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Speaker 1: We've just got to remind ourselves that if we want

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Speaker 1: to sort of feel well function well, particularly keeping the

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Speaker 1: old brain working well, we've just got to be mindful

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Speaker 1: that trying to stimulate it with too much stuff from

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Speaker 1: our phones or our screens is actually detrimental to our

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Speaker 1: health and well being.

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Speaker 2: Everyone.

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Speaker 3: Before we get into this week's podcast, we got a

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Speaker 3: pretty cool announcement to make you are not able to

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Speaker 3: connect with us. We have a pretty cool little widget

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Speaker 3: that's on the website. Just go to poletailor dot biz

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Speaker 3: Forwards Life podcast and near the top of the page

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Speaker 3: you'll see a little icon that says send a message

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Speaker 3: to the Pole Tailor podcast. And so what we can

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Speaker 3: do with that you just click on that and then

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Speaker 3: you send us an audio message and we will get

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Speaker 3: do with using it is actually do and ask me

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Speaker 3: anything episode. So all you got to do if you

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Speaker 3: got a question that we want me to cover is

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Speaker 3: just go to Paul Taylor dot b is z Forward

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Speaker 3: Slash podcast and on start the recording, and then send

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Speaker 3: us a message about what you would like me to

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Speaker 3: talk about, and they ask.

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Speaker 2: Me anything and leave your name. We will call it

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Speaker 2: out on the show. I'll get that all put together.

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Speaker 3: And the other thing you can do is just leave

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Speaker 3: us a message about what you like about the podcast,

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Speaker 3: what you don't like about the podcast day I talk

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Speaker 3: too about all of that sort of stuff, and just

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Speaker 3: give us some feedback and we will use that to

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Speaker 3: continuously improve. So looking forward to hearing from you now

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Speaker 3: I hover the podcast.

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Speaker 2: Doctor Jenny Brocus, Welcome to the podcast.

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Speaker 3: You are a i'll met physician and you have written

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Speaker 3: a book called The Natural Advantage. So tell our listeners

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Speaker 3: what a lifestyle and medicine position is and how you

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Speaker 3: got to become one of them.

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Speaker 2: Where did your interest in this area spark?

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Speaker 3: So?

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Speaker 1: I trained in medicine originally and worked as a GP

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Speaker 1: for many years and until I burnt out and then

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Speaker 1: decided I needed to do something else other than general

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Speaker 1: practice because I thought I'd probably burn out again if

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Speaker 1: I went back into it. But I really loved medicine

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Speaker 1: and wanted to apply it in a different way. And

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Speaker 1: even before the burnout happened, I'd been really curious as

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Speaker 1: to why some of my patients went to other healthcare practitioners.

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Speaker 1: Why did some of them go to a naturopath or

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Speaker 1: a chiropractice rather than me. You know, doctors meant to

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Speaker 1: be the be all and end all and know everything.

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Speaker 1: Of course we don't. So I had started exploring why,

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Speaker 1: and the answer I kept coming up with was the

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Speaker 1: fact that people wanted more time to be heard, and

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Speaker 1: they wanted a more holistic approach to their health rather

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Speaker 1: than the sort of quick tell me what's wrong. Oh,

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Speaker 1: this is a diagnosis, here's yours, here's yes script, now

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Speaker 1: you've got it. It was and that was very dissatisfying

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Speaker 1: for me as a practitioner. So I fell over lifestyle medicine,

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Speaker 1: having sort of set up a workplace health and well

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Speaker 1: being consultancy in the meantime, and realize that these people

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Speaker 1: who were all sorts of different health practitioners were basically

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Speaker 1: singing from the same thumsheet of asking, well, what keeps

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Speaker 1: people well? What can we do to prevent people from

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Speaker 1: becoming sick in the first place. We've got this epidemic

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Speaker 1: of chronic disease, which is sort of putting a burden

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Speaker 1: on everybody, and we have to do things differently. And

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Speaker 1: I just love the fact that lifestyle medicine offers the

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Speaker 1: practitioner the opportunity to engage at a different level with

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Speaker 1: their patient or client, whatever you want to call them,

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Speaker 1: so that you're you're basically having a conversation with them

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Speaker 1: and you're working together to resolve their health issues, seeking

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Speaker 1: also at the same time to keep them in best

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Speaker 1: functional state as possible, so you're encouraging them to take

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Speaker 1: more responsibility for looking after themselves in the first place,

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Speaker 1: and that is much better for everybody. The patients love

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Speaker 1: it because they feel heard, because they feel that, oh,

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Speaker 1: you're not just interested in my souteau, you're interested in

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Speaker 1: me as a person. And it's much more satisfying for

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Speaker 1: the practitioner or physician because we feel that we are

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Speaker 1: actually making a positive difference to people's overall health and wellbeing.

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Speaker 1: So that's what got me into it.

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Speaker 3: There's so much say on pack there and a couple

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Speaker 3: of things I want to touch on. So firstly around

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Speaker 3: you talked about sickness and writing scripts. I was just

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Speaker 3: writing a new book and I was just doing a

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Speaker 3: bit of research earlier on and ninety five to ninety

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Speaker 3: eight percent of all healthcare spending in most OECD nations

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Speaker 3: is on tertiary treatment, So we don't really have a

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Speaker 3: healthcare system. We've got a sick care system which, as

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Speaker 3: you rightly say, is not proactive about people's health and

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Speaker 3: it tends to be just writing scripts and then the

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Speaker 3: whole system that then drives burnout as well, because, as

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Speaker 3: you'll be very aware, I think doctors are at the

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Speaker 3: highest or among the highest in terms of professional burnout.

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Speaker 3: How much of that do you think is down to

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Speaker 3: the fact that you have to churn out patients every

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Speaker 3: is it fifteen minutes for an appointment these days, and

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Speaker 3: you just yes.

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Speaker 2: And you've just got to get.

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Speaker 3: Through, and there's a lot of frustration with not being

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Speaker 3: able to be effective. You know, how much of the

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Speaker 3: burnout of physicians is because of the way that the

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Speaker 3: healthcare system is set up, And there's a lot of

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Speaker 3: burnout obviously as they go through medical training as well.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I think there's a lot to be so for

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Speaker 1: the system itself. Burnout doesn't just happen to a person necessarily.

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Speaker 1: I mean, sure certain personalities are going to be more

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Speaker 1: at risk, but I think it's when you feel that

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Speaker 1: you're fighting the system and the system is sort of

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Speaker 1: knocking your back all the time.

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Speaker 3: And for me, SYSM Sorry, Jenny, is a very high

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Speaker 3: predictor of bernout right being cynical, but it.

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Speaker 1: Is the reality. And knowing that, you know, we spend

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Speaker 1: less than two percent of our total healthcare pudget on prevention,

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Speaker 1: just begs the question, what are we trying to achieve?

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Speaker 1: We know that so much of chronic disease is essentially preventable.

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Speaker 1: We know that, and yet the system is sort of

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Speaker 1: pushing against the idea that we should be spending more

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Speaker 1: time on prevention first, then dealing with the appropriate disease

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Speaker 1: as required. We can't. It's totally unsustainable as is. And

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Speaker 1: I suspect that many people who are given their prescription

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Speaker 1: who because that's what they expect. You know, we've trained

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Speaker 1: our patients well to expect the script. Oh I've seen

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Speaker 1: the doctor, Yeah, I got my script. They often don't

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Speaker 1: get filled or also whatever, throw it in the bin, whatever,

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Speaker 1: And it's a missed opportunity. And so often I hear

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Speaker 1: doctors or other health professionals pushing back saying, well, we

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Speaker 1: don't have time because we've got this tsunami of patients

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Speaker 1: waiting to be seen. But we have to make the time.

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Speaker 1: If we can't make the time to ask a question

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Speaker 1: in thirty seconds, tell me more about you know, how

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Speaker 1: are you sleeping at the moment, what's going on in

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Speaker 1: your world? How are you coping with everything? If we

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Speaker 1: can't take the time to ask that, how can we

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Speaker 1: possibly work to make them better?

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Speaker 3: And that gets to another point that I wanted to

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Speaker 3: discuss because you mentioned it in your introduction, by complimentary

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Speaker 3: medicine practitioners. So I've heard lots of doctors, GPS, medical

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Speaker 3: people being quiet critical of complementary medicine and saying a

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Speaker 3: lot of it is not evidence based. Yet lots of

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Speaker 3: people go to them, and lots of people have good

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Speaker 3: results with them, And I think a huge component of

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Speaker 3: that is the strength of the relationship. I mean, there's

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Speaker 3: an barket load of research that shows, whether it's in medicine, health,

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Speaker 3: or psychology, the strength of the relationship and the warmth

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Speaker 3: of the therapeutic alliance is a big predictor of success.

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Speaker 3: So how much of that do you think factors in

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Speaker 3: to doctors not being as effective as they could be massive?

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Speaker 1: And I think the criticism often comes from a place

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Speaker 1: of ignorance because we don't understand what we do. And

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Speaker 1: I think what is heartening to say is we're saying

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Speaker 1: the development of many more integrative practices. Whereas you have

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Speaker 1: not just the GP or doctor on site, you might

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Speaker 1: have a naturopath and a dietitian, a psychologist, ex health coach,

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Speaker 1: exercise physiologists. You have access to all these other people,

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Speaker 1: and it's only by working alongside each other that you

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Speaker 1: actually get to understand what everybody does. When we held

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Speaker 1: the Lifestyle Medicine Conference this year in Adelaide, we partnered

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Speaker 1: with the primary health care nurses and it was so

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Speaker 1: good to see that it provided this marvelous opportunity for

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Speaker 1: both sides to get to understand what the other person

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Speaker 1: was doing. And when you have more understanding, you lose

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Speaker 1: that sort of intolerance or dismissive nature. And when you say, oh,

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Speaker 1: there's no evidence to this, let's remember that a lot

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Speaker 1: of these allied health professionals are going through their own

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Speaker 1: degrees and they are evidence based, so we can't ignore it.

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Speaker 1: And I think the biggest gift we could ever give

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Speaker 1: anybody we're working with is the gift of our full

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Speaker 1: and undivided attention and time.

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Speaker 2: I love it.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and I was at that conference as well presenting it.

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Speaker 3: It was brilliant and that the Lifestyle Medicine Association has

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Speaker 3: been pooshing that bandwagon for many, many years, which is obviously.

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Speaker 2: Why you have jumped on the bandwagon. Now let's talk

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Speaker 2: about your book, The Natural Advantage.

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Speaker 3: So you mentioned in that book having high functioning anxiety

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Speaker 3: and finding solace in nature.

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Speaker 2: So was that what it was inspired you to write

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Speaker 2: the book or what?

