WEBVTT - The Late Debate | 19 June 0:00:00.360 --> 0:00:07.520 Late Well girl, the Late Debate. Well, it's great to 0:00:07.560 --> 0:00:09.880 have your company on the Late Debate. I'm James Macpherson, 0:00:09.920 --> 0:00:13.200 Will Liz Staer and birthday boy Caleb Bonb. 0:00:13.280 --> 0:00:15.360 Happy birthday, Thank. 0:00:15.120 --> 0:00:18.239 You very much. It's terrible that I am now an 0:00:18.280 --> 0:00:20.599 old man. I'm over the hill and I don't know. 0:00:20.640 --> 0:00:23.480 They'll probably sack me tomorrow for being too old. But still, 0:00:23.760 --> 0:00:24.800 it's nice to be here. 0:00:24.840 --> 0:00:29.200 It's a quarter century that gray hair boy I have. 0:00:29.320 --> 0:00:31.240 Actually, I looked in the mirror the other day and 0:00:31.280 --> 0:00:33.159 I noticed a couple of grays and I thought, oh 0:00:33.200 --> 0:00:35.280 my god, we're really in trouble here. 0:00:36.280 --> 0:00:37.800 Well, the good news is you get to spend your 0:00:37.840 --> 0:00:38.920 birthday with us. 0:00:39.040 --> 0:00:41.519 And who else would I want to spend it with 0:00:41.600 --> 0:00:43.639 but my Late Debate family, and that. 0:00:43.600 --> 0:00:45.760 Of course includes all of you at home who let 0:00:45.800 --> 0:00:48.599 me into your lounge rooms and bedrooms every night. It's 0:00:48.640 --> 0:00:49.080 a pleasure. 0:00:49.240 --> 0:00:51.640 Well, happy birthday again. Let's get into the program. 0:00:51.720 --> 0:00:55.520 We've got a lot coming up, including Victorian MP's promoting 0:00:55.600 --> 0:00:58.200 pill testing. Fair enough, but wait till you see what 0:00:58.240 --> 0:01:00.400 they were wearing when they moted. 0:01:00.480 --> 0:01:02.200 It will show you that later. Plus we'll look at 0:01:02.240 --> 0:01:03.200 the papers of course. 0:01:03.440 --> 0:01:07.000 Peter Dutton's nuclear plan is across all of tomorrow's papers. 0:01:07.240 --> 0:01:08.600 We'll talk about that later. 0:01:09.000 --> 0:01:12.080 And speaking of plans, the Gold Coast Bulletin outlines a 0:01:12.160 --> 0:01:14.039 plan to improve surface paradise. 0:01:14.520 --> 0:01:15.560 Get this, Caleb and Liz. 0:01:15.560 --> 0:01:20.200 They're proposing cheaper alcoholic drinks at surfers that Linkbil. 0:01:20.840 --> 0:01:21.959 Caleb's already booked. 0:01:22.440 --> 0:01:23.800 That's where I'm going on the weekend. 0:01:24.520 --> 0:01:29.200 Let's start the program in the UK, where CCTV cameras 0:01:29.280 --> 0:01:34.720 are being used at train stations to secretly monitor people's emotions. 0:01:35.040 --> 0:01:38.360 The cameras were originally installed at eight train stations in 0:01:38.400 --> 0:01:42.040 a bid to reduce anti social behavior, but as most 0:01:42.080 --> 0:01:44.640 of us have figured out by now, the worst anti 0:01:44.640 --> 0:01:48.800 social behavior usually comes from people in the government, and 0:01:48.840 --> 0:01:52.800 so Network Rail, which is the public transport authority, they 0:01:52.840 --> 0:01:57.800 decided to use the cameras to scan people's expressions and 0:01:57.840 --> 0:02:02.040 then record using special AI whether they were feeling sad 0:02:02.240 --> 0:02:05.240 or happy or angry. Because it's not enough for the 0:02:05.280 --> 0:02:07.520 state to know where you're going, they want to know 0:02:07.560 --> 0:02:10.000 what's going on in your head. 0:02:10.440 --> 0:02:10.639 Now. 0:02:11.280 --> 0:02:15.720 Network Rail from now on known as Dystopian Rail, they said, look, 0:02:15.919 --> 0:02:18.680 we were only using the technology because we wanted to 0:02:18.760 --> 0:02:20.400 monitor customer satisfaction. 0:02:20.880 --> 0:02:22.160 Of course, it never occurred to them. 0:02:22.160 --> 0:02:24.639 They could get a pretty good idea of customer satisfaction 0:02:25.000 --> 0:02:28.239 by simply checking what percentage of trains were running on time. 0:02:28.760 --> 0:02:34.119 Oh and they were selling the information to advertisers. 