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Speaker 1: I'm going to a team might come to another installment

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Speaker 1: to show Bobby get.

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Speaker 2: A chance, Doctor hopes.

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Speaker 1: I'm not doctor Harps. In fact, you and I had

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Speaker 1: to just who knows, who knows when or if? Well,

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Speaker 1: let's hope it's more when than if. But we're sliding

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Speaker 1: slowly towards home base. But yes, we just had to

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Speaker 1: delay the start of the show because I had my

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Speaker 1: senior supervisor, who when you're doing a PhD, your senior

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Speaker 1: supervisor is pretty much god. So when he or she

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Speaker 1: sends you a message, you reply to the message. When

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Speaker 1: he or she wrings, you answer the call. When he

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Speaker 1: or she wants a meeting. And people are probably amused

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Speaker 1: to think that I'm scared of someone, I'm fucking scared.

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Speaker 1: Going about that I'm scared. It's because they hold in

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Speaker 1: a way, they hold your academic future in their hand,

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Speaker 1: and you think you're in charge. You're not really in charge.

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Speaker 1: You're just almost a passenger in your own project. But

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Speaker 1: nonetheless it's good. So I resolved that I spoke with them,

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Speaker 1: and here I am.

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Speaker 2: Back talking to you, which I'm grateful for.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, did you ever get I mean, you are the

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Speaker 1: most educated and I don't even like the term non academic,

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Speaker 1: but technically but you've you have. And this is not

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Speaker 1: me trying to make you feel good or pump you

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Speaker 1: up in front of people, but like it. I've literally

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Speaker 1: been at UNI now combined about ten years, and you've

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Speaker 1: read vastly more quantities of papers and research than I have,

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Speaker 1: did you? And you're always reading research And even if

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Speaker 1: I mentioned something, there's a fair chance you've read the

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Speaker 1: paper or you know the authors, or you know the

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Speaker 1: studies or you know the research is there. Did you

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Speaker 1: get to a point in time where you when I

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Speaker 1: don't need to and not that you do need to,

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Speaker 1: By the way, I don't have any interest in doing

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Speaker 1: a tigree or got in university or college as you

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Speaker 1: signed the sites, because I can just read everything that's

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Speaker 1: relevant to me and it doesn't matter to me.

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Speaker 2: Well, I never I never wanted to read and study

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Speaker 2: so that I can write. It's like not in order

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Speaker 2: to It was first own sake. So where I started

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Speaker 2: diving into learning is I think the first the first

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Speaker 2: job I had that really changed the trajectory of my life.

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Speaker 2: Like when you're a kid, you do a ton of

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Speaker 2: odd jobs and you know it's not necessarily building a path.

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Speaker 2: When I was eighteen, I went to work at Gold Gym,

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Speaker 2: and you know, I've talked about you know, Mitch Pacifico

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Speaker 2: a lot of times. He's he was a majority owner

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Speaker 2: of that gym, and the relationship I formed with him

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Speaker 2: was in every way transformative. And I remember being frustrated

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Speaker 2: because I felt like I was dumber than everybody else.

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Speaker 2: I couldn't sell like the salespeople did. I didn't understand

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Speaker 2: what the trainers were talking about. And there I was,

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Speaker 2: and I was in college, right. It wasn't an uniqu

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Speaker 2: it was literally a college, smaller school, and I couldn't

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Speaker 2: find a direct application for what I was learning. And

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Speaker 2: I was living on my own at eighteen, which I

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Speaker 2: had to, and it was just a matter of if

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Speaker 2: I don't start learning how to improve, I'm not going

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Speaker 2: to have a job. And living alone at eighteen that's

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Speaker 2: kind of like expensive, and that was a little bit scary.

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Speaker 2: I can't go back home, so let me try to

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Speaker 2: read on my own. Because I noticed that people around

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Speaker 2: me were reading mostly mostly self help. That's where it started.

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Speaker 2: I was like, oh wow, I could get these ideas

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Speaker 2: and the same day I can go into work I

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Speaker 2: can listen to it in the morning, or read this

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Speaker 2: book in the morning. Let me see what works. Oh wow,

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Speaker 2: that worked or that didn't work. Most of the time,

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Speaker 2: I wonder if if it's the information that's not applicable,

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Speaker 2: it's probably the way I'm applying it. So let me

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Speaker 2: test other stuff, let me EXPERI meant, and that became

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Speaker 2: enthralling for me to test something, see what happens, change

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Speaker 2: your result, and eventually discover things that work that could

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Speaker 2: be duplicated. So I kind of learned for its own sake.

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Speaker 2: And a lot of times I'll pick up a book

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Speaker 2: simply because I'm interested in it. It's not necessarily connected

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Speaker 2: to anything I need to do at the moment, if

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Speaker 2: that makes any sense.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, definitely. I feel like, also rightly or wrongly, probably wrongly,

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Speaker 1: that academia and academic qualifications, while definitely not bad, definitely,

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Speaker 1: you know, they can be very valuable and very advantageous

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Speaker 1: and of course in fields like medicine, etc. You know, necessary,

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Speaker 1: but I think they have like a social currency that

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Speaker 1: is probably inflated in terms of practical real world use.

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Speaker 1: And then people who are just like if I think

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Speaker 1: of all the smartest people that I personally, you know,

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Speaker 1: in my judgment and the people to me that are

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Speaker 1: just in all ways, you know, or in most ways

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Speaker 1: they have a kind of a functional, practical real world

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Speaker 1: as well as sometimes scientific or whatever, but like a

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Speaker 1: kind of an intelligence that's very very user friendly and

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Speaker 1: very helpful day to day. And you know, so like

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Speaker 1: if I'm thinking about who do I want to talk

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Speaker 1: about this with, like you're always in the top few

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Speaker 1: on my list? Do you think that? Do you think, oh,

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Speaker 1: you're welcome, it's absolutely true. Do you think that in

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Speaker 1: twenty twenty five it's a disadvantage to not get a

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Speaker 1: degree or to not go to university or college. Do

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Speaker 1: you think it's because I feel like it's becoming less

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Speaker 1: and less relevant and important, especially a way that business

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Speaker 1: and career is and stiles and services and products are evolving.

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Speaker 2: You know, I think both of them have advantages. I

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Speaker 2: think it's a tough call to say, well, you know,

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Speaker 2: it's it's worthless to get a degree. I've heard that before.

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Speaker 2: It's like really, and then you know I've heard like, okay,

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Speaker 2: if you don't have a degree, it says a lot

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Speaker 2: about your lack of discipline, follow through, and you're just

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Speaker 2: not very educated, and it's like, well, I don't know.

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Speaker 2: Here in the States, you know billionaires. I made a

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Speaker 2: habit of going to and dropping out of Harvard. It

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Speaker 2: almost seems to be the path to like massive success.

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Speaker 2: So that can't be at one hundred percent true either.

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Speaker 2: I think it comes down to one what is it

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Speaker 2: that you want to do? Like, if you want to

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Speaker 2: be an entrepreneur, do you absolutely need a degree? I

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Speaker 2: mean a degree can A degree can help you. Someone's

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Speaker 2: popping into my head and he's in there quite a

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Speaker 2: bit because he's he's a fantastic storyteller. I used to

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Speaker 2: work with this guy, Frank and and he was the

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Speaker 2: president of a company that I was part of the

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Speaker 2: senior leadership team with. Actually that happened twice working with

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Speaker 2: Frank And. Frank was an attorney and has his NBA,

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Speaker 2: and he insisted that if you want to succeed as

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Speaker 2: an entrepreneur, never go out and get your NBA. He

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Speaker 2: had one, but he was like, don't go out and

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Speaker 2: do that. I think everything has something to offer you

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Speaker 2: if you're willing to pull the most out of it.

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Speaker 2: You know, why why is it you want?

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Speaker 1: This?

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Speaker 2: Is it because everybody else has this, and I think

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Speaker 2: I should have this Probably not the best reason, or

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Speaker 2: there's a deeply rooted thing I want to do. You know,

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Speaker 2: I want to be I want to be a neurosurgeon. Well,

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Speaker 2: you know, school is probably a good pathway. Trial and

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Speaker 2: error is going to land you in prison for a

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Speaker 2: very very long time, you know, if you're going to

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Speaker 2: go out and start it. Like me, I just wanted.

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Speaker 2: I had this entrepreneurial spirit for like a minute when

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Speaker 2: I was in my twenties. I just wanted to learn

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Speaker 2: as much as I could and apply as much as

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Speaker 2: I could, keep at work, throw away what didn't. I

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Speaker 2: didn't have time to follow a curriculum, and I'm someone

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Speaker 2: who enjoys having a curriculum laid out for me. So

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Speaker 2: I think it's like, what type of learner are you?

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Speaker 2: Because learning the way College of structured didn't match my

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Speaker 2: learning style at all. So that was a struggle. I thought.

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Speaker 2: I actually believed that I was incapable of learning like

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Speaker 2: everyone else until I got out and I started learning

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Speaker 2: my own. I started learning about my own learning style.

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Speaker 2: So I think it's like, how do you learn what

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Speaker 2: it is that you what do you want? And what

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Speaker 2: are you willing to implement an extract from it. I

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Speaker 2: think this is some important questions anyone should ask before

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Speaker 2: you know, pursuing anything.

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Speaker 1: Really Yeah, And I think you make a great point,

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Speaker 1: and that is I think we need to learn how

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Speaker 1: we learn optimize. When I did my when I went

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Speaker 1: to Unique for the first time, and I think first semester,

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Speaker 1: first year or maybe second semester, we were doing basically anatomy.