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Speaker 3: So talk a little bit about your high functioning anxiety,

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Speaker 3: how you find that solace in nature and how that

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Speaker 3: layed to the writing of the book.

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Speaker 1: I think I realized that I always had been a

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Speaker 1: fairly anxious type of person. That was just me, and

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Speaker 1: I just lived with it, didn't think anything of it.

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Speaker 1: But it was at a time when I had been

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Speaker 1: particularly anxious and was seeing a psychologist for some assistance,

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Speaker 1: and she just mentioned, by the way, oh, Jenny, You've

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Speaker 1: made some interesting career choices because I'd been through medicine,

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Speaker 1: I'd studied how to be a public speaker for somebody

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Speaker 1: with high functioning anxiety, and it was like, WHOA Really?

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Speaker 1: In that moment, I realized that I had been dealing

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Speaker 1: with something that was something I didn't have to deal

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Speaker 1: with for so many years, as I had that secondly,

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Speaker 1: there was something I could do about it. And thirdly

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Speaker 1: that intuitively I had always in times of trouble, so

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Speaker 1: to speak, gone out for long walks, hikes down to

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Speaker 1: the ocean, through bush or whatever, because that gave me peace.

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Speaker 1: It helped me just to feel better in myself. I

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Speaker 1: just switched off from all everything else going on in

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Speaker 1: my world and was able just to reconnect with that

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Speaker 1: natural state or environment around me. And all the science

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Speaker 1: that's been around you know, for what forty years or

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Speaker 1: if not longer, shows that by going outside we change

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Speaker 1: our physiology in just a few minutes.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, we know that.

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Speaker 2: It is pretty amazing, isn't it.

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Speaker 3: And so you talk about how sight, hearing, smell, and

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Speaker 3: other senses are really vitally connecting with nature. Just give

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Speaker 3: us a high level overview by the rule that our

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Speaker 3: different sensors play in our overall well being.

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Speaker 1: I think sight, being sort of one of our principal senses,

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Speaker 1: is the one that can really help us with mental

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Speaker 1: strain or brain fry from too much screen time when

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Speaker 1: we're hyper focused and we're looking at being on tasks

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Speaker 1: for so long is exhausting. By looking outside, we change

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Speaker 1: our perspective because we can look up to the sky,

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Speaker 1: we see brought more broadly, we can see the trees

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Speaker 1: and the green around us, and that is calming in

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Speaker 1: itself to the brain. So it immediately softens our focus

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Speaker 1: and we become more attentive to what's going on in

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Speaker 1: our immediate environment, so we actually start to observe things

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Speaker 1: better rather than just being sort of blinkered. The second

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Speaker 1: one is hearing, and again we live in very noisy environments,

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Speaker 1: often human, human made noise, and that's stressful in its

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Speaker 1: own right. Getting outside again into natural sound, whether it's

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Speaker 1: bird song, wind water, very soothing again to the mind

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Speaker 1: and the body. And again when we tune into what

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Speaker 1: we can hear. For example, if you like notice this

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Speaker 1: particular bird singing, you ask yourself the question, what bird's that,

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Speaker 1: and then you start to get better at identifying the

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Speaker 1: different birds in your locality. Improves our ability to hear better.

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Speaker 1: So when we're interacting with other people, were better at listening.

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Speaker 1: I've always thought I was a good missler, and my

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Speaker 1: husband never agrees, but.

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Speaker 2: Tell them it's selective listening.

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Speaker 1: It's selective, yes, But you know, if you get better

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Speaker 1: at looking and better at hearing, we're onto a good

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Speaker 1: start right for being able to function more appropriately. The

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Speaker 1: other senses, smell and taste sort of go together, and

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Speaker 1: here it's about really taking notice of the smells around us.

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Speaker 1: Not all natural smells are wonderful, some of them quite authensedic.

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Speaker 1: But you know, walking through a pine forest where you've

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Speaker 1: got pine needles underneath your feet, I mean you get

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Speaker 1: the crunch of the needles underneath, but you also get

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Speaker 1: that lovely pine smell. Or if there's flowers that are

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Speaker 1: blooming and they've got their own particular scent. That is

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Speaker 1: a very powerful link memory of people and events quite often,

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Speaker 1: which again makes us feel calm, makes us feel connected

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Speaker 1: at a greater level. And of course touch we have.

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Speaker 1: You know, people stop touching, and in COVID we went

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Speaker 1: allowed to touch, wentn't allowed to hug or anything like that.

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Speaker 1: And yet touch is such an important sense to help

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Speaker 1: us make sense of the world, which is why kids

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Speaker 1: explore outside, get into the dirt, climb trees. They're touching everything,

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Speaker 1: which is essential to their development. But we need to

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Speaker 1: be able to do that as well. I mean, we

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Speaker 1: probably don't climb trees as much as we used to.

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Speaker 1: That's when we were little, but touch, whether it's touching

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Speaker 1: an animal, keeping a pet, cat, dog, whatever, or sometimes

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Speaker 1: just noticing different barks or different textures on trees or leaves.

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Speaker 1: It's something that we gain from by just engaging in

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Speaker 1: that activity. So I always encourage people they're going to

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Speaker 1: go out for a walk in nature, I say, use

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Speaker 1: all of your senses if possible. Start by what you

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Speaker 1: can see, tune into what you can hear, what can

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Speaker 1: you smell, What can you taste, Can you taste something

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Speaker 1: in your mouth, or you know, what can you touch?

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Speaker 1: And that gives you the full sort of immersion into

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Speaker 1: nature itself.

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Speaker 2: I fully endorse that.

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Speaker 3: Having moved about ten years ago, me moved from the

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Speaker 3: city down to the Mornington Peninsula, which is a wonderful

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Speaker 3: spot and we're quite lucky to have a bit of

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Speaker 3: the view of the water now. We didn't originally when

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Speaker 3: we moved down here. But me and Callie both get

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Speaker 3: up in the morning and when the weather's decent in Melbourne,

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Speaker 3: get outside first thing in the morning. You know, there's

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Speaker 3: so many birds around us. You know, we sleep with

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Speaker 3: the window open and get woken up by the birds.

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Speaker 3: And there's a particular bird that's my alarm clock whenever

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Speaker 3: the sun is starting to come up. But just being

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Speaker 3: outside and listening to the bird is just it's freaking amazing, right,

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Speaker 3: And sometimes with depending on where the wind is coming from,

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Speaker 3: you can.

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Speaker 2: Actually smell the sear and the salt and all that.

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Speaker 3: And I was I went into the city yesterday and

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Speaker 3: it just it just struck me how busy and noisy

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Speaker 3: it was. And it just becomes a little bit overwhelming,

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Speaker 3: doesn't it. If you're just I was actually just thinking

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Speaker 3: because and I drove past our old place yesterday, I

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Speaker 3: was thinking, Jesus, there's you can't pay me enough money

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Speaker 3: to go back and live in the city having been

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Speaker 3: there and move darts to where we are where it's

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Speaker 3: it's beautiful and super quiet and all of that.

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Speaker 2: But let's dig in a little bit.

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Speaker 3: Into each of those senses. So you talked about screen time,

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Speaker 3: and you're talking in your book about screen fatigue, and

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Speaker 3: there is it has been recorded around it where the

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Speaker 3: kids are becoming more and more myopic, right because of

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Speaker 3: the amount of time that they're spending on screens. And

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Speaker 3: you mentioned it earlier on about when you're that hyper focused.

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Speaker 3: Research from Andrew Huberman's lab showed that focusing in at

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Speaker 3: a short distance for long periods to actually activates the

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Speaker 3: stress response system, right and getting out and opening up

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Speaker 3: your field of view, which is also brilliant for athletes,

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Speaker 3: by the way, going from short focus to wide focus,

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Speaker 3: to short focus to wide focus. So give us some

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Speaker 3: recommendations around both individuals who are just struggling with screen

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Speaker 3: time and also parents with kids, because I find that

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Speaker 3: more and more people are spending their free time in

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Speaker 3: the confines of four walls with.

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Speaker 2: Their heads buried in a screen.

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Speaker 3: And that's bad for a number of reasons.

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Speaker 2: Number one, that.

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Speaker 3: Focus that you talked about, the short focus, but also

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Speaker 3: I call them passive consumers of life. They're not active

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Speaker 3: Part two diipants, right, And it's like entertaining me device,

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Speaker 3: whether it's a phone or it's a TV. So let's

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Speaker 3: just go a bit deeper into what are the issues

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Speaker 3: with that, and you know, what can people do to

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Speaker 3: try and break some of this screen addiction and just

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Speaker 3: give a sense of people for you know, a bit

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Speaker 3: more depth about the benefits of actually getting off screens

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Speaker 3: and getting outside.

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Speaker 2: Particularly.

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Speaker 1: I think the problem is that we're so drawn to

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Speaker 1: the technical gadgets because they're fun and you can interact

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Speaker 1: and you can play with other people elsewhere, and it's

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Speaker 1: what everyone else does, so we want to be part

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Speaker 1: of that group too, and so we don't look for

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Speaker 1: the opportunities to go outside. So, as parents, the greatest

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Speaker 1: gift we can give our children is to kick them

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Speaker 1: out for help, kick them out so you're not you

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Speaker 1: can have time on your video games or whatever, but first.

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Speaker 2: After going after during the holidays.

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Speaker 1: Yep, yep, and and you'll get lots of kickback and

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Speaker 1: screaming and it's not fair, is boring. But you know what,

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Speaker 1: if they do it often enough, they actually start to

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Speaker 1: look forward to it and they start to want to

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Speaker 1: get outside and you know, kick a footy round or

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Speaker 1: play with each other or whatever it is they're doing.

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Speaker 1: So I think we've just got to be a parent

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Speaker 1: sometimes and say, darling, this is this is of real good.

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Speaker 1: And we know that you know, the minimum time that

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Speaker 1: they need to be outside that is an hour for

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Speaker 1: their well being and for their eyesight, and preferably more.

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Speaker 1: And so what can we do. We've got to take

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Speaker 1: back control and give our kids guidance as to what

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Speaker 1: is appropriate for them in terms of entertainment. The best

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Speaker 1: entertainment is self entertainment. When they're doing things outside, free

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Speaker 1: unstructured play is best. It stimulates creativity, relates to their imagination.

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Speaker 1: It calms them down so they're less angry, less stressed,

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Speaker 1: so they perform better, and their behavior improves all sorts

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Speaker 1: of things. And they sleep better too, which is going

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Speaker 1: to be always good for parents.

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Speaker 2: That's right, sleeping children again.

