WEBVTT - The men who survived Kinchela Boys Home 0:00:01.639 --> 0:00:05.800 From Schwartz Media. I'm Ruby Jones. This is seven AM. 0:00:07.480 --> 0:00:11.000 This week, a group of Stolen Generation survivors visited a 0:00:11.039 --> 0:00:14.520 site from their childhood that holds a lot of painful memories, 0:00:15.160 --> 0:00:19.159 the notorious Kinchilla Boy's Home in New South Wales. The 0:00:19.200 --> 0:00:22.120 gathering marked one hundred years since the home was opened, 0:00:22.600 --> 0:00:26.960 a home that institutionalized hundreds of Indigenous boys and subjected 0:00:27.000 --> 0:00:31.320 them to torture, abuse and reprogramming in order to assimilate 0:00:31.360 --> 0:00:35.879 them into white society. Now, the survivors and their families 0:00:36.280 --> 0:00:38.440 want to take ownership of the site to make it 0:00:38.479 --> 0:00:43.920 a place of healing for future generations. Today, Gunner Kerney 0:00:44.000 --> 0:00:46.920 and watch a balloch writer and contributor to the Saturday Paper, 0:00:47.080 --> 0:00:51.159 Ben Abotangelo on the enduring legacy of the Kinchilla Boys Home. 0:00:59.240 --> 0:01:04.600 It's Wednesday, October twenty three and just a warning, today's 0:01:04.600 --> 0:01:16.520 episode discusses abuse and suicide. So then you've been looking 0:01:16.520 --> 0:01:21.199 into this home, this institution where Aboriginal children were sent 0:01:21.440 --> 0:01:25.640 for decades. It's called the Kinchilla Boys Home. Tell me 0:01:25.680 --> 0:01:26.319 about the place. 0:01:26.760 --> 0:01:26.920 Well. 0:01:27.000 --> 0:01:31.760 Kinchilla is known as one of the most notorious homes. 0:01:32.680 --> 0:01:34.760 It was open in the nineteen twenties and closed down 0:01:35.200 --> 0:01:38.840 in the early nineteen seventies. Young boys from across New 0:01:38.880 --> 0:01:42.959 South Wales predominantly were taken from their families and institutionalized 0:01:43.000 --> 0:01:46.679 at that home and just went through some of the 0:01:46.720 --> 0:01:53.120 most torturous years of their lives. So the children were 0:01:53.840 --> 0:01:56.840 as young as six or seven up to fourteen, fifteen, 0:01:56.960 --> 0:02:01.320 sixteen years of age, and you know, across varying periods 0:02:01.320 --> 0:02:05.760 of time, were just subject to humiliation, to torture, to slavery, 0:02:05.840 --> 0:02:10.440 to sexual assault, to rapes, to indentioned servitude, to just 0:02:10.520 --> 0:02:14.919 the most brutal reprogramming and re engineering that I think 0:02:14.960 --> 0:02:16.520 this country has seen. 0:02:17.400 --> 0:02:20.040 So yeah, it's a really tough story to cover. 0:02:20.480 --> 0:02:24.800 There's now only forty nine of the six hundred survivors remaining. 0:02:25.400 --> 0:02:29.440 Four of those uncles have passed in the last four 0:02:29.440 --> 0:02:32.160 to six months. So there's a real sense of urgency 0:02:32.520 --> 0:02:35.520 around the fact that a lot of these young people 0:02:35.560 --> 0:02:38.519 who are now old that went through that home you 0:02:38.680 --> 0:02:41.200 are now coming towards the end of their lives. 0:02:42.400 --> 0:02:46.359 Okay, So these boys who made it out, who survived 0:02:46.919 --> 0:02:50.360 that torture that you described, can you tell me more 0:02:50.440 --> 0:02:51.840 about them about their stories. 