WEBVTT - Sharri | 19 June 0:00:04.519 --> 0:00:07.640 Show, good evening. 0:00:07.680 --> 0:00:09.680 Well coming up on the show tonight, and it's a 0:00:09.720 --> 0:00:13.480 massive show. Tonight Peter Dutton goes all in on nuclear 0:00:13.680 --> 0:00:15.760 We'll have a look at whether the polls. 0:00:15.400 --> 0:00:16.759 Are on his side. 0:00:17.200 --> 0:00:21.280 Also tonight, he was one of the country's most powerful bureaucrats. 0:00:21.640 --> 0:00:25.280 Former Home Affairs Boss Mike Bozzullo would join Me Live 0:00:25.520 --> 0:00:29.600 for an exclusive interview to discuss China's bullying of cheng 0:00:29.680 --> 0:00:33.800 Lei Albanizi's approach to China and the threat of war 0:00:34.040 --> 0:00:38.480 that coming up and in a special and emotional interview. 0:00:38.920 --> 0:00:43.000 Two survivors of the October seven massacre are on the show, 0:00:43.479 --> 0:00:47.120 a mother held at gunpoint and a local police officer 0:00:47.440 --> 0:00:51.600 who fought off terrorists and saved two hundred lives. 0:00:52.000 --> 0:00:52.960 You don't want to miss that. 0:00:54.000 --> 0:00:58.000 But first now to Peter Dutton's major nuclear energy plan, 0:00:58.360 --> 0:01:01.520 which has drawn fierce political battle lines. 0:01:02.120 --> 0:01:03.600 As you know by now. 0:01:03.520 --> 0:01:09.240 Peter Dutton today announced seven sites for nuclear reactors in Queensland, 0:01:09.440 --> 0:01:13.440 New South Wales, Victoria, WA and South Australia. 0:01:14.080 --> 0:01:18.200 Here he was making that announcement, what will. 0:01:18.000 --> 0:01:21.480 Happen in Osborne, where Premier Malanowski is signed up to 0:01:21.640 --> 0:01:24.640 the Orchest deal. There will be a reactor there where 0:01:24.680 --> 0:01:27.800 sub mariners in Australian uniforms will be sleeping in the 0:01:27.840 --> 0:01:31.720 submarine alongside the reactor in a safe way in Henderson 0:01:31.760 --> 0:01:35.360 in WA. Then Premier McGowan signed up to the Orchest 0:01:35.400 --> 0:01:39.240 deal where the nuclear reactors in the submarines will be 0:01:39.319 --> 0:01:44.840 there alongside residential and industrial areas. So those premiers have 0:01:44.920 --> 0:01:48.320 shown a level of pragmatism. Before we signed up to Orcust, 0:01:48.440 --> 0:01:50.960 nobody believed that it could happen. Everyone said that the 0:01:50.960 --> 0:01:51.960 premiers wouldn't. 0:01:51.640 --> 0:01:52.120 Agree to it. 0:01:52.160 --> 0:01:54.880 They did, so we'll work with the premiers because it's 0:01:54.920 --> 0:01:56.080 in our national interest. 0:01:57.520 --> 0:02:01.960 Well, the opposition to his policy today extensive, with every 0:02:02.080 --> 0:02:05.880 labor figure in the country opposing it in the strongest 0:02:05.920 --> 0:02:07.120 possible terms. 0:02:08.400 --> 0:02:10.960 We know that mister Dutton wants to slow down the 0:02:11.040 --> 0:02:14.000 role out of renewables and he wants to introduce the 0:02:14.040 --> 0:02:16.920 most expensive form of energy that's slow to build. But 0:02:17.000 --> 0:02:21.040 today we've seen no costs, we've seen no gigawatts, we've 0:02:21.080 --> 0:02:21.920 seen no detail. 0:02:22.720 --> 0:02:23.360 This is a joke. 0:02:24.040 --> 0:02:28.840 It is the worst combination of economic and ideological stupidity. 0:02:29.080 --> 0:02:31.760 We're not supporting nuclear power. I think our state laws 0:02:31.760 --> 0:02:33.880 are pretty clear when it comes to planning, but whether 0:02:33.919 --> 0:02:38.600 there's some overriding constitutional question that he can pursue. 0:02:38.880 --> 0:02:43.880 Nuclear energy is toxic, it's risky, it's more expensive. 0:02:45.200 --> 0:02:48.959 The announcement was always going to be controversial, and there 0:02:49.000 --> 0:02:52.640 will be a massive scare campaign from labor, no question. 