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Speaker 1: I get a team. It's ups, it's it's Nicole Morrison,

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Speaker 1: it's Tiffany and Cook, it's us, it's you. It's the

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Speaker 1: fucking new Project for the fifteen hundred and thirtieth time,

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Speaker 1: or something like that. Tippany an Cook over there with

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Speaker 1: the wrong promo behind her, as is always the way,

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Speaker 1: not representing the U Project at all, but some opposition podcast.

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Speaker 1: I will not even mention the name of Hi Tiv.

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Speaker 2: I'll be sure to snip out a visual promo from

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Speaker 2: this one then, if I've decked it out the right way. Really,

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Speaker 2: will you make hay while the sun shines?

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Speaker 1: Will you? I see what you're doing there using my

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Speaker 1: show to promote your show, Like, oh my god, did

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Speaker 1: I leave that up?

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Speaker 3: That happened? Oh?

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Speaker 1: How did that exactly? Nicole? You know what she's up to.

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Speaker 1: There's a bit of subterfuge. I'm not even sure what

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Speaker 1: that means, but I think it's I don't know, Tiv,

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Speaker 1: what's going on over there at you Central.

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Speaker 2: Oh it's been a busy old time. I feel like

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Speaker 2: I haven't seen you for so long already. I feel

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Speaker 2: like it's been days and days.

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Speaker 1: Well, you and I normally do three and sometimes four

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Speaker 1: podcasts a week. As we record this, it's it's heading

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Speaker 1: towards three pm on Wednesday, avough, and we've done fuck

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Speaker 1: all in the industry in one another. No, no, well,

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Speaker 1: here we are to remedy that. Nicole Nikki Morrison.

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Speaker 3: Hi hllo, here you going.

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Speaker 1: I'm well, very good. That's beautiful audio you've got there.

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Speaker 1: That's beautiful. Now it's two thirty nine. As I said,

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Speaker 1: I think I rang you at about two twenty three,

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Speaker 1: which would be yeah, sixteen sixteen minutes ago, and I said,

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Speaker 1: do you can't do a podcast? And you went, oh

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Speaker 1: sure when? And I went about now? Then you went,

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Speaker 1: oh right.

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Speaker 3: Okay, then I'm going to get a call at this

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Speaker 3: time okay, and I wait for it.

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Speaker 1: Yeah exactly. Yeah. What he's not ringing because he loves me,

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Speaker 1: He's ring because he wants something.

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Speaker 3: Yees.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that's my way at least. I'm as long as

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Speaker 1: you're transfer.

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Speaker 3: Straight about it, exactly exactly.

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Speaker 1: So a month or two ago you and I were

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Speaker 1: chatting about a condition. Do we call it a condition?

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Speaker 3: Yeah?

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Speaker 1: So we call it a condition that I've never heard of,

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Speaker 1: which that doesn't mean much, but for a bloke I

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Speaker 1: probably know a fair bit about women's physiology and medical

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Speaker 1: conditions and biology, because I spent the best part of

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Speaker 1: forty years training more women than I did men, including

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Speaker 1: elite athletes, more women than men, and a lot of

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Speaker 1: the general public. Huge amount of my work was with

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Speaker 1: the general public, and as I said to you before,

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Speaker 1: you know, dealing with you know, or working with women

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Speaker 1: who were going through menopause, perimenopause and you know, younger

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Speaker 1: women and women with eating disorders who are a men

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Speaker 1: a rehea because did I say that correctly, who don't

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Speaker 1: have their period, and women who suffer from postpartum depression

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Speaker 1: and all of those things that you know, women have

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Speaker 1: to deal with and navigate at various stages of their

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Speaker 1: kind of journey. And so it was a steep learning

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Speaker 1: curve for me over the years, especially when I was

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Speaker 1: in my twenties and was even more of an idiot

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Speaker 1: than I am now and trying to you know, that's

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Speaker 1: one of the really interesting things as a young trainer,

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Speaker 1: working with people with issues that you're never going to

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Speaker 1: have right and trying to understand that and then support

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Speaker 1: them through that. But anyway, one day you were feeling shit,

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Speaker 1: correct me if I'm wrong, and we were chatting and

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Speaker 1: you told me that you have that you suffer from

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Speaker 1: a thing called pre menstrual dysphoric disorder. Did I get

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Speaker 1: that right?

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Speaker 3: Yeah? You did?

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Speaker 1: You ever heard of that? Tiff night?

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Speaker 3: Yeah? Many ends?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, me too. So let's let's start with the obvious.

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Speaker 1: What is it? Okay?

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Speaker 3: So, a lot of women suffer from pre minstu symptoms

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Speaker 3: prior to their menstrual cycle kicking in. And that can

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Speaker 3: be anything from having certain food craving, so then bit tied, fling,

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Speaker 3: bit luck, whatever the case may be. Pre menstr dysphoric

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Speaker 3: disorder is all of that on steroids.

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Speaker 1: Wow.

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Speaker 3: And it lasts. It sort of kicks in about a

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Speaker 3: few days before your cycle is meant to kick in,

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Speaker 3: and then it lasts several days after the cycle ends.

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Speaker 3: So it kind of feels like you might feel normal

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Speaker 3: for two weeks out of every four weeks.

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Speaker 1: Wow. Yeah, And so sometimes half of your life you're

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Speaker 1: kind of dealing with this.

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Speaker 3: Oh gotcha? Absolutely?

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Speaker 1: Wow.

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Speaker 3: And that's and for me, as I've gotten older, the

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Speaker 3: symptoms got more intense in terms of For me, it

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Speaker 3: was migraines, nausea, just incredible helvic pain, and just anxiety.

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Speaker 3: Depression moods. It was like I became a different person

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Speaker 3: and then it had stopped, and I sort of look

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Speaker 3: back and go, what the hell was that? What just

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Speaker 3: happened there? Because I didn't know what was happening, I

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Speaker 3: didn't think to connect the dots as I just went

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Speaker 3: through that for years, and I learned about premature disphoric

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Speaker 3: disorder purely by chance when I was talking to a

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Speaker 3: girl who's actually a patient that I was caring for

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Speaker 3: at the time, and she was starting to explain some

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Speaker 3: of the symptoms that she had and I'm like, yeah,

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Speaker 3: I kind of get that too, and she's like, Nikki,

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Speaker 3: it's a real thing. I'm like, what do you mean.