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Speaker 3: Researching for this book, I read a shocking statistic that

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Speaker 3: kids in America and I'm sure it's pretty similar here

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Speaker 3: spend less time outside than high security prisoners.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I think the statistic I saw with seven minutes

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Speaker 1: a day, which is shock. It's just insane, absolutely insane.

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Speaker 1: But there's all sorts of reasons for that too, and

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Speaker 1: safetyism comes into that.

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Speaker 2: Parents of food shit.

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Speaker 3: It's bullshit, right, I mean, yeah, that sorry to jump in,

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Speaker 3: but that that pushes my buttons. That does because we

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Speaker 3: are wetier than we've ever been. I see Professor Grant

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Speaker 3: schol Feed Good Men of Mind did a whole heep

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Speaker 3: of research in news Land and find that when we

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Speaker 3: were young, we would generally roam around at five miles

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Speaker 3: from the house. You know, you'd be out on your

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Speaker 3: bikes and stuff like that. And now for the average kid,

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Speaker 3: at six hundred meters is how far they roam. So

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Speaker 3: we are using battery children rather than free range kids.

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Speaker 2: He talks about three range kids. What I love it.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, that's true, and I think sometimes it's not even

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Speaker 1: six hundred meters. It's within the confines of the front

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Speaker 1: or the backyard, which is which is scary to.

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Speaker 2: Or from the front door to the car. Ah.

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Speaker 1: Yes, yes, because we take our children everywhere by car,

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Speaker 1: don't we all public transport?

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Speaker 2: Yeah, yes, it is. It's crazy.

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Speaker 3: Okay, let's not talk about And something that plays into

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Speaker 3: what I was talking about being in the city. Er

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Speaker 3: pollution and noise pollution and just hide those two things

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Speaker 3: affect us in terms of our health, and you know

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Speaker 3: what we can do about it.

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Speaker 1: They're both sort of hidden from sight, really, aren't they.

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Speaker 1: I Mean, sometimes we can see the air pollution when

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Speaker 1: it's particularly bad, but often we don't notice it until

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Speaker 1: we wonder why. You know, our kids are developing asper

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Speaker 1: and people are getting into trouble with chronic coughs and

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Speaker 1: everything like that. But air pollution because we live in

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Speaker 1: a city, means we're subjected to traffic, planes, all sorts

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Speaker 1: of things going on around us, and the pollution builds up,

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Speaker 1: and it's the size of the particles of the different

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Speaker 1: molecules which obviously can get into our lungs and cause

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Speaker 1: lung damage. So having access to trees, particularly large trees

401
00:23:45,240 --> 00:23:47,720
Speaker 1: around is essential for a number of reasons. I mean,

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00:23:47,720 --> 00:23:50,640
Speaker 1: obviously they provide us with shelter, they give us oxygen,

403
00:23:50,920 --> 00:23:54,199
Speaker 1: but they also act as air filters. They absorb some

404
00:23:54,359 --> 00:23:59,600
Speaker 1: ridiculous amount of pollutants into themselves and then get rid

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Speaker 1: of it through their roots or when it rains, that

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Speaker 1: gets washed off the leaves, So that we need trees

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Speaker 1: around us to actually help improve our air quality. So

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Speaker 1: that's one thing, and many Australian cities have woffle tree

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Speaker 1: canopies speak for a number of reasons. So I think

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Speaker 1: there's a big push now people now understand that we

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Speaker 1: need tree canopy to keep our cities healthier.

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Speaker 3: And lower and lower temperature as well, and lower temperatures.

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Speaker 3: And I actually know whenever I first came to Australia,

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Speaker 3: I thought there were so many more trees than the UK.

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Speaker 3: In cities in the UK, A lot of them are

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Speaker 3: just concrete Jungles. Is there anywhere in the world that

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Speaker 3: does really well on this in terms of the amount

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Speaker 3: of tree cover in the cities.

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Speaker 2: Did you look into that at all in your.

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Speaker 1: Singapore comes out number one in the world. It is

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Speaker 1: the greenest city and it was the premier at the time.

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Speaker 1: I can never remember his name, but he decided that

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Speaker 1: he needed to make Singapore a green city. And over

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Speaker 1: the last few decades that has been achieved. And if

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00:25:07,800 --> 00:25:10,920
Speaker 1: you ever passed through Singapore or stay there, you will

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00:25:10,960 --> 00:25:15,680
Speaker 1: see just how much vegetation there is around there. Virtually

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00:25:15,760 --> 00:25:20,160
Speaker 1: every building has either roof garden or things coming down

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00:25:20,200 --> 00:25:23,920
Speaker 1: the sides of the building, or you know, every road

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Speaker 1: has avenues of trees. The Median strip has trees and bushes.

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Speaker 2: It's fully green.

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Speaker 1: And yeah, we've got a lot to emulate and do better.

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Speaker 1: Sydney has taken on the challenge to improve tree canopy

433
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Speaker 1: to forty percent by twenty fifty, so there is move

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Speaker 1: a foot. But obviously it takes a long time to

435
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Speaker 1: plant and grow trees. You can't do it overnight. So

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Speaker 1: we've just got to get better and really question why

437
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Speaker 1: we are cutting trees down. I mean, in a moment

438
00:25:54,440 --> 00:25:59,160
Speaker 1: in Perth. We've got a particularly nasty bug or insect

439
00:25:59,160 --> 00:26:01,720
Speaker 1: which bores in trees and it's killing a lot of trees.

440
00:26:02,280 --> 00:26:04,760
Speaker 1: And so the response is being, well, you just cut

441
00:26:04,800 --> 00:26:07,200
Speaker 1: all the trees down get rid of the pests that way.

442
00:26:07,400 --> 00:26:11,200
Speaker 1: Well that doesn't work. So they're trying now to work

443
00:26:11,240 --> 00:26:13,920
Speaker 1: out a different way of managing it. Otherwise we're just

444
00:26:13,960 --> 00:26:16,159
Speaker 1: going to I'm in a complete desert with no trees,

445
00:26:16,280 --> 00:26:17,760
Speaker 1: which is not the way forward.

446
00:26:18,720 --> 00:26:21,919
Speaker 3: So yeah, and interesting on Singapore actually, because I've been

447
00:26:21,960 --> 00:26:23,760
Speaker 3: to Singapore quite a lot, used to go there for

448
00:26:24,000 --> 00:26:25,600
Speaker 3: I used to do it for a bit of work there.

449
00:26:25,480 --> 00:26:28,000
Speaker 2: And you're right, it is very, very green.

450
00:26:28,040 --> 00:26:30,520
Speaker 3: Even when you drive out of the airport, you're driving

451
00:26:30,560 --> 00:26:33,000
Speaker 3: down and there's a big there's a big strip coming

452
00:26:33,040 --> 00:26:35,160
Speaker 3: out of the airport, and I remark, just how many.

453
00:26:35,000 --> 00:26:38,359
Speaker 2: Trees are around. This is the benefit of having a

454
00:26:38,400 --> 00:26:41,840
Speaker 2: benevolent dictator. Yes, exactly.

455
00:26:42,640 --> 00:26:48,000
Speaker 3: Look at how much really good shit happens in Singapore.

456
00:26:49,000 --> 00:26:51,240
Speaker 2: It is. It is fantastic.

457
00:26:51,280 --> 00:26:55,080
Speaker 3: Some of the stuff around the healthcare in Singapore, some

458
00:26:55,160 --> 00:26:58,240
Speaker 3: of the public programs, it's just And this is what

459
00:26:58,320 --> 00:27:00,240
Speaker 3: happens when you have people who are in part for

460
00:27:00,400 --> 00:27:03,960
Speaker 3: long periods of time who actually truly care about.

461
00:27:03,720 --> 00:27:06,440
Speaker 2: Their citizens right, And that's the difference.

462
00:27:06,600 --> 00:27:09,320
Speaker 3: That's the difference. There's plenty of blinesses. Dictators here are

463
00:27:09,320 --> 00:27:14,720
Speaker 3: not benevolent. But I'm saying better not go there anytime soon.

464
00:27:14,840 --> 00:27:19,440
Speaker 3: I've said analyticator, but it is. It is a brilliant

465
00:27:19,440 --> 00:27:22,679
Speaker 3: place that it is gone from a tiny little city

466
00:27:22,720 --> 00:27:27,000
Speaker 3: to a world powerhouse over the period of fifty years.

467
00:27:27,359 --> 00:27:30,080
Speaker 3: And there's so much cutting out stuff that's coming out

468
00:27:30,080 --> 00:27:34,879
Speaker 3: of Singapore that's really interesting. Let's talk about being in

469
00:27:35,000 --> 00:27:39,399
Speaker 3: nature and how that can enhance our mindfulness. I mean,

470
00:27:39,440 --> 00:27:41,760
Speaker 3: you hinted at it a little bit earlier on, but

471
00:27:42,520 --> 00:27:44,080
Speaker 3: let's do a bit of a dive into that.

472
00:27:44,440 --> 00:27:47,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, a lot of people like to get outside into

473
00:27:47,480 --> 00:27:51,679
Speaker 1: nature to be more mindful, and you can interpret that

474
00:27:51,720 --> 00:27:56,639
Speaker 1: in any way you want. There are mindfulness practitioners who

475
00:27:56,920 --> 00:27:59,840
Speaker 1: take people in sort of on nature walks, and they

476
00:27:59,840 --> 00:28:03,320
Speaker 1: are are invited to be mindful in how they place

477
00:28:03,400 --> 00:28:07,280
Speaker 1: their feet when they're walking, and to tune into all

478
00:28:07,320 --> 00:28:12,640
Speaker 1: their senses as they move or sit in a natural space.

479
00:28:13,320 --> 00:28:18,240
Speaker 1: But I think it's really about being observant or noticing.

480
00:28:18,640 --> 00:28:21,680
Speaker 1: It's that to me, is the mindfulness of it, which

481
00:28:21,760 --> 00:28:25,400
Speaker 1: we're often not very good at so to be mindful,

482
00:28:25,520 --> 00:28:27,679
Speaker 1: I mean, one of my favorite things to do, and

483
00:28:27,760 --> 00:28:29,880
Speaker 1: I've I had to practice and learn how to do

484
00:28:29,920 --> 00:28:32,760
Speaker 1: this because I was always a doer, was to make

485
00:28:32,800 --> 00:28:34,919
Speaker 1: myself my first cup of tea in the morning, because

486
00:28:35,400 --> 00:28:38,320
Speaker 1: coming from the UK, tea first thing in the morning.

487
00:28:38,320 --> 00:28:39,520
Speaker 1: But yeah, tea first.

488
00:28:39,960 --> 00:28:41,760
Speaker 2: So are you a tea person rather than the coffee

489
00:28:41,800 --> 00:28:42,880
Speaker 2: person or you better both?