0:02:54.000 --> 0:02:56.880 I'm sort of staggered that we haven't heard aim and 0:02:57.000 --> 0:02:59.960 talk about three headed Fish and the Simpsons and Springfield, 0:03:00.720 --> 0:03:02.160 all the other things that you had to see a 0:03:02.160 --> 0:03:03.799 lot of over the next of a while, because we're 0:03:03.800 --> 0:03:07.000 going to have the mother of all scare campaigns that 0:03:07.040 --> 0:03:09.520 has played out before us over the next in a while. 0:03:10.840 --> 0:03:13.160 And the scare campaign kicked off today. 0:03:13.919 --> 0:03:17.880 Just like with medi scare, this emotional fear campaign could 0:03:17.880 --> 0:03:22.239 well be very effective. But what do these labor politicians 0:03:22.360 --> 0:03:26.520 say about the thirty two countries internationally which already rely 0:03:26.840 --> 0:03:30.720 on nuclear energy. Nuclear is a successful part of the 0:03:30.840 --> 0:03:39.440 energy mix in Canada, Mexico, the USA, Argentina, Brazil, Belgium, Finland, France, Spain, Sweden, Switzerland, 0:03:39.440 --> 0:03:39.880 the UK. 0:03:40.480 --> 0:03:41.720 The list goes on. 0:03:42.880 --> 0:03:48.360 Sky News reporter Annalie's Nielsen visited Canada's nuclear reactor sites 0:03:48.560 --> 0:03:51.720 to see their model, and it's said to be close 0:03:52.040 --> 0:03:54.040 to the one that Dutton is pursuing. 0:03:55.480 --> 0:03:58.520 Nuclear power has been operating safely in Canada since the 0:03:58.600 --> 0:04:03.320 nineteen sixties. The province of Ontario has three nuclear facilities 0:04:03.520 --> 0:04:07.560 that generates around sixty percent of the energy here and 0:04:07.720 --> 0:04:10.920 is often held up as the model to export to Australia. 0:04:12.480 --> 0:04:16.479 But Peter Dutton left himself open to attack today by 0:04:16.520 --> 0:04:20.440 refusing to detail the cost of this policy. At least 0:04:20.440 --> 0:04:25.520 of the moment, it unquestionably will be expensive, but then 0:04:25.640 --> 0:04:29.360 so is the renewable energy transition. There are also remaining 0:04:29.480 --> 0:04:35.440 questions about nuclear waste now. It was Anthony Albanesi himself, 0:04:35.680 --> 0:04:40.240 as part of Kevin Rudd's team in opposition, who campaigned against. 0:04:40.040 --> 0:04:41.960 Nuclear in two thousand and seven. 0:04:42.600 --> 0:04:46.720 At the time, Ziggi Switkowski recommended to John Howard, who 0:04:46.760 --> 0:04:50.520 is the PM, that Australia consider nuclear as part of 0:04:50.560 --> 0:04:55.360 its action to curb emissions or John Howard, facing a 0:04:55.360 --> 0:04:59.320 loss at the two thousand and seven election, dropped the policy. 0:05:00.200 --> 0:05:05.279 But before that there were TV ads campaign posters just 0:05:05.480 --> 0:05:08.719 like this advert from August two thousand and seven. 0:05:10.160 --> 0:05:12.960 John Howard says a nuclear industry is a solution to 0:05:13.000 --> 0:05:16.680 climate change, but he won't say where the reactor should go. 0:05:17.360 --> 0:05:20.080 He refuses to talk about a list of possible sites 0:05:20.080 --> 0:05:26.240 for reactors that includes Rockhampton, Bunderberg, Mackay, Townsville, the Sunshine Coast, 0:05:26.920 --> 0:05:34.000 even Brydie Island, Queensland. Beautiful one day, nuclear the next. 0:05:36.279 --> 0:05:39.640 And that was a very effective scare campaign back in 0:05:39.680 --> 0:05:43.839 two thousand and seven. Well, Albinizi ran the campaign. He 0:05:43.960 --> 0:05:48.279 knows this area well and he won't hesitate to strike again. 0:05:49.560 --> 0:05:51.960 What's your number one reason? What's your number one message 0:05:52.040 --> 0:05:54.640 to people who live in and around loy Yang, which 0:05:54.680 --> 0:05:56.560 is the site of a potential nuclear reactor. 0:05:56.600 --> 0:05:58.640 What would you say to them. 0:05:59.320 --> 0:06:04.640 That a nuclear reactor is fifteen years away and will 0:06:04.760 --> 0:06:08.560 drive up power prices, lead to more energy and security, 0:06:09.040 --> 0:06:13.680 and lead to less jobs being created. Every economic analysis 0:06:13.760 --> 0:06:17.440 says it doesn't stack up, and that's why it's extraordinary 0:06:17.960 --> 0:06:20.120 that they continue to go down this track. 