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Speaker 3: I thought it was just me just being me and

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Speaker 3: me just having to deal with it. She's like, no,

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Speaker 3: it's an actual condition called pre minster hisphoric disorder. I

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Speaker 3: belonged to a research group about it. I belonged to

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Speaker 3: a support group about it. It's starting to get more

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Speaker 3: traction in terms of being known in Australia and in

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Speaker 3: terms of psychologists starting to do more research into it

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Speaker 3: and how to treat it and manage it. And that's

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Speaker 3: where I started to learn about it. But Prior to that,

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Speaker 3: I've just been trying to survive. Really, I have a

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Speaker 3: confession I have. I was familiar with PMDDY. I just

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Speaker 3: was googling, went, oh, this is the yes, so I

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Speaker 3: actually am familiar with it.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's and.

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Speaker 3: Look, there's a whole range of symptoms that A lists

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Speaker 3: and you know, everyone's going to have their own experience

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Speaker 3: of that, and you won't necessarily have all of the symptoms.

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Speaker 3: I had like a handful of them, and others will

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Speaker 3: have different ones. But it's thanks acutally well. In my experience,

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Speaker 3: it took over my life and was exhausting to the

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Speaker 3: point where I thought something that had changed one wow.

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Speaker 3: You know.

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Speaker 1: You know what's interesting is before we progress, everyone Nicky

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Speaker 1: was worried. Before we not worried, but just concerned that

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Speaker 1: this would be confused with medical advice. This is not

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Speaker 1: medical advice, This is not a recommendation. This is just

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Speaker 1: this is really an education for me and maybe for

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Speaker 1: some of you around something yeah, and trying to open

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Speaker 1: the door on awareness and understanding and you know, maybe

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Speaker 1: we can push the needle a little bit on something

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Speaker 1: in their space, which is what I want to do.

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Speaker 1: But you know what's ironic is so you've been a

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Speaker 1: nurse for a long time and you're a high level nurse,

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Speaker 1: you're very qualified, and you also you're a death dueler,

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Speaker 1: and you do you work with people at the end

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Speaker 1: stage of life, and you work with cancer patients and

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Speaker 1: you do a lot of amazing But you had a

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Speaker 1: patient teach you about.

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Speaker 3: I know, it was literally were she was about coming

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Speaker 3: to the clinic, and I went out to the waiting

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Speaker 3: room just to have a chat with her before she

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Speaker 3: came in to see the consultants. And you know, we've

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Speaker 3: become good friends along the way, and yeah, she was

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Speaker 3: just telling me about some of the things that she'd

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Speaker 3: been experiencing and just surely happened by chance. And it

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Speaker 3: was like, oh my gosh, maybe it's not just me.

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Speaker 3: Maybe this isn't all in my head. Maybe this isn't

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Speaker 3: me just being weird. Maybe this is an actual thing.

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Speaker 3: And from that day on, I just felt relief.

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Speaker 1: Tell us about your experience, Nikki, up until that point

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Speaker 1: in time, because I mean, we had this chat months ago,

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Speaker 1: but I feel like you told me that basically, some people, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: some experts in inverted commas that you've been see have

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Speaker 1: kind of like, you know, you know, jog it out,

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Speaker 1: it's in your mind, or it's like you're overreacting. All

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Speaker 1: women go through this like chill out and stop being

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Speaker 1: a big baby kind of.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, when it was getting really bad, sort of into

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Speaker 3: my mid to late thirties, I was really starting to look,

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Speaker 3: look at this is taking over my life. I can't

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Speaker 3: function like this anymore. So I started to you know,

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Speaker 3: I speak to different endocrinologists and different medical medical professionals

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Speaker 3: in sort of the gynecology area, and often, don't get

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Speaker 3: me wrong, somewhere wonderful. But I had to get through

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Speaker 3: a lot of hoops before I found people who would

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Speaker 3: believe me and support me and provide me with the

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Speaker 3: management that I needed to.

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Speaker 1: What does that mean? Tell us about the hoops that

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Speaker 1: you had to get through. Can you give us? Is

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Speaker 1: it just just that they didn't believe you?

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Speaker 3: Yeah. I remember clearly sitting in one GP's office and

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Speaker 3: I was practically in tears in front of us, saying,

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Speaker 3: this is my life. I'm not functioning. I'm going to

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Speaker 3: have a breakdown if it's something doesn't happen, And she

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Speaker 3: just said, you're thinking about it too much, and I

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Speaker 3: was like, right, so that occasions like that were really

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Speaker 3: demoralizing and disheartening, but also just I admitted, you know,

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Speaker 3: stand up for myself because as a nurse I've encouraged

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Speaker 3: patients to be their own advocate and to have their

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Speaker 3: own voice. And I thought, I've got to do this

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Speaker 3: for me now and and not give up, and not

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Speaker 3: give up. And thankfully, you know, going through a lot

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Speaker 3: of different specialists and trying so many different medications and

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Speaker 3: that often made me worse, but you know, that was

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Speaker 3: all part of the experience and in terms of trial

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Speaker 3: and errorfying it find out what I actually needed to

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Speaker 3: deal with my particular case. Yeah, it's been a long

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Speaker 3: journey than many years, but thankfully in the end I

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Speaker 3: met with specialists who were compassionate and listened to me

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Speaker 3: and understanding and believed me and took me seriously.

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Speaker 1: So where did you start?

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Speaker 3: Like what?

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Speaker 1: So finally somebody listened and I mean, are there I

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Speaker 1: guess there is, but are there people who specialize in

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Speaker 1: this or you know, in all this is within their

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Speaker 1: speciality where they deal with this, and they went did

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Speaker 1: somebody go, no, Nicole, this is absolutely real and you're

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Speaker 1: not crazy, And yeah, right, tell us a bit about

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Speaker 1: that that person and that process.

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Speaker 3: My friend who first told me about PMTD told me

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Speaker 3: about a research group that she was involved with, and

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Speaker 3: I subsequently contacted them myself because I didn't know where

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Speaker 3: to go, and I thought, Okay, I'm just going to

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Speaker 3: do this and see what happens. Anyway, the head of

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Speaker 3: that service, who's quite a and I pushed psychiatrist, actually

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Speaker 3: rang me herself and spoke to me on the phone

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Speaker 3: and listened to me and listened to my symptoms and

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Speaker 3: I said, does that sound a bit like what I

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Speaker 3: think you're talking about? And she's like yes, And I said, trouble.

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Speaker 3: I can't live like this anymore. It is horrible. You're

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Speaker 3: not making it up. And I'm go and speak to us.

