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Speaker 1: Oh, good ad, you bloody champions. Welcome to another installment

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Speaker 1: of you Know What with you know Who? Tiffany and

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Speaker 1: Cook sitting over there like like she just got back

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Speaker 1: from some kind of outdoor adventure, which I think is

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Speaker 1: the case. Is that the case? That's the case? Cracking

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Speaker 1: still wearing your outdoor baseball cap? What's going on?

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Speaker 2: Well? I thought we might have like the line across

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Speaker 2: my head if I take it off. Now we're all morning.

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Speaker 1: Where'd you go?

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Speaker 2: I went to the thousand steps again, hanging out with

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Speaker 2: a bit of nature.

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Speaker 1: And who do you go there with?

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Speaker 2: By myself?

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Speaker 1: Wow? Yeah, look at you getting your bloody your nature

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Speaker 1: girl vibe going.

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Speaker 2: I should get my calf down in the mail this week,

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Speaker 2: I think, do.

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Speaker 1: You take do you take the wonder dog?

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Speaker 2: No?

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Speaker 1: You know I had to take dogs there.

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Speaker 2: Hmm.

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Speaker 1: It's been sad. Well, well that's okay, just you and

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Speaker 1: you and God and nature. That's it. Whoever got whoever

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Speaker 1: your God is? Joel Sardi, Hi, good morning. Did you

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Speaker 1: go to the thousands? You go on thousand stairs this morning? Mate?

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Speaker 3: I The last time I went to a thousand steps

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Speaker 3: was probably more than ten years ago. Tip, So yeah,

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Speaker 3: I didn't do the thousand steps this morning. I've I've

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Speaker 3: done probably a few less steps than everybody here on

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Speaker 3: the call.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. Probably not because you're lazy, just because you know,

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Speaker 1: these days, stepping is not really a forte let's be honest.

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Speaker 1: No more of a more, more of a roller than

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Speaker 1: a step of these days. Yes, and it's not like, yeah,

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Speaker 1: not like the thousand steps are particularly wheelchair friendly.

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Speaker 3: Yeah no, last I checked, they weren't accessible.

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Speaker 1: Oh yeah, how are you?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, I'm really good. A lot of changed since we

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Speaker 3: spoke last. I think I saw you last in October?

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Speaker 3: Was it no, November?

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Speaker 1: No, we saw each other earlier this year. Oh yeah, yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: yeah that was that was not that long ago. But yeah,

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Speaker 1: but we didn't really get to check much because we

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Speaker 1: were at an event and we're all talking, Yeah, have

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Speaker 1: you joined a cult? Because your hair is very short?

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Speaker 1: You look like a Buddhist or some kind of you

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Speaker 1: know what's going on? And it's if you are a Buddhist,

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Speaker 1: well done? What's going on with the hair? Beautiful?

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Speaker 3: I was told by a four or three year old

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Speaker 3: daughter that it's probably time for a change because my

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Speaker 3: hair was as long as hers. And that was all

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Speaker 3: the advice or the feedback I needed, Harps and Tip.

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Speaker 3: So that day I went to the barber and he

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Speaker 3: shaved it.

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Speaker 1: Off and look at you. I'll tell you what. You'll

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Speaker 1: never go back. I used to have long hair. But

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Speaker 1: my hair looks My hair looks fucking terrible long yours

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Speaker 1: look good. Mine looks like some kind of shrub, some

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Speaker 1: ugly shrub. Ergo the perpetual short hair. What's what's going on?

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Speaker 1: Like what you said, A lot's happened. What's happened?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, well, since I met you guys, to you guys

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Speaker 3: last I was made redundant from my last job along

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Speaker 3: with the whole team. There was no performance indicati. It

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Speaker 3: was more so a finance repercussion and it sent me

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Speaker 3: on the path of unemployment with a mortgage and a

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Speaker 3: family to support. So it was a really stressful time

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Speaker 3: and one I've never been put in before. And just

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Speaker 3: the way the world works, Harps and if it's quite interesting.

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Speaker 3: I was approached by someone at the Department of Veteran

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Speaker 3: Affairs and asked for some input and they said, would

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Speaker 3: you like to join the team, And I said absolutely,

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Speaker 3: because I've wanted to work in veteran welfare and improving

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Speaker 3: the lives of people who have experienced adversity or hardship.

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Speaker 3: It's funny, you know, at the time I needed at

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Speaker 3: most summer reached out and said come and join us.

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Speaker 3: So I'm now turning a bit months into a new

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Speaker 3: role with the Department of Veteran Affairs, working with veterans

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Speaker 3: and their families who are you could say, catastrophically injured

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Speaker 3: and affected. Yeah, and putting together there's some framework to

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Speaker 3: assist them.

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Speaker 1: Wow, congratulations mate, that's amazing, Thank you. Well, tell us

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Speaker 1: a little bit about like, because obviously that's you know,

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Speaker 1: it's in the wheelhouse, but it's a different role, and

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Speaker 1: it's a different organization and it's working with a different

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Speaker 1: group of people. How do you how do you learn

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Speaker 1: how to do that job? Like, do they go, well, mate,

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Speaker 1: we're going to train you four weeks and then cut

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Speaker 1: your loose or how does it work?

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Speaker 3: Well, that's the interesting thing, Harps. I joined a team

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Speaker 3: when there wasn't really a job description for me, So

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Speaker 3: my left and right of arc hadn't really been defined,

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Speaker 3: and my job description wasn't there, So I really didn't

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Speaker 3: completely understand what my day to day looked like until

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Speaker 3: I sort of did my for lack of a better word,

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Speaker 3: apprenticeship in your public service, understanding who does what and

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Speaker 3: what teams have responsibility for what, and then understanding there

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Speaker 3: were some gaps in capability and sort of pitching that

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Speaker 3: to some of the people at the team. And that

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Speaker 3: was where they said, Yep, let's jumped out, let's jump

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Speaker 3: into that. And again, you know, I'm starting from scratch.

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Speaker 3: I've never been a project manage lead before, but here

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Speaker 3: i am. Yeah, I'm doing a lot of Courserra, a

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Speaker 3: lot of YouTube, a lot of LinkedIn.

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Speaker 2: On the go.

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Speaker 1: Yeah.

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Speaker 3: But the benefit I have Craig and Tiff is the

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Speaker 3: fact that I've been in the position where I'm going

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Speaker 3: to be working. I've been in the position where catastrophically injured,

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Speaker 3: where my family was affected, where we didn't know where

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Speaker 3: to turn to for help. So that lived experience is

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Speaker 3: critical and that's what I'll be leaning on. But the

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Speaker 3: major difference in what my role is now, it's quite

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Speaker 3: it's strategic as opposed to the operational role I've been

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Speaker 3: in with my previous jobs, so as opposed to seeing

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Speaker 3: the outcomes, I'm not sure if I'll see that yet

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Speaker 3: because I'm building the program.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I love that what you said about lived experience,

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Speaker 1: because I was thinking when someone comes knocking on the

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Speaker 1: metaphoric door to talk to someone and you're not coming

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Speaker 1: from a theoretical or an academic place or a you know,

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Speaker 1: of course you need knowledge and skills and know awareness

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Speaker 1: around what to do and strategy and tools and resources

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Speaker 1: and all of that. But at the same time, you know,

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Speaker 1: they meet you and they go, oh wow, you understand.

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Speaker 1: You're like, you experientially understand, if not exactly what we're

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Speaker 1: going through, a version of what we're going through.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, exactly. And I'll never understand what you're going

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Speaker 3: through Craig let alone the veterans who are going through families.

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Speaker 3: But the fact that I've got my injury and my

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Speaker 3: experience gives me a little bit of credibility. And for

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Speaker 3: those out there that aren't aware, you know, people love

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Speaker 3: to throw shade at DVA and so they're not doing

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Speaker 3: a good enough job. But I think a lot of

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Speaker 3: those people haven't really said, you know what, I'll put

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Speaker 3: my hand and I'll join the team and I'll try

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Speaker 3: and improve the processes. So that's something I want to do.

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Speaker 3: I am doing. I want to improve the rhetoric or

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Speaker 3: improve the narrative around DBA and injecting people who lived experience,

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Speaker 3: who have served into the department, I think is a

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Speaker 3: really good start without lowing own trumpet.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I mean, I think that every organization needs to

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Speaker 1: be you know, it's hard because it is an organization,

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Speaker 1: not an individual. But if there's such a thing as

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Speaker 1: organizational self awareness, I think all organizations need it, you know,

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Speaker 1: where we can say yeah, we do some things well,

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Speaker 1: some things we could do better. You know, we're not perfect.

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Speaker 1: We're working stuff out and everything is you know, there

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Speaker 1: is no perfect system, there is no perfect model. Yeah

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Speaker 1: that's great, mate, that's great. So how does it work?

