WEBVTT - Trump threatens Australian medical research

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<v Speaker 1>Tonight, NBC News has obtained a memo ordering that all

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<v Speaker 1>references to quote gender ideology be removed across the federal government.

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<v Speaker 1>The deadline was about an hour and twenty minutes ago

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<v Speaker 1>at five pm Eastern Time, and.

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<v Speaker 2>The CDC is cutting off all communications with the World

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<v Speaker 2>Health Organization effective immediately. The movers to comply with the

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<v Speaker 2>executive order President Trump signed last week withdrawing the US

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<v Speaker 2>from the WHO.

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<v Speaker 1>The CDC website on youth LGBTQ mental health was up

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<v Speaker 1>and running January twenty third, but if you look today

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<v Speaker 1>you get a message that reads the page you're looking

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<v Speaker 1>for was not found.

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<v Speaker 3>Right now, there's a note to the top of all

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<v Speaker 3>web pages for the US Centers for Disease Control. It

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<v Speaker 3>says this website is being modified to comply with President

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<v Speaker 3>Trump's executive orders. Thousands of pages across US government websites

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<v Speaker 3>were also taken offline as they were scrubbed for mention

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<v Speaker 3>of gender, race, sexual orientation, and other terms the Trump

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<v Speaker 3>administration have banned. And this is just the start of

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<v Speaker 3>the Trump administration's attack on science. Donald Trump's flurry of

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<v Speaker 3>executive orders science since coming into office also threaten the

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<v Speaker 3>funding of any research projects they consider to promote quoke

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<v Speaker 3>gender ideology. From Schwartz Media, I'm Ruby Jones. This is

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<v Speaker 3>seven AM Today. Science journalist and contributor to the Saturday

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<v Speaker 3>paper Bianca no Grady on America's ideological war on science

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<v Speaker 3>and the implications for Australia. It's Wednesday, February twelve. So Viianka,

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<v Speaker 3>I'm hoping that you can help me unpack the impact

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<v Speaker 3>of Trump's orders and understand the situation right now because

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<v Speaker 3>so many organizations are affected in different ways. So to

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<v Speaker 3>begin with, can you tell me about the situation at

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<v Speaker 3>the Centers for Disease Control.

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<v Speaker 4>It's chaos, I think is probably the only word I

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<v Speaker 4>can think of. So the Centers for Disease Control, it's

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<v Speaker 4>the leading national science based organization for public health. So

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<v Speaker 4>its job is to track disease outbreaks, to collect data, to.

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<v Speaker 5>Analyze that data, to look at the who, what, why, how, all.

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<v Speaker 4>Of that of any diseases, and they look at not

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<v Speaker 4>just what's happening within the US, but beyond its borders.

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<v Speaker 5>So globally. It's particularly important at the moment because.

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<v Speaker 4>We've got bird flu or H five N one in birds,

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<v Speaker 4>which in the US has also spread into dairy cattle,

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<v Speaker 4>into cats, into foxes, and into humans. And at the moment,

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<v Speaker 4>it's not spreading between humans, but it's an evolving situation,

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<v Speaker 4>and it's a situation that has global implications. So a

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<v Speaker 4>whole heap of that data is being pulled off the

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<v Speaker 4>CDC website. They've been hit with the communications blackout, so

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<v Speaker 4>no public communications, no public speaking coming out of any

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<v Speaker 4>one at the CDC. The Trump administration has told federal

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<v Speaker 4>health agencies to pause external communications that include scientific reports

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<v Speaker 4>and health advisories.

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<v Speaker 5>The CDC at thea.

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<v Speaker 4>That extends to all of their publications, and the most

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<v Speaker 4>important of which is called the Morbidity and Mortality Weekly Report.

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<v Speaker 6>According to a copy of the data obtained by The

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<v Speaker 6>New York Times, the CDC pulled a part of the

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<v Speaker 6>report that said some cases of bird flu had infected

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<v Speaker 6>cats that in turn infected humans.

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<v Speaker 4>Scientists are banned from traveling, so they're not able to

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<v Speaker 4>attend meetings, meet with collaborators.

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<v Speaker 5>It's just, I mean, it's extraordinary.

