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Speaker 1: The public has had a long held fascination with detectives.

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Speaker 1: Detective see a side of life the average persons never

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Speaker 1: exposed to. I spent thirty four years as a cop.

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Speaker 1: For twenty five of those years, I was catching killers.

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Speaker 1: That's what I did for a living. I was a

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Speaker 1: homicide detective. I'm no longer just interviewing bad guys. Instead,

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Speaker 1: I'm taking the public into the world in which I operated.

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Speaker 1: The guests I talk to each week have amazing stories

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Speaker 1: from all sides of the law. The interviews are raw

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Speaker 1: and honest, just like the people I talk to. Some

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Speaker 1: of the content and language might be confronting. That's because

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Speaker 1: no one who comes into contact with crime is left unchanged.

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Speaker 1: Join me now as I take you into this world. Today,

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Speaker 1: I had to sit down with former bikei Owen Turnbull.

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Speaker 1: Owen's lucky to be alive. He's been shot on two

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Speaker 1: separate occasions and even had his home firebombed, which came

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Speaker 1: close to killing his family members. It's a price paid

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Speaker 1: for living the life of a gangster. Owen took us

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Speaker 1: deep into the world of outlaw motorcycle gangs. He was

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Speaker 1: a member of the Rebels before patching over to the Nomads,

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Speaker 1: where he became the sergeant of arms, an enforcer for

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Speaker 1: the club. But when he was sent to prison, he

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Speaker 1: came to the realization that this is not the life

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Speaker 1: he wants to live. Owen's a hard man with no

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Speaker 1: bullshit approach to life, as you will hear today, he's

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Speaker 1: now out of the biking world and educating young men

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Speaker 1: to understand the cost of living this life. Now, this

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Speaker 1: is a heavy conversation, but it's one I think it's

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Speaker 1: worthwhile having Ohen turnbull welcome, Do I catch killers? Well,

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Speaker 1: we can both have a bit of a laugh. For

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Speaker 1: X cop and X bikey sitting down having a chat. Well,

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Speaker 1: you could say that, you could say that we're parts

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Speaker 1: of organization, gangs and different things, but it's sort of

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Speaker 1: an accepted practice at Bikey's and cops neverthe two shall meet.

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Speaker 1: It's funny how life plays out, isn't it.

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Speaker 2: It's like, it's pretty funny considering off I left. I

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Speaker 2: get along with like the higher up cops a bit

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Speaker 2: better than I did some of the bikis.

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Speaker 1: Because it's well, how we how we got in contact

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Speaker 1: with I bumped into a current serving cop, yeah, and

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Speaker 1: got to talking with him, and he said, oh, you

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Speaker 1: should speak to this, but he's doing some good work.

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Speaker 2: We do the doing the NRL gig together. Yeah, the

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Speaker 2: juniors sharing my story helping them out of trouble. Well,

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Speaker 2: don't want your money gambling all that kinds of stuff.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, well, it's a good message to get across, but

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Speaker 1: I think we probably should clarify that. Yeah, the cop

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Speaker 1: a current serving cop you're speaking to. You're not an informant. No,

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Speaker 1: no informant.

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Speaker 2: No, let's put that on record. It's a job I

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Speaker 2: got with the NRL talking to the juniors, helping them

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Speaker 2: don't stray along the same path I did go on

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Speaker 2: from potential NRL first grader to becoming a bikey. My

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Speaker 2: story kind of helps out because a lot of the

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Speaker 2: young fellows these days, they've got money in social media.

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Speaker 2: They can get caught up on all that stuff. You know.

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Speaker 1: So well, the world's attract each other, don't.

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Speaker 2: They, because the intertwines.

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Speaker 1: It comes across. So I would imagine it is an

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Speaker 1: important message to get across. And that was the initiative

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Speaker 1: of the Queensland cops.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. The Queensland one was Gang Exit Gang Exit video.

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Speaker 2: For me, it was me ben Geppert who was part

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Speaker 2: of it as well. And there's another bloke who was

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Speaker 2: with the Titans Gold Coast Titans through his career way

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Speaker 2: to become a biking on stuff as well.

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Speaker 1: So well, I watch the watch your video on it,

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Speaker 1: and it's pretty heavy stuff and something that really got

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Speaker 1: a strong message up front in the video where you

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Speaker 1: talk about going to a funeral of a member that

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Speaker 1: someone got up and said how much he's going to

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Speaker 1: miss the brother and.

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Speaker 2: He's the person that followed. Yeah, it's about twenty sixteen.

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Speaker 2: Big there was a big time for the rebels, you

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Speaker 2: know what I mean. So I knew a lot of

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Speaker 2: things due to my position and getting told things, and

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Speaker 2: back in my head, I'm like, fuck, what am I

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Speaker 2: doing in this place? You're fucking consoling his mother and

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Speaker 2: you're the one that organized it. I started to realize

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Speaker 2: it's fucking mostly bullshit, but I still stayed in for

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Speaker 2: a couple few more years.

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Speaker 1: You learn your lessons, yeah, as you grow up. But

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Speaker 1: it reminds me of mafia. Dudes always talk about you

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Speaker 1: wacking each other. If you're going to get knocked that's

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Speaker 1: probably by your best mate. When you at least expect you.

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Speaker 2: See that all the time movies, real life, they get

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Speaker 2: knocked by their best mates because it's business or something

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Speaker 2: like that. Yeah.

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Speaker 1: Well, we had Michael Francis, he's a cape from.

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Speaker 2: New York in Australia.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, and I did a tour with him. But he

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Speaker 1: was talking about how, yeah, if you're going to get knocked,

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Speaker 1: it's probably by the person that's your best mate, which

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Speaker 1: is it's a hard life.

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Speaker 2: It's a fucked life, isn't it. It's meant to be

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Speaker 2: like a brotherhood, but you're getting killed by your best

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Speaker 2: mate or someone close to you.

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Speaker 1: Just paranoia kicking.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, oh fuck. There'd be heaps of times I'll get

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Speaker 2: called on the BlackBerry and we used to have them

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Speaker 2: I needed to come here, I needed to meet here,

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Speaker 2: or I think I'm in the back of my head,

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Speaker 2: I'm thinking, have I done something? Am I fucking gonna

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Speaker 2: get something gonna happen to me? It was. There was

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Speaker 2: a couple of times where I thought I was gonna

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Speaker 2: get fucking like shot or knocked or bashed by a

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Speaker 2: couple of people. I'd rock up to the President's house

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Speaker 2: at the time and there'll be people I wouldn't even

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Speaker 2: seen before there. I'm thinking, what's going on here, be

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Speaker 2: on edge, couldn't get out of their quick enough. A

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Speaker 2: just shows you like, and they just couldn't be brothers,

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Speaker 2: couldn't even trust him.

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Speaker 1: But to add to the paranoia, paranoia that's that's in

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Speaker 1: your your own crew, then you've got the could be

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Speaker 1: knocking on the door of.

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Speaker 2: Other clubs as well. Like we had a thing where

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Speaker 2: every common chero, every lander was a common shero.

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Speaker 1: Yeah you didn't know, you know what I mean.

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Speaker 2: So they think it's like three there's three big boys here.

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Speaker 2: They just normal everyday blokes or Bikey's something going to happen,

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Speaker 2: always on it, especially in camera. Was tiny.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, it's a small, very small place. Everyone's is business.

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Speaker 1: Is it more relaxing being out of the gangs.

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Speaker 2: Oh yeah, it's so much better because down there, obviously

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Speaker 2: it's such a small place. I can't just hide all

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Speaker 2: the time.

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Speaker 1: And what I high, I say, Hi, goodbye, very polite,

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Speaker 1: keep it, keep it, keep it short.

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Speaker 2: And yeah, they're good with me down there. They know

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Speaker 2: I'm completely out and doing my own thing and I

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Speaker 2: don't want anything to do with it, you know what

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Speaker 2: I mean. But yeah, just keep it nice and polite,

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Speaker 2: don't hate them. They don't hate me.

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Speaker 1: Yeah did you? You grew up in Canberra?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, born and raise the camera. Me.

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Speaker 1: Mother was a nurse.

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Speaker 2: My dad was a carpenter his whole life. And I

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Speaker 2: got a younger brother.

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Speaker 1: Right, okay, and you're a big unit and you're playing NRL.

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Speaker 2: I I was hoping. I was hoping to get there.

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Speaker 2: I stopped and I was playing soccer first, and then

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Speaker 2: I was like to mommy, I want to play pay

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Speaker 2: ruby league and your parents are real courtious, then I'm

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Speaker 2: going to get You're going to speak head over and

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Speaker 2: stuff like that. Finally was able to play rugby league.

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Speaker 2: I was under elevens and twelve played for two years

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Speaker 2: before I got selected for act score Boys, which like

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Speaker 2: First South Wales, Cleansland, stuff like that. Who kept playing?

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Speaker 2: I kept up to me under fourteen fifteen sixteens. My

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Speaker 2: whole time growing up, I was completely dedicated to becoming

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Speaker 2: an NRL football player. I was. I didn't associate with

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Speaker 2: anyone and what age? What age was this about? Fourteen

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Speaker 2: fifteen sixteen? And then I said, I said, I never

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Speaker 2: touched I won't touch alcohol, don't touch drugs anything. I

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Speaker 2: didn't touch drugs. Alcohol My first alcohols I was sixteen,

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Speaker 2: and then from there it was like downhill into like

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Speaker 2: just a spiral of lost on my cardio, no desire

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Speaker 2: to play football, just wanted to chase girls.

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Speaker 1: Did you put it down into the alcohol? It was

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Speaker 1: just the lifestyle and the bright lights and.

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Speaker 2: The lifestyle and the alcohol as well, because you don't

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Speaker 2: realize how much of affect you I when you look

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Speaker 2: with your cardio and stuff, when you're doing it every

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Speaker 2: weekend and pecual you want to hang out with your mates.

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Speaker 2: You've just turned eighteen as well, you're leave in school,

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Speaker 2: going out to the clubs after after school it was

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Speaker 2: cool the next day.

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Speaker 1: There's so many stories of blokes that, yeah, all the

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Speaker 1: potential in the world that could have made it at

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Speaker 1: the top level, and they made a good living out.

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Speaker 2: Of it, but the grog or drugs or get focus

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Speaker 2: the way. You have a big thumbs up to the

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Speaker 2: boys that can do both of that.

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Speaker 1: Stuff, you know, But you look back now and you think,

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Speaker 1: fuck what, I'm sure all the way.

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Speaker 2: For what for people who aren't even there anymore? Why

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Speaker 2: they don't care about me? You never cared about me.

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Speaker 2: It's just fuck, it's just stuck with my guns and

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Speaker 2: just kept my head down.

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Speaker 1: So okay, you're fifteen sixteen, you're getting you got the

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Speaker 1: taste of alcohol and the.

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Speaker 2: Wall played hal mats for the Raiders during that time

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Speaker 2: was when the first time I had my first sup

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Speaker 2: of beer, alcohol and drugs and didn't touch anything before that.

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Speaker 2: And you can tell from like how deteriorated I got

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Speaker 2: from like my cardio. I couldn't even finish doing like

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Speaker 2: one training session. It was that fuck. And then they

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Speaker 2: burned me from that. They said, oh, was on the coach,

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Speaker 2: you has your waste of fucking talent? Was the turbule?

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Speaker 2: I fuck, I got a bit of a fucking to

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Speaker 2: put my head in.

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Speaker 1: Shame, shame, listen, listen, You're a waste.

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Speaker 2: I still remember it stays in my head and kind

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Speaker 2: of like the fuck it I saw myself out. But

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Speaker 2: it's it's a bit hard when you're around a lot

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Speaker 2: of people and it's like, well, I can do this

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Speaker 2: and that. And then eventually, because I got kicked out

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Speaker 2: at home, I sent to live with my uncle.

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Speaker 1: What was that? You got kicked out at home?

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Speaker 2: Dad? Me and my dad were always at each other.

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Speaker 2: A lot of people, a lot of pressure on me

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Speaker 2: growing up to play football, I think I was just trying

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Speaker 2: to live through him, like it's just he's always he

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Speaker 2: always used to be about, oh yeah, my son's this

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Speaker 2: football is going to do this, And that's a lot

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Speaker 2: of pressure.

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Speaker 1: As I got older that that's interesting, and a lot

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Speaker 1: of parents are like, that isn't it. You want to

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Speaker 1: live vicariously through your through your kid, but it puts

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Speaker 1: out the pressure on you.

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Speaker 2: Because I just love it, just live and breathe at football,

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Speaker 2: and then it just become a chore and I just

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Speaker 2: hated it. Like we're training for Raiders on Monday, Wednesday Fridays.