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Speaker 3: And that was I think. I don't know. I probably

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Speaker 3: did cry on the phone because I was just so

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Speaker 3: exhausted by that point. Just to have someone believe me,

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Speaker 3: to have a professional believe me and validate me and

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Speaker 3: acknowledge what I was saying and not dismiss it as

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Speaker 3: I'm overreacting or I'm building it up in my head.

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Speaker 3: That was that really started to change the course of

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Speaker 3: how I started to deal with it.

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Speaker 1: It's It's like there's there's two like there's two issues,

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Speaker 1: parallel issues. One is the physical pain and then the

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Speaker 1: other is the psychological anguish of people going it's not real,

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Speaker 1: nik exact thinking you're thinking too much, Nikki. Yeah, I

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Speaker 1: mean that must have complicated and compounded the issue.

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Speaker 3: Oh god, yeah, I was. I was a mess. I was,

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Speaker 3: and I'm not trying to be dramatic about it, but

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Speaker 3: I was so stressed physical and mentally emotionally, just from

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Speaker 3: trying to find someone who would believe me and would

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Speaker 3: try and help me navigate this maze that I felt

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Speaker 3: I was locked into. Yeah. It literally felt like something's

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Speaker 3: going to give sooner. I'm going to Leprescen.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, could you I know this is probably hard to do,

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Speaker 1: but for me, the dude who never has to deal

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Speaker 1: with stuff like that, obviously, but could you try to

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Speaker 1: help me understand and maybe some of the other men

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Speaker 1: who are listening to this and some of the women

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Speaker 1: who were unfamiliar with it, and maybe who have sailed

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Speaker 1: through I don't know, but those of us who don't

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Speaker 1: get it, try to give me an insight into the

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Speaker 1: physical reality, Like what like if you got it, like

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Speaker 1: a like a level seven out of ten gut ache.

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Speaker 1: Is it like excruciating acute adominal pain? Is it? What

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Speaker 1: is it?

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Speaker 3: It's like everyone's going to be different. Obviously for me,

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Speaker 3: I would just get like a head fog that would

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Speaker 3: sort of develop into migrain nausea that was so intense

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Speaker 3: that I just I couldn't move, you know, or otherwise

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Speaker 3: I just haven't had in the toilet bowl because I

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Speaker 3: just couldn't go anywhere else, and burning pain for me

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Speaker 3: in my back, and you know, as it kind of

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Speaker 3: got worse and worse, just it was like I'd been

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Speaker 3: hit by a bus and I just have to literally

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Speaker 3: I would have to sleep off a couple of just

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Speaker 3: lose a couple of days in sleep because I couldn't

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Speaker 3: deal with it any other way.

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Speaker 1: And that must be hard for you because you're the

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Speaker 1: least lazy person. I know.

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Speaker 3: It was so stressful because you know, I was trying

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Speaker 3: to hold down my job, which was being different were

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Speaker 3: more difficult to do because I couldn't show up because

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Speaker 3: I was so affected, and that psychologically that was playing

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Speaker 3: on me too, and just yeah, I just have to

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Speaker 3: sort of step off the world for a few days

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Speaker 3: just to try and cope with it.

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Speaker 1: If have you had anything in the ballpark? Feel free

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Speaker 1: to not answer anything. I don't know if I'm allowed to,

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Speaker 1: but feel free to tell me to. You know, I'm like, fuck,

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Speaker 1: where do I which doors can I open? I'm in

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Speaker 1: this conversation. But does any of this resonate for you

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Speaker 1: or what are your thoughts around this?

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Speaker 2: When I was a teenager, I had quite a turbulent

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Speaker 2: time with my hormones and I got monthly migraines in

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Speaker 2: the lead up to starting to have a cycle. And

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Speaker 2: when I went on the contraceptive pill as a teen

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Speaker 2: I had a lot of mood issues in finding the

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Speaker 2: right pill, and that was feedback from Mum. She's like,

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Speaker 2: you're a little bit like you have to go and

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Speaker 2: get that change. So there was a yeah, yeah, And

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Speaker 2: I get a lot of I'm a sugar head a

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Speaker 2: couple of days before I crave sugar big time the

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Speaker 2: day the day before my cycle starts. And maybe if

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Speaker 2: I tracked moods and symptoms and watched them a little

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Speaker 2: more carefully, I would probably see more. But nothing that's

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Speaker 2: stabilitating like what Nicky experiences. But I do know people

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Speaker 2: that are and just.

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Speaker 3: On the mood stuff. I'm a fairly steady, calm person generally,

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Speaker 3: but when all those symptoms were ramping up, I was

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Speaker 3: looking to have a fight with someone or I was

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Speaker 3: so depressed that I just was it was a struggle

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Speaker 3: for me to get out my front door.

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Speaker 1: Because also, also you live by yourself. I mean there's

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Speaker 1: not like there's someone else in the night that can

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Speaker 1: bring you a glass of water or just check in

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Speaker 1: on you, or sit on your bed and hold your

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Speaker 1: hand and have a chat. That must have made it worse, right, yes.

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Speaker 3: Because I just sort of isolated, because I just so

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Speaker 3: stuck in it, and I just kept on sort of

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Speaker 3: getting deeper down the rabbit hole. And it got to

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Speaker 3: the point where I said to my mum, Okay, Mom,

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Speaker 3: I'm going to text you every morning just to let

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Speaker 3: you know that I've gotten to work today, because it

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Speaker 3: was so it was a battle to get out of

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Speaker 3: the door sometimes and if I could text her to

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Speaker 3: say I got to work, then I was like, good,

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Speaker 3: she's out the house. She's made to get herself together

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Speaker 3: and get herself off to work. That was when it

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Speaker 3: was really bad, and when I wasn't getting any making

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Speaker 3: any headway in getting treatment, So that that was That

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Speaker 3: was pretty massive, and I think that put you know,

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Speaker 3: bless my mum. She has just been an absolute rock

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Speaker 3: and an angel. But yeah, there was a point where

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Speaker 3: I had to move back in with my parents because

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Speaker 3: I couldn't handle living by myself anymore. I feel, say

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Speaker 3: by myself.

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Speaker 1: Wow. So I'm going to ask you a hard question,

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Speaker 1: which you are welcome to decline. Sure, but you've spoken

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Speaker 1: very openly about you know, we've both spoken about eating disorders,

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Speaker 1: disordered eating body dysmorphia, and some of the weird and

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Speaker 1: wonderful and borderline crazy shit that both you and I

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Speaker 1: have done with food, with exercise, with obsessive, compulsive, addictive behaviors.

