1 00:00:01,780 --> 00:00:04,779 Speaker 1: News of an alleged rape involving seven men at an 2 00:00:04,860 --> 00:00:08,540 Speaker 1: elite university, a case being called the Cornell Seven, is 3 00:00:08,580 --> 00:00:12,690 Speaker 1: reverberating across the US. For many people, the case and 4 00:00:12,710 --> 00:00:15,790 Speaker 1: the way the men and institutions involved responded at the 5 00:00:15,810 --> 00:00:21,390 Speaker 1: time echoes high-profile incidents here in Australia. So what responsibilities 6 00:00:21,510 --> 00:00:24,380 Speaker 1: are our institutions failing to live up to and what 7 00:00:24,400 --> 00:00:27,680 Speaker 1: should they be doing differently? I'm Ruby Jones, and you're 8 00:00:27,720 --> 00:00:32,280 Speaker 1: listening to 7am. Today, advocate Taring Chawla on the so-called 9 00:00:32,380 --> 00:00:35,510 Speaker 1: Cornell 7 and what the case tells us about misogyny 10 00:00:35,550 --> 00:00:35,930 Speaker 1: at home. 11 00:00:39,570 --> 00:00:42,650 Speaker 2: It's Friday, October 2. 12 00:00:43,070 --> 00:00:45,409 Speaker 1: And a warning, while we try not to get too graphic, 13 00:00:45,490 --> 00:00:51,250 Speaker 1: this episode does cover sexual assault. Trang, let's begin by 14 00:00:51,330 --> 00:00:55,350 Speaker 1: talking about the, quote, Cornell 7 as they've become known, 15 00:00:55,470 --> 00:00:58,380 Speaker 1: and this really awful case that we're hearing about in 16 00:00:58,400 --> 00:00:59,000 Speaker 1: the US. 17 00:00:59,660 --> 00:01:01,440 Speaker 2: Tell me about what's been alleged. 18 00:01:02,080 --> 00:01:05,560 Speaker 3: So the allegations at this point that we know about 19 00:01:05,680 --> 00:01:08,670 Speaker 3: are that there was a young female university student who 20 00:01:08,750 --> 00:01:12,280 Speaker 3: was allegedly plied with drugs and alcohol and who is 21 00:01:12,400 --> 00:01:16,240 Speaker 3: unconscious in a fraternity room upstairs, and she was subsequently 22 00:01:16,520 --> 00:01:19,810 Speaker 3: allegedly gang raped by seven male students after one of 23 00:01:19,860 --> 00:01:24,429 Speaker 3: them put out on the fraternity group chat that there is, quote, 24 00:01:24,790 --> 00:01:28,810 Speaker 3: free pussy upstairs. There were 57 men on that chat, 25 00:01:29,150 --> 00:01:33,610 Speaker 3: and two of the seven were expelled following a university investigation. 26 00:01:34,110 --> 00:01:36,810 Speaker 3: And then the others, it's been reported across the news 27 00:01:36,850 --> 00:01:40,039 Speaker 3: in the US, were exiled. made to do workshops or 28 00:01:40,060 --> 00:01:44,070 Speaker 3: were assigned to write essays as punishment for the alleged 29 00:01:44,170 --> 00:01:48,280 Speaker 3: actions and so Cornell has denied this. The university has 30 00:01:48,320 --> 00:01:52,040 Speaker 3: said that the consequential punishments, they weren't handed out in 31 00:01:52,200 --> 00:01:55,450 Speaker 3: that way, but it won't provide any specific information and 32 00:01:55,470 --> 00:01:59,630 Speaker 3: it's citing federal privacy laws. But obviously advocates, women, victim 33 00:01:59,650 --> 00:02:04,210 Speaker 3: survivors across the world are enraged that, you know, these allegations. 34 00:02:04,130 --> 00:02:05,250 Speaker 4: Could ever happen in the first place. 35 00:02:05,290 --> 00:02:07,790 Speaker 3: And they sort of speak to a widespread issue of 36 00:02:07,870 --> 00:02:12,350 Speaker 3: sexual violence on university campuses and school environments across the world. 