490
00:28:43,920 --> 00:28:45,880
Speaker 1: I'm now a bit of both, but it has to be.

491
00:28:45,800 --> 00:28:48,160
Speaker 2: Tea first, right, Okay, there we go.

492
00:28:48,400 --> 00:28:51,040
Speaker 1: So I make a cup of tea, I go outside,

493
00:28:51,640 --> 00:28:55,040
Speaker 1: I jump into our backyard pool from my immersion and

494
00:28:57,960 --> 00:29:00,239
Speaker 1: as I say, I've had to learn how to do this,

495
00:29:00,400 --> 00:29:03,160
Speaker 1: And sometimes I will just sit and drink my cup

496
00:29:03,160 --> 00:29:05,800
Speaker 1: of tea in peace and quiet and just notice everything

497
00:29:05,880 --> 00:29:10,240
Speaker 1: around me. It's just lovely and that quietness just sets

498
00:29:10,240 --> 00:29:12,800
Speaker 1: me up for a good day. I can handle things better.

499
00:29:13,040 --> 00:29:16,000
Speaker 1: I'm more resilient. I'm not sort of so frazzled before

500
00:29:16,000 --> 00:29:16,760
Speaker 1: I even start.

501
00:29:17,600 --> 00:29:21,280
Speaker 2: And I think that's so many, so many people there.

502
00:29:22,480 --> 00:29:26,600
Speaker 3: Are they check their phone before their feet touched the grind.

503
00:29:26,840 --> 00:29:30,400
Speaker 3: And I have started saying, if you if you check

504
00:29:30,440 --> 00:29:32,120
Speaker 3: your phone before your feet touched the grind.

505
00:29:32,200 --> 00:29:35,600
Speaker 2: You have got a major, major problem going on.

506
00:29:36,440 --> 00:29:38,840
Speaker 1: Well, we do have a major problem. And it's got

507
00:29:38,840 --> 00:29:40,880
Speaker 1: a name. It's called digital dementia.

508
00:29:42,080 --> 00:29:42,880
Speaker 2: I never heard that.

509
00:29:43,200 --> 00:29:46,400
Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, it's a it's a real thing, you know.

510
00:29:46,440 --> 00:29:48,720
Speaker 1: I mean we've been talking about, you know, we shouldn't

511
00:29:48,760 --> 00:29:52,440
Speaker 1: doom scroll, this perpetual need to be on our phones

512
00:29:53,040 --> 00:29:55,479
Speaker 1: scrolling down. Oh we see one message, or there might

513
00:29:55,480 --> 00:29:57,360
Speaker 1: be another message. Oh, that looks interesting, and we just

514
00:29:57,360 --> 00:30:00,120
Speaker 1: go on and on and on and on, and it's

515
00:30:00,120 --> 00:30:02,960
Speaker 1: been shown it it's very bad for our working memory.

516
00:30:03,480 --> 00:30:06,360
Speaker 1: Now it's not good for you at any age, but

517
00:30:06,400 --> 00:30:08,800
Speaker 1: particularly as you get older and you and your working

518
00:30:08,840 --> 00:30:10,880
Speaker 1: memory isn't quite as good as it used to be.

519
00:30:11,680 --> 00:30:15,760
Speaker 1: You don't want to aggravate that by reducing your capacity

520
00:30:15,840 --> 00:30:18,760
Speaker 1: to actually utilize your working memory as it's designed. It's

521
00:30:18,840 --> 00:30:22,880
Speaker 1: much harder to regain that, but you can by simply

522
00:30:23,080 --> 00:30:26,280
Speaker 1: not scrolling. But we need to be more mindful about

523
00:30:26,280 --> 00:30:28,440
Speaker 1: how we and this goes back to how do we

524
00:30:28,480 --> 00:30:31,720
Speaker 1: interact with all our beautiful gudgets that we love so much.

525
00:30:32,400 --> 00:30:37,000
Speaker 1: So for me, it's it's making that conscious choice. If

526
00:30:37,040 --> 00:30:39,640
Speaker 1: I am out and I'm having to wait to be

527
00:30:39,720 --> 00:30:42,400
Speaker 1: seen by somebody, or you know, I've got an appointment,

528
00:30:43,480 --> 00:30:48,680
Speaker 1: I make it a conscious decision not to take the

529
00:30:48,680 --> 00:30:50,880
Speaker 1: phone out of my handbag to fill the.

530
00:30:50,840 --> 00:30:55,440
Speaker 3: Time that night at a cafe, at a bus stop,

531
00:30:55,560 --> 00:30:59,720
Speaker 3: in a lift, right, yes, A and I get into lifts.

532
00:30:59,560 --> 00:31:01,160
Speaker 2: And I really don't take my phone out.

533
00:31:01,200 --> 00:31:04,720
Speaker 3: And I just just just notice how many people we've

534
00:31:04,800 --> 00:31:10,080
Speaker 3: just become so uncomfortable in the presence of strangers that

535
00:31:10,480 --> 00:31:10,920
Speaker 3: we just.

536
00:31:10,920 --> 00:31:13,880
Speaker 2: People just go straight to their phones, still't.

537
00:31:13,600 --> 00:31:16,600
Speaker 1: They they do. It's it's quite peculiar, you know, to

538
00:31:16,640 --> 00:31:19,360
Speaker 1: be sitting there and realize you're the only person who

539
00:31:19,400 --> 00:31:23,080
Speaker 1: hasn't got their face stuck in her phone. But I

540
00:31:23,080 --> 00:31:26,320
Speaker 1: think we've just got to remind ourselves that if we

541
00:31:26,360 --> 00:31:30,160
Speaker 1: want to sort of feel well function well, particularly keeping

542
00:31:30,160 --> 00:31:33,080
Speaker 1: the old brain working well, we've just got to be

543
00:31:33,360 --> 00:31:36,720
Speaker 1: mindful that trying to stimulate it with too much stuff

544
00:31:37,080 --> 00:31:40,960
Speaker 1: from our phones or our screens is actually detrimental to

545
00:31:41,040 --> 00:31:41,880
Speaker 1: our health and well being.

546
00:31:42,160 --> 00:31:45,160
Speaker 3: And is this to to have you read that into

547
00:31:45,200 --> 00:31:50,160
Speaker 3: the mechanisms by which all of this impers our working memory?

548
00:31:50,240 --> 00:31:53,400
Speaker 3: Is it just because we're just moving from one thing

549
00:31:53,440 --> 00:31:57,120
Speaker 3: to the next and not taking time to focus and

550
00:31:57,280 --> 00:32:00,240
Speaker 3: make connections and stuff like that. Is it this weed

551
00:32:00,560 --> 00:32:03,760
Speaker 3: of of the inputs that is detrimental.

552
00:32:04,320 --> 00:32:08,640
Speaker 1: It's the speed and multiple distractions or interruptions. We never

553
00:32:08,880 --> 00:32:11,120
Speaker 1: focus for more than a couple of seconds on one thing,

554
00:32:11,160 --> 00:32:12,440
Speaker 1: and then you're on to the next, and then the

555
00:32:12,480 --> 00:32:14,120
Speaker 1: next and then the next. Yeah.

556
00:32:14,280 --> 00:32:18,600
Speaker 3: And you know, I see people watching movies with their

557
00:32:18,800 --> 00:32:21,040
Speaker 3: bloody phone note as well watching TV.

558
00:32:21,280 --> 00:32:23,720
Speaker 2: Like double screening. I'm like, when I see.

559
00:32:23,560 --> 00:32:27,040
Speaker 3: My kids do that, I lose my rag for double

560
00:32:27,080 --> 00:32:29,840
Speaker 3: screening and they're just oh.

561
00:32:29,680 --> 00:32:32,600
Speaker 2: Shite, there's a thing.

562
00:32:32,640 --> 00:32:35,920
Speaker 3: There's so much stuff in our environment that is just

563
00:32:36,120 --> 00:32:41,200
Speaker 3: going right wrong. But let's talk about sunlight, right, because

564
00:32:41,880 --> 00:32:42,600
Speaker 3: we live in the street.

565
00:32:42,600 --> 00:32:44,920
Speaker 2: We're both from the UK, right where aboutually from in

566
00:32:44,960 --> 00:32:45,480
Speaker 2: the UK.

567
00:32:45,960 --> 00:32:50,040
Speaker 1: Born in Yorkshire, Yorkshire, Yorkshire, Yorkshire where.

568
00:32:50,320 --> 00:32:55,320
Speaker 3: There's very little sun, and there's even less sun where

569
00:32:55,360 --> 00:32:58,280
Speaker 3: I'm from across the water in Northern Ireland.

570
00:32:58,560 --> 00:32:58,760
Speaker 2: Right.

571
00:33:00,120 --> 00:33:03,200
Speaker 3: But yet in Australia where we now both live, that

572
00:33:03,360 --> 00:33:07,480
Speaker 3: is frigging amazing. There are comparable levels of vitamin D

573
00:33:07,640 --> 00:33:11,800
Speaker 3: deficiency and insufficiency as there are in the UK, and

574
00:33:11,880 --> 00:33:16,680
Speaker 3: even in freaking Scotland where there's just very little sun. Ever,

575
00:33:17,040 --> 00:33:19,600
Speaker 3: because I lived there in glasgy for five.

576
00:33:19,440 --> 00:33:22,160
Speaker 2: Years, So talk talk to.

577
00:33:22,120 --> 00:33:26,640
Speaker 3: Us about a what what are some of the risks

578
00:33:26,880 --> 00:33:28,280
Speaker 3: of low vitamin D.

579
00:33:28,520 --> 00:33:29,680
Speaker 2: I think it shouldn't be called a vitamin.

580
00:33:29,720 --> 00:33:32,840
Speaker 1: I should think it should be cause it's a hormone.

581
00:33:32,960 --> 00:33:36,920
Speaker 3: Yeah, right, And can you please elaborate on that, just

582
00:33:37,160 --> 00:33:41,360
Speaker 3: about the stuff that vitamin D, vitamin hormone D, whatever

583
00:33:41,440 --> 00:33:45,800
Speaker 3: we want to call it, why it is important in

584
00:33:45,880 --> 00:33:50,560
Speaker 3: our overall health and in the role of sunlight and

585
00:33:50,600 --> 00:33:52,280
Speaker 3: where we're going wrong in all of this.