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Speaker 1: Do you like? Where are you right now? I can

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Speaker 1: see Dennis Rodman Jersey behind you. Are you at home

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Speaker 1: or at work? Or do you go? Do you work

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Speaker 1: or do you do it from home? What's the practical?

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Speaker 3: The beautiful part of the public service is the flexibility

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Speaker 3: and the hybrid environment that I've rolled into, not stepped into.

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Speaker 3: So it's two days in the office, which is in CBD,

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Speaker 3: and then three days from home. Yeah, and for someone

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Speaker 3: like myself with disability, who sometimes my morning routine could

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Speaker 3: take two and a half three hours. That flexually allows

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Speaker 3: me to work from home on days where I need to,

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Speaker 3: and then go into the office when I can.

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Speaker 1: What's the what are the like in a perfect world?

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Speaker 1: Is that hybrid the best fit for you? Because I

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Speaker 1: would imagine going to work five days wouldn't be ideal,

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Speaker 1: but always being at home wouldn't be ideal.

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Speaker 3: Oh, it's ideal in that I can also maintain sessions

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Speaker 3: with my EP. So start early, So I start at seven,

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Speaker 3: finish around eight thirty nine o'clock, and then do a

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Speaker 3: full day of work and then go into the office

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Speaker 3: the next day to then build the networks to then

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Speaker 3: understand a little bit more about the going is on internally.

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Speaker 3: See I'm no different to people that have no that

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Speaker 3: I don't have disability. That's crucial for a work life balance.

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Speaker 1: So when you say your EP some there's a percentage

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Speaker 1: of people right now going what's an OP. So you're

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Speaker 1: talking about your excise physiologist. I'm guessing, YEP. So how

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Speaker 1: long since your injury is it? Now?

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Speaker 3: It was ten years in August this year.

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Speaker 1: I won't say happy birthday, that feels inappropriately. How does

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Speaker 1: your rehab? And I guess your exercise programming in general,

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Speaker 1: How does that work now? Is it just now more

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Speaker 1: where you've got to a point where trying to keep

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Speaker 1: it maintain it, or is there still is the goal

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Speaker 1: still improvement increased function? Like what's the focus?

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Speaker 3: Well, the focus for me now getting to the gym

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Speaker 3: and exercising recovery isn't getting back to what it used

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Speaker 3: to be in terms of before my injuries, just maintaining

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Speaker 3: a level of health and strength. Over the past the

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Speaker 3: past ten years, I've had a lot of learning about

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Speaker 3: what my body's capability is because of my spinal cord injury.

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Speaker 3: But my EP will work holistically on nutrition, on exercise,

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Speaker 3: on wellness outside of the gym as well, and that

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Speaker 3: would be three sessions a week, two hours a day.

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Speaker 3: And over the past ten years, my weights fluctuated from

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Speaker 3: ninety five kilos down to what started at ninety five,

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Speaker 3: and then we dropped down to sixty and then went

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Speaker 3: back up to ninety five and then back down to

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Speaker 3: sixty and understanding the body's limitations. And over the last

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Speaker 3: I think ten months, I've stopped drinking alcohol and I

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Speaker 3: haven't had a trip to hospital a bladder infection, and

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Speaker 3: my strength, my AP's notice has gone through the roof,

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Speaker 3: so Graig, you'd probably understand Tiff, and for the exercise

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Speaker 3: buffs bench press is a pretty good measure of strength.

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Speaker 3: Then I started twelve kilos at the start of the year.

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Speaker 3: I'm now at thirty five kilos.

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Speaker 1: That's amazing, mate, that's fucking wow. That's I mean, that's

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Speaker 1: one kilo away from triple you know, three hundred percent increase.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and you know it's funny, there's no surprise. It's

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Speaker 3: consistency and nutrition.

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Speaker 1: And that's booze is no good for you everyone, Sorry,

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Speaker 1: you heard it here first. Hey, let's just pause this

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Speaker 1: conversation momentarily, and just for the people who are meeting

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Speaker 1: you today for the first time, can you just remind

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Speaker 1: us what your injury is. Just it doesn't need to

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Speaker 1: be well as much or as little as you want. Yeah, yep.

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Speaker 3: So I've got a spinal cord injury at the C

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Speaker 3: five level, so I'm classed as a C five quadriplegic.

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Speaker 3: So you'll you'll see I've got use of my arms,

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Speaker 3: but not my fingers, not use of my tricep or

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Speaker 3: my core or basically anything below my chest. And that

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Speaker 3: was the result of a fall down some stairs ten

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Speaker 3: years go. So when Craig was referring to happy Birthday,

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Speaker 3: the thirty first of August is my wheel aniversary in diiversary,

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Speaker 3: whatever you want to say, And yeah, that's that's where

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Speaker 3: I'm at now.

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Speaker 1: Cool, Hey, this day you had to mention on the

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Speaker 1: show tip and I did. Jim and I just did

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Speaker 1: a freestyle chat, as we do because planning is overrated

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Speaker 1: and we're both lazy. So other than that, other than that,

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Speaker 1: it's all gold. And we're talking about we're talking about gratitude,

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Speaker 1: and I was talking about my gratitude practices and you

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Speaker 1: know which, as I said yesterday, it can be it

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Speaker 1: can be a kind of a cheesy concept, I guess,

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Speaker 1: But tell us about you and gratitude, like I was.

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Speaker 1: My three things, which I'll say just quickly again, is one,

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Speaker 1: every time I talk to my mom, I have overwhelming

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Speaker 1: gratitude because one day she won't be there, right, so

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Speaker 1: right now she's still here, I can talk to her.

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Speaker 1: It's right. Every time I get up out of the

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Speaker 1: chair that I'm now in as I talk to you,

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Speaker 1: just the fact that I can stand is fucking amazing, right,

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Speaker 1: It's like, as you more than anyone knowing being able

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Speaker 1: to walk down my stairs and walk up my stairs, right,

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Speaker 1: I have this little gratitude practice, especially having spent time

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Speaker 1: with you and John, my friend who also got blown up.

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Speaker 1: You know, it's just being able to walk upstairs is

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Speaker 1: a privilege, but we don't have that sense because we've

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Speaker 1: met most of us have never lost it, right. And

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Speaker 1: then my last one is just being able to turn

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Speaker 1: on tap. You know, I turn on a tap and

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Speaker 1: cold water comes out, and more than a quarter of

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Speaker 1: a million people in the world can't. Court of the

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Speaker 1: population I should say two point two billion people, not

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Speaker 1: only do they not have taps, they don't even have

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Speaker 1: any access to fresh, cold drinking water. Right, So the

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Speaker 1: amount of people who don't have a tap could be

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Speaker 1: half the population in the world. But you know, so

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Speaker 1: we're talking about these little like what brings me back?

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Speaker 1: Like what for me? Kind of grounds me and gives

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Speaker 1: me a healthy perspective that makes me realize sometimes I'm

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Speaker 1: a privileged, entitled fuck what about I am? You know,

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Speaker 1: I don't want to be. I don't mean to be,

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Speaker 1: you know, but sometimes, you know, sometimes some of the

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Speaker 1: shit that goes on in my mind, I go I

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Speaker 1: don't even fucking like me, And I am me, why

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Speaker 1: am I thinking like this? You know? You know, Huck,

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Speaker 1: So tell me about you. Do you find it? I'm

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Speaker 1: sure the answer is no. But tell us about you

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Speaker 1: and gratitude. How does that work? Now?

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Speaker 3: Look, when you said the word perspective, Cray, you could

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Speaker 3: have just finished everything you was saying there, because perspective

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Speaker 3: is literally what I live by, Because you know, I

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Speaker 3: may not be able to move ninety percent of my

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Speaker 3: body or control it, but you know, my mind is active,

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Speaker 3: it's healthy, functional. I've got two little girls. I've got

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Speaker 3: a wife who we've been married for six years this year.

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Speaker 3: So there's so much in my life that that is good.

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Speaker 3: You know, I've got a good job, I've got a

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Speaker 3: great family around me. I may not be able to

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Speaker 3: do things like you know, peace or shit or you

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Speaker 3: know all the other things that people do without, but

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Speaker 3: you know what, I woke up this morning. I've got

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Speaker 3: in the shower, my care, I got me dressed, and

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Speaker 3: I went to had a coffee with my oldest daughter.

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Speaker 3: I drove her down. Now, all of that doesn't happen

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Speaker 3: without being grateful for what I do have. And there

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Speaker 3: was a long time when I was injured, where I

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Speaker 3: was looking at everything that I couldn't do every day.

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Speaker 3: Why couldn't I? Why me? Were the questions, And it

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Speaker 3: took a moment of realization to change the narrative of

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Speaker 3: why me too? Why the fuck not me? Why can't

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Speaker 3: I happy? Why can't I be successful just because I'm

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Speaker 3: a quadriplegic, Because I've got friends in my life that

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Speaker 3: that won't be around for much longer because they've got

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Speaker 3: brain cancer.

