1
00:00:05,080 --> 00:00:08,200
Speaker 1: From The Australian. I'm Claire Harvey a special bonus episode

2
00:00:08,240 --> 00:00:15,760
Speaker 1: of The Front for You Today. How did Kamala Harris

3
00:00:15,800 --> 00:00:20,800
Speaker 1: and the Democrats fail so comprehensively? Gender, race, and celebrity

4
00:00:20,880 --> 00:00:24,240
Speaker 1: all played out in ways the Harris campaign didn't expect

5
00:00:24,800 --> 00:00:28,520
Speaker 1: and delivered Donald Trump back to the White House. Today?

6
00:00:28,640 --> 00:00:32,520
Speaker 1: Are US reporter Joe Kelly helps me soort rhetoric from

7
00:00:32,640 --> 00:00:36,240
Speaker 1: reality In the wake of the democrats defeat.

8
00:00:40,159 --> 00:00:50,560
Speaker 2: Welcome the next President of these United States, Hamma Harras Good, Seek.

9
00:00:52,040 --> 00:01:03,200
Speaker 1: Seek, No. She couldn't. Kamala Harris couldn't turn around the

10
00:01:03,280 --> 00:01:07,880
Speaker 1: disastrous campaign begun by Joe Biden. She couldn't convince voters

11
00:01:07,959 --> 00:01:11,760
Speaker 1: she knew how to ease their grocery prices. She couldn't

12
00:01:11,800 --> 00:01:16,399
Speaker 1: ease fear and anger about illegal immigration. When she was

13
00:01:16,440 --> 00:01:19,760
Speaker 1: handed the chalice by a faltering Joe Biden back in July,

14
00:01:20,280 --> 00:01:22,640
Speaker 1: Harris chose to go for optimism.

15
00:01:23,319 --> 00:01:29,640
Speaker 3: I will be a president for all Americans. This has

16
00:01:29,720 --> 00:01:32,440
Speaker 3: not been about a fight that is against something. This

17
00:01:32,520 --> 00:01:36,640
Speaker 3: is about a fight that is for something. We are

18
00:01:36,680 --> 00:01:40,839
Speaker 3: not going back. We are not going back.

19
00:01:42,520 --> 00:01:45,240
Speaker 1: But it turned out too few Americans were in the

20
00:01:45,319 --> 00:01:49,720
Speaker 1: mood for her brand of joy. Harris left her dejected

21
00:01:49,720 --> 00:01:54,680
Speaker 1: supporters waiting on election night and then took until Thursday morning,

22
00:01:54,720 --> 00:01:59,000
Speaker 1: Australian time, more than twelve hours after the confetti settled

23
00:01:59,040 --> 00:02:09,960
Speaker 1: at Trump's victory, everty to concede defeat.

24
00:02:12,360 --> 00:02:16,280
Speaker 4: My heart is full today. My heart is full today.

25
00:02:17,639 --> 00:02:21,680
Speaker 5: I thought the speech was disappointing from Kamala Harris. I

26
00:02:21,680 --> 00:02:26,200
Speaker 5: think this was a comprehensive defeat for the Democrats, and

27
00:02:26,360 --> 00:02:28,480
Speaker 5: I felt she was doubling down on failure.

28
00:02:29,480 --> 00:02:32,160
Speaker 1: Joe Kelly is part of our reporting team in the

29
00:02:32,280 --> 00:02:33,079
Speaker 1: United States.

30
00:02:34,240 --> 00:02:37,480
Speaker 4: I spoke with President elect Trump and congratulated him on

31
00:02:37,520 --> 00:02:42,320
Speaker 4: his victory. I also told him that we will help

32
00:02:42,400 --> 00:02:46,080
Speaker 4: him and his team with their transition and that we

33
00:02:46,120 --> 00:02:54,360
Speaker 4: will engage in a peaceful transfer of power. A fundamental

34
00:02:54,400 --> 00:02:58,520
Speaker 4: principle of American democracy is that when we lose an election,

35
00:02:58,720 --> 00:03:03,679
Speaker 4: we accept the result. That principle, as much as any other,

36
00:03:04,440 --> 00:03:11,600
Speaker 4: distinguishes democracy from monarchy or tyranny, and anyone who seeks

37
00:03:11,720 --> 00:03:13,880
Speaker 4: the public trust must honor it.