0:02:33.200 --> 0:02:34.399 So there you go. 0:02:34.800 --> 0:02:38.400 The information was revealed after a freedom of information request 0:02:38.760 --> 0:02:42.760 by a civil liberties group called Big Brother Watch. The 0:02:42.840 --> 0:02:45.120 good news in all of this, Caleb and Liz is 0:02:45.200 --> 0:02:47.880 that the Transport Department don't need to do this anymore 0:02:47.919 --> 0:02:51.000 because now the public are aware they've been secretly filmed 0:02:51.040 --> 0:02:55.280 since about twenty twenty two with this pseudo science analyzing 0:02:55.280 --> 0:02:56.160 their expressions. 0:02:56.480 --> 0:02:59.239 Everyone has the same emotion. Now all of the UK 0:02:59.400 --> 0:03:01.040 is thoroughly they's right. 0:03:01.120 --> 0:03:03.280 And look, you'd be going to the railway station just 0:03:03.400 --> 0:03:05.920 trying to look angry, now, wouldn't you, just to see 0:03:05.919 --> 0:03:08.800 what they could possibly do about it? I mean closed 0:03:08.840 --> 0:03:12.600 circuit television CCTV. The operative part of that has always 0:03:12.639 --> 0:03:16.440 been closed circuit, Like the vision is being taken from 0:03:16.440 --> 0:03:19.640 one place, ie in the train station specifically, to one 0:03:19.760 --> 0:03:20.800 other place where. 0:03:20.639 --> 0:03:22.320 It's being monitored for safety. 0:03:22.320 --> 0:03:25.359 If someone starts a fight, whatever, the fat security guard 0:03:25.440 --> 0:03:26.840 can go down there and try and break. 0:03:26.680 --> 0:03:28.120 It up while they wait for the coppers. 0:03:28.440 --> 0:03:31.320 What we are now talking about is a system that 0:03:31.440 --> 0:03:34.280 is not only being monitored by the security guard sitting 0:03:34.320 --> 0:03:37.480 in the room, it's being analyzed, in this case by Amazon, 0:03:37.600 --> 0:03:40.080 so it's going to a third party company, so it's 0:03:40.080 --> 0:03:43.880 being held on their servers, and god knows what happens 0:03:43.920 --> 0:03:46.840 to that then. I mean, if Amazon was hacked, presumably 0:03:46.880 --> 0:03:49.040 they could someone could collect all of that data so 0:03:49.080 --> 0:03:52.640 they could tell and this stuff is highly valuable. Data 0:03:52.640 --> 0:03:55.000 is highly valuable, So some hacker on the other side 0:03:55.040 --> 0:03:57.920 of the world could find out all the people who 0:03:58.000 --> 0:04:01.800 walked through the railway stefe on a particular day, the 0:04:01.840 --> 0:04:04.680 moods they were in, and that is very telling about 0:04:05.000 --> 0:04:07.760 what stage of life you're in, whether you're going through 0:04:07.760 --> 0:04:10.360 a divorce, and all these things might see minor at 0:04:10.360 --> 0:04:12.880 the time, but when they start to piece that together 0:04:12.960 --> 0:04:16.600 with other information and data they've taken from other places, 0:04:16.880 --> 0:04:18.480 it becomes extremely valuable. 0:04:18.520 --> 0:04:20.560 And then in comes the. 0:04:20.440 --> 0:04:22.960 Advertising factor, which blows it all out of the water. 0:04:23.040 --> 0:04:26.880 It's not about safety, it's about monetization. And we all 0:04:26.920 --> 0:04:29.479 know that when you're in a public place a it 0:04:29.560 --> 0:04:31.839 is legal to be filmed in a public place but 0:04:31.960 --> 0:04:35.400 you expect that CCTV is being used for one purpose 0:04:35.520 --> 0:04:38.440 and one purpose alone, and that is to monitor for 0:04:38.520 --> 0:04:39.400 bad behavior. 0:04:39.680 --> 0:04:41.480 This has gone well beyond. 