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Speaker 1: Right, Yes, there's the.

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Speaker 3: Word perspective for you.

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Speaker 1: Yes, O.

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Speaker 3: My daughters don't know me as any different. They just

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Speaker 3: know me as dad, and they treat me no differently.

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Speaker 3: CREATI and Tiff and your prime example is our youngest

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Speaker 3: daughter Luna, who grabs a TV, runs away from me,

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Speaker 3: and hides behind the couch. She treats me no different,

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Speaker 3: She just tells me. So that is my gratitude, those

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Speaker 3: little moments. And I think everybody not I think everybody

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Speaker 3: in your life. You could look around and they've all

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Speaker 3: got some shit going on. Yeah, it's my injury and

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Speaker 3: it's not really a problem for me. I'll just I

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Speaker 3: want to use the biggest example we've got now, Elon

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Speaker 3: Musk Maybe Lebron James, all these massive names with so

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Speaker 3: much profile, money, success. I bet you they're going to

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Speaker 3: have their problems Monday through Friday or nine five. So

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Speaker 3: just because there's someone we see on TV or picture

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Speaker 3: anywhere externally in our lives doesn't mean that they've got

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Speaker 3: their shit squared away and their lives are better than ouns.

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Speaker 3: We've all had our own problems, so understanding that we've

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Speaker 3: got good things in our lives and having gratitude for

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Speaker 3: those is really important.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I love that. As you were talking, then I

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Speaker 1: wrote down. I wrote down on my ever present pad

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Speaker 1: that I have in front of me when I talk

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Speaker 1: to people. I wrote life situation versus life experience. Right,

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Speaker 1: So there's the situation that we're in, and then there's

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Speaker 1: the experience that we are having. And for the most part,

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Speaker 1: our experience is a byproduct of our thinking and our emotions.

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Speaker 1: You know, like you are in a situation. I mean

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Speaker 1: this with respect, and I talk about not your family,

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Speaker 1: kid's job, but in terms of being in a wheelchair

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Speaker 1: and being C five quadity like you, you are in

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Speaker 1: a reality, a physiological reality that nobody wants. Nobody wants, right,

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Speaker 1: that's part of your life situation. But in the middle

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Speaker 1: of that thing that nobody wants, there's every chance that

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Speaker 1: you're happier than a lot of our listeners who don't

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Speaker 1: have that. Now, by the way, listeners, I love you.

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Speaker 1: I'm not throwing you under the bus, but I'm just thinking,

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Speaker 1: like when we when we look at somebody's just practical reality,

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Speaker 1: their life situation, circumstance, environment, and then we look at

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Speaker 1: the experience, which is an internal thing, not an external thing,

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Speaker 1: but that internal experience in the middle of that practical,

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Speaker 1: observable reality. What's the link? What's the relationship? Either of

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Speaker 1: you two feel free to jump in, but what comes

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Speaker 1: to mind with that? Like when you think about some

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Speaker 1: people in great situations are having bad experiences and some

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Speaker 1: people in terrible situations are typically having much better experiences.

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Speaker 1: You know, for me, there's a lot of that is

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Speaker 1: about our ability to consciously create our version of reality.

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Speaker 3: I think the link the link there is the perspective

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Speaker 3: perhaps over time we become numb to certain experiences or memories,

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Speaker 3: so therefore we forget what things used to be, and

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Speaker 3: we really don't compare it to what we used to have.

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Speaker 3: We just compare it to the now and I guess

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Speaker 3: that's the perspective part, you know, in terms of what

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Speaker 3: was it the internal experience versus the internal situation?

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Speaker 1: Well, I was just saying your life experience, like you

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Speaker 1: how you experience life now? You know all the internal stuff, feelings, thoughts, ideas, emotions, joy, pleasure, fun,

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Speaker 1: pain versus situation. And like you said, Lebron James and

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Speaker 1: Elon Musk, from the outside looking in, you would both say,

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Speaker 1: depending on the metrics that were used, they are wildly successful.

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Speaker 1: Therefore they're probably really fucking happy. Well, statistically they might

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Speaker 1: be less happy than the average person who knows.

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Speaker 2: I feel like like in Joel's situation, the idea of

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Speaker 2: it is what it is now. I talked about with

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Speaker 2: Captain Charlie Plumb when he was imprisoned for six years

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Speaker 2: in the Hanoi Hilton, and the fact that they didn't

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Speaker 2: come out with PTSD because it was the worst it

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Speaker 2: could possibly be and it stayed there. So this no

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Speaker 2: rise and fall of expectations, Like Joel isn't suffering from

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Speaker 2: a physical disease where he's deteriorating. In somebody who might

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Speaker 2: have a disease like that, like say maybe MS or

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Speaker 2: something where their function is declining, whereas Joel's at a baseline.

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Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, yeah. Have either of you read Man Search

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Speaker 1: for Meaning Victor Frankel.

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Speaker 2: A long time ago.

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Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, so you'd love that, mate. It's about a

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Speaker 1: psychiatrist in the Second World War who was in prisoner

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Speaker 1: of war, a prisoner of war camp in Germany, a

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Speaker 1: Jewish psychiatrist, and essentially he was like, they can take everything,

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Speaker 1: but they can't take my mind, you know, and like

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Speaker 1: they can for me. The way that I read it,

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Speaker 1: which is just my interpretation, was very much they can

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Speaker 1: control my situation and my environment and my circumstance, but

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Speaker 1: they can't control me because I'm not my situation or

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Speaker 1: environment or circumstance. I'm not that. I'm something separate. I'm

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Speaker 1: not even my body, you know. And there's that beautiful like,

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Speaker 1: oh yeah, I'm not my body, I'm not my environment,

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Speaker 1: I'm not my bank balance, I'm not my wheelchair, I'm

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Speaker 1: not my situation. I'm not what other people fucking think

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Speaker 1: me and who I am at my core. No one

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Speaker 1: can take that doesn't matter what goes on around me.

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Speaker 3: It rings a bell and I do remember that was

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Speaker 3: his coping mechanism. Yes, have you finished your PhD at Harts?

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Speaker 1: Oh no, from on the way for a while. I'm

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Speaker 1: not the fastest, but it's only I say only, but

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Speaker 1: it's five years, so I would I don't know like

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Speaker 1: I think i'll be. I'm handing, so I've done without

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Speaker 1: boring my listeners again. But so all of the work

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Speaker 1: that I have to do in terms of running studies,

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Speaker 1: collecting data, doing my own research, all that is done

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Speaker 1: passing what's called all of my academic hurdle or requirements,

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Speaker 1: which is going in front of a board. You've got

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Speaker 1: to do that four times. That's been done and passed.

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Speaker 1: So now I'm at what's called the write up stage

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Speaker 1: where i'm writing up. So I'm writing what's called a

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Speaker 1: systematic literature review, which is about a fourteen month process.

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Speaker 1: So if you do a search on how long does

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Speaker 1: it take to write a systematic literature review for a PhD,

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Speaker 1: it says fourteen months full time. That's if you're doing

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Speaker 1: nothing else, right, So that's if it's your job. So

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Speaker 1: I've been working on that for about a year. And

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Speaker 1: I'm also writing to what's empirical papers, which are papers

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Speaker 1: off the research. So the research that I did on

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Speaker 1: metaaccuracy and metaperception. You know how other people see us.

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Speaker 1: So you do your research, you get the data, you

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Speaker 1: interpret the data, and then you write papers about that.

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Speaker 1: And you've got to add, Like in a PhD, you've

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Speaker 1: got to bring something new into the world in that

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Speaker 1: area of research. You can't do what's been done, So

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Speaker 1: you've got to build on the research. You've got to

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Speaker 1: add to someone else's research, or you've got to open

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Speaker 1: a new door and go, oh, look what's in here,

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Speaker 1: and so look at this. So yeah, to answer your question,

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Speaker 1: hopefully in six months, I'm done and dusted. But even then,

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Speaker 1: when you hand everything in, it's not like they go

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Speaker 1: thumbs up, well done and pad on the back. More

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Speaker 1: than likely i'll get stuff sent back where they say

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Speaker 1: you've got to fix this, change that, or address that.

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Speaker 1: So it's a bit of a too. But I'm on

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Speaker 1: the If it was the Melbourne Cup, which I do

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Speaker 1: not like, but would be in the last fucking furlong

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Speaker 1: or so, I would think, whatever a furlong is, Yeah.

431
00:24:13,480 --> 00:24:15,680
Speaker 3: Beats me for your doc.

432
00:24:16,680 --> 00:24:19,640
Speaker 1: Oh, when you can call me doc. Hopefully in about

433
00:24:20,119 --> 00:24:24,359
Speaker 1: six months, I would hope. So what else is going on?

