Speaker 1: Live on Sky News.
Speaker 2: This is Shari.
Speaker 3: Good evening and welcome to the program.
Speaker 4: I'm Danikiti Giorgio filling in tonight for Shari. Coming up
Speaker 4: on the show, Susan Lee's first day as opposition leader.
Speaker 3: Left a lot to be desired.
Speaker 4: I'll give you my take, and Senator Dave Shamel will
Speaker 4: try to change my mind. Is the coalition's commitment to
Speaker 4: net zero about to be abandoned? David Little Proud dropped
Speaker 4: a big hint. Frowen Bishop and David Elliott will join
Speaker 4: me next. And the new look Labor Ministry has us
Speaker 4: asking is the misinformation bill coming back? I'll get to
Speaker 4: that later in the show, but first tonight, I really
Speaker 4: really want to believe the Liberal Party is ready to
Speaker 4: take the ball by the horns, regroup after the thumping
Speaker 4: election loss, and be a clear and strong alternative to Labor.
Speaker 3: But honestly, I'm not sure yet.
Speaker 4: Susan Lee has been elected leader of the Liberal Party,
Speaker 4: the first female leader of the Liberal Party, backed in
Speaker 4: by the Liberal Left, and congratulations to her for being
Speaker 4: the first female. Yes, it does carry weight now, personally,
Speaker 4: I don't care about the gender of an individual in
Speaker 4: a high profile role as long as they can do
Speaker 4: the job, and that they've gotten.
Speaker 3: There through merit.
Speaker 4: Now, she's a mother, a grandmother, a very smart woman.
Speaker 4: She's been a commercial pilot, a farmer, an air traffic controller,
Speaker 4: amongst other things, and of course was recently the deputy
Speaker 4: Opposition leader. And perhaps she can portray a softer side
Speaker 4: than what the party was able to do with Peter Dutton.
Speaker 4: But the question now is, and this is key, is
Speaker 4: she the person to lift the party out of one
Speaker 4: of its biggest crises? And I'm not yet convinced. And
Speaker 4: now is the time for a quick reset, especially as
Speaker 4: we face another three years of labor, a party which
Speaker 4: has already left us broke backwards, divided in a trillion
Speaker 4: dollars of debt, more exposed than ever on the defense front,
Speaker 4: with a broken renewable system, and in the lurch for
Speaker 4: the future. And I want to give Susan Lee the
Speaker 4: benefit of the doubt, give her a go, I really do,
Speaker 4: and I hope for the sake of the party that
Speaker 4: she is going to take it forward. But if Susan
Speaker 4: Lee cannot put up a genuine alternative policy to labor,
Speaker 4: and I'll read today we didn't really get a lot
Speaker 4: of certainty on that, albeit it is early days obviously,
Speaker 4: then it's goodbye. The Liberals will be in the wilderness
Speaker 4: for years and I will have more on policy in
Speaker 4: a moment.
Speaker 3: But here she was today pledging that she is up
Speaker 3: for the job.
Speaker 5: We listened to the Australian people on Saturday and we
Speaker 5: will continue to listen to them around the country. We
Speaker 5: have to have a Liberal party that respects modern Australia,
Speaker 5: that reflects modern Australia, and that represents modern Australia. And
Speaker 5: we have to meet the people where they are. And
Speaker 5: that's what I am committed to doing. Are what I'm
Speaker 5: determined to do. I want to do things differently and
Speaker 5: we have to have a fresh approach.
Speaker 4: And a fresh approach is absolutely needed. But this was
Speaker 4: not a resounding victory for Susan Lee. She was voted
Speaker 4: in twenty nine to twenty five to Shadow treasurer Angus Taylor. Now,
Speaker 4: if you take away the votes of Linda Reynolds, Holly
Speaker 4: Hughes and Richard Colbeck who were leaving because of the
Speaker 4: Senate and all who voted for her, or realistically it
Speaker 4: leaves her with twenty six votes, it's almost a tie.
Speaker 3: It's not a convincing win.
Speaker 4: So the question is is she keeping the seat warm
Speaker 4: for a few years only to be rolled at the
Speaker 4: eleventh hour ahead of the next election.