38
00:03:15,280 --> 00:03:18,520
Speaker 5: There was nothing in there about what the Democrats need

39
00:03:18,560 --> 00:03:22,239
Speaker 5: to do moving forward, or reconnecting with the working or

40
00:03:22,280 --> 00:03:24,880
Speaker 5: middle class of America. I think that was a mistake,

41
00:03:25,440 --> 00:03:27,840
Speaker 5: and that key line in the speech was.

42
00:03:28,520 --> 00:03:33,800
Speaker 6: I am here to say while I conceide this election,

43
00:03:34,639 --> 00:03:39,200
Speaker 6: I do not concede the fight that fueled this campaign.

44
00:03:43,720 --> 00:03:47,800
Speaker 5: Well, you just lost. So I think it was problematic,

45
00:03:48,160 --> 00:03:51,400
Speaker 5: But in some ways, I think it's typical of the

46
00:03:51,480 --> 00:03:56,840
Speaker 5: Democrat mentality out in various states. When I was speaking

47
00:03:56,840 --> 00:04:00,840
Speaker 5: to people, most of the Republican supporters were voting on issues.

48
00:04:01,600 --> 00:04:04,240
Speaker 5: They were talking about the economy, they were talking about

49
00:04:04,320 --> 00:04:07,760
Speaker 5: the price of their groceries, they were talking about the border.

50
00:04:08,200 --> 00:04:12,560
Speaker 5: Most of the Democratic supporters were talking about Donald Trump's character.

51
00:04:12,840 --> 00:04:18,160
Speaker 5: So I felt that Trump engaged with these people concerned

52
00:04:18,200 --> 00:04:22,960
Speaker 5: about their everyday lives the cost of living. Harris didn't

53
00:04:22,960 --> 00:04:26,080
Speaker 5: cut through to them, and I think the campaign was

54
00:04:26,080 --> 00:04:29,000
Speaker 5: exposed for being out of touch. I think it was

55
00:04:29,200 --> 00:04:33,239
Speaker 5: a mistake. She should have been more accommodating. She should

56
00:04:33,240 --> 00:04:35,760
Speaker 5: have said that they would have listened to the message,

57
00:04:35,880 --> 00:04:39,200
Speaker 5: they would have taken heed of the result and essentially

58
00:04:39,240 --> 00:04:42,560
Speaker 5: sort of reassessed moving forward. There was none of that

59
00:04:43,440 --> 00:04:46,400
Speaker 5: in that regard. I think it was not a politically

60
00:04:46,920 --> 00:04:49,880
Speaker 5: clever speech from Kamala Harris.

61
00:04:50,640 --> 00:04:54,000
Speaker 4: On the campaign, I would often say, when we fight,

62
00:04:54,360 --> 00:04:58,960
Speaker 4: we win, but here's the thing. Here's the thing. Sometimes

63
00:04:59,000 --> 00:05:03,040
Speaker 4: the fight takes a while. That doesn't mean we won't win.

64
00:05:04,320 --> 00:05:05,760
Speaker 1: The important thing.

65
00:05:05,760 --> 00:05:07,520
Speaker 3: Is don't ever give up.

66
00:05:08,080 --> 00:05:12,440
Speaker 4: Don't ever give up, don't ever stop trying to make

67
00:05:12,600 --> 00:05:14,719
Speaker 4: the world a better place.

68
00:05:15,960 --> 00:05:19,560
Speaker 1: Something that always strikes me about American politicians, candidates for

69
00:05:19,600 --> 00:05:23,040
Speaker 1: President Joe is that they have themselves introduced at rallies.