434
00:24:24,480 --> 00:24:26,920
Speaker 1: How's the family? How old are the kids now?

435
00:24:27,480 --> 00:24:31,080
Speaker 3: So as may turns for tomorrow, she turns for tomorrow.

436
00:24:31,720 --> 00:24:32,919
Speaker 1: How do you spell may.

437
00:24:34,440 --> 00:24:36,120
Speaker 3: Me with a little.

438
00:24:39,400 --> 00:24:43,119
Speaker 1: Yeah? All right, what a cool cute where's the little

439
00:24:43,160 --> 00:24:44,439
Speaker 1: thing go above the last e?

440
00:24:45,119 --> 00:24:49,280
Speaker 3: Yeah? Yeah? So from top right to bottom left?

441
00:24:50,280 --> 00:24:54,800
Speaker 1: What's the origin story of Esme? What? How did you?

442
00:24:55,080 --> 00:24:57,199
Speaker 1: I mean, it's a very cute name. That's enough. It

443
00:24:57,200 --> 00:25:00,000
Speaker 1: doesn't need to be a backstory. But is there a backstory?

444
00:25:00,840 --> 00:25:03,719
Speaker 3: The origin goes My wife said what do you think

445
00:25:03,760 --> 00:25:07,119
Speaker 3: of Esme? And I said, I love it? That's the origin?

446
00:25:07,760 --> 00:25:12,200
Speaker 1: Yeah, well that's good. That's all. That's all you need.

447
00:25:12,680 --> 00:25:17,960
Speaker 1: So tell me about as you as you step into

448
00:25:18,000 --> 00:25:20,680
Speaker 1: this new role in your job and you're working alongside

449
00:25:20,680 --> 00:25:24,760
Speaker 1: other people, are you being mentored and coached or is

450
00:25:24,800 --> 00:25:28,160
Speaker 1: this largely you know, here's this space over here, Joel,

451
00:25:28,240 --> 00:25:30,640
Speaker 1: go figure it out. Yeah.

452
00:25:30,640 --> 00:25:33,080
Speaker 3: I'm definitely being mentored, and I'm really grateful for that

453
00:25:33,240 --> 00:25:37,119
Speaker 3: because the public service is so different to private sector.

454
00:25:37,800 --> 00:25:40,520
Speaker 3: Coming from the tech startup where everything was go go, go,

455
00:25:40,520 --> 00:25:44,760
Speaker 3: go go, it was a lot faster. However, where I

456
00:25:44,800 --> 00:25:47,639
Speaker 3: am now it's it's understanding. You know, this morning I

457
00:25:47,640 --> 00:25:51,720
Speaker 3: had to listen to Estimate Center estimates. I've never done

458
00:25:51,760 --> 00:25:53,960
Speaker 3: that before. I had no idea what was happening, but

459
00:25:54,280 --> 00:25:58,320
Speaker 3: there I was. So it's a really different landscape in

460
00:25:58,440 --> 00:26:03,560
Speaker 3: terms of impacts my immediate job as well. But yeah,

461
00:26:03,560 --> 00:26:07,080
Speaker 3: I've been mentored and guided and the first two and

462
00:26:07,080 --> 00:26:09,960
Speaker 3: a half months, I say, it's like the apprenticeship. I've

463
00:26:10,160 --> 00:26:13,840
Speaker 3: probably got a lot more to go on my apprenticeship

464
00:26:13,920 --> 00:26:15,040
Speaker 3: in the public service.

465
00:26:18,000 --> 00:26:20,880
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's I feel like when you do the first

466
00:26:22,840 --> 00:26:25,439
Speaker 1: I don't know, month two, three ten, Like when I

467
00:26:25,480 --> 00:26:28,399
Speaker 1: opened my first business. I was twenty six, and the

468
00:26:28,480 --> 00:26:31,399
Speaker 1: idea of opening that business to the reality of what

469
00:26:31,440 --> 00:26:34,440
Speaker 1: I had to do when the business was opened, I

470
00:26:34,480 --> 00:26:39,720
Speaker 1: was completely unprepared, like I didn't have the skills because

471
00:26:39,760 --> 00:26:42,399
Speaker 1: I never had my own business. And then all of

472
00:26:42,400 --> 00:26:45,520
Speaker 1: a sudden, like I'm in meetings with lawyers, I'm in

473
00:26:45,560 --> 00:26:48,760
Speaker 1: meetings with marketing people, or with my accountant or with

474
00:26:49,520 --> 00:26:52,240
Speaker 1: and I'm having conversations that are just over my head

475
00:26:52,240 --> 00:26:55,040
Speaker 1: because I don't I don't know the answers for a start,

476
00:26:55,680 --> 00:26:58,360
Speaker 1: and then I don't have the language because I don't know,

477
00:26:59,000 --> 00:27:02,720
Speaker 1: especially when I'm talking to a lawyer. And even when

478
00:27:02,840 --> 00:27:05,520
Speaker 1: I remember when I went looking for my first premises

479
00:27:06,520 --> 00:27:10,240
Speaker 1: commercial premises to set up Astralia's first personal training studio.

480
00:27:11,320 --> 00:27:14,280
Speaker 1: And the guy said that I had no experience. I

481
00:27:14,280 --> 00:27:17,240
Speaker 1: didn't own a house or I owned I had no

482
00:27:17,400 --> 00:27:21,240
Speaker 1: real estate. I'd never done anything like that. And the

483
00:27:21,280 --> 00:27:23,240
Speaker 1: guy goes to me, what kind of lease are you

484
00:27:23,359 --> 00:27:25,239
Speaker 1: looking at? This is for the thing, and I go

485
00:27:25,320 --> 00:27:31,120
Speaker 1: what kind are there? And he goes what I go,

486
00:27:31,440 --> 00:27:35,159
Speaker 1: I don't know how to answer that question, Like I

487
00:27:35,400 --> 00:27:38,000
Speaker 1: just looked like a fucking idiot, but I thought I

488
00:27:38,040 --> 00:27:40,840
Speaker 1: can't make up an answer because I don't, you know.

489
00:27:40,920 --> 00:27:42,919
Speaker 1: And what he was saying was how long do you

490
00:27:42,960 --> 00:27:46,800
Speaker 1: want the lease to be? And do you want any options?

491
00:27:46,880 --> 00:27:49,200
Speaker 1: Like a three year lease with two three year options

492
00:27:49,240 --> 00:27:51,840
Speaker 1: do you want I didn't know that language. And he

493
00:27:51,880 --> 00:27:55,040
Speaker 1: also said to me, how many square feet are you

494
00:27:55,119 --> 00:27:57,320
Speaker 1: looking at? You know, like back then it was feet

495
00:27:57,400 --> 00:27:59,600
Speaker 1: not meters. And he goes how many square like what area?

496
00:27:59,720 --> 00:28:03,159
Speaker 1: How many square feet? And we're standing on Hampton Street

497
00:28:03,400 --> 00:28:06,119
Speaker 1: and I said, see that silver Corolla down there, and

498
00:28:06,160 --> 00:28:08,600
Speaker 1: he goes, yeah. I go from me to the silver

499
00:28:08,680 --> 00:28:12,439
Speaker 1: Corolla and across to that orange Cortina and back to

500
00:28:12,520 --> 00:28:17,840
Speaker 1: that fucking white Commodore, Like I literally just all I

501
00:28:17,960 --> 00:28:21,760
Speaker 1: knew was in my head what it looked like, but

502
00:28:21,840 --> 00:28:26,840
Speaker 1: I didn't translate that into some fucking formula or number.

503
00:28:27,720 --> 00:28:30,080
Speaker 1: Like I knew what it looked like, but I couldn't

504
00:28:30,119 --> 00:28:33,520
Speaker 1: quantify it, because I mean, now I can, But then

505
00:28:33,720 --> 00:28:36,159
Speaker 1: I didn't know what two thousand square feet looked like.

506
00:28:37,280 --> 00:28:40,400
Speaker 1: And He's like, he must have thought, this is the

507
00:28:40,520 --> 00:28:44,760
Speaker 1: dumbest motherfucker I've ever spoken, you know, But that's where

508
00:28:44,760 --> 00:28:46,240
Speaker 1: you grow, right, That's where you grow.