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Speaker 1: I mean, you know, like all the muscles of the body,

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Speaker 1: you know, but where everything originates and inserts and actions,

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Speaker 1: like really quite basic stuff. But you know, all of

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Speaker 1: a sudden, I've got to you know, know the five

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Speaker 1: adductors of the fema and where they originate and inserting

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Speaker 1: for you know, whatever muscles of the quad or barber,

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Speaker 1: all of these things that I kind of knew, but

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Speaker 1: then and then you know all of the like the

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Speaker 1: smaller muscles that oh yeah, the rotator cuff here, but

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Speaker 1: what are the two internal and external rotators? And you've

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Speaker 1: got to remember everything, right, So and I remember just

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Speaker 1: reading and reading and going and I was at this

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Speaker 1: stage thirty six and reading and reading and like it's

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Speaker 1: and I'm reading something and I'm thinking about a Hamburger

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Speaker 1: like or whatever, like it's not and I'm like, it

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Speaker 1: doesn't matter how much I read this. Within three four

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Speaker 1: five lines, I am distracted and I'm sitting in a

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Speaker 1: room with a book. And so I had to figure

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Speaker 1: out that. And I've told this once or twice before,

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Speaker 1: but what worked in that instance for me with anatomy

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Speaker 1: and then functional anatomy and then physiology and all of

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Speaker 1: the stuff that I eventually did was Okay, so get

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Speaker 1: out of the big fat book, get a highlighter, get

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Speaker 1: a pen, and then write on your book and then

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Speaker 1: write on the line the ship that you know that

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Speaker 1: you need to know. Highlight the ship that you know

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Speaker 1: you need to know. And then I had basically what

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Speaker 1: I think was a not a tape but a digital

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Speaker 1: an early incarnation of a digital recorder all the luck

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Speaker 1: and I would, you know, there's maybe twenty pages that

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Speaker 1: I had to kind of know, and then that would

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Speaker 1: be distilled into a couple of pages of must know

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Speaker 1: and then I would record all of that into audio

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Speaker 1: and I would go the four muscles of the quad

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Speaker 1: are they you know? In certain to tell a ten?

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Speaker 1: And then the tibal tuberosity and the fucking whatever, right,

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Speaker 1: and then I'd record all of that and then listen

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Speaker 1: to it repeatedly, And that was how it got into

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Speaker 1: my brain. But me trying to learn by looking at

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Speaker 1: a book, reading stuff and then remembering the stuff. Even now,

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Speaker 1: that doesn't work for me. It doesn't work for me.

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Speaker 1: It's like very very suboptimal. So I think the idea

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Speaker 1: of learning how you best learn a little bit of

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Speaker 1: trial and error is paramount for anyone who wants to

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Speaker 1: do any kind of whether it's personal or professional development

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Speaker 1: or academic endeavor. But it's figuring out how you best

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Speaker 1: work in that space.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, and leaning in towards that century modality but not

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Speaker 2: utilizing it exclusively for me would helped me. And this

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Speaker 2: was just, you know, serendipitous. It wasn't strategic on my part.

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Speaker 2: Is when I was reading something, I wanted to know,

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Speaker 2: how does this help me today? So there was a

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Speaker 2: very narrow gap between learning theory and learning and now

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Speaker 2: to me and procedural learning. So I would take a

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Speaker 2: book out onto the floor and say, Okay, I'm gonna

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Speaker 2: work out right now what am I working?

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Speaker 3: Like?

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Speaker 2: Why am I choosing one path of motion versus another?

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Speaker 2: Like okay, well, what's a bench press. Good for I

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Speaker 2: don't know who are you and what is your goal?

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Speaker 2: What are you trying to achieve? And what does the

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Speaker 2: anatomy say?

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Speaker 1: So?

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Speaker 2: Am I going to move more in the sadgittal plane?

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Speaker 2: That would be like with my elbows into my body

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Speaker 2: moving forward and back? Am I going to have my

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Speaker 2: elbows a little bit higher? So horizontal adduction? Well, how

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Speaker 2: am I making those choices? Well, the anatomy is going

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Speaker 2: to dictate things like plane of motion, and there's many,

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Speaker 2: many choices that you have. So I would go and

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Speaker 2: I would say, Okay, well, here's the origin assertion of

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Speaker 2: the pectoralyis major, here's like what it does, Here's all

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Speaker 2: the things that it can do. If I'm going to

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Speaker 2: go to incline, how many degrees of incline do I want? Optimally?

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Speaker 2: I go back to my book and it's like okay, wow,

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Speaker 2: So now I'm learning how this theory actually is applied.

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Speaker 2: So yes, and I would talk about it. I would

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Speaker 2: listen to things as well. I did the same thing.

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Speaker 2: I record myself, which was painful at first, but then

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Speaker 2: at the end of the week, you've applied the information

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Speaker 2: you've read, the information you've listened to the information you've taught,

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Speaker 2: the information you're saturating multiple learning modalities. You're gonna learn

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Speaker 2: faster if it's actually something that you're interested in, that

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Speaker 2: you deeply care about. That's a high level of engagement.

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Speaker 2: You're gonna seek out more and more information because your

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Speaker 2: self efficacy or confidence is increasing, but so is your capacity.

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Speaker 2: You're you're expanding your ability to engage with the world

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Speaker 2: relative to that information. I think that's really exciting, and

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Speaker 2: you could do that. I mean, you could do that

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Speaker 2: on your own. If you're that type of person. You

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Speaker 2: can do that in university. Let me flip Let me

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Speaker 2: flip this on you. Since you've been going for your PhD,

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Speaker 2: what has been the single most impactful aspect of that

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Speaker 2: experience on the pay.

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Speaker 1: I stay journey MS. I don't think there's been a

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Speaker 1: single thing. But as I've said many times, like I'm

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Speaker 1: not a natural academic, right, and so for me being

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Speaker 1: an environment that's not my natural habitat doing a thing

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Speaker 1: that doesn't come easily or naturally learning a new language,

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Speaker 1: it's been apart from the actual practical process of designing research,

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Speaker 1: running research, interpreting data, writing papers, learning you know how

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Speaker 1: to write academically, learning how to apply to journals and

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Speaker 1: stand in front of a board and do you performance reviews.

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Speaker 1: You know, four of those I had to do. I've

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Speaker 1: done them all. I've got through them, which is all

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Speaker 1: the practical stuff. But really for me just doing something

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Speaker 1: where I don't think I ever get ahead of myself,

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Speaker 1: because I've never thought I'm a genius. But realizing that

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Speaker 1: one there's so much that I don't know and now

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Speaker 1: I'm learning. But two, I can start a PhD at

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Speaker 1: fifty six and do it. I can finish it at

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Speaker 1: sixty one. I can become whatever, a doctor of psychology

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Speaker 1: at sixty one I can do, you know, So for

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Speaker 1: me a little bit about confidence, a little bit about

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Speaker 1: understanding myself, and you know, on a practical level, how

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Speaker 1: to do real world research, to design studies, to get

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Speaker 1: bums on seats, to get ethical approval, to advertise for participants,

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Speaker 1: to figure out, no, you can't do that cretic and

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Speaker 1: you can't talk like that, and you can't write like that,

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Speaker 1: and you can't get participants that way. And by the way,

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Speaker 1: here are thirteen design flaws in your methodology or your

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Speaker 1: intended You know all of that where you're like, oh,

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Speaker 1: this has to be perfect or as close to perfect

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Speaker 1: as you can do. Whereas as you know, I'm a

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Speaker 1: little bit you know, I'm Freddy freestyle. I'm like, well,

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Speaker 1: let's just see, Like yesterday I did a six hour

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Speaker 1: corporate and I turn up and I speak, and I

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Speaker 1: have no notes and I have no PowerPoint and I

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Speaker 1: have no and it went well. But I'm in the moment,

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Speaker 1: I'm in flow, I'm reading the room, I'm and all

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Speaker 1: of that stuff with works with that task or that role.

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Speaker 1: That doesn't work doing a PhD because there's none of that.

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Speaker 1: So for me learning by the way, you know, just

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Speaker 1: because you maybe have a little bit of a profile crag,

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Speaker 1: that doesn't mean anything just because you think you're a

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Speaker 1: bit funny. Nobody cares just because you think you're a

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Speaker 1: bit clever. In some ways, you're not hearing the dunst

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Speaker 1: in the room. And you know, I think, and I'm

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Speaker 1: in that in a self loathing way at all, just

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Speaker 1: a self a wems way. So it's been many, many

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Speaker 1: times more beneficial than I thought it would be.

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Speaker 2: So here's something that I clearly remember. I had signed

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Speaker 2: up for a public speaking a presenter's mastermind. Yeah, and

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Speaker 2: it was it was kind of cool. It wasn't you know.

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Speaker 2: It was the best experience with these things. I've had

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Speaker 2: to be fair. But you would get coached group coaching.

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Speaker 2: You would have your one on one coaching, and one

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Speaker 2: of the things in the modules that they had you

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Speaker 2: do is write out what you're gonna speak about word

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Speaker 2: for word and memorize it. So if you're going to

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Speaker 2: give a forty five minute keynote, like you know, you're

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Speaker 2: going to have like, however many pages? I know I

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Speaker 2: had like over twenty pages. I think that was a

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Speaker 2: little bit too much. You're going to scale back. But

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Speaker 2: it's like literally from Hello, introducing yourself all the way

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Speaker 2: to thank you word for word that is for me personally,

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Speaker 2: or recipe for a nightmare of a presentation. I don't

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Speaker 2: think that way. I don't function that way, although lately

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Speaker 2: I've been preparing for speeches that way. That's that's a

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Speaker 2: totally different podcast. And I remember I was telling life,

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Speaker 2: you know, I don't know if I if I'm really

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Speaker 2: in the right mastermind. I think this was a mistake.

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Speaker 2: This is so anathetical to how I think, how I learn,

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Speaker 2: how I perform. She's like, that's why you need to do.

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Speaker 2: It's like if you never take any of their advice,

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Speaker 2: just do what they tell you to do and learn

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Speaker 2: how to do something well like develop a let maybe

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Speaker 2: not mastery. You're not going to spend ten years on this,

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Speaker 2: but develop a level of proficiency with this just because

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Speaker 2: it opens up different insights and pathways. You could throw

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Speaker 2: it all away if it doesn't work for you, but

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Speaker 2: go through it. That's the exact reason. So the question

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Speaker 2: I have for you is if you were going to

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Speaker 2: let's say the day you got your PhD, like you

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Speaker 2: know what, I'm over this, I'm not going to use

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Speaker 2: this for anything, in what ways would you be more

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Speaker 2: more well equipped, more insightful. What would be the benefits

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Speaker 2: in your life and work for going through the process

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Speaker 2: even if you never use it for anything.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, great question. So on practical you know, on level,

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Speaker 1: I'm a lot more confidence to talk about you know,

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Speaker 1: research and science with people because I have a better

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Speaker 1: understanding and having been through the process. So I'm still

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Speaker 1: i still think I've got my al plates on right,

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Speaker 1: but I've got a better academic and intellectual and scientific

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Speaker 1: and methodological understanding around how things work. So there's that,

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Speaker 1: But Honestly, I feel this is going to sound like cheesy,

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Speaker 1: but I feel more humble and grounded because I realize

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Speaker 1: how smart so many people are, how much stuff there

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Speaker 1: is to know, how little I know. And I guess when,

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Speaker 1: like yesterday, I'm going to say the name, I'm going

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Speaker 1: to give a shout out to the company. I did

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Speaker 1: a gig for a company called Fireline. Shout out to them.

