1 00:00:05,920 --> 00:00:08,640 Speaker 1: Welcome the Fear and Greed Business Interview. I'm Sean Aylmer. 2 00:00:08,760 --> 00:00:11,520 Speaker 1: The new financial year seems as good a time as 3 00:00:11,560 --> 00:00:13,920 Speaker 1: any for small businesses to get things in order for 4 00:00:13,960 --> 00:00:17,120 Speaker 1: the year ahead. Has always there's plenty of uncertainty about 5 00:00:17,160 --> 00:00:19,040 Speaker 1: what's going to come over the next twelve months, but 6 00:00:19,320 --> 00:00:24,200 Speaker 1: the twenty twenty six fiscal year is particularly challenging, shall 7 00:00:24,239 --> 00:00:27,160 Speaker 1: we say, because of the jab political climate and potential 8 00:00:27,200 --> 00:00:30,160 Speaker 1: for tariffs. Now, while tariffs may not directly impact a 9 00:00:30,280 --> 00:00:33,720 Speaker 1: small or medium sized business, they will impact the Australian economy. 10 00:00:34,000 --> 00:00:37,159 Speaker 1: So how should businesses prepare for the year ahead? To 11 00:00:37,280 --> 00:00:41,840 Speaker 1: help answer that question, I welcome Banjo Loan's CEO, Guy Callahan. Guy, 12 00:00:41,880 --> 00:00:42,840 Speaker 1: welcome to Fear and Greed. 13 00:00:43,159 --> 00:00:44,840 Speaker 2: Hi Sean, thanks great to be here. 14 00:00:45,479 --> 00:00:49,840 Speaker 1: Broadly, what's the state of the SME market at the moment? 15 00:00:50,640 --> 00:00:53,800 Speaker 2: It is? It's tough. It's really really tough out there. 16 00:00:54,040 --> 00:00:56,440 Speaker 3: They've been doing it pretty tough for five years and 17 00:00:56,480 --> 00:00:58,600 Speaker 3: probably the first time we've got a little bit of 18 00:00:58,640 --> 00:01:00,120 Speaker 3: a light at the end of the tunnel with some 19 00:01:00,200 --> 00:01:04,240 Speaker 3: interest rate drops, which I think will you know, hopefully 20 00:01:04,440 --> 00:01:06,440 Speaker 3: touch wood in the next few days. We might get 21 00:01:06,440 --> 00:01:09,480 Speaker 3: some more good news around that for the SMEs because 22 00:01:09,640 --> 00:01:11,679 Speaker 3: with getting a bit of debt funding and help them 23 00:01:11,760 --> 00:01:14,840 Speaker 3: sort of really power their growth where they have not 24 00:01:15,000 --> 00:01:17,880 Speaker 3: been able to do that lately. But yeah, believe me, 25 00:01:18,000 --> 00:01:20,520 Speaker 3: it's a tough environment. They've been doing it really tough 26 00:01:20,520 --> 00:01:21,160 Speaker 3: for a long time. 27 00:01:21,840 --> 00:01:24,240 Speaker 1: We have discussed this before. But are they sect as 28 00:01:24,240 --> 00:01:27,160 Speaker 1: particularly finding it hard and others doing okay? 29 00:01:27,560 --> 00:01:33,640 Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, So construction is still really hurting, Manufacturing is 30 00:01:33,640 --> 00:01:36,160 Speaker 3: still hurting, and a bit of you know, sort of 31 00:01:36,200 --> 00:01:40,280 Speaker 3: wholesale logistics transport that side of things. Interestingly, there's been 32 00:01:40,319 --> 00:01:43,560 Speaker 3: a little bit and it's continued a little bit of 33 00:01:43,560 --> 00:01:48,800 Speaker 3: a rebound on retail and hospitality, not not not significantly, 34 00:01:48,880 --> 00:01:50,440 Speaker 3: but compared to where they were. 35 00:01:50,880 --> 00:01:52,920 Speaker 2: So what we've kind of seen over the last. 36 00:01:53,400 --> 00:01:56,200 Speaker 3: Four or five years as a real sort of jagged 37 00:01:56,280 --> 00:01:58,160 Speaker 3: sharks too, where there's a little bit of growth, then 38 00:01:58,160 --> 00:02:00,000 Speaker 3: it goes back down again a little bit of growth, 39 00:02:00,000 --> 00:02:01,160 Speaker 3: so then it goes back down. 40 00:02:01,440 --> 00:02:03,160 Speaker 2: So it's been like that for a while. 