0:02:52.639 --> 0:02:55.640 I was really humbled to get the opportunity to hold 0:02:55.639 --> 0:02:59.040 the stories of people like Uncle Roger Pigeon Jarrett. Can 0:02:59.080 --> 0:03:02.720 you just start with me by just telling me your 0:03:02.800 --> 0:03:09.119 name in full, Roger Sharrett. He speaks about June twenty five, 0:03:09.280 --> 0:03:13.079 nineteen fifty eight, when he was merely eleven years old, 0:03:13.360 --> 0:03:17.679 and he speaks with just vivid clarity about the day 0:03:17.760 --> 0:03:21.040 that the big black English riley rolled onto the mission 0:03:21.680 --> 0:03:24.760 and how the sergeant stepped out of the car, came 0:03:24.840 --> 0:03:27.160 up to the house, sat his mother down on the 0:03:27.240 --> 0:03:29.239 veranda outside of their little home. 0:03:33.400 --> 0:03:36.000 Down there, and. 0:03:36.080 --> 0:03:38.960 Just said to her, missus Jarrett, if you signed these papers, 0:03:39.000 --> 0:03:43.680 your kids will return within twelve months. Uncle Roger's mother 0:03:44.040 --> 0:03:47.600 didn't have a formal education, she knew that she was 0:03:47.680 --> 0:03:53.560 confronted with an ultimatum, and within the confluence of those circumstances, 0:03:53.680 --> 0:03:58.520 she signed those papers. Now, Uncle Roger reflects on, you know, 0:03:58.640 --> 0:04:00.320 only being eleven years of age. 0:04:00.960 --> 0:04:04.440 His other brother was only six, and he speaks. 0:04:04.080 --> 0:04:06.880 Again with just real clarity about the moment that the 0:04:06.960 --> 0:04:10.480 sergeant who was acting on behalf of the Aboriginal Welfare 0:04:10.520 --> 0:04:11.600 Board grabbed him. 0:04:13.120 --> 0:04:13.600 Was going. 0:04:15.120 --> 0:04:18.440 So mom's dress. 0:04:18.839 --> 0:04:21.479 He says that, you know, as they grabbed him he 0:04:21.520 --> 0:04:24.599 clutched his mother's dress, and you know, the sergeant just 0:04:24.760 --> 0:04:26.880 was wrangling like a piece of meat. 0:04:27.000 --> 0:04:28.000 And Mom's crying. 0:04:28.040 --> 0:04:36.120 After this day, I guess still free with on my arm. 0:04:36.960 --> 0:04:39.960 He said that the sergeant basically grabbed him, dragged him 0:04:39.960 --> 0:04:42.000 to the car, and threw him in the back. And 0:04:42.839 --> 0:04:46.080 you know, he can still remember sliding across those seats, 0:04:46.600 --> 0:04:51.600 hitting his head on the window wiper and basically splitting 0:04:51.680 --> 0:04:54.760 it open. And it was from there, within a matter 0:04:54.800 --> 0:04:57.200 of hours that he was at the front gates of 0:04:57.240 --> 0:05:01.520 the Kinchuler Boys Home. Another a survivor that I was 0:05:01.720 --> 0:05:05.800 fortunate to sit with was Uncle Richard Bare Campbell, and 0:05:05.960 --> 0:05:07.719 he was only eight or nine years old when he 0:05:07.760 --> 0:05:10.559 was stolen from his family in nineteen sixty six. 0:05:10.920 --> 0:05:14.280 My name is Richard Campbell. I'm a cool beat that 0:05:14.440 --> 0:05:18.919 gutty man from the back Obacker and the Thebezy Bellies 0:05:18.920 --> 0:05:20.920 off the north coast of wal So we have the 0:05:21.040 --> 0:05:22.440 back aheads cost Harbor. 0:05:23.160 --> 0:05:26.360 But his first memory of Kinchla was being wrestled out 0:05:26.360 --> 0:05:29.880 of the car and being separated from his three young sisters. 