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Speaker 1: Do you think that any of the stuff that you

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Speaker 1: did as a kid and as a young adult brought

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Speaker 1: this on, impacted this, intersected with this, or do you

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Speaker 1: think it's it's completely genetic.

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Speaker 3: I've asked myself that so many times, and I've had

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Speaker 3: to work through a lot of guilt and shame about

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Speaker 3: all of that, because I thought, have I caused this

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Speaker 3: well to the point where the managements that I had

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Speaker 3: to have surgically changed my life. So I don't know.

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Speaker 3: I can't answer that definitively part of me has you know,

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Speaker 3: just really beat that horse to the nth degree. And

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Speaker 3: I thought, Nikki, you just can't keep going down.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, I mean for me, it was more out

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Speaker 1: of curiosity because trying to figure out you know, maybe

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Speaker 1: I don't know, like in science, were always like, what's

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Speaker 1: the mechanism? How does this thing work? Did I do?

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Speaker 1: Did I do something or not do something? And and

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Speaker 1: for me, it's definitely not about blame or self loathing,

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Speaker 1: just understanding and awareness, you know.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and maybe halps, I don't know. I just sort

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Speaker 3: of thought, look, nick, maybe contributed, maybe it didn't. You

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Speaker 3: can't know that. You can't change that, so you just

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Speaker 3: got to get on with it.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, so you mentioned, well you mentioned a treatment

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Speaker 1: that changed your life in some way. Can can you

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Speaker 1: talk to us about that?

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Speaker 3: Yeah? So I'm in my mid forties and I had

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Speaker 3: when I was getting serious about looking at what are

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00:23:04,640 --> 00:23:10,399
Speaker 3: some viable treatment options for this condition? I kept on

357
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Speaker 3: coming across surgery, and the surgery that I was looking

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Speaker 3: at would be removing the uterus and the ovaries, so

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Speaker 3: basically removing my reproductive system. And given I was about

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Speaker 3: forty one or forty two. At the time when I

361
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Speaker 3: was looking at that, a lot of practitioners were very

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Speaker 3: reluctant to agree for me to have that surgery because

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Speaker 3: they thought, you're too young and it's too drastic. But thankfully,

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Speaker 3: in the end, I met with an endochronologist who just

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00:23:53,920 --> 00:23:57,119
Speaker 3: worked with me and collaborated with me and believed and

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Speaker 3: saw what I was going through, and she referred me

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Speaker 3: to a surgeon, and all along the way it was

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00:24:06,600 --> 00:24:08,720
Speaker 3: made very clear to me, You've got to be aware

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Speaker 3: that this is a life changing decision that you're making.

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Speaker 3: You know the consequences. Take your time to make the decision,

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Speaker 3: because it would mean I can't have children. So after

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Speaker 3: a lot of thought and just not being able to

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Speaker 3: live that way anymore, the only option I did have

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Speaker 3: left to me was to have the surgery.

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Speaker 1: And is that a common treatment path, Nikki?

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Speaker 3: It can be. There are other options, certainly in terms

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Speaker 3: of different medications to help you manage the symptoms, different

378
00:24:54,920 --> 00:25:00,879
Speaker 3: lifestyle behavioral modifications that you can make. Oh, I was

379
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Speaker 3: doing all of that and I was not getting any better.

380
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Speaker 3: It was I was just like keeping my hand above order.

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Speaker 3: So at the end, in the end, it felt like

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Speaker 3: for me, it was the only choice that was available

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Speaker 3: to me.

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Speaker 1: And now I'm going to ask you a weird It's

385
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Speaker 1: not weird between you and me because we know each

386
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Speaker 1: other well, but it might be a weird question in

387
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Speaker 1: the context of where we've been so far. But I

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Speaker 1: know that you're a very spiritual person, and that you know,

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Speaker 1: you're probably more heart driven, soul driven, spirit driven for

390
00:25:41,440 --> 00:25:44,359
Speaker 1: one of a better term, than you are brain driven

391
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Speaker 1: in your life. Is that an accurate comment? Yeah, yeah,

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Speaker 1: which is not to say that you're not smart and

393
00:25:51,920 --> 00:25:55,440
Speaker 1: don't use of course, I mean you've got multiple degrees.

394
00:25:55,440 --> 00:26:01,280
Speaker 1: You're highly intelligent, But so did you. I know that

395
00:26:01,359 --> 00:26:04,080
Speaker 1: you always kind of tune in, you know, like to

396
00:26:04,240 --> 00:26:06,800
Speaker 1: the universe, to God, to the trees, to mother Earth

397
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Speaker 1: to you know, you're always when I talk to you,

398
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Speaker 1: you're like, you're always tuning into something. Yes, thankfully, thankfully

399
00:26:14,080 --> 00:26:20,240
Speaker 1: it's not fucking Instagram, right, So to I'm glad you're going.

400
00:26:20,520 --> 00:26:22,560
Speaker 1: I'm glad you go into a better source than most

401
00:26:22,560 --> 00:26:26,919
Speaker 1: of us. Did you do that? Did you pray? Did

402
00:26:27,000 --> 00:26:30,840
Speaker 1: you meditate? Did you seek? Did you and what kind

403
00:26:30,840 --> 00:26:31,639
Speaker 1: of happened in that?

404
00:26:33,520 --> 00:26:43,760
Speaker 3: Oh? Gosh, yes, I prayed, I meditated? If we said,

405
00:26:44,320 --> 00:26:46,719
Speaker 3: what do I do if I don't have the surgery.

406
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Speaker 3: If it's not the right thing for me to have

407
00:26:48,560 --> 00:26:51,879
Speaker 3: the surgery, then I won't have it. Then how am

408
00:26:51,920 --> 00:26:53,920
Speaker 3: I going to function? How am I going to show

409
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Speaker 3: up in life? How am I going to contribute to

410
00:26:57,680 --> 00:27:00,880
Speaker 3: life the way I want to contribute? Because I can't

411
00:27:00,880 --> 00:27:04,720
Speaker 3: survive this. I don't see it well. I mean I

412
00:27:04,720 --> 00:27:07,400
Speaker 3: couldn't see the time how I could survive it otherwise

413
00:27:08,040 --> 00:27:11,520
Speaker 3: in terms of being able to continue to work and

414
00:27:11,600 --> 00:27:14,400
Speaker 3: function and show up as the person wanted to be

415
00:27:14,480 --> 00:27:18,840
Speaker 3: in my life and in my family, and and you know,

416
00:27:19,040 --> 00:27:22,680
Speaker 3: just for myself as well. I was losing myself.