0:06:21.400 --> 0:06:24.640 Well, he doesn't mention that Labor has already signed up 0:06:24.800 --> 0:06:28.159 to nuclear powered submarines as part of the Orchest deal. 0:06:28.760 --> 0:06:31.599 He also doesn't mentioned that thirty two other countries around 0:06:31.600 --> 0:06:34.880 the world, as I said, rely on nuclear as part 0:06:34.920 --> 0:06:38.279 of their energy mix. And never mind that his solution 0:06:38.760 --> 0:06:44.040 renewable energy won't meet our energy needs alone. What Political 0:06:44.160 --> 0:06:48.039 editor Simon Benson notes today that the more hysterical the 0:06:48.080 --> 0:06:52.080 Prime Minister and his colleagues are inclined to become, the 0:06:52.080 --> 0:06:55.479 more he is lured into presenting as an opposition leader 0:06:55.800 --> 0:06:59.440 rather than a prime minister. And Simon Benson says that 0:06:59.480 --> 0:07:03.159 the nuclear plan is a platform for Peter Dutton's rebrand 0:07:03.320 --> 0:07:06.640 as a leader. He writes that it shifts the dynamic 0:07:06.680 --> 0:07:10.400 from a coalition opposition always opposed to things, as to 0:07:10.520 --> 0:07:15.040 one fighting for something. Well, this may be the case, 0:07:15.320 --> 0:07:20.000 but ultimately the nuclear debate presents the greatest political risk 0:07:20.400 --> 0:07:24.280 for Peter Dutton, who's in recent times been surging ahead 0:07:24.320 --> 0:07:28.920 of Albanezi in the polls. It's virtually unprecedented to have 0:07:29.240 --> 0:07:33.440 such a significant policy contest ahead of a federal election. 0:07:34.400 --> 0:07:37.640 Both leaders say that the next election will be a 0:07:37.680 --> 0:07:40.680 referendum on nuclear energy. 0:07:41.440 --> 0:07:43.320 I'm very happy for the election to be a referendum 0:07:43.600 --> 0:07:47.560 on energy, on nuclear on power prices, on lights going out. 0:07:47.640 --> 0:07:49.640 As we agree, the next election will be a referendum 0:07:49.640 --> 0:07:52.160 on energy policy. Mister Dutton says the next election will 0:07:52.160 --> 0:07:54.800 be a referendum on energy policy. We actually agree with that. 0:07:55.280 --> 0:07:57.360 But here's the news for mister Dutton have a referendum, 0:07:57.360 --> 0:07:58.200 You've gotta have a policy. 0:07:59.440 --> 0:08:02.000 Well, without rob and easy proving himself to be a 0:08:02.040 --> 0:08:06.080 failure of a leader who has destroyed Australian's social cohesion 0:08:06.560 --> 0:08:11.520 and is incapable of governing effectively, Well, if he executes 0:08:11.720 --> 0:08:15.680 this scare campaign properly, it just could be a lifeline 0:08:15.760 --> 0:08:19.440 for him in choosing to pursue this policy contest. 0:08:19.800 --> 0:08:23.840 The stakes for Peter Darton are as high as they 0:08:23.880 --> 0:08:29.880 can get. All Right, As I said, it's a big show. 0:08:29.920 --> 0:08:32.720 I've got an exclusive interview with Mike Bozzullo coming up. 0:08:32.800 --> 0:08:35.440 Also two survivors of the Nova Music Festival. 0:08:35.760 --> 0:08:38.079 But first let's discuss this nuclear debate. 0:08:38.160 --> 0:08:41.400 Let's bring it now Tonight's Political Panel National Senate Leader 0:08:41.440 --> 0:08:45.960 Bridget McKenzie and the Menzies Research Center Executive director Dave Hughes. 0:08:46.160 --> 0:08:47.600 Welcome to you both. 0:08:48.160 --> 0:08:51.880 Bridget, do you think this is a gamble worth taking 0:08:52.000 --> 0:08:52.760 for the Coalition? 