0:05:30.080 --> 0:05:33.280 And you know, he tols this really graphic story of 0:05:33.560 --> 0:05:37.320 you know, his his sister's screaming in the car and 0:05:37.440 --> 0:05:39.159 you know him being at the gates of Kinchler and 0:05:39.200 --> 0:05:41.040 the car driving off, and. 0:05:40.920 --> 0:05:45.280 Then we can eat a screaming as a car was 0:05:45.320 --> 0:05:48.320 going around the corner away from Kitchener. We can still 0:05:48.360 --> 0:05:51.440 hear him screaming, you don't fade away in the distance. 0:05:52.040 --> 0:05:55.080 You know, that was his first and most enduring memory 0:05:55.080 --> 0:05:57.479 from Kinchler, because it was also the last time that 0:05:57.520 --> 0:06:00.440 he saw his sister in approximately twenty years. 0:06:01.240 --> 0:06:05.000 And so these men, well they were children at the 0:06:05.040 --> 0:06:08.719 time they were taken from their families, taken to Kinchilla. 0:06:08.960 --> 0:06:12.880 So what did they tell you about what happened next, 0:06:12.920 --> 0:06:15.240 about what their life was like in the home? 0:06:16.200 --> 0:06:19.719 I think the first really significant point is that you know, 0:06:19.839 --> 0:06:23.040 Aboriginal families were stolen from their country and rounded up 0:06:23.040 --> 0:06:27.200 onto missions, and these young boys were then secondarily from that, 0:06:27.480 --> 0:06:30.400 you know, stolen from their communities. So they were stolen 0:06:30.440 --> 0:06:33.760 from their country, stolen from their communities, and sent to 0:06:33.839 --> 0:06:39.320 these institutions where they were then stolen from themselves. Uncle 0:06:39.400 --> 0:06:43.159 Roger Pigeon Jarrett basically says that you know, the moment 0:06:43.200 --> 0:06:45.719 that you get to those gates is where you lose 0:06:45.760 --> 0:06:49.360 your identity, your culture, and your name now for him 0:06:49.360 --> 0:06:51.360 when you walked in those gates, he was no longer 0:06:51.600 --> 0:06:52.960 Roger Jarrett. 0:06:53.240 --> 0:06:54.760 That's when he became number twelve. 0:06:55.040 --> 0:06:59.040 And it was a saying for Uncle Richard, who as 0:06:59.040 --> 0:07:01.120 soon as he walks into the gates, he says, the 0:07:01.160 --> 0:07:03.600 first thing that happened to him and his brothers was 0:07:03.960 --> 0:07:05.800 that they just started getting bashed. 0:07:06.240 --> 0:07:12.120 Just say, okay, Richard Cambll anymore, you're there number twenty 0:07:12.120 --> 0:07:18.240 eight to be older brother, but you were not Robert Cambell, 0:07:18.280 --> 0:07:20.200 and will you have the number twenty nine. 0:07:20.920 --> 0:07:24.560 They spoke about the minutes feeling like hours, and the 0:07:24.640 --> 0:07:29.320 hours feeling like days. The boys were humiliated, they were beaten, 0:07:29.520 --> 0:07:32.720 they were sexually assaulted and raped. They were staved, they 0:07:32.760 --> 0:07:35.280 were enslaved. They're indoctrinated and re engineered. 0:07:36.040 --> 0:07:36.200 You know. 0:07:36.280 --> 0:07:38.480 Uncle Witty Walsh, who is another one of the survivors 0:07:38.520 --> 0:07:41.119 that I spoke to, you know, reflected on the fact 0:07:41.120 --> 0:07:44.520 that boys would go missing that you know, they were 0:07:44.800 --> 0:07:47.720 classified as flora and fauna at the time. 0:07:48.240 --> 0:07:48.400 You know. 0:07:48.440 --> 0:07:51.080 In one of the testimonies from Uncle Whitty, he spoke 0:07:51.080 --> 0:07:54.000 about basically the ex army men that ran the site, 0:07:54.600 --> 0:07:57.200 you know, would have animals that had names, but for 0:07:57.240 --> 0:07:59.280 the young Aboriginal boys that