70
00:05:23,080 --> 00:05:26,800
Speaker 1: We heard Oprah Winfrey introducing Kamala Harris with this phrase,

71
00:05:27,279 --> 00:05:30,000
Speaker 1: welcome the next president of the United States. Both sides

72
00:05:30,040 --> 00:05:32,920
Speaker 1: do that. They do that in every election campaign. It's

73
00:05:32,960 --> 00:05:35,280
Speaker 1: really the opposite of what we hear in Australia, isn't it,

74
00:05:35,320 --> 00:05:39,920
Speaker 1: Where politicians are trying to encourage their supporters to think

75
00:05:39,960 --> 00:05:42,200
Speaker 1: that their vote matters. You must vote for me, otherwise

76
00:05:42,200 --> 00:05:45,600
Speaker 1: I might not get elected. In Harris's case, obviously now

77
00:05:45,640 --> 00:05:48,200
Speaker 1: it's embarrassing to look back and see that she's not

78
00:05:48,200 --> 00:05:50,479
Speaker 1: the president of the United States. What do you think

79
00:05:50,520 --> 00:05:56,040
Speaker 1: about that kind of bullish, optimistic sentiment that she invoked

80
00:05:56,040 --> 00:05:56,839
Speaker 1: at her rallies.

81
00:05:58,560 --> 00:06:00,839
Speaker 5: I think it's something that happens on both sides. But

82
00:06:01,320 --> 00:06:04,839
Speaker 5: I think the problem for Kamala Harris was this sense

83
00:06:04,880 --> 00:06:08,719
Speaker 5: of elitism that was associated with her campaign you know,

84
00:06:08,839 --> 00:06:12,960
Speaker 5: she had this congo line of celebrity endorsements rock stars,

85
00:06:13,000 --> 00:06:20,400
Speaker 5: big musicians, Lady Gaga, Beyonce, Bruce Springsteen, eminem. But at

86
00:06:20,400 --> 00:06:22,480
Speaker 5: the end of the day, the result shows that it

87
00:06:22,520 --> 00:06:25,719
Speaker 5: doesn't matter what celebrity endorsements you have. It doesn't matter

88
00:06:25,760 --> 00:06:30,120
Speaker 5: what a less celebrities hitching themselves to your wagon. People

89
00:06:30,520 --> 00:06:34,120
Speaker 5: want to vote on the issues, and.

90
00:06:34,200 --> 00:06:39,320
Speaker 3: When Congress passes a bill to restore reproductive freedom nationwide,

91
00:06:41,000 --> 00:06:44,400
Speaker 3: as President of the United States, I will proudly sign

92
00:06:44,440 --> 00:06:45,039
Speaker 3: it into law.

93
00:06:46,800 --> 00:06:50,000
Speaker 1: One of the issues that Harris leant on heavily was abortion,

94
00:06:50,200 --> 00:06:53,520
Speaker 1: but she kind of turned that into an identity point

95
00:06:53,640 --> 00:06:57,200
Speaker 1: Joe telling women that they should be fearful of a

96
00:06:57,240 --> 00:07:00,080
Speaker 1: Trump presidency, that he would enact a national abortion and

97
00:07:00,400 --> 00:07:02,840
Speaker 1: kind of assuming that women would get that and would

98
00:07:02,920 --> 00:07:06,280
Speaker 1: vote for her. Educated in young women, of course, in

99
00:07:06,480 --> 00:07:09,760
Speaker 1: large numbers did vote for Harris responding to that rhetoric

100
00:07:09,840 --> 00:07:13,680
Speaker 1: about abortion, But it seems many other women, particularly in

101
00:07:13,680 --> 00:07:17,120
Speaker 1: the suburbs, had other priorities, like the cost of groceries.

102
00:07:17,680 --> 00:07:20,640
Speaker 1: So do you think that focus on abortion was misjudged

103
00:07:20,840 --> 00:07:24,400
Speaker 1: by her or was it just that she mangled the message.