0:04:41.160 --> 0:04:43.600 That now, and we should be really scared about it 0:04:43.640 --> 0:04:47.960 because it starts with one company or one metro outfit 0:04:48.040 --> 0:04:50.919 saying we've got these cameras to monitor our people. What 0:04:50.960 --> 0:04:53.440 if the cops rock up and they want to take 0:04:53.680 --> 0:04:56.360 all of that data. It starts in the railway station, 0:04:56.760 --> 0:04:58.760 then it's on the street, then it's in front of 0:04:58.760 --> 0:05:02.479 your house, dislutely everywhere, and they will be able to 0:05:02.640 --> 0:05:06.240 law enforcement and private businesses be able to track not 0:05:06.360 --> 0:05:09.320 only where you're going every minute of the day, how 0:05:09.360 --> 0:05:11.200 you're feeling every. 0:05:10.920 --> 0:05:11.720 Minute of the day. 0:05:12.240 --> 0:05:15.799 This is really really dangerous that falls into the wrong hands. 0:05:16.080 --> 0:05:17.400 We are stuffed well. 0:05:17.440 --> 0:05:19.919 I think it's far more nefarious than just all for 0:05:20.040 --> 0:05:23.240 advertising purposes. No doubt people are making money off it, 0:05:23.279 --> 0:05:26.599 but I want to know why they want this kind 0:05:26.800 --> 0:05:31.200 of data. One's thoughts and feelings. That's your private sphere. 0:05:31.600 --> 0:05:34.800 That is the one thing that you alone have access 0:05:34.839 --> 0:05:37.360 to know what you're thinking, know what you're feeling at 0:05:37.400 --> 0:05:40.480 any given point. And I find it very curious that 0:05:40.560 --> 0:05:43.240 this program, which we only know about thanks to an 0:05:43.400 --> 0:05:46.280 FOI by a Big Brother Watch Can we get a 0:05:46.320 --> 0:05:50.320 few of those in Australia please? Was launched in twenty 0:05:50.440 --> 0:05:53.320 twenty two. My very first thought was it was in 0:05:53.400 --> 0:05:57.000 twenty twenty two that Bunning's Camart and the good Guys 0:05:57.480 --> 0:06:03.400 here in Australia were busted for the exact same facial recognition. Yes, 0:06:03.600 --> 0:06:07.240 not feelings and emotions that we know of. Who knows, 0:06:07.800 --> 0:06:10.200 but they were busted for that and nobody had been 0:06:10.240 --> 0:06:13.679 told either. So you've got millions of people walking into 0:06:13.760 --> 0:06:17.440 these stores having their faces recognized. Goodness knows what that 0:06:17.560 --> 0:06:20.960 data was actually being used for as well, and people 0:06:21.040 --> 0:06:25.240 are numb the wiser. Nobody is being asked permission. They 0:06:25.279 --> 0:06:28.000 say that there was a small mention of this program 0:06:28.160 --> 0:06:33.320 under the company's privacy policy on their website, but again 0:06:33.800 --> 0:06:37.760 no accountability whatsoever. They just found it because they went 0:06:37.880 --> 0:06:40.840 digging for it. And what are people supposed to do, 0:06:40.960 --> 0:06:43.320 even if they are aware of it not use the 0:06:43.400 --> 0:06:46.840 tube like that is literally the only mode of transport 0:06:46.920 --> 0:06:50.359 for millions of people living in London, living in the 0:06:50.480 --> 0:06:54.240 UK who don't own a car. It's extortionately expensive over there, 0:06:54.560 --> 0:06:58.720 so people are left with absolutely no other option. Anyway, 0:06:58.920 --> 0:07:01.880 even if they were like, yeah, we're wildly uncomfortable about this, 0:07:02.200 --> 0:07:05.320 what are you going to do? Not ride the tube? 0:07:05.400 --> 0:07:10.640 They are normalizing AI powered surveillance and they're not asking permission. 0:07:10.880 --> 0:07:14.440 And this is the tip of the iceberg, because, like 0:07:14.520 --> 0:07:17.440 I say, every time one of these stories make it 0:07:17.440 --> 0:07:20.720 to the media, imagine what else is going on that 0:07:20.760 --> 0:07:24.200 we have absolutely no idea about and they're never going 0:07:24.240 --> 0:07:24.640 to tell you. 0:07:25.120 --> 0:07:27.760 And consider the attitude of the authorities who put this 0:07:27.840 --> 0:07:30.880 program together, because in the documents that were released, it 0:07:30.960 --> 0:07:33.000 is recorded that they had a discussion about whether or 0:07:33.040 --> 0:07:35.840 not this is appropriate. The question was asked, are some 0:07:35.880 --> 0:07:39.000 people likely to find it intrusive? And the answer was 0:07:39.400 --> 0:07:42.320 typically no. But there's no accounting for some people. 