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Speaker 2: They were way before.

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Speaker 1: Cheating.

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Speaker 2: If I've lost fucking five kilos in onion was probably

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Speaker 2: water eight, but you know five kilos from eighty five

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Speaker 2: to eighty Yeah. I just I'd come off of like

219
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Speaker 2: a birthday party or some shit. And we played the

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Speaker 2: trial against Sharks the next day for getting picked, and

221
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Speaker 2: fuck I played horrible rubbish, dropped the ball twice. I

222
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Speaker 2: still remember it, and then fucking you see me, Dad

223
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Speaker 2: and I had this shit say then they got cut

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Speaker 2: from there, the waste of talent thing and then my

225
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Speaker 2: dad always had each other's head. It chose next and

226
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Speaker 2: fuck it you can get the fuck out, sent me

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Speaker 2: up on a train to Barrow, lived in lived there

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Speaker 2: for about six to eight months working. I was living

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Speaker 2: in a garage. Your bedroom was a garage with a

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Speaker 2: bed of the mattress and a TV. And I was

231
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Speaker 2: working five dollars an hour sixteen seventeen years old. I

232
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Speaker 2: was like slave labor. I fucking hated it and maybe

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Speaker 2: it made me resent.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, next career choice didn't really stay in the right direct.

235
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Speaker 1: And you start working as a bouncer, didn't you How

236
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Speaker 1: old were you then?

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Speaker 2: Eighteen eighteen? I've got my old coach got me the job. Really, so, yeah,

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Speaker 2: I had enough of living in a fucking garage. This

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Speaker 2: ship moved back. No, I didn't even I just got

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Speaker 2: on a train one day and came back. So it's

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Speaker 2: got to make me Dad tell me to fuck off,

242
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Speaker 2: you know, at each other. And now obviously I got

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Speaker 2: to stay home. Wasn't nowhere else coming to go stay

244
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Speaker 2: with them? And they got the job. Next thing, you know,

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Speaker 2: because there was a pop in Tiger on the south

246
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Speaker 2: of Camber and rebels would frequent it a lot, and

247
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Speaker 2: they'd always come in and I think, oh, you know,

248
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Speaker 2: these guys are bad motherfuckers because eighteen, you don't know

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Speaker 2: anybout it and you're working the door. Yeah, working the

250
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Speaker 2: door and inside the club, the bar, and being young,

251
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Speaker 2: you don't know any But I don't think these guys

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Speaker 2: are so bad hectic. And then I was hanging I

253
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Speaker 2: met a few of them, hanging around for three months,

254
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Speaker 2: and then I numbed up after three months. So I

255
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Speaker 2: was about twenty years old.

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Speaker 1: What and this is a you know, the cautionary tail

257
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Speaker 1: because you're you're out of it now, But what what

258
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Speaker 1: was the attraction to it?

259
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Speaker 2: Like it's always the girls, the money, because I was

260
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Speaker 2: fucking dead broke. I had no life skills. I'm no

261
00:12:11,480 --> 00:12:14,040
Speaker 2: trade skills anything. I mean, best I could probably do

262
00:12:14,160 --> 00:12:16,439
Speaker 2: is lift up some furniture and stuff and move. And

263
00:12:17,280 --> 00:12:20,160
Speaker 2: so I started getting involved, like just hustling and doing

264
00:12:20,200 --> 00:12:22,079
Speaker 2: drugs and stuff. I didn't touch cocaine. The first of

265
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Speaker 2: a line of cocaine was with my president at the time. Yeah,

266
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Speaker 2: I was still scared to do it. I watched that

267
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Speaker 2: lend Bias doc go back in the day, I think

268
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Speaker 2: it was, and he had his first line and he

269
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Speaker 2: died from itself. Was always too scared to do it.

270
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Speaker 2: That's probably, and then I'd eventually just start doing it

271
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Speaker 2: and just kind of massive habit. I was broke till

272
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Speaker 2: about twenty four and then that's when I started making

273
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Speaker 2: bigger money.

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Speaker 1: So how and you're working the door and the rebels

275
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Speaker 1: are coming in all the bike How was that for you? Intimidating?

276
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Speaker 2: Intimidating at the time.

277
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Speaker 1: Intimidating. Imagine you're intimidated because.

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Speaker 2: You don't know any better and you don't know who

279
00:12:53,640 --> 00:12:56,440
Speaker 2: they are. But then you join and you realize, fucking

280
00:12:56,520 --> 00:12:58,760
Speaker 2: most of these guys are just fucking blow asses, you

281
00:12:58,800 --> 00:13:01,079
Speaker 2: know what I mean. They've got no balls, hard about him. Nothing.

282
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Speaker 1: But when you're young or you don't know anything about

283
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Speaker 1: that life or from that life, you think, Okay, this

284
00:13:07,360 --> 00:13:09,599
Speaker 1: every day bloke, he's a bad motherfucker because he's a

285
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Speaker 1: bike And then you're joining, he's just like the guy

286
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Speaker 1: that's made to go do the shitter stuff, you know

287
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Speaker 1: what I mean, Just like he's in the club just

288
00:13:15,679 --> 00:13:17,760
Speaker 1: for a fucking so you can fix a bike or

289
00:13:18,160 --> 00:13:20,240
Speaker 1: do certain things, you know what I mean, Bring bring

290
00:13:20,240 --> 00:13:23,280
Speaker 1: a skill set to the club that can help. So

291
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Speaker 1: how did you you said you're asked to be How

292
00:13:26,320 --> 00:13:28,319
Speaker 1: did that happen. Did you start going to parties or

293
00:13:28,320 --> 00:13:28,800
Speaker 1: hanging out?

294
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Speaker 2: And I was start hanging out with a couple of

295
00:13:31,240 --> 00:13:34,520
Speaker 2: the members who just got their colors, like they were young,

296
00:13:35,040 --> 00:13:38,600
Speaker 2: about a couple of years older than me. And I'm

297
00:13:38,960 --> 00:13:41,400
Speaker 2: hanging out three months, are going to ship clubs, partying,

298
00:13:42,080 --> 00:13:44,480
Speaker 2: doing all kinds of driving around, just a shit like that.

299
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Speaker 2: And yeah, after three months told us if I wanted

300
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Speaker 2: to join, and I was like, yeah, sure, got nothing

301
00:13:49,440 --> 00:13:51,839
Speaker 2: else going for me? What am I doing fucking working

302
00:13:51,840 --> 00:13:54,080
Speaker 2: two days a week doing nothing?

303
00:13:54,440 --> 00:13:56,920
Speaker 1: And so that that seemed to be better offer. Did

304
00:13:56,920 --> 00:14:00,160
Speaker 1: you have have an interest in bikes? Was that to

305
00:14:00,160 --> 00:14:02,200
Speaker 1: touch the bike? It never touched a hearty in my life. Okay,

306
00:14:02,320 --> 00:14:03,559
Speaker 1: we'll yap skill.

307
00:14:03,760 --> 00:14:05,679
Speaker 2: So actually the first time I got the bike, I

308
00:14:05,760 --> 00:14:09,319
Speaker 2: paid borught off them. It's fifteen thousand. There's a piece

309
00:14:09,320 --> 00:14:12,240
Speaker 2: of shit. Soft Tail twousand model soft Tail went for

310
00:14:12,240 --> 00:14:14,199
Speaker 2: a ride, got mees went for ride the first time,

311
00:14:14,240 --> 00:14:16,400
Speaker 2: and I was horrible because you got to lean them

312
00:14:16,800 --> 00:14:18,480
Speaker 2: and they're so heavy. I tried, I was trying to

313
00:14:18,520 --> 00:14:20,560
Speaker 2: turn the bars, come around around about I'm like, oh,

314
00:14:20,640 --> 00:14:23,440
Speaker 2: fucking nearly dropped it. And then I'm going up a hill.

315
00:14:23,520 --> 00:14:26,000
Speaker 2: First year second year, I'm like, oh, I've seen them

316
00:14:26,000 --> 00:14:28,000
Speaker 2: like don't bet it go down and you know it

317
00:14:28,040 --> 00:14:29,640
Speaker 2: slows them down a bit. And I did it, and

318
00:14:29,680 --> 00:14:31,880
Speaker 2: I think tailor spin. I dropped the bike. So the

319
00:14:31,880 --> 00:14:34,000
Speaker 2: first time on the hardy I was horrible. They it's

320
00:14:34,040 --> 00:14:37,240
Speaker 2: not not a good bike to be nah nah. But yeah,

321
00:14:37,600 --> 00:14:40,440
Speaker 2: from there I just kept riding around enjoy it.

322
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Speaker 1: How long were you non for?

323
00:14:43,040 --> 00:14:46,040
Speaker 2: I did twelve months. It's like, I think it's mostly

324
00:14:46,120 --> 00:14:47,640
Speaker 2: mandatory everywhere twelve months.

325
00:14:47,760 --> 00:14:51,320
Speaker 1: Describe and everyone has a different experience, but it's generally

326
00:14:51,360 --> 00:14:55,360
Speaker 1: not overly overly pleasant. Describe your experience.

327
00:14:54,920 --> 00:14:58,920
Speaker 2: Being noms like being a slive really and doing the

328
00:14:59,000 --> 00:15:04,720
Speaker 2: most stupid better ship, or like why am I doing this?

329
00:15:04,760 --> 00:15:07,080
Speaker 2: Are you that fucking lazy that you're calling me at

330
00:15:07,080 --> 00:15:09,720
Speaker 2: four in the morning to go and get your hungry jacks?

331
00:15:10,600 --> 00:15:13,880
Speaker 2: Or are you fucking I had two sponsors. One of

332
00:15:13,880 --> 00:15:16,120
Speaker 2: them is missus was pregnant, and he lived across from

333
00:15:16,120 --> 00:15:19,680
Speaker 2: the hospital, like literally a fifty meter walk. I lived

334
00:15:20,040 --> 00:15:22,800
Speaker 2: about half an hour away. He caught me, I needed

335
00:15:22,880 --> 00:15:24,400
Speaker 2: to fucking I need you to come and take me

336
00:15:24,440 --> 00:15:27,600
Speaker 2: to me and my misses to the hospital, just gonna

337
00:15:27,600 --> 00:15:31,200
Speaker 2: get a check up for the baby, like I'm fucking

338
00:15:31,240 --> 00:15:33,120
Speaker 2: doing that, you know what I mean, Like you fucking

339
00:15:33,160 --> 00:15:35,600
Speaker 2: live right there. It's like, are you that fucking lazy?

340
00:15:35,600 --> 00:15:38,800
Speaker 2: And he fucking lost it. And I've had some sort

341
00:15:38,840 --> 00:15:45,320
Speaker 2: of a reputation, but I was looked after and I

342
00:15:45,400 --> 00:15:47,520
Speaker 2: didn't get in trouble for telling a member to fuck

343
00:15:47,560 --> 00:15:50,840
Speaker 2: off and like all this kind of shit with oh yeah,

344
00:15:51,000 --> 00:15:53,080
Speaker 2: big striking, and they fucking a lot of the older

345
00:15:53,120 --> 00:15:55,800
Speaker 2: members and that didn't like me. I'm not going to

346
00:15:55,840 --> 00:15:57,680
Speaker 2: be stuck up, but I knew I was better than you,

347
00:15:57,760 --> 00:15:59,440
Speaker 2: know what I mean, Like these these guys are fucking

348
00:15:59,520 --> 00:16:01,320
Speaker 2: like I joined, and I'm like, holy funk, A lot

349
00:16:01,320 --> 00:16:03,160
Speaker 2: of these people are really fucking blow asses.

350
00:16:03,600 --> 00:16:07,600
Speaker 1: Yeah and that, yeah, well I wonder because you're fairly outspoken,

351
00:16:07,640 --> 00:16:07,960
Speaker 1: there's no.

352
00:16:08,000 --> 00:16:10,160
Speaker 2: Bullshit that it might be the same as a cop

353
00:16:10,160 --> 00:16:11,920
Speaker 2: where you go in and like fucking better than these people.

354
00:16:12,640 --> 00:16:15,600
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, well there's good good cops, bad cops, and

355
00:16:15,880 --> 00:16:19,720
Speaker 1: I'm sure the same applies with the bikis. But okay,

356
00:16:19,840 --> 00:16:24,280
Speaker 1: so you become a member, what what's that involved? And

357
00:16:24,400 --> 00:16:26,080
Speaker 1: I don't want you to go down the path of

358
00:16:26,160 --> 00:16:29,000
Speaker 1: revealing club secrets. Will put that out because of that.

359
00:16:29,720 --> 00:16:32,200
Speaker 1: That's not what it's about. This is your your personal

360
00:16:32,520 --> 00:16:33,320
Speaker 1: personal story.