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<v Speaker 4>This is a resource that, particularly during the pandemic, so

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<v Speaker 4>many people around the world relied on, from journalists to

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<v Speaker 4>doctors to politicians, and it's just it's vanishing in front

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<v Speaker 4>of our eyes, Like it's inconceivable how much of a

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<v Speaker 4>resource that is and how devastating its loss is going

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<v Speaker 4>to be.

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<v Speaker 3>And the CDC is not the only body in the

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<v Speaker 3>US affected. What else is happening?

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah, I mean, we've seen the attack on transgender healthcare.

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<v Speaker 4>We sort of knew that this was coming, but I

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<v Speaker 4>think it's still so deeply shocking to see an executive

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<v Speaker 4>order from the Presidential Office issued the day he was

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<v Speaker 4>sworn in, which was about defending women from gender ideology

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<v Speaker 4>extremism and restoring biological truths to the federal government. It

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<v Speaker 4>will henceforth be the official policy of the United States

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<v Speaker 4>government that there are only two genders, male and female.

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<v Speaker 4>That's led to a memorandum that came out of the

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<v Speaker 4>Office of Personnel Management which talked about that they have

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<v Speaker 4>to review all.

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<v Speaker 5>Agency programs, contracts, and grants and terminate any that promote

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<v Speaker 5>or inculcate gender ideology.

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<v Speaker 7>Key resources for health care providers are gone. Information about

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<v Speaker 7>gay and bisexual men and transgender people are gone. Pages

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<v Speaker 7>on racial disparities and HIV are gone.

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<v Speaker 4>All research papers that have been submitted for publication and

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<v Speaker 4>peer review journals are being retracted so that they can

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<v Speaker 4>be flagged for.

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<v Speaker 5>Terms including gender.

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<v Speaker 4>Any clinical study is going to reference gender because you

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<v Speaker 4>have to look at the sex and gender of your participants,

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<v Speaker 4>for example, to determine if they if they respond differently

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<v Speaker 4>to a drug based on their sex and on their gender.

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<v Speaker 3>So it's fair to say this is ideological rather than scientific.

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<v Speaker 4>Oh, absolutely, they're absolutely ideological. The Trump administration would like

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<v Speaker 4>to assert that there are only two biological sexes, which

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<v Speaker 4>is male and female, and that assertion is wrong. It's

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<v Speaker 4>actually scientifically incorrect. It's outdated, and it's dangerous. It ignores

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<v Speaker 4>decades of research, and it ignores decades of work that

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<v Speaker 4>has gone into actually trying to incorporate sex and gender

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<v Speaker 4>into medical research that's vital for public health.

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<v Speaker 5>And the idea that you can.

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<v Speaker 4>Simply rewrite biology and make this political ideological assertion, that's

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<v Speaker 4>one of the really what seems to be one of

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<v Speaker 4>the leading crusades that's going on here in terms of

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<v Speaker 4>science and medical research.

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<v Speaker 3>Right, And so, how is this crusade impacting the scientists themselves?

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<v Speaker 3>What is happening to them?

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<v Speaker 4>A lot of people are really concerned because one of

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<v Speaker 4>the executive wards was a freeze on all grants coming

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<v Speaker 4>out of US government, and that extended to all agencies

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<v Speaker 4>and particularly obviously captured the National Institutes of Health and

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<v Speaker 4>the National Science Foundation.

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<v Speaker 5>And so for five days there were quite a.

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<v Speaker 4>Few scientists in the US who were not able to

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<v Speaker 4>access their own paychecks.

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<v Speaker 2>Lucien and has learned that the Trump Whitehouse has rescinded

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<v Speaker 2>its freeze on federal aid. It comes up for widespread

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<v Speaker 2>confusion and conflicting messages on who would have been affected.

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<v Speaker 4>The freeze has been temporarily lifted. But how long that's

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<v Speaker 4>going to last is anyone's guess.

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<v Speaker 7>A federal judge said that President Donald Trump violated his

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<v Speaker 7>order that lifted a blanket freeze on federal spending and

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<v Speaker 7>again directed the administration to release the funds.

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<v Speaker 1>So the big question here ONMNA is does the Trump

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<v Speaker 1>administration comply with this judge's order?

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<v Speaker 3>I asked the White House. They didn't answer that question.

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<v Speaker 5>The scientists themselves.

