WEBVTT - #205 Westpac CEO Anthony Miller: My First Podcast with a Major Bank Leader 0:00:00.080 --> 0:00:02.960 Him, I Boris and this is straight talk. I'm about 0:00:03.000 --> 0:00:06.320 to do a podcast with Anthony Miller. He's the CEO 0:00:06.360 --> 0:00:08.520 of the Westpac Group, which encompasses a lot of banks. 0:00:09.360 --> 0:00:14.800 I should make an initial disclosure. The disclosure is that 0:00:15.600 --> 0:00:19.800 my company Yellow Big Road Group, of which I'm the 0:00:19.840 --> 0:00:23.600 chairman of Made Shoulder, has a relationship with Westpac. They 0:00:23.600 --> 0:00:26.120 are a warehouse provided to us in relation to our 0:00:26.160 --> 0:00:29.800 own product with our global partner, which is Magneta, through 0:00:29.840 --> 0:00:32.400 a business called Resi Homelands or the Resi product. 0:00:32.920 --> 0:00:34.640 So that's a disclosure you need to make. 0:00:35.280 --> 0:00:39.640 And I also will happily disclose that I've been maybe 0:00:39.680 --> 0:00:41.959 forty year customer of Saint George Bank, right back from 0:00:41.960 --> 0:00:44.199 the days it was building society right through today. It's 0:00:44.240 --> 0:00:46.560 now sitting under the Westpac Group as still as a bank, 0:00:46.640 --> 0:00:51.600 but using the Westpac Group's banking license. So that's my disclosure. 0:00:51.880 --> 0:00:53.880 Other than that I have no relationship with Anthony. I 0:00:53.920 --> 0:00:56.040 have many a couplications before, but. 0:00:56.560 --> 0:00:58.880 In his capacity as a sea of a bank. So 0:00:59.600 --> 0:01:00.800 look for to this podcast. 0:01:00.880 --> 0:01:02.880 It's pretty exciting, pretty cool to actually be able to 0:01:02.920 --> 0:01:05.440 interview a CEO of one of the four b banks 0:01:05.480 --> 0:01:08.960 in Australia and from my point of view, one of 0:01:09.000 --> 0:01:09.760 my favorite banks. 0:01:10.520 --> 0:01:12.279 Anthony Miller, well and straight talk. 0:01:12.200 --> 0:01:14.080 Mate, thank you thanks for having me. 0:01:14.160 --> 0:01:17.280 This is pretty unusually it's a I find it as 0:01:17.360 --> 0:01:20.840 quite an exciting opportunity to sit in front of a 0:01:22.720 --> 0:01:25.319 someone who's the CEO of one of the largest banks 0:01:25.319 --> 0:01:28.480 in this country. And of course, you know, for our audience, 0:01:28.520 --> 0:01:30.479 you know, Australian banks are some of the most profitable 0:01:30.480 --> 0:01:34.240 banks in the world by virtual market capitalization if you're 0:01:34.319 --> 0:01:37.520 relative to that, and maybe that don't make the biggest 0:01:37.560 --> 0:01:39.600 profits in the world, but they in a relative sense, 0:01:39.600 --> 0:01:41.040 they are some of the most profitable banks in the 0:01:41.040 --> 0:01:43.160 world and definitely some of the highest rated banks in 0:01:43.160 --> 0:01:43.520 the world. 0:01:43.920 --> 0:01:45.360 And you're sitting at the helm of Westpac. 0:01:45.840 --> 0:01:48.480 Absolutely and I've been in the role two hundred and 0:01:48.520 --> 0:01:52.240 sixteen days Mark, so enjoyed every single day so far. 0:01:52.760 --> 0:01:54.120 It's pretty amazing. 0:01:55.640 --> 0:02:00.160 I understand you come from fairly humble background. Maybe can 0:02:00.240 --> 0:02:02.280 just tell me where's Anthony Miller come from? 0:02:02.480 --> 0:02:03.120 Where we were born? 0:02:03.200 --> 0:02:05.640 But sure so I was. I was born in Canberra 0:02:06.360 --> 0:02:10.280 and for various reasons, we moved around a lot as 0:02:10.320 --> 0:02:17.000 I grew up. So I lived in Canberra Darwin, Alice Springs, Doubo, Canberra, Brisbane, 0:02:17.000 --> 0:02:18.760 and I finished high school in Brisbane. My last two 0:02:18.800 --> 0:02:21.520 years of high school were in Brisbane. And so often 0:02:21.560 --> 0:02:24.639 people think I'm a Queenslander, and I suppose