104
00:07:24,920 --> 00:07:27,239
Speaker 5: I think it was too narrow. I think it's fine

105
00:07:27,280 --> 00:07:29,840
Speaker 5: for them to promote that message on abortion, which is

106
00:07:29,840 --> 00:07:33,280
Speaker 5: obviously very important to many women in their base, and

107
00:07:33,320 --> 00:07:36,600
Speaker 5: you need to get the base out. But obviously women

108
00:07:36,920 --> 00:07:40,680
Speaker 5: have different views on all sorts of political issues, so

109
00:07:40,880 --> 00:07:44,560
Speaker 5: I think the campaign lacked depth in its appeal to women.

110
00:07:44,920 --> 00:07:48,440
Speaker 5: But this was not a problem that was limited to

111
00:07:48,480 --> 00:07:52,320
Speaker 5: women only. The coalition which she was hoping to cobble

112
00:07:52,360 --> 00:07:56,400
Speaker 5: together didn't end up materializing at the end of the day,

113
00:07:56,960 --> 00:08:02,280
Speaker 5: So in terms of Black communities, Ltis communities, these communities

114
00:08:02,320 --> 00:08:07,360
Speaker 5: still on average, shifted towards Trump. This was a big

115
00:08:07,960 --> 00:08:11,960
Speaker 5: shock result for Harris, and Kamala Harris didn't do any

116
00:08:11,960 --> 00:08:15,160
Speaker 5: better than Joe Biden did four years before. So you'd

117
00:08:15,200 --> 00:08:19,400
Speaker 5: have to say her campaign was disappointing in that regard,

118
00:08:19,800 --> 00:08:22,960
Speaker 5: and that she needed to add more flesh to the

119
00:08:22,960 --> 00:08:27,000
Speaker 5: bone to really get this broad coalition she wanted over

120
00:08:27,040 --> 00:08:30,320
Speaker 5: the line, and she didn't. I think you're correct to

121
00:08:30,360 --> 00:08:34,400
Speaker 5: identify the fact that simply a hollow appeal to identity

122
00:08:34,440 --> 00:08:37,840
Speaker 5: politics doesn't cut it. There needs to be more substance there.

123
00:08:38,559 --> 00:08:41,240
Speaker 1: Kamala Harris spent a lot of time during the campaign

124
00:08:41,320 --> 00:08:43,760
Speaker 1: talking about Donald Trump's character.

125
00:08:44,559 --> 00:08:48,080
Speaker 4: Well, I think this is so rich coming from someone

126
00:08:48,080 --> 00:08:54,520
Speaker 4: who has been prosecuted for national security crimes, economic crimes,

127
00:08:54,720 --> 00:09:00,640
Speaker 4: election interference, has been found liable for sexual assault, and

128
00:09:00,720 --> 00:09:04,080
Speaker 4: his next big court appearance is in November at his

129
00:09:04,160 --> 00:09:05,679
Speaker 4: own criminal sentencing.

130
00:09:06,800 --> 00:09:08,920
Speaker 1: You can see why it was tempting for Kamala Harris,

131
00:09:08,960 --> 00:09:11,800
Speaker 1: of course, to talk about his character in the hopes

132
00:09:11,840 --> 00:09:15,040
Speaker 1: that people didn't like all those things about him, didn't

133
00:09:15,120 --> 00:09:17,240
Speaker 1: like his crude language and the way he spoke about

134
00:09:17,280 --> 00:09:20,720
Speaker 1: women in particular. But it didn't work for her, So

135
00:09:20,880 --> 00:09:21,920
Speaker 1: was that a misfire too.