Speaker 3: It is hardly a case for unification. Now.
Speaker 4: Secondly, she spoke there about Liberal party values, but what
Speaker 4: does that mean because we've got a moderate opposition leader
Speaker 4: in Susan Lee and a moderate deputy in Ted O'Brien.
Speaker 4: So not only do the Liberals abandon their conservative base
Speaker 4: through their labor light policies and position changes at the election,
Speaker 4: they now have voted in two moderates, yet hope to
Speaker 4: reclaim their base and hope for this fresh approach.
Speaker 3: And call me cynical, but.
Speaker 4: This is unconvincing to me and hardly inspiring. And yes,
Speaker 4: of course it comes down to policies. Yes, it comes
Speaker 4: down to having an alternative.
Speaker 3: But already I fear.
Speaker 4: This new Liberal Party is off to a shaky start.
Speaker 4: First on nuclear policy, here was Susan Lee and.
Speaker 6: Having federal government own nuclear power stations?
Speaker 7: Is that going to be your position? Do you think
Speaker 7: going forward?
Speaker 5: We'll just hear in this party room. Only a couple
Speaker 5: of hours ago I committed to my colleagues that there
Speaker 5: would be no captain's calls from anywhere by me, and
Speaker 5: I also committed during the discussions I had with them
Speaker 5: this week that we would work through every single policy issue,
Speaker 5: we would canvass the different views and we would take
Speaker 5: the time to get it right.
Speaker 4: Now, of course, it had only been hours since she
Speaker 4: was voted in. But compare this to National's leader David
Speaker 4: Little Proud yesterday.
Speaker 8: We've had the courage on nucleanergy, something our party room
Speaker 8: has believed in for a very long time, and all
Speaker 8: renewables approach won't work. But it was our party room,
Speaker 8: from many people before us, that had the courage to
Speaker 8: come forward.
Speaker 1: But it was us. It was our party room that
Speaker 1: delivered it.
Speaker 4: The two very contrasting answers, and the point is if
Speaker 4: he's not making captain calls, then the Liberal left may triumph,
Speaker 4: and that is a worry if serious and hard decisions
Speaker 4: are not made by its leader.
Speaker 3: Take this for example, this is.
Speaker 2: A policy that went to an election. The election result
Speaker 2: was devastating, so the message from the community is very
Speaker 2: very clear, and that's why I believe that this nuclear
Speaker 2: policy has to go unbelievable.
Speaker 4: And if that's the case, the Liberals would have learnt
Speaker 4: nothing because we need nuclear energy to shore up supply
Speaker 4: in this country.
Speaker 3: It is the only.
Speaker 4: Option and nuclear was a key point of difference you
Speaker 4: remember for the coalition before it ran away from.
Speaker 3: It In the dying weeks of the campaign.
Speaker 9: Why didn't you go to the site to marked for
Speaker 9: a nuclear reactor? Why didn't you get eighty by your
Speaker 9: side at press conferences every week and try and sell
Speaker 9: this policy.
Speaker 10: I got the feeling you dropped it like a hot potato.
Speaker 2: It's not been a huge issue at this election cap
Speaker 2: either four against. I think people have prioritized other issues
Speaker 2: and that's probably where the campaigns concentrate.
Speaker 3: Now.
Speaker 4: If you're not going to go bold, you won't win elections,
Speaker 4: and that should be the lesson from this election. We
Speaker 4: know nuclear is a proven energy resource in powerhouses like
Speaker 4: the US and UK, and if we want to keep
Speaker 4: the lights on nuclear is it now secondly on net
Speaker 4: zero by twenty fifty.
Speaker 5: There are different views about how we appropriately reduce emissions. Now.
Speaker 5: We need to reduce emissions in this country and Australia
Speaker 5: needs to play its part in reducing emissions.
Speaker 4: But the problem is this again may put the party
Speaker 4: at odds with the nationals, as David Little Proud has
Speaker 4: put ditching that target on the table.
Speaker 8: You cannot run an economy of the industrial scale the
Speaker 8: size of Australia on an llor renewables approach.
Speaker 1: Just look at Spain and Portugal.