two years 0:02:24.680 --> 0:02:27.360 of high school and five years of UNI sort of 0:02:27.400 --> 0:02:30.639 formative years, and certainly have a lot of affection for Queensland, 0:02:30.680 --> 0:02:33.560 but I spent a lot of time outside Queensland growing up. 0:02:33.720 --> 0:02:35.880 Under the state of origin rules. That doesn't qualify years 0:02:35.880 --> 0:02:36.720 to Queensland, or does. 0:02:36.639 --> 0:02:39.400 It not quite. The way it broke down is that 0:02:39.760 --> 0:02:42.799 when State of Origin first came on in nineteen eighty, 0:02:43.240 --> 0:02:45.320 I lived in New South Wales double Hoo, and I 0:02:45.360 --> 0:02:49.560 was mad Keen Rugua League supporter and it was seared 0:02:49.560 --> 0:02:52.560 in my memory that, you know, the frustrations that Queensline 0:02:52.600 --> 0:02:54.560 just kept beating us for those first four or five 0:02:54.600 --> 0:02:57.080 years until so they beaten But well that's right, and 0:02:57.080 --> 0:02:59.120 they had some grades, you know Wally Lewis and you 0:02:59.160 --> 0:03:02.360 know mountvin Ingram goodness, you know Eddie's Prime. So it 0:03:02.400 --> 0:03:05.320 was almost impossible to win. And so therefore I'm a 0:03:05.400 --> 0:03:08.280 little bit partial to see New South Wales competing state 0:03:08.280 --> 0:03:10.680 of a blue shirt on yes, that's right. But I'm 0:03:10.680 --> 0:03:12.640 a bit of a fan of the queens Land Red's 0:03:12.680 --> 0:03:14.960 rugby team because I had the privilege to going to 0:03:14.960 --> 0:03:17.799 school and people like Johnny Eels and guys like Mark 0:03:17.840 --> 0:03:20.280 Connors that I knew from UNI all played for the Reds, 0:03:20.320 --> 0:03:23.079 so I follow the Reds pretty closely. So so I'm 0:03:23.080 --> 0:03:24.440 sort of a little bit of it each way. 0:03:24.440 --> 0:03:26.640 Bet there, no, no, no, no, come on, come on, 0:03:26.760 --> 0:03:28.640 come on, and no, no, you can't do that. 0:03:28.639 --> 0:03:32.839 You can't do that too, which, Okay, which NRL team 0:03:32.840 --> 0:03:33.320 do you follow? 0:03:33.600 --> 0:03:36.360 Paramatta Eels deals And I've been with the Paramatta Eels 0:03:36.360 --> 0:03:38.680 since nineteen seventy five when my dad sat me down 0:03:38.720 --> 0:03:40.800 and said you can go for any team you want 0:03:40.880 --> 0:03:41.920 as long as it's the Eels. 0:03:43.080 --> 0:03:44.279 That's fairly democratic. 0:03:44.360 --> 0:03:46.080 And then and then I was sport because in seventy 0:03:46.080 --> 0:03:48.280 six they made the Grand Final. And then it just 0:03:48.320 --> 0:03:50.360 felt like for me until I was about seventeen, that 0:03:50.480 --> 0:03:52.520 every year the Paramatta Eels were either in the Grand 0:03:52.560 --> 0:03:54.880 Final or just missed out on the Grand Final, or 0:03:54.880 --> 0:03:57.320 won a Grand Final. And then since then, you know, 0:03:57.400 --> 0:03:58.680 it's been pretty barren. 0:03:59.200 --> 0:04:02.200 In terms of your fan brothers, sisters. What's the deal? 0:04:02.520 --> 0:04:05.240 So I'm the ordest of six six kids, six kids. Yeah, 0:04:05.280 --> 0:04:08.960 so myself, then my two sisters and then three youngest, 0:04:09.640 --> 0:04:13.480 three boys, six kids. Wow. Yeah, you know, it was 0:04:13.480 --> 0:04:18.680 a really really lucky, you know, really good upbringing, a 0:04:18.720 --> 0:04:22.040 great family. Mom and dad still going really strong. They're 0:04:22.040 --> 0:04:24.560 still live. Yeah, absolutely, Wow, that's still going strong. We 0:04:24.600 --> 0:04:28.320 celebrated dad's eightieth a couple of weeks ago. He's got well, 0:04:28.360 --> 0:04:31.120 they've got six kids, and they've got twenty three grandchildren, 0:04:31.520 --> 0:04:32.320 great grandchild. 