WEBVTT - Sharri | 27 August 0:00:01.639 --> 0:00:05.559 Live on Sky News This is Sharry. 0:00:07.440 --> 0:00:11.639 Good Evening massive show. Tonight, former Prime Minister Scott Morrison 0:00:11.920 --> 0:00:16.759 hits back against claims Peter Dutton is divisive and racist. 0:00:17.239 --> 0:00:21.200 In his exclusive interview, Morrison also says bringing in Hermas 0:00:21.200 --> 0:00:24.960 supporters would be like giving visas to Nazis? 0:00:26.160 --> 0:00:31.800 Would we allow you know, those who'd supported the stalin 0:00:31.840 --> 0:00:39.360 As purges and had sympathies with Nazism And people go, 0:00:39.360 --> 0:00:40.080 that's outrageous. 0:00:40.120 --> 0:00:42.200 You can't draw that parallel. I can. 0:00:42.479 --> 0:00:47.800 October seven and he doesn't hold back that sensational interview 0:00:47.920 --> 0:00:50.839 in a moment. Also tonight, joining me live in the 0:00:50.880 --> 0:00:55.120 studio is Hollywood star Nate Buzz. He's been shunned by 0:00:55.160 --> 0:00:58.680 actors from his own show because of his support for Israel. 0:00:59.080 --> 0:01:03.200 Those behind the sceneans coming up, plus fashion designer Mark 0:01:03.240 --> 0:01:05.600 Freeman will be here to speak about the campaign to 0:01:05.680 --> 0:01:09.680 find a cure for ovarian cancer and our favorite of 0:01:09.720 --> 0:01:14.880 Feisty Tuesday regulars Bronwan Bishop and calebont. But first Tonight, 0:01:15.400 --> 0:01:18.839 Treasurer Jim Chalmers has joined the Labour campaign in calling 0:01:19.000 --> 0:01:23.800 Peter Dutton divisive with invective that indicates a level of 0:01:23.880 --> 0:01:28.400 personal animosity. The Treasurer said Dutton was the most divisive 0:01:28.440 --> 0:01:30.600 political leader in living memory. 0:01:31.880 --> 0:01:36.640 He is the most divisive leader of a major political 0:01:36.720 --> 0:01:39.400 party in Australia's modern. 0:01:39.360 --> 0:01:42.600 History, and not by accident, but by a choice. 0:01:42.920 --> 0:01:46.240 He divides deliberately, almost. 0:01:45.920 --> 0:01:51.120 Pathologically, particularly and this is worse than disappointing, it's dangerous. 0:01:52.440 --> 0:01:52.600 Well. 0:01:52.640 --> 0:01:56.600 His comments are part of Labour's campaign to portray Dutton 0:01:56.760 --> 0:02:01.400 as divisive for expressing serious concern about the issuing of 0:02:01.560 --> 0:02:05.960 visitor visas to a terrorist controlled war zone. The Prime 0:02:05.960 --> 0:02:10.160 Minister Anthony Alberenzi backed in Charmer's attack on Dutton today. 0:02:11.200 --> 0:02:17.040 Preda Dutton has promoted division his entire political career. He 0:02:17.080 --> 0:02:20.120 always looks for what will divide Australians rather than what 0:02:20.160 --> 0:02:22.320 will bring Australians together. 0:02:24.080 --> 0:02:28.239 The Australian's Political editor, Simon Benson says that having lost 0:02:28.280 --> 0:02:32.360 control of the political agenda, Albanesi has leant back on 0:02:32.400 --> 0:02:36.280 the sid of personality politics that arose from the activist's 0:02:36.320 --> 0:02:39.760 handbook and how to win an argument after you've already 0:02:39.800 --> 0:02:43.200 lost it. Benson writes that when the substance of a 0:02:43.240 --> 0:02:47.639 debate isn't going your way, attack the opponent rather than 0:02:47.919 --> 0:02:51.720 the issue, but This is vintage Albanesi, he writes, and 0:02:51.720 --> 0:02:55.680 he used it to devastating effect against Scott Morrison. By 0:02:55.720 --> 0:02:58.880 the time Morrison caught on and tried to counter the 0:02:59.040 --> 0:03:03.920 damage was already done. Albanezy appears to be convinced that 0:03:04.000 --> 0:03:07.960 he can rerun the last election using the same tactical 0:03:08.000 --> 0:03:13.800 weapon against Dutton. And this is the very point I 0:03:13.919 --> 0:03:18.600 discussed in my interview with Scott Morrison today. Do you 0:03:18.639 --> 0:03:20.639 think the public will see through this or do you 0:03:20.680 --> 0:03:23.680 think this is quite an effective technique to paint him 0:03:23.680 --> 0:03:24.480 as divisive? 