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Speaker 1: They were great and we were together not six hours,

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Speaker 1: five hours from eight to one ish.

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Speaker 3: And I realize that when I'm doing that, when I'm

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Speaker 3: talking to a group about you know, without giving any

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Speaker 3: secret away, but we're just talking about the idea of

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Speaker 3: high performance, high performance as a team, as a company,

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Speaker 3: as an organization, as an individual.

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Speaker 1: And we're not talking about making the Olympic team, or

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Speaker 1: curing cancer or flying to the moon. We're just talking

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Speaker 1: about how do we get the most out of us

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Speaker 1: with what we've got to work with? Right, So, what's

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Speaker 1: your psychological, emotional, practical, whatever potential? How much of that

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Speaker 1: are you using? What are we doing great? What are

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Speaker 1: we not doing great? And I think like being in

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Speaker 1: that environment now with all the experiential insight and understanding

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Speaker 1: and working with teams and athletes and all the shit

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Speaker 1: I've done for forty years and then working on the

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Speaker 1: last five and a half years of this academic process.

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Speaker 1: I guess it gives me more confidence to speak about

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Speaker 1: things that I once felt like a fraud to speak about.

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Speaker 1: And that's more about my insecurity and my self doubt

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Speaker 1: and my imposter syndrome than it is now. I'm a

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Speaker 1: genius and I can talk with confidence rot. So I

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Speaker 1: guess that the long winded answer is in pought confidence

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Speaker 1: and awareness.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, wow, confidence and awareness. I mean those two things,

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Speaker 2: like awareness, especially self awareness, key to the lock on

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Speaker 2: any type of long term behavior change. Confidence. If you're

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Speaker 2: not confident, are you really going to act on what

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Speaker 2: you're becoming increasingly aware of? Maybe not, because why would

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Speaker 2: you if you don't believe that you can bring an

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Speaker 2: outcome or an experience to fruition. So when you think

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Speaker 2: about how many people are working in industries that have

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Speaker 2: nothing to do with what they majored in, still probably

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Speaker 2: a lot of benefit that they want to university anyway.

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Speaker 2: So I guess, and that's just where I sit. Whatever

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Speaker 2: it is, whatever journey or path you're taking, yeah, road

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Speaker 2: less traveled, just just go far down that path, like,

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Speaker 2: go for it. So I think who you become at

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Speaker 2: the end of that, and what you experience and what

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Speaker 2: that opens up for you. It makes your life a

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Speaker 2: lot bigger if you allow it to.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, I one hundredsent agree. So I've got a

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Speaker 1: couple of questions for you. So people might be listening

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Speaker 1: to this thinking, yeah, I don't want to go to

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Speaker 1: you any thanks anyway, but I really want to. I

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Speaker 1: want to be more informed and more educated, and I

401
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Speaker 1: think now has never been in some ways, It's never

402
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Speaker 1: been easier to access information and research and all of that,

403
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Speaker 1: but it's never been simultaneously, it's never been easier to

404
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Speaker 1: get tripped up because there's so much bullshit. So what's

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Speaker 1: your advice for people who want to educate themselves using

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Speaker 1: the Internet and all the various websites and resources and

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Speaker 1: portals as basically you know their go to for like,

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Speaker 1: how do we how do we decipher and filter through

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Speaker 1: what is true and what is bullshit? And what is

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Speaker 1: a sales pitch? I know there's no three step answer

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Speaker 1: to this, but what's your broad advice, Because I mean you,

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Speaker 1: this is where both of us, you and I do

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Speaker 1: a huge amount of online stuff where we're researching and

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Speaker 1: we're picking through this stuff. But what's your advice?

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Speaker 2: The answer is forty two Yes, that's rightly Hitchhiker's got

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Speaker 2: to the galaxy. But I think the follow up is

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Speaker 2: the key to that, which is, but what's the question?

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Speaker 2: What are the what are the questions or the question

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Speaker 2: that you're seeking an answer to and why? I think

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Speaker 2: you know, that's a good place to start. What's the benefit?

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Speaker 2: What what exactly is the outcome you're looking for? And

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Speaker 2: this doesn't have to be well, I'm going to increase

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Speaker 2: fifty sales you know a year to hit my income

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Speaker 2: goal of you know that it can be that it

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Speaker 2: could be something intrinsic in you, a shift, but clearly

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Speaker 2: know what it is that you're after and what did

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Speaker 2: you you're trying to do. And if you start with

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Speaker 2: a question, you can go to chat GPT and say, well,

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Speaker 2: here's a question I have, you know, pretend that you

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Speaker 2: know you were my you know, professor, Yeah, where should

431
00:24:26,160 --> 00:24:28,320
Speaker 2: I go? What are all the references I should look

432
00:24:28,359 --> 00:24:31,399
Speaker 2: at out of those? You know, given the context of

433
00:24:31,560 --> 00:24:34,359
Speaker 2: I'm asking this question with the intention of what are

434
00:24:34,359 --> 00:24:38,199
Speaker 2: the top five or ten and just start there. I

435
00:24:38,200 --> 00:24:40,879
Speaker 2: mean with research. You know, we were talking about something

436
00:24:40,880 --> 00:24:43,439
Speaker 2: before you hit the record button where somebody comes out

437
00:24:43,480 --> 00:24:46,520
Speaker 2: and says, well, study show that's one of the most

438
00:24:46,560 --> 00:24:51,160
Speaker 2: irritating statements that anyone can make, because one, I think

439
00:24:51,160 --> 00:24:55,240
Speaker 2: it's I think it's a little bit manipulative. I'm not

440
00:24:55,280 --> 00:24:57,560
Speaker 2: saying it's always intentional, but it's a little bit manipultive.

441
00:24:57,640 --> 00:25:01,119
Speaker 2: Number two, what studies? What was the methodol like, what

442
00:25:01,119 --> 00:25:03,760
Speaker 2: were the end values? Was it of a duplicated But

443
00:25:03,800 --> 00:25:06,960
Speaker 2: I think that's where you have to decide your line

444
00:25:07,000 --> 00:25:10,840
Speaker 2: of evidence. What is your line of evidence, and if

445
00:25:10,880 --> 00:25:17,359
Speaker 2: it's line of evidence is just what is it that's

446
00:25:17,440 --> 00:25:24,600
Speaker 2: acceptable for you in terms of efficacy and quality information?

447
00:25:25,240 --> 00:25:28,320
Speaker 2: So you know your your line of research for some people,

448
00:25:28,359 --> 00:25:31,760
Speaker 2: your line of evidence for some people is like a randomized,

449
00:25:31,960 --> 00:25:35,320
Speaker 2: you know, double blind experiment, that kind of it. And

450
00:25:35,760 --> 00:25:38,240
Speaker 2: this has to be duplicated. You know who else has

451
00:25:38,280 --> 00:25:40,679
Speaker 2: produced the same result? Is it one study showed this

452
00:25:41,119 --> 00:25:43,000
Speaker 2: or is it well, you know what we've done a

453
00:25:43,040 --> 00:25:47,040
Speaker 2: meta analysis of twenty seven high quality studies published in

454
00:25:47,200 --> 00:25:50,159
Speaker 2: High impact factor. That's just that's just showing the quality

455
00:25:50,560 --> 00:25:53,240
Speaker 2: of the journal that's published in. Right, So low impact

456
00:25:53,280 --> 00:25:56,600
Speaker 2: factor would be like Capuccio's journal, don't read that journal

457
00:25:57,080 --> 00:25:59,760
Speaker 2: if you want to see it, or or nature would

458
00:25:59,760 --> 00:26:02,120
Speaker 2: be on the other end of that. So let's say

459
00:26:02,160 --> 00:26:05,399
Speaker 2: you know, there are twenty five quality studies published and

460
00:26:05,440 --> 00:26:08,040
Speaker 2: they all pretty much are saying the same thing. Well,

461
00:26:08,080 --> 00:26:12,480
Speaker 2: you know, that's kind of assuring that what you're reading

462
00:26:12,600 --> 00:26:16,560
Speaker 2: and the answer to that question has some validity behind it.

463
00:26:16,760 --> 00:26:20,520
Speaker 2: Or you know, let's take sales. I might not be

464
00:26:20,560 --> 00:26:23,879
Speaker 2: able to point to a study, but I might talk

465
00:26:23,960 --> 00:26:26,919
Speaker 2: to some of the top sales people in my organization

466
00:26:27,480 --> 00:26:30,520
Speaker 2: that are constantly being brought up at the national event

467
00:26:30,600 --> 00:26:32,720
Speaker 2: every year because they're at the top of the company.

468
00:26:32,960 --> 00:26:35,320
Speaker 2: I'm like, well, would you sit with me and help me?

469
00:26:35,760 --> 00:26:38,480
Speaker 2: You know, what do you think makes you as effective

470
00:26:38,480 --> 00:26:40,560
Speaker 2: as you are? You know, with all the successes you've

471
00:26:40,560 --> 00:26:44,240
Speaker 2: had over your career, what do you attribute most to that? Well,

472
00:26:44,240 --> 00:26:47,600
Speaker 2: that's not research, that's purely anecdotal. But then you talk

473
00:26:47,680 --> 00:26:50,440
Speaker 2: to another salesperson, like let's say number two in the company,

474
00:26:50,680 --> 00:26:52,320
Speaker 2: and then you talk to someone who's number one in

475
00:26:52,320 --> 00:26:55,640
Speaker 2: a different industry, and there are some correlations there as

476
00:26:55,680 --> 00:26:58,639
Speaker 2: long as it's as long as it's not unethical, What

477
00:26:58,680 --> 00:27:00,879
Speaker 2: they're doing and you trying it is not going to

478
00:27:01,000 --> 00:27:04,520
Speaker 2: hurt yourself with others, experiment with stuff and see what works.