0:04:32.640 --> 0:04:32.919 Wow. 0:04:33.040 --> 0:04:38.080 And all fit, healthy, all all good people going after 0:04:38.160 --> 0:04:39.160 life in the right way. 0:04:39.600 --> 0:04:44.080 You have in your family, as I understand it, either 0:04:44.120 --> 0:04:46.960 one or two brothers who were fairly decent with using 0:04:46.960 --> 0:04:47.440 their hands. 0:04:47.839 --> 0:04:50.719 Yeah. So my one of my brothers, Paul, was a 0:04:50.720 --> 0:04:54.560 great boxer. He represented Australia at the Sydney two thousand 0:04:54.560 --> 0:04:58.120 Olympics and Manchester conwalf Games and he won a gold 0:04:58.160 --> 0:05:00.479 medal a super middleweight in two thousand and so he 0:05:00.560 --> 0:05:03.320 was a very good boxer. All my brothers they can 0:05:03.320 --> 0:05:06.560 handle themselves pretty well, younger brothers, that's right. Yeah, So 0:05:06.640 --> 0:05:09.359 I got to stay humble when I'm at home. And 0:05:09.360 --> 0:05:11.400 and then one of my sisters. Both my sisters were 0:05:11.400 --> 0:05:14.560 great sports persons and one of them won a gold 0:05:14.600 --> 0:05:17.840 medal at the Sydney Olympics in water polo. Really yeah, 0:05:17.920 --> 0:05:20.120 so they left me nothing in the gene covered in 0:05:20.200 --> 0:05:23.799 terms of you know, they just all of them super 0:05:23.839 --> 0:05:25.600 talented at sport and achieved so much. 0:05:25.720 --> 0:05:26.599 Did you play sport? 0:05:26.839 --> 0:05:31.039 Yeah? I was a really enthusiastic swimmer, really swimmer. Yeah, 0:05:31.040 --> 0:05:33.200 and I like I played all my sort of sports 0:05:33.200 --> 0:05:37.360 at young football and AFL rugby league, rugby union. I 0:05:37.400 --> 0:05:40.919 was really committed to being a swimmer, and you know, 0:05:40.920 --> 0:05:42.760 I trained twice a day. I was trained with Joe 0:05:42.800 --> 0:05:46.600 King at Leander in Brisbane. Hayley Lewis was one of them. 0:05:46.680 --> 0:05:48.159 Yeah, so she was in the squad. 0:05:48.279 --> 0:05:50.000 She was in the squad. Yeah. She was a terrific 0:05:50.040 --> 0:05:54.080 swimmer and obviously represented Australia. I wanted to represent Australia, 0:05:54.120 --> 0:05:54.880 just wasn't good enough. 0:05:54.920 --> 0:05:57.760 But because a lot of swimmers in up playing water polo. Yeah, 0:05:57.920 --> 0:05:59.480 is that how your sister's gone on a water polow. 0:06:00.760 --> 0:06:02.520 I think a little bit of the influence was that 0:06:02.560 --> 0:06:05.040 we were a mad keen swimming family and so at 0:06:05.080 --> 0:06:08.080 the pool and good swimmers. I think Gail, you know, 0:06:08.400 --> 0:06:10.640 my sister who was a water PLoP player. She could 0:06:10.640 --> 0:06:13.640 have been a champion swimmer, could have been a champion 0:06:14.400 --> 0:06:17.400 any sports. She is just such a natural athlete and 0:06:17.440 --> 0:06:21.960 such a capable, hard working training kind of person, So 0:06:22.160 --> 0:06:24.200 any sports she chose, I think she probably would have 0:06:24.279 --> 0:06:24.919 succeeded in. 0:06:25.040 --> 0:06:28.839 As a parent myself of a swimmer who was like 0:06:29.320 --> 0:06:32.080 one of my sons was an elite swimmer. One of 0:06:32.120 --> 0:06:36.279 the things I learned is about swimmers is that there's 0:06:36.800 --> 0:06:40.120 a massive amount of commitment to the to the craft 0:06:41.640 --> 0:06:45.960 and also for the parents for that matter too. What 0:06:46.120 --> 0:06:51.320 do you think you've learned in a character sense from 0:06:51.440 --> 0:06:56.279 a being a swimmer, but more importantly watching your parents 0:06:56.320 --> 0:07:01.120 sort of adopt or adapt into the commitment of having 0:07:01.160 --> 0:07:02.800 a son who wanted to be a swimmer. 