0:07:44.160 --> 0:07:49.360 Towards what who doesn't think that's in true? And that's 0:07:49.400 --> 0:07:52.080 the major problem with a we're not told about it. 0:07:52.400 --> 0:07:57.520 You mentioned the privacy policy, it's the anti privacy or 0:07:57.600 --> 0:07:58.800 they always name. 0:07:58.800 --> 0:08:02.119 These things, I know, opposite of what it's actually doing. 0:08:02.200 --> 0:08:06.080 But it's because once you take like everyone uses credit 0:08:06.120 --> 0:08:08.360 cards and debit cards and whatever these so the bank 0:08:08.760 --> 0:08:10.920 knows where you go every Thursday. At the same time, 0:08:11.120 --> 0:08:13.280 they know what you buy, They know how much you spend. 0:08:13.640 --> 0:08:16.440 Once you start putting all of these little crumbs together, 0:08:17.360 --> 0:08:21.840 law enforcement, private business, everyone else can literally work out 0:08:21.960 --> 0:08:24.360 everything you are doing at every moment. 0:08:24.800 --> 0:08:25.520 Law enforcement. 0:08:25.520 --> 0:08:27.440 What my thought when I read this was could it 0:08:27.480 --> 0:08:29.680 be used in evidence against you if you. 0:08:29.680 --> 0:08:31.400 Were accused of a crime. 0:08:31.920 --> 0:08:35.680 Well, our CCTV had him at this station looking guilty. 0:08:36.440 --> 0:08:40.079 Analysis says he was feeling paranoid. 0:08:40.120 --> 0:08:44.520 And that's volatile because previously you would have been able 0:08:44.559 --> 0:08:46.439 that the cops would have gone and asked. 0:08:46.160 --> 0:08:48.840 The tube for the CCTV footage that would have showed 0:08:48.880 --> 0:08:50.239 you moving through. 0:08:50.320 --> 0:08:53.960 The station, you know, prior to or after the alleged crime. 0:08:54.280 --> 0:08:57.120 But now that comes with all this analysis that it 0:08:56.920 --> 0:08:59.559 is creating about what it thinks you're feeling at the time. 0:09:00.360 --> 0:09:02.280 It is value adding to all. 0:09:02.120 --> 0:09:05.480 Of this, and without legislation to stop it, which will 0:09:05.480 --> 0:09:08.840 never get because of course it benefits people like law enforced, 0:09:09.720 --> 0:09:10.560 you can't stop it. 0:09:11.000 --> 0:09:15.960 We are this is minority report. We're living in minority report. Now, 0:09:16.000 --> 0:09:18.320 how soon is it going to be before someone's busting 0:09:18.360 --> 0:09:21.000 in your door because you are thinking about something? And 0:09:21.080 --> 0:09:24.880 it throws out innocent until proven guilty of rea because 0:09:24.880 --> 0:09:28.480 if we're actually sussing out people's thoughts and feelings. Well, 0:09:28.480 --> 0:09:31.800 they're just trying to jolly well ride the tube, and 0:09:31.840 --> 0:09:34.800 then they're tapping into that data. Say you are convicted 0:09:34.840 --> 0:09:38.320 of petty theft or something like that, how much of 0:09:38.360 --> 0:09:42.200 this is going to add value to such a case, 0:09:42.280 --> 0:09:44.680 and the prosecutor, even if it's not brought to court 0:09:44.720 --> 0:09:46.480 because they don't want the fact that they're doing this 0:09:46.600 --> 0:09:50.360 blown wide open, will be relying on that evidence in 0:09:50.400 --> 0:09:52.880 the back of their head knowing no, no, we reckon. 0:09:52.920 --> 0:09:54.280 We definitely got the guy. 0:09:54.480 --> 0:09:57.040 If you're recording my facial expression as I'm catching the 0:09:57.040 --> 0:09:59.000 train first thing in the morning, you would definitely be 0:09:59.040 --> 0:10:00.720 able to tell whether I'd had my coffee or not. 0:10:00.880 --> 0:10:04.199 That yeah, I don't conclude I don't want to be 0:10:04.240 --> 0:10:06.520 filmed first thing in the morning anyway, because I look 0:10:06.559 --> 0:10:08.040 pretty shocking when I wake up. 0:10:08.200 --> 0:10:10.479 But of course, so we've talked about the problems. 