509
00:28:46,960 --> 00:28:50,400
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, outside the comfort zone. I'm doing a lot

510
00:28:50,400 --> 00:28:52,840
Speaker 3: of that at the moment, and imposter syndrome. I'm getting

511
00:28:52,880 --> 00:28:57,560
Speaker 3: a healthy dose of healthy dose of it. It wears

512
00:28:57,600 --> 00:29:01,960
Speaker 3: off a little bit further into the role, but you

513
00:29:02,000 --> 00:29:04,040
Speaker 3: know that those lessons you learn, like speaking to the

514
00:29:04,040 --> 00:29:08,280
Speaker 3: real estate agent, understanding what square feed are Yeah, I'm

515
00:29:08,280 --> 00:29:10,760
Speaker 3: getting little lessons like that every day, and I think

516
00:29:10,760 --> 00:29:13,320
Speaker 3: it's best for me to sit back and listen as

517
00:29:13,360 --> 00:29:15,840
Speaker 3: opposed to talking, which is what I was doing in

518
00:29:15,840 --> 00:29:18,560
Speaker 3: my last job, because I was quite confident and competent,

519
00:29:19,320 --> 00:29:21,760
Speaker 3: whereas I'm not saying I'm not competent here, but there's

520
00:29:21,760 --> 00:29:24,000
Speaker 3: not as much confidence as of yet.

521
00:29:25,520 --> 00:29:28,760
Speaker 1: But I think this is really relevant, this conversation because everybody,

522
00:29:29,200 --> 00:29:32,200
Speaker 1: Like a lot of us want to change something, Like

523
00:29:32,280 --> 00:29:34,640
Speaker 1: especially people who are listening to the show, they want

524
00:29:34,680 --> 00:29:37,680
Speaker 1: to change something in their life. They want to adapt

525
00:29:37,760 --> 00:29:40,000
Speaker 1: or do something different, or they do the same thing

526
00:29:40,040 --> 00:29:42,600
Speaker 1: a better way, or be more effective or more efficient,

527
00:29:42,840 --> 00:29:47,640
Speaker 1: or learn more or grow more. But like for you,

528
00:29:47,760 --> 00:29:50,480
Speaker 1: right now, you're probably going to go through more of

529
00:29:50,520 --> 00:29:57,560
Speaker 1: a growth spurt in inverted commas, intellectually, emotionally, sociologically, you know,

530
00:29:58,240 --> 00:30:02,120
Speaker 1: skill wise, more of a growth spurt in this six

531
00:30:02,200 --> 00:30:04,760
Speaker 1: months than the last six years. Maybe.

532
00:30:05,360 --> 00:30:08,000
Speaker 3: Yeah, I'd say so. I absolutely agree, and I'm really

533
00:30:08,000 --> 00:30:08,840
Speaker 3: looking forward to it.

534
00:30:10,080 --> 00:30:12,800
Speaker 1: Yeah. And that's I mean, that's being willing to put

535
00:30:12,840 --> 00:30:17,920
Speaker 1: ourselves in that situation. I guess do you remember TIF

536
00:30:17,960 --> 00:30:22,560
Speaker 1: when you started your podcast? Right? Like, how many episodes

537
00:30:22,560 --> 00:30:24,480
Speaker 1: are you in now to yours? Are you about eight

538
00:30:24,640 --> 00:30:25,479
Speaker 1: hundred or something?

539
00:30:25,760 --> 00:30:26,840
Speaker 2: Eight fifty something?

540
00:30:27,560 --> 00:30:32,160
Speaker 1: Yeah? Yeah, But do you remember, like I remember jumping

541
00:30:32,240 --> 00:30:35,040
Speaker 1: on and I had a running start because I've already

542
00:30:35,120 --> 00:30:37,360
Speaker 1: done a few that were no good, and I've done radio,

543
00:30:37,800 --> 00:30:41,160
Speaker 1: so at least I was used to talking. But what

544
00:30:41,640 --> 00:30:44,720
Speaker 1: like when you look back now and you've done hundreds

545
00:30:44,720 --> 00:30:48,160
Speaker 1: of episodes with me, so you've probably done I mean

546
00:30:48,200 --> 00:30:50,360
Speaker 1: you must be heading towards one and a half thousand

547
00:30:50,360 --> 00:30:54,800
Speaker 1: episodes yourself all up? What did you thinking back now?

548
00:30:54,880 --> 00:30:57,640
Speaker 1: What didn't you know and what skills didn't you have?

549
00:30:58,840 --> 00:31:01,760
Speaker 1: And it doesn't need to be about podcasting everyone. We're

550
00:31:01,800 --> 00:31:04,280
Speaker 1: just talking about taking us something that we're good at

551
00:31:04,320 --> 00:31:07,040
Speaker 1: and getting good at it and developing it into a

552
00:31:07,080 --> 00:31:09,320
Speaker 1: real thing in the world that works. Like, what was

553
00:31:09,320 --> 00:31:10,200
Speaker 1: a challenge for you?

554
00:31:10,880 --> 00:31:15,160
Speaker 2: Well, I didn't know what I didn't know, but what

555
00:31:15,320 --> 00:31:19,840
Speaker 2: was What I've always talk about is naivety was the

556
00:31:19,920 --> 00:31:22,560
Speaker 2: gift for me. So because I didn't know what I

557
00:31:22,600 --> 00:31:25,360
Speaker 2: didn't know, I just got stuck into it and I

558
00:31:25,400 --> 00:31:29,360
Speaker 2: didn't get held back by any rules that might that

559
00:31:29,440 --> 00:31:32,400
Speaker 2: I might have perceived existed that I wasn't up to

560
00:31:32,400 --> 00:31:35,880
Speaker 2: scratch with. I remember calling you maybe three months in

561
00:31:35,960 --> 00:31:38,600
Speaker 2: and going, okay, so I've been doing this a bit

562
00:31:38,680 --> 00:31:41,040
Speaker 2: now and I want to get better, but I don't

563
00:31:41,080 --> 00:31:43,080
Speaker 2: know what that means. I don't know what it looks

564
00:31:43,160 --> 00:31:45,040
Speaker 2: like or feels like, and I don't know what I'm

565
00:31:45,080 --> 00:31:48,360
Speaker 2: asking to get better at. So you're the guru? Can

566
00:31:48,400 --> 00:31:49,480
Speaker 2: you make me better?

567
00:31:50,520 --> 00:31:53,840
Speaker 1: Definitely? I've been fucking masquerading as a guru. In fact,

568
00:31:53,880 --> 00:31:56,440
Speaker 1: I never masqueraded as a guru, but it is funny

569
00:31:56,480 --> 00:32:00,640
Speaker 1: when you know, it's like sometimes I'm about four days

570
00:32:00,680 --> 00:32:04,520
Speaker 1: ahead of someone else on the progression and they I'm like, mate,

571
00:32:04,920 --> 00:32:08,680
Speaker 1: but you know last Thursday I was you, I don't know.

572
00:32:09,080 --> 00:32:12,040
Speaker 1: I'm fucking making it up as I go. So that

573
00:32:12,560 --> 00:32:15,840
Speaker 1: imposter syndrome, Joel, and the kind of the feeling like

574
00:32:15,880 --> 00:32:21,040
Speaker 1: a fraud is that is that more apparent now than

575
00:32:21,040 --> 00:32:23,800
Speaker 1: it was in the last few years because you're in

576
00:32:23,840 --> 00:32:27,000
Speaker 1: this new space, And also how do you deal with

577
00:32:27,040 --> 00:32:31,560
Speaker 1: that because that's a scourge. I mean, everybody's got a

578
00:32:31,680 --> 00:32:32,160
Speaker 1: version of that.

579
00:32:33,240 --> 00:32:36,400
Speaker 3: Oh, it's absolutely more prevalent now than it was in

580
00:32:36,440 --> 00:32:40,600
Speaker 3: the past. Somebody told me once that all strangers know

581
00:32:40,720 --> 00:32:43,120
Speaker 3: something you don't, and it's always stuck with me. So

582
00:32:43,160 --> 00:32:44,719
Speaker 3: I just sit there and I think was as much

583
00:32:44,720 --> 00:32:46,200
Speaker 3: as I don't know what they know and they don't

584
00:32:46,240 --> 00:32:49,120
Speaker 3: know what I know, goes back to what you're saying, Tiff,

585
00:32:49,120 --> 00:32:50,760
Speaker 3: you know you don't know what you don't know. And

586
00:32:51,960 --> 00:32:54,040
Speaker 3: I'll sit there in a meeting and listen to people

587
00:32:54,200 --> 00:32:57,400
Speaker 3: speak about certain topics or certain projects are running, and

588
00:32:57,400 --> 00:33:01,120
Speaker 3: there'll be a brain brain snap, something will come out

589
00:33:01,160 --> 00:33:04,720
Speaker 3: and I'll think we should consider this, we should consider that.