0:07:03.640 --> 0:07:06.680 Yeah, great, great question. I mean, in terms of summing, 0:07:07.200 --> 0:07:09.800 I'm forever grateful that I was very committed to it, 0:07:10.640 --> 0:07:15.080 and also the fact that I didn't get there. I 0:07:15.120 --> 0:07:18.080 have no regrets because I trained really hard. I just 0:07:18.160 --> 0:07:21.080 wasn't good enough. But I got so much out of 0:07:21.120 --> 0:07:23.920 it in terms of friends, but also fitness, and also 0:07:24.560 --> 0:07:26.760 just I knew how to set a goal and how 0:07:26.760 --> 0:07:28.040 to relentlessly go. 0:07:27.960 --> 0:07:29.680 After And maybe you could explain it a little bit 0:07:29.720 --> 0:07:32.200 because most people probably haven't been to US. I haven't 0:07:32.200 --> 0:07:37.280 had the experience of it. So your summer holidays was 0:07:37.320 --> 0:07:39.400 committed to training when all you're made. 0:07:39.280 --> 0:07:41.480 To do it all year round. So I swam all 0:07:41.520 --> 0:07:42.360 year around, but the. 0:07:42.360 --> 0:07:43.760 Trials were and a jenerary. 0:07:43.840 --> 0:07:48.160 That's exactly right through summer summer holidays. Five am in 0:07:48.200 --> 0:07:52.000 the water, finished session seven, seven thirty in the morning, 0:07:53.320 --> 0:07:55.360 wouldn't do much during the day. Then I'd train in 0:07:55.400 --> 0:07:57.920 the afternoon. I'd be swimming anywhere between sort of ten 0:07:57.960 --> 0:08:01.000 to fourteen kilimeters a day. I was really going for it. 0:08:01.720 --> 0:08:06.040 What was this stroke? Look, breaststroke I wanted. I was 0:08:06.160 --> 0:08:09.800 competitive as a breastroker. I tried pretty hard at individual 0:08:09.840 --> 0:08:13.880 medally as well, but breastroke was my main sport, particularly 0:08:13.920 --> 0:08:14.679 a main stroker. 0:08:14.720 --> 0:08:17.040 And then you swim at minimum six days a week. 0:08:17.400 --> 0:08:20.120 That's right, it'd be twice a day every day, and 0:08:20.160 --> 0:08:21.680 then Saturday once this sad day. 0:08:21.760 --> 0:08:24.760 So which means when your mates when you were fifteen 0:08:24.800 --> 0:08:26.440 six and your mates is just starting to go to 0:08:26.520 --> 0:08:28.440 movies or whatever together and you can't do that sort 0:08:28.440 --> 0:08:30.080 of stuff because you're getting up four o'clock. 0:08:30.720 --> 0:08:33.800 So you have to give a fair bit up. Is 0:08:33.840 --> 0:08:35.160 it because you're the sort. 0:08:35.040 --> 0:08:39.679 Of personality is that you were compliant as a because 0:08:39.679 --> 0:08:41.520 I got four sons, only one that was any good 0:08:41.559 --> 0:08:43.120 at this was the most compliant sun. 0:08:43.640 --> 0:08:45.760 In other words, you never challenged me. Don't make it up. 0:08:46.080 --> 0:08:46.640 We got to go. 0:08:47.400 --> 0:08:49.360 Was it because you were a compliant kid, or was 0:08:49.400 --> 0:08:51.079 it because you were a driven kid? 0:08:51.280 --> 0:08:55.559 Or both? Well? Look, I think I think I was compliant. 0:08:55.679 --> 0:08:57.440 I suppose you know, I like to think I was 0:08:57.440 --> 0:09:00.199 a good boy, but I was driven. Yeah, I was 0:09:00.320 --> 0:09:02.800 very focused on I had a goal. I wanted to 0:09:02.840 --> 0:09:05.600 represent Australia. I trained twice a day. I trained really hard. 0:09:06.920 --> 0:09:09.720 In some ways, I didn't trade smart. I trained hard 0:09:10.040 --> 0:09:13.040 and without sort of nuance and you know, giving the 0:09:13.120 --> 0:09:16.080 right things like rest and recovery, the right weight that 0:09:16.120 --> 0:09:18.079 they deserved. But that was back in the mid to 0:09:18.160 --> 0:09:20.319 late eighties where everyone thought you just just put the 0:09:20.360 --> 0:09:21.280 miles in and you'll get there. 0:09:21.320 --> 0:09:22.840 We're keeping log books in those days. 0:09:23.679 --> 0:09:26.400 I kept a bit of a log of you know, 0:09:26.520 --> 0:09:28.720 the sessions, but I didn't keep copious notes. 