37 00:02:13,160 --> 00:02:15,880 Speaker 1: And you mentioned the group chat and the message that 38 00:02:15,919 --> 00:02:19,680 Speaker 1: was sent out. It's been reported that there were 57 39 00:02:19,680 --> 00:02:22,880 Speaker 1: men who were on that group chat. So that's around 40 00:02:22,880 --> 00:02:25,660 Speaker 1: 50 men who said nothing when that message went out. 41 00:02:25,820 --> 00:02:28,850 Speaker 1: What does that say to you about the broader cultural 42 00:02:28,889 --> 00:02:29,410 Speaker 1: problem here? 43 00:02:29,430 --> 00:02:32,370 Speaker 4: Yeah, it's such a harrowing thing to think about. 44 00:02:32,830 --> 00:02:34,829 Speaker 3: If we want to be frank with ourselves, we have 45 00:02:34,850 --> 00:02:37,130 Speaker 3: to look at the consequences for this alleged victim who 46 00:02:37,169 --> 00:02:39,500 Speaker 3: has dropped out of university and, according to her lawyer, 47 00:02:39,570 --> 00:02:40,600 Speaker 3: is barely hanging on. 48 00:02:40,620 --> 00:02:45,140 Speaker 5: Her life has... been destroyed. She's a woman who comes 49 00:02:45,180 --> 00:02:49,140 Speaker 5: from a small town. She was not somebody who was 50 00:02:49,180 --> 00:02:52,250 Speaker 5: a legacy or somebody who was from a wealthy family. 51 00:02:52,430 --> 00:02:54,970 Speaker 5: This was her dream. And it was taken away from 52 00:02:55,010 --> 00:02:58,310 Speaker 5: her at a young age in just a horrific fashion. 53 00:02:58,730 --> 00:03:03,060 Speaker 5: And she's not even in college anymore. She is barely 54 00:03:03,100 --> 00:03:03,730 Speaker 5: hanging on. 55 00:03:04,139 --> 00:03:06,660 Speaker 3: And what we know about the allegations so far is 56 00:03:06,700 --> 00:03:09,480 Speaker 3: that this alleged act took place over seven hours. So 57 00:03:09,520 --> 00:03:11,660 Speaker 3: that is, you know, that is like the equivalent of 58 00:03:11,700 --> 00:03:14,100 Speaker 3: flying from Melbourne to Singapore. And all of that time, 59 00:03:14,480 --> 00:03:18,710 Speaker 3: someone decided not to do a single thing. And this, 60 00:03:18,760 --> 00:03:21,760 Speaker 3: to me, just speaks to that cultural problem of male 61 00:03:21,820 --> 00:03:24,680 Speaker 3: silence helping to enable male violence. Not one of those 62 00:03:24,760 --> 00:03:27,280 Speaker 3: people allegedly called the police, not one of them intervened 63 00:03:27,300 --> 00:03:29,440 Speaker 3: to say, hey, hang on a minute, this is wrong. 64 00:03:29,600 --> 00:03:31,460 Speaker 3: And I think one of the ways that we need 65 00:03:31,480 --> 00:03:34,359 Speaker 3: to approach these conversations with boys and men is to 66 00:03:34,419 --> 00:03:36,310 Speaker 3: have a whole lot more nuance than we currently do. 67 00:03:36,380 --> 00:03:40,330 Speaker 3: We've got to create the environment where social permission exists 68 00:03:40,410 --> 00:03:42,730 Speaker 3: to actually be the one outlier to say, hey, this 69 00:03:42,810 --> 00:03:43,430 Speaker 3: is not okay. 70 00:03:44,010 --> 00:03:46,610 Speaker 4: Because at the moment, men care more about what other 71 00:03:46,630 --> 00:03:47,510 Speaker 4: men might think. 72 00:03:47,330 --> 00:03:50,010 Speaker 3: Or perceived loss of like a social safety net than 73 00:03:50,030 --> 00:03:53,510 Speaker 3: the actual physical safety of women and girls. 