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Speaker 1: Approche production.

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Speaker 2: I can't say. Look, I was looking at ten years

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Speaker 2: and got six, and I was a prick for two

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Speaker 2: years that I had to learn to shut his fucking

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Speaker 2: mouth and just deal with it and move forward from it.

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Speaker 2: You had thirteen years, brother, thirteen years of constant kicks

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Speaker 2: in the guts.

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Speaker 1: And yet I could have went the other way.

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Speaker 2: But you know, one hundred percent, I don't know too

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Speaker 2: many men that wouldn't have gone that way.

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Speaker 1: But I've been That's what I'm saying. I've been blessed.

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Speaker 3: You know, when I say blessed, I believe that I've

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Speaker 3: been blessed because I had a lot of good people

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Speaker 3: around me, you know, like and that's why he molded me.

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Speaker 3: You know, the time that I spent in the first

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Speaker 3: couple of years, I was angry, but he molded me

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Speaker 3: into a softer person, and he made me look at

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Speaker 3: life a lot different more the years that I've done.

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Speaker 3: You know, it should have made me more miss he

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Speaker 3: should have made me miserable. But what he done, he

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Speaker 3: blossoed me. You know, it was like a flower and

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Speaker 3: it came from nothing.

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Speaker 4: You know, I don't remember in the in the slot

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Speaker 4: whatever call them, is it some flowers, then orange little

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Speaker 4: I remember in the conk from like a crack concrete.

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Speaker 1: They used to come out some flowers.

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Speaker 3: And I used to look at it, and I'm thinking,

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Speaker 3: in the hardest place in the world or just all

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Speaker 3: concrete everywhere, it was still beauty. And it was like,

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Speaker 3: look what he had to go through to blossom lot

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Speaker 3: to just like to open his arms and just like

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Speaker 3: to become the of the flower it was, you know,

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Speaker 3: to call it Sun's flower, you know.

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Speaker 1: And I used to look at it and I'm thinking, out,

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Speaker 1: that's what That's what I wanted to know.

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Speaker 3: I don't want this joint to make me a miserable person.

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Speaker 3: I don't want this want to make me hard. You know,

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Speaker 3: a lot of guys to come out of a job.

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Speaker 3: I'm a tough camp whatever, you know, because the time whatever.

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Speaker 3: But what for men like at the end of the day,

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Speaker 3: on all these guys you're trying to impress, You're not

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Speaker 3: going to know him five years, is not.

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Speaker 1: Going to know him ten years. This guy's not going

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Speaker 1: to come here.

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Speaker 2: No one cares about the wall stones.

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Speaker 4: You know.

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Speaker 3: And and to me it was like, you know what,

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Speaker 3: I want to leave a mark in this world and

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Speaker 3: I want people.

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Speaker 1: I want to live.

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Speaker 3: When I say I want to live forever, I want

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Speaker 3: my my my story and my soul to live forever

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Speaker 3: because I want I wanted to live for others in

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Speaker 3: the sense of your leave.

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Speaker 1: When you live a mark with someone.

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Speaker 3: They carry that, They carry that and pay it forward

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Speaker 3: and it's it's it's you living through them.

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Speaker 1: Even if you pass away, you still live. Can I

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Speaker 1: ask you something?

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Speaker 2: Yes, you have dreams of having a family children.

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Speaker 1: I want a big family now, I want six seven kids.

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Speaker 2: Got me good, bro, got me good?

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Speaker 1: Got me real good?

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Speaker 3: M hm.

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Speaker 2: Your legal team A lot of people get sacked that

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Speaker 2: representing people convicted wrongly.

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Speaker 1: You know a lot of a lot of people go through.

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Speaker 2: Different barristers, different lawyers, just turn them over. Can I

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Speaker 2: can I ask without being rude and please tell me

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Speaker 2: you do?

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Speaker 1: I have to answer it.

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Speaker 2: But how have you been able to maintain that that

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Speaker 2: that affording that too? I mean that's hundreds and hundreds

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Speaker 2: of thousands of dollars.