0:10:10.080 --> 0:10:12.720 With AI in terms of how they're using it against 0:10:12.800 --> 0:10:15.080 you and they're monitoring everything you're doing. But of course 0:10:15.120 --> 0:10:17.640 the other thing that AI is doing is making it 0:10:17.679 --> 0:10:18.320 more and more. 0:10:18.200 --> 0:10:20.600 Difficult to tell what is real. 0:10:20.760 --> 0:10:23.880 We have this what is called deep fake technology now 0:10:23.920 --> 0:10:27.880 which is where artificial intelligence is used to create something 0:10:28.080 --> 0:10:31.079 that is fake, that is false, be it a video 0:10:31.240 --> 0:10:34.320 or an image, it looks like the person who's saying it. 0:10:34.320 --> 0:10:38.079 It might be a voice recording that sounds convincingly like. 0:10:38.080 --> 0:10:40.680 The person who is supposedly. 0:10:40.040 --> 0:10:44.480 Saying it, and it is basically imperceptible as to whether 0:10:44.600 --> 0:10:46.480 or not it is real. And think about that for 0:10:46.480 --> 0:10:48.199 a minute. I mean, you could be watching a video 0:10:48.280 --> 0:10:51.560 online that is supposedly me, and it's me saying I 0:10:51.600 --> 0:10:54.520 hate jumps racing. Jumps racing should be banned. Now that 0:10:54.640 --> 0:10:56.920 might set off the alarm bells and you go, okay, well, 0:10:56.960 --> 0:10:58.880 I don't believe he would actually say that, but it 0:10:59.120 --> 0:11:02.480 genuinely look like I am saying it if you don't 0:11:02.520 --> 0:11:06.320 believe me. This is an example of how good deep 0:11:06.360 --> 0:11:07.480 fake technology is. 0:11:08.800 --> 0:11:11.840 Second youngest son's suggesting it came out of nowhere. What 0:11:11.920 --> 0:11:14.319 we subsequently learned is it may have come from the 0:11:14.360 --> 0:11:17.040 former president or his legal team acting in bad faith. 0:11:17.280 --> 0:11:19.760 This is deep fake example of what is possible with 0:11:19.920 --> 0:11:23.400 powerful computer and editing. It took around seventy two hours 0:11:23.440 --> 0:11:27.240 to create this example from scratch using extremely powerful GPU. 0:11:27.679 --> 0:11:30.280 It could be improved with more computing time, but ninety 0:11:30.280 --> 0:11:32.120 percent of people cannot tell the difference. 0:11:33.160 --> 0:11:34.679 I mean that is that is imperceptible. 0:11:34.720 --> 0:11:37.600 You would think you were actually watching the real Anderson 0:11:37.679 --> 0:11:41.080 Cooper there on the right. Well down in Victoria, criminals 0:11:41.120 --> 0:11:44.560 have started using this against each other. I love this 0:11:44.640 --> 0:11:47.679 story so much. Bikeis have decided that the best way 0:11:47.720 --> 0:11:49.720 they can get back at each other now is to 0:11:49.760 --> 0:11:54.520 start producing deep fake videos about each other to spread lies. 0:11:54.559 --> 0:11:56.960 Because of coase, people are watching Bikis and Crimson. What 0:11:56.960 --> 0:12:00.400 about watching these videos and thinking that it's actually the 0:12:00.440 --> 0:12:03.840 person that they're talking about. And one recent example that 0:12:03.880 --> 0:12:07.120 the Herald Son got hold of was a supposed news 0:12:07.160 --> 0:12:11.079 report from Channel seven. And the Herald Son has watched 0:12:11.160 --> 0:12:14.520 this footage and they say it looks like a genuine 0:12:14.600 --> 0:12:18.480 Channel seven report about two members of organized crime who've 0:12:18.520 --> 0:12:22.120 been involved in the illicit tobacco wars down in Victoria. 