41 00:02:03,240 --> 00:02:07,080 Speaker 3: So no industries are really singing out. They're all hurting. 42 00:02:07,320 --> 00:02:11,560 Speaker 3: But interestingly, we just got some data out last week 43 00:02:11,600 --> 00:02:13,400 Speaker 3: for our last quarter. For the first time I sort 44 00:02:13,400 --> 00:02:16,119 Speaker 3: of saw services starting to hurt a little bit too. 45 00:02:16,919 --> 00:02:22,399 Speaker 1: Okay, So cash flow is king in all businesses. Obviously, 46 00:02:22,880 --> 00:02:27,720 Speaker 1: take me through your views on how small businesses should 47 00:02:27,919 --> 00:02:31,520 Speaker 1: think about cash flow and running the business. Now I 48 00:02:31,639 --> 00:02:36,000 Speaker 1: know you off air we discussed there was five suggestions 49 00:02:36,040 --> 00:02:38,720 Speaker 1: to think about. The first one, take advantage of financial 50 00:02:38,760 --> 00:02:40,359 Speaker 1: support for SMEs. 51 00:02:40,800 --> 00:02:41,040 Speaker 2: Yep. 52 00:02:41,240 --> 00:02:45,240 Speaker 3: So look, no budget, not federal or state, have been 53 00:02:45,280 --> 00:02:49,160 Speaker 3: that kind to SMEs, I would say, out there, so 54 00:02:49,480 --> 00:02:51,720 Speaker 3: you've really got I would say, use the accountants that 55 00:02:51,800 --> 00:02:54,840 Speaker 3: you're working with and really look for what grants are available. 56 00:02:55,160 --> 00:02:58,440 Speaker 3: You know, we've got the energy rebate, that's probably about 57 00:02:58,560 --> 00:03:00,520 Speaker 3: the best thing that's out there at the moment. Stopped 58 00:03:00,520 --> 00:03:04,160 Speaker 3: doing the asset finance rebate, which was which was really 59 00:03:04,560 --> 00:03:05,400 Speaker 3: really great. 60 00:03:05,120 --> 00:03:06,440 Speaker 2: For sms to help them. 61 00:03:06,680 --> 00:03:09,680 Speaker 3: So what I would say is really use your accountants 62 00:03:09,680 --> 00:03:11,359 Speaker 3: and those people around you to try and find out 63 00:03:11,400 --> 00:03:15,480 Speaker 3: what grants, what grants are available, particularly within your state 64 00:03:15,520 --> 00:03:17,440 Speaker 3: where your head officers. 65 00:03:17,800 --> 00:03:20,560 Speaker 1: Yeah, is it particularly it just doesn't seem to be 66 00:03:20,560 --> 00:03:23,600 Speaker 1: a lot out there at the moment. That's what seems interesting. 67 00:03:24,840 --> 00:03:25,320 Speaker 2: It's been. 68 00:03:26,040 --> 00:03:28,040 Speaker 3: It's been like a Christmas Grinch for a while in 69 00:03:28,120 --> 00:03:31,640 Speaker 3: those budget updates. I'll be honest, Yeah, all the state 70 00:03:31,680 --> 00:03:34,320 Speaker 3: ones this year have been pretty pretty poor for SMS 71 00:03:34,320 --> 00:03:37,480 Speaker 3: and the federal budget it had nothing had nothing about 72 00:03:37,520 --> 00:03:38,680 Speaker 3: from the electricity rebate. 73 00:03:39,520 --> 00:03:43,240 Speaker 1: Okay, the second thing, the second suggestion complete the shift 74 00:03:43,320 --> 00:03:44,440 Speaker 1: to digital payments. 75 00:03:44,720 --> 00:03:44,920 Speaker 2: Yep. 76 00:03:45,440 --> 00:03:48,280 Speaker 3: So this is all about just making yourself as efficient 77 00:03:48,520 --> 00:03:52,960 Speaker 3: and operationally efficient as you possibly can. So getting as 78 00:03:52,960 --> 00:03:56,360 Speaker 3: digital with all of your payments, the ability to kind 79 00:03:56,400 --> 00:03:59,520 Speaker 3: of if you need to change financial institutions or anything 80 00:03:59,560 --> 00:04:01,480 Speaker 3: like that, just being in that position where you can 81 00:04:01,840 --> 00:04:03,960 Speaker 3: so you can look at what's best for you rather 82 00:04:04,120 --> 00:04:09,360 Speaker 3: than being beholden to slow systems and everything like that. 83 00:04:10,080 --> 00:04:11,720 Speaker 