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Speaker 1: What is incredible is the workload that the energy ombardsman

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Speaker 1: is dealing with at the moment. As we know, cost

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Speaker 1: of living. We've talked about that a lot over the

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Speaker 1: last couple of years, and we're clearly struggling across the

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Speaker 1: state with paying energy and water bills because the Energy

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Speaker 1: and Water Mbudsman's office has been inundated. Fifty eight percent

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Speaker 1: increase in the number of people calling through with payment difficulties.

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Speaker 1: The ombudsman is Sandy Kinali, and he joins me now, Sandy,

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Speaker 1: good mining, Good morning, Matthew. This is not good news, obviously,

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Speaker 1: but it is. We know this is happening. Cost of living,

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Speaker 1: it's hurting, and obviously people explaining that as they call.

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Speaker 2: You, they do, and quite often they present with a

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Speaker 2: because their bill, they've just received it and it's significantly

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Speaker 2: higher than they were perhaps anticipating or expecting, and they're

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Speaker 2: wanting to ensure that it is accurate. And quite often

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Speaker 2: when we sort of peel things back, there's a couple

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Speaker 2: of factors which are at play there. In most cases,

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Speaker 2: the bill is accurate, but perhaps they're not sitting on

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Speaker 2: the best plan that they could be on. So that's

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Speaker 2: a reason why perhaps they're paying a little more than

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Speaker 2: they would. Some of those customers have been moved to

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Speaker 2: a different TWERFF structure, a time of view structure, and

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Speaker 2: they're not shifting their usage into those cheaper time slots,

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Speaker 2: So that also has been a contributing factor. And then

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Speaker 2: there are just some customers who are having difficulty in

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Speaker 2: making ends meet, and for those customers, it's a question

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Speaker 2: of making sure that they have access to the retailers

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Speaker 2: programs that support customers who just simply are unable to

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Speaker 2: pay their bill. And that's the point that I would

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Speaker 2: make quite strongly that all all retailers are obligated to

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Speaker 2: have programs in place to assist customers. And that can

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Speaker 2: be in different ways. It can be short term. You know,

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Speaker 2: I've got some cash flow issues and I need a

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Speaker 2: couple of months to pay the bill. There are others

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Speaker 2: who perhaps have more long term issues, a lots of employment,

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Speaker 2: or there might be, you know, some change in the

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Speaker 2: family situation, and they go on to longer term programs

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Speaker 2: where they're able to manage their consumption over that period

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Speaker 2: of time and hopefully get back onto the mainstream.

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Speaker 1: All right now, I imagine electricity is probably the biggest

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Speaker 1: for one of a better term offender in this regard.

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Speaker 1: In terms of numbers, ringing in.

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Speaker 2: Oh, you're absolutely correct. It made up probably two thirds

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Speaker 2: of our total complaint based about eighty three percent. Behigh

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Speaker 2: that eighty three percent. We're all electricity, and that's predominantly

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Speaker 2: because it impacts and just about every household. Gas account

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Speaker 2: for about twelve percent, and then water at about five percent,

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Speaker 2: which probably because it's more a bill which is paid

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Speaker 2: by the owner of the property rather than the occupier,

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Speaker 2: and there's not those transfers in and out each day

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Speaker 2: like you have with gas and electricity. Where As you

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Speaker 2: move into a premise or vacated premise, you need to

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Speaker 2: communicate with your retailer.

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Speaker 1: Okay. I've always had the view Sandy that, particularly with plans,

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Speaker 1: you say, people might not be on the right plan

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Speaker 1: and need to look at that. But when you do

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Speaker 1: get on a plan and eventually what twelve months, most

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Speaker 1: of them they come off. I reckon the retailer should

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Speaker 1: be sending a letter out or a phone call saying

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Speaker 1: your plan has ended, what would you like to do?

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Speaker 1: Because you're going to get the higher tariffs and it's

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Speaker 1: beyond me as to why they don't automatically give you

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Speaker 1: the best deal as a requirement, you know, almost needs

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Speaker 1: to be legislated that they give you the best deal

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Speaker 1: rather than have you sat on an expensive plan.

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Speaker 2: Here, there's a couple of things there, Matt, and you

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Speaker 2: raise a good point they do. They do generally advise

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Speaker 2: you that your plan is coming to an end. And

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Speaker 2: what they might advise you is that you know they

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Speaker 2: have other plans available which may be okay for that

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Speaker 2: particular retailer. And also retailers are obligated to actually tell

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Speaker 2: you on the bill whether there might be a better

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Speaker 2: plan for you. I think that's every quarter at least

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Speaker 2: they need to advise you that they might that they

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Speaker 2: may have a better plan. The problem with that is

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Speaker 2: that that might be their best plan, but it may

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Speaker 2: not be the best plan in the market. And you

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Speaker 2: can do a lot better than that by having a

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Speaker 2: bit of a shop around. And I know that term seems,

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Speaker 2: you know, thrown around a fair bit, and it's not

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Speaker 2: always simple to compare one plan with the other. But

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Speaker 2: Energy made Easy is a good website to have a

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Speaker 2: look at because all the retailers are obligated to provide

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Speaker 2: their plans to the regulator and they run that website

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Speaker 2: and it does give you some indication of what might

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Speaker 2: be best for you at this particular point in time,

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Speaker 2: but it does change, so it is worth doing a

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Speaker 2: review at least every twelve months. And also understanding your

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Speaker 2: tarwerff structure. You know, you may be on what's what

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Speaker 2: I deem to be a flat tariff where you know

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Speaker 2: you pay energy consistently. It might be you might have

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Speaker 2: an off peak on that and just to peek rate,

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Speaker 2: but a lot of customers have been moved to what's

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Speaker 2: called a time of use tariff. And with that type

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Speaker 2: of tariff, and this is explained on the back of

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Speaker 2: your bill, you need to be aware of when energy

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Speaker 2: is going to cost you the most and when it's

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Speaker 2: going to cost you the least. Now, the supplementary of that,

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Speaker 2: of course is well that's great. But you know, if

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Speaker 2: ten to three during the day is the best time

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Speaker 2: for me to use my energy because it's the cheapest,

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Speaker 2: it doesn't particularly suit my lifestyle. That might be a

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Speaker 2: valid reason. But you might be able to shift some

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Speaker 2: of your usage into that period if you can run

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Speaker 2: your washing machine, your dishwasher, your pool pumps and those

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Speaker 2: sort of energy intensive appliances into those cheaper time slots.