361
00:16:33,400 --> 00:16:37,360
Speaker 2: But got my colors. There's me. I lived at the

362
00:16:37,360 --> 00:16:41,160
Speaker 2: clubhouse with another mate another none lived there. We're both

363
00:16:41,200 --> 00:16:43,680
Speaker 2: broke as fuck. We had like we're just doing a

364
00:16:43,720 --> 00:16:45,760
Speaker 2: lot of missions things of that, Like we had to

365
00:16:45,840 --> 00:16:50,640
Speaker 2: earn our colors basically, and we got our colors. And

366
00:16:51,680 --> 00:16:54,520
Speaker 2: they always they try to stick with my chapter. They

367
00:16:54,560 --> 00:16:56,640
Speaker 2: try to like scare you when intimidate you, but it's

368
00:16:56,680 --> 00:16:59,280
Speaker 2: all a joke when you get your colors, and like

369
00:16:59,400 --> 00:17:01,720
Speaker 2: they went in. I just smiling. I was laughing because

370
00:17:01,720 --> 00:17:03,080
Speaker 2: I knew I was geting my colors and they're trying

371
00:17:03,120 --> 00:17:05,760
Speaker 2: to put on like a facada. It's like you're in trouble, mate,

372
00:17:06,040 --> 00:17:09,359
Speaker 2: we know what you've done. Did that? I started laughing,

373
00:17:09,720 --> 00:17:12,280
Speaker 2: like it's not a fucking laughing matter. And I was

374
00:17:12,359 --> 00:17:16,960
Speaker 2: like what And then yeah, they've got my colors like

375
00:17:17,040 --> 00:17:19,040
Speaker 2: this straight after and then you have a big party,

376
00:17:19,800 --> 00:17:20,879
Speaker 2: how like you were.

377
00:17:21,320 --> 00:17:24,760
Speaker 1: You're reflecting now and your attitudes change, but that at

378
00:17:24,840 --> 00:17:26,920
Speaker 1: the time, was that something that you're gone, Yeah.

379
00:17:27,160 --> 00:17:29,360
Speaker 2: That was my number one goal in life is come

380
00:17:29,400 --> 00:17:33,200
Speaker 2: around that you were. I got I got their r

381
00:17:33,320 --> 00:17:36,600
Speaker 2: for far before it even like like a week after

382
00:17:36,600 --> 00:17:39,080
Speaker 2: I got my colors down my leg. Yeah, you know

383
00:17:39,400 --> 00:17:41,080
Speaker 2: you're to wait five years, But I.

384
00:17:41,119 --> 00:17:45,240
Speaker 1: Said, what the tattoo, You're in it forever. Yeah, that's

385
00:17:45,280 --> 00:17:45,680
Speaker 1: what I say.

386
00:17:45,760 --> 00:17:48,160
Speaker 2: You see, like all these young fellows now get look

387
00:17:48,200 --> 00:17:50,800
Speaker 2: at the tattoo shop and they're getting like whatever club

388
00:17:51,200 --> 00:17:52,800
Speaker 2: and then you're like, you're going to get that. You

389
00:17:52,880 --> 00:17:54,840
Speaker 2: know eventually you're gonna get that removed, right, No, I

390
00:17:54,880 --> 00:17:57,000
Speaker 2: mean forever. So I was saying the same ship.

391
00:17:57,680 --> 00:18:00,800
Speaker 1: But that's that's so that that's the experience of yeh

392
00:18:01,000 --> 00:18:03,200
Speaker 1: been through it and looking back because you wouldn't have

393
00:18:03,200 --> 00:18:05,200
Speaker 1: thought that at the time, because I think it's interesting

394
00:18:05,720 --> 00:18:07,320
Speaker 1: what your attitude was at the time.

395
00:18:07,440 --> 00:18:09,760
Speaker 2: Yes, this is my world totally different. So I lived

396
00:18:09,800 --> 00:18:11,800
Speaker 2: and breathe it like it's all I wanted. It's all

397
00:18:11,840 --> 00:18:13,080
Speaker 2: I wanted to do, and be I was like, yeah,

398
00:18:13,080 --> 00:18:16,560
Speaker 2: I want to become president on this chapter. And then

399
00:18:16,840 --> 00:18:19,040
Speaker 2: all the politics when you get higher up and stuff,

400
00:18:19,080 --> 00:18:22,040
Speaker 2: you're just like it's very clickie, like a lot of childish,

401
00:18:22,160 --> 00:18:25,040
Speaker 2: backstabbing shit, and it always revolves around money.

402
00:18:25,400 --> 00:18:27,440
Speaker 1: Where you put any group of people together and there's

403
00:18:27,440 --> 00:18:28,040
Speaker 1: always going to be.

404
00:18:28,200 --> 00:18:31,040
Speaker 2: A lot of fucking jealousy, especially from older members or

405
00:18:31,080 --> 00:18:33,119
Speaker 2: like they've been there for like ten fifteen years and

406
00:18:33,240 --> 00:18:34,760
Speaker 2: here you come in. You're like in there for two

407
00:18:34,840 --> 00:18:36,440
Speaker 2: years and you're already above.

408
00:18:36,240 --> 00:18:39,440
Speaker 1: Them, and what was expected of you being a member,

409
00:18:39,560 --> 00:18:41,280
Speaker 1: like put the club above everything else?

410
00:18:42,119 --> 00:18:44,119
Speaker 2: Yeah, stuff, You pay the fifty dollars a week dues

411
00:18:44,480 --> 00:18:48,880
Speaker 2: for a rubbish club hours every Tuesday, you got the church,

412
00:18:49,000 --> 00:18:51,359
Speaker 2: you stay every Friday's manatory, you've got to go. You

413
00:18:51,400 --> 00:18:54,040
Speaker 2: can't leave until twelve. And I've got fucking sick of

414
00:18:54,119 --> 00:18:56,080
Speaker 2: that stuff because it's you'd sit there and you do

415
00:18:56,200 --> 00:18:58,520
Speaker 2: the same thing every week. You'd get on it like

416
00:18:58,600 --> 00:19:00,320
Speaker 2: you have a couple of lines and then be like

417
00:19:01,359 --> 00:19:04,560
Speaker 2: he'd be repeating they'd be repeating the same stories, and

418
00:19:04,720 --> 00:19:06,959
Speaker 2: He's like, fuck, this is boring. And then it got

419
00:19:07,000 --> 00:19:09,400
Speaker 2: to a point where a lot of the chapter will

420
00:19:09,400 --> 00:19:11,280
Speaker 2: get jealous because I was hanging out with like normal

421
00:19:11,359 --> 00:19:14,919
Speaker 2: mates because I was just fucking sick of the staying

422
00:19:14,960 --> 00:19:18,000
Speaker 2: there till twelve o'clock or children a bit longer and

423
00:19:18,480 --> 00:19:22,119
Speaker 2: just repeat the same shit, same stories. It's like, this

424
00:19:22,240 --> 00:19:24,399
Speaker 2: is really fucking boring. It's not fun at all.

425
00:19:24,720 --> 00:19:27,000
Speaker 1: It looks like it's fun, sounds like it sounds like

426
00:19:27,080 --> 00:19:29,680
Speaker 1: a group of cops going out on the piss talking

427
00:19:29,720 --> 00:19:32,600
Speaker 1: about how good we were in the old days.

428
00:19:32,880 --> 00:19:34,600
Speaker 2: That's the same thing like this. It's like you're a

429
00:19:34,640 --> 00:19:36,320
Speaker 2: president or whatever telling us a year when I was

430
00:19:36,320 --> 00:19:38,119
Speaker 2: a normous I was under this guying, you know, to

431
00:19:38,200 --> 00:19:42,000
Speaker 2: earn the colors, and you know, repeating the same stories

432
00:19:42,119 --> 00:19:44,600
Speaker 2: every fucking week. It's like I fucking heard this already,

433
00:19:45,080 --> 00:19:47,200
Speaker 2: and it just becomes tiresome where you're just thinking of

434
00:19:47,320 --> 00:19:48,200
Speaker 2: excuses not to go.

435
00:19:49,119 --> 00:19:52,520
Speaker 1: It's funny the psychology of it. And you talk about,

436
00:19:52,840 --> 00:19:55,560
Speaker 1: you know, you've kicked out at home at sixteen, you

437
00:19:55,680 --> 00:19:57,879
Speaker 1: were going down the path of NRL, which would have

438
00:19:57,960 --> 00:20:01,680
Speaker 1: been yeah, you got bikes, got cops, you've got NRL teams.

439
00:20:01,720 --> 00:20:03,680
Speaker 1: You know, it's all been part of a group. Is

440
00:20:03,720 --> 00:20:04,960
Speaker 1: that something you were looking for?

441
00:20:05,359 --> 00:20:09,080
Speaker 2: Yeah, because we have anything, because I've been kicked out

442
00:20:09,080 --> 00:20:11,920
Speaker 2: at home or come back, I've had mates. But it's

443
00:20:12,080 --> 00:20:14,119
Speaker 2: like we're not doing my life, not doing anything. I

444
00:20:14,160 --> 00:20:16,120
Speaker 2: wanted to feel part of something. Really, It's like that's

445
00:20:16,119 --> 00:20:18,560
Speaker 2: what I'm saying. When I first joined, the President goes,

446
00:20:18,560 --> 00:20:20,720
Speaker 2: I'm going to turn you into a soldier, and I thought, oh,

447
00:20:20,760 --> 00:20:22,920
Speaker 2: that was cool. That's cool. Shit, he cares about me.

448
00:20:23,359 --> 00:20:25,560
Speaker 2: He's going to buy me food, looking after me, stuff

449
00:20:25,600 --> 00:20:27,600
Speaker 2: like that. So it's like, Okay, the person really cares

450
00:20:27,640 --> 00:20:30,119
Speaker 2: about me, like don't have a good relationship with me

451
00:20:30,200 --> 00:20:32,520
Speaker 2: dad and my mum, Like you know, I can count

452
00:20:32,560 --> 00:20:35,800
Speaker 2: on these guys to look after me. But liked talking

453
00:20:35,840 --> 00:20:37,880
Speaker 2: shit behind your back all the time out of jealousy

454
00:20:37,960 --> 00:20:39,440
Speaker 2: or the other members and shit like that.

455
00:20:39,600 --> 00:20:43,320
Speaker 1: Yeah, so when did the early stages? How long were

456
00:20:43,320 --> 00:20:45,199
Speaker 1: you in it where you thought this this rocks are

457
00:20:45,320 --> 00:20:48,080
Speaker 1: like the lifestyle you're living at the clubhouse, which has

458
00:20:48,280 --> 00:20:50,200
Speaker 1: this inherent dangers too, because there's a lot of the

459
00:20:50,240 --> 00:20:53,080
Speaker 1: clubhouses that get shot up all time, fucking.

460
00:20:52,960 --> 00:20:55,639
Speaker 2: Fire bombed everything. I was living there when when of

461
00:20:55,680 --> 00:20:57,800
Speaker 2: them happened when I was living there when I got

462
00:20:57,840 --> 00:21:01,800
Speaker 2: rated ones too, But like, yeah, it's just a lot

463
00:21:01,880 --> 00:21:06,080
Speaker 2: of jealousy and comes being a little favorite.

464
00:21:06,119 --> 00:21:11,080
Speaker 1: I guess, right, Okay, so you probably a bad terminology,

465
00:21:11,160 --> 00:21:12,040
Speaker 1: but the teacher's pet.

466
00:21:12,280 --> 00:21:15,040
Speaker 2: Yeah, well I did think mixed beach and stuff, you

467
00:21:15,080 --> 00:21:18,560
Speaker 2: know what I mean. It's like, oh fuck, I'd rather

468
00:21:18,640 --> 00:21:20,640
Speaker 2: not be driving him around every fucking day all day,

469
00:21:20,720 --> 00:21:21,879
Speaker 2: you know what I mean? You do it?

470
00:21:22,000 --> 00:21:25,240
Speaker 1: Then, did you have to fight like there was a

471
00:21:25,320 --> 00:21:26,199
Speaker 1: lot of punch ups and.

472
00:21:26,680 --> 00:21:28,560
Speaker 2: With other people and stuff. Yeah, I got to do

473
00:21:28,640 --> 00:21:31,080
Speaker 2: this and that's when I was the hang around. The

474
00:21:31,160 --> 00:21:33,399
Speaker 2: first thing we did was that was it was one

475
00:21:33,440 --> 00:21:36,120
Speaker 2: of the people that have shot at him or something

476
00:21:36,160 --> 00:21:38,359
Speaker 2: before this happened before I joined, was getting tattoed at

477
00:21:38,359 --> 00:21:41,680
Speaker 2: the shop that they own, and we're told to go.