0:03:24.680 --> 0:03:26.520 Well, it's pretty effective in the past. 0:03:26.960 --> 0:03:29.920 I can say from personal experience that is usually at 0:03:29.919 --> 0:03:32.600 a mission that you can't hold the argument on the 0:03:32.600 --> 0:03:33.480 policy issue you. 0:03:33.639 --> 0:03:35.560 This happens a lot more than it used to. 0:03:35.640 --> 0:03:38.760 I don't think it's a good thing, and I get 0:03:38.800 --> 0:03:43.040 disappointed when I see those who can't match it on 0:03:43.440 --> 0:03:44.440 the policy. 0:03:44.120 --> 0:03:49.160 Argument just go the lazy route. And that's what it is. 0:03:49.880 --> 0:03:52.680 It's intellectually lazily, it's politically lazy. 0:03:53.840 --> 0:03:57.600 And my full exclusive interview coming up shortly. But as 0:03:57.600 --> 0:04:01.840 Scott Morrison points out, the tactic of personality politics is 0:04:01.960 --> 0:04:06.680 used when they can't respond to serious policy questions, When 0:04:06.720 --> 0:04:10.800 all else fails play the man and not the ball. Well, 0:04:10.840 --> 0:04:13.640 here was the Prime Minister well when he was Opposition 0:04:13.760 --> 0:04:17.679 leader attacking Scott Morrison personally ahead of the twenty twenty 0:04:17.680 --> 0:04:18.240 two election. 0:04:19.640 --> 0:04:26.359 That is his way, that's his character. Whenever Australia needs 0:04:26.400 --> 0:04:30.440 a solution, he offers only smirk and mirrors. The Prime 0:04:30.480 --> 0:04:34.880 Minister never bothers Toliver up to his job titles. Is 0:04:34.920 --> 0:04:38.760 there any issue in which Scott Morrison doesn't blame someone else? 0:04:40.760 --> 0:04:44.120 And Morrison argues this says more about labor than it 0:04:44.160 --> 0:04:47.440 does about him or Peter Dutton. As you heard he 0:04:47.520 --> 0:04:52.080 called it intellectually and politically lazy. Now Scott Morrison is 0:04:52.080 --> 0:04:55.279 the second former Prime minister to come out today to 0:04:55.320 --> 0:04:58.719 say how ludicrous it is that Gaza visas can be 0:04:58.800 --> 0:05:03.279 issued to Hermas support former Prime Minister John Howard Todd 0:05:03.279 --> 0:05:06.560 Greg Sheridan. Where you've got a body that's a declared 0:05:06.640 --> 0:05:10.320 terrorist organization, I don't think for a moment that someone 0:05:10.360 --> 0:05:14.479 who has declared support for that organization should come to Australia. 0:05:15.120 --> 0:05:17.479 The majority of Australians would feel that a lot of 0:05:17.520 --> 0:05:20.440 people want to come and live in Australia. And why not. 0:05:21.440 --> 0:05:24.680 You've won life's lottery if you come here, So why 0:05:24.839 --> 0:05:27.960 let these people in if they're spooking for a declared 0:05:28.240 --> 0:05:33.960 terrorist organization. Now, on the substance of this particular argument 0:05:34.240 --> 0:05:38.080 that guards and visas were issued without proper security vetting 0:05:38.440 --> 0:05:43.279 or in some cases any security vetting, Dutton is right 0:05:43.839 --> 0:05:48.240 and Australians are with him. It must have painted the 0:05:48.279 --> 0:05:52.080 Guardian to publish this story today, where their own poll 0:05:52.640 --> 0:05:56.080 found that more Australians agree with Dutton's visa pause for 0:05:56.160 --> 0:06:00.920 gardens that oppose it. The Guardian Essentral shows that forty 0:06:00.960 --> 0:06:04.440 four percent agree with Dutton's call for a pause, twenty 0:06:04.480 --> 0:06:09.320 six percent are undecided, and only thirty percent oppose it. 0:06:10.279 --> 0:06:12.880 The poll was conducted to the end of two weeks 0:06:12.880 --> 0:06:16.280 in Parliament spent debating the issue. In a sign of 0:06:16.320 --> 0:06:19.400 no confidence in the Prime minister, fifty two percent of 0:06:19.480 --> 0:06:23.120 voters said Australia was heading down the wrong track, and 0:06:23.320 --> 0:06:26.719 the Prime Minister's own approval rating has hit a new 