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Speaker 3: My family suffered a lot. Yeah, they gave up a

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Speaker 3: lot to fight for my freedom. You know when I

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Speaker 3: will never forget it. Whatever I do in life, would

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Speaker 3: never pay back what they've done. For me, you know,

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Speaker 3: and the suffering and everything else they're going through. And

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Speaker 3: my lawyers, my first lawyer, Bill Douges, he's he's a

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Speaker 3: beautiful man. I remember after my trial, I left the

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Speaker 3: firm like because I was so upset. It wasn't his fault.

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Speaker 3: I went to a different firm. And I've done what

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Speaker 3: they've done and didn't get the verdict. And and Bill

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Speaker 3: even Christmas times and that I'm a Muslim and all,

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Speaker 3: like would I celebrate Christmas.

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Speaker 1: But the end of the day, he used to send me

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Speaker 1: Christmas cards. I used to send him Christmas cards.

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Speaker 3: You know.

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Speaker 1: He used to write me letters.

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Speaker 3: You know, you know, you guys, I'm gonna I'm gonna

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Speaker 3: make sure that your name gets cleared. And I'll never

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Speaker 3: forget that, you know. And yeah, he's still with me now,

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Speaker 3: finding the killing my name. And I remember even after

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Speaker 3: my trial, he wrote, he wrote this beautiful letter and

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Speaker 3: put it up on his law firm, and I'll never

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Speaker 3: forget it.

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Speaker 1: Like my sister read it to me.

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Speaker 3: And he said, you know, I didn't do a trial

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Speaker 3: after yours for a very long time.

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Speaker 1: And he affected him. He goes in some cases.

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Speaker 3: In life where you don't get over it, and he

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Speaker 3: goes one of your cases, one of them things. He

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Speaker 3: goes because I truly believe and I know that you're innocent,

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Speaker 3: and he goes and I never will give up on you.

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Speaker 1: And he's still here fighting for me.

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Speaker 3: Now you know.

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Speaker 1: And he's a beautiful man.

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Speaker 3: And yeah, Bill Dougs, it's O'Brien and Dugs in Melbourne,

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Speaker 3: very very good lawyer. If you ever looking for anything,

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Speaker 3: and if.

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Speaker 1: You ever looking for a lawyer, look up Bill Dougs.

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Speaker 1: He's a great man. And yeah, a great team. I've

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Speaker 1: got a great team now, very special human to be

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Speaker 1: still there.

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Speaker 2: Now what are we going into?

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Speaker 3: Now?

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Speaker 1: How many years?

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Speaker 3: Fifteen years he's been with me?

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Speaker 2: How far at the moment do you feel you are

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Speaker 2: with getting closer to your innocence?

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Speaker 3: This year?

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Speaker 2: Closure?

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Speaker 1: Yeah? Closure? Are you able to pursue it?

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Speaker 2: Found not guilty?

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Speaker 3: Yeah, that's what that's that's all we were looking for.

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Speaker 3: This is how I look at it. All all the

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Speaker 3: money in the world ain't going to bring that time back.

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Speaker 3: All I want to do and I've said it from

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Speaker 3: day one, Yeah, I just want to clean my name.

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Speaker 3: The way, the way I'm going to live. I can

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Speaker 3: make money. You know, and that's the honest truth. I

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Speaker 3: hear with my with my career and what everything I've

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Speaker 3: been through, and I'll write a book whatever I don't.

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Speaker 1: I don't need any handouts, you know, like I survived.

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Speaker 1: I've survived this long. I don't need anyone to help

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Speaker 1: me in that sense.

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Speaker 3: You know.

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Speaker 2: I think, I think from from the point of view

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Speaker 2: of hearing your story and how beautiful and supportive your

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Speaker 2: family have been.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I know for me, people like you lost a lot.

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Speaker 3: You know that may be taken a lot, but they

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Speaker 3: gave me more than they've ever taken. And people never

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Speaker 3: I can never explain that properly. They made it. They

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Speaker 3: might have taken a bit, but they gave me more

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Speaker 3: than they're ever taken because they made me the man

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Speaker 3: that I am right now.

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Speaker 1: That molded me into this person.

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Speaker 3: And I'm very thankful for that because the way I

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Speaker 3: look at life and the way I live my life,

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Speaker 3: I'm very thankful for that.