478
00:21:41,720 --> 00:21:43,200
Speaker 2: We've got four or five of us have to go

479
00:21:43,320 --> 00:21:45,080
Speaker 2: wait there around the corner to come out around there

480
00:21:45,080 --> 00:21:47,720
Speaker 2: for about a couple of hours. Finally walked outside and

481
00:21:47,840 --> 00:21:50,080
Speaker 2: it was over within like ten twenty seconds, you know

482
00:21:50,119 --> 00:21:52,720
Speaker 2: what I mean? That was like my first thing I

483
00:21:52,800 --> 00:21:54,280
Speaker 2: did for the club really right, Yeah?

484
00:21:54,600 --> 00:21:57,159
Speaker 1: And how did you feel with doing that?

485
00:21:57,400 --> 00:22:00,760
Speaker 2: Was it just mad? Yeah? I was on edge of beer.

486
00:22:01,560 --> 00:22:03,840
Speaker 2: You get to doing sad much stuff. It just comes natural.

487
00:22:04,040 --> 00:22:05,040
Speaker 2: You don't even think about it.

488
00:22:05,520 --> 00:22:08,800
Speaker 1: So you become de sensitive because you come across as

489
00:22:08,960 --> 00:22:12,399
Speaker 1: a bloke got a conscience and you've got a brain, and.

490
00:22:12,400 --> 00:22:14,360
Speaker 2: Then you're just doing everything. You know, sometimes you don't

491
00:22:14,680 --> 00:22:16,639
Speaker 2: like and you don't want to do things, but you

492
00:22:16,720 --> 00:22:19,120
Speaker 2: fucking have to as well. You just like to get

493
00:22:19,119 --> 00:22:20,359
Speaker 2: a fucking over with, you know what I mean?

494
00:22:21,200 --> 00:22:24,320
Speaker 1: And what what about the drugs. Did that get older you?

495
00:22:24,440 --> 00:22:26,080
Speaker 1: Did you become depending on.

496
00:22:26,400 --> 00:22:31,280
Speaker 2: The cocaine was the biggest thing. But I didn't become

497
00:22:31,359 --> 00:22:34,560
Speaker 2: really dependent on that until about four years after I joined.

498
00:22:34,760 --> 00:22:38,200
Speaker 2: I was. I broke bumb for a lot of years

499
00:22:38,680 --> 00:22:41,400
Speaker 2: because I started hustling making money with like the pingers,

500
00:22:41,480 --> 00:22:43,639
Speaker 2: the pills that I got done with, all the cocaine,

501
00:22:44,480 --> 00:22:48,680
Speaker 2: bottles of valium. It's making a killing. And then yeah,

502
00:22:49,160 --> 00:22:52,520
Speaker 2: we're doing like an ounce a week cocaine and funct

503
00:22:52,880 --> 00:22:54,720
Speaker 2: you you were doing that, but I was getting people

504
00:22:54,720 --> 00:22:58,280
Speaker 2: to come over. Yeah. I didn't want to do by myself.

505
00:22:58,440 --> 00:23:01,120
Speaker 2: I felt like a piece of ship, degenerate you, which

506
00:23:01,160 --> 00:23:03,520
Speaker 2: I was, but I was like, fuck you. There's people

507
00:23:03,600 --> 00:23:05,000
Speaker 2: skipping work to come over, and and.

508
00:23:04,960 --> 00:23:07,640
Speaker 1: I would imagine when you're living that lifestyle and then

509
00:23:07,720 --> 00:23:11,280
Speaker 1: you're on the days that you do sober up and

510
00:23:11,640 --> 00:23:13,400
Speaker 1: clear your head, you'd be back down.

511
00:23:13,480 --> 00:23:18,239
Speaker 2: What am I doing life? It's the rebels. And then

512
00:23:18,280 --> 00:23:23,119
Speaker 2: we we had that national run of Perth to come

513
00:23:23,200 --> 00:23:25,160
Speaker 2: back and we had a big foury out within our chapter.

514
00:23:25,480 --> 00:23:27,879
Speaker 2: We had in our colors. We throw them at at

515
00:23:27,920 --> 00:23:31,320
Speaker 2: the North Side Clubhouse and left and then within like

516
00:23:31,400 --> 00:23:34,199
Speaker 2: a couple of days we'll get offers from like No Mads,

517
00:23:35,240 --> 00:23:37,639
Speaker 2: and then we got start talking about patch over to

518
00:23:37,680 --> 00:23:40,639
Speaker 2: another club or do this or that. So we talks

519
00:23:40,880 --> 00:23:43,600
Speaker 2: like Nomads, Angels and a couple of other clubs.

520
00:23:43,960 --> 00:23:46,879
Speaker 1: Explain, explain what patch over means, I know.

521
00:23:47,400 --> 00:23:50,280
Speaker 2: Throw, throwing your own colors and enjoying another club basically.

522
00:23:50,760 --> 00:23:55,680
Speaker 2: But so we settled on the Nomads, and so we

523
00:23:55,800 --> 00:23:58,200
Speaker 2: took our rebel gear. We took it to like the

524
00:23:58,280 --> 00:24:01,960
Speaker 2: North Side clubhouse lit on fire. They all come running out,

525
00:24:02,000 --> 00:24:06,320
Speaker 2: blah blah blah, stuff was happening and left. Then they

526
00:24:06,359 --> 00:24:08,840
Speaker 2: didn't want to bar. And then we went over to

527
00:24:08,920 --> 00:24:12,000
Speaker 2: No We chose Nomads, went up there, had dinner, met

528
00:24:12,040 --> 00:24:14,200
Speaker 2: all the other boys. We were along kind of clicked.

529
00:24:14,600 --> 00:24:16,880
Speaker 2: But I didn't realize we had to pay till after

530
00:24:17,040 --> 00:24:19,280
Speaker 2: the three und a k for us to get into

531
00:24:19,359 --> 00:24:20,879
Speaker 2: the club or something like that. I was like, we

532
00:24:20,920 --> 00:24:22,840
Speaker 2: could have joined another club for free. You know what

533
00:24:22,920 --> 00:24:24,720
Speaker 2: I mean, we're paying three on a green.

534
00:24:24,920 --> 00:24:28,399
Speaker 1: A lot of politics in it, oh, sounds of anything,

535
00:24:29,040 --> 00:24:33,399
Speaker 1: any kickback or any payback, I should say, leaving the

536
00:24:33,480 --> 00:24:34,400
Speaker 1: rebels with rebels.

537
00:24:34,680 --> 00:24:39,920
Speaker 2: We we kicked it off. It was our chapter. It

538
00:24:39,960 --> 00:24:42,040
Speaker 2: was on about eight of us. We kicked it off

539
00:24:42,119 --> 00:24:45,119
Speaker 2: with all of them, so like northwest East stuff like that.

540
00:24:46,160 --> 00:24:48,520
Speaker 2: A lot of things happened over three days, and then

541
00:24:49,040 --> 00:24:50,760
Speaker 2: they didn't want to buy anymore, so they all threw

542
00:24:50,800 --> 00:24:52,919
Speaker 2: their clothing the rebels. There was no one more rebels there,

543
00:24:53,200 --> 00:24:56,200
Speaker 2: and then they tried to come to the Nomads, and

544
00:24:56,320 --> 00:24:58,640
Speaker 2: it's like, fucking the reason we left in the first

545
00:24:58,640 --> 00:25:00,840
Speaker 2: place was because of what you fucking you know what

546
00:25:00,920 --> 00:25:03,280
Speaker 2: you're trying to come to us for. And I was adamant.

547
00:25:03,280 --> 00:25:05,200
Speaker 2: I was like that they are if they fucking come

548
00:25:05,240 --> 00:25:07,280
Speaker 2: on buck and leave it. I was sergeant at that time,

549
00:25:07,680 --> 00:25:09,240
Speaker 2: so I was doing a lot of shit. Yeah.

550
00:25:09,760 --> 00:25:13,320
Speaker 1: So when you when you're left and joined the nomads,

551
00:25:13,800 --> 00:25:16,400
Speaker 1: you've handed your colors in, you've gone with a crew,

552
00:25:17,040 --> 00:25:19,040
Speaker 1: you still must have mates in the rebels.

553
00:25:19,080 --> 00:25:21,800
Speaker 2: And the funny thing was, I'd bring up some boys

554
00:25:21,840 --> 00:25:24,280
Speaker 2: from city and they've got the ships at me about it. Yeah,

555
00:25:24,480 --> 00:25:26,040
Speaker 2: what the fuck, bro, you know we do? I mean,

556
00:25:26,160 --> 00:25:27,680
Speaker 2: fucking is what it is. You know. I'm well to

557
00:25:28,080 --> 00:25:29,879
Speaker 2: him as you would be loyal to yours.

558
00:25:30,600 --> 00:25:33,240
Speaker 1: But it's a culture, isn't it. The rules that you

559
00:25:34,040 --> 00:25:35,639
Speaker 1: don't stand until it happens to you. Or you go

560
00:25:35,680 --> 00:25:37,840
Speaker 1: through it till you get fucked over and you're like okay.

561
00:25:38,520 --> 00:25:40,200
Speaker 1: So how long were you in the rebels for?

562
00:25:40,480 --> 00:25:42,720
Speaker 2: I think it was about four years, and then the

563
00:25:42,800 --> 00:25:44,399
Speaker 2: nomads for two years.

564
00:25:44,880 --> 00:25:46,000
Speaker 1: When did which was a.

565
00:25:46,040 --> 00:25:49,680
Speaker 2: Fucking wild time? Yeah? Over overall, more action happened in

566
00:25:50,359 --> 00:25:53,240
Speaker 2: six months than ever happened before that.

567
00:25:53,720 --> 00:25:55,680
Speaker 1: When did you get When was the first time you

568
00:25:55,760 --> 00:25:56,280
Speaker 1: went to prison?

569
00:25:57,280 --> 00:26:03,040
Speaker 2: October twenty seventeen. I was in there for three months.

570
00:26:03,119 --> 00:26:08,280
Speaker 2: I got bail. I was just doing I was hustling

571
00:26:08,320 --> 00:26:10,439
Speaker 2: at a lot of drugs. Then, Yeah, hustling a.

572
00:26:10,440 --> 00:26:13,159
Speaker 1: Lot and tell us, tell us about your arrests and

573
00:26:13,240 --> 00:26:14,600
Speaker 1: the build up, how.

574
00:26:14,280 --> 00:26:17,520
Speaker 2: That first started from my birthday and the rest on

575
00:26:17,560 --> 00:26:21,720
Speaker 2: my birthday and locked up. I had a lot of

576
00:26:21,760 --> 00:26:23,399
Speaker 2: money owing to me. It was about two hundred and

577
00:26:23,400 --> 00:26:29,120
Speaker 2: fifty three three out a K. I told my best mate.

578
00:26:29,280 --> 00:26:31,879
Speaker 2: Had we bought a cafe? It was ninety six zerusan sweet?

579
00:26:31,880 --> 00:26:33,960
Speaker 2: Because do you hustle on your sell that stuff that

580
00:26:34,320 --> 00:26:37,320
Speaker 2: the ideas you go to legit, you don't keep fucking

581
00:26:37,359 --> 00:26:40,080
Speaker 2: doing it. But yeah it makes sense. Yeah, so I'm

582
00:26:40,119 --> 00:26:41,439
Speaker 2: going to git. We're gonna do this, you know, I mean,

583
00:26:41,520 --> 00:26:46,120
Speaker 2: whatever I get locked up on my birthday. I bought

584
00:26:46,119 --> 00:26:48,200
Speaker 2: the cafe with okay, bro, and can you collect this

585
00:26:48,280 --> 00:26:51,359
Speaker 2: money for me? Because I still owe someone? And yeas, sweet, sweet,

586
00:26:51,920 --> 00:26:54,199
Speaker 2: you collected at all. And then like two or three

587
00:26:54,240 --> 00:26:55,760
Speaker 2: weeks before I get out, like my missus at the

588
00:26:55,800 --> 00:26:58,240
Speaker 2: time and my mates. So he collected like three hundred

589
00:26:58,280 --> 00:27:00,560
Speaker 2: k and just disappeared, left his miss is everything. So

590
00:27:00,600 --> 00:27:02,440
Speaker 2: I'd got out and I'd had nothing, So I was

591
00:27:02,440 --> 00:27:04,840
Speaker 2: stressing us. Was I've got to pay my fucking up

592
00:27:04,920 --> 00:27:07,320
Speaker 2: the road as like fuck. I was doing anything I could.