Speaker 8: The reality is is even Anthony Albanezi is saying your
Speaker 8: energy bill is going to go up, not down. And
Speaker 8: so what we'll do is calmly and methodically work through
Speaker 8: our policy settings and what that means to make sure
Speaker 8: that we have a position that addresses the cost of
Speaker 8: living crisis.
Speaker 1: Because energy is the economy now.
Speaker 4: If the Liberals want to win back the base, ditch
Speaker 4: net zero by twenty fifty because the world's biggest emitters,
Speaker 4: including the US and China, are moving away from this
Speaker 4: target and are in favor of nuclear. This renewables fantasy,
Speaker 4: we know is a disaster in this country. It is
Speaker 4: plunging us further into the darkness during heat waves and
Speaker 4: cold snaps, all the while coal is being driven out
Speaker 4: of the system. The Paris Agreement is a joke. It's
Speaker 4: a waste of our time.
Speaker 3: We have to keep moving forward with keeping the lights
Speaker 3: on in this country now.
Speaker 4: Our third policy point is on female representation in the
Speaker 4: Liberal Party three years ago, it was the same old
Speaker 4: tysome narrative that the election loss.
Speaker 3: Was due to a lack of women.
Speaker 4: Three years later, there are calls again for gender quotas.
Speaker 4: Look what an absolute diabolical insult in my view, to
Speaker 4: have women in Parliament because of their gender, not on merit,
Speaker 4: not because they're the best person for the job, not
Speaker 4: because they've earned it, but because of their gender. And
Speaker 4: this is not why the Liberal Party lost the election.
Speaker 4: It is true that earlier this year women strongly favored
Speaker 4: the Coalition, but by the end of April that had
Speaker 4: blown up. If you look there, the Coalition's lead among
Speaker 4: female voters reversed from fifty one to forty nine in
Speaker 4: January to forty six to fifty four in favor of Labor.
Speaker 4: That was a week out from the poll. But this
Speaker 4: was largely due to its work from home policy, and
Speaker 4: Susan Lee wasn't shying away from the possibility of quotas
Speaker 4: when asked today.
Speaker 5: I want to say, right here and now, we need
Speaker 5: more women in our party. We need more women in
Speaker 5: our party organization, We need more women in this party room.
Speaker 5: Had we done better at the last election, we would
Speaker 5: have standing women in this party room. Deputy opposed to
Speaker 5: quotas and targets women.
Speaker 3: I support what the leaders just said.
Speaker 5: A came moving alone.
Speaker 4: Look, she's not wrong about more female representation, but still
Speaker 4: there was no definitive answer there. And it's not about
Speaker 4: more female representation or moving to the center, because the
Speaker 4: more you raise this gender card, the more you stray
Speaker 4: away from those conservative values, and goodness me, you may
Speaker 4: as well be the Labor Party. Then with quotas, it's
Speaker 4: about a strong, cohesive policy platform reflecting those values and
Speaker 4: also policy which reflects women. Now, the other point I
Speaker 4: would make here is on just sent to nampajimp Price.
Speaker 4: She pulled out of the deputy leadership role after it
Speaker 4: became apparent Angus Taylor was not going to win, and
Speaker 4: I really hope her defection from the Nationals has not
Speaker 4: been a waste of time because politics is tough, it
Speaker 4: is so brutal, and this is a woman who, in
Speaker 4: my view, is a born leader and one of the
Speaker 4: only voices of common sense. She single handedly helped get
Speaker 4: that no vote in the Voice to Parliament referendum over
Speaker 4: the line.
Speaker 3: She clearly loves this country, does not.
Speaker 4: Seek to divide us by the color of our skin,
Speaker 4: and she really sticks to her values, and it would
Speaker 4: be of detriment to the party in this reboot phase
Speaker 4: not to give Senator Price a key role in the
Speaker 4: shadow cabinet and make her front and center, not hidden like.
Speaker 3: She was during the election campaign.