586
00:33:52,840 --> 00:33:57,040
Speaker 1: Okay, So, vitamin D or hormone D, whatever you want

587
00:33:57,080 --> 00:34:01,000
Speaker 1: to call it, is produced naturally in our skin by

588
00:34:01,000 --> 00:34:06,800
Speaker 1: exposure to sunlight. In the UK, less sunlight for shorter

589
00:34:06,840 --> 00:34:10,680
Speaker 1: periods of time. So the government there now recommends that

590
00:34:10,800 --> 00:34:14,480
Speaker 1: the population take a vitamin D supplement for the winter months,

591
00:34:14,520 --> 00:34:16,680
Speaker 1: for six months of the year. They suggest people should

592
00:34:16,680 --> 00:34:19,080
Speaker 1: take it. They don't tell us here to do that.

593
00:34:19,480 --> 00:34:21,680
Speaker 1: But what happens here in Australia is we will stay

594
00:34:21,680 --> 00:34:25,000
Speaker 1: inside because we're afraid of the sun. We've got so

595
00:34:25,040 --> 00:34:29,000
Speaker 1: good with the slip slop slab covering up. We don't

596
00:34:29,040 --> 00:34:32,600
Speaker 1: want premature wrinkles or sun spots or anything like that,

597
00:34:32,960 --> 00:34:35,680
Speaker 1: or it's too hot or whatever. We don't go out

598
00:34:35,719 --> 00:34:38,600
Speaker 1: as much as we used to. I mean going out

599
00:34:38,640 --> 00:34:41,440
Speaker 1: as a teenager with olive oil on my skin to

600
00:34:41,560 --> 00:34:45,400
Speaker 1: Spain to get brown and peel at least three times,

601
00:34:45,440 --> 00:34:48,520
Speaker 1: because that made your tan last longer. Probably what'sn't the

602
00:34:48,520 --> 00:34:50,799
Speaker 1: best way to get my vitamin D up. But hey,

603
00:34:51,160 --> 00:34:53,200
Speaker 1: we learn as we.

604
00:34:53,120 --> 00:34:56,600
Speaker 2: Go, do you know, Jenny, just a folling aside on this.

605
00:34:56,719 --> 00:34:59,719
Speaker 2: We were talking to friends of ours the other day.

606
00:35:00,040 --> 00:35:02,799
Speaker 3: I'm not going to throw this person onto the bus,

607
00:35:03,600 --> 00:35:09,200
Speaker 3: but one of our friends is still doing that, is

608
00:35:09,239 --> 00:35:13,840
Speaker 3: still in this throwing out into this. And my wife

609
00:35:13,880 --> 00:35:16,480
Speaker 3: had actually said to her, Oh, I love your tan.

610
00:35:16,680 --> 00:35:20,360
Speaker 3: What's that the brand of fake tan? And she laughed

611
00:35:20,440 --> 00:35:22,680
Speaker 3: and rather sheepishly went olive oil.

612
00:35:23,640 --> 00:35:26,680
Speaker 2: It's not a shocker.

613
00:35:26,880 --> 00:35:28,200
Speaker 1: Oh my lord.

614
00:35:29,280 --> 00:35:31,160
Speaker 2: Digress, Yes, we digress.

615
00:35:31,400 --> 00:35:36,759
Speaker 1: So we need vitamin D because it's it's basically utilized

616
00:35:36,840 --> 00:35:40,640
Speaker 1: in so many different chemical processes within the body. So

617
00:35:40,719 --> 00:35:44,520
Speaker 1: it's not just about bones and teeth and muscle and

618
00:35:44,760 --> 00:35:49,000
Speaker 1: better brain health. Vitamin D is involved in multiple different

619
00:35:49,120 --> 00:35:54,640
Speaker 1: organs to help cellular function. Without vitamin D, we're not

620
00:35:54,640 --> 00:35:55,959
Speaker 1: going to be doing quite so well.

621
00:35:56,080 --> 00:35:59,040
Speaker 2: Metabolism just doesn't work well, does it.

622
00:36:00,040 --> 00:36:04,720
Speaker 1: And as we age again, our ability to manufacture vitamin

623
00:36:04,760 --> 00:36:08,280
Speaker 1: DY diminishes. I think I can't remember what the exact

624
00:36:08,280 --> 00:36:10,879
Speaker 1: percentage decline it is over the age of sixty five,

625
00:36:10,960 --> 00:36:15,120
Speaker 1: but it's significant. And if you're somebody who finds it

626
00:36:15,120 --> 00:36:18,040
Speaker 1: difficult to get outside, obviously that's going to reduce your

627
00:36:18,120 --> 00:36:20,680
Speaker 1: exposure to some light as well. And of course we're

628
00:36:20,719 --> 00:36:23,320
Speaker 1: going to keep the olive oil in the pantry and

629
00:36:23,400 --> 00:36:26,200
Speaker 1: we're not going to go to a solarium. So the

630
00:36:26,320 --> 00:36:29,680
Speaker 1: ideal thing is to basically just get out in the

631
00:36:29,680 --> 00:36:33,399
Speaker 1: time of day that we can early morning or late

632
00:36:33,480 --> 00:36:36,640
Speaker 1: afternoon when the intensity the sun is down and we've

633
00:36:36,640 --> 00:36:40,400
Speaker 1: got longer shadows, because then you don't need all the

634
00:36:40,440 --> 00:36:43,560
Speaker 1: sunscreen and all the cover up that we do for

635
00:36:43,600 --> 00:36:45,480
Speaker 1: the rest of the day, and we only need about

636
00:36:45,480 --> 00:36:47,680
Speaker 1: ten minutes a day. I mean, it's not a long

637
00:36:47,760 --> 00:36:50,520
Speaker 1: period of time to try and sort of build up

638
00:36:50,520 --> 00:36:51,279
Speaker 1: our levels.

639
00:36:51,520 --> 00:36:55,680
Speaker 2: Yeah, unless you're of darker skin obviously out obviously that's different.

640
00:36:55,880 --> 00:36:56,600
Speaker 1: That's different.

641
00:36:56,840 --> 00:36:59,000
Speaker 2: I think that's one that people should look at.

642
00:36:59,040 --> 00:37:03,080
Speaker 3: So in our house, my my wife and daughter are

643
00:37:03,200 --> 00:37:08,360
Speaker 3: really quite peel and very sunconscious. Cardie's vitamin D levels

644
00:37:08,400 --> 00:37:12,680
Speaker 3: are off the charts right she's just a little bit

645
00:37:12,680 --> 00:37:16,000
Speaker 3: of exposure and with very peel skin shield manufacture it

646
00:37:16,200 --> 00:37:19,160
Speaker 3: really well. And me and Oscar tend to be darker.

647
00:37:19,239 --> 00:37:21,360
Speaker 3: He just needs to look at the sun and he

648
00:37:21,440 --> 00:37:22,120
Speaker 3: goes dark.

649
00:37:22,640 --> 00:37:24,000
Speaker 2: And but we.

650
00:37:24,040 --> 00:37:28,040
Speaker 3: Actually need more sun exposure than they do. And if

651
00:37:28,080 --> 00:37:31,279
Speaker 3: you are our dark skin, and particularly if you are

652
00:37:31,600 --> 00:37:35,200
Speaker 3: of African American or African descent, you need a shitload

653
00:37:35,360 --> 00:37:36,839
Speaker 3: more sun exposure.

654
00:37:37,080 --> 00:37:38,160
Speaker 2: Right. That that's key.

655
00:37:38,239 --> 00:37:42,680
Speaker 3: Is I think doing or greeting your sun exposure based

656
00:37:42,680 --> 00:37:43,680
Speaker 3: on your skin type?

657
00:37:43,760 --> 00:37:48,600
Speaker 1: I think yes, really important skin, skin type and location. Yeah, yeah, yeah,

658
00:37:48,640 --> 00:37:49,120
Speaker 1: for sure.

659
00:37:49,440 --> 00:37:50,040
Speaker 2: Yeah.

660
00:37:50,080 --> 00:37:55,040
Speaker 3: Okay, so let's not let's talk about grounding and earthing,

661
00:37:55,480 --> 00:37:58,919
Speaker 3: right because when I first heard about this, I gotta say,

662
00:37:58,960 --> 00:38:02,840
Speaker 3: I was like, that is fluffy bullshit, And then I

663
00:38:03,560 --> 00:38:06,920
Speaker 3: actually dug into some of the research and had my

664
00:38:07,080 --> 00:38:11,960
Speaker 3: mind opened pretty wide. So talk to us about the

665
00:38:12,000 --> 00:38:16,200
Speaker 3: benefits of being in contact with the surfaces of the earth.

666
00:38:16,800 --> 00:38:20,840
Speaker 1: Grounding is something that's becoming quite popular. It seems to

667
00:38:23,000 --> 00:38:25,080
Speaker 1: be of interest to many people. Is because when I'm

668
00:38:25,120 --> 00:38:28,680
Speaker 1: asked to talk about the book Invariable Master talk about

669
00:38:28,920 --> 00:38:32,600
Speaker 1: grounding or earthing because that's what they're interested in, and

670
00:38:32,640 --> 00:38:36,080
Speaker 1: they do it themselves. We're taking the shoes off and

671
00:38:36,120 --> 00:38:42,160
Speaker 1: they're standing barefooted on grass or sand or the dirt

672
00:38:42,320 --> 00:38:48,000
Speaker 1: and just getting the sensation through the feet to feel

673
00:38:49,480 --> 00:38:52,840
Speaker 1: can you describe it as a sensation or feeling grounded?

674
00:38:53,920 --> 00:38:57,279
Speaker 1: And people say it makes them feel better now like you.

675
00:38:57,480 --> 00:38:59,640
Speaker 1: When I first heard about it, I thought, oh, yeah, right,

676
00:39:00,120 --> 00:39:02,080
Speaker 1: it's a bit like sort of those foots so a

677
00:39:02,160 --> 00:39:03,959
Speaker 1: bit worrier. You can put your foot in the soak

678
00:39:04,000 --> 00:39:05,759
Speaker 1: and get all the toxins out and all this sort

679
00:39:05,760 --> 00:39:07,640
Speaker 1: of stuff. But there does seem to be something in

680
00:39:07,719 --> 00:39:11,120
Speaker 1: it in that it does sort of connect us. And

681
00:39:11,200 --> 00:39:15,480
Speaker 1: what's really interesting is that we need connection with the

682
00:39:15,520 --> 00:39:19,440
Speaker 1: soil in particular to boost our own immune system. And

683
00:39:19,480 --> 00:39:23,839
Speaker 1: I found that really fascinating that people who live in

684
00:39:24,000 --> 00:39:28,319
Speaker 1: areas where they have more opportunities, if you like, for

685
00:39:29,719 --> 00:39:33,520
Speaker 1: being grounded or in contact with the soil, actually have

686
00:39:33,640 --> 00:39:38,360
Speaker 1: stronger immune systems. They don't get as many allergies or

687
00:39:38,400 --> 00:39:42,160
Speaker 1: asthma and things like that. And what better thing to do, then,

688
00:39:42,239 --> 00:39:43,960
Speaker 1: you know, if you want to be fitter and stronger

689
00:39:43,960 --> 00:39:46,719
Speaker 1: and not get sick so often, is just gone for

690
00:39:46,760 --> 00:39:48,359
Speaker 1: a little play in your flower bed.