593
00:27:07,359 --> 00:27:10,720
Speaker 2: I was organizing four thousand pills to this bloke he

594
00:27:10,840 --> 00:27:14,000
Speaker 2: messaged me. I knew him from used to sell to

595
00:27:14,080 --> 00:27:16,320
Speaker 2: him before. It was the setup. He goes, hey, I

596
00:27:16,359 --> 00:27:18,760
Speaker 2: want to get some pills. So I got out and

597
00:27:19,119 --> 00:27:21,560
Speaker 2: the bail was only out for two or three months,

598
00:27:23,040 --> 00:27:25,440
Speaker 2: and so I've got the pills. We're in the car together.

599
00:27:25,840 --> 00:27:28,480
Speaker 2: In the paperwork I've seen I started laughing, showing everyone

600
00:27:28,480 --> 00:27:30,200
Speaker 2: when I got locked up again, and I started laughing

601
00:27:30,280 --> 00:27:33,000
Speaker 2: til it's like you fucking serious. It's in the paperwork.

602
00:27:33,040 --> 00:27:36,320
Speaker 2: It has me looking in the car with him going

603
00:27:36,359 --> 00:27:38,280
Speaker 2: to meet his mate. We see I see his mate.

604
00:27:38,320 --> 00:27:40,160
Speaker 2: I turned him and her mate looks like a fucking cop.

605
00:27:40,720 --> 00:27:42,400
Speaker 2: Turns out that he was a fucking cop. So I'd

606
00:27:42,440 --> 00:27:44,240
Speaker 2: give him this cop fucking four thousand pills.

607
00:27:44,600 --> 00:27:45,480
Speaker 1: That's not a good idea.

608
00:27:45,600 --> 00:27:48,000
Speaker 2: Yeah, And it happened numerous times. I was thinking, in

609
00:27:48,119 --> 00:27:49,960
Speaker 2: my fucking gut, I knew it was a fucking cop

610
00:27:50,119 --> 00:27:52,880
Speaker 2: the whole time. I knew it was a cop. Yeah,

611
00:27:53,280 --> 00:27:56,199
Speaker 2: you're living. You learn though, And that thing was out

612
00:27:56,240 --> 00:27:57,680
Speaker 2: of desperation, as I was like, fuck, I need to

613
00:27:57,680 --> 00:28:00,240
Speaker 2: make money quick, going from having all this money it's

614
00:28:00,320 --> 00:28:01,280
Speaker 2: nothing and this.

615
00:28:01,440 --> 00:28:05,280
Speaker 1: Is your illegal activities, that's a source of your income.

616
00:28:05,400 --> 00:28:07,800
Speaker 2: Yeah, the whole literally, fucking I didn't have a job

617
00:28:08,000 --> 00:28:10,840
Speaker 2: entire time I was in the in the bike is.

618
00:28:10,880 --> 00:28:12,960
Speaker 2: I had a job from like for a couple of years.

619
00:28:12,960 --> 00:28:14,679
Speaker 2: At the start, I was working at the door at

620
00:28:14,680 --> 00:28:17,680
Speaker 2: the strip club and I was doing the Saudi Arabian

621
00:28:17,720 --> 00:28:19,240
Speaker 2: Ambassador's residents.

622
00:28:19,280 --> 00:28:24,639
Speaker 1: Yeah security, yeah, yeah, yeah, okay, so I need to

623
00:28:24,760 --> 00:28:28,680
Speaker 1: have a job. Blake, I know that went through the

624
00:28:28,760 --> 00:28:31,719
Speaker 1: gangs and all that. He was described himself as becoming

625
00:28:31,760 --> 00:28:35,159
Speaker 1: a citizen after he left there. Before there and he

626
00:28:35,200 --> 00:28:37,720
Speaker 1: said he was an outlaw. I won't mention the club,

627
00:28:37,800 --> 00:28:40,360
Speaker 1: but the president was saying that it's about time you

628
00:28:40,400 --> 00:28:42,080
Speaker 1: get a job, and he said, well, fuck that, I'm

629
00:28:42,080 --> 00:28:43,880
Speaker 1: an outlaw law job.

630
00:28:44,600 --> 00:28:46,800
Speaker 2: Is that the the you need a job? Like he's

631
00:28:46,840 --> 00:28:49,080
Speaker 2: going to pay dues? Are going to pay for your

632
00:28:49,320 --> 00:28:52,000
Speaker 2: by bike or do anything? Really going to go going

633
00:28:52,000 --> 00:28:53,120
Speaker 2: on a run? You know how you're going to pay

634
00:28:53,160 --> 00:28:55,440
Speaker 2: for hotel stuff like that? You know what I mean?

635
00:28:56,080 --> 00:28:57,760
Speaker 2: Actually I was just selling a lot of drugs and

636
00:28:57,880 --> 00:28:59,840
Speaker 2: making a lot of money. You need a job and

637
00:29:00,000 --> 00:29:01,120
Speaker 2: I fucking didn't have a job.

638
00:29:01,840 --> 00:29:05,880
Speaker 1: Tell us just say, people that don't understand the biking world,

639
00:29:06,280 --> 00:29:09,960
Speaker 1: give us an overview of a week in a week

640
00:29:10,000 --> 00:29:13,120
Speaker 1: without giving yourself up on anything. But what's the week

641
00:29:13,200 --> 00:29:15,440
Speaker 1: in the bike? Is you got your club meeting.

642
00:29:15,320 --> 00:29:17,520
Speaker 2: On a night as with a job or without a job,

643
00:29:17,640 --> 00:29:20,640
Speaker 2: without a job, what it'd be Monday? I'd wake up

644
00:29:20,640 --> 00:29:22,800
Speaker 2: at about eleven am, probably have a line of rack

645
00:29:22,880 --> 00:29:25,080
Speaker 2: or something with the mother, my housemate, with other boys.

646
00:29:25,240 --> 00:29:28,480
Speaker 2: We'd chill out, we'd try and get girls. We scroll

647
00:29:28,520 --> 00:29:31,520
Speaker 2: on Instagram, put up I was young with twenty twenty

648
00:29:31,560 --> 00:29:32,560
Speaker 2: one years old? You know what I mean?

649
00:29:32,760 --> 00:29:32,960
Speaker 1: Young?

650
00:29:33,000 --> 00:29:37,080
Speaker 2: It's just putting up photos driving around trying to sell drugs,

651
00:29:37,120 --> 00:29:39,080
Speaker 2: flat stick and then Tuesday would come, you do the

652
00:29:39,120 --> 00:29:42,160
Speaker 2: same thing. It's this your Groundhog Day every single day.

653
00:29:42,160 --> 00:29:43,720
Speaker 2: And there'd be days where you wouldn't sleep for like

654
00:29:43,840 --> 00:29:48,160
Speaker 2: three nights. You'd be just doing big vendors, and then

655
00:29:48,800 --> 00:29:49,680
Speaker 2: you'd get in trouble.

656
00:29:49,920 --> 00:29:54,560
Speaker 1: Trouble through the from the game. Yeah, for doing what

657
00:29:54,600 --> 00:29:55,360
Speaker 1: you meant to be doing.

658
00:29:56,480 --> 00:29:59,560
Speaker 2: There wass another one where we went about Facebook. At

659
00:29:59,560 --> 00:30:01,560
Speaker 2: the time, this is before like social medias were a

660
00:30:01,600 --> 00:30:04,640
Speaker 2: real thing with bikes. Yeah, we're allowed. We're allowed of Facebook.

661
00:30:04,720 --> 00:30:06,840
Speaker 2: So a lot of would have secret ones because you're

662
00:30:06,880 --> 00:30:08,560
Speaker 2: fucking young. You want to talk to girls and you

663
00:30:08,600 --> 00:30:11,240
Speaker 2: want to do things. I've got found out. I've got

664
00:30:11,280 --> 00:30:14,640
Speaker 2: to find fifteen hundred dollars for having Facebook, and then

665
00:30:14,960 --> 00:30:18,360
Speaker 2: like two weeks later, through through the through the have

666
00:30:18,440 --> 00:30:23,360
Speaker 2: a hearing, you get fifteen hundred dollars, have anyone representing yourself.

667
00:30:23,360 --> 00:30:25,040
Speaker 2: You don't even get represented. It's like, man, you know

668
00:30:25,160 --> 00:30:28,240
Speaker 2: the rules, fifte hundred bucks. Fuck, I don't know. Poor

669
00:30:28,320 --> 00:30:30,680
Speaker 2: as fun. There isn't nothing as it is, so you

670
00:30:30,800 --> 00:30:34,200
Speaker 2: just give them money. And two weeks later they unbanned

671
00:30:34,320 --> 00:30:36,200
Speaker 2: that you were allowed to have Facebook. So it's like

672
00:30:36,360 --> 00:30:38,480
Speaker 2: what a fucking joe? Okay, they're going to get the

673
00:30:38,520 --> 00:30:39,200
Speaker 2: money backs, Like, no.

674
00:30:39,360 --> 00:30:40,800
Speaker 1: Mat didn't make it retrospective.

675
00:30:41,000 --> 00:30:42,880
Speaker 2: Yeah the fuck on now we're going to use it

676
00:30:42,920 --> 00:30:45,120
Speaker 2: to recruit. It's like, fuck, this kind of happened like

677
00:30:45,160 --> 00:30:45,680
Speaker 2: two weeks ago.

678
00:30:45,800 --> 00:30:49,680
Speaker 1: Yeah, you know that's the life you you're a young fellow.

679
00:30:49,760 --> 00:30:53,360
Speaker 1: I've had spoken to other bikies that were working life

680
00:30:53,400 --> 00:30:55,600
Speaker 1: and they're saying that work of life is there. They're

681
00:30:55,640 --> 00:30:58,760
Speaker 1: different ways of being in the clubs, like as in

682
00:30:58,840 --> 00:31:01,080
Speaker 1: they had jobs and the bike bike.

683
00:31:02,240 --> 00:31:03,760
Speaker 2: If you had a job, you're probably a bit better off.

684
00:31:03,800 --> 00:31:05,280
Speaker 2: You wouldn't have to do as much. That's prob. I

685
00:31:05,320 --> 00:31:07,840
Speaker 2: had to drive him around all day every day. I'd

686
00:31:07,880 --> 00:31:10,800
Speaker 2: got to get it, come to mine at ten, pick

687
00:31:10,880 --> 00:31:13,600
Speaker 2: him up, drive him around's been talking, going around, just

688
00:31:13,640 --> 00:31:17,479
Speaker 2: doing a lot of talking. Sergeant natural state sergeant. Oh.

689
00:31:17,640 --> 00:31:20,160
Speaker 2: Sometimes once a month, every Tuesday, I'd have to drive

690
00:31:20,240 --> 00:31:25,680
Speaker 2: him up at Sydney for the fucking big meeting. Once

691
00:31:25,720 --> 00:31:27,560
Speaker 2: a month. It's a lot of driving and I'd rather

692
00:31:27,600 --> 00:31:29,480
Speaker 2: At the point I was like, I wish I was

693
00:31:29,480 --> 00:31:30,520
Speaker 2: going to have to come up with a lie and

694
00:31:30,560 --> 00:31:32,440
Speaker 2: say I have a job so I wouldn't have to

695
00:31:32,520 --> 00:31:32,720
Speaker 2: go and.

696
00:31:32,840 --> 00:31:35,920
Speaker 1: See the life you're describing them. We've all been through

697
00:31:36,000 --> 00:31:39,160
Speaker 1: stage uber driving, but we've all been through stages in

698
00:31:39,240 --> 00:31:41,120
Speaker 1: life that you don't quite like what you're doing and

699
00:31:41,400 --> 00:31:44,320
Speaker 1: you're sort of put up with it. You're taking a

700
00:31:44,400 --> 00:31:48,160
Speaker 1: high risk being in the bike is you're not enjoying

701
00:31:48,200 --> 00:31:50,840
Speaker 1: it by the sounds of it. There's the highlights, like

702
00:31:51,200 --> 00:31:53,800
Speaker 1: you said, the women and the drugs at the start

703
00:31:53,880 --> 00:31:56,080
Speaker 1: were a highlight, but that can become a bit repetitive.

704
00:31:56,440 --> 00:31:58,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's the thing, Like I want to fucking we've

705
00:31:58,800 --> 00:32:02,360
Speaker 2: got made Sergeant arms. There was a lot more responsibility

706
00:32:02,800 --> 00:32:06,080
Speaker 2: as well, and you couldn't really say no to doing

707
00:32:06,120 --> 00:32:07,400
Speaker 2: anything because I had to do it because it was

708
00:32:07,480 --> 00:32:09,160
Speaker 2: my position. I didn't There's a lot of things I

709
00:32:09,160 --> 00:32:10,840
Speaker 2: didn't want to do what I had to do it.