0:06:27.000 --> 0:06:31.839 low of minus ten. Now, Peter Dutton, despite the attacks 0:06:31.839 --> 0:06:35.480 from Labor, he knows he's on strong ground fighting Labor 0:06:35.600 --> 0:06:40.680 on national security and the economy. The perception is cementing 0:06:41.080 --> 0:06:46.760 that Albineazy has mishandled both issues, and while Labour paints 0:06:46.839 --> 0:06:51.839 Dutton as divisive, it's becoming very clear to voters that 0:06:51.920 --> 0:06:55.919 they were misled into electing the most radical left prime 0:06:55.960 --> 0:07:01.839 minister disguised as a centrist. It's ironic that Labor accuses 0:07:01.920 --> 0:07:06.799 Dutton of being divisive because Alban Easy is literally dividing 0:07:06.839 --> 0:07:10.960 the country by failing to stand up to hatred, aggression 0:07:11.120 --> 0:07:15.080 and lawlessness. The country has never been more socially divided, 0:07:15.800 --> 0:07:20.800 Racism has never been more prolific, and it's all under 0:07:20.840 --> 0:07:28.320 his watch. Okay, that powerful Scott Morrison interview is coming 0:07:28.400 --> 0:07:31.480 up in a moment just after our political panel, and 0:07:31.520 --> 0:07:34.360 he doesn't miss. But let's bring in now former Speaker 0:07:34.360 --> 0:07:37.360 of the House Bronwin Bishop and Sky News host Caleb Bond. 0:07:37.400 --> 0:07:39.960 Great to see you both. Look, I want to talk 0:07:40.000 --> 0:07:44.520 about this one billion dollar mine that Tanya Pliberset killed off. 0:07:44.520 --> 0:07:47.640 The Prime Minister seems to be engaging in an acrobatic 0:07:47.680 --> 0:07:51.200 twist to try spin his way out of Plebis's decision 0:07:51.520 --> 0:07:54.440 to kill off the gold mine. Here was Albin Easy today. 0:07:55.640 --> 0:07:57.680 Chris Mins would like it to go ahead. I'd like 0:07:57.720 --> 0:08:01.240 to go ahead too, to stop it. There are other 0:08:01.280 --> 0:08:04.200 options that the company put forward on the tailing step. 0:08:05.160 --> 0:08:08.320 Nothing to stop it. Only his own government and even 0:08:08.360 --> 0:08:12.120 the Chris Min's government is laying the blame squarely on 0:08:12.400 --> 0:08:17.120 Albanezi's team. New South Wales Natural Resources Minister Courtney Husos 0:08:17.160 --> 0:08:20.440 met with the mining company Regius Resources today and she 0:08:20.600 --> 0:08:24.640 confirmed that the state government had and I quote expected 0:08:24.640 --> 0:08:28.040 the project to go ahead and is disappointed at the 0:08:28.040 --> 0:08:34.120 federal government's decision to issue a Section ten declaration. Bronwin, 0:08:34.880 --> 0:08:37.000 what is it about albit easy that he tried to 0:08:37.280 --> 0:08:41.120 spin his way out of the actual fact that his 0:08:41.360 --> 0:08:45.160 own government has stopped this mind from going ahead at present? 0:08:45.400 --> 0:08:48.200 Of course he's not very bright. I mean, the bottom 0:08:48.240 --> 0:08:52.600 line is that this particular project had ticked every box 0:08:52.760 --> 0:08:55.520 that it needed to do. So it is wrong to 0:08:55.600 --> 0:08:58.760 my mind that the power lies with the single person, 0:08:58.840 --> 0:09:02.280 the Minister, to be able to deny that project going ahead. 0:09:02.920 --> 0:09:07.160 Now all that legislation, there's no head of power that 0:09:07.280 --> 0:09:10.360 allows the minister to do that in the Constitution and 0:09:10.440 --> 0:09:13.280 basically they will rely on the treaty making power and 0:09:13.360 --> 0:09:16.400 some connection to a treaty they've made somewhere along the line. 0:09:16.400 --> 0:09:18.720 It gives her the power to make a regulation to 0:09:18.760 --> 0:09:22.520 destroy it, and in my mind that should not be permitted. 0:09:22.760 --> 0:09:24.079 That is bad lawmaking. 