0:08:55.080 --> 0:09:01.280 Absolutely, Sharion, I really loved your opening segment. We don't 0:09:01.280 --> 0:09:03.840 see it as a gamble. We see it as providing 0:09:03.880 --> 0:09:08.000 a credible vision for a safe and prosperous, sustainable future 0:09:08.000 --> 0:09:10.840 for our country. We're not just interested getting to net 0:09:10.920 --> 0:09:13.440 zero by twenty fifty. We still want to be a 0:09:13.480 --> 0:09:16.840 sovereign country that cannot just keep the lights on but 0:09:17.480 --> 0:09:22.360 have a fantastic economic growth story in the coming century, 0:09:22.440 --> 0:09:28.160 and that means having affordable, reliable baseload power generation. Now, 0:09:28.200 --> 0:09:33.160 with ninety percent of that reliable baseload going off in 0:09:33.200 --> 0:09:35.800 the next decade, we need something to replace it, and 0:09:36.360 --> 0:09:38.920 wind and solar aren't going to do it. We know that, 0:09:39.679 --> 0:09:41.680 and I'm very, very proud to be part of a 0:09:41.720 --> 0:09:44.880 team that is putting Australia where it should have been 0:09:45.000 --> 0:09:49.720 during Howard's years and actually harnessing the opportunity that nuclear 0:09:49.760 --> 0:09:52.560 power generation brings in a low emissions future. 0:09:54.160 --> 0:09:56.560 Dave, just how big a risk this is for the 0:09:56.559 --> 0:09:59.839 coalition ultimately comes down to the current view of a 0:10:00.000 --> 0:10:03.520 Australians and whether they are going to support this. 0:10:03.920 --> 0:10:05.000 Can you tell us a bit. 0:10:04.840 --> 0:10:07.680 About what some of the recent polls have shown about 0:10:07.720 --> 0:10:10.920 whether Australians do support a move towards. 0:10:10.640 --> 0:10:14.560 Nuclear A lot has changed since that Scare campaign that 0:10:14.600 --> 0:10:18.520 Anthony Alberanesi ran in two thousand and seven. Back then, 0:10:19.000 --> 0:10:23.280 sixty percent of Australians were opposed to nuclear energy. In 0:10:23.320 --> 0:10:27.160 twenty twenty four sixty percent of Australians support nuclear energy. 0:10:27.200 --> 0:10:29.319 We know that because the Low Institute has been tracking 0:10:29.400 --> 0:10:33.600 this issue for a number of years. Labor voters as 0:10:33.640 --> 0:10:37.360 well support nuclear energy. There was a pole from Jim Reed. 0:10:39.400 --> 0:10:39.920 Some of them. 0:10:41.000 --> 0:10:43.959 There was a pole from Jim Reid who runs Resolved 0:10:43.960 --> 0:10:47.959 Strategic recently as well, it showed that only twenty percent 0:10:48.000 --> 0:10:51.040 of labor voters were opposed to nuclear energy. So the 0:10:51.080 --> 0:10:54.440 grounds for a scare campaign are significantly different than they 0:10:54.480 --> 0:10:56.680 were in two thousand and seven. So that's something that 0:10:56.720 --> 0:10:59.480 Anthony Alberanesi needs to factor in. He also needs to 0:10:59.520 --> 0:11:02.240 factor in that if he's running a scare campaign around 0:11:02.360 --> 0:11:07.160 nuclear safety, that scare campaign also undermines the orcut submarines 0:11:07.480 --> 0:11:09.880 that are going to be docked in Adelaide and in Perth, 0:11:10.640 --> 0:11:14.560 our nuclear reactor that's operated safely not too far from 0:11:14.600 --> 0:11:17.000 us in southwestern Sydney as well, So he's going to 0:11:17.000 --> 0:11:18.360 have to be conscious of that if he's looking to 0:11:18.400 --> 0:11:19.560 run another scare campaign. 0:11:19.679 --> 0:11:21.400 And do you think though, this is going to be 0:11:21.480 --> 0:11:22.439 a big political risk. 0:11:22.480 --> 0:11:24.960 I mean, you ran at least the media section of 0:11:25.000 --> 0:11:28.559 the Liberal Party's last federal election campaign or the past 0:11:28.559 --> 0:11:30.680 couple do you think this is a big gamble for 0:11:30.679 --> 0:11:31.760 the coalition. 0:11:31.840 --> 0:11:34.120 Well, it's going to dominate. It's going to be one 0:11:34.160 --> 0:11:36.120 of the issues that's going to dominate the next campaign, 0:11:36.200 --> 0:11:39.880 that's for sure. Peter Dutton's been open about this so 0:11:40.000 --> 0:11:43.199 for the last year, and in that same time his 0:11:43.360 --> 0:11:47.320 vote has strengthened and Anthony Alberonizi's vote's been declining. And 0:11:47.400 --> 0:11:53.439 I think younger Australians in particular, aren't you know, they 0:11:53.480 --> 0:11:56.880 place facts above fear as well. They're more open to 0:11:57.000 --> 0:11:58.679 nuclear as well. So I think they're going to be 0:11:58.760 --> 0:12:01.280 persuaded by the facts in this argument and not spooked 0:12:01.320 --> 0:12:03.880 by three eyed fish and everything else that Labor will 0:12:03.920 --> 0:12:04.439 roll out. 0:12:04.520 --> 0:12:06.439 All right, let's have a look at Labor and p 0:12:06.679 --> 0:12:09.439 Josh Burns And as you know by now, his federal 0:12:09.480 --> 0:12:14.280 office was vandalized overnight by pro Palestinian activists. It was 0:12:14.360 --> 0:12:17.760 what the Jewish MP called a politically motivated attack. 