Speaker 4: And I really hope, for the sake of moving this
Speaker 4: party forward and for the sake of actually having any
Speaker 4: chances of winning elections, that this is indeed a winning
Speaker 4: ticket of Susan Lee and Ted O'Brien. But the Opposition
Speaker 4: lost the election because they went Labor light. And look
Speaker 4: at the contrast now. The Labor Cabinet met today to
Speaker 4: take their group photo. They're all smiles but unified, and
Speaker 4: the Liberals, fresh from a leadership ballot, are now desperately
Speaker 4: trying to rebuild after their election loss with a leader
Speaker 4: who just scraped over the line. They have no clear
Speaker 4: policies yet and are largely becoming at odds with their
Speaker 4: coalition partners, the Nationals and the Nats are basically propping
Speaker 4: up the coalition right now because they're not the ones
Speaker 4: who've lost a lot of seats, and this is an
Speaker 4: opposition which would want to shape up pretty quick if
Speaker 4: they want to have any chance of beating the Labor Party,
Speaker 4: Susan Lee faces a massive challenge, but the question is
Speaker 4: will she go bold or will the Liberals face years
Speaker 4: in the wilderness.
Speaker 3: Well for more on that.
Speaker 4: Joining me now is former Speaker of the House Bromin
Speaker 4: Bishop and forming New South Wales Police Minister David Elliott
Speaker 4: Hight To both of you, thank you so much for
Speaker 4: joining me on the show this evening. Bron We'll start
Speaker 4: with you. Is Susan Lee the right choice for the party?
Speaker 4: How do you feel about the appointment?
Speaker 10: I think it is quite an achievement for the Liberal
Speaker 10: Party to have a woman leader, and as someone who's
Speaker 10: been the first in many positions in my political life,
Speaker 10: I congratulate Susan one hundred percent on achieving that she
Speaker 10: now has a great opportunity. Now there's were all sorts
Speaker 10: of criticism being thrown her, but she's had it before
Speaker 10: and she's been able to stand up to it. She's
Speaker 10: been on the hustings, and when you've been on the
Speaker 10: hustings and you've been in the small groups as well
Speaker 10: as the large groups, you learn a lot about what
Speaker 10: you've got to do to put policy that appeals to
Speaker 10: those people together. So I think people have got to
Speaker 10: give her a go. And as I've said before, I
Speaker 10: sat for twenty years in the Parliament with that Anthony
Speaker 10: Alvern easy and nobody but nobody ever said he was
Speaker 10: a leader. And yet now he's won ninety two seats.
Speaker 10: So politics is a very fickle game. It can surprise you,
Speaker 10: it can something can arise up and things change and
Speaker 10: you have to be prepared to do it. And I
Speaker 10: think she's got to be given a go. And I
Speaker 10: think for the Level Party to have a female leader
Speaker 10: is a recognition that women in the Liberal Party can
Speaker 10: get there without quotas one hundred.
Speaker 4: You know this quotea's nonsense, really really bothers me. I
Speaker 4: think it's actually offensive, to be honest, at I find
Speaker 4: it now. I find it highly highly offensive. David I
Speaker 4: asked the question there in Madatorial. Is Susan Lee the
Speaker 4: one that can pull this Liberal Party out of one
Speaker 4: of its biggest crises?
Speaker 3: Yes or no?
Speaker 7: Yes she is, And I'll tell you what she has
Speaker 7: got the experience. She's been there for twenty years. She's
Speaker 7: more than twenty years. She has proven herself as a
Speaker 7: loyal deputy. And your colleagues look at you and your
Speaker 7: commitment to loyalty in sub leadership roles before they decide
Speaker 7: to put you in leadership role. So she's proven, she's
Speaker 7: proven that, unlike Anthony Abernezi, she's had real jobs. She
Speaker 7: had a significant career before she entered parliament, so she
Speaker 7: can draw on real world experiences. Setting her gender aside.
Speaker 7: I think she has got a very appealing approach to people.
Speaker 7: I think she's articulate. What she does need she needs
Speaker 7: right now is a head kicker. And I don't think
Speaker 7: Tedday Brown as the head kicker. I think we've really
Speaker 7: stuffed up with him as a deputy leader. But she
Speaker 7: will rely on people like Andrew Hasty, She'll rely on
Speaker 7: people like just Senter Price.
Speaker 1: She'll rely on.