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<v Speaker 4>They're just trying to keep on doing what they need

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<v Speaker 4>to do until they're told otherwise, you know. I mean,

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<v Speaker 4>the thing with scientific and clinical research is it's not

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<v Speaker 4>like you can just stop it and pick it back

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<v Speaker 4>up again in three months.

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<v Speaker 3>Time.

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<v Speaker 5>If you lose a cell line.

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<v Speaker 4>Or if you've got specially bred engineered mice and you

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<v Speaker 4>lose those, I mean that can terminate an entire study,

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<v Speaker 4>That can through years of research out the windows.

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<v Speaker 5>So I think, really.

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<v Speaker 4>What scientists are doing and what they have to do

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<v Speaker 4>is just keep going, just keep turning up to work,

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<v Speaker 4>you know. And there's a big effort underway that's being

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<v Speaker 4>led by a scientist in the US to essentially rescue

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<v Speaker 4>a lot of that information in those databases and make

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<v Speaker 4>it online somewhere else so that it's safe from destruction.

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<v Speaker 5>Who knows what's going to happen.

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<v Speaker 3>After the break, how Australian medical research could be under threat,

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<v Speaker 3>so Bianca. There's still a lot of confusion on exactly

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<v Speaker 3>how Trump's executive orders will affect federal grants and loans

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<v Speaker 3>for health and science research. But the White House Press

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<v Speaker 3>Secretary is saying that a review to eliminate spending on

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<v Speaker 3>woke ideology will proceed. So let's talk about what that

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<v Speaker 3>means for us here in Australia. How could that impact

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<v Speaker 3>research done here?

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<v Speaker 4>Well, it's it's a global impact because the US is

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<v Speaker 4>such a scientific and medical research powerhouse. The National Institutes

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<v Speaker 4>of Health, for example, is the single biggest public funder

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<v Speaker 4>of biomedical research in the world.

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<v Speaker 5>So Australia gets.

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<v Speaker 4>Probably somewhere between twenty and thirty million dollars worth of

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<v Speaker 4>grants from the NIH every year.

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<v Speaker 5>There's also the National Science Foundation.

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<v Speaker 4>There's also research funding that comes to Australia from the

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<v Speaker 4>Department of Defense. So all of these institutions have temporarily

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<v Speaker 4>frozen some of those grants, although there is some legal challenges.

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<v Speaker 5>To that, so that's sort of a little bit of

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<v Speaker 5>a movable feast.

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<v Speaker 4>We do know that, for example, Vick Thompson, who's CEO

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<v Speaker 4>of the Group of Eight, which represents Australia's eight leading

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<v Speaker 4>research intensive universities, they are getting advice around grants that

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<v Speaker 4>they've received from the US. There's going to be direct

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<v Speaker 4>effects on scientists in Australia who are funded by these organizations,

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<v Speaker 4>but there.

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<v Speaker 5>Will also be indirect effects on.

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<v Speaker 4>Their collaborators and this might lead to large scale clinical trials,

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<v Speaker 4>halting of new drugs. Studies that have been running for

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<v Speaker 4>decades might suddenly just go dark because lead investigators based

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<v Speaker 4>in the US might suddenly not be able to access funding.

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<v Speaker 4>I mean, it's very chaotic, and I think the impression

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<v Speaker 4>I get from the Australian scientific and medical research community

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<v Speaker 4>is they're very concerned. And we do have researchers in

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<v Speaker 4>Australia who are funded by institutions like the NIH in

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<v Speaker 4>one case specifically to look at an issue that does

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<v Speaker 4>relate to transgender health care.

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<v Speaker 3>Can you tell me about that and who you spoke to.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah, so Professor Aida Cheung, who is based at the

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<v Speaker 4>University of Melbourne. She's co lead on a project that's

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<v Speaker 4>looking at how gender affirming hormone therapy affects the immune system.

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<v Speaker 4>So obviously the face of it, that's really important for

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<v Speaker 4>transgender health care, but it's also really important for everybody

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<v Speaker 4>because we are all hormonal creatures and hormones have huge

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<v Speaker 4>impacts on the immune system. And you know, Professor Chung

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<v Speaker 4>has as far as I know, has not received any

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<v Speaker 4>information yet about what's happening with that grant, but that

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<v Speaker 4>is an ongoing grant from the National Institutes of.