0:09:28.920 --> 0:09:30.760 You weren't doing pulse rates and stuff like that. 0:09:30.800 --> 0:09:33.880 Oh no, we were doing in training sessions and there 0:09:33.920 --> 0:09:37.920 was a lot more science coming into if you were 0:09:37.960 --> 0:09:40.840 coaching and swimming training then, and the Institute Sport had 0:09:40.840 --> 0:09:43.160 been a big contributor to that sort of delivery of 0:09:43.200 --> 0:09:48.120 science into it. But I was very focused on just 0:09:48.400 --> 0:09:51.360 on the training, and I enjoyed the training. To be 0:09:51.400 --> 0:09:53.439 honest with you that you know it was quite social. 0:09:53.920 --> 0:09:56.000 It is you think not, but at the end of 0:09:56.040 --> 0:09:58.920 a fifteen hundred have a little bit of a chat. 0:09:59.080 --> 0:10:01.400 Yeah, exactually right, and then look, you know I'm ad 0:10:01.440 --> 0:10:04.640 at all boys school and then assuming cent training, there's 0:10:04.800 --> 0:10:07.320 lots of girls, so that was also a little bit 0:10:07.360 --> 0:10:09.520 of a wow. This is a bit of an interesting dynamic. 0:10:09.800 --> 0:10:11.680 So what do you I mean? 0:10:11.720 --> 0:10:14.920 I can I often ask my son, but he'll tell 0:10:14.960 --> 0:10:18.199 me this. But what do you think you might have 0:10:18.280 --> 0:10:23.920 gained in terms of character or your character from putting 0:10:23.920 --> 0:10:28.079 in many kilomas in the pool, many early mornings, making 0:10:28.120 --> 0:10:31.120 lots of sacrifices. Maybe they weren't sacrifices, but when you 0:10:31.120 --> 0:10:34.200 look back in hindsight, had to make a call, what 0:10:34.280 --> 0:10:35.920 do you think you might have gained in terms of 0:10:36.000 --> 0:10:38.880 your character today in what you do at the bank 0:10:39.000 --> 0:10:41.640 for example? And I don't mean anything specific, but how 0:10:42.040 --> 0:10:44.520 how did that shape Anthony Miller today. 0:10:44.559 --> 0:10:47.800 What I think? How would I? Yeah, that's again a 0:10:47.800 --> 0:10:52.079 good challenge, certainly, the idea that you've just got to 0:10:52.200 --> 0:10:54.640 sometimes go through a lot of hard work to get 0:10:54.640 --> 0:10:56.920 the game, and that you know there's going to be 0:10:56.960 --> 0:10:59.640 periods of time where it's just a real grind, and 0:10:59.679 --> 0:11:03.000 that there there's not the sugarcoat of every day and 0:11:03.320 --> 0:11:05.360 everything's positive always because you're just in the middle of 0:11:05.400 --> 0:11:08.440 hard work, training hard you're for going going out with 0:11:08.440 --> 0:11:10.079 your friends because you want to be able to train 0:11:10.120 --> 0:11:12.440 at your best the next day. But then there's great 0:11:12.480 --> 0:11:15.160 rewards at the end of it. And then equally, the 0:11:15.200 --> 0:11:18.040 thing I enjoyed, I really liked your training. I like 0:11:18.160 --> 0:11:21.400 the sense of, you know, putting one hundred percent in 0:11:21.440 --> 0:11:25.120 and just feeling like you've exhausted yourself. And maybe it's perverse, 0:11:25.160 --> 0:11:27.520 but I took satisfaction out of being a really hard 0:11:27.559 --> 0:11:30.560 trainer and took great pride in that I was one 0:11:30.600 --> 0:11:33.120 of the better trainers and the team. And then one 0:11:33.160 --> 0:11:35.079 of the things I did learn was, you know, it's 0:11:35.080 --> 0:11:37.080 all very well to be good and hard training, but 0:11:37.600 --> 0:11:39.600 at that moment when you have to stand on the 0:11:39.640 --> 0:11:42.200 block and compete in the race. You know, you've got 0:11:42.240 --> 0:11:43.719 to have your head in the game. You've got to 0:11:43.760 --> 0:11:46.760 be in that moment ready to deliver. And that's one 0:11:46.800 --> 0:11:50.080 of the other great challenges of assuming, is that you 0:11:50.080 --> 0:11:53.520 can train for six months through summer and then you've 0:11:53.520 --> 0:11:55.480 got two and a half minutes to win, and your 0:11:55.640 --> 0:11:57.880 entire summers defined by two and a half minutes. 