417
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Speaker 1: So when you're asking these questions, right, and you're in

418
00:27:26,200 --> 00:27:29,680
Speaker 1: this kind of you're opening this spiritual door to connect

419
00:27:29,720 --> 00:27:33,879
Speaker 1: to an intelligence or wisdom or whatever. You know. I know,

420
00:27:33,960 --> 00:27:37,240
Speaker 1: different people believe different things, but something greater and smarter

421
00:27:37,400 --> 00:27:40,560
Speaker 1: and wiser than me and you, right, and tip like

422
00:27:40,720 --> 00:27:45,480
Speaker 1: you to connect. Are you looking for clarity? Are you

423
00:27:45,560 --> 00:27:50,400
Speaker 1: looking for calm? Like what is it that that happens

424
00:27:50,440 --> 00:27:54,159
Speaker 1: that kind of tells you where you go? You know,

425
00:27:54,280 --> 00:27:57,160
Speaker 1: it's like I feel a sense of calm or confidence

426
00:27:57,240 --> 00:27:58,360
Speaker 1: or knowing about.

427
00:27:58,040 --> 00:28:01,879
Speaker 3: This for me, it's off and a real process of

428
00:28:03,000 --> 00:28:08,280
Speaker 3: journaling and writing and talking about it with trusted others

429
00:28:08,480 --> 00:28:15,199
Speaker 3: and doing a lot of prayer about it, and really

430
00:28:15,359 --> 00:28:20,240
Speaker 3: just going into I guess for in a better way

431
00:28:20,280 --> 00:28:27,080
Speaker 3: to put the real bets of myself to go, Okay,

432
00:28:28,040 --> 00:28:29,720
Speaker 3: how do I what do I do? Where do I

433
00:28:29,760 --> 00:28:33,640
Speaker 3: go from here? It's I sort of have to make

434
00:28:33,680 --> 00:28:35,680
Speaker 3: my way through all the layers and all the talk

435
00:28:35,720 --> 00:28:37,760
Speaker 3: and the chatter in my head of do these do

436
00:28:39,840 --> 00:28:43,640
Speaker 3: and go okay, I need to find the stillness around this.

437
00:28:44,320 --> 00:28:47,800
Speaker 3: I need to find the stillness. And for me, a

438
00:28:47,840 --> 00:28:50,280
Speaker 3: part of that was a lot of walking in nature,

439
00:28:50,320 --> 00:28:53,800
Speaker 3: because when I'm out in nature, that's when I feel

440
00:28:54,080 --> 00:28:59,040
Speaker 3: grounded and calm, And often that's when I feel like

441
00:29:01,000 --> 00:29:04,800
Speaker 3: I get the clarity that I need or I create

442
00:29:04,840 --> 00:29:09,680
Speaker 3: the conditions that allows that clarity to come through. And

443
00:29:09,720 --> 00:29:15,200
Speaker 3: it just when I got the sort of the the

444
00:29:15,240 --> 00:29:20,040
Speaker 3: guidance of Nicky have the surgery, I just thought, Okay,

445
00:29:20,040 --> 00:29:22,000
Speaker 3: I'm just going to sit with that. But it was

446
00:29:22,080 --> 00:29:26,920
Speaker 3: consistent over a period of time and I just thought, well,

447
00:29:26,920 --> 00:29:29,280
Speaker 3: that's it. Then it wasn't dramatic, it was just it

448
00:29:29,320 --> 00:29:32,680
Speaker 3: was calm, it was clear, it was concise, which for

449
00:29:32,760 --> 00:29:37,800
Speaker 3: me is often the way that the guidance appears in

450
00:29:37,880 --> 00:29:46,360
Speaker 3: my heart. As I said, okay, m but it's definitely

451
00:29:46,360 --> 00:29:47,480
Speaker 3: a process for me.

452
00:29:48,800 --> 00:29:53,440
Speaker 1: Yeah, So I mean, I want to chuck in a

453
00:29:53,480 --> 00:29:55,560
Speaker 1: red herring here, but just because I thought of it,

454
00:29:56,200 --> 00:29:59,080
Speaker 1: And if you haven't heard Nikki before, this might not

455
00:29:59,200 --> 00:30:02,120
Speaker 1: make much sense, but I'll try to make it make sense.

456
00:30:03,600 --> 00:30:06,640
Speaker 1: So one of the things, So there's a thing in

457
00:30:07,080 --> 00:30:11,560
Speaker 1: Victoria called assisted dying. Is that what it's called? Yeah?

458
00:30:11,600 --> 00:30:14,240
Speaker 1: And you are sorry, what's.

459
00:30:14,120 --> 00:30:15,760
Speaker 3: Called elementary assisted dying?

460
00:30:16,680 --> 00:30:20,080
Speaker 1: Right? And you are a what do we call you?

461
00:30:20,160 --> 00:30:20,240
Speaker 3: Like?

462
00:30:20,360 --> 00:30:23,719
Speaker 1: You help people on that journey through that process. So

463
00:30:23,800 --> 00:30:28,160
Speaker 1: what's the name for that? Like for you life an

464
00:30:28,240 --> 00:30:32,320
Speaker 1: end of life tooler? Okay, like doing your job, which

465
00:30:32,360 --> 00:30:34,760
Speaker 1: is I mean? And I also know that you volunteer

466
00:30:34,800 --> 00:30:36,880
Speaker 1: and you work with homeless people, and you work with

467
00:30:36,920 --> 00:30:39,640
Speaker 1: addicts and alcoholics and men in prison and you do

468
00:30:40,360 --> 00:30:42,240
Speaker 1: and I know that you don't want accolades and you

469
00:30:42,280 --> 00:30:44,480
Speaker 1: don't want glory. I know that. I know that. So

470
00:30:44,560 --> 00:30:47,320
Speaker 1: this is me just telling people kind of who you are.