74 00:03:53,530 --> 00:03:55,040 Speaker 4: And I think that's something that a lot of. 75 00:03:55,060 --> 00:03:57,500 Speaker 3: Australian listeners will be able to relate to, that idea 76 00:03:57,520 --> 00:04:00,080 Speaker 3: that we don't dog the boys. We need to have 77 00:04:00,100 --> 00:04:03,540 Speaker 3: frank communication. and earnest conversations with boys and men that 78 00:04:03,720 --> 00:04:07,200 Speaker 3: accountability does not mean blame. It's not about punishment for 79 00:04:07,240 --> 00:04:10,670 Speaker 3: you as an individual, but it's about understanding that accountability 80 00:04:10,690 --> 00:04:13,170 Speaker 3: is empathy for your own values, as well as for 81 00:04:13,230 --> 00:04:14,090 Speaker 3: the rights. 82 00:04:13,850 --> 00:04:15,630 Speaker 4: And safety and dignity of women and girls. 83 00:04:15,730 --> 00:04:20,060 Speaker 3: And so I think this example as horrific and extreme 84 00:04:20,180 --> 00:04:23,099 Speaker 3: as it is for parents and educators is an opportunity 85 00:04:23,140 --> 00:04:25,810 Speaker 3: to go well if you heard about something like this 86 00:04:25,850 --> 00:04:27,670 Speaker 3: happening what would you do if you're one of those 87 00:04:27,670 --> 00:04:30,650 Speaker 3: 50 what would you do if you knew that your 88 00:04:30,710 --> 00:04:32,790 Speaker 3: boys around you were making these kinds of comments in 89 00:04:32,810 --> 00:04:35,240 Speaker 3: the group chat or that they joked about doing something 90 00:04:35,300 --> 00:04:37,480 Speaker 3: violent to a woman a girl or they shared a 91 00:04:37,520 --> 00:04:41,359 Speaker 3: deep fake pornographic image of a woman or girl that 92 00:04:41,380 --> 00:04:43,780 Speaker 3: they created through AI, what would you do? Would you 93 00:04:43,820 --> 00:04:46,200 Speaker 3: tell a teacher? Would you tell a trusted adult? Would 94 00:04:46,220 --> 00:04:47,830 Speaker 3: you talk to someone about it? Would you go to 95 00:04:47,850 --> 00:04:51,350 Speaker 3: law enforcement? And helping them understand that they are not 96 00:04:51,430 --> 00:04:54,290 Speaker 3: powerless here. They actually have options that are available to them. 97 00:04:54,370 --> 00:04:56,450 Speaker 3: And it shouldn't be on women and girls to constantly 98 00:04:56,490 --> 00:04:57,830 Speaker 3: have to wave the flag for this. 99 00:05:00,300 --> 00:05:03,060 Speaker 1: And this particular case is obviously playing out on the 100 00:05:03,080 --> 00:05:08,380 Speaker 1: other side of the world. It Why do you think 101 00:05:08,420 --> 00:05:12,240 Speaker 1: it is that it is stoking these conversations in Australia? 102 00:05:12,480 --> 00:05:15,740 Speaker 1: How do you think the kind of cultural response compares? 103 00:05:16,420 --> 00:05:19,000 Speaker 3: I think the reason that this has really struck a 104 00:05:19,040 --> 00:05:22,940 Speaker 3: chord in Australia is that we've seen recent allegations around 105 00:05:23,000 --> 00:05:24,200 Speaker 3: Sydney Swans players. 106 00:05:24,240 --> 00:05:26,720 Speaker 6: Key players for the Sydney Swans are expected to be 107 00:05:26,820 --> 00:05:30,260 Speaker 6: charged by the AFL as police continue investigating. 108 00:05:30,740 --> 00:05:33,640 Speaker 1: an alleged sexual assault at the team's Melbourne hotel. 109 00:05:33,760 --> 00:05:37,520 Speaker 3: We have allegations of boys from the, you know, so-called 110 00:05:37,560 --> 00:05:39,500 Speaker 3: elite Scots College in Sydney. 111 00:05:39,600 --> 00:05:43,029 Speaker 7: Three young teenage boys from the prestigious Scots College in 112 00:05:43,110 --> 00:05:47,469 Speaker 7: Sydney's eastern suburbs are tonight charged with the aggravated sexual 113 00:05:47,510 --> 00:05:49,570 Speaker 7: assault of a 14-year-old girl. 114 00:05:49,810 --> 00:05:53,070 Speaker 3: We've got allegations around St Gregory's in New South Wales. 