were on the site that 0:07:59.360 --> 0:08:04.680 were just subject to the most barbaric of treatment, they 0:08:04.720 --> 0:08:06.440 had numbers, right And. 0:08:06.440 --> 0:08:10.320 So then when survivors say that some of these boys 0:08:10.360 --> 0:08:13.640 went missing, do we know what happened to them? 0:08:13.920 --> 0:08:14.760 Yeah, we know that. 0:08:16.000 --> 0:08:19.640 Recently there was a report from experts who used ground 0:08:19.640 --> 0:08:23.600 penetrating radars at the homes and essentially what they found 0:08:23.720 --> 0:08:29.360 were readings consistent with clandestine burials in other places around 0:08:29.440 --> 0:08:34.079 the world and at Kinchla. Now there's approximately nine sites 0:08:34.160 --> 0:08:39.680 that could hold graves of young boys. Now that report 0:08:40.080 --> 0:08:43.760 has been tabled with the Minister, the New South Wales 0:08:43.800 --> 0:08:47.640 Premier Chris Means and his Minister for Abridge and All 0:08:47.640 --> 0:08:52.079 Affairs and Treaty, David Harris, have committed to further investigations 0:08:52.120 --> 0:08:56.560 at the site and to engage further specialists to explore 0:08:57.040 --> 0:09:00.840 in full, you know, the really serious question marks that 0:09:00.880 --> 0:09:03.800 are lingering over the place. But when I speak to 0:09:03.840 --> 0:09:07.199 the uncles around whether or not they are surprised about 0:09:07.760 --> 0:09:13.480 the prospect of their being potential burial grounds. There's not 0:09:14.880 --> 0:09:19.480 so life at Kinchla. From listening to these stories, the 0:09:19.520 --> 0:09:22.440 one thing that was a constant in all of these 0:09:22.480 --> 0:09:29.280 testimonies was that terror was just there at every moment 0:09:29.520 --> 0:09:32.600 of the day. 0:09:33.280 --> 0:09:36.320 After the break, the survivors on a mission to reclaim 0:09:36.360 --> 0:09:49.840 the Conchilla Boys Home, So ben Kinchilla Boy's Home. It 0:09:49.880 --> 0:09:57.480 closed down in nineteen seventy. Hundreds of boys were taken there. 0:09:58.559 --> 0:10:01.080 Can you tell me a bit about what life was 0:10:01.200 --> 0:10:03.520 like for them once they were old enough to be 0:10:03.600 --> 0:10:04.320 able to leave. 0:10:05.120 --> 0:10:10.240 I think Uncle Richard summarized it really aptly by saying that, 0:10:10.559 --> 0:10:13.079 you know, most of he and the other survivors were 0:10:13.120 --> 0:10:16.440 basically on a suicide journey having stepped out of there. 0:10:16.559 --> 0:10:21.440 Now today there's only forty nine survivors remaining. Four survivors 0:10:21.679 --> 0:10:24.920 have passed away in the previous four to six months. 0:10:25.320 --> 0:10:27.960 You know, we really are getting towards that later chapter 0:10:28.920 --> 0:10:33.400 of the Stolen Generation survivors' lives, But the impacts from 0:10:33.520 --> 0:10:39.640 Kinchla have permeated every single aspect of these young boys' lives. 0:10:40.400 --> 0:10:44.080 Uncle Richard spoke about the story of him sort of 0:10:44.240 --> 0:10:47.040 being thrusted out of the gates of Kinchula and back 0:10:47.080 --> 0:10:49.839 into society thinking that he. 0:10:49.800 --> 0:10:50.480 Was a white fellaw. 