0:09:24.760 --> 0:09:27.640 So I think there's some fundamental changes needs to be 0:09:27.720 --> 0:09:33.359 made to the principal legislation that she's overseeing for starters, 0:09:34.240 --> 0:09:36.800 and I think that she should be made to literally 0:09:36.920 --> 0:09:41.280 recant because this business of someone whispered something in my ear. 0:09:41.760 --> 0:09:44.680 And then Albani she says, oh, I'm not stopping the mind. 0:09:44.800 --> 0:09:47.480 He put the tailing down somewhere else. And she comes 0:09:47.520 --> 0:09:49.640 out and says, well, the person who whispered in my 0:09:49.720 --> 0:09:52.120 ear said that the spirits are now telling me. 0:09:52.120 --> 0:09:54.000 She's glad the mind is closing. 0:09:54.320 --> 0:09:57.000 I mean, the whole thing is an absolute nonsense and 0:09:57.080 --> 0:10:02.079 an insult to the average Australians intellect. But that law, 0:10:02.240 --> 0:10:07.040 that basic legislation needs changing and BLIBOCT has to be 0:10:07.080 --> 0:10:09.840 held up to account. She's tried to save her own 0:10:09.880 --> 0:10:12.360 seat from a incursion from the Greens. 0:10:12.679 --> 0:10:14.360 Say look at me, I stopped her mind. 0:10:14.480 --> 0:10:15.040 What do you do? 0:10:15.720 --> 0:10:18.600 Politics is behind so much of what we're seeing going on. 0:10:19.080 --> 0:10:20.920 But Caleb, I want to know, do you think there 0:10:20.960 --> 0:10:24.440 are other avenues now for Regius Resources to go ahead 0:10:24.480 --> 0:10:26.760 with this mine? And also what's your view on that 0:10:26.840 --> 0:10:29.680 level of spinnight. I just think it's breathtaking that the 0:10:29.720 --> 0:10:31.640 Prime Minister can stand up there in front of the 0:10:31.720 --> 0:10:34.800 media and give an answer that seems to indicate he 0:10:34.880 --> 0:10:37.319 had nothing to do with this, his own government had 0:10:37.320 --> 0:10:37.960 nothing to do with this. 0:10:38.160 --> 0:10:40.200 Well, the Prime Minister has now made it clear that 0:10:40.240 --> 0:10:43.120 there is an avenue for this mind to go ahead. Now, 0:10:43.120 --> 0:10:46.199 whether or not he's spoken to Tenure Blibersk before making 0:10:46.200 --> 0:10:49.360 that public announcement, I don't know. And to come out 0:10:49.400 --> 0:10:52.240 and say, look, you know I supported, I supported as 0:10:52.280 --> 0:10:55.200 though we're the decision of his government to block it. 0:10:55.240 --> 0:10:58.040 I'm surprised you didn't blame Peter Dutton. That's genuinely what 0:10:58.080 --> 0:11:00.040 they have done. We'll show you with everything else it 0:11:00.120 --> 0:11:03.040 has gone wrong within his government, particularly when it's come 0:11:03.080 --> 0:11:07.400 to borders and people being let out of immigration detention, etc. 0:11:08.120 --> 0:11:11.720 But for these decisions sorry, that was made by Tenia 0:11:11.760 --> 0:11:14.839 Plibersik at the last moment, was on the basis that 0:11:15.480 --> 0:11:18.200 there was an Aboriginal heritage problem and therefore the project 0:11:18.200 --> 0:11:20.960 could not go ahead. The Prime Minister now says, well, 0:11:21.000 --> 0:11:23.520 there are other places where that that damn can go. 0:11:24.200 --> 0:11:26.000 There is a solution to this problem. 0:11:26.280 --> 0:11:30.120 That being the case, why did Plibisek as the minister, 0:11:30.600 --> 0:11:33.320 not go to the developer and say, look, I have 0:11:33.559 --> 0:11:36.320 concerns about where you want to do this bit. Why 0:11:36.360 --> 0:11:39.000 don't we put it over here? Do you have alternatives? 0:11:39.160 --> 0:11:41.960 The Prime Minister says today that there are alternatives that 0:11:42.000 --> 0:11:45.440 Regis has put forward alternatives. Well, why was that not 0:11:45.559 --> 0:11:48.480 taken into account in the first place? He is walking 0:11:48.520 --> 0:11:51.280 backward one hundred miles an hour because he knows how 0:11:51.320 --> 0:11:54.439 bad it looks. And in the meantime Plibersek has refused 0:11:54.480 --> 0:11:57.040 to front up to the locals and explain her decision. 