115 00:05:53,210 --> 00:05:56,650 Speaker 6: Well, sickening details have emerged this afternoon with three teenage 116 00:05:56,690 --> 00:06:00,420 Speaker 6: boys now charged over the alleged rape of a 17-year-old 117 00:06:00,460 --> 00:06:05,279 Speaker 6: girl in Sydney's southwest. Olivia Blunden is live outside Gregory's 118 00:06:05,339 --> 00:06:08,540 Speaker 6: College where two of the boys are students. 119 00:06:08,740 --> 00:06:11,310 Speaker 3: Other things out of my home state of Victoria and 120 00:06:11,440 --> 00:06:15,010 Speaker 3: others around the country. And I think we're seeing the 121 00:06:15,070 --> 00:06:18,850 Speaker 3: way that male entitlement and exceptionalism is being bred in 122 00:06:18,890 --> 00:06:22,719 Speaker 3: an environment of growing class inequality, of people having cost 123 00:06:22,779 --> 00:06:27,150 Speaker 3: of living pressures and tied away from the belief that 124 00:06:27,170 --> 00:06:31,350 Speaker 3: gender equality benefits everyone. We're seeing how these environments are 125 00:06:31,390 --> 00:06:34,600 Speaker 3: creating physical spaces for men and boys where there are 126 00:06:34,640 --> 00:06:38,159 Speaker 3: no consequences for their actions. So we've got an environment 127 00:06:38,180 --> 00:06:40,320 Speaker 3: where they can get away with this kind of stuff 128 00:06:40,339 --> 00:06:43,520 Speaker 3: with relative impunity. I think in the Australian context, it's 129 00:06:43,580 --> 00:06:46,890 Speaker 3: resonated because we're so sick and tired, women and victim 130 00:06:46,910 --> 00:06:49,690 Speaker 3: survivors and their advocates and allies, of seeing this kind 131 00:06:49,730 --> 00:06:53,410 Speaker 3: of behaviour go without consequence or accountability for far too long. 132 00:06:54,230 --> 00:06:55,890 Speaker 2: Do you think there needs to be more pressure on 133 00:06:55,910 --> 00:06:59,610 Speaker 2: the institutions in cases like this? So the universities, the 134 00:06:59,670 --> 00:07:01,250 Speaker 2: schools and their leadership? 135 00:07:01,670 --> 00:07:03,950 Speaker 4: Oh, absolutely. There has to be. There has to be. 136 00:07:03,970 --> 00:07:06,300 Speaker 3: You can't, you know, call yourself one of the Ivy 137 00:07:06,330 --> 00:07:10,340 Speaker 3: League universities and be a so-called elite institution if you're 138 00:07:10,520 --> 00:07:16,820 Speaker 3: educating boys implicitly or explicitly that it's acceptable to see 139 00:07:16,860 --> 00:07:20,280 Speaker 3: this kind of conduct and say or do nothing. frankly, 140 00:07:20,610 --> 00:07:23,410 Speaker 3: it is on institutions and it's incumbent on them to act. 141 00:07:23,450 --> 00:07:25,440 Speaker 3: I know in the Australian context, there is now a 142 00:07:25,980 --> 00:07:28,580 Speaker 3: a new national higher education code around the prevention of 143 00:07:28,620 --> 00:07:31,840 Speaker 3: gender-based violence, which came into place earlier this year, around February. 144 00:07:32,380 --> 00:07:35,860 Speaker 3: But we're seeing that, you know, these cultural issues are 145 00:07:35,900 --> 00:07:38,500 Speaker 3: not resolved by a piece of paper or a PDF 146 00:07:38,560 --> 00:07:42,000 Speaker 3: on a computer screen. They're resolved by actually embedding cultural 147 00:07:42,050 --> 00:07:48,370 Speaker 3: practices that change the way that universities, educational institutions, and 148 00:07:48,410 --> 00:07:50,710 Speaker 3: the broader communities around them respond to these actions. 