471
00:30:48,360 --> 00:30:51,280
Speaker 1: And then you spend your life in service helping sick people,

472
00:30:52,760 --> 00:30:58,080
Speaker 1: and then you spend some of your time helping people die,

473
00:30:58,920 --> 00:31:01,560
Speaker 1: you know, I mean like that, I don't can't think

474
00:31:01,560 --> 00:31:05,920
Speaker 1: of another way to say it. Okay, is yeah, it

475
00:31:05,960 --> 00:31:09,200
Speaker 1: is what it is, isn't it. How does all of

476
00:31:09,240 --> 00:31:12,200
Speaker 1: this and I know this is a little bit of

477
00:31:12,240 --> 00:31:15,440
Speaker 1: a left turn from our chat until now, but how

478
00:31:15,440 --> 00:31:22,040
Speaker 1: does this inform your thinking and decision making? And I

479
00:31:22,120 --> 00:31:27,479
Speaker 1: don't know direction, you know, when you're you know, like

480
00:31:27,560 --> 00:31:31,400
Speaker 1: you deal with some what would for me and Tiff

481
00:31:31,480 --> 00:31:34,480
Speaker 1: probably I can't speak for Tiff, but for me anyway,

482
00:31:34,640 --> 00:31:37,200
Speaker 1: this would be very confronting, hard stuff that you do

483
00:31:37,280 --> 00:31:42,160
Speaker 1: every day. How does that impact how you manage you

484
00:31:45,440 --> 00:31:48,000
Speaker 1: or maybe you're thinking, or your gratitude or your I

485
00:31:48,000 --> 00:31:51,920
Speaker 1: don't know. It just seems like that must really impact

486
00:31:52,360 --> 00:31:53,800
Speaker 1: the way that you do life.

487
00:31:56,360 --> 00:32:03,400
Speaker 3: And me, I think it's a privilege to be in

488
00:32:03,400 --> 00:32:09,400
Speaker 3: that position and be in the sacred space of all

489
00:32:11,480 --> 00:32:19,640
Speaker 3: that intimate private space of others. And it makes me

490
00:32:19,840 --> 00:32:29,360
Speaker 3: fit how I say it, it's feeds me, It nourishes me,

491
00:32:29,600 --> 00:32:34,440
Speaker 3: It enlivens me. To be in that position, to be

492
00:32:34,480 --> 00:32:42,440
Speaker 3: abut off the kindness and compassion and human wrongth when

493
00:32:42,480 --> 00:32:48,600
Speaker 3: some run is at their most vulnerable is extraordinary. There

494
00:32:48,600 --> 00:32:53,120
Speaker 3: aren't words to describe it, well, I can't find them,

495
00:32:53,560 --> 00:32:56,720
Speaker 3: but it is it's like my heart and my soul

496
00:32:57,160 --> 00:32:58,680
Speaker 3: is alive in those moments.

497
00:33:00,920 --> 00:33:04,920
Speaker 1: Wow wow, I.

498
00:33:04,600 --> 00:33:08,400
Speaker 3: Think, yeah, it's like un lit up on the inside.

499
00:33:09,720 --> 00:33:18,160
Speaker 1: Wow. Do you think that that that role amongst the

500
00:33:18,200 --> 00:33:20,920
Speaker 1: other roles that you play? But I don't know. We

501
00:33:20,960 --> 00:33:24,640
Speaker 1: talk about purpose a lot in our culture, right whether

502
00:33:24,680 --> 00:33:27,520
Speaker 1: or not it's preordained or me ordained, you know, whether

503
00:33:27,600 --> 00:33:29,600
Speaker 1: or not we've got to discover it or create it

504
00:33:29,720 --> 00:33:34,840
Speaker 1: or choose it. Like, what do you think your purpose is?

505
00:33:35,440 --> 00:33:37,440
Speaker 1: I mean, I know that's a big question, but do

506
00:33:37,480 --> 00:33:41,160
Speaker 1: you do you have clarity about your purpose?

507
00:33:45,000 --> 00:33:50,280
Speaker 3: I think it ultimately. I feel like my purpose is

508
00:33:50,920 --> 00:33:58,479
Speaker 3: surface and that can take different iterations in terms of

509
00:34:00,200 --> 00:34:09,239
Speaker 3: h I guess my my sort of overriding prayer that

510
00:34:09,320 --> 00:34:11,160
Speaker 3: I put out there is placing where you want me

511
00:34:11,200 --> 00:34:15,960
Speaker 3: to be. So sometimes that's that's the cold face in

512
00:34:16,080 --> 00:34:18,440
Speaker 3: terms of you know, being right in the thick of

513
00:34:18,440 --> 00:34:22,600
Speaker 3: an acute hospital doing treatment, diagnosis, all that sort of stuff.

514
00:34:22,600 --> 00:34:25,239
Speaker 3: And at other times it's been at the end of

515
00:34:25,320 --> 00:34:33,759
Speaker 3: life where it's a totally different environment. But it's ultimately

516
00:34:34,320 --> 00:34:36,880
Speaker 3: I see all of that as a function.

517
00:34:38,680 --> 00:34:39,120
Speaker 1: Mhmm.

518
00:34:40,080 --> 00:34:42,879
Speaker 3: Yeah, And you know, just service. And I don't mean

519
00:34:42,880 --> 00:34:47,000
Speaker 3: that to sound you know, I don't know weird, but

520
00:34:47,280 --> 00:34:55,840
Speaker 3: just ash giving, sharing human wants and compassion, and that

521
00:34:56,080 --> 00:34:58,520
Speaker 3: is something that all of us can do with each

522
00:34:58,560 --> 00:35:02,319
Speaker 3: other and it doesn't cost, but it can make so

523
00:35:02,560 --> 00:35:05,680
Speaker 3: different in someone else's life. Just such a difference for

524
00:35:05,760 --> 00:35:10,840
Speaker 3: someone to feel that they're acknowledged and they're known acknowledged

525
00:35:10,840 --> 00:35:15,040
Speaker 3: and they're known and they're seen, you know. That's that's

526
00:35:15,800 --> 00:35:20,399
Speaker 3: especially in my work in like one of the major

527
00:35:20,480 --> 00:35:25,520
Speaker 3: public hospitals where there's a lot of homeless and like

528
00:35:25,800 --> 00:35:31,640
Speaker 3: disenfranchised people, to see them as the person rather than

529
00:35:31,719 --> 00:35:37,200
Speaker 3: to see them as patient X or medical number four

530
00:35:37,320 --> 00:35:39,640
Speaker 3: seventy nine or whatever. But to see them and to

531
00:35:39,719 --> 00:35:44,239
Speaker 3: go up and you know them as a person. You know,

532
00:35:44,320 --> 00:35:47,640
Speaker 3: there's I don't think there's any greater gift than for

533
00:35:47,719 --> 00:35:51,040
Speaker 3: someone to feel that they're being seen and heard and

534
00:35:51,160 --> 00:35:54,839
Speaker 3: listened to and acknowledged and cared about. Giving someone out

535
00:35:54,800 --> 00:35:57,919
Speaker 3: of time, that is the most precious thing.