590
00:33:04,920 --> 00:33:07,120
Speaker 3: But the other the voice in my head saying, no,

591
00:33:07,240 --> 00:33:09,840
Speaker 3: someone's already thought of that, someone's already spoken it. But

592
00:33:10,120 --> 00:33:12,400
Speaker 3: that naivety comes in TIF I'll put my hand up

593
00:33:12,440 --> 00:33:14,760
Speaker 3: and I'll make a comment and it's received well, and

594
00:33:14,800 --> 00:33:17,760
Speaker 3: there's a little bit of imposter syndrome wear enough with

595
00:33:17,880 --> 00:33:20,080
Speaker 3: each little risk I take. And I think in a

596
00:33:20,120 --> 00:33:23,520
Speaker 3: productive environment, people should be willing to and prepared to

597
00:33:23,560 --> 00:33:26,080
Speaker 3: make mistakes and say almost the wrong thing, but not

598
00:33:26,160 --> 00:33:29,000
Speaker 3: in terms of insulting others, because that in there, that

599
00:33:29,120 --> 00:33:33,600
Speaker 3: is where the growth happens, that's where we develop. I'm

600
00:33:33,640 --> 00:33:35,840
Speaker 3: not to someone say I haven't made some silly comments

601
00:33:35,840 --> 00:33:37,880
Speaker 3: in the past, or ask some silly questions or been

602
00:33:37,920 --> 00:33:40,880
Speaker 3: asked questions when I wasn't concentrating and thrown out an

603
00:33:40,920 --> 00:33:46,360
Speaker 3: absolutely ludicrous answer. But hey, there were again learnings.

604
00:33:47,600 --> 00:33:51,280
Speaker 1: I think that's one of the good things about having

605
00:33:51,360 --> 00:33:54,560
Speaker 1: somebody who isn't part of the program, who gets brought

606
00:33:54,640 --> 00:33:57,320
Speaker 1: in who like you, don't think like them. You don't

607
00:33:57,320 --> 00:34:01,760
Speaker 1: have their background, their program, their conditioning, and they're not

608
00:34:01,840 --> 00:34:04,160
Speaker 1: bad things that just you haven't been part of that.

609
00:34:05,000 --> 00:34:07,480
Speaker 1: And then you come into a different space and environment

610
00:34:07,880 --> 00:34:11,919
Speaker 1: with a different skill set and background, and maybe you'll

611
00:34:11,960 --> 00:34:14,880
Speaker 1: have an idea, maybe you'll see something they don't see.

612
00:34:14,960 --> 00:34:21,440
Speaker 1: Maybe you'll bring a different energy. Like I I met

613
00:34:21,440 --> 00:34:23,400
Speaker 1: a lady the other day in the cafe who I

614
00:34:23,480 --> 00:34:26,799
Speaker 1: don't know, she knows me, and she's she listens to

615
00:34:26,840 --> 00:34:31,000
Speaker 1: the show, and she was a sweetheart, and she's like,

616
00:34:31,080 --> 00:34:33,239
Speaker 1: you know what i'd love you to do? And I

617
00:34:33,280 --> 00:34:36,440
Speaker 1: went what she goes, I'd love you to coach someone

618
00:34:36,520 --> 00:34:39,600
Speaker 1: in real time on the show, And I'm like, all

619
00:34:39,640 --> 00:34:41,640
Speaker 1: of a sudden, I just thought of fifty things that

620
00:34:41,640 --> 00:34:45,160
Speaker 1: could go wrong with that, right, And I was kind

621
00:34:45,160 --> 00:34:48,319
Speaker 1: of that would be a challenge, right because you've got

622
00:34:48,360 --> 00:34:51,400
Speaker 1: to find that. But then later on I thought, like

623
00:34:51,560 --> 00:34:56,359
Speaker 1: the right person, the right way that could be, you know,

624
00:34:56,880 --> 00:34:59,719
Speaker 1: And then I thought, do you know what? I thought?

625
00:34:59,719 --> 00:35:02,239
Speaker 1: This was my ego and my fear and my insecurity.

626
00:35:02,360 --> 00:35:05,879
Speaker 1: I thought, what if I do a bad job? What if?

627
00:35:06,000 --> 00:35:11,359
Speaker 1: What if proper coaches listen? What if what if real

628
00:35:11,440 --> 00:35:14,120
Speaker 1: coaches listen and they go, why the fuck is why

629
00:35:14,160 --> 00:35:16,279
Speaker 1: did he do that? Why did he say? But then

630
00:35:16,360 --> 00:35:21,200
Speaker 1: you know that was my own bullshit. But have you pardon?

631
00:35:21,560 --> 00:35:23,040
Speaker 3: Have you found anybody to coach.

632
00:35:23,920 --> 00:35:26,200
Speaker 1: No, I haven't put it out there yet, but it

633
00:35:26,320 --> 00:35:28,799
Speaker 1: would be I mean I think some people go, yeah,

634
00:35:28,840 --> 00:35:32,440
Speaker 1: pick me, pick me, but I don't think most people

635
00:35:32,480 --> 00:35:37,440
Speaker 1: would realize no, that is that is perhaps not the

636
00:35:37,480 --> 00:35:41,239
Speaker 1: prize you think it is. To be coached like that

637
00:35:41,400 --> 00:35:43,640
Speaker 1: seems like, oh, I'll get a bit of airtime, I'll

638
00:35:43,640 --> 00:35:46,880
Speaker 1: be on Craig show. No, no, that's not. It's not

639
00:35:46,960 --> 00:35:50,680
Speaker 1: a self promotion exercise. I actually genuinely want to open

640
00:35:50,719 --> 00:35:54,680
Speaker 1: the door and coach someone. And obviously it'd be pre recorded,

641
00:35:54,760 --> 00:35:56,960
Speaker 1: so if it ended up being a dog's breakfast, we'd

642
00:35:56,960 --> 00:35:59,400
Speaker 1: been it, so there's no you know. Or if the

643
00:35:59,400 --> 00:36:02,160
Speaker 1: person went fuck, I don't want that to go to air,

644
00:36:02,200 --> 00:36:04,640
Speaker 1: that would be okay. Or if I went, look, that's

645
00:36:04,680 --> 00:36:07,160
Speaker 1: probably not going to be great listening. Yeah, but just

646
00:36:07,200 --> 00:36:10,200
Speaker 1: as a concept, like as in terms of someone coming

647
00:36:10,239 --> 00:36:15,279
Speaker 1: into my space with a fresh idea, I thought, what

648
00:36:15,280 --> 00:36:18,200
Speaker 1: do you think of that idea? TIF I still don't

649
00:36:18,239 --> 00:36:19,520
Speaker 1: know if I've about.

650
00:36:19,239 --> 00:36:21,080
Speaker 2: It, and I think Joel might be raising his hand,

651
00:36:21,160 --> 00:36:23,799
Speaker 2: but I love it. I listened to shows where people

652
00:36:23,880 --> 00:36:27,320
Speaker 2: are doing either live therapy or coaching, and that the

653
00:36:28,239 --> 00:36:32,120
Speaker 2: benefit you get as a listener is astounding. Because you

654
00:36:32,160 --> 00:36:37,440
Speaker 2: have to borrow the stories of others and see similarities,

655
00:36:37,480 --> 00:36:42,000
Speaker 2: and there's something beautifully authentic about those sorts of honest, open,

656
00:36:42,680 --> 00:36:44,520
Speaker 2: real conversations.

657
00:36:45,760 --> 00:36:48,040
Speaker 1: I think one of the challenges for me I'm thinking

658
00:36:48,080 --> 00:36:52,600
Speaker 1: about it would be because whenever I like what I'm

659
00:36:52,600 --> 00:36:54,440
Speaker 1: doing right now, what we're doing right now, we're in

660
00:36:54,480 --> 00:36:59,320
Speaker 1: a conversation. But even though we're in a genuine, organic, unplanned,

661
00:36:59,400 --> 00:37:06,120
Speaker 1: unscripted conversation, I always have audience awareness, you know, so

662
00:37:06,400 --> 00:37:09,880
Speaker 1: I would want to do it where essentially I'm not

663
00:37:10,000 --> 00:37:14,240
Speaker 1: at all at all thinking about which that's a challenge

664
00:37:14,320 --> 00:37:16,759
Speaker 1: about the fact that thousands of people are going to

665
00:37:17,280 --> 00:37:19,719
Speaker 1: listen because I don't want to. I don't want how

666
00:37:19,760 --> 00:37:22,759
Speaker 1: I would normally be or coach or connect. I don't

667
00:37:22,800 --> 00:37:25,680
Speaker 1: want that to be influenced by my awareness that there's

668
00:37:25,719 --> 00:37:29,399
Speaker 1: a big audience. So that might be something I need

669
00:37:29,440 --> 00:37:31,759
Speaker 1: to figure out. But I don't know.

670
00:37:31,840 --> 00:37:34,360
Speaker 2: How does that come into play with your group coaching.

671
00:37:35,040 --> 00:37:38,560
Speaker 2: Do you have a number of people in the room witnessing.

672
00:37:38,120 --> 00:37:43,680
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, interest I mean really that's that's a small group.