149 00:07:50,810 --> 00:07:53,540 Speaker 4: You know, for So, for example, later this year. 150 00:07:53,600 --> 00:07:58,300 Speaker 3: There's a symposium around safer communities around university campuses, knowing 151 00:07:58,320 --> 00:08:00,160 Speaker 3: that this is an issue that's happening here in Australia 152 00:08:00,180 --> 00:08:02,880 Speaker 3: as well. And one of the problems that's been relayed 153 00:08:02,920 --> 00:08:05,340 Speaker 3: to me from university staff who work in the area 154 00:08:05,360 --> 00:08:08,620 Speaker 3: and care deeply is that victim survivors are afraid to 155 00:08:08,660 --> 00:08:11,960 Speaker 3: go public because they're more worried about the consequences to them, 156 00:08:12,500 --> 00:08:15,730 Speaker 3: even though they're victims of rape and other serious crimes. 157 00:08:17,500 --> 00:08:19,580 Speaker 3: And so that really tells me that we're living in 158 00:08:19,640 --> 00:08:23,260 Speaker 3: a world where the consequences are not where they should be. 159 00:08:23,300 --> 00:08:26,360 Speaker 3: And it reminds me, I suppose, of Giselle Pellicott's words 160 00:08:26,380 --> 00:08:28,810 Speaker 3: where she said that shame has to change sides. The 161 00:08:28,850 --> 00:08:31,350 Speaker 3: shame shouldn't be with victim-survivors and women and girls who 162 00:08:31,370 --> 00:08:34,270 Speaker 3: are speaking up. It should be with perpetrators. And educational 163 00:08:34,309 --> 00:08:38,230 Speaker 3: institutions or sporting leagues, etc., should be much more concerned 164 00:08:38,370 --> 00:08:41,850 Speaker 3: about the impacts on victim-survivors in the community than the 165 00:08:41,890 --> 00:08:44,550 Speaker 3: perceived reputational damage when these things come to light. 166 00:08:50,730 --> 00:08:53,230 Speaker 1: Coming up, the federal government is working on its next 167 00:08:53,390 --> 00:09:06,630 Speaker 1: action plan. So what would actually make a difference? So, Trang, 168 00:09:07,030 --> 00:09:11,140 Speaker 1: the national conversation in Australia around consent and misogyny and 169 00:09:11,179 --> 00:09:14,660 Speaker 1: violence against women, it's been swirling for years now. You've 170 00:09:14,679 --> 00:09:18,110 Speaker 1: been part of it through your advocacy, yet it's hard 171 00:09:18,250 --> 00:09:20,530 Speaker 1: to see any real change or progress. 172 00:09:20,630 --> 00:09:22,350 Speaker 2: So what do. 173 00:09:22,290 --> 00:09:26,069 Speaker 1: You see that does give you any sense of hope 174 00:09:26,110 --> 00:09:27,890 Speaker 1: in this space? Or do you think we are kind 175 00:09:27,929 --> 00:09:29,170 Speaker 1: of headed in the wrong direction? 176 00:09:29,630 --> 00:09:32,390 Speaker 3: I think it's difficult to maintain hope. I came to 177 00:09:32,429 --> 00:09:34,590 Speaker 3: be involved in this area following the murder of my 178 00:09:34,630 --> 00:09:39,340 Speaker 3: younger sister, Nikki, in 2015. And there's been some excellent 179 00:09:39,390 --> 00:09:42,720 Speaker 3: progress in terms of how we speak about these issues 180 00:09:42,820 --> 00:09:45,020 Speaker 3: and that there are more men who are now willing 181 00:09:45,100 --> 00:09:48,600 Speaker 3: to speak up and to help also amplify the voices 182 00:09:48,640 --> 00:09:51,040 Speaker 3: and experiences of women and girls. But there's also a 183 00:09:51,100 --> 00:09:55,230 Speaker 3: sobering reality, which is that boys now, some of them 184 00:09:55,270 --> 00:09:58,449 Speaker 3: are holding more damaging views about women and girls than 185 00:09:58,470 --> 00:10:01,240 Speaker 3: their grandparents' generation. So in some way, we've gone backwards. 