479
00:27:04,880 --> 00:27:07,560
Speaker 2: So that's a completely different line of evidence. When you're

480
00:27:07,560 --> 00:27:10,360
Speaker 2: getting your PhD. That's not a line of evidence that's

481
00:27:10,359 --> 00:27:12,600
Speaker 2: really going to work for you. When I'm trying stuff

482
00:27:12,640 --> 00:27:15,760
Speaker 2: out in the world, my line of evidence is my decision.

483
00:27:16,240 --> 00:27:20,840
Speaker 2: So know what that is. And you know, like two emotions.

484
00:27:21,520 --> 00:27:23,080
Speaker 2: I don't know if there are emotions, they could be

485
00:27:23,160 --> 00:27:29,080
Speaker 2: mental states that you need to learn effectively, both psychologically neurobiologically.

486
00:27:29,200 --> 00:27:34,080
Speaker 2: Is curiosity and frustration? What are you curious about? And

487
00:27:34,200 --> 00:27:39,240
Speaker 2: are you challenging yourself enough to where you're frustrated to

488
00:27:39,400 --> 00:27:43,479
Speaker 2: creating the biochemical environments in your brain to optimize focus

489
00:27:43,520 --> 00:27:44,000
Speaker 2: and learning.

490
00:27:44,760 --> 00:27:49,000
Speaker 1: Wow, I love that. I've never I've never heard that

491
00:27:49,080 --> 00:27:54,639
Speaker 1: time that way. What's the is the spice between self

492
00:27:54,680 --> 00:27:59,400
Speaker 1: help and full education? Is the gap getting bigger or smaller?

493
00:28:00,080 --> 00:28:01,040
Speaker 1: Or is it unchanged?

494
00:28:02,080 --> 00:28:05,000
Speaker 2: I have no idea. I have no idea how to

495
00:28:05,080 --> 00:28:09,200
Speaker 2: answer that question. What I can say he's.

496
00:28:09,040 --> 00:28:13,160
Speaker 1: A better question. Maybe so you and I from both

497
00:28:13,200 --> 00:28:15,760
Speaker 1: of us had a similar part in our early twenties

498
00:28:16,520 --> 00:28:19,760
Speaker 1: maybe late teens. We both opened the self outdoor went

499
00:28:19,840 --> 00:28:24,679
Speaker 1: via you Know Everything from you Know which you Know,

500
00:28:25,320 --> 00:28:29,800
Speaker 1: Tony Robbins has sets to Stephen Covey to you Know.

501
00:28:29,880 --> 00:28:31,639
Speaker 1: I think we opened a lot of the same books

502
00:28:31,680 --> 00:28:35,480
Speaker 1: and listened to a lot of the same people. How

503
00:28:35,680 --> 00:28:41,120
Speaker 1: has that kind of self help or personal development evolved

504
00:28:41,320 --> 00:28:44,920
Speaker 1: or devolved in your opinion where we're at now in

505
00:28:44,960 --> 00:28:46,040
Speaker 1: twenty twenty five.

506
00:28:47,480 --> 00:28:50,200
Speaker 2: I think you can seely say it's far more ubiquitous

507
00:28:50,240 --> 00:28:54,000
Speaker 2: than it was twenty years ago. Like everybody right now

508
00:28:54,120 --> 00:28:57,920
Speaker 2: has access or plugged into self help. In the West,

509
00:28:57,960 --> 00:29:00,960
Speaker 2: it's almost a daily way of life. I mean, there

510
00:29:01,000 --> 00:29:03,880
Speaker 2: are more self help gurus than there are like seminar

511
00:29:03,960 --> 00:29:08,719
Speaker 2: participants at this stage in the game. So it's I

512
00:29:08,760 --> 00:29:12,360
Speaker 2: think it's grown and it shifted quite a bit, hasn't

513
00:29:12,360 --> 00:29:16,280
Speaker 2: it now. I think self help for me was amazing

514
00:29:16,400 --> 00:29:18,920
Speaker 2: because I think there's a lot I have a lot

515
00:29:18,920 --> 00:29:21,760
Speaker 2: of criticisms of self help, but I also think it

516
00:29:21,800 --> 00:29:24,040
Speaker 2: brings a lot of value. I think if you're constantly

517
00:29:24,080 --> 00:29:29,160
Speaker 2: engaging in ideas that expand your imagination and your scope

518
00:29:29,160 --> 00:29:32,320
Speaker 2: of possibilities and your interests, it's like, oh, I want

519
00:29:32,360 --> 00:29:34,800
Speaker 2: to try that, I want to learn more about that.

520
00:29:34,800 --> 00:29:40,760
Speaker 2: That's fascinating. I just think it requires a combination of

521
00:29:41,840 --> 00:29:44,040
Speaker 2: doing your own I don't want to say research, but

522
00:29:44,120 --> 00:29:49,240
Speaker 2: your own learning process, questioning everything you hear. You can

523
00:29:49,280 --> 00:29:55,120
Speaker 2: go to Google scholar and type in you know, triggers, cues,

524
00:29:55,560 --> 00:29:58,600
Speaker 2: and habit formation see what comes up. So if somebody's

525
00:29:58,640 --> 00:30:02,440
Speaker 2: recommending something on Instagram, it could be the greatest advice

526
00:30:02,480 --> 00:30:04,360
Speaker 2: in the world, or you know, they could be an

527
00:30:04,400 --> 00:30:06,280
Speaker 2: end value of one. It could have worked for them

528
00:30:06,520 --> 00:30:09,640
Speaker 2: nobody else. You have enough tools now where you can

529
00:30:09,680 --> 00:30:15,200
Speaker 2: go and investigate and let your curiosity drive you. Here's

530
00:30:15,240 --> 00:30:18,240
Speaker 2: an example, right. I think I've talked about this on

531
00:30:18,360 --> 00:30:21,479
Speaker 2: the show because it was a hilarious point in my life.

532
00:30:21,800 --> 00:30:24,239
Speaker 2: But I was listening to a self help speaker. I'm

533
00:30:24,280 --> 00:30:26,160
Speaker 2: not going to mention any names, and what they were

534
00:30:26,200 --> 00:30:29,640
Speaker 2: talking about was the Yale Study of nineteen fifty three. Now,

535
00:30:29,680 --> 00:30:32,400
Speaker 2: as I'm saying this, you probably know what I'm talking

536
00:30:32,440 --> 00:30:35,360
Speaker 2: about already. You've come across this for those of you

537
00:30:35,400 --> 00:30:39,000
Speaker 2: who haven't. Back in nineteen fifty three, Yale University and

538
00:30:39,040 --> 00:30:43,120
Speaker 2: Ivy League School in the United States surveyed the entire

539
00:30:43,320 --> 00:30:47,160
Speaker 2: graduating class and they asked them a specific question, how

540
00:30:47,160 --> 00:30:51,800
Speaker 2: many of you have clearly defined written goals and plans

541
00:30:51,840 --> 00:30:54,960
Speaker 2: for their achievement. And what was interesting is either the

542
00:30:55,120 --> 00:30:58,560
Speaker 2: entire graduating class of nineteen fifty three at Yale, only

543
00:30:58,680 --> 00:31:02,800
Speaker 2: three percent had clearly defined written goals and plans for

544
00:31:02,840 --> 00:31:06,040
Speaker 2: their achievement. And they followed these people for twenty years,

545
00:31:06,280 --> 00:31:09,720
Speaker 2: all the way up to nineteen seventy three. And then

546
00:31:09,920 --> 00:31:13,040
Speaker 2: when they went back and they interviewed these people again,

547
00:31:13,360 --> 00:31:17,440
Speaker 2: what they found was astonishing. The surviving members of the

548
00:31:17,720 --> 00:31:21,440
Speaker 2: nineteen fifty three class that had clearly defined written goals

549
00:31:21,480 --> 00:31:24,360
Speaker 2: and plans for their achievement were earning more than the

550
00:31:24,400 --> 00:31:28,600
Speaker 2: other ninety seven percent. But what is really powerful about

551
00:31:28,600 --> 00:31:31,640
Speaker 2: that is they were earning more than the other ninety

552
00:31:31,720 --> 00:31:36,640
Speaker 2: seven percent combined. Now, Harvard did a very similar study

553
00:31:36,880 --> 00:31:39,920
Speaker 2: years later, and they found the same exact results and

554
00:31:39,960 --> 00:31:42,920
Speaker 2: the same exact ratios. And I went ahead when I

555
00:31:42,960 --> 00:31:46,280
Speaker 2: heard that, and I started clearly writing out my goals

556
00:31:46,560 --> 00:31:50,920
Speaker 2: and plans for their achievement. And one year from when

557
00:31:50,960 --> 00:31:53,120
Speaker 2: I had done that, half of the goals that I

558
00:31:53,160 --> 00:31:56,800
Speaker 2: had written down for myself, whether you know, whatever level

559
00:31:56,800 --> 00:32:00,000
Speaker 2: of ambition as a person who's just you know, turned

560
00:32:00,080 --> 00:32:05,080
Speaker 2: twenty would have I achieved them now, neither the Yale

561
00:32:05,120 --> 00:32:08,680
Speaker 2: study nor the Harvard study ever took place. It's an

562
00:32:08,760 --> 00:32:14,360
Speaker 2: urban myth because Fast Company magazine credible publication. Lawrence Tayback

563
00:32:14,680 --> 00:32:18,360
Speaker 2: was a researcher and he was interested in this, and

564
00:32:18,600 --> 00:32:21,000
Speaker 2: he researched the Yale and Harvard study, and no one

565
00:32:21,040 --> 00:32:24,560
Speaker 2: at Yale nor Harvard had any information on a study

566
00:32:24,640 --> 00:32:28,160
Speaker 2: like that ever having taken place. So you'll hear something

567
00:32:28,200 --> 00:32:30,920
Speaker 2: from self help and you'll run with it like, wow,

568
00:32:30,960 --> 00:32:35,760
Speaker 2: this is amazing. And they even contacted Fast Companies team

569
00:32:35,960 --> 00:32:41,840
Speaker 2: contacted a couple of speakers that had actually said this

570
00:32:41,960 --> 00:32:46,600
Speaker 2: quite often, and the response was, well, if it's not true,

571
00:32:46,680 --> 00:32:51,680
Speaker 2: it ought to be. Yes, that's kind of interesting. But

572
00:32:52,040 --> 00:32:54,840
Speaker 2: there's two ways you can take it. One, you had

573
00:32:54,840 --> 00:33:01,640
Speaker 2: people that sold tons of books, seminars, tapes deceiving their audience.