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<v Speaker 3>Health, so she must be concerned.

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<v Speaker 5>Oh, absolutely absolutely.

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<v Speaker 4>I mean I think you know, anybody working in transgender

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<v Speaker 4>healthcare right now is concerned not just about what's happening

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<v Speaker 4>in the US, but even what's happening in Australia in

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<v Speaker 4>terms of.

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<v Speaker 5>Attacks on transgender health care here.

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<v Speaker 4>So this is part of a broader and a bigger

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<v Speaker 4>ideological war that's been going on for a long time.

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<v Speaker 5>It's just Trump has really stepped up the beat.

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<v Speaker 3>And so if Trump's attack on sciences continue in the US,

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<v Speaker 3>what do we need to be doing here in Australia

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<v Speaker 3>to protect research.

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<v Speaker 5>Well, I think we need to fund it better Australia.

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<v Speaker 4>I mean the number of times I hear people say

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<v Speaker 4>Australia punch is above its weight, and it does.

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<v Speaker 5>For the amount of funding we receive.

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<v Speaker 4>We do incredibly well on the world stage with science

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<v Speaker 4>and medical research, but we really need more funding. So

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<v Speaker 4>we need to be more independent with our science and

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<v Speaker 4>medical research funding. We are in the process of setting

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<v Speaker 4>up our own centers for disease control. That was one

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<v Speaker 4>of the recommendations that's come out of the COVID pandemic

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<v Speaker 4>is we need to have a resource like the CDC

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<v Speaker 4>that's here that's focused on the public health of Australians.

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<v Speaker 4>So I think this really turbocharge is the need for that.

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<v Speaker 5>Science.

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<v Speaker 4>It's a human endeavor and we are all operating in

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<v Speaker 4>a political environment. Science funding is highly politicized in Australia

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<v Speaker 4>as well. But I think the great thing about science

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<v Speaker 4>is it comes down to evidence.

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<v Speaker 5>It comes down to the facts.

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<v Speaker 4>To what the tests tell you, to what the surveys

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<v Speaker 4>tell you, to what the studies tell you. And you know,

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<v Speaker 4>I think within Australia we really have to hold the line.

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<v Speaker 4>We have to hold the line against the return of racism,

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<v Speaker 4>of sexism and misogyny, of transphobia, of queerphobia. We have

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<v Speaker 4>to hold the line against that coming into our science

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<v Speaker 4>and medical research. It was there for a long time

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<v Speaker 4>and it's taken a lot of progress and a lot

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<v Speaker 4>of effort to really address those bias.

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<v Speaker 5>In particularly in medical research.

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<v Speaker 4>And we just have to keep looking at those facts

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<v Speaker 4>and pull the line against this ideology coming out of

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<v Speaker 4>the US and stop it taking root here.

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<v Speaker 3>Bianca, thank you for your time.

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<v Speaker 5>Thank you.

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<v Speaker 3>Also in the news today, I just spoke to him,

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<v Speaker 3>very fine man and he has a surplus. President Trump

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<v Speaker 3>called Prime Minister Albanezi a quote very fine man.

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<v Speaker 5>After the Prime.

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<v Speaker 3>Minister made the case for Australia to be exempt from

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<v Speaker 3>Trump's twenty five percent tariffs on steel and aluminium. Trump

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<v Speaker 3>said he would give quote great consideration to exempting Australia

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<v Speaker 3>from the trade restrictions, despite already signing the executive orders

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<v Speaker 3>that claimed the tariffs were without exception or exemption. And

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<v Speaker 3>the ABC has withdrawn one of its arguments in Antonetta

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<v Speaker 3>Tufe's unlawful termination case. The Troop's lawyers argued that race

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<v Speaker 3>played a role in their decision to terminate her casual

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<v Speaker 3>position at ABC Radio Sydney. In response, the ABC's lawyers

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<v Speaker 3>had initially tried to argue there was no such thing

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<v Speaker 3>as quote Lebanese, Arab or Middle Eastern race. At the

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<v Speaker 3>start of Tuesday's hearing in the Federal Court, the ABC

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<v Speaker 3>updated its defense to accept those races exist. I'm Ruby Jones.

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<v Speaker 3>This is seven AM. Thanks for listening.