136
00:09:22,920 --> 00:09:25,400
Speaker 5: Look, I think this was the great trap when it

137
00:09:25,440 --> 00:09:28,680
Speaker 5: comes to Donald Trump. This was the trap that the

138
00:09:28,760 --> 00:09:33,280
Speaker 5: Democrats fell into in twenty sixteen. It didn't work, Then

139
00:09:33,280 --> 00:09:36,560
Speaker 5: it worked with Joe Biden, and it didn't work again. Now,

140
00:09:37,280 --> 00:09:40,120
Speaker 5: I think it was so tempting, and it's an easy

141
00:09:40,280 --> 00:09:43,280
Speaker 5: campaign to run, but it only had a fifty percent

142
00:09:43,360 --> 00:09:46,720
Speaker 5: track record. So I think it was a mistake to

143
00:09:46,800 --> 00:09:50,560
Speaker 5: have so squarely focused so much of the campaign on

144
00:09:50,600 --> 00:09:54,240
Speaker 5: this relentless character attack. When you go negative, I think

145
00:09:54,280 --> 00:09:57,760
Speaker 5: you have to accompany that negative campaign with positive offerings,

146
00:09:57,800 --> 00:10:00,120
Speaker 5: and I don't think that there was enough there. And

147
00:10:00,240 --> 00:10:03,120
Speaker 5: people also have to believe that the person who is

148
00:10:03,160 --> 00:10:07,520
Speaker 5: actually going negative has credibility, And I think people felt

149
00:10:07,559 --> 00:10:10,679
Speaker 5: Donald Trump was a known quantity. He'd been president before,

150
00:10:10,920 --> 00:10:14,520
Speaker 5: they were familiar with his style, they knew the problematic

151
00:10:14,679 --> 00:10:18,560
Speaker 5: aspects of his personality, of his character. But at the

152
00:10:18,640 --> 00:10:21,880
Speaker 5: end of the day, this negative campaign from Kamala Harris

153
00:10:21,920 --> 00:10:24,880
Speaker 5: also probably shone a spotlight on the fact that people

154
00:10:25,480 --> 00:10:29,280
Speaker 5: didn't feel they knew too much about her, that she

155
00:10:29,440 --> 00:10:32,720
Speaker 5: was a bit of an unknown quantity. Her campaign was

156
00:10:32,720 --> 00:10:35,880
Speaker 5: one hundred and seven days, and so in that regard,

157
00:10:36,240 --> 00:10:37,920
Speaker 5: I think it was a bit of a risk to

158
00:10:38,000 --> 00:10:43,800
Speaker 5: go down this well worn route of character assassination against

159
00:10:43,800 --> 00:10:44,440
Speaker 5: Donald Trump.

160
00:10:48,679 --> 00:10:54,800
Speaker 1: Coming up, how do the Democrats start picking better candidates.

161
00:11:08,040 --> 00:11:11,200
Speaker 1: Kamala Harris was on the ticket for this election campaign

162
00:11:11,320 --> 00:11:16,040
Speaker 1: from the beginning as vice president. Then Joe Biden's debate

163
00:11:16,280 --> 00:11:17,520
Speaker 1: car crash happened.

164
00:11:19,040 --> 00:11:20,760
Speaker 5: Yeah, when I'm going to do to fix the Texas

165
00:11:20,800 --> 00:11:23,880
Speaker 5: for example, Oh, we had one thousand tillionaires an Antha

166
00:11:24,320 --> 00:11:25,720
Speaker 5: and a billionaires anthy.

167
00:11:26,559 --> 00:11:28,679
Speaker 1: He stepped down shortly afterwards.

168
00:11:29,640 --> 00:11:35,080
Speaker 3: Nothing, nothing can come in the way of saving our democracy.

169
00:11:35,240 --> 00:11:36,600
Speaker 6: That includes personal ambition.

170
00:11:38,280 --> 00:11:41,480
Speaker 1: So Harris had one hundred and seven days to try

171
00:11:41,520 --> 00:11:45,880
Speaker 1: to defeat Donald Trump. She certainly pulled the polls a

172
00:11:45,920 --> 00:11:50,080
Speaker 1: lot closer, and maybe she avoided a complete thrashing that

173
00:11:50,200 --> 00:11:53,640
Speaker 1: Biden would have suffered. But Democrats are now looking back

174
00:11:53,800 --> 00:11:57,560
Speaker 1: thinking maybe they should have held a primary process to

175
00:11:57,679 --> 00:12:03,080
Speaker 1: find a different candidate. So was Harris the wrong candidate?