574
00:33:02,200 --> 00:33:04,640
Speaker 2: It's an outright lie. Whether you know it's a lie.

575
00:33:04,720 --> 00:33:07,760
Speaker 2: Maybe you read a book from someone who read a

576
00:33:07,760 --> 00:33:10,560
Speaker 2: book that was written by somebody who made this stuff up,

577
00:33:11,240 --> 00:33:14,280
Speaker 2: but you are deceiving people. On the other hand, half

578
00:33:14,280 --> 00:33:17,360
Speaker 2: of my goals were achieved because there's a lot of

579
00:33:17,400 --> 00:33:20,920
Speaker 2: science behind goal setting and what goal setting does and

580
00:33:21,560 --> 00:33:24,240
Speaker 2: how it changes the biochemistry in your brain, how it

581
00:33:24,280 --> 00:33:28,640
Speaker 2: supports mental health, how it supports resilience. So and you know,

582
00:33:28,680 --> 00:33:31,800
Speaker 2: if your goals are aligned to your values, there's engagement

583
00:33:31,840 --> 00:33:35,400
Speaker 2: and there's a sense of well being there. So you're

584
00:33:35,560 --> 00:33:38,280
Speaker 2: probably going to work longer, You're going to try more stuff.

585
00:33:38,520 --> 00:33:43,520
Speaker 2: There's a lot of validity, even though the actual story

586
00:33:44,000 --> 00:33:46,800
Speaker 2: was fictitious. So there's two ways you could frame that.

587
00:33:47,080 --> 00:33:49,040
Speaker 2: And if you're listening to this, I'll let you decide

588
00:33:49,040 --> 00:33:50,640
Speaker 2: which one is more powerful for you.

589
00:33:52,360 --> 00:33:55,560
Speaker 1: That's super interesting and it's I guess one of the

590
00:33:55,680 --> 00:33:59,680
Speaker 1: ongoing practical realities for people is there's the idea that

591
00:34:00,960 --> 00:34:03,720
Speaker 1: you know, I want to do be, create, change x

592
00:34:03,920 --> 00:34:06,680
Speaker 1: y Z. So there's the thing that I want to

593
00:34:06,720 --> 00:34:09,560
Speaker 1: achieve or produce or change the habit I want to

594
00:34:09,760 --> 00:34:11,640
Speaker 1: you know, let go of, or the habit I want

595
00:34:11,640 --> 00:34:14,239
Speaker 1: to create, or the money I want to earn, or

596
00:34:14,239 --> 00:34:16,359
Speaker 1: the body I want to build, or the health state

597
00:34:16,400 --> 00:34:20,240
Speaker 1: I want to transform on, whatever it is. There's the idea,

598
00:34:20,440 --> 00:34:23,840
Speaker 1: So that's that's the goal, But then there's the execution.

599
00:34:24,200 --> 00:34:27,279
Speaker 1: Then there's the doing. So the idea, the intention, the

600
00:34:27,280 --> 00:34:29,640
Speaker 1: goal of the plan. You know that to do list

601
00:34:29,760 --> 00:34:34,040
Speaker 1: is all theory, but it's then you know, stepping into

602
00:34:34,160 --> 00:34:38,400
Speaker 1: what can be the uncertain, uncomfortable, unfamiliar, unenjoyable at times

603
00:34:38,480 --> 00:34:42,279
Speaker 1: process like the idea of doing shit. The goal, the

604
00:34:42,320 --> 00:34:45,200
Speaker 1: intention is not the same as the work right, And

605
00:34:45,280 --> 00:34:49,200
Speaker 1: I think that that's being able to set a goal easy,

606
00:34:49,320 --> 00:34:52,279
Speaker 1: being able to execute the goal, being able to consistently

607
00:34:52,320 --> 00:34:54,880
Speaker 1: act on the goal through peaks and troughs and motivation

608
00:34:55,000 --> 00:34:58,400
Speaker 1: and focus and excitement and support, all of that stuff.

609
00:34:59,000 --> 00:34:59,960
Speaker 1: That's the challenge.

610
00:35:01,600 --> 00:35:04,360
Speaker 2: That is the exact problem that I have with self help.

611
00:35:04,719 --> 00:35:08,560
Speaker 2: That is my biggest criticism is self help will tell

612
00:35:08,640 --> 00:35:11,680
Speaker 2: you what to do. Everybody knows what to do, and

613
00:35:11,760 --> 00:35:14,040
Speaker 2: if you're not doing what they're doing, well, clearly you're

614
00:35:14,040 --> 00:35:16,680
Speaker 2: doing it wrong. And they'll search many levels deep to

615
00:35:16,680 --> 00:35:20,160
Speaker 2: find you guilty of something. If the speaker's really good,

616
00:35:20,160 --> 00:35:23,200
Speaker 2: they'll get into what your personal why behind the what

617
00:35:23,480 --> 00:35:27,880
Speaker 2: is not their why. There's enough of those as well.

618
00:35:27,960 --> 00:35:30,960
Speaker 2: What they leave out very often is the how. And

619
00:35:31,200 --> 00:35:34,239
Speaker 2: if you're not taking the look at research and the

620
00:35:34,520 --> 00:35:38,200
Speaker 2: what the empirical evidence says, and you're taking things at

621
00:35:38,239 --> 00:35:41,120
Speaker 2: face value, you're gonna become frustrated and you're going to

622
00:35:41,200 --> 00:35:44,520
Speaker 2: start to develop erroneous beliefs. About yourself and has nothing

623
00:35:44,600 --> 00:35:48,160
Speaker 2: to do with something that you lack internally. It's just

624
00:35:48,200 --> 00:35:51,040
Speaker 2: that you don't have the mechanism and the vehicle. Like

625
00:35:51,160 --> 00:35:54,319
Speaker 2: if you are going to race and you know you

626
00:35:54,400 --> 00:35:56,400
Speaker 2: could be the greatest car driver in the world, you

627
00:35:56,719 --> 00:36:00,600
Speaker 2: could be a Formula one driver. If your race against

628
00:36:00,640 --> 00:36:03,640
Speaker 2: someone who's in a Honda, but all you have is

629
00:36:03,640 --> 00:36:06,360
Speaker 2: a golf cart, You're not going to win. You just

630
00:36:06,440 --> 00:36:08,840
Speaker 2: don't have the right vehicle. And you can tell yourself

631
00:36:08,880 --> 00:36:12,040
Speaker 2: stories about how, man, if I only would have driven harder,

632
00:36:12,080 --> 00:36:14,480
Speaker 2: if I only was more motivated, you know, if I

633
00:36:14,520 --> 00:36:16,880
Speaker 2: only wanted it more. No, dude, you were in a

634
00:36:16,880 --> 00:36:21,920
Speaker 2: golf court. So they'll say things like what you just

635
00:36:21,920 --> 00:36:27,280
Speaker 2: said execution, But when you look at the research, how

636
00:36:27,320 --> 00:36:31,080
Speaker 2: do people execute and how do they go about achieving

637
00:36:31,120 --> 00:36:36,560
Speaker 2: their goals dealing with sets yes in order to increase

638
00:36:36,600 --> 00:36:40,719
Speaker 2: the probability that they'll succeed or at least maintain those

639
00:36:40,760 --> 00:36:43,440
Speaker 2: behaviors in the long term. You know, one thing that

640
00:36:43,480 --> 00:36:46,759
Speaker 2: self help comes up with is, you know, happiness is

641
00:36:46,800 --> 00:36:50,239
Speaker 2: a decision, right, So if I'm someone who is just

642
00:36:50,320 --> 00:36:53,280
Speaker 2: crimogeneous and I'm miserable, and maybe I'm going through something

643
00:36:53,760 --> 00:36:57,640
Speaker 2: that I haven't explored. Holy shit, now I'm guilty because

644
00:36:57,680 --> 00:37:00,960
Speaker 2: I'm not a positive person. I need to side well.

645
00:37:01,080 --> 00:37:03,319
Speaker 2: When when you look at the research that has been

646
00:37:03,400 --> 00:37:10,160
Speaker 2: duplicated by many qualified researchers, fifty percent of happiness is genetic.

647
00:37:10,520 --> 00:37:14,520
Speaker 2: It's heredity, natural selection, gene mutation. You're not gonna do

648
00:37:14,640 --> 00:37:17,800
Speaker 2: a damn thing about that, no matter how much you decide.

649
00:37:17,880 --> 00:37:21,520
Speaker 2: Another ten percent is situational. I lost my job, Well,

650
00:37:21,560 --> 00:37:25,680
Speaker 2: that's going to impact your happiness, especially in the immediate

651
00:37:25,840 --> 00:37:28,640
Speaker 2: You're gonna habituate to that. You know, we habituate to

652
00:37:28,719 --> 00:37:31,280
Speaker 2: really good things happening to us. We kind of habituate,

653
00:37:31,360 --> 00:37:34,040
Speaker 2: thankfully to really bad things happening to us. But you

654
00:37:34,080 --> 00:37:37,799
Speaker 2: have the forty percent in between there, and none of

655
00:37:37,800 --> 00:37:40,799
Speaker 2: that forty percent, according to the research, falls into the

656
00:37:40,840 --> 00:37:45,200
Speaker 2: category of decide or just do it. There are specific

657
00:37:45,320 --> 00:37:48,840
Speaker 2: behaviors that people engage in. You know, you don't go

658
00:37:48,880 --> 00:37:52,960
Speaker 2: out and find happiness. You do happiness. So just that

659
00:37:53,080 --> 00:37:56,719
Speaker 2: happiness is a choice that's gonna make me very unhappy.

660
00:37:57,000 --> 00:38:00,880
Speaker 2: It's also going to prevent me from engage in things

661
00:38:00,960 --> 00:38:05,000
Speaker 2: like affective labeling, which the research says is one of

662
00:38:05,040 --> 00:38:07,680
Speaker 2: the most important things you need to do if you

663
00:38:07,719 --> 00:38:11,680
Speaker 2: want to avoid ruminating on negative emotions or just suppressing

664
00:38:11,680 --> 00:38:15,600
Speaker 2: them for the rest of your life and exacerbating your discontentment.