Speaker 7: People, certainly the Victorian Liberals to make sure that we
Speaker 7: don't lose our standing with the urban vote, because it's
Speaker 7: that Victorian vote that needs to now be moved to
Speaker 7: Western Sydney so we can pick up similar seats and
Speaker 7: demographics in Western Sydney.
Speaker 3: What do you think of Tett O'Brien's appointment from Well.
Speaker 10: I think he's showed himself in that debate that he
Speaker 10: had with Bowen to be right on top of Boone.
Speaker 3: Oh, definitely think.
Speaker 10: I think everyone gave him a great, big chair. So
Speaker 10: he's now going to have the opportunity to define further
Speaker 10: the policy he took. And one option they can go
Speaker 10: is and it's something that I thought was perhaps the
Speaker 10: way they should have gone earlier, is say, we will
Speaker 10: remove the innig reality of uranium. We will make it
Speaker 10: legal to build you your reactors and to have nuclear
Speaker 10: power and let the market see if they're going to
Speaker 10: build it and invest in it. Yeah, and I suggest
Speaker 10: that probably will well.
Speaker 3: Hope, you'd hope so, you'd really hope so.
Speaker 4: And that's why they need some clear, definitive policies urgent.
Speaker 10: But what was so killing for Peter Dutton was he
Speaker 10: didn't fight back on that six hundred billion dollar figure.
Speaker 10: It was a lie, it was, but it wasn't refuted.
Speaker 10: You've got to refute things again and again and again
Speaker 10: and again.
Speaker 3: It was like Medicare. It was like the Medicare.
Speaker 4: You know, Albo was out there every day with that
Speaker 4: Medicare cand It was the same thing.
Speaker 10: I could have heard of.
Speaker 3: Yeah, no, look, I completely a.
Speaker 4: Great let's move on because I talked about the Just
Speaker 4: Center napagym for price debarcle.
Speaker 8: There.
Speaker 3: Obviously, she pulled out of the race for opposition deputy.
Speaker 4: Now she explained that decision a little earlier on the
Speaker 4: Kenny Report.
Speaker 3: This is what she said.
Speaker 11: I declared that I was running on a leadership ticket
Speaker 11: with Angus Taylor, and I had made my mind up
Speaker 11: prior too that if Angus was unsuccessful that I would
Speaker 11: allow on you that Ted wanted to run for the
Speaker 11: deputy leadership, that I wouldn't contest that and withdraw from
Speaker 11: that point onward.
Speaker 4: But she also dropped this line which I'm sure got
Speaker 4: conservatives quite excited.
Speaker 8: And to big Prime Minister, of course she need to
Speaker 8: go to the Lower House.
Speaker 11: Well, there is that, you know, and I know there's
Speaker 11: a lot of Australians who'd love to see that. But
Speaker 11: right now, as I said, you know, my focus is
Speaker 11: the Senate.
Speaker 4: I mean, it sounded to me, David like there's still
Speaker 4: some leadership ambition.
Speaker 3: In her, there's still some fights. But what do you
Speaker 3: make of that?
Speaker 7: Well, I don't think this lady's for turning. I think
Speaker 7: we just seeing here is certainly somebody that is going
Speaker 7: to pursue a political career. I think that she should
Speaker 7: be brought down into the Lower House. She can prosecute
Speaker 7: a debate. We saw that in the Voice and anybody
Speaker 7: who thinks that you know, the election result has turned.
Speaker 7: This shown that the Australian electorate has gone left of center,
Speaker 7: has forgot about the voice response in the electorate. And
Speaker 7: she's one of the reasons why we got that. We
Speaker 7: got that look, so we've got that result. So I
Speaker 7: think we've just center. She needs to be harnessed, she
Speaker 7: needs to be mentored, she needs to be given an
Speaker 7: opportunity to go out and forge her own brand in
Speaker 7: the electorate, because I can tell you she's a vote
Speaker 7: winner for us, She's a vote winner for the Liberal Party.
Speaker 7: And I think that the more Susan Leigh stands next
Speaker 7: to the center price and people like Melinda McIntosh, Melissa McIntosh,
Speaker 7: the more we're going to be able to attract those
Speaker 7: votes that have got to come back.
Speaker 4: Do you agree, Brolin, that she could still be a
Speaker 4: star power within Absolutely?