673
00:37:43,760 --> 00:37:47,799
Speaker 1: So it's it's for me, it's more, you know, it's

674
00:37:47,840 --> 00:37:51,359
Speaker 1: closer to one on one coaching. Than a podcast, which

675
00:37:51,440 --> 00:37:55,959
Speaker 1: is thousands of listeners. But yeah, I'm I'm as raw

676
00:37:56,040 --> 00:38:03,160
Speaker 1: and as open and as direct and as what's the

677
00:38:03,200 --> 00:38:08,359
Speaker 1: word impactful as they will let me be. Like, there

678
00:38:08,400 --> 00:38:12,240
Speaker 1: are people who on my in my current mentoring group

679
00:38:13,280 --> 00:38:19,280
Speaker 1: a very vulnerable and very like they've opened the door

680
00:38:19,400 --> 00:38:23,839
Speaker 1: wide right. There's a few people who who the door

681
00:38:23,880 --> 00:38:27,480
Speaker 1: is still shut and they're peeking through the keyhole. And

682
00:38:27,520 --> 00:38:29,520
Speaker 1: then there's a few. Then there's a few who have

683
00:38:29,640 --> 00:38:32,440
Speaker 1: opened the door about fucking three inches but they've got

684
00:38:32,440 --> 00:38:35,400
Speaker 1: the foot against the door, right, and all of that

685
00:38:35,560 --> 00:38:39,000
Speaker 1: is okay, that's no judgment either way. That's just. And

686
00:38:39,040 --> 00:38:42,080
Speaker 1: so you get people who like I even know and

687
00:38:42,120 --> 00:38:44,120
Speaker 1: I'm you know, next week is week ten, So I've

688
00:38:44,160 --> 00:38:46,560
Speaker 1: spent nine weeks with them. I've done one on a

689
00:38:46,880 --> 00:38:50,560
Speaker 1: one on one with most of them, and I'm well

690
00:38:50,600 --> 00:38:54,799
Speaker 1: aware of who even though I haven't met any of

691
00:38:54,840 --> 00:38:58,759
Speaker 1: these people face to face. Oh actually that's not true.

692
00:38:58,800 --> 00:39:00,960
Speaker 1: I've done a couple of face to face coachings, but

693
00:39:01,000 --> 00:39:03,319
Speaker 1: most of them I don't know them other than through

694
00:39:03,320 --> 00:39:05,759
Speaker 1: the program. But I know them now well enough to

695
00:39:05,880 --> 00:39:09,640
Speaker 1: know who I could ask a particular question that I

696
00:39:09,680 --> 00:39:12,719
Speaker 1: could not ask another member of the group, you know,

697
00:39:13,280 --> 00:39:15,840
Speaker 1: so I think there's and I mean, this just comes

698
00:39:15,880 --> 00:39:20,279
Speaker 1: back to you know, even even when we're talking before

699
00:39:20,320 --> 00:39:22,959
Speaker 1: about what's happening in our external world and our internal world,

700
00:39:22,960 --> 00:39:26,239
Speaker 1: and you know, you and I opened a pretty you

701
00:39:26,280 --> 00:39:28,839
Speaker 1: and I on our chat yesterday, like I got quite

702
00:39:28,920 --> 00:39:33,439
Speaker 1: vulnerable and and I didn't. But I've cried about four

703
00:39:33,480 --> 00:39:35,960
Speaker 1: times in the history of the show, and yesterday was

704
00:39:36,239 --> 00:39:38,719
Speaker 1: fucking very close to number five. Did you get that?

705
00:39:38,800 --> 00:39:42,440
Speaker 1: Did you know? I was a bit emotional? Yes, But

706
00:39:42,520 --> 00:39:45,279
Speaker 1: it's like I don't mind that. I don't mind that.

707
00:39:45,400 --> 00:39:48,200
Speaker 1: It's like if if where I just end up is

708
00:39:48,239 --> 00:39:51,160
Speaker 1: in tears and that's just organic, then I'm cool with it.

709
00:39:51,800 --> 00:39:55,880
Speaker 1: I don't like that to me, that doesn't that's not

710
00:39:55,960 --> 00:39:58,480
Speaker 1: an indictment on me. That's not a problem for me.

711
00:39:59,200 --> 00:40:03,640
Speaker 1: I just tried be aware of being whatever the best

712
00:40:03,719 --> 00:40:09,240
Speaker 1: version of me for the listeners is. But yeah, yeah,

713
00:40:09,280 --> 00:40:11,640
Speaker 1: so well mate, it's going to be interesting to chat

714
00:40:11,680 --> 00:40:14,160
Speaker 1: to you in a year to see what the progression

715
00:40:14,200 --> 00:40:14,600
Speaker 1: has been.

716
00:40:15,280 --> 00:40:17,400
Speaker 3: Yeah. Well, look, I'll be happy to chat to you

717
00:40:17,400 --> 00:40:18,320
Speaker 3: in a year from today.

718
00:40:19,320 --> 00:40:19,560
Speaker 1: Yeah.

719
00:40:20,000 --> 00:40:22,080
Speaker 2: Can I ask, just for the benefit of me and

720
00:40:22,160 --> 00:40:25,160
Speaker 2: maybe the listeners, what were you doing Before this job, Joel,

721
00:40:25,200 --> 00:40:26,320
Speaker 2: what was your role before?

722
00:40:27,040 --> 00:40:29,719
Speaker 3: I was an account manager at a tech startup called

723
00:40:29,760 --> 00:40:33,320
Speaker 3: the Field dot Jobs, and it was helping employers directly

724
00:40:33,320 --> 00:40:35,760
Speaker 3: target people with disability to employ them into their business

725
00:40:36,040 --> 00:40:38,680
Speaker 3: and for job seekers with disability to go on there

726
00:40:38,719 --> 00:40:41,560
Speaker 3: and apply for jobs on a website that was accessible

727
00:40:41,600 --> 00:40:46,680
Speaker 3: in terms of catering to their accessibility needs. And I

728
00:40:46,719 --> 00:40:51,040
Speaker 3: absolutely loved every moment of it. It was purposeful and

729
00:40:51,080 --> 00:40:53,920
Speaker 3: we could see the impact it was having. And then

730
00:40:54,000 --> 00:40:56,279
Speaker 3: moving on from that, there was a big, big transformation

731
00:40:56,360 --> 00:41:00,000
Speaker 3: moving from there to Department of Veteran Affairs.

732
00:41:01,000 --> 00:41:03,560
Speaker 1: How many weeks were you in limbo and what was

733
00:41:03,600 --> 00:41:06,400
Speaker 1: that like? What was that like? Dealing with the unknown?

734
00:41:07,000 --> 00:41:10,239
Speaker 3: Poor Craig. It was a daily challenge of I had done?

735
00:41:11,680 --> 00:41:12,160
Speaker 3: When did I have?

736
00:41:12,200 --> 00:41:12,480
Speaker 1: Written?

737
00:41:12,480 --> 00:41:16,880
Speaker 3: On my mirror? I think it was be present, Be present.

738
00:41:16,880 --> 00:41:19,479
Speaker 3: It was on my mirror. And it was six weeks

739
00:41:19,520 --> 00:41:21,480
Speaker 3: of unemployment until I found out I had a new job.

740
00:41:21,760 --> 00:41:23,680
Speaker 3: So every morning I'd wake up. But the beauty was

741
00:41:23,719 --> 00:41:25,320
Speaker 3: every day I get to hang out with the girls

742
00:41:25,520 --> 00:41:28,640
Speaker 3: every day. So there was one one moment where I

743
00:41:28,680 --> 00:41:31,680
Speaker 3: took as May on my own for the first time

744
00:41:32,400 --> 00:41:35,319
Speaker 3: in our relationship together to the city. We had a

745
00:41:35,400 --> 00:41:38,239
Speaker 3: day together of getting on the train and she had

746
00:41:38,400 --> 00:41:41,040
Speaker 3: chocolate for breakfast, we had ice cream for lunch, and

747
00:41:41,280 --> 00:41:44,400
Speaker 3: I just did whatever the fuck I could to spoil

748
00:41:44,480 --> 00:41:47,600
Speaker 3: her because it was the first chance I got with

749
00:41:47,680 --> 00:41:51,400
Speaker 3: her because I was unemployed. So all of those experiences

750
00:41:51,440 --> 00:41:53,600
Speaker 3: that I was having were because I was unemployed. So

751
00:41:53,640 --> 00:41:57,000
Speaker 3: I was really grateful to be unemployed at that stage.

752
00:41:57,200 --> 00:41:58,719
Speaker 3: It was you know, it was tense. It was hard

753
00:41:58,719 --> 00:42:01,160
Speaker 3: to be present. At the same time, was understanding that

754
00:42:01,719 --> 00:42:04,160
Speaker 3: I had to find a job. Yeah, it was a

755
00:42:04,160 --> 00:42:07,600
Speaker 3: bit of a roller coaster each day, but there was

756
00:42:07,760 --> 00:42:11,080
Speaker 3: I think better experiences than they were worse worse.