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Speaker 2: That willing itself also help mitigate some of your costs.

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Speaker 2: So there's a couple of things to sort of be

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Speaker 2: aware of and to understand. If you have solar, if

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Speaker 2: your thoughts enough to have solar, you know, make sure

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Speaker 2: that you make use of that at the times of

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Speaker 2: the day where it's generating at its peak. And there's

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Speaker 2: generally a view that you know, I'm concerned about what

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Speaker 2: I feedback into the grids. Yes, that's great and fine.

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Speaker 2: But if you can offset your forty eight cents or

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Speaker 2: your fifty cents with something that's virtually free unless the

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Speaker 2: cost of the unit that you put in the first place,

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Speaker 2: you're going to be way way ahead. So don't be

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Speaker 2: so concerned about what you're push into the grid. Be

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Speaker 2: more concerned about using that energy at that time to

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Speaker 2: do the things you need to do.

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Speaker 1: Water. Now, water accounted for five percent of people calling in.

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Speaker 1: Are you expecting that to increase with the government suggesting

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Speaker 1: not suggesting, telling us that water prices are going up

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Speaker 1: as they pay for infrastructure in coming months.

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Speaker 2: Look, we haven't seen that at this stage. With water,

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Speaker 2: it's more generally to be around connections or access to

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Speaker 2: services and things like that. The pricing element hasn't really

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Speaker 2: come into the equation, are they And I'm talking about

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Speaker 2: say water in particularly here, they have a good program

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Speaker 2: of support for customers as well, and we don't get

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Speaker 2: to see many of those cases coming to us because

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Speaker 2: one of the first things that we ask all customers

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Speaker 2: to do is to obviously give the supply whether it

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Speaker 2: be water, gas or electricity, and opportunity to resolve the complaint.

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Speaker 2: If that doesn't work, then you come to us. And

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Speaker 2: I guess in the water space that seems to be

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Speaker 2: working generally.

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Speaker 1: Quite well, all right. So if people want to get

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Speaker 1: in touch Sandy, how do they do that? What's the

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Speaker 1: best way to If they've got concerns with their bill

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Speaker 1: and you'd want them, you'd expect them to have got

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Speaker 1: in touch with their provider first, particularly if it is

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Speaker 1: billing inquiry or really anything first than you're the last resort.

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Speaker 2: Absolutely always gives them an opportunity because the vast majority

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Speaker 2: of times things can be resolved quite quickly just by

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Speaker 2: communicating with your with your provider. My number is one

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Speaker 2: eight hundred six sixty five five sixty five and one

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Speaker 2: other thing that I should have mentioned to Matthew is

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Speaker 2: you know, sometimes billing issues arise because they're receiving an

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Speaker 2: estimated bill. They're receiving an estimated bill because obviously the

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Speaker 2: meta reader wasn't able to get onto the property to

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Speaker 2: read the meter. You can if you just check your bill,

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Speaker 2: it'll have a knee around the me to read number

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Speaker 2: or an a if it's actual, and bring them give

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Speaker 2: them your details before the due date and they must

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Speaker 2: substitute your bill for you as well. Okay, if you

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Speaker 2: don't want to pay on an estimate, but even with

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Speaker 2: an estimate, once the bill is actually once the meter

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Speaker 2: sorry is actually read, you'll pay no more or no less.

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Speaker 2: It's just like the odameter or a car. It moves

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Speaker 2: forward and you're part of that time. Keep that in mind.

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Speaker 2: But yes, and also if you need some help to

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Speaker 2: understand what you might want to do in terms of

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Speaker 2: accessing different plans and whatever else. Obviously were an independent body.

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Speaker 2: We can't recommend anyone, but we can certainly help see

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Speaker 2: you on the right path. We have a lot of

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Speaker 2: resources on our website as well where you can access

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Speaker 2: information which might help you understand the market a little bit.

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Speaker 2: More and the sort of things you might be able

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Speaker 2: to do to help get your consumption down as well.

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Speaker 1: And a question that's just come through smart meters, how

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Speaker 1: are they working? Are you getting complaints about that?

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Speaker 2: No, not about the meters themselves. Generally, the meters doing

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Speaker 2: what they've meant to do that they record energy. It's

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Speaker 2: more the tariff structure that goes with the smart meter.

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Speaker 2: You know, as I said before, most of us have

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Speaker 2: grown up with a consistent rate that we pay for energy.

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Speaker 2: It might be a peak rate and off peak. Now

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Speaker 2: with smart meaters, a lot of customers have been moved

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Speaker 2: to this time of use, which has generally three different

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Speaker 2: price bands, a shoulder, peak and off peak. And you

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Speaker 2: know that can have an impact if you're not moving

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Speaker 2: your consumption around to meet those times. But the meters

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Speaker 2: themselves are not really generating many complaints other than you know,

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Speaker 2: there might be a delay sometimes in getting a meter installed.

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Speaker 1: Okay, all right, Sandy, appreciate your time this morning, my pleasure.

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Speaker 1: Sandy Canali, who is the energy umbudsman