0:12:17.800 --> 0:12:23.200 Have a look. No amount of aggression and violence. 0:12:22.760 --> 0:12:25.400 Here in Australia is going to change what's happening in 0:12:25.400 --> 0:12:27.920 the Middle East. This sort of vandalism, this sort of 0:12:27.920 --> 0:12:30.240 political aggression, has no place in Australia. 0:12:30.640 --> 0:12:31.199 It's enough. 0:12:32.960 --> 0:12:36.520 Bridget you know what I found so moving about Josh's 0:12:36.559 --> 0:12:39.840 comments when he held that press conference earlier today is that 0:12:39.920 --> 0:12:43.600 he made the point that if action isn't taken, there 0:12:43.720 --> 0:12:46.959 is going to be an attack, that this is escalating, 0:12:47.080 --> 0:12:50.480 something worse is going to happen. And we are seeing 0:12:50.559 --> 0:12:54.920 lawlessness in part because our political leaders and the police 0:12:55.120 --> 0:12:56.320 aren't doing anything. 0:12:56.360 --> 0:12:59.600 They're not arresting anyone. 0:13:00.200 --> 0:13:03.160 No, Shari, you know we've talked about this a lot. 0:13:03.160 --> 0:13:08.760 You're exactly right. The permissiveness, if I can use that word, 0:13:10.000 --> 0:13:16.160 of state governments, state police forces, and indeed the language 0:13:16.520 --> 0:13:23.280 being used by the federal government has allowed given tacit approval, 0:13:23.360 --> 0:13:27.520 shall we say, in people expressing their views in this 0:13:27.760 --> 0:13:32.200 conflict at home here domestically in ways that I think 0:13:32.200 --> 0:13:35.920 a reminiscent of the nineteen thirties in Germany. I've been appalled, 0:13:35.960 --> 0:13:39.720 as you have been, as you've highlighted over many, many months, 0:13:40.080 --> 0:13:44.360 what's happening on our suburban streets, in our schools, at 0:13:44.360 --> 0:13:49.280 our universities, in businesses that you would have been appalled 0:13:49.360 --> 0:13:54.640 and shocked about in previous decades that today are being 0:13:54.960 --> 0:13:58.240 almost tacitly approved or sort of waved way as if 0:13:58.280 --> 0:14:00.920 we're all helpless in the face of this sort of behavior. 0:14:01.200 --> 0:14:01.520 We're not. 0:14:02.120 --> 0:14:06.120 We have laws, stop keeping the peace and start up 0:14:06.160 --> 0:14:06.960 holding the law. 0:14:07.600 --> 0:14:11.840 Well said, absolutely agree. And what worries me as well, Dave, 0:14:11.960 --> 0:14:13.880 is that it's not it's a. 0:14:13.840 --> 0:14:15.079 Targeting of Jewish people. 0:14:15.200 --> 0:14:19.040 And we saw it just yet again overnight with Jerry Seinfeld. 0:14:19.200 --> 0:14:22.000 You know he's not a representative of Israel. He's just 0:14:22.200 --> 0:14:24.680 a Jewish comedian. And well, let's have a look at 0:14:24.720 --> 0:14:27.080 what happened again at his show last night. 0:14:28.840 --> 0:14:31.320 You're getting them on your side, can you hear it? 0:14:31.920 --> 0:14:32.200 Good? 0:14:33.560 --> 0:14:35.640 There's the police say you have. 0:14:35.840 --> 0:14:41.200 Shown political feelings, but you don't know where you say that. 0:14:42.800 --> 0:14:44.720 Do you think that ruining the name? 0:14:45.040 --> 0:14:46.080 It doesn't affect me? 0:14:46.600 --> 0:14:47.920 All these people. 0:14:47.600 --> 0:14:50.280 You're ruining their name. Thank you for Tommy. 0:14:50.400 --> 0:14:52.640 Did you like the horse bit before you leave? 