536
00:36:01,320 --> 00:36:03,320
Speaker 1: So my prayer tonight is going to be, dear sweet

537
00:36:03,320 --> 00:36:08,560
Speaker 1: baby Jesus, make me more like Nikki. All right, let's

538
00:36:08,640 --> 00:36:13,560
Speaker 1: just I could listen to you. I feel like I

539
00:36:13,560 --> 00:36:16,120
Speaker 1: want to talk to you when we open the door,

540
00:36:16,160 --> 00:36:19,719
Speaker 1: and you kind of share like truly, I don't know

541
00:36:19,760 --> 00:36:21,960
Speaker 1: that you know for me, I don't know how everyone

542
00:36:22,000 --> 00:36:28,400
Speaker 1: else feels. But I find you very inspiring and also,

543
00:36:29,560 --> 00:36:30,480
Speaker 1: Craig do better.

544
00:36:31,560 --> 00:36:34,360
Speaker 3: No, no, no, I'm just I'm just one person just

545
00:36:34,400 --> 00:36:37,880
Speaker 3: having a crack and you know, learning from others. And

546
00:36:37,920 --> 00:36:42,240
Speaker 3: I work with amazing people who inspire me and humble

547
00:36:42,320 --> 00:36:46,960
Speaker 3: me and just lead the way for me. They like

548
00:36:47,080 --> 00:36:51,279
Speaker 3: them for me. So I'm so privileged to be in

549
00:36:51,320 --> 00:36:52,640
Speaker 3: those spaces.

550
00:36:54,080 --> 00:36:57,279
Speaker 1: So it's not it's I know, I know, we know.

551
00:36:57,360 --> 00:36:59,759
Speaker 1: There's no chest beating coming from you. I'm doing it

552
00:36:59,800 --> 00:37:02,560
Speaker 1: for you. All right, let's just wind up. Tell us,

553
00:37:03,239 --> 00:37:09,080
Speaker 1: so you had that surgery, what was the outcome? What

554
00:37:09,280 --> 00:37:11,359
Speaker 1: you know, if you could tell us in a few

555
00:37:11,400 --> 00:37:14,719
Speaker 1: minutes kind of the without rushing you. If you need more,

556
00:37:14,800 --> 00:37:17,200
Speaker 1: that's fine, but like, what was the outcome of that?

557
00:37:17,719 --> 00:37:20,120
Speaker 1: How long before you felt different or better or you

558
00:37:20,160 --> 00:37:22,800
Speaker 1: didn't feel different or better? And where are you now?

559
00:37:23,400 --> 00:37:27,479
Speaker 3: So I think it's been really two years, I think

560
00:37:27,560 --> 00:37:30,279
Speaker 3: off the top of my head since I since I

561
00:37:30,320 --> 00:37:33,520
Speaker 3: had the surgery. It's been up and down for sure,

562
00:37:35,080 --> 00:37:39,239
Speaker 3: in terms of just all of a sudden, you know,

563
00:37:40,120 --> 00:37:44,200
Speaker 3: major bits are no longer in my body. My body's

564
00:37:44,239 --> 00:37:49,200
Speaker 3: like the hell, you know, and just trying to balance

565
00:37:49,280 --> 00:37:53,160
Speaker 3: hormones and biochemistry. That's been It's been really up and

566
00:37:53,200 --> 00:38:02,520
Speaker 3: down at times. Within the past that's probably six months.

567
00:38:02,719 --> 00:38:09,200
Speaker 3: I start to feel like I'm coming out of the

568
00:38:09,360 --> 00:38:13,600
Speaker 3: postop sort of recovery period of it in terms of

569
00:38:13,719 --> 00:38:17,200
Speaker 3: I think my body is starting to stabilize a bit more.

570
00:38:19,280 --> 00:38:24,680
Speaker 3: I still have symptoms will on a better way to

571
00:38:24,719 --> 00:38:30,479
Speaker 3: put it, but they're nowhere near as prolonged or as

572
00:38:30,640 --> 00:38:36,080
Speaker 3: debilitating as they were, which I'm so grateful for this

573
00:38:36,280 --> 00:38:38,440
Speaker 3: in the sense that I've got my life back today

574
00:38:39,520 --> 00:38:43,040
Speaker 3: in that I can say, yeah, I will, I will

575
00:38:43,040 --> 00:38:47,120
Speaker 3: show up to that because I'm not trying to think,

576
00:38:47,520 --> 00:38:49,120
Speaker 3: oh my god, what's my body going to be? Like,

577
00:38:49,160 --> 00:38:50,560
Speaker 3: where am I going to be that, What's going to happen?

578
00:38:50,680 --> 00:38:52,080
Speaker 3: Am I going to be able to function that day?

579
00:38:53,080 --> 00:38:55,960
Speaker 3: I'm able to function more days than I'm not. And

580
00:38:56,000 --> 00:39:01,839
Speaker 3: they's just been so precious, the whole precious, And.

581
00:39:01,800 --> 00:39:04,160
Speaker 1: I guess on top of what we spoke about before,

582
00:39:04,239 --> 00:39:08,160
Speaker 1: the dealing with the emotional and psychological and not being

583
00:39:08,200 --> 00:39:10,880
Speaker 1: believed and all of that as well, as the physical

584
00:39:10,960 --> 00:39:15,279
Speaker 1: pain and debilitating kind of stuff, which you mentioned. The

585
00:39:15,360 --> 00:39:19,080
Speaker 1: third bit to that is work and not wanting to

586
00:39:19,160 --> 00:39:24,239
Speaker 1: let people down, patients patients down, or your colleagues down,

587
00:39:24,480 --> 00:39:28,120
Speaker 1: and not wanting to be seen as being that unreliable

588
00:39:28,200 --> 00:39:32,000
Speaker 1: chick that keeps taking time off because oh she's sick again.

589
00:39:32,400 --> 00:39:40,279
Speaker 3: Yeah, that was excruciating, absolutely xcretiating for me. I was

590
00:39:40,600 --> 00:39:45,600
Speaker 3: really fortunate to have some very compassionate and kind and

591
00:39:45,719 --> 00:39:50,720
Speaker 3: understanding managers and it was my responsibility to be upfront

592
00:39:50,760 --> 00:39:54,000
Speaker 3: with him about what was going on. That's what That's

593
00:39:54,040 --> 00:39:59,719
Speaker 3: how I felt about it. But yeah, that's been excretiating.