Speaker 10: Absolutely, And all this business about being elected on a
Speaker 10: national party ticket, it's just not true. She is a
Speaker 10: member of the Country Liberal Party and traditionally when we
Speaker 10: had a senator and member for Solomon, one would sit
Speaker 10: in each House, in each party group. Now that we're
Speaker 10: down to just having a senator, we don't have a
Speaker 10: lower House seat in the Northern Territory. Well, she's free
Speaker 10: to choose where she sits.
Speaker 4: Yeah, so you still think, though, but do you think
Speaker 4: she should have a real prominent role now she should?
Speaker 3: Yeah. I hope that Susan Lee gives her I really
Speaker 3: really do hope.
Speaker 4: So I won't to talk about dumping net zero by
Speaker 4: twenty fifty. It was mentioned today at the press conference.
Speaker 4: Now it's clear that the Nationals are looking to drop
Speaker 4: that target. Other big power houses around the world are
Speaker 4: not even thinking about that target anymore.
Speaker 3: But where does this leave the coalition? More broadly, if
Speaker 3: you've got two possibly opposing narratives here, how do you
Speaker 3: see this playing out?
Speaker 7: Well, targets that far out are just a complete waste
Speaker 7: of time because nobody is going to be held accountable
Speaker 7: for the lack of meeting it, and quite frankly, nobody
Speaker 7: believes it. I mean, the Liberal Party needs to highlight
Speaker 7: the fact that we are we believe as conservatives that
Speaker 7: we should be good custodians of the earth, and there
Speaker 7: being good custodians of the earth means we're we're committed
Speaker 7: to bringing down levels of pollution, bringing down liberals of
Speaker 7: carbon emission, replacing them with clean energy without destroying our economy.
Speaker 7: And that's the that's the debate that we always have
Speaker 7: in Western Sydney seats conservative in the Western Sydney seats,
Speaker 7: in the north west of Sydney, we have the highest
Speaker 7: number of families having solar panels on their roofs than
Speaker 7: per capita, than anywhere else. That's that is a liberal
Speaker 7: voting area and they have all the highest number. Now
Speaker 7: what is that to you? It means that when that
Speaker 7: worked out that renewable energy is cheaper than what is
Speaker 7: what in the conventional energy, they'll move to it. But
Speaker 7: they're not going to be lectured to. They're certainly not
Speaker 7: going to be told you have to have their energy
Speaker 7: policy linked to things like the voice and linked to
Speaker 7: things like gender equality and linked to things that got
Speaker 7: nothing to do with the economy of energy. And that's
Speaker 7: what's happened. That's why the Greens lost. They forgot that
Speaker 7: they were there to be environmentalists and they started being
Speaker 7: They started presenting themselves as the thought police.
Speaker 4: So they were running all these air campaigns they were
Speaker 4: going completely alarmists. They were just going into a completely
Speaker 4: different direction. Now they're so irrelevant in this political clime.
Speaker 7: And trying to argue in the same sentence, we've got
Speaker 7: to have renewables, but by the way, we've got a
Speaker 7: free Palestine. Oh, just confuses people.
Speaker 3: You know, it's ridiculous.
Speaker 10: Well, look, I don't think the Greens are worth discussing.
Speaker 10: They're still a vile party, yeah, truly vile. And their
Speaker 10: voters dropped and as I've said before, these minor parties
Speaker 10: usually last about twenty five to thirty years, whether it's
Speaker 10: the DLP, whether it was the Democrats. Well the Greens
Speaker 10: picked up what was left of the Democrats and put
Speaker 10: it into their vote. Something else will happen. But they're
Speaker 10: on the decline.
Speaker 4: Yeah, and just want to get your opinion there on
Speaker 4: net zero by twenty.
Speaker 3: Fifteen, I'm a little proud. Was pretty cold.
Speaker 10: It sounds like that.
Speaker 3: That's a confident that they don't want this.
Speaker 10: Listen, we should never have signed up in the first place.
Speaker 10: I mean, there are many things the many things I
Speaker 10: can say about Scott Morrison. That was the worst thing
Speaker 10: you ever did. It took away all the advantage we
Speaker 10: had in giving a sensible energy policy to the country.