0:14:54.040 --> 0:14:54.640 Did you get. 0:14:58.680 --> 0:14:59.160 So good? 0:14:59.240 --> 0:15:00.840 Did you like the whole bit before you left? 0:15:00.840 --> 0:15:03.520 I wish we could obvious see his show, But Dave, 0:15:03.560 --> 0:15:05.400 you know it strikes me and I made this point 0:15:05.440 --> 0:15:08.920 the other night that Jerry Seinfeld has a better grasp 0:15:08.920 --> 0:15:12.320 of security than our Australian federal police. He manages to 0:15:12.400 --> 0:15:15.040 move the pro Palestinians out. Why can't our police do 0:15:15.120 --> 0:15:15.480 the same. 0:15:16.280 --> 0:15:19.080 He got them out there quicker than Sydney University. Yes, 0:15:19.760 --> 0:15:22.960 that's for sure. As you said before, Shari, he's not 0:15:23.040 --> 0:15:25.960 out here as a representative of the Israeli government or 0:15:25.960 --> 0:15:29.800 the Israeli Defense Force. He's not a commentator, a prolific 0:15:29.800 --> 0:15:33.440 commentator on foreign policy issues. He's out here as a 0:15:33.480 --> 0:15:37.320 comedian to entertain. And the reason he was targeted by 0:15:37.400 --> 0:15:40.720 activists is because he's a Jew, and that's something we 0:15:40.720 --> 0:15:43.880 can't tolerate. And I'll be making the same point that 0:15:43.880 --> 0:15:47.280 that's equally concerning if it was a Muslim comedian targeted 0:15:47.640 --> 0:15:49.520 solely on the basis of their religion as well, that 0:15:49.600 --> 0:15:51.400 is something that we cannot tolerate in Australia. 0:15:51.400 --> 0:15:55.880 In twenty twenty four, Absolutely absolutely, bridget I couldn't believe 0:15:55.960 --> 0:15:58.640 this story in the City Morning Herald. Former Prime Minister 0:15:58.680 --> 0:16:02.320 Scott Morrison has been denied entry at least at the moment, 0:16:02.360 --> 0:16:05.360 but currently he has been denied entry from the Elite 0:16:05.480 --> 0:16:09.920 Australian Club. Now this is a controversial club, but the 0:16:09.960 --> 0:16:13.520 club secretary, Michael Solomon, said that they have a policy 0:16:13.560 --> 0:16:15.960 of not commenting on membership nominations. 0:16:16.560 --> 0:16:21.160 Ridget this is outrageous. He's a former prime minister. You 0:16:21.280 --> 0:16:24.880 might not agree with his politics, but his service to 0:16:24.920 --> 0:16:26.640 our country has been enormous. 0:16:29.280 --> 0:16:31.560 This is true, Sharry. But you and I can't join 0:16:31.600 --> 0:16:34.480 the Australia Club either. Let's remember that if I was 0:16:34.520 --> 0:16:37.600 the Prime minister. If I was the Prime Minister, I 0:16:37.600 --> 0:16:40.360 wouldn't be able to join the Australia clubs. 0:16:40.400 --> 0:16:42.480 So and we do have a. 0:16:42.280 --> 0:16:46.200 Former premier here in Victoria that's been unable to join 0:16:46.240 --> 0:16:50.960 a golf club down south of our place. So I 0:16:51.000 --> 0:16:54.480 do think at the end of the day, these are 0:16:55.080 --> 0:16:59.240 private entities, for good or for ill, that make these 0:16:59.240 --> 0:17:03.000 sort of decisions. And you know, I think former PM's, 0:17:03.320 --> 0:17:07.560 former servants of our country, no matter what side of politics, 0:17:08.160 --> 0:17:12.159 should be able to join these type of establishments. But 0:17:12.200 --> 0:17:15.200 I'd be arguing that I would hope that a future 0:17:15.200 --> 0:17:17.600 female Prime minister would also be able to join the 0:17:17.600 --> 0:17:18.720 Australia Club one day. 0:17:19.119 --> 0:17:22.919 Yes, indeed, that those are well made points. I have 0:17:23.080 --> 0:17:26.120 been for lunch there once or twice, and I don't 0:17:26.119 --> 0:17:28.000 know why everyone's to join as well. 0:17:28.000 --> 0:17:30.080 It's a bit stiff, it's a bit boring. 0:17:30.359 --> 0:17:33.119 I don't remember there being any atmosphere or music or 0:17:33.560 --> 0:17:34.160 great food. 0:17:34.200 --> 0:17:36.120 So there are other clubs I'd love to join. 0:17:36.359 --> 0:17:38.879 Come on, Dad, I share that view and I'm not 0:17:38.920 --> 0:17:40.080 a member of Dilas. 