710
00:32:11,480 --> 00:32:13,040
Speaker 1: I want to talk a little bit more about the

711
00:32:13,160 --> 00:32:15,240
Speaker 1: role of sergeant of arms because it seems like the

712
00:32:15,320 --> 00:32:17,600
Speaker 1: poison Chaloue and the amount of people.

713
00:32:18,880 --> 00:32:20,760
Speaker 2: A position with a lot of power. I cann's basically

714
00:32:20,800 --> 00:32:22,880
Speaker 2: just stand forcing an action. You can do whatever you want.

715
00:32:22,960 --> 00:32:25,160
Speaker 2: You got more power than a VP. Basically you can.

716
00:32:26,640 --> 00:32:28,480
Speaker 2: I don't know if it's with every club, but the

717
00:32:28,560 --> 00:32:32,040
Speaker 2: clubs I was in, you could sergeant Arms you could.

718
00:32:33,320 --> 00:32:35,840
Speaker 2: I can force violence on any member at any point

719
00:32:35,880 --> 00:32:36,960
Speaker 2: if you wanted to, you know what I mean, for

720
00:32:37,040 --> 00:32:40,200
Speaker 2: any reason. So and I hated doing that ship. What's

721
00:32:40,360 --> 00:32:42,120
Speaker 2: especially like the young fellows because I was coming up

722
00:32:42,120 --> 00:32:43,920
Speaker 2: as a normal I fucking hated it. So I was like,

723
00:32:44,240 --> 00:32:46,120
Speaker 2: I'm gonna put them through that ship. I'd take them

724
00:32:46,160 --> 00:32:47,840
Speaker 2: out to party with me and they'd get in trouble.

725
00:32:48,080 --> 00:32:49,760
Speaker 2: You know, I'll get in trouble too, you know what

726
00:32:49,840 --> 00:32:51,840
Speaker 2: I mean. But yeah, I didn't want to pull other ship.

727
00:32:51,840 --> 00:32:53,920
Speaker 2: And this is fucked up, and you're thinking, fuck me,

728
00:32:53,960 --> 00:32:56,200
Speaker 2: why do you put me in this particament position. I

729
00:32:56,400 --> 00:32:57,960
Speaker 2: now got to pump out in front of everyone.

730
00:32:58,200 --> 00:33:01,760
Speaker 1: So I make the observation of living the outlaw lifestyle.

731
00:33:01,840 --> 00:33:03,800
Speaker 1: There's a lot of rules and regulations, isn't it.

732
00:33:04,400 --> 00:33:07,760
Speaker 2: Yeah, for suppose outlaw live your life how you want.

733
00:33:07,800 --> 00:33:09,880
Speaker 2: There's a lot of rules, and they're going to go

734
00:33:09,920 --> 00:33:13,200
Speaker 2: to the Constitution and ship like that. You can't do this,

735
00:33:13,640 --> 00:33:16,520
Speaker 2: you can't sell this, that's a lie they're doing that.

736
00:33:17,880 --> 00:33:19,720
Speaker 2: You can't sell this certain drug, you can't do this,

737
00:33:20,160 --> 00:33:21,880
Speaker 2: and they're all doing it anyway.

738
00:33:22,200 --> 00:33:24,800
Speaker 1: Could have anyone first of all, did anyone try and

739
00:33:24,880 --> 00:33:28,600
Speaker 1: pull you away from the lifestyle. Did anyone that you

740
00:33:28,800 --> 00:33:30,320
Speaker 1: respected sort of tap beyond?

741
00:33:30,760 --> 00:33:32,320
Speaker 2: I think all the ship that with the cops were

742
00:33:32,360 --> 00:33:34,720
Speaker 2: fucking around, and you pushed me further into it. I

743
00:33:34,920 --> 00:33:37,760
Speaker 2: understand they got a job to do, just saying ship

744
00:33:37,880 --> 00:33:40,760
Speaker 2: as well or fucking just destroying ship. It's like, why

745
00:33:40,760 --> 00:33:44,880
Speaker 2: are you doing, cosucker? Just make me when I you

746
00:33:45,080 --> 00:33:47,240
Speaker 2: coming in the clubhouse and ripping it apart, or even

747
00:33:47,320 --> 00:33:50,160
Speaker 2: like your are in bedroom like my parents' house and

748
00:33:50,200 --> 00:33:51,120
Speaker 2: they just tear it apart.

749
00:33:51,160 --> 00:33:53,760
Speaker 1: It's like, how how were you were you back on

750
00:33:53,880 --> 00:33:56,840
Speaker 1: speaking terms with your old before I got locked up?

751
00:33:56,880 --> 00:33:59,200
Speaker 1: I was you went in as a gang member?

752
00:33:59,720 --> 00:33:59,920
Speaker 2: Yep?

753
00:34:00,280 --> 00:34:01,600
Speaker 1: What what's that like in prison?

754
00:34:01,720 --> 00:34:04,560
Speaker 2: Well, they're segregated. It's like you got like different club yards.

755
00:34:04,600 --> 00:34:07,760
Speaker 2: So you got like comos, rebels, phinx, no, mad's like

756
00:34:07,840 --> 00:34:11,560
Speaker 2: different yards. They're all separated. You have no contact at all,

757
00:34:11,560 --> 00:34:14,359
Speaker 2: and if there is, that's a mistake on the screws part,

758
00:34:14,440 --> 00:34:18,160
Speaker 2: which happened a lot ironically, if you ended up in

759
00:34:18,200 --> 00:34:21,080
Speaker 2: the same yard, not in the same holding, like you say,

760
00:34:21,080 --> 00:34:23,800
Speaker 2: you're going up for meds or you're on for a

761
00:34:23,960 --> 00:34:27,160
Speaker 2: VL sometimes that you accidentally get put in the same

762
00:34:27,280 --> 00:34:28,080
Speaker 2: holding cell and.

763
00:34:28,120 --> 00:34:31,120
Speaker 1: So what's the mentality then if you're you got to

764
00:34:31,160 --> 00:34:32,719
Speaker 1: do it because you're on camera as well.

765
00:34:32,760 --> 00:34:36,040
Speaker 2: And it's like because there in there, it's like their

766
00:34:36,040 --> 00:34:37,960
Speaker 2: own little community, you know what I mean. Like it's

767
00:34:38,440 --> 00:34:42,480
Speaker 2: the screws and camera, the screws and the inmates talk,

768
00:34:42,600 --> 00:34:44,560
Speaker 2: you know what I mean, and you hear it all

769
00:34:44,600 --> 00:34:46,560
Speaker 2: the time. Fucking oh yeah, this kind of bitched out

770
00:34:46,600 --> 00:34:48,759
Speaker 2: to him. So like the first time I locked up

771
00:34:48,800 --> 00:34:51,440
Speaker 2: on my birthday, when I first went in, I got

772
00:34:51,480 --> 00:34:54,319
Speaker 2: put in the cell where you before you get transported

773
00:34:54,480 --> 00:34:57,279
Speaker 2: to the prison. I got put in. Is one of

774
00:34:57,360 --> 00:34:59,680
Speaker 2: my best mates back in the day. Will rebels together

775
00:35:00,120 --> 00:35:03,400
Speaker 2: over the comments. It's good guy, awesome, but we just

776
00:35:03,840 --> 00:35:06,200
Speaker 2: we were put the same thing and it's like, we

777
00:35:06,320 --> 00:35:08,440
Speaker 2: fucking have to do this, you know what I mean.

778
00:35:08,680 --> 00:35:10,879
Speaker 2: So you got one cunt block on the camera when

779
00:35:11,040 --> 00:35:13,920
Speaker 2: him going out of it. Oh, I sit here and

780
00:35:14,280 --> 00:35:16,960
Speaker 2: I understand, God, dummy, you understand it. Oh no, mad,

781
00:35:17,000 --> 00:35:17,479
Speaker 2: he's a comment.

782
00:35:17,560 --> 00:35:21,319
Speaker 1: You know, I understand understand violence. But the last time

783
00:35:21,560 --> 00:35:23,800
Speaker 1: I thought someone I didn't want to fight was in

784
00:35:23,920 --> 00:35:26,640
Speaker 1: the school yard when the kids are forming round.

785
00:35:26,560 --> 00:35:29,160
Speaker 2: Game to do it a fight, fight, fight, But it

786
00:35:29,200 --> 00:35:32,399
Speaker 2: doesn't look good because because like camera's a small place

787
00:35:32,440 --> 00:35:34,040
Speaker 2: and people talk, you know what I mean, so they

788
00:35:34,120 --> 00:35:37,239
Speaker 2: find out everything, Like my mom mum found out like

789
00:35:37,360 --> 00:35:38,880
Speaker 2: a day later what happened. I was like, what are

790
00:35:38,880 --> 00:35:40,080
Speaker 2: we talking about? You know what I mean?

791
00:35:40,239 --> 00:35:43,640
Speaker 1: But like, do you like I'm saying, yeah, as you

792
00:35:43,680 --> 00:35:45,239
Speaker 1: get older, you might have to have a fight. You

793
00:35:45,360 --> 00:35:47,680
Speaker 1: understand that. But he's a bloke that you haven't got

794
00:35:47,719 --> 00:35:50,000
Speaker 1: a real gripe with. And as business though, it's like

795
00:35:50,120 --> 00:35:53,360
Speaker 1: just club ship. It looks like schoolboys stuff in that.

796
00:35:54,600 --> 00:35:56,040
Speaker 1: I like you, but I'm going to have to punch

797
00:35:56,080 --> 00:35:57,719
Speaker 1: on because otherwise we're gonna And the only.

798
00:35:57,640 --> 00:36:01,200
Speaker 2: Reason we fought was because he started to comos and

799
00:36:01,560 --> 00:36:04,480
Speaker 2: which I'll think it back then, if like I was

800
00:36:04,520 --> 00:36:07,360
Speaker 2: saying before, if I had a president like Alan Meahan

801
00:36:07,520 --> 00:36:10,120
Speaker 2: or whatever, I'd still be there because he's like the

802
00:36:10,280 --> 00:36:14,560
Speaker 2: ideal boss. He's a fucking gentleman, a different way of caring.

803
00:36:14,600 --> 00:36:15,960
Speaker 2: He gives a fuck about his boys.

804
00:36:18,360 --> 00:36:20,880
Speaker 1: How did you end up sergeant arms? And what's the

805
00:36:21,000 --> 00:36:23,799
Speaker 1: quality of the sergeant arms they look for? You're going

806
00:36:23,880 --> 00:36:25,640
Speaker 1: to have to be able to look after yourself because

807
00:36:25,719 --> 00:36:26,879
Speaker 1: violence I didn't.

808
00:36:27,239 --> 00:36:30,240
Speaker 2: I wasn't made sergeant arms because of fighting or anything.

809
00:36:30,880 --> 00:36:33,520
Speaker 2: She was like a lot of other things. But yeah,

810
00:36:33,560 --> 00:36:36,600
Speaker 2: I was always if I was asking this something, I

811
00:36:36,600 --> 00:36:40,560
Speaker 2: would do it within reason. Like there'd be one time

812
00:36:40,600 --> 00:36:43,960
Speaker 2: where we had an arrival club beefing with heavy at

813
00:36:44,000 --> 00:36:48,120
Speaker 2: the time eating or eating in our area, which is

814
00:36:48,200 --> 00:36:50,120
Speaker 2: so fucking they're eating in the area. We've got to

815
00:36:50,160 --> 00:36:52,600
Speaker 2: do something about it. And looking back as so fucking sad.

816
00:36:52,840 --> 00:36:56,440
Speaker 1: He's embarrassing, it seems. But you look back now with

817
00:36:56,800 --> 00:36:58,560
Speaker 1: the distance from it at the time.

818
00:36:59,280 --> 00:37:01,160
Speaker 2: If I think it's a imagine what other people at

819
00:37:01,200 --> 00:37:02,200
Speaker 2: the time think about that ship.

820
00:37:02,440 --> 00:37:05,839
Speaker 1: So someone someone's come into your patch. Basically, yeah, sons

821
00:37:05,840 --> 00:37:07,360
Speaker 1: in our area. So we got to do something about it.

822
00:37:07,400 --> 00:37:10,400
Speaker 1: So these I was sober, a couple of arts were sober,

823
00:37:10,719 --> 00:37:13,120
Speaker 1: and the rest they were on a bender at the time.