3: And then comes with that, I think another one we've 84 00:04:11,760 --> 00:04:15,600 Speaker 3: got down there is looking at compliance around fraud. So 85 00:04:15,880 --> 00:04:18,640 Speaker 3: all of that technology side of things is really important 86 00:04:18,680 --> 00:04:21,760 Speaker 3: to your business. So staying ahead of the game and 87 00:04:22,680 --> 00:04:27,760 Speaker 3: being as payment efficient as digitally efficient, fraud, all of 88 00:04:27,800 --> 00:04:31,919 Speaker 3: that stuff is super important. So it and technology, do 89 00:04:32,040 --> 00:04:33,599 Speaker 3: not skimp on it, that would be that would be 90 00:04:33,640 --> 00:04:34,080 Speaker 3: my advice. 91 00:04:34,560 --> 00:04:37,240 Speaker 1: Do SMEs skimp on it? At the moment, I'd imagine 92 00:04:37,240 --> 00:04:39,080 Speaker 1: that it's kind of almost in the too hard basket 93 00:04:39,120 --> 00:04:39,840 Speaker 1: for some It is. 94 00:04:40,120 --> 00:04:41,279 Speaker 2: Yeah, it is, it really is. 95 00:04:41,360 --> 00:04:42,919 Speaker 3: So what we've kind of seen is a lot of 96 00:04:43,040 --> 00:04:46,119 Speaker 3: SMEs holding off hiring and when they're you know, hiring 97 00:04:46,120 --> 00:04:49,360 Speaker 3: for those resources that can help them achieve you know, 98 00:04:49,600 --> 00:04:51,440 Speaker 3: the efficiencies in the IT side of. 99 00:04:51,360 --> 00:04:53,840 Speaker 2: Things the way SMEs you know. 100 00:04:54,040 --> 00:04:55,960 Speaker 3: So we had had a look at when inflation first 101 00:04:55,960 --> 00:04:58,720 Speaker 3: started hurting, they all raise their prices. They stopped doing 102 00:04:58,760 --> 00:05:01,600 Speaker 3: that about eighteen months ago, and now they're looking at 103 00:05:01,600 --> 00:05:04,800 Speaker 3: seeing where they can cut costs. So things like spending 104 00:05:04,800 --> 00:05:08,800 Speaker 3: on a flash eyed new IT system. That's not happening right, 105 00:05:08,839 --> 00:05:11,000 Speaker 3: So so use what they're going to use what they've 106 00:05:11,000 --> 00:05:13,360 Speaker 3: got and try and be as effective as they can 107 00:05:13,440 --> 00:05:17,240 Speaker 3: with it. Yeah, but don't skimp on security. That would 108 00:05:17,240 --> 00:05:18,320 Speaker 3: be the one big thing. 109 00:05:18,839 --> 00:05:27,880 Speaker 1: So with me, guy, we'll be right back. I'm speaking 110 00:05:27,920 --> 00:05:31,360 Speaker 1: to Guy Callahan, CEO of Ban Joe Loans. We're going 111 00:05:31,400 --> 00:05:33,280 Speaker 1: through a list of things that SM should at least 112 00:05:33,279 --> 00:05:36,480 Speaker 1: think about it as we head into the new year. 113 00:05:36,760 --> 00:05:39,000 Speaker 1: Manage the cost of lending is another one. 114 00:05:39,320 --> 00:05:42,360 Speaker 3: Yeah, well, particularly now that interest rates are coming down 115 00:05:42,480 --> 00:05:44,560 Speaker 3: and hopefully sure and we get some really good news 116 00:05:44,560 --> 00:05:46,839 Speaker 3: in the next couple of days that are coming down again. 117 00:05:47,480 --> 00:05:49,400 Speaker 3: So it's time to sort of look around and seeing 118 00:05:49,400 --> 00:05:51,320 Speaker 3: if you're getting the best here with some of your funding. 119 00:05:52,000 --> 00:05:54,480 Speaker 3: Because believe me, the leander won't drop their rates pretty 120 00:05:54,520 --> 00:05:57,040 Speaker 3: quickly if you're sort of set set there. And that's 121 00:05:57,080 --> 00:06:00,560 Speaker 3: where being sort of with your digital set up, you're 122 00:06:00,600 --> 00:06:03,200 Speaker 3: able to sort of change. The other thing to do 123 00:06:03,279 --> 00:06:06,680 Speaker 3: here is to use your finance brokers that are around you. 124 00:06:06,720 --> 00:06:09,520 Speaker 3: So there's some really smart finance brokers