665
00:38:16,160 --> 00:38:20,040
Speaker 2: So things like that get me going, like, there's got

666
00:38:20,040 --> 00:38:21,920
Speaker 2: to be there's got to be a how like you

667
00:38:22,040 --> 00:38:24,719
Speaker 2: going for your PhD? Imagine this right, you sit down

668
00:38:24,719 --> 00:38:27,480
Speaker 2: with you know, you're seeing your supervisor. He says, Craig,

669
00:38:28,160 --> 00:38:31,240
Speaker 2: here's here's like all the information, here's all the data,

670
00:38:31,800 --> 00:38:35,560
Speaker 2: and we expect the thesis, go after it. And then

671
00:38:35,600 --> 00:38:36,880
Speaker 2: you come back and it's like, well, okay, well I

672
00:38:36,880 --> 00:38:39,880
Speaker 2: don't know how to make sense of this. Well look, Craig,

673
00:38:39,920 --> 00:38:41,719
Speaker 2: if you want the PhD, you just have to want

674
00:38:41,719 --> 00:38:45,000
Speaker 2: it bad enough. Discipline yourself, stay up late into the night,

675
00:38:45,320 --> 00:38:48,160
Speaker 2: wake up early in the morning. We want that thesis.

676
00:38:49,400 --> 00:38:51,799
Speaker 2: To me, that's someone who has no idea how to

677
00:38:51,840 --> 00:38:54,839
Speaker 2: guide you. So they're putting it on you so then

678
00:38:54,880 --> 00:38:56,319
Speaker 2: they can say, well, you didn't do what I told

679
00:38:56,320 --> 00:38:58,359
Speaker 2: you to do. You didn't do the work. No, there's

680
00:38:58,360 --> 00:39:01,560
Speaker 2: a very specific process, and that process is there for

681
00:39:01,600 --> 00:39:06,279
Speaker 2: a reason. It doesn't excuse hard work. It demands it,

682
00:39:06,680 --> 00:39:10,239
Speaker 2: but it structures it. And when something goes wrong and

683
00:39:10,280 --> 00:39:12,480
Speaker 2: I'm assuming in a PhD. There are a lot of

684
00:39:12,520 --> 00:39:16,920
Speaker 2: those moments. You know how to notice it, evaluate it,

685
00:39:17,360 --> 00:39:20,319
Speaker 2: and begin again more intelligently as a result of it,

686
00:39:20,600 --> 00:39:25,080
Speaker 2: and probably learn more than if that never happened. That's process.

687
00:39:26,239 --> 00:39:31,759
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, so interesting. Yeah, I've had this, I mean

688
00:39:31,800 --> 00:39:34,280
Speaker 1: I've had a long time, but I've started doing something

689
00:39:34,320 --> 00:39:39,000
Speaker 1: about it, and you know, like does it hurt? Yeah,

690
00:39:39,000 --> 00:39:40,440
Speaker 1: well there's a little bit of that, but that's a

691
00:39:40,440 --> 00:39:43,480
Speaker 1: different podcast. Now none at the moment, actually pretty good.

692
00:39:44,600 --> 00:39:44,960
Speaker 2: Nice.

693
00:39:47,560 --> 00:39:48,520
Speaker 1: I'll come to sixty.

694
00:39:50,760 --> 00:39:53,120
Speaker 3: I realized that I realized a long time, guys, that

695
00:39:53,320 --> 00:39:55,239
Speaker 3: I can walk into a room as can you.

696
00:39:55,560 --> 00:39:57,279
Speaker 1: I mean, you and I have worked together on the

697
00:39:57,320 --> 00:40:01,040
Speaker 1: same stage. You've spoken at my weekend camps, You've been

698
00:40:01,360 --> 00:40:03,240
Speaker 1: We've done a lot of stuff together over the years.

699
00:40:03,680 --> 00:40:05,480
Speaker 1: And you can walk out and you can talk for

700
00:40:05,520 --> 00:40:07,920
Speaker 1: forty five minute Kenota, or you can talk all day

701
00:40:07,960 --> 00:40:11,480
Speaker 1: and you can blow people away, and you know, I

702
00:40:11,520 --> 00:40:13,279
Speaker 1: can walk out and do my thing and make a

703
00:40:13,280 --> 00:40:15,680
Speaker 1: few people laugh. And you know, I just got some

704
00:40:15,800 --> 00:40:18,719
Speaker 1: feedback this morning from a gig that I did through

705
00:40:18,719 --> 00:40:22,160
Speaker 1: a speaking agency for an organization last week, and it

706
00:40:22,200 --> 00:40:24,839
Speaker 1: was lovely, It was wonderful, it was amazing and very positive, right,

707
00:40:25,200 --> 00:40:29,439
Speaker 1: all you know, nice stuff. And then which is good

708
00:40:29,520 --> 00:40:31,560
Speaker 1: because as a speaker, you don't want them to say

709
00:40:31,600 --> 00:40:33,319
Speaker 1: your shit. You want them to go that was good.

710
00:40:33,360 --> 00:40:35,319
Speaker 1: We enjoyed him, he did a great job. We want

711
00:40:35,360 --> 00:40:37,400
Speaker 1: to get him back. We would recommend him highly right,

712
00:40:37,520 --> 00:40:40,720
Speaker 1: tickety boo, as Paul Taylor says, you've ticked the box.

713
00:40:40,840 --> 00:40:44,239
Speaker 1: And that's good, freer and good for business. But there's

714
00:40:44,280 --> 00:40:48,439
Speaker 1: this other bit where like, I know that I can

715
00:40:48,480 --> 00:40:52,000
Speaker 1: turn up and do my job. I know that I

716
00:40:52,000 --> 00:40:54,760
Speaker 1: can be funny, tell stories being gained you. Not always,

717
00:40:54,800 --> 00:40:56,719
Speaker 1: not every time do I kill it or crush it.

718
00:40:56,800 --> 00:41:00,279
Speaker 1: But most of the time, especially after four hundred years

719
00:41:00,320 --> 00:41:03,840
Speaker 1: of practice, most of the time it's somewhere between okay

720
00:41:03,880 --> 00:41:08,080
Speaker 1: and pretty good. Right. But I really have this awareness

721
00:41:08,160 --> 00:41:14,240
Speaker 1: that in many instances like that, when a speaker gets

722
00:41:14,320 --> 00:41:17,840
Speaker 1: up and talks, then he or she gets off the

723
00:41:17,960 --> 00:41:21,360
Speaker 1: stage and goes away and never sees that audience ever again.

724
00:41:22,400 --> 00:41:27,239
Speaker 1: And then while that audience might be temporarily inspired, motivated,

725
00:41:27,520 --> 00:41:30,960
Speaker 1: you know whatever, impressed, the amount of people who will

726
00:41:31,000 --> 00:41:36,440
Speaker 1: then take away those ideas, thought, strategies, information and operationalize

727
00:41:36,480 --> 00:41:40,440
Speaker 1: it and actually create real world change and do something

728
00:41:40,560 --> 00:41:44,600
Speaker 1: and keep doing something, and that moment in time with

729
00:41:44,719 --> 00:41:48,080
Speaker 1: Bobby or Craig or Sally or Donna on the stage,

730
00:41:48,280 --> 00:41:50,960
Speaker 1: that moment in time will become the catalyst for something

731
00:41:51,719 --> 00:41:57,399
Speaker 1: truly transformative. That's a different question. And so now I've

732
00:41:57,440 --> 00:42:00,560
Speaker 1: been doing this thing where I leave a few minutes

733
00:42:00,600 --> 00:42:03,120
Speaker 1: at the end where I almost like walk over, sit

734
00:42:03,200 --> 00:42:05,480
Speaker 1: on the edge of the stage, swing my feet, and

735
00:42:05,520 --> 00:42:08,680
Speaker 1: I'll just go, look, here's the deal. You know, we

736
00:42:08,880 --> 00:42:10,800
Speaker 1: just had a good time. I made you laugh, I

737
00:42:10,880 --> 00:42:13,120
Speaker 1: told you some stories. I think for the most part

738
00:42:13,239 --> 00:42:15,879
Speaker 1: you liked it. You see, pretty engaged in connected. That's

739
00:42:15,920 --> 00:42:19,240
Speaker 1: all good. But and then I'll talk about what really

740
00:42:19,280 --> 00:42:22,080
Speaker 1: matters is not the hour that we just had, but

741
00:42:22,160 --> 00:42:26,040
Speaker 1: what happens next. And again that's not fixing it or

742
00:42:26,120 --> 00:42:29,799
Speaker 1: solving it, but I'm just trying to impress upon them

743
00:42:30,239 --> 00:42:34,960
Speaker 1: the importance of, you know, the actual journey versus the

744
00:42:34,960 --> 00:42:36,120
Speaker 1: theory of the journey.

745
00:42:36,239 --> 00:42:42,080
Speaker 2: You know, I think those numbers, whatever they are, right, yeah,

746
00:42:41,719 --> 00:42:46,239
Speaker 2: they show up quite a lot. I mean that that

747
00:42:46,440 --> 00:42:49,840
Speaker 2: three percent is saving quite a bit, Like three percent

748
00:42:49,880 --> 00:42:52,000
Speaker 2: of the room will go out and change their lives

749
00:42:52,040 --> 00:42:54,600
Speaker 2: as a result of what is you had to say?

750
00:42:55,200 --> 00:42:59,839
Speaker 2: The other ninety seven percent won't. Now that doesn't mean

751
00:43:00,560 --> 00:43:04,239
Speaker 2: that they won't, but they'll read a book, or they'll

752
00:43:04,280 --> 00:43:06,480
Speaker 2: sign up for the next seminar and the next one,

753
00:43:06,719 --> 00:43:11,239
Speaker 2: maybe four seminars. In some of those people, that day

754
00:43:11,320 --> 00:43:15,920
Speaker 2: is their day. But those numbers, those numbers are pretty consistent.