0:11:57.920 --> 0:11:59.400 In the last race of this it could be one 0:11:59.440 --> 0:12:00.880 hundred exactly right. 0:12:00.920 --> 0:12:04.120 And you know if you don't get everything perfectly right 0:12:04.160 --> 0:12:07.320 in the race, you know someone can beat you. And 0:12:07.400 --> 0:12:09.680 so you know you have to be so focused on 0:12:09.760 --> 0:12:11.920 am I doing it all? Am I doing it all right? 0:12:12.000 --> 0:12:14.480 Am I getting it all done? And so that sort 0:12:14.480 --> 0:12:18.760 of constant challenge of is this right? Am I really 0:12:18.800 --> 0:12:21.400 pushing myself as I should? Have I done everything as 0:12:21.440 --> 0:12:24.800 I should That constant challenge you imposed on yourself is 0:12:24.840 --> 0:12:26.720 sort of like a skill that's really helpful later on 0:12:26.840 --> 0:12:29.120 in whatever you decide to do. So I sort of 0:12:29.120 --> 0:12:31.640 feel like assuming that I was pretty privileged to be 0:12:31.679 --> 0:12:33.760 able to be a swimmer. I thought it really did 0:12:33.800 --> 0:12:36.360 give me a lot of opportunities and also the fitness 0:12:36.360 --> 0:12:38.679 and health consequences of just being able to swim ten 0:12:38.720 --> 0:12:41.800 to fourteen kilometers a day sets you up for life. 0:12:42.320 --> 0:12:43.679 I think that's right in a health sense. 0:12:43.920 --> 0:12:46.360 And I think also you've got to have at least 0:12:46.400 --> 0:12:52.120 one parent who's completely committed to that process for the kid, 0:12:52.160 --> 0:12:54.480 because it's actually quite when I look back, it's all 0:12:54.559 --> 0:12:57.760 encompassing being a parent of a swimmer in the end. 0:12:57.760 --> 0:12:59.480 For me, like I was happy to get my kid 0:12:59.480 --> 0:13:01.200 of a car and get when he got his license 0:13:01.200 --> 0:13:02.880 so he could at least get himself at training at 0:13:02.880 --> 0:13:03.720 four thirty in the morning. 0:13:05.040 --> 0:13:06.559 If I then say to. 0:13:06.520 --> 0:13:09.320 You today in terms of your job of the bank, 0:13:10.200 --> 0:13:12.720 and by the way, Westpac sits on a number of banks, 0:13:12.760 --> 0:13:14.120 well they're not. There's not a number of banks, but 0:13:14.120 --> 0:13:16.400 there's a number of brands, that's right. So you know 0:13:16.440 --> 0:13:18.839 you've got Saint George, that's right, your bank essays, a 0:13:18.880 --> 0:13:21.240 bank essays Bank of Melbourne and Bank of Melbourne and 0:13:21.400 --> 0:13:22.079 anyone else. 0:13:22.240 --> 0:13:26.280 And so in terms of bank or bank like offerings. 0:13:26.320 --> 0:13:29.600 RAMS also has its own system as well. So what 0:13:29.679 --> 0:13:33.119 really Westpac is an amalgam of you know, different banks 0:13:33.559 --> 0:13:36.280 sitting under the one group that is Westpac Group. Yeah, 0:13:36.600 --> 0:13:39.199 and so it's really actually a collection of banks within 0:13:39.240 --> 0:13:39.560 the group. 0:13:39.720 --> 0:13:43.640 Yeah, and they all talk to different customers and they 0:13:43.640 --> 0:13:46.880 talk to different emotions from different sorts of customers. Like 0:13:46.920 --> 0:13:51.240 Bank of Melbourne is very Melbourne, Yes, Saint George is 0:13:51.720 --> 0:13:54.040 sort of not so much Melbourne's Sydney, more Sydney than 0:13:54.040 --> 0:13:57.000 anything else. I think, you know traditionally, because I remember 0:13:57.040 --> 0:13:59.240 Sir George about I was a customer of Saint George 0:13:59.320 --> 0:14:02.360 Building Society, Are you okay? And I went through every 0:14:02.440 --> 0:14:05.360 and then Saint George Building Society merged with another credit 0:14:05.480 --> 0:14:07.760 union or building society. Come overhood it was, and then 0:14:07.800 --> 0:14:11.120 they then ultimately it became St. George Bank, and then 0:14:11.120 --> 0:14:15.480 Saint George Bank was taken over under Gail Kelly by Westpac. 