186 00:10:01,780 --> 00:10:04,160 Speaker 3: And what often gets talked about in these situations is 187 00:10:04,179 --> 00:10:06,959 Speaker 3: the influence of the Manosphere and Andrew Tate and online 188 00:10:06,980 --> 00:10:13,260 Speaker 3: creators and care bill and and all of that will 189 00:10:13,360 --> 00:10:16,679 Speaker 3: go some way to helping you know curb these kinds 190 00:10:16,720 --> 00:10:19,620 Speaker 3: of messages but i think the broader piece which lingers 191 00:10:19,840 --> 00:10:22,910 Speaker 3: is that these views aren't new misogyny wasn't created by 192 00:10:22,950 --> 00:10:25,550 Speaker 3: an algorithm it's certainly amplified by and so we still 193 00:10:25,610 --> 00:10:28,130 Speaker 3: are living in that world and so it's really difficult 194 00:10:28,150 --> 00:10:30,950 Speaker 3: in that environment to have hope but seeing the voices 195 00:10:30,990 --> 00:10:33,700 Speaker 3: of victim survivors and seeing that one example can make 196 00:10:33,790 --> 00:10:36,540 Speaker 3: news globally and and cause this level of uproar and 197 00:10:36,580 --> 00:10:40,219 Speaker 3: actually prompt uh you know, a reopening of a criminal investigation, 198 00:10:40,300 --> 00:10:42,660 Speaker 3: I think is a really telling example that we are 199 00:10:42,700 --> 00:10:44,679 Speaker 3: seeing progress and that if you want to be on 200 00:10:44,700 --> 00:10:47,040 Speaker 3: the right side of history, particularly for men who are listening, 201 00:10:47,120 --> 00:10:49,620 Speaker 3: that you should be more vocal in speaking up about 202 00:10:49,640 --> 00:10:51,680 Speaker 3: this and also listening to the experiences of women and 203 00:10:51,710 --> 00:10:53,970 Speaker 3: girls to understand the reality that they go through. 204 00:10:54,490 --> 00:10:57,090 Speaker 4: It's simply not good enough to say, not all men. 205 00:10:57,250 --> 00:11:00,150 Speaker 3: If we're going to say that with any semblance of sincerity, 206 00:11:00,190 --> 00:11:01,869 Speaker 3: then we have to actually give women and girls a 207 00:11:01,929 --> 00:11:03,430 Speaker 3: reason to believe that that's the case. 208 00:11:04,460 --> 00:11:07,250 Speaker 1: And just a few weeks ago, the Commissioner into Domestic 209 00:11:07,390 --> 00:11:10,590 Speaker 1: and Family and Sexual Violence released her annual report. 210 00:11:11,050 --> 00:11:12,650 Speaker 2: Taking a look at that, I mean, what did it 211 00:11:12,690 --> 00:11:16,380 Speaker 2: say to you about where Australia currently is on addressing this? 212 00:11:16,970 --> 00:11:18,110 Speaker 4: I think it spoke to a few things. 213 00:11:18,170 --> 00:11:21,500 Speaker 3: It spoke to the fact that despite other parts of 214 00:11:21,540 --> 00:11:24,679 Speaker 3: violent crime decreasing in the community, we are still seeing 215 00:11:24,700 --> 00:11:27,780 Speaker 3: intimate partner violence be a widespread issue. And in the 216 00:11:27,820 --> 00:11:29,660 Speaker 3: words of the United Nations, it is one of the 217 00:11:29,700 --> 00:11:33,480 Speaker 3: most devastating human rights violations globally. Australia is no different. 