0:11:57.120 --> 0:11:59.439 I mean, it's a mess. You just get the very 0:11:59.480 --> 0:12:02.360 strong set that he doesn't know what each of his 0:12:02.440 --> 0:12:06.760 ministers are doing. He's not across the detail until it's 0:12:06.800 --> 0:12:09.200 too late. Suddenly there's a crisis, and then he says, oh, 0:12:09.240 --> 0:12:11.679 what's going on here, let's walk it back. But you 0:12:12.240 --> 0:12:14.840 really get the sense that, unlike other prime ministers, he's 0:12:15.040 --> 0:12:17.400 just not across the detail in each of the different 0:12:17.480 --> 0:12:21.360 ministerial portfolios. Now, I spoke last night about the right 0:12:21.440 --> 0:12:25.280 to disconnect laws that came into effect yesterday. I spoke 0:12:25.280 --> 0:12:31.120 about how they work against flexible working arrangements, particularly for parents. Now, 0:12:31.240 --> 0:12:35.240 our regular panelist Andrew Carswell has today written an article 0:12:35.280 --> 0:12:38.959 in The Nightly and he says the government says these 0:12:39.040 --> 0:12:41.679 laws are progressive, when in fact they are a throwback 0:12:41.720 --> 0:12:45.400 to the bygone era when mobile phones and email didn't exist, 0:12:45.600 --> 0:12:49.360 when we all punched our time cards into a physical machine. 0:12:49.679 --> 0:12:54.240 Mutual flexibility is progressive, not rigid rules around nine to 0:12:54.360 --> 0:12:58.559 five as wined by Dolly Parton, you know, forty four 0:12:58.720 --> 0:13:00.840 years ago, Brugnan. I'm not to ask you to sing 0:13:00.880 --> 0:13:03.719 that song. I love that song. I'm not working nine 0:13:03.760 --> 0:13:07.520 to five, but you know, surely flexible working arrangements are 0:13:07.559 --> 0:13:11.360 a two way street, and employers can't expect to have 0:13:11.480 --> 0:13:16.160 time off if they're not going to then respond later. 0:13:16.720 --> 0:13:22.080 Flexibility and agreement between employer and employee was the fundamental 0:13:22.080 --> 0:13:27.079 principle that all the reforms about industrial relations were done 0:13:27.160 --> 0:13:31.200 under the hard government that brought in flexibility, that allowed 0:13:31.520 --> 0:13:34.760 particularly women to have ours that could suit them. They 0:13:34.880 --> 0:13:37.840 come to an agreement, and this concept of nine to 0:13:37.920 --> 0:13:42.080 five is just antiquated. It belongs in the public service. 0:13:42.280 --> 0:13:45.040 Where my memory serves me, I think it was actually 0:13:45.559 --> 0:13:50.640 nine to nine minutes to five. It was very precise, 0:13:51.520 --> 0:13:55.840 so it is it's an idea that came out of 0:13:55.880 --> 0:14:00.720 the European Union. This government hasn't gotten original thoughtness. It 0:14:00.800 --> 0:14:03.480 picks it up from somebody else and it was suddenly 0:14:03.480 --> 0:14:07.160 picked up and added in to that last tranch that 0:14:07.240 --> 0:14:10.240 Burke falls through, and it came into effect on the 0:14:10.280 --> 0:14:14.240 twenty sixth of August. There are seven pages, as Andrew 0:14:14.480 --> 0:14:18.040 Carswell pointed out, about what is the definition of a 0:14:18.080 --> 0:14:22.200 reasonable or unreasonable attempt to contact. 0:14:21.840 --> 0:14:22.680 Using for bus. 0:14:22.720 --> 0:14:25.960 So we will have no idea what it means until 0:14:25.960 --> 0:14:27.120 there's a body of case law. 0:14:27.320 --> 0:14:28.880 I mean, what are you going to do? Oh, let 0:14:28.920 --> 0:14:31.440 me look read through those seven pages to find out 0:14:31.520 --> 0:14:34.400 if I can send this email with a question, because 0:14:34.400 --> 0:14:36.520 that's five minutes past six. Kale can't. 0:14:36.600 --> 0:14:38.640 But you can't. You won't get an answer by reading 0:14:38.680 --> 0:14:41.320 the seven pages. You have to have the Fair Work 0:14:41.320 --> 0:14:46.000 Commission interpret the seven pages in order to know that 0:14:46.040 --> 0:14:49.120 this is what they will decide is a reasonable thing 0:14:49.160 --> 0:14:51.360 to do. So there are going to be people who 0:14:51.360 --> 0:14:53.120 are going to be in no man's land for a 0:14:53.120 --> 0:14:53.720 long time. 0:14:54.040 --> 0:14:56.680 Now. I have a lot of friends who are similar 0:14:56.760 --> 0:14:59.080 age to me, who have children in a lot of 0:14:59.120 --> 0:15:02.640 different professions and they work, they go do school pickup, 0:15:02.680 --> 0:15:04.480 and then they log back on at night when their 0:15:04.520 --> 0:15:08.240 kids are asleep. Especially lawyers people like that, and they 0:15:08.280 --> 0:15:11.280 do a lot of work at night. This works against 0:15:11.360 --> 0:15:12.960 that these laws are aggressive. 