0:10:51.360 --> 0:10:55.720 He speaks to how powerful the indoctrination the re engineering 0:10:56.000 --> 0:10:59.439 was that he was subjected to. But at the same time, 0:11:00.080 --> 0:11:04.040 you know, large sections of the Aboriginal community also turned 0:11:04.080 --> 0:11:07.400 their back on him because they didn't see these boys 0:11:07.400 --> 0:11:10.319 that went through Kinchula as one of them anymore. So 0:11:10.960 --> 0:11:14.640 they were stuck in this no man's land, not belonging anywhere, 0:11:14.760 --> 0:11:19.120 and just with these really deep wounds and no support 0:11:19.559 --> 0:11:24.480 to mend them. For Uncle Roger Jarrett, you know, he 0:11:24.559 --> 0:11:27.480 spoke about going out into the world and just not 0:11:27.880 --> 0:11:30.920 knowing how to love. You know, his words are that 0:11:31.040 --> 0:11:32.880 when you come out, you've got no idea of what 0:11:32.960 --> 0:11:35.760 love is. You can spell it, you can write it, 0:11:36.360 --> 0:11:40.760 but to feel what love is, it's been killed. Uncle 0:11:41.080 --> 0:11:45.880 Richard has had multiple kids to multiple women. He speaks 0:11:45.880 --> 0:11:49.600 about not having strong relationships with his children, about his 0:11:49.800 --> 0:11:54.920 children having challenges with substance abuse. For Uncle Witty Walsh, 0:11:55.000 --> 0:11:59.760 he talks about, you know, his children being removed from him, 0:12:00.040 --> 0:12:04.160 his grandchildren being removed from his sons and daughters. 0:12:04.640 --> 0:12:06.520 I put the gun in my mouth, but I was 0:12:06.600 --> 0:12:09.840 about I think I was about noidy at the time 0:12:09.920 --> 0:12:12.120 when I was going to shoot myself because they took 0:12:12.320 --> 0:12:14.920 us away from the woman that I married. 0:12:15.320 --> 0:12:19.240 We've seen Kinchler Act as this really fractuous moment in 0:12:19.280 --> 0:12:24.080 these people's lives, and that has continued to reverberate every day, 0:12:24.200 --> 0:12:28.760 every week, and every generation. We know that the number 0:12:28.760 --> 0:12:31.880 of First Nations children being removed from their families today. 0:12:31.600 --> 0:12:32.720 Is at record rates. 0:12:33.160 --> 0:12:35.400 The projections are for the years to come that those 0:12:35.520 --> 0:12:39.080 rates will continue to increase. They currently make up forty 0:12:39.080 --> 0:12:41.920 three point seven percent of the children in out of 0:12:41.960 --> 0:12:46.199 home care. We know that, you know, the pipeline of 0:12:46.320 --> 0:12:51.320 children from out of home care into youth juvenile detention 0:12:51.480 --> 0:12:57.280 centers is also ever expanding. So in the uncle's eyes, yeah, 0:12:57.320 --> 0:13:01.840 it's it's what's old remains new, and so been. 0:13:01.880 --> 0:13:05.880 One hundred years on from when Kinchella was opened, some 0:13:05.960 --> 0:13:09.920 of the survivors want to try and reclaim that site. 0:13:10.000 --> 0:13:12.439 Can you tell me a bit about that, because I 0:13:12.440 --> 0:13:15.839 imagine that it would be complicated trying to work out 0:13:15.920 --> 0:13:19.200 how you might mark a place where all of these 0:13:19.280 --> 0:13:23.600 horrors happened to you in a way that feels right. 