691
00:39:48,800 --> 00:39:51,000
Speaker 3: And we see pretty strongly that that kids who are

692
00:39:51,000 --> 00:39:53,319
Speaker 3: brought up in the country and particularly on farms, Yes,

693
00:39:53,560 --> 00:39:56,759
Speaker 3: has much better immune systems, much less allergies, much less

694
00:39:56,800 --> 00:40:00,400
Speaker 3: asthma than city kids. Yeah yeah, and even you know,

695
00:40:00,440 --> 00:40:04,160
Speaker 3: growing up with animals as well. And what I found

696
00:40:04,239 --> 00:40:07,680
Speaker 3: really interesting I did a short wisdom Wednesday on it

697
00:40:07,760 --> 00:40:12,400
Speaker 3: is that just walking through a forest we actually absorb

698
00:40:12,560 --> 00:40:15,719
Speaker 3: some of the microbiome from the forest. And even and

699
00:40:16,520 --> 00:40:18,040
Speaker 3: you know, I'm very lucky because the beach is just

700
00:40:18,080 --> 00:40:19,839
Speaker 3: down there and I'll often have my dogs down there

701
00:40:19,840 --> 00:40:24,279
Speaker 3: in the morning. It's just walking along the beach, you

702
00:40:24,400 --> 00:40:28,000
Speaker 3: actually absorb some of the microbiome from the ocean, and

703
00:40:28,040 --> 00:40:31,799
Speaker 3: that actually diversifies our microbiome. Like that is just it's

704
00:40:31,960 --> 00:40:33,279
Speaker 3: mind boggling, isn't it.

705
00:40:33,280 --> 00:40:33,640
Speaker 2: It is.

706
00:40:33,880 --> 00:40:37,680
Speaker 1: I blew my mind to know that we need that

707
00:40:37,800 --> 00:40:43,400
Speaker 1: interaction between the planets microbiome if you want to call

708
00:40:43,440 --> 00:40:45,560
Speaker 1: it that, or risesome or whatever you want to call it,

709
00:40:45,880 --> 00:40:50,600
Speaker 1: in order to strengthen our own microbiome. I mean, that

710
00:40:50,760 --> 00:40:52,000
Speaker 1: is insane, right.

711
00:40:52,200 --> 00:40:52,640
Speaker 2: Yeah.

712
00:40:52,760 --> 00:40:57,120
Speaker 3: We are very clearly a super ecosystem. I used to

713
00:40:57,120 --> 00:41:00,520
Speaker 3: talk about by us being an ecosystem and talk about

714
00:41:00,560 --> 00:41:04,719
Speaker 3: our microband, but we are. The evidence is very very

715
00:41:04,760 --> 00:41:07,319
Speaker 3: strong now, and I think your book really doubles down

716
00:41:07,400 --> 00:41:10,200
Speaker 3: on this. We're not just an ecosystem. We're a super

717
00:41:10,200 --> 00:41:15,560
Speaker 3: ecosystem that we interact with nature and have many, many

718
00:41:15,600 --> 00:41:17,239
Speaker 3: benefits from those interactions.

719
00:41:17,440 --> 00:41:21,360
Speaker 1: It's similar that like grounding that the fighters sides that

720
00:41:21,440 --> 00:41:26,160
Speaker 1: are produced has volatile compounds from trees that we inhale

721
00:41:26,800 --> 00:41:30,239
Speaker 1: or sit on our skin do the same thing. I'll

722
00:41:30,320 --> 00:41:33,840
Speaker 1: really stimulate the immune system and calm the blood pressure,

723
00:41:34,160 --> 00:41:37,440
Speaker 1: et cetera, et cetera. So you're getting the benefit of

724
00:41:37,600 --> 00:41:41,640
Speaker 1: so many different things happening simultaneously simply by getting outside

725
00:41:42,040 --> 00:41:44,560
Speaker 1: and going for a walk in a natural environment.

726
00:41:44,960 --> 00:41:47,480
Speaker 3: Yeah, and you know what, I used to go out

727
00:41:47,560 --> 00:41:49,200
Speaker 3: and take my dogs out for the morning, and I

728
00:41:49,280 --> 00:41:51,440
Speaker 3: used to listen to podcasts because I don't get a

729
00:41:51,480 --> 00:41:53,520
Speaker 3: lot of time to listen to podcasts. But you know,

730
00:41:53,600 --> 00:41:56,120
Speaker 3: for a while, there's a few times I would forget

731
00:41:56,120 --> 00:41:58,080
Speaker 3: my headphones and forget my phone or whatever.

732
00:41:58,600 --> 00:42:02,320
Speaker 2: And I actually note over time that I felt better

733
00:42:02,960 --> 00:42:04,040
Speaker 2: and I couldn't really put.

734
00:42:03,880 --> 00:42:06,719
Speaker 3: My finger on it, and then you know, it was

735
00:42:06,920 --> 00:42:09,359
Speaker 3: just Carly's the one. You know, she she's much more

736
00:42:09,400 --> 00:42:13,920
Speaker 3: into mindfulness than I am. But she's influenced me pretty

737
00:42:13,920 --> 00:42:17,000
Speaker 3: well that now I don't actually take my headphones out,

738
00:42:17,000 --> 00:42:18,719
Speaker 3: I don't take my phone out. I just go out

739
00:42:19,200 --> 00:42:21,880
Speaker 3: and I just try to use my senses as she

740
00:42:22,000 --> 00:42:24,799
Speaker 3: talked about, and it just it's a such a good

741
00:42:24,800 --> 00:42:27,240
Speaker 3: frigging start to the day, particularly when you're up before

742
00:42:27,280 --> 00:42:30,279
Speaker 3: other people, the son's just coming up. You know, there's

743
00:42:30,320 --> 00:42:32,000
Speaker 3: something magical about it, isn't there?

744
00:42:32,320 --> 00:42:36,600
Speaker 1: Absolutely? And they've actually done research to demonstrate the difference

745
00:42:36,840 --> 00:42:39,920
Speaker 1: between going for a walk with your head your ear

746
00:42:40,000 --> 00:42:43,279
Speaker 1: pods in to listen to a podcast or music, or

747
00:42:43,680 --> 00:42:46,480
Speaker 1: answering your phone or sending a text when you're outside

748
00:42:46,560 --> 00:42:50,880
Speaker 1: compared to not and there's there's a stark difference in

749
00:42:50,920 --> 00:42:53,320
Speaker 1: the same way that we know there's a difference between

750
00:42:53,480 --> 00:42:56,680
Speaker 1: how you feel after walking in a natural environment or

751
00:42:56,680 --> 00:42:59,000
Speaker 1: in an urban environment just walking down a busy street.

752
00:42:59,560 --> 00:43:02,520
Speaker 1: You don't marvelous or change in the positive way by

753
00:43:02,560 --> 00:43:05,200
Speaker 1: doing that. If you're in a natural environment but you're

754
00:43:05,239 --> 00:43:10,359
Speaker 1: still engaged with that music, podcast, whatever, you're missing out

755
00:43:10,480 --> 00:43:13,759
Speaker 1: on what the nature can provide you. It diminishes the

756
00:43:13,800 --> 00:43:15,400
Speaker 1: positive impact of it.

757
00:43:15,560 --> 00:43:17,759
Speaker 2: And is that have they dug into that?

758
00:43:17,920 --> 00:43:22,440
Speaker 3: Is that more about just the benefits of being mindful

759
00:43:22,600 --> 00:43:25,600
Speaker 3: and interacting consciously with nature.

760
00:43:25,719 --> 00:43:26,759
Speaker 2: Is that what's driving it?

761
00:43:26,960 --> 00:43:30,600
Speaker 1: I think that's the case. Yes, because again, your your

762
00:43:30,640 --> 00:43:36,560
Speaker 1: focus becomes what you're hearing between years or looking at

763
00:43:36,680 --> 00:43:37,880
Speaker 1: on a small screen.

764
00:43:37,640 --> 00:43:38,840
Speaker 2: Again, yeah, because whenever.

765
00:43:39,160 --> 00:43:42,080
Speaker 3: Yeah, that's right, and even when you're listening, you're not

766
00:43:42,400 --> 00:43:47,560
Speaker 3: really paying so much attention visually, right, that's right.

767
00:43:47,960 --> 00:43:49,440
Speaker 1: Yeah, the blinkers come back on.

768
00:43:49,560 --> 00:43:51,239
Speaker 2: As soon as we're on our phone, Like a horse

769
00:43:51,280 --> 00:43:52,000
Speaker 2: with blink.

770
00:43:53,680 --> 00:43:56,560
Speaker 1: We stop seeing. And they know. They ask people to

771
00:43:56,640 --> 00:43:59,880
Speaker 1: recall things that they had actually noticed during their walk,

772
00:44:00,440 --> 00:44:03,919
Speaker 1: and people who've been on their phone could remember far

773
00:44:04,040 --> 00:44:05,880
Speaker 1: less than those people.

774
00:44:05,640 --> 00:44:10,880
Speaker 3: That have interesting So let's let's talk about what people

775
00:44:10,960 --> 00:44:13,040
Speaker 3: can do. So you know, if they've got half a

776
00:44:13,080 --> 00:44:15,399
Speaker 3: brilliant they should be going, I need to spend more

777
00:44:15,400 --> 00:44:20,920
Speaker 3: time in nature. So what sort of practical steps can

778
00:44:20,920 --> 00:44:22,560
Speaker 3: people do, because I know you're right about this in

779
00:44:22,600 --> 00:44:26,760
Speaker 3: your book, to just bring more nature into their lives.

780
00:44:27,400 --> 00:44:30,600
Speaker 3: You know, maybe talk about people who kind of live

781
00:44:30,719 --> 00:44:32,719
Speaker 3: somewhere rural like me, and then city.

782
00:44:32,560 --> 00:44:34,440
Speaker 2: Dwellers who've got less opportunities.

783
00:44:34,760 --> 00:44:38,960
Speaker 1: Yeah. So the rural dwellers obviously had an advantage because

784
00:44:38,960 --> 00:44:42,200
Speaker 1: you've got greenery or blue stuff around you and that's

785
00:44:42,239 --> 00:44:45,320
Speaker 1: automatically going to put you at a huge advantage because

786
00:44:45,680 --> 00:44:47,560
Speaker 1: you fall over nature wherever you go.