0:14:15.640 --> 0:14:17.959 That's well taken control by Westpak and now as a 0:14:17.960 --> 0:14:19.600 result that I'm now with Westpak, but I'm still with 0:14:19.640 --> 0:14:21.120 St George. But I know it's sitting on the west 0:14:21.120 --> 0:14:25.240 Bank brand. And as a as someone's sitting on top 0:14:25.280 --> 0:14:26.680 of such a it's a large group. 0:14:29.080 --> 0:14:30.920 What do you would you say that. 0:14:32.280 --> 0:14:33.880 The event Isswen, lots of other things happened in your 0:14:33.880 --> 0:14:36.080 life will talk about at a moment, but were they 0:14:36.400 --> 0:14:40.280 do they build resilience? View? Because like as a bank boss, 0:14:41.720 --> 0:14:44.359 I can't imagine I think you'd be putting a bushfires 0:14:44.400 --> 0:14:46.680 a lot. I mean there'd be a lot of dramas, 0:14:46.760 --> 0:14:49.080 I mean, like within the bank or maybe didn't you 0:14:49.120 --> 0:14:52.880 come in you came in after west PAC's major drama, 0:14:52.920 --> 0:14:56.880 the drama that sort of occurred during after nineteen twenty nineteen. 0:14:56.880 --> 0:14:59.160 I think, yeah, no, certainly. I joined Westpac at the 0:14:59.240 --> 0:15:01.040 end of twenty twenty and that was just in that 0:15:01.080 --> 0:15:03.960 sort of a difficult twelve months where you know, there 0:15:04.040 --> 0:15:08.080 was obviously infractions under the money laundering and OSTRAK matter, 0:15:08.440 --> 0:15:09.920 and then there was quite a bit of work that 0:15:10.000 --> 0:15:12.160 Westpac as a group had to do, which was you know, 0:15:12.440 --> 0:15:15.680 fixed or immediate processes, and so for a few years 0:15:15.720 --> 0:15:19.119 there it was very you know, very much focused on getting. 0:15:18.840 --> 0:15:21.160 Its house in order. We're doing it fifteen hundreds. 0:15:21.120 --> 0:15:23.520 That's exactly right, and so that was just that's just 0:15:23.560 --> 0:15:27.680 hard work, grinding way that's right, and more importantly, it's 0:15:27.720 --> 0:15:29.640 just getting back to the basics and making sure the 0:15:29.640 --> 0:15:32.480 way we deliver products and service to the customers were 0:15:32.480 --> 0:15:36.960 done at a standard that met community and regulatory expectations. 0:15:37.880 --> 0:15:39.240 And so you know, the bank did a lot of 0:15:39.280 --> 0:15:44.200 work on that, and that was also while challenging, also 0:15:45.000 --> 0:15:48.880 quite enjoyable in the sense of just you know, as 0:15:48.920 --> 0:15:51.000 a leadership team, all of us at the time just 0:15:51.080 --> 0:15:53.480 very focused on how do we just get Westpac the 0:15:53.600 --> 0:15:56.520 group back to where it should be, which is, you know, 0:15:56.960 --> 0:16:01.000 a really good bank, performing well and delivering for customers. 0:16:00.560 --> 0:16:03.240 And share holders, which, by the way, I'll come back 0:16:03.240 --> 0:16:05.000 to the customer shareholder thing, because that's a hard one 0:16:05.040 --> 0:16:09.000 to balance. Well, there's a balance, but it's a difficult one. 0:16:09.000 --> 0:16:10.720 I want to talk to you about how you do that. Yeah, 0:16:10.960 --> 0:16:13.080 if I just go back to you left school and 0:16:13.120 --> 0:16:13.600 what did you do. 0:16:14.400 --> 0:16:20.880 So I finished school in eighty seven and I went 0:16:20.880 --> 0:16:23.800 to university and I did a degree at the time, 0:16:23.840 --> 0:16:26.440 which was a little bit unusual. And you might remember 0:16:26.480 --> 0:16:29.560 the late eighties, Japan was the second largest colony world 0:16:29.560 --> 0:16:31.920 had just come out of nowhere through the seventies and eighties, 0:16:32.240 --> 0:16:34.840 and Japan was buying everything in Queensland. It just felt 0:16:34.880 --> 0:16:37.480 like tourists exactly right. 