0:15:13.320 --> 0:15:16.840 Well, it's essentially a solution in search of a problem, right. 0:15:16.920 --> 0:15:19.880 I mean this for the vast majority of people is 0:15:20.000 --> 0:15:23.240 not a problem. And if your boss is contacting you 0:15:23.360 --> 0:15:27.000 incessantly outside of work hours, we have a great job 0:15:27.080 --> 0:15:30.040 market at the moment. You can pack up and go elsewhere. 0:15:30.200 --> 0:15:33.360 Boss who operates like that will not keep staff and 0:15:33.400 --> 0:15:36.440 will not remain in business. It is as simple as that. 0:15:36.960 --> 0:15:38.600 If you want to work in a job where you're 0:15:38.640 --> 0:15:42.680 not going to be contacted outside of your normal working hours, 0:15:43.000 --> 0:15:43.520 will get. 0:15:43.400 --> 0:15:44.280 A different job. 0:15:44.360 --> 0:15:47.760 I mean, you and I have worked in journalism, our 0:15:47.880 --> 0:15:51.960 entire working lives broad when in politics, right, and their 0:15:52.080 --> 0:15:55.000 jobs where you're going to be contacted at all hours. 0:15:55.200 --> 0:15:57.880 I know that the chief of staff might call me 0:15:57.920 --> 0:16:00.800 at eight pm and ask me a question on deadline 0:16:01.160 --> 0:16:02.480 before the paper goes out. 0:16:02.520 --> 0:16:03.840 Well, that's just part of the deal. 0:16:04.000 --> 0:16:06.120 That's what was on cadet wages for him AND's sake. 0:16:06.760 --> 0:16:09.080 That's not even after hours for you now after hours, 0:16:09.680 --> 0:16:10.800 right in the morning. 0:16:10.520 --> 0:16:14.040 After you if you're a trade union leader, you can 0:16:14.040 --> 0:16:14.880 bring up any time. 0:16:16.120 --> 0:16:17.080 Is there a carvat? 0:16:17.160 --> 0:16:21.080 Oh yeah, they will be able to bring up and 0:16:21.120 --> 0:16:24.760 say you get out there and on stroke of course. 0:16:24.560 --> 0:16:27.040 All right, brom and Bishop Calebon, thank you both so 0:16:27.200 --> 0:16:32.200 much now. Anthony Alberanezi pledged a new tone in politics 0:16:32.240 --> 0:16:35.680 when he became Prime minister, yet his government has launched 0:16:35.680 --> 0:16:39.200 a series of personal attacks against Peter Dutton, with a 0:16:39.240 --> 0:16:42.440 treasurer last night accusing him of being the most divisive 0:16:42.480 --> 0:16:46.520 political leader in modern history. I sat down with former 0:16:46.560 --> 0:16:50.680 Prime Minister Scott Morrison today. He says Labour's using the 0:16:50.760 --> 0:16:54.520 same tactics against Dutton that they did against him in 0:16:54.560 --> 0:16:58.360 the lead up to the last election. Morrison wasn't keen 0:16:58.520 --> 0:17:01.760 to speak about domestic policy, but he did give very 0:17:01.800 --> 0:17:05.840 strong views on the Palestinian visa saga that's dominated Canbra. 0:17:06.240 --> 0:17:10.480 I also asked him about Donald Trump, Kamala, Harris, Orcus 0:17:10.520 --> 0:17:14.200 and Moore. Scott Morrison, great to see you again. 0:17:14.000 --> 0:17:14.520 Hi, Charry. 0:17:14.960 --> 0:17:19.000 The Teals have accused Peter Dutton of racism for saying 0:17:19.040 --> 0:17:23.000 that we should stop or at least pause the intake 0:17:23.080 --> 0:17:27.440 of Palestinians coming from a terrorist controlled region in Gaza. 0:17:28.560 --> 0:17:29.400 Is this racism? 0:17:30.000 --> 0:17:35.600 Of course not, and it's an absurd and lazy and appalling. 