757
00:42:12,120 --> 00:42:13,680
Speaker 1: A part of me wants to tell you you're a

758
00:42:13,680 --> 00:42:15,600
Speaker 1: ship father, and part of me wants to tell you

759
00:42:15,600 --> 00:42:18,480
Speaker 1: you're the best dad ever.

760
00:42:18,800 --> 00:42:20,719
Speaker 2: I just want to know, next time you're going out

761
00:42:20,760 --> 00:42:23,960
Speaker 2: and doing that, can I come more dream.

762
00:42:24,120 --> 00:42:28,120
Speaker 3: Yeah, my wife was with the ice cream breakfast and

763
00:42:28,440 --> 00:42:29,640
Speaker 3: the chocolate breakfast.

764
00:42:30,040 --> 00:42:32,759
Speaker 1: That's because she's an actual fucking grown up. That's well,

765
00:42:37,920 --> 00:42:42,879
Speaker 1: maybe maybe breakfast or lunch, but not both. Now, it's

766
00:42:42,920 --> 00:42:44,560
Speaker 1: a good thing you've got a job and you're out

767
00:42:44,600 --> 00:42:48,520
Speaker 1: of your wife's way because you and parenting. I'm not sure.

768
00:42:49,000 --> 00:42:50,759
Speaker 3: I got asked today, Dad, when are we going to

769
00:42:50,800 --> 00:42:52,280
Speaker 3: go back to the big city again?

770
00:42:52,880 --> 00:42:57,759
Speaker 1: No time soon. Mom won't let me. Maybe if you're twenty.

771
00:42:57,520 --> 00:43:01,360
Speaker 3: First diabetes is crept into her life suddenly.

772
00:43:02,600 --> 00:43:05,880
Speaker 1: That's hilarious. Do you know what? I think we're going

773
00:43:05,920 --> 00:43:08,680
Speaker 1: to wind up? But you know what, I and this

774
00:43:08,840 --> 00:43:12,799
Speaker 1: is completely unhelpful, unhelpful, this doesn't what about tell you

775
00:43:12,880 --> 00:43:19,200
Speaker 1: doesn't help you at all. But I reckon you should

776
00:43:19,239 --> 00:43:24,640
Speaker 1: study psychology. I reckon you'd be good at it. I

777
00:43:24,719 --> 00:43:29,120
Speaker 1: just think you have you know, I know that's completely impractical.

778
00:43:29,560 --> 00:43:32,319
Speaker 1: Maybe you could study part time. Do you ever think

779
00:43:32,360 --> 00:43:35,840
Speaker 1: about not necessarily psyched, but studying anything.

780
00:43:36,680 --> 00:43:39,400
Speaker 3: I've got a semester into psychological.

781
00:43:38,680 --> 00:43:41,040
Speaker 1: Science rest my case.

782
00:43:41,440 --> 00:43:45,040
Speaker 3: Yeah, I freaking loved it and I actually got really

783
00:43:45,080 --> 00:43:46,960
Speaker 3: good grades. And then I got offered a job to

784
00:43:47,160 --> 00:43:48,920
Speaker 3: be at the field and I put that on hold.

785
00:43:50,640 --> 00:43:53,280
Speaker 3: There you go, if I had the capacity, Craig, everyone's

786
00:43:53,280 --> 00:43:54,600
Speaker 3: got the same amount of time in the day that

787
00:43:54,680 --> 00:43:59,279
Speaker 3: I do. But if I had more capacity, I will

788
00:43:59,320 --> 00:43:59,920
Speaker 3: return to it.

789
00:44:01,200 --> 00:44:04,320
Speaker 1: You know what you need? You need a voluntary research assistant,

790
00:44:04,680 --> 00:44:06,680
Speaker 1: so we could get someone to help you with you

791
00:44:06,880 --> 00:44:10,000
Speaker 1: just the practical shit you can get those, you know,

792
00:44:10,680 --> 00:44:12,960
Speaker 1: it'd be good for you, good anyone.

793
00:44:12,719 --> 00:44:14,600
Speaker 3: Out there that would know how to support me there,

794
00:44:15,160 --> 00:44:16,080
Speaker 3: I'll start tomorrow.

795
00:44:16,840 --> 00:44:21,040
Speaker 1: Yeah, I just think that you, apart from the fact

796
00:44:21,080 --> 00:44:23,000
Speaker 1: that you know, you're smart and you have a curious

797
00:44:23,040 --> 00:44:25,959
Speaker 1: mind and you're fascinated with human behavior, I think because

798
00:44:26,000 --> 00:44:29,160
Speaker 1: of your lived experience, on top of the knowledge, on

799
00:44:29,239 --> 00:44:34,200
Speaker 1: top of the education and the training, you know, it

800
00:44:34,280 --> 00:44:37,120
Speaker 1: would be Yeah. I don't know. That's I don't know

801
00:44:37,160 --> 00:44:39,280
Speaker 1: why I think that, but that's and I probably shouldn't

802
00:44:39,280 --> 00:44:41,799
Speaker 1: have said that mid fucking podcast. I probably should have

803
00:44:41,800 --> 00:44:44,360
Speaker 1: told you that off there. It's probably totally inappropriate. But

804
00:44:44,440 --> 00:44:45,880
Speaker 1: there you go. Listeners, You're welcome.

805
00:44:46,520 --> 00:44:48,920
Speaker 3: You're on point, because you know I was half a halfway.

806
00:44:48,920 --> 00:44:50,440
Speaker 3: I was an eighth of the way there.

807
00:44:50,719 --> 00:44:55,080
Speaker 1: Greig, Well, we'll see what happens. If people want to

808
00:44:57,280 --> 00:45:02,600
Speaker 1: get you, Joel, Barry, Evan, Brian Sarti to come and

809
00:45:02,600 --> 00:45:05,560
Speaker 1: work with their organization and buy that. I mean, come

810
00:45:05,600 --> 00:45:09,319
Speaker 1: and have a chat with them, inspire them, educate, inform them.

811
00:45:09,400 --> 00:45:12,160
Speaker 1: Be at a corporate be at a sporting a club,

812
00:45:12,200 --> 00:45:15,520
Speaker 1: be at any other kind of organization. I've heard Joel

813
00:45:15,600 --> 00:45:21,040
Speaker 1: speak multiple times. He's very good and not just because

814
00:45:21,040 --> 00:45:23,120
Speaker 1: he's a bloke in a wheelchair and a bit inspiring.

815
00:45:23,920 --> 00:45:26,279
Speaker 1: He's very good. He's a very good presenter. So if

816
00:45:26,280 --> 00:45:29,319
Speaker 1: you want somebody like Joel to come and chat with

817
00:45:29,360 --> 00:45:31,560
Speaker 1: your group, hit him up and how do they do that?

818
00:45:32,320 --> 00:45:34,520
Speaker 3: Thank you so much, Craig Joelsarty dot com and the

819
00:45:34,640 --> 00:45:35,680
Speaker 3: details will be there.

820
00:45:37,920 --> 00:45:40,520
Speaker 1: Is that it. You're the worst fucking self promoter of

821
00:45:40,560 --> 00:45:44,360
Speaker 1: all time, Joel better at promoting I'm better at promoting

822
00:45:44,360 --> 00:45:47,120
Speaker 1: you than you are. Mate. We appreciate you, We love

823
00:45:47,120 --> 00:45:51,760
Speaker 1: your guards. Congrats on a new position. Onward and upward.

824
00:45:52,080 --> 00:45:54,840
Speaker 1: Have a good day mate. We'll say goodbye affair, of course,

825
00:45:54,880 --> 00:45:57,520
Speaker 1: but for now, thanks Ben on the if you've got

826
00:45:57,520 --> 00:45:58,880
Speaker 1: your pen up, do you want to say something?

827
00:45:59,120 --> 00:46:01,880
Speaker 2: Yes, if anyone wants to hear more about Joel Sadi's

828
00:46:02,200 --> 00:46:06,000
Speaker 2: story that they haven't already heard prior to today episode one

829
00:46:06,080 --> 00:46:09,840
Speaker 2: two five three titled when Life gives You a Shit Sandwich,

830
00:46:10,160 --> 00:46:13,160
Speaker 2: so you can hear more about his accident, recovery and

831
00:46:13,280 --> 00:46:13,640
Speaker 2: all of that.

832
00:46:14,320 --> 00:46:16,479
Speaker 1: Yeah, that was a good chat. That was a good chat.

833
00:46:16,600 --> 00:46:19,480
Speaker 1: Thank you, Tiff. That's why we have you see it.

834
00:46:19,560 --> 00:46:20,520
Speaker 1: Tam