594
00:40:02,920 --> 00:40:05,840
Speaker 1: As always, we love chatting with you if people want to.

595
00:40:05,920 --> 00:40:08,480
Speaker 1: And I know you're not the spokesperson or the advocate,

596
00:40:08,560 --> 00:40:12,400
Speaker 1: but in this three way conversation you are. If people

597
00:40:12,440 --> 00:40:16,640
Speaker 1: want to find out more, what is it? Just like, go,

598
00:40:16,719 --> 00:40:20,080
Speaker 1: do a Google search, do some reading, watch a video

599
00:40:20,200 --> 00:40:20,520
Speaker 1: or two.

600
00:40:21,080 --> 00:40:25,600
Speaker 3: Yeah, I think you've got my email address and I've

601
00:40:25,600 --> 00:40:28,680
Speaker 3: been more than happy to put on the links that

602
00:40:28,760 --> 00:40:31,279
Speaker 3: I've that have been shown to me.

603
00:40:32,120 --> 00:40:34,440
Speaker 1: Would you are you happy to tell people your email

604
00:40:34,520 --> 00:40:36,480
Speaker 1: or do you want them to come via us?

605
00:40:36,880 --> 00:40:38,000
Speaker 3: Come by you? Great?

606
00:40:38,640 --> 00:40:43,879
Speaker 1: Yep? Okay, so just send it to Craig Harper dot net.

607
00:40:44,080 --> 00:40:47,839
Speaker 1: If you want to Nikki to connect with you and

608
00:40:48,000 --> 00:40:51,120
Speaker 1: stee you in the right direction, that'd be great. Uh

609
00:40:52,880 --> 00:40:54,000
Speaker 1: what did you think of that? Tip?

610
00:40:55,880 --> 00:40:57,160
Speaker 2: Could listen to her all day?

611
00:40:58,040 --> 00:40:59,000
Speaker 1: Really sweet, isn't she?

612
00:40:59,320 --> 00:40:59,520
Speaker 3: Yeah?

613
00:41:00,320 --> 00:41:02,880
Speaker 2: But no, I think that was There'll be so many

614
00:41:02,920 --> 00:41:07,160
Speaker 2: people that will probably feel heard for the very first time,

615
00:41:07,200 --> 00:41:09,239
Speaker 2: to be honest, so some like.

616
00:41:10,480 --> 00:41:15,799
Speaker 3: If if it is relief to someone, you know.

617
00:41:15,880 --> 00:41:18,319
Speaker 2: The funny thing I was going to comment earlier when

618
00:41:18,360 --> 00:41:20,479
Speaker 2: I googled it and realized I had heard of it before,

619
00:41:20,520 --> 00:41:23,120
Speaker 2: but I didn't. I didn't remember the full name, but

620
00:41:24,000 --> 00:41:27,160
Speaker 2: the classification of it being a mental disorder when it's

621
00:41:26,920 --> 00:41:31,120
Speaker 2: a it's a hormonal issue, and I find that is

622
00:41:31,160 --> 00:41:35,120
Speaker 2: really perplexing and has a lot of stigma and causes,

623
00:41:35,239 --> 00:41:38,400
Speaker 2: shame and causes. So it's really tough.

624
00:41:39,360 --> 00:41:43,239
Speaker 3: You know. I literally asked myself, how many times am

625
00:41:43,239 --> 00:41:47,200
Speaker 3: I going crazy? This is it? Some lose my mind?

626
00:41:47,200 --> 00:41:49,120
Speaker 3: Now it's all done, it's all over.

627
00:41:51,120 --> 00:41:55,080
Speaker 1: You are crazy. But that's a separate issue. Yeah, yeah,

628
00:41:55,120 --> 00:41:56,280
Speaker 1: that's different, Yeah.

629
00:41:56,480 --> 00:41:57,279
Speaker 3: In a different way.

630
00:41:57,360 --> 00:42:01,960
Speaker 2: But also having an understanding that those hormones drive behavior

631
00:42:02,040 --> 00:42:06,600
Speaker 2: like even and this is like what tiny version of it.

632
00:42:06,680 --> 00:42:07,359
Speaker 1: But when I.

633
00:42:07,520 --> 00:42:11,920
Speaker 2: Realized that those days before my first day of my cycle,

634
00:42:11,960 --> 00:42:14,359
Speaker 2: with the days that I was just losing my shit

635
00:42:14,440 --> 00:42:19,080
Speaker 2: on sugar and binging, yeah, this shame and self loath

636
00:42:19,480 --> 00:42:23,120
Speaker 2: and I dropped because I went, oh, oh, that's just

637
00:42:23,200 --> 00:42:25,000
Speaker 2: that thing that happens for one day and I let

638
00:42:25,000 --> 00:42:26,680
Speaker 2: it go on. And then it's like sometimes I just

639
00:42:26,719 --> 00:42:27,840
Speaker 2: do it and I let it go and I go,

640
00:42:27,920 --> 00:42:29,680
Speaker 2: that's okay because there's a reason. It's not like, oh,

641
00:42:29,719 --> 00:42:32,080
Speaker 2: you've lost it. Oh you've just lost control. You're going

642
00:42:32,120 --> 00:42:34,080
Speaker 2: to be a fatty hounders every day of line.

643
00:42:34,320 --> 00:42:41,799
Speaker 3: Yep. I was just trapped in that. Yeah, yeah, yeah,

644
00:42:41,920 --> 00:42:45,440
Speaker 3: and it's yeah, I was just trapped.

645
00:42:45,120 --> 00:42:49,640
Speaker 1: In there, Nicky. We appreciate you. Thanks for coming to

646
00:42:49,640 --> 00:42:53,480
Speaker 1: play on the You project. Thanks Tiff, Thanks guys, Thanks

647
00:42:53,520 --> 00:42:54,000
Speaker 1: so much.

648
00:42:54,040 --> 00:42:54,400
Speaker 3: Tiff.

649
00:42:55,040 --> 00:42:56,000
Speaker 2: Good to see you again.

650
00:42:57,280 --> 00:42:59,680
Speaker 3: Yeah, so good to see you. Look for to seeing

651
00:42:59,680 --> 00:43:00,080
Speaker 3: you again and