0:17:35.119 --> 0:17:36.919 Slur that they have made. 0:17:37.560 --> 0:17:40.040 I mean, Peter and I both dealt with this during 0:17:40.040 --> 0:17:43.120 the course of the previous government. If someone doesn't agree 0:17:43.160 --> 0:17:46.040 with your border protection and immigration policies, they just call 0:17:46.119 --> 0:17:50.119 you a racist and unable to address what are the 0:17:50.119 --> 0:17:53.240 substantive policy issues that are occurring. You know, when you're 0:17:53.240 --> 0:18:00.000 an immigration minister, you wear those security responsibilities very heavily 0:18:00.440 --> 0:18:04.439 and you consider carefully what the implications might be for 0:18:04.480 --> 0:18:07.480 the decisions that you take. You seek to balance your 0:18:08.000 --> 0:18:10.960 program in a way that can commitigate risks, and to 0:18:11.000 --> 0:18:15.000 be blind to risks, as some of Peter's critics seem 0:18:15.040 --> 0:18:18.639 happy to be, I think is foolish and dangerous. I 0:18:18.680 --> 0:18:21.919 think Peter has spoken out in the national interest, in 0:18:21.960 --> 0:18:25.600 the national security interest. It's not a one size fits 0:18:25.640 --> 0:18:31.240 all policy. You need to be cognizant of blatant risks 0:18:31.760 --> 0:18:34.960 that are there, and you need to adjust your policy, 0:18:35.960 --> 0:18:40.200 as we did when we're in government successfully. 0:18:39.920 --> 0:18:42.600 Where the need arises. It's a very dangerous world. 0:18:42.720 --> 0:18:46.040 It can't be you can't run an immigration policy on 0:18:46.080 --> 0:18:46.600 the vibe. 0:18:46.880 --> 0:18:48.880 You've got to do it on the basis. 0:18:48.440 --> 0:18:53.280 Of considered national interests and security interests considerations. 0:18:53.440 --> 0:18:55.760 I mean today it is. 0:18:55.720 --> 0:19:01.440 Three years since the evacuation of Carble. We believed we 0:19:01.440 --> 0:19:05.000 were going to have to evacuate some nine hundred people 0:19:05.000 --> 0:19:07.040 and over the course of ten days it proved to 0:19:07.040 --> 0:19:10.720 be four thousand. It was one of the biggest challenges 0:19:10.760 --> 0:19:14.000 we faced at that time. But even then we had 0:19:14.040 --> 0:19:19.720 immigration officers on the tarmac there in Carble being very 0:19:19.760 --> 0:19:24.320 mindful of who we were letting on the plane, and. 0:19:24.280 --> 0:19:27.399 We don't have that presence in Gaza. Well Tony Burker 0:19:27.440 --> 0:19:30.880 said in Parliament there are no face to face interviews occurring. 0:19:31.119 --> 0:19:33.439 It was one of the really challenging issues when it 0:19:33.480 --> 0:19:38.800 came to getting Afghan interpreters and others out of Afghanistan, because. 0:19:38.480 --> 0:19:41.600 You still had to follow the process and we. 0:19:41.480 --> 0:19:44.240 Were seeking to do that now on those last days, 0:19:44.240 --> 0:19:49.000 obviously we operated in a more accelerated environment, but I 0:19:49.000 --> 0:19:52.760 can assure you we were still seeking to apply all 0:19:52.800 --> 0:19:56.080 the checks we possibly could in such an urgent circumstance 0:19:56.119 --> 0:19:57.080 and without. 0:19:56.720 --> 0:19:59.720 That level of security. Vettic face to face interviews and 0:20:00.119 --> 0:20:03.760 the FARO background checks. Should people from a terrorist controlled 0:20:03.800 --> 0:20:08.040 warzone be coming to Australia on visas right now, you 0:20:08.160 --> 0:20:08.560 have to have. 0:20:08.520 --> 0:20:12.320 The checks and processes, of course, I mean that is 0:20:12.359 --> 0:20:15.160 a necessary step, even if someone is I mean, you'll 0:20:15.200 --> 0:20:18.240 often have the case when someone is already here for 0:20:18.400 --> 0:20:22.000 other reasons and has come under a legitimate visa and 0:20:22.760 --> 0:20:26.680 cannot return to their home country. Now they will often 0:20:26.720 --> 0:20:29.159 be put on bridging visas or things of that nature 0:20:29.640 --> 0:20:34.000 while their humanitarian visa application is considered. But that's a 0:20:34.000 --> 0:20:37.480 proper process. Now, true, that can take some time. But 