0:17:40.119 --> 0:17:41.600 I'm not a member, but I. 0:17:41.520 --> 0:17:42.440 Don't really think it's Scott. 0:17:42.480 --> 0:17:43.080 I don't think it's. 0:17:42.960 --> 0:17:46.960 Scott Morrison's style either. He's happy in shorts watching the footy, 0:17:47.119 --> 0:17:48.959 so I'm not sure it's really his style anyway. 0:17:49.280 --> 0:17:51.119 Look, he applied, did he apply? 0:17:51.440 --> 0:17:52.080 Did he apply? 0:17:52.600 --> 0:17:56.040 Well, the reporting says he did apply, So if he applied, 0:17:56.280 --> 0:17:58.600 the fact that they rejected him but not the likes 0:17:58.600 --> 0:18:01.600 of Malcolm Turnbull says a lot. All right, Bridget Mackenzie, 0:18:01.640 --> 0:18:04.560 Dave Hughes, it's very Sydney. Yes, great to have you 0:18:04.600 --> 0:18:07.480 both on tonight now, just before we got a break 0:18:07.480 --> 0:18:11.080 in a major development, Lisa Wilkinson is seeking to challenge 0:18:11.119 --> 0:18:15.240 a finding made against her in the Bruce Lehman defamation case. 0:18:15.560 --> 0:18:19.760 The Projects former star has filed to appeal against Justice 0:18:19.800 --> 0:18:24.040 Michael Lee's finding that she and ten acted unreasonably and 0:18:24.160 --> 0:18:28.320 unfairly when pursuing the Brittney Higgins story, and she claims 0:18:28.320 --> 0:18:31.720 the judge made more than fifty errors in the Bruce 0:18:31.800 --> 0:18:36.119 Lehman failed defamation case against her and Network ten. The 0:18:36.119 --> 0:18:38.919 Australian reports today that Justice Lee made a number of 0:18:39.000 --> 0:18:41.560 errors in its findings of her conduct and about the 0:18:41.640 --> 0:18:44.520 rape of Britney Higgins by mister Lherman. 0:18:45.119 --> 0:18:48.240 So yet again, that story never seems to end. 0:18:48.560 --> 0:18:51.280 Now, coming up, Mike Puzzullo will join me live in 0:18:51.320 --> 0:18:54.639 an exclusive interview. I'll ask him about China's bullying of 0:18:54.800 --> 0:18:57.639 Cheng Lai. Plus later in the show, I'll speak to 0:18:57.720 --> 0:19:00.280 two survivors of the October seven attack. 0:19:00.400 --> 0:19:09.560 By Hamask you don't want to miss that interview. Welcome back. 0:19:09.600 --> 0:19:12.720 Well, we saw this week that Chinese officials tried to 0:19:12.800 --> 0:19:17.239 bodyblock Australian journalist Chang Lay at a press briefing, and 0:19:17.280 --> 0:19:20.720 then we learned today that Cheng Lay was actually barred 0:19:20.880 --> 0:19:25.080 completely from attending another press event with the Chinese premier. 0:19:25.560 --> 0:19:29.359 This time it was his meeting with Peter Dutton. Cheng 0:19:29.440 --> 0:19:32.679 l wrote on Sky News that Australia is appeasing China 0:19:33.040 --> 0:19:36.280 and she's not surprised by it. She said, for a moment, 0:19:36.520 --> 0:19:40.360 it reminded me of being in residential surveillance, where shifts 0:19:40.400 --> 0:19:43.000 of two guards were glued to me every minute of 0:19:43.040 --> 0:19:47.359 the day. Anthony Alberdezi wanted to make this visit by 0:19:47.400 --> 0:19:51.760 the Chinese premier all about pandas and penfolds. But when 0:19:51.800 --> 0:19:56.639 the Chinese officials felt emboldened on our soil to bully 0:19:56.720 --> 0:20:00.359 Cheng lay Well, the Prime Minister failed to f fiercely 0:20:00.520 --> 0:20:05.199 protect his Australian citizen or our values of freedom of 0:20:05.240 --> 0:20:08.840 the press. It seems like China may have already bought 0:20:08.960 --> 0:20:15.520 Australia's silence despite its foreign interference, it's espionage, its extensive 0:20:15.560 --> 0:20:20.440 malicious cyber attacks, and its appalling human rights abuses where 0:20:20.440 --> 0:20:25.680 whistleblowers and journalists regularly disappear, and Muslim wigas are subject 0:20:25.720 --> 0:20:29.879 to terrible treatment in slave labor camps. As I said 0:20:29.960 --> 0:20:34.600 on Monday night, Albinizi condemns our democratic ally in Israel 0:20:35.119 --> 0:20:40.720 more than he does the greatest aggressor in our region, China. 