755
00:43:16,680 --> 00:43:20,960
Speaker 2: And I understand because I've heard professionals in the fitness industry,

756
00:43:21,239 --> 00:43:25,080
Speaker 2: trainers saying the effect of what is wrong with ninety

757
00:43:25,160 --> 00:43:28,479
Speaker 2: seven percent of the people? And I think I don't

758
00:43:28,480 --> 00:43:30,279
Speaker 2: agree with that statement, but I think it's a fair

759
00:43:30,320 --> 00:43:34,480
Speaker 2: statement because when you dedicate your life to hopefully adding

760
00:43:34,600 --> 00:43:38,080
Speaker 2: value to others through what it is that you can

761
00:43:38,200 --> 00:43:40,480
Speaker 2: teach or import or how you can help or guide,

762
00:43:41,000 --> 00:43:43,440
Speaker 2: it's really frustrating because I think a lot of people

763
00:43:43,440 --> 00:43:46,799
Speaker 2: that get into those professions, not all, but a lot

764
00:43:46,880 --> 00:43:51,919
Speaker 2: of they're really invested in seeing people transform and having

765
00:43:51,960 --> 00:43:54,640
Speaker 2: a better experience of life. But I think a more

766
00:43:54,680 --> 00:43:59,319
Speaker 2: powerful question becomes what's different about the three percent? Like

767
00:43:59,400 --> 00:44:03,520
Speaker 2: what is really different without without a throwaway word like well,

768
00:44:03,560 --> 00:44:07,160
Speaker 2: it's confidence, it's you know, it's discipline, it's you know, character,

769
00:44:07,280 --> 00:44:11,560
Speaker 2: What exactly does that mean? Like, explain that function in

770
00:44:11,600 --> 00:44:16,920
Speaker 2: the brain when you say that, But what is different?

771
00:44:17,200 --> 00:44:22,400
Speaker 2: About the three percent that take action versus the ninety

772
00:44:22,440 --> 00:44:26,160
Speaker 2: seven percent that don't. You know, but that's a big question.

773
00:44:26,480 --> 00:44:30,560
Speaker 1: But also sometimes the ninety seven percent in the next

774
00:44:31,120 --> 00:44:34,760
Speaker 1: you know, it's like maybe someone sits in nineteen presentations

775
00:44:34,760 --> 00:44:38,319
Speaker 1: and they're in the ninety cent and then the twentieth presentation,

776
00:44:39,400 --> 00:44:41,799
Speaker 1: something goes off in their brain and now they're in

777
00:44:41,840 --> 00:44:47,240
Speaker 1: the three percent. Sometimes I think it's where they're at mentally, emotionally,

778
00:44:47,280 --> 00:44:53,160
Speaker 1: psychologically whatever, sociologically, and there's you know, maybe it's timing,

779
00:44:53,360 --> 00:44:57,040
Speaker 1: maybe there's I don't know, I just think that for

780
00:44:57,120 --> 00:45:02,440
Speaker 1: a range of reasons. Ah, you know, some people are

781
00:45:02,480 --> 00:45:06,720
Speaker 1: just not ready and like starting when you're not really ready,

782
00:45:07,480 --> 00:45:10,200
Speaker 1: like you're really really not ready to do the work

783
00:45:10,239 --> 00:45:12,800
Speaker 1: and keep going. It's probably better that you don't start

784
00:45:14,800 --> 00:45:17,360
Speaker 1: rather than starting throwing throw it in and start and

785
00:45:17,440 --> 00:45:19,920
Speaker 1: throw it in. To say, I say to people all

786
00:45:19,920 --> 00:45:22,400
Speaker 1: the time, you know, what do you want? But then cool,

787
00:45:22,800 --> 00:45:24,880
Speaker 1: of course, you know what would you talk about? And

788
00:45:24,880 --> 00:45:27,719
Speaker 1: the why, the driver the real reason. But then there's

789
00:45:27,760 --> 00:45:30,040
Speaker 1: the how fucking much do you want it?

790
00:45:30,400 --> 00:45:34,600
Speaker 4: Because unless the answer is like a lot, then you're

791
00:45:34,719 --> 00:45:38,440
Speaker 4: probably because the chances of you starting with kind of

792
00:45:38,600 --> 00:45:43,480
Speaker 4: like a shoulder shrugg and creating a life changing, powerful outcome.

793
00:45:43,560 --> 00:45:45,200
Speaker 1: The chances of that are pretty much.

794
00:45:45,239 --> 00:45:49,799
Speaker 2: Zero, unless, of course, you don't know exactly what that is.

795
00:45:53,880 --> 00:45:59,239
Speaker 2: Go and say again, unless you don't know exactly what

796
00:45:59,560 --> 00:46:03,280
Speaker 2: that is for you where I'm coming to this seminar

797
00:46:03,320 --> 00:46:06,800
Speaker 2: because I'm looking, you know, I'm curious, but not serious.

798
00:46:07,760 --> 00:46:11,319
Speaker 2: That's okay, because I think there's something to be said, like, like,

799
00:46:11,400 --> 00:46:13,879
Speaker 2: why do human beings play like I'm a big fan

800
00:46:13,920 --> 00:46:17,040
Speaker 2: of Stuart Brown, you know, in his book Play, you know,

801
00:46:17,920 --> 00:46:21,880
Speaker 2: human beings as mammals like my cat, he will play

802
00:46:22,120 --> 00:46:25,040
Speaker 2: all day long if you let him. He is always

803
00:46:25,040 --> 00:46:28,359
Speaker 2: in a play state. For for a mammal, that's very

804
00:46:28,480 --> 00:46:30,960
Speaker 2: dangerous because if he was out in the wild the

805
00:46:31,000 --> 00:46:34,840
Speaker 2: time he's playing, he's not vigilant about predators, he's not

806
00:46:35,120 --> 00:46:39,240
Speaker 2: hunting at the moment. It's pretty risky business. So why

807
00:46:39,440 --> 00:46:44,399
Speaker 2: is so much of mammalian behavior dedicated to play? There's

808
00:46:44,440 --> 00:46:47,200
Speaker 2: a lot of reasons. It helps us socialize with one another.

809
00:46:47,920 --> 00:46:50,719
Speaker 2: It allows us to experiment out in the world and

810
00:46:50,760 --> 00:46:53,200
Speaker 2: try stuff out and figure out who we are and

811
00:46:53,239 --> 00:46:57,319
Speaker 2: where our places within you know, within that troop, within

812
00:46:57,400 --> 00:47:01,720
Speaker 2: that clan, you know, whatever. So I think going around

813
00:47:01,760 --> 00:47:07,000
Speaker 2: and experimenting with things and seeing what clicks does work,

814
00:47:07,040 --> 00:47:09,959
Speaker 2: there is value in that. So if you're like, ah,

815
00:47:10,000 --> 00:47:12,520
Speaker 2: I don't know, well, you know what? So what like?

816
00:47:12,880 --> 00:47:16,239
Speaker 2: What are you interested in? What are you hoping happens here?

817
00:47:16,320 --> 00:47:16,640
Speaker 1: And there?

818
00:47:16,760 --> 00:47:19,840
Speaker 2: Used to be something that self help speakers used to

819
00:47:19,880 --> 00:47:22,640
Speaker 2: do and it started to irritate me. But now I

820
00:47:22,640 --> 00:47:25,200
Speaker 2: have a very different opinion about it. I've reversed this

821
00:47:25,680 --> 00:47:29,080
Speaker 2: where and you've heard this in seminars you've been to

822
00:47:29,360 --> 00:47:31,800
Speaker 2: where they'd start off by saying, I know two things

823
00:47:31,800 --> 00:47:34,960
Speaker 2: about everyone in this room. Person just slept on stage,

824
00:47:35,000 --> 00:47:37,960
Speaker 2: didn't even introduce himself. I've never seen this guy before.

825
00:47:38,000 --> 00:47:39,920
Speaker 2: I'm sure he's never seen me, but he knows two

826
00:47:40,040 --> 00:47:43,279
Speaker 2: things about me. Okay, this I want to hear right.

827
00:47:43,400 --> 00:47:48,600
Speaker 2: Number one, you are in the top ninety percent of

828
00:47:48,680 --> 00:47:51,279
Speaker 2: anyone working in your industry today. And if you're not

829
00:47:51,400 --> 00:47:53,919
Speaker 2: in the top ninety percent, you're well on your way

830
00:47:54,400 --> 00:47:57,000
Speaker 2: because less than ten percent of the people take the

831
00:47:57,000 --> 00:47:59,239
Speaker 2: time to read the books and go to courses. And

832
00:47:59,680 --> 00:48:02,080
Speaker 2: I don't know where they got that stat from. And

833
00:48:02,160 --> 00:48:04,120
Speaker 2: so they're talking to me about all the things they

834
00:48:04,120 --> 00:48:08,440
Speaker 2: know about me and it's like that sounds manipulent, But

835
00:48:08,719 --> 00:48:11,799
Speaker 2: when you look at it from a behavior change perspective,

836
00:48:12,480 --> 00:48:16,319
Speaker 2: if you can point out to someone where they're already

837
00:48:16,360 --> 00:48:20,160
Speaker 2: taking action so before they go out and execute, it's like, listen,

838
00:48:20,200 --> 00:48:24,280
Speaker 2: you've already executed, You've already engaged. You're already the type

839
00:48:24,280 --> 00:48:27,879
Speaker 2: of person that does this stuff. Right, So you've bought

840
00:48:27,920 --> 00:48:30,520
Speaker 2: a ticket to the event, You've gotten in a car,

841
00:48:30,640 --> 00:48:33,799
Speaker 2: a train, a plane, you've taken off from work, or

842
00:48:33,880 --> 00:48:39,280
Speaker 2: you've missed a weekend. You've already sacrificed and done the work.

843
00:48:39,400 --> 00:48:43,839
Speaker 2: You're that person. What is the most valuable thing you've

844
00:48:43,880 --> 00:48:47,200
Speaker 2: heard from the stage today? What really lands with you?

845
00:48:47,800 --> 00:48:49,920
Speaker 2: What's one thing in the next seven days you can

846
00:48:49,960 --> 00:48:53,320
Speaker 2: do to build on this momentum. Because I think that's

847
00:48:53,480 --> 00:48:57,200
Speaker 2: different than Okay, hey, go out and do something. Use

848
00:48:57,280 --> 00:49:03,040
Speaker 2: this versus you've already done this, because that languaging is

849
00:49:03,160 --> 00:49:09,719
Speaker 2: connected to probability of action. So it's just something I'm

850
00:49:09,760 --> 00:49:11,839
Speaker 2: thinking about, like because I don't want to. I don't

851
00:49:11,880 --> 00:49:14,520
Speaker 2: want to trash self help because there are things I

852
00:49:14,520 --> 00:49:16,160
Speaker 2: look at I'm like, oh wow, I think I was

853
00:49:16,160 --> 00:49:18,040
Speaker 2: wrong about that. You know, two years from now, I'll

854
00:49:18,040 --> 00:49:19,120
Speaker 2: probably have a different idea.