0:13:24.160 --> 0:13:26.760 It's a great point, Ruby, and the first hurdle has 0:13:26.800 --> 0:13:30.800 been the survivors being able to reimagine what the site 0:13:30.880 --> 0:13:34.800 could be, that the place that was a catalyst for 0:13:34.840 --> 0:13:38.640 so much harm and heartbreak could be actually repositioned as 0:13:38.640 --> 0:13:42.640 a site for healing. So that first hurdle was one 0:13:42.679 --> 0:13:45.080 of the hardest I think for many of the now 0:13:45.160 --> 0:13:50.440 men to overcome. The second hurdle has been negotiating a 0:13:50.480 --> 0:13:55.760 just timely and fair agreement with the KEMPS Local Aboriginal 0:13:55.840 --> 0:14:00.560 Land Council, who is the owner of the Kinschula site. Now, 0:14:01.120 --> 0:14:04.960 a lot of the survivors believe that their own community 0:14:05.000 --> 0:14:09.080 continues to turn their back on them, and that that 0:14:09.240 --> 0:14:15.960 is playing out within these negotiations. You know, Uncle Richard 0:14:16.040 --> 0:14:19.040 spoke to me about the fact that when they first 0:14:19.320 --> 0:14:24.160 endeavored to put an offer forward to reclaim ownership of 0:14:24.240 --> 0:14:27.360 the land, a lot of people within the community saw 0:14:27.400 --> 0:14:29.920 that as a land grab and saw that the uncles 0:14:29.920 --> 0:14:33.479 were trying to take land from other members within the community. 0:14:33.680 --> 0:14:36.600 And I suppose what's really. 0:14:36.360 --> 0:14:40.360 Important from their perspective at what I've captured is that 0:14:40.920 --> 0:14:46.560 ownership matters absolutely, but it's an endeavor to have custodianship 0:14:46.720 --> 0:14:51.080 over the site. It's not ownership in as they would say, 0:14:51.240 --> 0:14:55.560 Whitefellow Way, its ownership in Blackfellow Way. And by having 0:14:55.600 --> 0:15:00.640 that it means that they cannot only repair themselves, importantly, 0:15:01.360 --> 0:15:05.120 ensure that that site remains standing until the end of 0:15:05.160 --> 0:15:09.400 time so people will never forget what went down there, 0:15:09.560 --> 0:15:13.240 and as importantly to ensure that it never happens again. 0:15:17.280 --> 0:15:19.440 Ben, Thank you so much for your time. 0:15:19.960 --> 0:15:39.880 Appreciate it. Thanks Ruby. 0:15:51.800 --> 0:15:54.760 Also in the news today, the British Prime Minister has 0:15:54.800 --> 0:15:58.440 defended King Charles after news of Senator Lydia Thorpe's protest 0:15:58.480 --> 0:16:02.440 against him made headline around the world. So Kia Stama 0:16:02.480 --> 0:16:05.440 said the King is doing a fantastic job, particularly in 0:16:05.520 --> 0:16:08.760 light of his recent treatment for cancer. The Monarch's trip 0:16:08.800 --> 0:16:12.960 to Australia was his first since the diagnosis, and students 0:16:12.960 --> 0:16:16.480 at the Australian Catholic University have staged a walkout during 0:16:16.480 --> 0:16:19.400 a speech by former union boss jo deah Bruin, The 0:16:19.480 --> 0:16:23.440 former National president of the Shop Distributive and Allied Employees Association, 0:16:23.920 --> 0:16:26.760 was accepting an honorary degree at the university and he 0:16:26.800 --> 0:16:30.360 began sharing his views on same sex marriage, IVF and abortion. 0:16:31.000 --> 0:16:33.720 Mister de Bruin said abortion was the single biggest killer 0:16:33.720 --> 0:16:36.360 of human beings in the world, before the majority of 0:16:36.360 --> 0:16:40.280 the audience left the auditorium while he was speaking. Tomorrow 0:16:40.320 --> 0:16:42.800 and seven am. We'll be looking at how abortion became 0:16:42.840 --> 0:16:45.160 a surprise issue in the run up to Queensland's state 0:16:45.200 --> 0:16:46.280 election this weekend. 0:16:47.040 --> 0:16:47.920 I'm Ruby Jones. 0:16:48.200 --> 0:16:50.080 This is seven AM. Thanks for listening.