0:16:37.520 --> 0:16:40.720 So it was a massive development and everything, Yesdney as well, okay. 0:16:40.600 --> 0:16:44.640 Yeah, well certainly in Queensland. And so when I finished school, 0:16:45.400 --> 0:16:47.440 I suppose you know, my father had studied law, so 0:16:47.440 --> 0:16:49.640 I was a little bit drawn to I'll study law. 0:16:50.000 --> 0:16:52.120 But I decided to do an arts law degree, and 0:16:52.160 --> 0:16:54.560 it was the first time it had been offered. There 0:16:54.600 --> 0:16:57.280 was only eleven of us in the first class. And 0:16:57.320 --> 0:17:00.000 it was a combination of Asian studies majoring in Japanese 0:17:00.080 --> 0:17:02.320 language and some other so that's the outside of it. 0:17:02.360 --> 0:17:04.159 That's the outside of it, plus a law degree. And 0:17:04.160 --> 0:17:06.919 the law degree was at QUT and the Arts or 0:17:07.000 --> 0:17:09.199 Asian Studies degree was at griff of the University. So 0:17:09.280 --> 0:17:12.200 the two universities had combined and so to be sort 0:17:12.240 --> 0:17:15.879 of like Monday at QUT Tuesday at Griffith or vice versa. 0:17:16.000 --> 0:17:17.640 And they were physical in those days. 0:17:17.320 --> 0:17:21.200 Exactly right, quite two different campuses, one in the city, 0:17:21.200 --> 0:17:23.560 one out at sort of Mount Gravat. So that was 0:17:23.600 --> 0:17:27.439 a really interesting combination. And so I went after that. 0:17:27.480 --> 0:17:30.760 And my intention was when I finished that degree that 0:17:30.800 --> 0:17:34.480 I'd probably go and pursue, you know what it calls, 0:17:34.800 --> 0:17:37.159 like a career, perhaps working in Japan, or I'd go 0:17:37.200 --> 0:17:38.520 and study further in Japan. 0:17:39.040 --> 0:17:41.840 And as it turned out, that didn't eventuate. Did you 0:17:41.920 --> 0:17:43.000 learn to speak Japanese? 0:17:43.119 --> 0:17:45.520 I study Japanese, that's right. I would say my Japanese 0:17:45.560 --> 0:17:48.399 is poor, you know, one of the one of the 0:17:48.480 --> 0:17:50.679 challenges is that once you study languages, you've got to 0:17:50.680 --> 0:17:54.399 go and live and immerse yourself in the culture. And 0:17:54.520 --> 0:17:57.199 I didn't get to do that straight after university and 0:17:57.280 --> 0:18:00.280 so missed my window to really cement the language. But then, 0:18:00.359 --> 0:18:03.240 as it turns out, through my career later on, I 0:18:03.280 --> 0:18:06.120 was in Japan a lot for business. I really enjoyed 0:18:06.240 --> 0:18:08.919 working in Japan, and I had teams reporting to me 0:18:09.359 --> 0:18:11.960 out of Japan, so I've had a lot of exposure 0:18:11.960 --> 0:18:13.840 to Japan over the course the last thirty years. 0:18:14.000 --> 0:18:15.840 So did you ever practice as a lawyer? 0:18:16.440 --> 0:18:20.280 So I did. I finished university and I was a 0:18:20.280 --> 0:18:22.359 bit unsure about where I was going to go, and 0:18:22.520 --> 0:18:24.639 I was actually playing a little bit of rugby at 0:18:24.720 --> 0:18:28.880 Brothers Rugby Club in Britain, and a guy called Paul 0:18:28.960 --> 0:18:31.720 Tully and another guy who was working at the law 0:18:31.760 --> 0:18:34.640 firm Grand Deal Love encouraged me to join their law firm. 0:18:34.720 --> 0:18:36.800 So I joined their law firm for a couple of years, 0:18:36.800 --> 0:18:38.760 which was great because I was sort of unsure about 0:18:38.800 --> 0:18:40.480 what I wanted to do and where I wanted to go, 0:18:41.800 --> 0:18:43.720 and they gave me an opportunity just to work for 0:18:43.760 --> 0:18:47.080 a couple of years qualify as a lawyer. And I 0:18:47.119 --> 0:18:49.800