824
00:37:13,160 --> 00:37:14,719
Speaker 1: They found us out. They found out they were having

825
00:37:14,880 --> 00:37:19,640
Speaker 1: a feed where we frequent and I was like, I

826
00:37:19,760 --> 00:37:21,160
Speaker 1: want you to go there, and I wanted to fucking

827
00:37:21,200 --> 00:37:23,320
Speaker 1: shoot it up, like spray it. I'm thinking, are you

828
00:37:23,400 --> 00:37:24,319
Speaker 1: fucking serious, mate?

829
00:37:24,800 --> 00:37:27,520
Speaker 2: Like it was me. I was sergeant. We had another

830
00:37:27,680 --> 00:37:30,080
Speaker 2: young fella brought in and then a driver. I think

831
00:37:30,120 --> 00:37:31,880
Speaker 2: you want me to go and shoot up a public

832
00:37:32,040 --> 00:37:36,319
Speaker 2: fucking area at seven pm at night, like prime dinner

833
00:37:36,400 --> 00:37:39,439
Speaker 2: time on a Friday night. It's like, you fucking dumb,

834
00:37:39,800 --> 00:37:44,400
Speaker 2: Like and I it's like, what if I hit someone

835
00:37:44,600 --> 00:37:47,120
Speaker 2: or even if I don't, I get like them. I'm

836
00:37:47,160 --> 00:37:49,480
Speaker 2: doing to do like ten to fifteen years easily. Yeah, yeah,

837
00:37:49,520 --> 00:37:51,480
Speaker 2: and throw throw my way, throw away my life for

838
00:37:51,560 --> 00:37:53,640
Speaker 2: what just because you've got to fucking sow ego. You

839
00:37:53,680 --> 00:37:56,200
Speaker 2: can't do it yourself, you're fuck wed like within reason,

840
00:37:56,280 --> 00:38:00,320
Speaker 2: I do it, but like that's just dumb. What's the

841
00:38:00,400 --> 00:38:03,160
Speaker 2: point but you So we did it, or we drove

842
00:38:03,239 --> 00:38:05,879
Speaker 2: past and outside the boys, I'm not going to because

843
00:38:05,920 --> 00:38:07,759
Speaker 2: it's them as well. They're young. It's like we're going

844
00:38:07,840 --> 00:38:09,120
Speaker 2: to do a lot of time for this too. If

845
00:38:10,360 --> 00:38:11,680
Speaker 2: it's like we're going to go, we're going to go.

846
00:38:11,920 --> 00:38:13,720
Speaker 2: We're going to tell him that they're not there anymore.

847
00:38:13,800 --> 00:38:17,120
Speaker 2: Out there still. So we drove past seeing him, I said, okay,

848
00:38:17,120 --> 00:38:18,600
Speaker 2: we're going to wait around a while, we're going to

849
00:38:18,640 --> 00:38:20,839
Speaker 2: do anything. We're going to when I go back and say, oh,

850
00:38:20,840 --> 00:38:23,239
Speaker 2: he's not there, not there anymore, and then leave it

851
00:38:23,320 --> 00:38:25,400
Speaker 2: at that. And that's just left at that. Yeah, I

852
00:38:25,440 --> 00:38:28,759
Speaker 2: think I was do you do you watch and we're out.

853
00:38:28,800 --> 00:38:31,320
Speaker 1: I'm not asking if you got any inside knowledge or whatever,

854
00:38:31,400 --> 00:38:34,640
Speaker 1: but my observation of some ship that goes down and

855
00:38:34,719 --> 00:38:38,000
Speaker 1: people often say what's going on with this gang war

856
00:38:38,200 --> 00:38:41,279
Speaker 1: or this or that? Sometimes it's as stupid are's things

857
00:38:41,360 --> 00:38:43,800
Speaker 1: like that thing And it can be one person just

858
00:38:43,920 --> 00:38:45,759
Speaker 1: talking tough and never undus falls.

859
00:38:47,000 --> 00:38:49,120
Speaker 2: As I'm saying something in social media you said all

860
00:38:49,160 --> 00:38:52,520
Speaker 2: the time like fuck you, fuck this club or fus

861
00:38:52,680 --> 00:38:54,840
Speaker 2: and it becomes something out of nothing.

862
00:38:54,640 --> 00:38:58,000
Speaker 1: Because I know the media often asking what's what's fueling

863
00:38:58,080 --> 00:39:01,680
Speaker 1: this this violence, and that something's something stupid.

864
00:39:01,719 --> 00:39:04,879
Speaker 2: It's tiny, miniscule. It's either money or a tiny little

865
00:39:04,920 --> 00:39:08,080
Speaker 2: beef over a girl or something someone said on the

866
00:39:08,120 --> 00:39:11,719
Speaker 2: grapevine and spun it and created drama. Yeah, I don't

867
00:39:11,719 --> 00:39:12,560
Speaker 2: have anything serious.

868
00:39:12,640 --> 00:39:16,960
Speaker 1: Really, What were your your parents thinking when you're in this,

869
00:39:17,160 --> 00:39:20,000
Speaker 1: because you know, regardless of how old the whole old

870
00:39:20,040 --> 00:39:21,640
Speaker 1: you are and how long you've been out of home.

871
00:39:22,400 --> 00:39:25,040
Speaker 2: My mum hated it, and I didn't realize at the

872
00:39:25,080 --> 00:39:27,000
Speaker 2: time all the damage and stuff I was doing to

873
00:39:27,120 --> 00:39:30,200
Speaker 2: her job. Like I went in the house first, got

874
00:39:30,600 --> 00:39:32,520
Speaker 2: has got shut up the first time a five. I

875
00:39:32,680 --> 00:39:34,960
Speaker 2: tried to keep it a secret but because my mum's

876
00:39:35,040 --> 00:39:36,839
Speaker 2: job is like, they've got intel and stuff as well,

877
00:39:36,920 --> 00:39:41,480
Speaker 2: they knew what the fuck's going on, and go was

878
00:39:41,520 --> 00:39:42,040
Speaker 2: it meant for me?

879
00:39:42,560 --> 00:39:44,640
Speaker 1: I'm just trying to get a sense of it too

880
00:39:44,719 --> 00:39:47,480
Speaker 1: when she's You know, when you're in prison, if they

881
00:39:47,560 --> 00:39:50,480
Speaker 1: come to visit you, they saying what are you going

882
00:39:50,520 --> 00:39:52,520
Speaker 1: to do when you get out? Because you're in how

883
00:39:52,600 --> 00:39:53,239
Speaker 1: long did you get?

884
00:39:53,360 --> 00:39:58,239
Speaker 2: For bears? But when I got out it hit the

885
00:39:58,320 --> 00:40:01,080
Speaker 2: media too. Yeah, I looked at I was w a

886
00:40:01,239 --> 00:40:07,000
Speaker 2: today Brisbane Times especially righted at your house. Yeah, the

887
00:40:07,160 --> 00:40:09,440
Speaker 2: fucking Then the cops put the thing and I was

888
00:40:09,480 --> 00:40:12,120
Speaker 2: seen running to the toilet trying to flush drugs, and

889
00:40:12,239 --> 00:40:14,640
Speaker 2: I mentionedly he tripped over and during the thing, I

890
00:40:14,719 --> 00:40:17,640
Speaker 2: was like you, I try to run you down in there.

891
00:40:18,480 --> 00:40:21,520
Speaker 1: And so at the time, I'm trying to get the

892
00:40:21,600 --> 00:40:24,080
Speaker 1: sense of you. At the time, did you think, okay,

893
00:40:24,120 --> 00:40:25,680
Speaker 1: well this is just the price I pay it, this

894
00:40:25,760 --> 00:40:28,000
Speaker 1: is this is cool? Did you get the ships with

895
00:40:28,040 --> 00:40:29,959
Speaker 1: yourself and go like, well I didn't.

896
00:40:29,960 --> 00:40:31,720
Speaker 2: I didn't really think about it much until I started

897
00:40:31,760 --> 00:40:33,880
Speaker 2: like affecting my mum's job, And then it took me

898
00:40:33,960 --> 00:40:37,000
Speaker 2: going to prison to realize all the ship I was

899
00:40:37,040 --> 00:40:39,000
Speaker 2: putting them through, you know what I mean. Like when

900
00:40:39,000 --> 00:40:41,040
Speaker 2: I was locked up, there was a point where fucking

901
00:40:41,320 --> 00:40:43,880
Speaker 2: in prison, I couldn't talk to me mum, just so

902
00:40:43,960 --> 00:40:48,040
Speaker 2: she could keep her job. We had my lawyer divvy

903
00:40:48,160 --> 00:40:49,920
Speaker 2: up a thing where we were I'd been like no

904
00:40:50,040 --> 00:40:52,160
Speaker 2: contact for like two years, and then we couldn't talk

905
00:40:52,239 --> 00:40:53,359
Speaker 2: for a bit till I got out.

906
00:40:53,719 --> 00:40:56,200
Speaker 1: After I got out, and that that's purely because the

907
00:40:56,320 --> 00:40:57,160
Speaker 1: job that she had.

908
00:40:57,239 --> 00:41:00,120
Speaker 2: Yeah, I'm not going to make it's not you all

909
00:41:00,120 --> 00:41:00,680
Speaker 2: fault that I was.

910
00:41:00,680 --> 00:41:02,920
Speaker 1: A piece of shit in conflict. Were you? Were you

911
00:41:03,000 --> 00:41:06,200
Speaker 1: in a relationship at the time, yes, how was that.

912
00:41:07,760 --> 00:41:10,080
Speaker 2: Together? And then we broke up after I got out

913
00:41:10,400 --> 00:41:13,360
Speaker 2: because before I went back again. It's in there. You

914
00:41:13,440 --> 00:41:15,759
Speaker 2: see a lot of the boys doing head miles over

915
00:41:15,880 --> 00:41:20,480
Speaker 2: women in jail, Like I swear, amplifies, amplifies your feelings

916
00:41:20,640 --> 00:41:22,120
Speaker 2: and stuff like that, because you think, oh, I'm going

917
00:41:22,160 --> 00:41:24,080
Speaker 2: to get out, baby, we're going to get married, We're

918
00:41:24,120 --> 00:41:25,600
Speaker 2: going to do all this, and they get out and

919
00:41:25,680 --> 00:41:28,440
Speaker 2: doesn't happen. They see boys in there, Like I was

920
00:41:28,520 --> 00:41:29,920
Speaker 2: in the yard with one of the boys and he

921
00:41:29,960 --> 00:41:31,640
Speaker 2: would spend one hundred and fifty bucks a week on

922
00:41:31,680 --> 00:41:33,800
Speaker 2: the phone just to talk to his missus, Like you

923
00:41:33,840 --> 00:41:36,160
Speaker 2: we'd have the visit. It sees miss as the first

924
00:41:36,200 --> 00:41:37,919
Speaker 2: thing you did. We'd come back and bring his missus again.

925
00:41:38,280 --> 00:41:41,400
Speaker 2: Like guys go crazy in there. Yeah, in a relationship.

926
00:41:41,440 --> 00:41:42,640
Speaker 2: And I was like, I'm not doing any of that.

927
00:41:43,080 --> 00:41:44,440
Speaker 2: That make me time even harder.

928
00:41:44,760 --> 00:41:46,600
Speaker 1: Well, I would imagine it would be harder. And I

929
00:41:46,640 --> 00:41:49,640
Speaker 1: would also imagine when you're inside and you're doing a

930
00:41:49,680 --> 00:41:52,120
Speaker 1: long stint, you'd be going, well, is she going to

931
00:41:52,200 --> 00:41:54,320
Speaker 1: move on from me? Yeah? You don't know what was

932
00:41:54,320 --> 00:41:56,920
Speaker 1: going on. You don't know, so it's kind of selfish

933
00:41:56,960 --> 00:42:00,000
Speaker 1: to fucking I can keep them. Yeah, So how many stints?

934
00:42:00,200 --> 00:42:02,919
Speaker 1: Stints did you do in prison to break it down?

935
00:42:03,680 --> 00:42:06,440
Speaker 2: It was like locked up on my birthday was like October.

936
00:42:07,760 --> 00:42:10,200
Speaker 2: Then all that stuff happened with the undercover cop and

937
00:42:10,440 --> 00:42:11,920
Speaker 2: the wire and they got locked up again. It was

938
00:42:11,920 --> 00:42:12,680
Speaker 2: like two would be years.

939
00:42:12,800 --> 00:42:14,600
Speaker 1: Yeah, what what was the second one?

940
00:42:17,520 --> 00:42:23,160
Speaker 2: More the sale of the pills, cocaine and valium and

941
00:42:23,440 --> 00:42:26,040
Speaker 2: proceeds of crime. I got more time for the value

942
00:42:26,080 --> 00:42:27,640
Speaker 2: than I did the cocaine, which is funny.