0:12:22.160 --> 0:12:24.559 And it starts off with a piece to camera from 0:12:24.640 --> 0:12:28.280 Cassie Zervos, who's a crime reporter at Channel seven. It 0:12:28.360 --> 0:12:31.400 all looks legit. It says that what these people have 0:12:31.480 --> 0:12:35.559 done will send shock waves through the community. The Herald's 0:12:35.559 --> 0:12:38.240 Son then says the report then throws to some earnest 0:12:38.280 --> 0:12:40.960 bloke who's meant to be a detective, urging the pair 0:12:41.040 --> 0:12:44.440 to turn themselves in and asking for public assistance. Any 0:12:44.520 --> 0:12:49.080 information provided will be treated with the utmost confidentiality and anonymity. 0:12:49.520 --> 0:12:52.720 The fake cop says, we are dedicating all available resources 0:12:52.960 --> 0:12:55.520 to this investigation. It, for all the world, looks like 0:12:55.760 --> 0:12:58.720 a legit detective. Next up as a bogus witness who 0:12:58.720 --> 0:13:00.679 claims to have seen the pair as he made his 0:13:00.679 --> 0:13:03.440 way to his local RSL club for the raffle. That 0:13:03.520 --> 0:13:07.160 fellow says, presumably for authenticity's sake, that he likes to 0:13:07.200 --> 0:13:10.959 get there early because he can't stand for long these days. Now, 0:13:10.960 --> 0:13:13.680 it is all quite comical that bikis are now using 0:13:13.840 --> 0:13:17.080 AI technology to fight against each other. But this is 0:13:17.120 --> 0:13:19.480 where we have come to. This tet is now so 0:13:19.679 --> 0:13:23.160 good that you can create a news bulletin that looks 0:13:23.200 --> 0:13:25.800 like a legit news bulletin and people are watching it 0:13:25.880 --> 0:13:27.760 and they think it's real. They can do it to you. 0:13:27.840 --> 0:13:29.360 They can do it to you, They can do it 0:13:29.360 --> 0:13:31.679 to me. They can even do it to you at home. 0:13:32.080 --> 0:13:35.480 The lines are being blurred by AI as to what 0:13:35.679 --> 0:13:38.360 is real and what is not. That I really worry 0:13:38.400 --> 0:13:41.920 in the next five ten years, how we will actually 0:13:41.960 --> 0:13:46.920 be able to tell what photos, what videos, what words. 0:13:46.559 --> 0:13:49.320 Are legit because you can just create anything. 0:13:49.360 --> 0:13:52.720 Now, this story really upset me because I just watched 0:13:52.760 --> 0:13:54.840 The Godfather for the first time the other night. 0:13:54.920 --> 0:13:59.600 You know the side before have you been watching other 0:13:59.640 --> 0:14:02.320 program So I decided to watch it. It is like it 0:14:02.320 --> 0:14:03.920 Marlon Brandoino. 0:14:04.240 --> 0:14:06.800 So You've got this image of gangsters and organized crime, 0:14:07.160 --> 0:14:08.520 and now I find out there are a bunch of 0:14:08.600 --> 0:14:14.640 computer geets with a milkshake, probably. 0:14:14.240 --> 0:14:18.040 Some computer geet with a gun. Hell, okay, put the 0:14:18.200 --> 0:14:19.240 things together quick. 0:14:19.960 --> 0:14:22.240 Anyway, it's just ruined my image of organized crime. I 0:14:22.240 --> 0:14:24.000 thought it was you know, well. 0:14:23.760 --> 0:14:27.720 Well they're getting sophisticated, right, but the outcomes of things 0:14:27.760 --> 0:14:30.600 like this, Obviously they're doing it to rile up the 0:14:30.680 --> 0:14:34.720 other gang. They're doing it to turn public sentiment against 0:14:34.760 --> 0:14:38.440 the other gang. Like we've got a favorite gang. We 0:14:38.520 --> 0:14:40.520 don't keep a list at home of Like, yeah, but 0:14:40.560 --> 0:14:43.120 I saw this thing on the internet. These guys are worse. No, 0:14:43.200 --> 0:14:45.320 you're all terrible, and we hate the stinking gut. 0:14:45.440 --> 0:14:47.560 Well in the gang world though, because like the real 0:14:47.600 --> 0:14:50.400 life consequences of something like this could be that it 0:14:50.440 --> 0:14:53.080 takes off within the gang world, and they believe it's legit, 0:14:53.200 --> 0:14:56.320 and they also to be the intent right, they got 0:14:56.920 --> 0:14:58.000 somewhat intense. 