176
00:12:04,400 --> 00:12:06,080
Speaker 5: I think there are a whole range of mistakes that

177
00:12:06,120 --> 00:12:10,959
Speaker 5: the Democrats made. There were big, overarching mistakes to smaller mistakes.

178
00:12:11,440 --> 00:12:16,520
Speaker 5: In terms of Harris herself, she didn't sufficiently differentiate herself

179
00:12:16,559 --> 00:12:20,160
Speaker 5: from Joe Biden. That was always a problem for her.

180
00:12:20,679 --> 00:12:23,160
Speaker 5: The campaign was too short, There wasn't enough time for

181
00:12:23,200 --> 00:12:27,120
Speaker 5: her to explain who she was to people. I think

182
00:12:27,520 --> 00:12:31,319
Speaker 5: the problem for her was there was no primary process.

183
00:12:31,520 --> 00:12:34,360
Speaker 5: She didn't have her feet held to the fire. And

184
00:12:34,440 --> 00:12:37,319
Speaker 5: it was a consistent theme that I picked up from

185
00:12:37,480 --> 00:12:40,280
Speaker 5: a voters on the ground. They felt that what happened

186
00:12:40,360 --> 00:12:44,680
Speaker 5: was undemocratic and that this undermined a lot of the

187
00:12:45,240 --> 00:12:48,800
Speaker 5: democratic attack on Donald Trump as a threat to democracy.

188
00:12:48,840 --> 00:12:53,439
Speaker 5: They kept saying, well, look at how Kamala Harris was elevated.

189
00:12:53,640 --> 00:12:56,880
Speaker 5: There was no primary process. This wasn't a democratic thing.

190
00:12:57,320 --> 00:13:00,480
Speaker 5: People were very concerned about that, and I think also

191
00:13:00,559 --> 00:13:04,960
Speaker 5: if you do look at the possible contenders. You have

192
00:13:05,240 --> 00:13:09,400
Speaker 5: Josh Shapiro, Gavin Newsom, Gretchen Whitmer. I think it's unlikely

193
00:13:09,800 --> 00:13:13,840
Speaker 5: if there was a proper primary campaign, that Kamala Harris

194
00:13:13,840 --> 00:13:18,120
Speaker 5: would have ended up running being the Democratic candidate. I

195
00:13:18,160 --> 00:13:20,959
Speaker 5: don't think she was the strongest person, but she got

196
00:13:21,240 --> 00:13:24,600
Speaker 5: the job. I think she was too negative. I think

197
00:13:24,640 --> 00:13:27,760
Speaker 5: those are the key problems. I think there are broader

198
00:13:28,400 --> 00:13:31,120
Speaker 5: cultural problems that the Democrats will have to come to

199
00:13:31,200 --> 00:13:33,920
Speaker 5: terms with, but I think the main problem is people

200
00:13:33,920 --> 00:13:37,160
Speaker 5: felt overlooked and they felt safe for going back to

201
00:13:37,360 --> 00:13:38,040
Speaker 5: Donald Trump.

202
00:13:45,920 --> 00:13:48,880
Speaker 1: Joe Keilly is covering the US election for The Australian.

203
00:13:51,080 --> 00:13:53,679
Speaker 1: On Friday, we'll be back right here with an episode

204
00:13:53,679 --> 00:13:57,000
Speaker 1: about Donald Trump two point zero, what we can really

205
00:13:57,040 --> 00:14:00,800
Speaker 1: expect from his administration and how much of his wild

206
00:14:01,000 --> 00:14:04,800
Speaker 1: talk will turn into policy. In the meantime, check out

207
00:14:04,840 --> 00:14:08,600
Speaker 1: all our journalism and analysis at The Australian dot com

208
00:14:08,640 --> 00:14:09,200
Speaker 1: dot au