who can who 125 00:06:09,680 --> 00:06:11,840 Speaker 3: know the different products that are out there, and they 126 00:06:11,880 --> 00:06:14,599 Speaker 3: know if you're getting a good deal or not, So 127 00:06:14,760 --> 00:06:17,200 Speaker 3: don't be afraid to engage them. And it's their job 128 00:06:17,279 --> 00:06:20,359 Speaker 3: to help you try and find the best deal for you, 129 00:06:20,839 --> 00:06:23,280 Speaker 3: the best type of loan and the best interest rate, 130 00:06:23,400 --> 00:06:25,960 Speaker 3: the best payments, the best repayments, all of that type 131 00:06:26,000 --> 00:06:29,160 Speaker 3: of stuff. So you again it's like the accountant, use 132 00:06:29,320 --> 00:06:31,680 Speaker 3: the financial advisors around you to really see if they 133 00:06:31,720 --> 00:06:32,880 Speaker 3: can get the best deal for you. 134 00:06:33,680 --> 00:06:35,720 Speaker 1: I mean, I went to my lender two weeks ago 135 00:06:35,880 --> 00:06:37,880 Speaker 1: and said, hey, can I do any better than this? 136 00:06:37,960 --> 00:06:41,839 Speaker 1: And I threatened to change banks. I got an amazing 137 00:06:41,920 --> 00:06:43,919 Speaker 1: disco well not amazing disc games, but it was fifty 138 00:06:43,920 --> 00:06:46,960 Speaker 1: bases points less than what I was paying. That's on 139 00:06:47,000 --> 00:06:49,440 Speaker 1: a mortgage, So it's a bit the same in small 140 00:06:49,480 --> 00:06:50,080 Speaker 1: business loans. 141 00:06:50,440 --> 00:06:51,040 Speaker 2: Absolutely. 142 00:06:51,760 --> 00:06:54,159 Speaker 3: In fact, I would say it's more because what's happened 143 00:06:54,240 --> 00:06:56,719 Speaker 3: is the fighting all the banks that were fighting around 144 00:06:56,800 --> 00:07:00,200 Speaker 3: all the retail mortgages and stuff like that. Now that 145 00:07:00,200 --> 00:07:02,400 Speaker 3: they can make their money is in the business lending right, 146 00:07:02,440 --> 00:07:06,080 Speaker 3: So I think it's even more imperative now that people 147 00:07:06,080 --> 00:07:07,800 Speaker 3: go and look and see what's out there and just 148 00:07:07,800 --> 00:07:10,400 Speaker 3: see what the competition. And it's not just the banks. 149 00:07:10,440 --> 00:07:12,480 Speaker 3: I mean, we're a non bank lender, so you know, 150 00:07:12,920 --> 00:07:16,520 Speaker 3: blatant plug for us. We're not the chiefs out there, 151 00:07:16,520 --> 00:07:18,280 Speaker 3: but we will look for the right type of product 152 00:07:18,360 --> 00:07:21,400 Speaker 3: for you and what's there. So the financial institutions are 153 00:07:21,400 --> 00:07:24,920 Speaker 3: clambering over business loans. So it's so you tear advantage 154 00:07:24,960 --> 00:07:26,040 Speaker 3: of for an sme own it. 155 00:07:26,760 --> 00:07:29,320 Speaker 1: Another one to invest in innovation and workforce development. 156 00:07:29,720 --> 00:07:31,480 Speaker 3: So this is going back to the IT side of things. 157 00:07:31,480 --> 00:07:34,760 Speaker 3: It's really don't skimp on it. But then also, as 158 00:07:34,760 --> 00:07:38,560 Speaker 3: we touched on, SMEs aren't really going out there and 159 00:07:38,640 --> 00:07:40,640 Speaker 3: hiring a lot at the moment because it's really tough. 160 00:07:40,720 --> 00:07:44,280 Speaker 3: So you want to keep the workforce you've got, so 161 00:07:44,480 --> 00:07:47,800 Speaker 3: offering some smart incentives for them to stay, get them, 162 00:07:48,120 --> 00:07:51,200 Speaker 3: get them engaged in what your business is doing and 163 00:07:51,240 --> 00:07:53,720 Speaker 3: what the goals are, and get their goals aligned with 164 00:07:53,760 --> 00:07:56,400 Speaker 3: that with there and reward them. It doesn't have to 165 00:07:56,440 --> 00:08:00,000 Speaker 3: be financially but you know, just just different kind of incentives. 