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Speaker 2: Because can I can I ask you going back to

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Speaker 2: because you know you were selected for the Commonwealth common

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Speaker 2: Wealth Games naturally and I'm only just speculating here, so

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Speaker 2: pull me up. They would have wiped it like a

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Speaker 2: dirty ass you were just that's it gone. You're a criminal,

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Speaker 2: you're a murderer. We can't have any communication contact whatsoever.

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Speaker 2: He's gone done, not wait for a verdict. You're just gone.

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Speaker 2: You're finished.

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Speaker 3: They came and they came and testify against against Smith

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Speaker 3: or like to them, it was the prosecution, brang the

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Speaker 3: Olympic Board against me Insida. He was an Australian champion,

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Speaker 3: blah blah blah. It had nothing to do with the case.

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Speaker 3: But they bring him up.

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Speaker 2: To me, it was like whatever, so you could be

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Speaker 2: seen as some sort of lethal weapon that was actually

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Speaker 2: there in a violent act, that had some sort of

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Speaker 2: connection with what was going on. They wanted you to

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Speaker 2: be portrayed as this machine, this this this dark man

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Speaker 2: with this fighting ability that could have caused this to happen.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and that's why when I came out, that's why

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Speaker 3: I didn't go back to the amateurs to you for

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Speaker 3: you to go to the Comwell or the Olympics.

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Speaker 1: Year, stay amateur.

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Speaker 3: And even if I came home, this is how I

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Speaker 3: looked at Even if I came home and I bet

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Speaker 3: every person in front of me, they would never select

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Speaker 3: me to go to the games because it's under the

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Speaker 3: it's their choice to select me. It doesn't matter. And

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Speaker 3: I looked at I'm not going to waste my time

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Speaker 3: sitting here after one one and bet all the all

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Speaker 3: the fight is for them to say no, you can't know.

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Speaker 3: I said to myself, I'm gonna turn, pray, I'm gonna

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Speaker 3: be in them more, and I'm gonna do it.

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Speaker 1: Take my TV again here, I fucking have it.

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Speaker 3: I'm gonna do it the way I want to do it.

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Speaker 3: When I turn, I'll do what I want to do.

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Speaker 3: I want to fight that they can't hold me down.

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Speaker 3: The only the only person who's going to beat me,

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Speaker 3: no one.

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Speaker 1: You know.

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Speaker 2: Like I said, I know that we're getting to that

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Speaker 2: point where we probably shouldn't go too much further into

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Speaker 2: what now is going to happen. So I do want

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Speaker 2: to sort of close that that part of our journey

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Speaker 2: together today and really start to focus on some really

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Speaker 2: positive stuff that I think people are going to love

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Speaker 2: to hear of where you are today and you know

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Speaker 2: what's happening.

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Speaker 3: But I honestly believe after all the laws have changed

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Speaker 3: and everything now like the truth it's going to come

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Speaker 3: out right now.

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Speaker 1: I'm a convictim murderer.

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Speaker 3: And that's the and that's the troop about it, Like,

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Speaker 3: let's not out of.

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Speaker 1: It right now. I am.

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Speaker 3: I'm still a convicted murderer in the court of the law,

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Speaker 3: the under the law, I'm a convicted murder. Me.

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Speaker 1: I know that I'm an innocent man. And it's gonna

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Speaker 1: come out.

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Speaker 2: Life starting again for mister Baker.

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Speaker 1: Now, I said, life never stopped, never.

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Speaker 3: Stop, all right, I love it, I love it all right.

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Speaker 1: Let me rewind.

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Speaker 3: Life has never stopped.

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Speaker 1: For mister Kulibaka.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, life never stopped because you got to remember life

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Speaker 3: is not about all the good times. Life is about

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Speaker 3: the rollercase st Yeah, we've got to remember, like you're

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Speaker 3: gonna have your ups and downs.

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Speaker 1: That's a part of life. And people always say, oh,

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Speaker 1: I know the good times and good times. Listen, you've

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Speaker 1: gotta go through the ship to enjoy the good.

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Speaker 3: If you always have it good and you go have

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Speaker 3: some ship times, you never come out of it because

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Speaker 3: you've never been for harship.

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Speaker 1: You never how to survive