218 00:11:34,240 --> 00:11:38,940 Speaker 3: What is heartening, particularly out of Commissioner Cronin's comments, is 219 00:11:38,980 --> 00:11:42,760 Speaker 3: that sexual violence will be treated as urgent priority. We're 220 00:11:42,800 --> 00:11:45,969 Speaker 3: seeing that the most likely perpetrator of sexual violence is 221 00:11:46,010 --> 00:11:48,469 Speaker 3: now a teen boy. And so it really puts an 222 00:11:48,510 --> 00:11:51,570 Speaker 3: emphasis on male peer relations. For me, this comes down 223 00:11:51,590 --> 00:11:55,250 Speaker 3: to all the government plans and actions and commitments are 224 00:11:55,340 --> 00:11:57,920 Speaker 3: only as good as the sort of collective and individual 225 00:11:58,100 --> 00:12:00,720 Speaker 3: responsibility and accountability that we're willing to take. So for 226 00:12:00,780 --> 00:12:03,520 Speaker 3: men who are in their sort of day-to-day environments, thinking 227 00:12:03,600 --> 00:12:05,640 Speaker 3: about what is the example that they're setting with how 228 00:12:05,660 --> 00:12:07,349 Speaker 3: they treat women and girls? What are the kinds of 229 00:12:07,410 --> 00:12:09,290 Speaker 3: jokes that they're laughing at? What are the kinds of 230 00:12:09,330 --> 00:12:12,290 Speaker 3: behaviours that they're willing to walk past? And what are 231 00:12:12,309 --> 00:12:15,090 Speaker 3: the things that they're open to challenging? And so I'm 232 00:12:15,150 --> 00:12:17,610 Speaker 3: heartened by some of the things in the Commissioner's report, 233 00:12:17,650 --> 00:12:20,250 Speaker 3: but I'm also a bit worried about the complacency of 234 00:12:20,290 --> 00:12:22,200 Speaker 3: a lot of Australian men when it comes to this issue. 235 00:12:22,780 --> 00:12:23,400 Speaker 2: And you mentioned. 236 00:12:24,170 --> 00:12:27,250 Speaker 1: the federal government's actions it's set to release its second 237 00:12:27,450 --> 00:12:31,110 Speaker 1: action plan to end domestic family and sexual violence next 238 00:12:31,210 --> 00:12:35,970 Speaker 1: year i mean what would make a difference what what 239 00:12:35,990 --> 00:12:37,600 Speaker 1: would you like to see in that plan. 240 00:12:37,960 --> 00:12:39,540 Speaker 3: I think one of the things when it comes to 241 00:12:39,600 --> 00:12:42,740 Speaker 3: these government plans is funding that is commensurate with the 242 00:12:42,760 --> 00:12:45,840 Speaker 3: scale of the problem. When we've got governments that are 243 00:12:45,920 --> 00:12:49,500 Speaker 3: able to fund submarines, they're able to think about the 244 00:12:49,540 --> 00:12:53,350 Speaker 3: implications of national security. Well, new research out of the 245 00:12:53,490 --> 00:12:57,070 Speaker 3: University of Melbourne confirms that misogyny is one of the 246 00:12:57,130 --> 00:13:01,270 Speaker 3: greatest predictors of other forms of violent extremism as well. 247 00:13:01,390 --> 00:13:03,570 Speaker 3: So it is now a national security issue that we 248 00:13:03,610 --> 00:13:06,430 Speaker 3: address misogyny. And so investment in those areas, as well 249 00:13:06,490 --> 00:13:09,370 Speaker 3: as treating victim survivors across the whole life cycle. So 250 00:13:09,390 --> 00:13:12,339 Speaker 3: seeing children as victim survivors in their own right is crucial, 251 00:13:12,429 --> 00:13:14,460 Speaker 3: as well as for those women who are able to 252 00:13:14,520 --> 00:13:19,339 Speaker 3: escape abusive or violent or controlling relationships. Ensuring that they're 253 00:13:19,360 --> 00:13:22,400 Speaker 3: supported