166 00:08:00,080 --> 00:08:03,040 Speaker 3: Whether it's an extra day off, whether it's sort of 167 00:08:03,440 --> 00:08:06,440 Speaker 3: wellness type activities, all sorts of stuff you can do 168 00:08:06,480 --> 00:08:09,440 Speaker 3: to incentivize you. You don't want to be out there 169 00:08:09,640 --> 00:08:12,640 Speaker 3: looking for new employees at the moment if a key 170 00:08:12,640 --> 00:08:14,520 Speaker 3: employee leaves you, you just don't. 171 00:08:14,960 --> 00:08:15,840 Speaker 2: It's really hard. 172 00:08:16,280 --> 00:08:18,920 Speaker 1: And finally we have touched in this one but bit 173 00:08:18,920 --> 00:08:22,680 Speaker 1: more details. Stay compliant with wage theft legislation and fraud management. 174 00:08:22,920 --> 00:08:26,040 Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, you've got to have You've just got to 175 00:08:26,080 --> 00:08:30,440 Speaker 3: have complete it systems around your fraud. So looking at 176 00:08:30,480 --> 00:08:32,440 Speaker 3: out of the side of things, we've just really upgraded 177 00:08:32,480 --> 00:08:35,880 Speaker 3: our the platform that we run our whole systems on 178 00:08:36,240 --> 00:08:38,520 Speaker 3: over the last it's actually taking us nearly twelve months to. 179 00:08:38,480 --> 00:08:41,760 Speaker 2: Do slowly upgrade it. And one of the. 180 00:08:41,679 --> 00:08:45,479 Speaker 3: Big things is fraud prevention for us of the security 181 00:08:45,520 --> 00:08:49,439 Speaker 3: for all of our customers. I mean, you just look 182 00:08:49,480 --> 00:08:51,440 Speaker 3: at Quantus has been it. There's been a lot of 183 00:08:51,800 --> 00:08:56,040 Speaker 3: large Australian corporation sets. So don't think the SMEs are 184 00:08:56,080 --> 00:08:58,520 Speaker 3: immune to being hit. If they can get into quantus. 185 00:08:58,960 --> 00:09:01,320 Speaker 3: They can get into your rights if you're not if 186 00:09:01,320 --> 00:09:03,720 Speaker 3: you're not careful. So you want to protect you, you 187 00:09:03,760 --> 00:09:06,280 Speaker 3: want to protect your clients data. That's just that's just 188 00:09:06,320 --> 00:09:06,720 Speaker 3: a given. 189 00:09:07,440 --> 00:09:10,040 Speaker 1: And just the wage theft legislation, what is that. 190 00:09:10,280 --> 00:09:12,439 Speaker 3: Oh, look, it's just it's making sure that you're. 191 00:09:12,280 --> 00:09:15,480 Speaker 2: Paying right your employees well and right. 192 00:09:15,520 --> 00:09:18,600 Speaker 3: You're not skimping on super or pay do anything like that. 193 00:09:18,920 --> 00:09:21,480 Speaker 3: So really just be right across it, making sure you've 194 00:09:21,520 --> 00:09:24,360 Speaker 3: got all your payments up to date. I mean even 195 00:09:24,440 --> 00:09:26,960 Speaker 3: like and this is not way, but looking at at 196 00:09:27,120 --> 00:09:30,800 Speaker 3: O debt, right, the ATO has now stopped having your 197 00:09:30,800 --> 00:09:33,200 Speaker 3: interest deductions on any debt you've got there, so so 198 00:09:33,280 --> 00:09:35,280 Speaker 3: the Bank of ATO, it's gone. 199 00:09:35,400 --> 00:09:36,360 Speaker 2: It's a thing of the past. 200 00:09:36,480 --> 00:09:38,280 Speaker 3: So you just want to keep ahead of all those 201 00:09:38,320 --> 00:09:41,160 Speaker 3: financial cup of payments. Thank you for talking to Fear 202 00:09:41,200 --> 00:09:43,600 Speaker 3: and Greed, No problem, Thanks not Sean, that was Guy 203 00:09:43,679 --> 00:09:46,480 Speaker 3: Callahan Banjo Loan CEO. This is the Fear and Greed 204 00:09:46,520 --> 00:09:49,360 Speaker 3: Business Interview. Join us every morning for the full episode 205 00:09:49,400 --> 00:09:51,560 Speaker 3: of Fear and Greed Business news. 206 00:09:51,360 --> 00:09:55,560 Speaker 1: You can use I'm Sean Elmer. Enjoy your day,