787
00:44:48,040 --> 00:44:49,719
Speaker 2: Yeah, as long as you get your head out of

788
00:44:49,760 --> 00:44:51,000
Speaker 2: your bloody she you do.

789
00:44:51,040 --> 00:44:52,279
Speaker 1: You do have to get your head out of the

790
00:44:52,280 --> 00:44:57,080
Speaker 1: bloody screen. Absolutely. The city dwellers have to make the

791
00:44:57,120 --> 00:45:00,839
Speaker 1: intentional choice to get outside more. We know so from

792
00:45:01,239 --> 00:45:04,840
Speaker 1: studies from University of Exeter that the minimum amount of

793
00:45:04,840 --> 00:45:08,120
Speaker 1: time we need for our mental well being out from

794
00:45:08,239 --> 00:45:10,480
Speaker 1: time outdoors is one hundred and twenty minutes a week,

795
00:45:11,080 --> 00:45:14,360
Speaker 1: all right, nothing, one hundred and twenty minutes a week.

796
00:45:14,800 --> 00:45:18,560
Speaker 1: That's seventeen minutes and a few seconds. So my recommendation

797
00:45:18,840 --> 00:45:23,040
Speaker 1: is we all need to find create make time for

798
00:45:23,360 --> 00:45:27,839
Speaker 1: twenty minutes a day outside regardless of the weather. I mean,

799
00:45:27,880 --> 00:45:31,239
Speaker 1: if it's fifty degrees centigrade, maybe not, or if you're

800
00:45:31,239 --> 00:45:34,040
Speaker 1: in the middle of a hurricane, maybe not. But otherwise

801
00:45:34,120 --> 00:45:37,360
Speaker 1: we can all find make the time to be outside

802
00:45:37,400 --> 00:45:40,560
Speaker 1: for that time because that's what we need to boost

803
00:45:41,400 --> 00:45:44,560
Speaker 1: our mental wellbeing and start the process of less stress,

804
00:45:44,760 --> 00:45:49,480
Speaker 1: less information, less risk of chronic disease developing. So, if

805
00:45:49,520 --> 00:45:52,080
Speaker 1: you live in a space where you've got access to

806
00:45:52,160 --> 00:45:55,680
Speaker 1: a local park nearby, that's a perfect place to start.

807
00:45:56,160 --> 00:45:59,560
Speaker 1: The greater the diversity within that green space, the better.

808
00:45:59,600 --> 00:46:01,719
Speaker 1: But obviously that's going to depend on where you live.

809
00:46:02,520 --> 00:46:02,680
Speaker 2: Now.

810
00:46:02,719 --> 00:46:04,560
Speaker 1: Obviously, if you're living in a rural area, you're going

811
00:46:04,640 --> 00:46:08,200
Speaker 1: to have much more biodiversity available to you. In a city,

812
00:46:08,440 --> 00:46:12,560
Speaker 1: maybe less. But if you've got a botanic garden, a

813
00:46:12,640 --> 00:46:15,920
Speaker 1: reasonable garden nearby, even if it's just got sort of

814
00:46:16,040 --> 00:46:19,560
Speaker 1: children's playground in it, it's better than nothing. And if

815
00:46:19,680 --> 00:46:25,200
Speaker 1: you've got difficulty accessing getting outside, then bring nature in.

816
00:46:25,920 --> 00:46:29,480
Speaker 1: And this is where biophilic design as it's called, really

817
00:46:29,520 --> 00:46:35,040
Speaker 1: comes to play. Where you lay out plants within your

818
00:46:35,080 --> 00:46:38,399
Speaker 1: house or on your back patio so that you can

819
00:46:38,520 --> 00:46:43,759
Speaker 1: see the greenery, and you can sort of use natural

820
00:46:44,560 --> 00:46:47,520
Speaker 1: elements such as stone or like you said, you've got

821
00:46:47,560 --> 00:46:52,600
Speaker 1: wooden floors, stone, anything that's made of a natural fabric.

822
00:46:53,200 --> 00:46:57,360
Speaker 1: All these things can contribute to that sense of this

823
00:46:57,480 --> 00:47:01,760
Speaker 1: is pleasing, This is esthetically pleasing to me. So office

824
00:47:01,960 --> 00:47:07,279
Speaker 1: designers will often now include living walls, little green nooks.

825
00:47:08,000 --> 00:47:11,800
Speaker 2: And they improve people's well being significantly. I've seen the research.

826
00:47:12,360 --> 00:47:15,279
Speaker 1: Yeah, so you know, we keep talking about we need

827
00:47:15,320 --> 00:47:19,080
Speaker 1: to get workplace health and well being sorted well, the

828
00:47:19,239 --> 00:47:21,799
Speaker 1: easiest thing to do is to put in big windows,

829
00:47:22,239 --> 00:47:27,080
Speaker 1: preferably with natural light and plenty of greenery to either

830
00:47:27,080 --> 00:47:30,520
Speaker 1: look out on or you've got within your working space

831
00:47:30,560 --> 00:47:33,800
Speaker 1: as well. Makes a huge difference to how we feel,

832
00:47:34,080 --> 00:47:36,520
Speaker 1: to how we function, how we think, and how productive

833
00:47:36,560 --> 00:47:39,320
Speaker 1: we are. And of course, if you're feeling better about

834
00:47:39,640 --> 00:47:43,520
Speaker 1: things in general, you're more productive, you do better, and

835
00:47:43,560 --> 00:47:45,919
Speaker 1: you might actually want to stay put in that job

836
00:47:45,960 --> 00:47:48,600
Speaker 1: for longer. So there's lots of reasons why it's a

837
00:47:48,640 --> 00:47:49,280
Speaker 1: good idea.

838
00:47:49,360 --> 00:47:49,960
Speaker 2: And here's the thing.

839
00:47:49,960 --> 00:47:52,200
Speaker 3: If you're happier and more productive, you get more shit

840
00:47:52,280 --> 00:47:54,840
Speaker 3: done in less time, and then you have more time

841
00:47:55,440 --> 00:47:58,960
Speaker 3: to contribute to that twenty minutes at least outside in nature,

842
00:47:59,040 --> 00:48:03,040
Speaker 3: and then you're on lily upwards vortex, not a downward spiral.

843
00:48:02,800 --> 00:48:05,680
Speaker 1: Right, yeah, yep, totally yeah. Yeah.

844
00:48:05,719 --> 00:48:09,960
Speaker 3: And I remember seeing research on people in hospital that

845
00:48:10,320 --> 00:48:13,440
Speaker 3: if they could see out a window and see nature,

846
00:48:13,960 --> 00:48:16,759
Speaker 3: their recovery time was so much quicker, and they were

847
00:48:16,800 --> 00:48:19,120
Speaker 3: out of the hospital a lot quicker than people who

848
00:48:19,120 --> 00:48:21,560
Speaker 3: were stuck and didn't have access to a window or

849
00:48:21,560 --> 00:48:23,320
Speaker 3: can see outside and couldn't see nature.

850
00:48:23,840 --> 00:48:29,120
Speaker 1: It's true, and yet still we have places within hospitals

851
00:48:29,120 --> 00:48:32,160
Speaker 1: which are meant to be healing places where that's not available.

852
00:48:32,360 --> 00:48:34,719
Speaker 1: And one lady was actually telling me earlier today her

853
00:48:34,760 --> 00:48:38,319
Speaker 1: husband was badly injured in an accident and ended up

854
00:48:38,360 --> 00:48:41,960
Speaker 1: on a trauma ward where there were no windows at all.

855
00:48:42,320 --> 00:48:44,799
Speaker 1: He didn't know if it was day or night. He

856
00:48:44,840 --> 00:48:47,799
Speaker 1: couldn't see anything. He was in terrible pain, and she

857
00:48:47,920 --> 00:48:50,960
Speaker 1: said she asked the staff, she said, can he please

858
00:48:51,120 --> 00:48:54,640
Speaker 1: be moved to a place where he can at least

859
00:48:54,760 --> 00:48:57,240
Speaker 1: have access to a window to look out on something,

860
00:48:57,520 --> 00:48:59,800
Speaker 1: And to their credit, they did, and all of a

861
00:48:59,800 --> 00:49:03,080
Speaker 1: sudd sudden, he was better able to manage his pain

862
00:49:03,160 --> 00:49:07,240
Speaker 1: more effectively because he could start to see the difference

863
00:49:07,239 --> 00:49:11,239
Speaker 1: between day and night, and the impact that had on

864
00:49:11,320 --> 00:49:16,239
Speaker 1: his healing journey. You know, as he recovered from his injuries.

865
00:49:16,719 --> 00:49:22,600
Speaker 1: We underestimate how important being connected to the outside world

866
00:49:22,719 --> 00:49:26,200
Speaker 1: is to us. We grossly underestimated.

867
00:49:26,440 --> 00:49:29,759
Speaker 2: And the other thing about hospitals as well. People are

868
00:49:29,800 --> 00:49:32,640
Speaker 2: in there, they're going through surgery.

869
00:49:33,280 --> 00:49:35,839
Speaker 3: You know, they've got something seriously wrong with them, and

870
00:49:35,880 --> 00:49:39,080
Speaker 3: what do they do They feed them ultra process shit.

871
00:49:39,719 --> 00:49:43,560
Speaker 1: Don't get me started on that. I think we both

872
00:49:43,600 --> 00:49:47,560
Speaker 1: agree that that's not the best way to help people recover.

873
00:49:49,840 --> 00:49:55,280
Speaker 3: So Jenny, talk to us about your personal routine, right,

874
00:49:55,440 --> 00:49:57,799
Speaker 3: just kind of close things out a little bit, you know,

875
00:49:57,840 --> 00:49:59,120
Speaker 3: you said to you get up in the morning, you

876
00:49:59,120 --> 00:50:01,560
Speaker 3: have your cup of tea, and you go and you

877
00:50:01,920 --> 00:50:02,960
Speaker 3: sit in your parl.

878
00:50:02,719 --> 00:50:05,680
Speaker 2: And you connect with nature. What other sort of stuff

879
00:50:05,840 --> 00:50:06,480
Speaker 2: you do? You do?

880
00:50:06,600 --> 00:50:09,880
Speaker 3: And and actually, by the way, I remember talking to

881
00:50:10,440 --> 00:50:15,760
Speaker 3: professor Ken Mogi from Japan who is a describes himself

882
00:50:15,760 --> 00:50:18,400
Speaker 3: as a rock star neuroscientist. Right, he's written over one

883
00:50:18,440 --> 00:50:20,480
Speaker 3: hundred books.

884
00:50:20,560 --> 00:50:23,239
Speaker 2: Yeah, and know crazy, right, and it's brilliant. The guy

885
00:50:23,320 --> 00:50:26,040
Speaker 2: is brilliant and.