855
00:49:19,840 --> 00:49:22,319
Speaker 1: If not, if not for self help, I don't think

856
00:49:22,360 --> 00:49:25,360
Speaker 1: I would be where I am. And it's not necessarily

857
00:49:25,400 --> 00:49:27,080
Speaker 1: that all of the stuff I read or heard was

858
00:49:27,120 --> 00:49:30,080
Speaker 1: brilliant or transformative, but rather some of it was, by

859
00:49:30,080 --> 00:49:35,279
Speaker 1: the way, but it really made me, as you talked

860
00:49:35,280 --> 00:49:38,520
Speaker 1: about before, curiosity and frustration. But it made me curious,

861
00:49:38,560 --> 00:49:42,920
Speaker 1: like made me because I didn't have a high opinion

862
00:49:43,080 --> 00:49:46,799
Speaker 1: of me. And then but I just started to think, oh, well,

863
00:49:46,880 --> 00:49:51,000
Speaker 1: maybe or maybe I don't need to be you know,

864
00:49:51,440 --> 00:49:52,440
Speaker 1: who I think I am.

865
00:49:52,480 --> 00:49:55,160
Speaker 5: Maybe there is more for me, maybe you know so

866
00:49:55,320 --> 00:49:58,760
Speaker 5: for me, just that just hearing some of the stuff,

867
00:49:58,880 --> 00:50:02,600
Speaker 5: like My Genesis was first book I ever read, was

868
00:50:02,600 --> 00:50:05,320
Speaker 5: written in nine point thirty six, how to Win Friends

869
00:50:05,320 --> 00:50:09,680
Speaker 5: and Influence People, Dale Carnegie, and you know that was

870
00:50:09,840 --> 00:50:12,319
Speaker 5: I mean, just think that's coming up in eleven years,

871
00:50:12,360 --> 00:50:13,600
Speaker 5: that'll be one hundred years old.

872
00:50:13,640 --> 00:50:17,640
Speaker 1: That book. That's fucking amazing. I read that and I'm like, oh,

873
00:50:18,320 --> 00:50:23,920
Speaker 1: it was very very basic, but probably where I was

874
00:50:23,960 --> 00:50:26,800
Speaker 1: at very basic and what I needed was very basic,

875
00:50:26,880 --> 00:50:31,919
Speaker 1: and he was just introducing these ideas about basically how

876
00:50:31,960 --> 00:50:36,719
Speaker 1: to do better around other people and to think differently,

877
00:50:36,840 --> 00:50:40,560
Speaker 1: and like really fundamental things. But for me, you know,

878
00:50:40,680 --> 00:50:45,080
Speaker 1: like even the idea of thinking about how we think

879
00:50:45,200 --> 00:50:48,600
Speaker 1: or thinking about how we see the world and opening

880
00:50:48,640 --> 00:50:52,600
Speaker 1: that awareness store in our own kind of mind to go, oh,

881
00:50:52,680 --> 00:50:57,880
Speaker 1: that's so, that's not the thing. That's just my story

882
00:50:57,920 --> 00:51:00,440
Speaker 1: about the thing, and my story about the and the

883
00:51:00,560 --> 00:51:03,880
Speaker 1: actual thing. I'm not the same, and just having that

884
00:51:04,000 --> 00:51:08,520
Speaker 1: awareness of where my reality finishes and the objective whatever

885
00:51:08,560 --> 00:51:12,440
Speaker 1: it is, begins. You know. So for me, all of

886
00:51:12,480 --> 00:51:17,160
Speaker 1: that stuff which just made me, for a range of

887
00:51:17,160 --> 00:51:20,920
Speaker 1: different reasons, pause and reflect and consider the fact that

888
00:51:21,040 --> 00:51:23,920
Speaker 1: life didn't need to be the way it was, or

889
00:51:24,000 --> 00:51:26,759
Speaker 1: I didn't need to be the way I was, and

890
00:51:26,800 --> 00:51:32,239
Speaker 1: that I could actually be Obviously I was always going

891
00:51:32,320 --> 00:51:35,000
Speaker 1: to be me, but I could be a better, modified,

892
00:51:35,320 --> 00:51:41,520
Speaker 1: you know, slightly sociologically, psychologically, physiologically different version of me.

893
00:51:41,840 --> 00:51:45,120
Speaker 1: Like that That's what. Yeah, that just kind of lit

894
00:51:45,200 --> 00:51:47,920
Speaker 1: affusing me that has kept going forever.

895
00:51:49,640 --> 00:51:51,680
Speaker 2: There's a lot there's a lot of good stuff in

896
00:51:51,680 --> 00:51:53,319
Speaker 2: that book, and there's a lot of good stuff and

897
00:51:53,360 --> 00:51:56,279
Speaker 2: self help. I feel like the same thing happened to

898
00:51:56,320 --> 00:51:58,719
Speaker 2: me because I was so stuck in dealer survival, Like

899
00:51:58,800 --> 00:52:01,600
Speaker 2: I didn't like the furthest I ever thought into the

900
00:52:01,640 --> 00:52:04,520
Speaker 2: future was like morning to evening, like how do I

901
00:52:04,600 --> 00:52:08,640
Speaker 2: get through this day and not end up in the hospital,

902
00:52:08,800 --> 00:52:11,880
Speaker 2: not end up with anything broken, and pretty much stay alive.

903
00:52:12,520 --> 00:52:14,960
Speaker 2: So there was that version of me, and then there

904
00:52:15,000 --> 00:52:17,640
Speaker 2: was the past version of me, and my story about

905
00:52:17,680 --> 00:52:20,880
Speaker 2: the past version of me that profoundly shape my reality

906
00:52:21,120 --> 00:52:23,719
Speaker 2: probably still does. But when I started listening to self help,

907
00:52:23,840 --> 00:52:27,160
Speaker 2: it dawned to me there's another version of me. There's

908
00:52:27,200 --> 00:52:30,520
Speaker 2: the future version of me that's kind of unformed yet,

909
00:52:31,360 --> 00:52:35,040
Speaker 2: and it's a certain trajectory. You know, like if you

910
00:52:35,120 --> 00:52:38,120
Speaker 2: hop on a train and the train's going west and

911
00:52:38,320 --> 00:52:41,000
Speaker 2: all of a sudden it's the last stop you can't

912
00:52:41,040 --> 00:52:43,840
Speaker 2: take credit for, like, wow, look how far west I've gone.

913
00:52:44,239 --> 00:52:46,960
Speaker 2: You couldn't have done otherwise you hopped on a westbound train.

914
00:52:47,760 --> 00:52:50,440
Speaker 2: But you know, if you got off the train and

915
00:52:50,480 --> 00:52:52,839
Speaker 2: you read a couple of maps and you started navigating

916
00:52:52,880 --> 00:52:56,000
Speaker 2: and you made you took a different series of actions,

917
00:52:56,520 --> 00:53:00,320
Speaker 2: well you can completely take credit for where you ended up. Well, no, actually,

918
00:53:00,400 --> 00:53:02,440
Speaker 2: the conductor of the people drive in the train, but

919
00:53:02,760 --> 00:53:06,239
Speaker 2: you are partly responsible for where you ended up. And

920
00:53:06,280 --> 00:53:09,080
Speaker 2: I was like, there's a future version of me. There's

921
00:53:09,239 --> 00:53:14,680
Speaker 2: many Wow, I wonder what I can do to live

922
00:53:14,840 --> 00:53:20,640
Speaker 2: into some of the more attractive possibilities. Yeah, yeah, that

923
00:53:21,120 --> 00:53:24,440
Speaker 2: dawned on me. It's like I could shape myself. I

924
00:53:24,520 --> 00:53:30,520
Speaker 2: don't have to be this person. I could become someone different. Now.

925
00:53:31,400 --> 00:53:35,680
Speaker 2: That brought with it a lot of benefits. I did

926
00:53:35,719 --> 00:53:39,160
Speaker 2: some things that you know were my best attempt, but

927
00:53:39,640 --> 00:53:43,640
Speaker 2: you know, in retrospect it ill advised. So it brought

928
00:53:43,640 --> 00:53:48,200
Speaker 2: about a lot of consequences as well. But it created

929
00:53:48,239 --> 00:53:53,560
Speaker 2: the possibility it's possible to change. That was that was

930
00:53:53,840 --> 00:53:54,640
Speaker 2: enthralling for me.

931
00:53:56,000 --> 00:54:00,919
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, sign a lot of it. I think we're

932
00:54:00,920 --> 00:54:03,439
Speaker 1: going to call this the other version of you. That's

933
00:54:03,480 --> 00:54:06,920
Speaker 1: what this episode. When you said you could be another

934
00:54:07,000 --> 00:54:09,520
Speaker 1: version of you? I love that. I How do people

935
00:54:09,840 --> 00:54:11,839
Speaker 1: connect with you and listen to you and read you,

936
00:54:13,080 --> 00:54:14,759
Speaker 1: engage you? How do people do that?

937
00:54:16,360 --> 00:54:20,040
Speaker 2: Well? The only social media platform I'm really like, not on,

938
00:54:20,160 --> 00:54:24,520
Speaker 2: but like engaged in is LinkedIn, and you can you

939
00:54:24,560 --> 00:54:27,600
Speaker 2: can reach out to me at the self helpandad dot com,

940
00:54:27,680 --> 00:54:31,239
Speaker 2: Robert Capuccio dot com. Those all the dot coms I have.

941
00:54:32,160 --> 00:54:33,960
Speaker 1: And if you can't remember any of that, just send

942
00:54:34,040 --> 00:54:37,399
Speaker 1: us anamail and we will forward. We will forward that's

943
00:54:37,480 --> 00:54:41,360
Speaker 1: the great Man. Always great chatting to you buddy, Enjoy

944
00:54:41,400 --> 00:54:45,080
Speaker 1: each What time is it like nine minutes past seven

945
00:54:45,200 --> 00:54:49,000
Speaker 1: over there in the PM MH. I'll talk to you

946
00:54:49,160 --> 00:54:52,160
Speaker 1: off airybuddy, but thank you, see you next time, See

947
00:54:52,200 --> 00:54:52,880
Speaker 1: you next time.