0:14:58.680 --> 0:15:00.800 So the other side of this is if they decide 0:15:00.800 --> 0:15:03.760 to give up crime, they've got a future in journalist money. 0:15:04.000 --> 0:15:06.000 That news report was really well written. 0:15:06.200 --> 0:15:10.040 I like that, it was very thoughtful. The fact that 0:15:10.080 --> 0:15:12.960 they even had like these people who were being interviewed 0:15:13.000 --> 0:15:15.280 just off the street and old mates like well, I 0:15:15.320 --> 0:15:18.720 can't stand for too long these days all very believable. 0:15:18.760 --> 0:15:20.640 I mean, whoever wrote the scripts. 0:15:21.760 --> 0:15:25.480 When you producers and angels or the you know, the 0:15:25.520 --> 0:15:26.520 camre Keevin. 0:15:28.240 --> 0:15:31.800 Yeah, and I'm sure the AI versions of us would 0:15:31.840 --> 0:15:35.640 be much cheaper. But Sky won't be giving in anytime soon, 0:15:35.720 --> 0:15:40.480 will you will? Our employers, please to the US now 0:15:40.560 --> 0:15:45.800 where Boeing is facing a Senate committee grilling. There has 0:15:45.880 --> 0:15:51.520 been many rumors, many whistleblowers over the years saying things 0:15:51.640 --> 0:15:55.600 are not well at Boeing. Well, the latest headline to 0:15:55.680 --> 0:15:59.360 greet us is this one here saying that dodgy parts 0:15:59.360 --> 0:16:05.080 were delivered brittlely being fitted. What is going on? Of course, 0:16:05.120 --> 0:16:08.120 this is a new whistle blower, the one who was 0:16:08.400 --> 0:16:11.560 facing he was in the middle of testifying at a 0:16:11.600 --> 0:16:17.400 deposition against Boeing months ago, when he suddenly showed up 0:16:17.920 --> 0:16:23.160 dead shot in his truck. Of course, a lot of 0:16:23.200 --> 0:16:26.840 people have trouble believing that John Barnett, the man who 0:16:26.880 --> 0:16:32.760 worked for Boeing for three decades before retiring in twenty seventeen, 0:16:33.360 --> 0:16:37.920 actually did take his own life. There he is there. 0:16:38.040 --> 0:16:42.160 He was known as by his fellow co workers as 0:16:42.160 --> 0:16:48.359 an extremely brave whistleblower who made many, many extremely influential 0:16:48.400 --> 0:16:52.240 and powerful enemies in his last days. So there are 0:16:52.280 --> 0:16:55.920 a lot of aspersions. Quite rightly, I would argue being 0:16:56.120 --> 0:17:01.840 cast about what actually happened to Barnett. But back to 0:17:01.920 --> 0:17:05.479 this Senate committee, they've taken up the cause. You would remember, 0:17:05.760 --> 0:17:11.159 in twenty nineteen, two Boeings crashed, killing everyone on board. 0:17:11.240 --> 0:17:16.159 We've seen several reports since of not quite crashes, but 0:17:16.359 --> 0:17:20.480 certainly near misses and people being injured as a result. 0:17:20.560 --> 0:17:23.760 So finally the federal government in the US is taking 0:17:23.800 --> 0:17:28.680 them to task. His Senator Josh Hawley raking them over 0:17:28.720 --> 0:17:29.240 the coals. 0:17:30.920 --> 0:17:32.920 Help me understand that, I mean, do you get paid 0:17:32.960 --> 0:17:35.840 for transparency? Is that part of is that one of 0:17:35.880 --> 0:17:37.920 the metrics for your income? 0:17:38.440 --> 0:17:40.760 I think the board counts on me for transparency. 0:17:40.840 --> 0:17:44.560 Really, because you're under investigation for falsifying seven eighty seven 0:17:44.640 --> 0:17:48.960 inspection records, the Boeings under criminal investigation for the Alaska 0:17:49.160 --> 0:17:54.440 Airlines flight. You were investigated by DOJ for criminal conspiracy 0:17:54.480 --> 0:17:57.119 to defraud the FAA. This is all in your tenure. 0:17:57.200 --> 0:17:59.879 This doesn't sound like a lot of transparency to me. 0:18:00.520 --> 0:18:02.400 And frankly, Sir, I think it's a travesy that you're 0:18:02.400 --> 0:18:03.120 still in your job. 0:18:04.640 --> 0:18:08.320 Here here you can hear for yourself that litany of abuses. 