 3: I I would love to do it, like to play
Speaker 3: a little, and I don't want to compromise your health
Speaker 3: at all, but it'd be really interesting for people one
Speaker 3: who is tracking to just keep tracking like how they
Speaker 3: actually feel, and then go back and look at the
Speaker 3: data and see how well it matches. Because I think
Speaker 3: so often now because we have the ability to measure everything,
Speaker 3: we're like, wow, I feel like garbage. Oh that's why this,
Speaker 3: This is why I feel like garbage. And yeah, and
Speaker 3: we let that drive it rather than the reverse, if
Speaker 3: that makes sense.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 1: I reckon tracking is good to a point and then
Speaker 1: it's bad. But it's free, like your bunch of gris
Speaker 1: three that it was too love you.
Speaker 3: Got that checked. That's that's scary, that's scary.
Speaker 1: Yeah, how many times a day do you eight tif
Speaker 1: do you reckon at the.
Speaker 3: Minute hundred all the time, all the time. You don't
Speaker 3: want to pass you like a little worths right now,
Speaker 3: like just suck on some hard candy or something.
Speaker 2: About My suspicion is for the for the level of
Speaker 2: intensity that I've always trained when I'm competing and even
Speaker 2: when I'm not, I think that looking now, I would
Speaker 2: be too low cap. I'm like, I'm not deliberately low cab,
Speaker 2: but I assume for how much in the intensity I
Speaker 2: train that's been going on for a while.
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's probably the case. Yeah, it's amazing how much
Speaker 3: our nutrition affects. Oh my gosh, there's so there's so
Speaker 3: many factors. And of course the soon to be doctor Harper,
Speaker 3: you know in physiology, like you change one little shift
Speaker 3: in hormones and everything changes. So it is, and we
Speaker 3: don't coming back to Youtipe, we do not study women enough,
Speaker 3: and especially women athletes, especially perry metopause. Like there's so
Speaker 3: many factors there that like a small tweak in diet,
Speaker 3: in hormones and anything, and it's like who knows, who
Speaker 3: knows what it is at this point, it could be anything.
Speaker 3: And that's both the joy and the absolute extreme frustration
Speaker 3: of physiology is like yep, yep, Like my body doesn't
Speaker 3: process alcohol. How dumb is that? Missing an enzyme that
Speaker 3: like breaks up a cheap date? But like it took
Speaker 3: me years to figure that out. I'm like, how are
Speaker 3: people doing this or just sucking back guinness? And I'm like,
Speaker 3: I'm dying over here. So like just learning those little
Speaker 3: things about your unique body. Who knows what it is
Speaker 3: with your with your blood sugar?
Speaker 2: I don't.
Speaker 3: It's an insulin strange it as. I don't know who knows?
Speaker 1: So what's the plan, Tiff, Well, this is the thing.
Speaker 2: I don't know who to Like, I'm trying to figure
Speaker 2: out what type of person with what knowledge I want
Speaker 2: to go to. Like I want someone that deals with athletes.
Speaker 2: I want someone that understands my background, but also that
Speaker 2: understands hormones at this time of my life. So I'm
Speaker 2: trying to do a lot of research before I go
Speaker 2: and turn to you know, I don't rock up to
Speaker 2: the LGP that knows nothing. It's a lot, yeah, a lot, Yeah,
Speaker 2: it's a lot.
Speaker 1: I think what's good is you're tracking everything and you
Speaker 1: are building more understanding about how your body responds to
Speaker 1: different things as you go.
Speaker 2: Yeah, you know, and eye because you have to let
Speaker 2: go of stories or things that like high intensity training
Speaker 2: has been my thing for so long and now I'm
Speaker 2: just strength training and it's really uncomfortable to do that.
Speaker 2: And it's really uncomfortable to eat a bowl of fucking
Speaker 2: oats before bed.
Speaker 3: I'm like, this is not what we do.
Speaker 2: But I'm looking at my blunk sugar, going, well, this
Speaker 2: is now what we do. Just for now.
Speaker 3: You need to heal some shit.
Speaker 2: You need to try to heal some shit. Yeah.
Speaker 1: I just need some dark chocolate on the bedside table
Speaker 1: and just wake up on the hour. I just have
Speaker 1: a little square and back to sleep. You know.
Speaker 3: I really hope you go see endocronologist and I want
Speaker 3: to know the end of the story. I feel like
Speaker 3: I'm hanging on their edge now, like this is this
Speaker 3: is a cliffhanger that I need some follow up on.
Speaker 3: I need some closure on test.
Speaker 2: This is interesting, all right, stay tuned, all right now.
Speaker 1: The book is called Springboard Transformed Stress to Work for you,
Speaker 1: Doctor Rebecca High, Did I pronounce heist correctly?
Speaker 3: Yeah? You nailed it. Like nace or lace or mice
Speaker 3: or whatever association you like.
Speaker 1: That let's not go with lice. Doctor Rebecca Height, PhD.
Speaker 1: Not lie. Don't confused that the book is out. Now
Speaker 1: go and get yourself thirteen copies, twenty seven copies. Well
Speaker 1: say goodbye off air, but Rebecca, we're going to get
Speaker 1: you back, even if you don't want to, We're going
Speaker 1: to get you back. Nice debut on the U Project.
Speaker 3: What a pleasure.
Speaker 1: We're quite fond of you. You're quite good at that.
Speaker 1: Thank you so much. We appreciate you.
Speaker 3: Gosh, I appreciate the two of you. This was This
Speaker 3: was truly a ton of fun. And I'm really serious.
Speaker 3: I want to know the end of the story. Thank you,
Speaker 3: thank you. This has been a gift.