0:20:37.600 --> 0:20:40.080 in terms of allowing many others to come, particularly on 0:20:40.160 --> 0:20:44.000 visitor visas in those circumstances, particularly from a country that 0:20:44.080 --> 0:20:47.080 you'd have to I should say, from a place that 0:20:47.119 --> 0:20:50.920 you'd have to consider high risk. I mean, this is 0:20:50.960 --> 0:20:54.800 a part of the world where if I'm ass were 0:20:54.840 --> 0:20:58.280 to have elections in Gaza tomorrow, they probably get ninety 0:20:58.280 --> 0:21:03.160 percent of the vote. Now, some could argue why they 0:21:03.240 --> 0:21:07.600 might get that support, but Hermas is a terrorist organization. 0:21:07.760 --> 0:21:11.280 But more than that, it is a terrorist organization committed 0:21:11.320 --> 0:21:16.399 to anti Semitism, which involves the destruction annihilation of the 0:21:16.480 --> 0:21:23.200 Jewish people. Any view or support for such an organization. 0:21:23.680 --> 0:21:27.320 I could not think of something more at odds with 0:21:28.880 --> 0:21:33.040 passing a character test to leave it an Australian in Australia. 0:21:33.800 --> 0:21:37.160 And yet the ASIER Director General, Mike Burgess has said 0:21:37.160 --> 0:21:41.440 that rhetorical support for HERMAS wouldn't preclude someone from being 0:21:41.440 --> 0:21:44.359 issued with an Australian visa, and the Prime Minister in 0:21:44.480 --> 0:21:47.439 Question Time on Thursday, in response to two questions from 0:21:47.520 --> 0:21:52.119 Julian Lisa, wouldn't say that if someone was a HERMAS supporter, 0:21:52.200 --> 0:21:55.480 they couldn't come here. This was inexplicable. 0:21:55.600 --> 0:21:56.200 I found this. 0:21:56.280 --> 0:21:58.760 I did find it inexplicable, to be honest, and Mike 0:21:58.800 --> 0:22:02.439 Burgess is an outstanding public servant. And I worked with 0:22:02.520 --> 0:22:04.960 Mike over a long period of time in many different roles. 0:22:05.000 --> 0:22:08.840 And whether he use a different form of words today 0:22:08.880 --> 0:22:12.080 as opposed to then, only he can say. And I 0:22:12.200 --> 0:22:17.280 find that completely inconsistent with what I would hear regularly 0:22:17.320 --> 0:22:18.400 from him over a long. 0:22:18.200 --> 0:22:18.840 Period of time. 0:22:18.880 --> 0:22:20.960 And I don't think at all that Mike Burgess would 0:22:20.960 --> 0:22:23.600 be an apologist for Hamas or anything alike. 0:22:23.680 --> 0:22:27.200 It, for a second, indicate it's Australian government policy that's 0:22:27.320 --> 0:22:29.280 changed and he's just following their policy. 0:22:29.400 --> 0:22:30.119 I don't think it's that. 0:22:30.320 --> 0:22:32.760 But what I think in circumstances like that is you 0:22:32.800 --> 0:22:35.880 can't leave an air gap. I mean an air gap 0:22:35.960 --> 0:22:39.040 got opened up over this, and you can't have that 0:22:39.200 --> 0:22:45.440 in place. The idea that any sympathy with hamas rhetorical 0:22:45.560 --> 0:22:50.800 or otherwise somehow could be overlooked and you could get 0:22:50.800 --> 0:22:51.720 a lead pass. 0:22:51.560 --> 0:22:55.040 To live long term in Australia. I can't imagine that. 0:22:55.800 --> 0:22:59.480 And I can't imagine anyone with the responsibility for letting 0:22:59.480 --> 0:23:05.320 people in a country as a minister rubber stamping that if. 0:23:05.160 --> 0:23:07.840 You were Prime minister, you would not be allowing into 0:23:07.920 --> 0:23:09.960 Australia anyone who's supported him US. 0:23:11.040 --> 0:23:16.160 It's like asking, would we allow, you know, those who'd 0:23:17.040 --> 0:23:24.800 supported the stalin As purges and or had sympathies with Nazism, 0:23:24.840 --> 0:23:27.640 And people go, that's outrageous. You can't draw that parallel. 0:23:28.080 --> 0:23:32.800 I can October seven. I contraw it exactly in a 0:23:32.840 --> 0:23:36.440 big thick line. And that's what we're talking about here. 0:23:36.960 --> 0:23:43.160 October seven gets just lost in this debate. The single 0:23:43.920 --> 0:23:50.280