0:18:08.400 --> 0:18:11.760 And yet Boeing seems to have dodged and weaved their 0:18:11.800 --> 0:18:17.639 way effortlessly through it, whistleblower after whistleblower. But their CEO 0:18:18.240 --> 0:18:21.480 actually paid a visit to this Senate committee in order 0:18:21.520 --> 0:18:24.919 to apologize to the families who had lost their loved 0:18:24.960 --> 0:18:28.560 ones in the two Boeing crashes of twenty nineteen. 0:18:30.000 --> 0:18:32.400 And I apologize for the grief that we have caused, 0:18:33.320 --> 0:18:35.480 and I want you to know we are totally committed 0:18:35.560 --> 0:18:39.840 in their memory, the work and focus on safety for. 0:18:39.800 --> 0:18:42.520 As long as long as we're employed by Bombing. 0:18:43.480 --> 0:18:44.440 So again, I'm. 0:18:44.240 --> 0:18:49.679 Sorry, very cold comfort to those families, I'm sure now, 0:18:50.040 --> 0:18:53.800 John Barnett took this up as soon as he retired, basically. 0:18:53.880 --> 0:18:56.760 In fact, he testified that he took it up before 0:18:56.840 --> 0:19:02.000 he retired and would send emails regards the shoddy workmanship 0:19:02.080 --> 0:19:05.800 going on. He claimed that they were deliberately fitting faulty 0:19:05.840 --> 0:19:09.639 parts even back then in order to make these deadlines 0:19:09.680 --> 0:19:13.480 that they had for production, and he was always told 0:19:13.640 --> 0:19:17.120 off for it, he said in person, which he took 0:19:17.160 --> 0:19:21.680 to mean stop making a paper trail. We don't want 0:19:21.720 --> 0:19:25.399 you sending these emails, John Barnett, please just speak to 0:19:25.480 --> 0:19:27.320 us in person so we can brush it under the 0:19:27.359 --> 0:19:30.240 carpet and do absolutely nothing about it. So we know 0:19:30.400 --> 0:19:34.000 that this has been going on for a very long time. Now, 0:19:34.119 --> 0:19:38.440 Thank goodness, the federal government in the US is finally 0:19:38.480 --> 0:19:42.000 taking this seriously and taking up the cause themselves. But 0:19:42.520 --> 0:19:45.919 no justice for the families who have lost their loved ones. 0:19:46.240 --> 0:19:48.520 And we don't know yet whether it will lead to 0:19:48.560 --> 0:19:53.280 any justice in terms of Boeing making airplanes worth flying on. 0:19:53.480 --> 0:19:55.600 None of this news is going to allay the fears 0:19:55.640 --> 0:19:56.800 of nervous flys. 0:19:57.440 --> 0:19:59.600 And it all sort of came to public attention, as 0:19:59.600 --> 0:20:00.080 you said in. 0:20:00.200 --> 0:20:04.600 January, when a door blew off of a Boeing aircraft 0:20:04.600 --> 0:20:09.000 over Portland. Then within weeks a aircraft at Atlanta Airport 0:20:09.000 --> 0:20:11.960 are Boeing lost its front tire as it was going 0:20:11.960 --> 0:20:14.879 along the runway. They had five incidents in four weeks, 0:20:15.240 --> 0:20:18.080 and then Boeing very high profile in the public eye. 0:20:18.080 --> 0:20:21.480 And this latest whistleblower who you spoke about, said that 0:20:21.640 --> 0:20:25.720 in order to avoid inspections, they took faulty parts and 0:20:25.800 --> 0:20:28.640 hit them out the back, and then over time these 0:20:28.680 --> 0:20:31.280 parts were moved again, and then they sort of lost 0:20:31.320 --> 0:20:33.479 track of these parts, which were dabbed with a bit 0:20:33.520 --> 0:20:36.320 of red paint. And the suspicion is some of those 0:20:36.320 --> 0:20:39.400 faulty parts were installed on new aircraft. So if you're 0:20:39.400 --> 0:20:41.320 getting on a Boeing plane, you look at the window 0:20:41.320 --> 0:20:44.320 and there's a dab of red paint on the very 0:20:44.480 --> 0:20:46.560 very many different problem. 0:20:46.760 --> 0:20:49.160 The problem is that you're already on the plane, so 0:20:49.240 --> 0:20:50.000 you're a little bit staff. 0:20:50.119 --> 0:20:53.119 The other interesting part of this is that the CEO 0:20:53.160 --> 0:20:58.919