for the life cycle, just because they are no 254 00:13:22,440 --> 00:13:24,600 Speaker 3: longer in an abusive relationship doesn't mean that they don't 255 00:13:24,640 --> 00:13:27,979 Speaker 3: have lifelong lingering trauma. And so actually funding that is 256 00:13:28,020 --> 00:13:30,520 Speaker 3: appropriate and tailored to the needs of victim survivors and 257 00:13:30,580 --> 00:13:33,060 Speaker 3: is trauma-informed will go a long way. As for the 258 00:13:33,120 --> 00:13:35,430 Speaker 3: actual mechanics of the plan, what I think is really 259 00:13:35,470 --> 00:13:38,130 Speaker 3: important and what I've been very vocal about saying to 260 00:13:38,170 --> 00:13:41,610 Speaker 3: Minister Plibersek and others, and frankly, anyone who'll listen really, 261 00:13:41,710 --> 00:13:43,469 Speaker 3: is that we need to have accountability. We have to 262 00:13:43,510 --> 00:13:46,040 Speaker 3: treat these issues the way that, you know, the corporate 263 00:13:46,059 --> 00:13:48,780 Speaker 3: sector would treat something where it's like, who's responsible for it? 264 00:13:48,840 --> 00:13:50,340 Speaker 4: How much is it costing? And when will it be 265 00:13:50,360 --> 00:13:50,880 Speaker 4: delivered by? 266 00:13:51,460 --> 00:13:53,360 Speaker 3: We can't have these things where the government says we're 267 00:13:53,380 --> 00:13:56,450 Speaker 3: investing X million or X billion, but five years later, 268 00:13:56,490 --> 00:13:58,730 Speaker 3: we're having the same conversation or two other people are 269 00:13:58,750 --> 00:14:00,990 Speaker 3: on a podcast having the exact same conversation about how 270 00:14:01,030 --> 00:14:04,170 Speaker 3: little progress we've made. Because if we don't do that, 271 00:14:04,330 --> 00:14:07,020 Speaker 3: then we're going to see the human cost of women 272 00:14:07,040 --> 00:14:08,339 Speaker 3: and girls continue to rise. 273 00:14:10,320 --> 00:14:12,100 Speaker 2: Tarang, thank you so much for speaking with me. 274 00:14:12,620 --> 00:14:13,020 Speaker 4: Thanks, Ruby. 275 00:14:25,700 --> 00:14:28,320 Speaker 7: Also in the news, the RBA has warned the risk 276 00:14:28,380 --> 00:14:31,640 Speaker 7: to Australia from a major global financial shock is growing. 277 00:14:32,210 --> 00:14:34,590 Speaker 7: The bank has now flagged that first home buyers, including 278 00:14:34,650 --> 00:14:38,010 Speaker 7: those who access the 5% deposit scheme, are more likely 279 00:14:38,030 --> 00:14:41,150 Speaker 7: to end up in negative equity as property prices fall 280 00:14:41,550 --> 00:14:45,200 Speaker 7: and interest rates rise. It also warned of red flags 281 00:14:45,260 --> 00:14:48,480 Speaker 7: in the finance behind AI, which is becoming more opaque 282 00:14:48,620 --> 00:14:53,520 Speaker 7: and circular. And a Tennessee woman on death row has 283 00:14:53,540 --> 00:14:56,620 Speaker 7: been taken to hospital after she survived the state's attempts 284 00:14:56,660 --> 00:15:00,200 Speaker 7: to execute her. Witnesses say she was heard snoring 40 285 00:15:00,200 --> 00:15:04,790 Speaker 7: minutes after two lethal injections were administered. 50-year-old Krista Pike 286 00:15:04,810 --> 00:15:07,330 Speaker 7: was set to be the first woman executed in Tennessee 287 00:15:07,710 --> 00:15:10,810 Speaker 7: in more than 200 years for a murder she committed 288 00:15:10,830 --> 00:15:14,810 Speaker 7: in 1995. I'm Daniel James. Thanks for listening to 7am. 289 00:15:15,210 --> 00:15:16,100 Speaker 7: We'll be back tomorrow.