0:20:40.760 --> 0:20:44.000 To discuss this in more, former Home Affair Secretary and 0:20:44.240 --> 0:20:48.399 longtime powerful diplomat Mike Buzzulo joins me now for an 0:20:48.400 --> 0:20:49.720 exclusive interview. 0:20:49.800 --> 0:20:52.919 Mike, thank you very much and welcome to the program. 0:20:53.200 --> 0:20:56.439 Look, I want to start with this incident, this treatment 0:20:56.480 --> 0:20:59.159 of Cheng Lei this week by the Chinese officials. 0:20:59.600 --> 0:21:01.760 What's reaction to what happened. 0:21:04.000 --> 0:21:07.000 Well, like most Australians, if not all Australians, I was appalled, 0:21:07.040 --> 0:21:10.840 particularly in the case of the first incident. That main 0:21:10.880 --> 0:21:13.400 Committee room, which is in the center of Parliament House, 0:21:13.400 --> 0:21:16.119 for those of your viewers who've never been there, is 0:21:16.160 --> 0:21:19.520 where parliamentary inquiries are held, estimates, hearings and the like. 0:21:19.560 --> 0:21:23.600 It's actually the citadel of our democratic scrutiny, our parliamentary 0:21:23.640 --> 0:21:26.400 scrutiny of the executive. And to have in that room 0:21:26.560 --> 0:21:29.679 that body blocking occurring, I thought it was disgraceful. It 0:21:29.720 --> 0:21:32.480 was appalling. I do want to applaud the quick witted 0:21:32.520 --> 0:21:35.159 actions by the officers. I believe that they're from the 0:21:35.160 --> 0:21:38.399 Prime Minister's Department who were trying as best as they 0:21:38.440 --> 0:21:40.920 could with grace, dignity, and I think very good judgment 0:21:41.280 --> 0:21:43.720 to try, without making a big scene, to try to 0:21:43.760 --> 0:21:47.760 move the particularly the tall blue suited gentlemen on and 0:21:47.960 --> 0:21:51.760 those officers should be I think praised for their charm, 0:21:51.880 --> 0:21:55.320 their grace, their dignity, but also their result. It shouldn't 0:21:55.320 --> 0:21:57.080 come to that in that room. I've sat in that 0:21:57.160 --> 0:22:00.399 room many many times, been quizzed by senators. Perhaps it's 0:22:00.440 --> 0:22:05.919 an alien practice for officials from communist China to comprehend 0:22:06.119 --> 0:22:09.600 the idea of officials being the subject of scrutiny, particularly 0:22:09.600 --> 0:22:10.880 in that room. I was appalled. 0:22:12.160 --> 0:22:15.560 Indeed, well, what about how the Prime Minister reacted to this? 0:22:15.680 --> 0:22:18.400 He was asked about it in a couple of media interviews. 0:22:18.560 --> 0:22:20.000 What did you make of his response? 0:22:22.320 --> 0:22:24.959 Ohl Shari, You have to excuse me these days, I'm 0:22:24.960 --> 0:22:27.480 a retired Canbra pensioner. I don't sort of follow the 0:22:27.640 --> 0:22:31.040 day the day to day media monitoring in the way 0:22:31.040 --> 0:22:33.879 that I used to. I have read some discussion and 0:22:33.920 --> 0:22:37.160 some commentary that suggests that initially there was a degree 0:22:37.160 --> 0:22:38.919 of dismissal, and then there was a hardening of the 0:22:38.960 --> 0:22:42.040 position where the government seems to have got to, which 0:22:42.080 --> 0:22:45.960 is to register a strong complaint, is where we should 0:22:45.960 --> 0:22:48.440 have started. The only thing I noticed in the commentary 0:22:48.440 --> 0:22:51.000 that I do want to make a point of and 0:22:51.080 --> 0:22:53.800 take some exception to, is any suggestion that we should 0:22:53.800 --> 0:22:59.480 be putting that this is somehow comprehensible or indeed excusable 0:22:59.480 --> 0:23:02.800 on the base of different political values or different political systems. No, 0:23:03.359 --> 0:23:07.359 our house, our rules. They need to understand, coming into 0:23:07.480 --> 0:23:10.520 our territory, our terrain, that they behave according to our 0:23:10.560 --> 0:23:14.119 principles and rules. I've got no doubt that if the 0:23:14.280 --> 0:23:17.359