886
00:50:25,160 --> 00:50:27,200
Speaker 3: Wrote a book on Ikey Guy and I was interviewing

887
00:50:27,239 --> 00:50:29,279
Speaker 3: him around Dicky Guy, and he says, one of his

888
00:50:29,480 --> 00:50:32,759
Speaker 3: Ikey guys is these little moments of joy is he

889
00:50:33,040 --> 00:50:35,560
Speaker 3: makes his tea in the market where it was tear coffee,

890
00:50:35,760 --> 00:50:37,520
Speaker 3: but he makes it and they sits down with a

891
00:50:37,560 --> 00:50:42,319
Speaker 3: little square of chocolate and he enjoys it all mindfully. Right,

892
00:50:42,880 --> 00:50:46,160
Speaker 3: So you're you've got your little Ikey guy to kick. Yes,

893
00:50:46,680 --> 00:50:49,560
Speaker 3: what does the rest of the routine look like.

894
00:50:50,040 --> 00:50:53,320
Speaker 1: Well, we've got two very exuberant Visla dogs.

895
00:50:53,800 --> 00:50:56,480
Speaker 2: They're mad as a box of frogs. Fistless. They are.

896
00:50:56,640 --> 00:50:59,120
Speaker 1: They gorgeous, but they certainly keep.

897
00:50:59,000 --> 00:50:59,680
Speaker 2: You on your toes.

898
00:51:00,360 --> 00:51:04,399
Speaker 1: There's plenty of energy and they they they have to have,

899
00:51:04,920 --> 00:51:07,759
Speaker 1: you know, two long walks a day, so we get

900
00:51:07,800 --> 00:51:11,080
Speaker 1: outside twice a day to walk our dogs. And I

901
00:51:11,080 --> 00:51:14,760
Speaker 1: think it's interacting with them. They are they're called teflon

902
00:51:14,840 --> 00:51:17,000
Speaker 1: dogs because they just want to be with you and

903
00:51:17,080 --> 00:51:19,960
Speaker 1: on you, sit on your head or whatever. So they

904
00:51:20,040 --> 00:51:24,120
Speaker 1: they're very sort of tactile, and there's nothing more pleasurable

905
00:51:24,120 --> 00:51:26,719
Speaker 1: than stroking their silky ears when they're sitting on your

906
00:51:26,800 --> 00:51:29,439
Speaker 1: lap at night. It's that's that's that's something that's part

907
00:51:29,480 --> 00:51:33,200
Speaker 1: of my routine. But seeing the joy that they have

908
00:51:33,880 --> 00:51:37,520
Speaker 1: when they're bouncing around doing their doggy thing is gives

909
00:51:37,600 --> 00:51:40,319
Speaker 1: me joy as well. So it's that interaction that you get.

910
00:51:40,360 --> 00:51:43,120
Speaker 1: You get so much joy and pleasure from other people,

911
00:51:43,400 --> 00:51:48,080
Speaker 1: but also from our pets or seeing wildlife out there.

912
00:51:48,440 --> 00:51:53,799
Speaker 1: So I love going for our daily walks. I enjoy kayaking.

913
00:51:54,000 --> 00:51:57,880
Speaker 1: I took up kayaking about two years ago now, and

914
00:51:57,920 --> 00:52:01,480
Speaker 1: there's there's something very magical about slipping into a boat

915
00:52:01,719 --> 00:52:06,000
Speaker 1: onto a river and just gliding down very peacefully. And

916
00:52:06,280 --> 00:52:09,160
Speaker 1: I mean the Swan River in perth Is. You got

917
00:52:09,160 --> 00:52:12,319
Speaker 1: the CBD and or high rise and all this sort

918
00:52:12,360 --> 00:52:15,279
Speaker 1: of stuff, and yet just around the corner there's an

919
00:52:15,280 --> 00:52:21,560
Speaker 1: ospray nest, there's seals, there's dolphins, the occasional bullshark.

920
00:52:22,120 --> 00:52:24,319
Speaker 3: I was about to say, just on capsize on your

921
00:52:25,480 --> 00:52:28,640
Speaker 3: there's bull sharks in the Swan River as well.

922
00:52:28,719 --> 00:52:34,080
Speaker 1: Right, That's just something that just gives me joy as well.

923
00:52:34,239 --> 00:52:36,640
Speaker 1: So apart from the little things that I like to

924
00:52:36,640 --> 00:52:40,960
Speaker 1: do every day like that, it's about scheduling in regular

925
00:52:41,040 --> 00:52:45,360
Speaker 1: times away from the city. So both my husband and

926
00:52:45,440 --> 00:52:50,600
Speaker 1: I are both very keen bush campers. So we just

927
00:52:50,680 --> 00:52:52,720
Speaker 1: load up the car. We used to load up the kids,

928
00:52:52,719 --> 00:52:54,640
Speaker 1: but they've grown up now so they don't want to

929
00:52:54,640 --> 00:52:56,879
Speaker 1: come with us anymore, which is sad, take the tent

930
00:52:57,000 --> 00:52:59,000
Speaker 1: to take everything we need and we just head out

931
00:52:59,000 --> 00:53:01,239
Speaker 1: into the never never for a couple of weeks.

932
00:53:01,640 --> 00:53:04,520
Speaker 3: Oh wow, and you said at tent to your proper campers,

933
00:53:04,560 --> 00:53:09,239
Speaker 3: you're like a UK company at remember I remember saying

934
00:53:09,520 --> 00:53:11,920
Speaker 3: with Sweden said yeah, we're going camping and went and

935
00:53:12,000 --> 00:53:14,120
Speaker 3: stayedian camp and so I'm like, this isn't camping.

936
00:53:15,960 --> 00:53:21,040
Speaker 1: No, we are on the ground intense and there's something

937
00:53:21,120 --> 00:53:26,799
Speaker 1: I mean, the Australian bush is just so spectacular. I

938
00:53:26,840 --> 00:53:30,520
Speaker 1: mean the sense of ore that I get from being

939
00:53:30,560 --> 00:53:32,839
Speaker 1: out there when you've just got the she oaks and

940
00:53:32,880 --> 00:53:37,160
Speaker 1: the and the bright orange sand and this beautiful night

941
00:53:37,239 --> 00:53:41,000
Speaker 1: sky with the Milky Way and everything, it's just sheer magic.

942
00:53:41,400 --> 00:53:43,279
Speaker 1: I mean, obviously we can't do that every day, but

943
00:53:43,920 --> 00:53:46,239
Speaker 1: we get our top ups, so I see it as

944
00:53:46,280 --> 00:53:48,799
Speaker 1: a top up of goodness, goodnats you goodness.

945
00:53:49,080 --> 00:53:54,000
Speaker 3: I think there's there's something really magical around, like the

946
00:53:54,160 --> 00:53:58,480
Speaker 3: night sky and just just getting to look up and

947
00:53:58,520 --> 00:54:02,359
Speaker 3: see the stars and and occasionally seeing a shooting star,

948
00:54:02,640 --> 00:54:04,479
Speaker 3: you know. And if you live anyone in the study,

949
00:54:04,520 --> 00:54:06,000
Speaker 3: you've got to get out of it, right, You've got

950
00:54:06,480 --> 00:54:08,920
Speaker 3: to get out and get into the bush and go camping.

951
00:54:09,000 --> 00:54:13,359
Speaker 3: But there is just something magical about lying there and

952
00:54:13,400 --> 00:54:14,240
Speaker 3: looking up and.

953
00:54:14,120 --> 00:54:17,840
Speaker 2: Going, holy shit, how small are we really?

954
00:54:18,920 --> 00:54:24,839
Speaker 1: Yeah, but it's actually reassuring as well, because it's there,

955
00:54:24,960 --> 00:54:28,120
Speaker 1: It's always there, and it just gets to give us

956
00:54:28,160 --> 00:54:32,880
Speaker 1: a sense of constancy. It's it's very yeah, reassuring, I

957
00:54:32,960 --> 00:54:34,120
Speaker 1: find very cool.

958
00:54:34,400 --> 00:54:39,040
Speaker 3: So, Jenny, are you still taking patients on and if so,

959
00:54:39,320 --> 00:54:41,600
Speaker 3: is it just face to face or do you do

960
00:54:42,120 --> 00:54:42,840
Speaker 3: over distance?

961
00:54:42,920 --> 00:54:43,280
Speaker 2: Learning.

962
00:54:43,400 --> 00:54:46,640
Speaker 3: And then also on top of that, I know you

963
00:54:46,680 --> 00:54:50,040
Speaker 3: do corporate speaking, so and there's quite a few corporates

964
00:54:50,280 --> 00:54:52,160
Speaker 3: who listens to this work.

965
00:54:52,280 --> 00:54:55,400
Speaker 2: Can people go to book you in either for corporate

966
00:54:55,440 --> 00:54:58,000
Speaker 2: talk or to look at your services and buy your book?

967
00:54:58,800 --> 00:55:01,640
Speaker 1: Sure? Easiest by this is my website which is simply

968
00:55:01,920 --> 00:55:03,160
Speaker 1: doctor Jenny Brocks.

969
00:55:02,840 --> 00:55:06,360
Speaker 2: Dot com and that's b R O k I S.

970
00:55:07,200 --> 00:55:10,000
Speaker 1: B r O c k I S. There you go

971
00:55:10,920 --> 00:55:15,799
Speaker 1: like Brock the Badger, right, So Brock is and my

972
00:55:15,960 --> 00:55:21,000
Speaker 1: major sand pit for connecting is LinkedIn something I like.

973
00:55:21,000 --> 00:55:27,160
Speaker 3: It very cool, So go go and play in the sandpit.

974
00:55:27,280 --> 00:55:31,880
Speaker 3: People that Jenny Brockers sent it on LinkedIn and booger

975
00:55:31,920 --> 00:55:35,520
Speaker 3: in for a talk for your organization and just to

976
00:55:35,880 --> 00:55:39,720
Speaker 3: really understand the benefits of being in nature and and.

977
00:55:39,800 --> 00:55:40,400
Speaker 2: Get the book.

978
00:55:40,680 --> 00:55:44,520
Speaker 3: And the book is called The Natural Advantage by doctor

979
00:55:44,680 --> 00:55:45,719
Speaker 3: Jenny Brocus.

980
00:55:46,000 --> 00:55:48,880
Speaker 1: Thank you so much for our conversation, Paul. It's been delightful.

981
00:55:49,080 --> 00:55:58,360
Speaker 2: Yes, it's been bloody awesome. Thanks Jenny, Thank you.

982
00:56:00,160 --> 00:56:00,319
Speaker 1: Ka