943
00:42:27,719 --> 00:42:28,440
Speaker 1: How did that break it?

944
00:42:28,640 --> 00:42:30,520
Speaker 2: I don't know. I think fifty bottles of valium's a

945
00:42:30,560 --> 00:42:32,120
Speaker 2: bit more than an ouncer case.

946
00:42:32,320 --> 00:42:36,520
Speaker 1: Yeah okay, yeah yeah. And so you didn't learn your

947
00:42:36,600 --> 00:42:37,680
Speaker 1: lesson the first time.

948
00:42:37,960 --> 00:42:42,239
Speaker 2: The second time, I'm thinking I had a lot of time.

949
00:42:42,320 --> 00:42:44,279
Speaker 2: It was because my lay goes, you need a the

950
00:42:44,320 --> 00:42:46,080
Speaker 2: early guilty player. He goes, I go, how we look,

951
00:42:46,120 --> 00:42:50,000
Speaker 2: and he goes, you fucked like you've literally on video

952
00:42:50,560 --> 00:42:54,920
Speaker 2: and photos giving an undercover cop drugs and receipt. You

953
00:42:54,960 --> 00:42:57,640
Speaker 2: can't beat it. Let'st we can do like a psychroport

954
00:42:57,800 --> 00:43:01,319
Speaker 2: report early guilty please. So I got twenty five percent off,

955
00:43:02,360 --> 00:43:04,759
Speaker 2: and so I was lucky I got the full twenty

956
00:43:04,800 --> 00:43:06,239
Speaker 2: five because I was looking at like he goes, You're

957
00:43:06,239 --> 00:43:08,719
Speaker 2: looking like nine years like six on the bottom, nine

958
00:43:08,800 --> 00:43:10,359
Speaker 2: years on the top. Was like fuck, I said, if

959
00:43:10,360 --> 00:43:13,399
Speaker 2: I don't want to be in here after I'm thirty.

960
00:43:13,440 --> 00:43:15,279
Speaker 2: If I said, if I if I'm in here after

961
00:43:15,320 --> 00:43:17,319
Speaker 2: I'm thirty, I'm gonna fuck if I get out at

962
00:43:17,480 --> 00:43:19,239
Speaker 2: thirty thirty one. I think I'm gonna kill myself, you know,

963
00:43:19,280 --> 00:43:21,320
Speaker 2: because I want to waste the life. And then I

964
00:43:21,400 --> 00:43:24,240
Speaker 2: went into the rehab yard, which is like the therapeutic community,

965
00:43:24,360 --> 00:43:27,120
Speaker 2: which kind of like talking to someone helped me a lot,

966
00:43:27,160 --> 00:43:28,840
Speaker 2: as well, I figured out what I want to do

967
00:43:28,880 --> 00:43:32,560
Speaker 2: in my life, and like I talking like the people

968
00:43:32,560 --> 00:43:34,560
Speaker 2: like you were a good Christian Catholic boy and all

969
00:43:34,560 --> 00:43:35,520
Speaker 2: the kind of stuff. I was like, you don't have

970
00:43:35,520 --> 00:43:36,880
Speaker 2: to be from the mud to get dirty, you know

971
00:43:36,920 --> 00:43:39,319
Speaker 2: what I mean. It's more so I'm probably a bit

972
00:43:39,360 --> 00:43:42,520
Speaker 2: more inclined to be smarter with that kinds of stuff,

973
00:43:42,560 --> 00:43:45,080
Speaker 2: like making money and stuff. But then I got out,

974
00:43:46,000 --> 00:43:48,440
Speaker 2: and then there's no incentive for any for them to

975
00:43:48,480 --> 00:43:50,120
Speaker 2: help you and stuff Like I went out, I'm going

976
00:43:50,200 --> 00:43:51,760
Speaker 2: to change my whole life. I'm going to do everything

977
00:43:51,800 --> 00:43:53,839
Speaker 2: I want to do and be like prop. I wanted

978
00:43:53,880 --> 00:43:56,040
Speaker 2: to be like a youth worker, so I did. I

979
00:43:56,120 --> 00:43:58,759
Speaker 2: went to like CIT which is like TAFE. So I

980
00:43:58,840 --> 00:44:02,440
Speaker 2: did CIRT three community services and then search for in

981
00:44:02,520 --> 00:44:05,879
Speaker 2: youth work, did the whole thing, all the assignments passed them.

982
00:44:06,080 --> 00:44:07,120
Speaker 1: This is when you're inside.

983
00:44:07,239 --> 00:44:08,719
Speaker 2: No, this is like within a couple months a me

984
00:44:08,760 --> 00:44:11,120
Speaker 2: get now right. But then when I went to the workplacement,

985
00:44:11,320 --> 00:44:13,880
Speaker 2: I couldn't even fucking finish it because I couldn't get

986
00:44:15,080 --> 00:44:17,560
Speaker 2: a lot of person's card. It's like fuck, And then

987
00:44:18,040 --> 00:44:20,360
Speaker 2: they are these people they want you to change and

988
00:44:20,440 --> 00:44:22,520
Speaker 2: change turn your life around and do anything. But then

989
00:44:22,520 --> 00:44:25,600
Speaker 2: they don't help you or given an incentive or not

990
00:44:25,719 --> 00:44:28,040
Speaker 2: even not an incentive, but they just like they make

991
00:44:28,080 --> 00:44:30,719
Speaker 2: it hard for you to change. And then I'm lucky

992
00:44:30,760 --> 00:44:32,399
Speaker 2: for me. I've got a good support network and good

993
00:44:32,440 --> 00:44:34,719
Speaker 2: mates and family, but I didn't turn back and go

994
00:44:34,800 --> 00:44:36,120
Speaker 2: back to all that doing that bullshit.

995
00:44:36,400 --> 00:44:39,600
Speaker 1: Well, if you break it down, you had your first stint.

996
00:44:40,080 --> 00:44:42,200
Speaker 1: You didn't learn from that because you've come out and

997
00:44:42,320 --> 00:44:44,320
Speaker 1: done the same for you. But I would imagine that

998
00:44:44,440 --> 00:44:47,680
Speaker 1: adds to your paranoid as well, because the cops know,

999
00:44:47,840 --> 00:44:50,320
Speaker 1: well you've convicted drug dealer. Yeah, it's not hard to

1000
00:44:50,840 --> 00:44:53,080
Speaker 1: look around. What are you up to? What are you

1001
00:44:53,160 --> 00:44:55,239
Speaker 1: up to now? How long were you out before you

1002
00:44:55,320 --> 00:44:56,440
Speaker 1: got locked up the second time?

1003
00:44:56,719 --> 00:44:59,720
Speaker 2: Two months? Right? Okay, so you didn't ever in that space,

1004
00:45:00,360 --> 00:45:05,000
Speaker 2: they fucking yes, slam me. So you Yeah, well you've

1005
00:45:05,040 --> 00:45:08,319
Speaker 2: come it's all out of just fucking I need money stressing. Yeah,

1006
00:45:08,400 --> 00:45:10,200
Speaker 2: you've come out with the intent that you're going to

1007
00:45:10,280 --> 00:45:13,719
Speaker 2: continue on them. But the second time, you same time, like, yeah,

1008
00:45:13,719 --> 00:45:15,120
Speaker 2: I got a fucking what am I doing my life?

1009
00:45:15,280 --> 00:45:18,439
Speaker 2: Like my mum like still having drums with her job

1010
00:45:18,760 --> 00:45:21,120
Speaker 2: stuff like that, and I mean, my grandma was sick

1011
00:45:21,320 --> 00:45:22,920
Speaker 2: and fucking I'm thinking of the mirror, like what the

1012
00:45:22,960 --> 00:45:24,440
Speaker 2: fuck am I doing? I don't belong here. It's like

1013
00:45:25,840 --> 00:45:27,319
Speaker 2: I'm trying to be a piece of ship. But it's

1014
00:45:27,400 --> 00:45:29,120
Speaker 2: like a lot of the boys in there in jail.

1015
00:45:30,080 --> 00:45:31,759
Speaker 2: I don't do eyes, so I don't hang around that

1016
00:45:31,840 --> 00:45:34,000
Speaker 2: stuff or you know. I mean, it's like that's not me.

1017
00:45:34,160 --> 00:45:37,000
Speaker 2: I don't call my sell my home like a lot

1018
00:45:37,040 --> 00:45:38,239
Speaker 2: of people do, like yeah, I'm going to go back

1019
00:45:38,239 --> 00:45:40,880
Speaker 2: to my home or this that it's not funny. Fucking

1020
00:45:41,400 --> 00:45:43,080
Speaker 2: grew up a fucking nerd, you know what I mean,

1021
00:45:43,120 --> 00:45:45,959
Speaker 2: playing video games and watching cartoons and ship.

1022
00:45:46,160 --> 00:45:49,319
Speaker 1: It's like, well, look we might we might take a break.

1023
00:45:49,400 --> 00:45:52,719
Speaker 1: What I want to cover off on in part two.

1024
00:45:53,239 --> 00:45:55,480
Speaker 1: I want to break down the shootings at home and

1025
00:45:55,560 --> 00:45:57,960
Speaker 1: the fire bombing in a little bit more detail, because

1026
00:45:58,000 --> 00:46:00,440
Speaker 1: I think what's going on in the streets Sydney at

1027
00:46:00,480 --> 00:46:03,360
Speaker 1: the moment, and there's these drive by shootings and everything

1028
00:46:03,400 --> 00:46:06,000
Speaker 1: else going on, and I want you to give like

1029
00:46:06,239 --> 00:46:07,640
Speaker 1: a personal camp.

1030
00:46:07,719 --> 00:46:09,640
Speaker 2: There's another big wake up, Paul, like they did the

1031
00:46:09,719 --> 00:46:13,040
Speaker 2: trajectory of the nine millimeters. Yeah forty five sorry and

1032
00:46:13,120 --> 00:46:15,040
Speaker 2: mean mum wasn't in bed at the time. She'd have

1033
00:46:15,040 --> 00:46:17,239
Speaker 2: been in bed at that time because she's where she

1034
00:46:17,320 --> 00:46:19,759
Speaker 2: slapped with. She would have been right through her. Yeah,

1035
00:46:20,000 --> 00:46:20,480
Speaker 2: I'm thinking the.

1036
00:46:20,560 --> 00:46:22,239
Speaker 1: Fuck, Well, that's the type of thing.

1037
00:46:22,280 --> 00:46:23,720
Speaker 2: That's when I started to think about leaving.

1038
00:46:23,880 --> 00:46:26,440
Speaker 1: That's the type of thing I want people people to hear,

1039
00:46:26,520 --> 00:46:28,839
Speaker 1: because people look at it and think it will happen

1040
00:46:28,880 --> 00:46:29,680
Speaker 1: to other people.

1041
00:46:29,760 --> 00:46:31,560
Speaker 2: But I thought it would happen to me. No, you

1042
00:46:31,719 --> 00:46:34,080
Speaker 2: get get caught up in it, and then no one's

1043
00:46:34,120 --> 00:46:35,640
Speaker 2: going to fucking come and shoot up my house.

1044
00:46:36,600 --> 00:46:38,880
Speaker 1: Yeah, I know. But it's all that dumb bravardo that

1045
00:46:39,239 --> 00:46:42,440
Speaker 1: you have as a young blake and how you have

1046
00:46:43,320 --> 00:46:46,040
Speaker 1: got associated with doing the gang exit video and what

1047
00:46:46,160 --> 00:46:48,800
Speaker 1: the purpose behind that is and what you hope to achieve.

1048
00:46:48,920 --> 00:46:52,879
Speaker 1: We've putting this message out to young fellows life. I've

1049
00:46:52,880 --> 00:46:55,680
Speaker 1: got to say, the life you've described, now, yeah, there

1050
00:46:55,880 --> 00:46:58,160
Speaker 1: might have been some highs, but there's more lowers and highs.

1051
00:46:58,239 --> 00:47:03,080
Speaker 2: Isn't it guaranteed? Fuckings here? Looking back? Yeah, I think

1052
00:47:03,840 --> 00:47:07,719
Speaker 2: I'm so what. I'm surprised I'm not still in prison, honestly. Yeah,

1053
00:47:07,840 --> 00:47:09,640
Speaker 2: it should I had to do or got told to do.

1054
00:47:09,760 --> 00:47:11,960
Speaker 2: I drinks myself.

1055
00:47:12,040 --> 00:47:14,120
Speaker 1: But well, I suppose that's why people are going to

1056
00:47:14,200 --> 00:47:17,800
Speaker 1: listen to you, because you've been through being through the pathway.

1057
00:47:18,040 --> 00:47:21,120
Speaker 1: So anyway, let's discuss that when we get back Part two.