Speaker 10: So sooner we're out of it, the better. As far
Speaker 10: as I'm concerned, I can see that seventy percent of
Speaker 10: the world is not in it. Yeah, point Russia, China,
Speaker 10: the United States, all his big economies nothing to do
Speaker 10: with it. And it's twenty fifty. I mean, what's going
Speaker 10: to happening with.
Speaker 3: The coalition on this from You think it's all chatter.
Speaker 3: You don't think that there will be a split down
Speaker 3: the middle.
Speaker 10: Look, there is always a discussion about whether or not
Speaker 10: the National Party wants to go on its own for
Speaker 10: a bit after there's been a loss. It's happened every
Speaker 10: now and again. But they come back together again because
Speaker 10: they were fundamentally part of the first Compact. When Mensis
Speaker 10: formed the Liberal Party. The National Party didn't want to
Speaker 10: give up its own identity and join in. But the
Speaker 10: coalition was forged and has been going for eighty year.
Speaker 3: Is so no change, no change, no change? Fair enough.
Speaker 4: Now, Look it's not just the Coalition who has a
Speaker 4: new face, but Labor as well, which has undergone a
Speaker 4: ministerial shake up. But most prominently Anthony I Abneasy dumped
Speaker 4: ed Husick and Mark Dreyfus and the PM didn't have
Speaker 4: a lot to say about it.
Speaker 3: Have a listen.
Speaker 7: Mark or either Mark Dreyfus saw it Husick to say
Speaker 7: in the ministry and if not, why not.
Speaker 12: Look, we have a process in the Labor Party caucus.
Speaker 1: You've been watching it for some time.
Speaker 4: What do you think, David on the flicking of both
Speaker 4: Dreyfus and Ed Husick Houston, he was very angry about
Speaker 4: it over the week.
Speaker 3: How I thought it was winging personally?
Speaker 7: Yeah, yeah, I mean it's not very smart to have
Speaker 7: a crack at your boss when you've just been demoted,
Speaker 7: because it makes it very hard for them to promote
Speaker 7: you again. But I mean, if I've ever had to
Speaker 7: have some self reflection about why I joined the Liberal
Speaker 7: Party over the Labor Party, what happened in the last
Speaker 7: seventy two hours is a classic example of why I
Speaker 7: did that, because they are not a meritocracy, and they
Speaker 7: both they celebrate the fact that they had to go
Speaker 7: to the factions and the factions had to divvy up
Speaker 7: the job, and as a result, Ed Husick.
Speaker 1: Got the sack.
Speaker 7: Now, I didn't think Ed was a bad MP. I
Speaker 7: don't think he was a bad minister. I think he
Speaker 7: pursued like Drapust. They were both important because of the
Speaker 7: demographics they represented as well, and you know, they could
Speaker 7: have played a very very important role in positioning Australia
Speaker 7: when it comes to Middle Eastern politics for a start.
Speaker 7: So I mean, obviously Drapus has been there for a
Speaker 7: very very long time, so maybe it was a little
Speaker 7: bit of a little bit of tenure there that saw
Speaker 7: him leave. But I think I think ed Husick being
Speaker 7: dumped for no other reason. It's because they had somebody
Speaker 7: else that they needed to pay off. That's that's bad politics.
Speaker 3: Well, I was interesting as well.
Speaker 4: Tanya Plipasek has been demoted well again, I mean now
Speaker 4: she's Social Services Minister. Look as Environment Minister bro when
Speaker 4: she made that dreadful decision about the blaming mere.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 10: But I want to say something about Dreyfus Music Rayfus
Speaker 10: is useless. He's the man who gave two million dollars
Speaker 10: to Michigan on a twenty twenty four hour turnaround. He's
Speaker 10: got a lot to answer for and he didn't come
Speaker 10: out being vocal on issues when I think he should
Speaker 10: have been.
Speaker 3: That was my view.
Speaker 10: So and when I used to throw him out when
Speaker 10: I was speaker. Nobody cared. No one on the Labor
Speaker 10: Party cared with regard to mister Hughsack. I've never seen
Speaker 10: such a winder in my life. He joined a collectivist party.
Speaker 10: Collectivist rules means that collective rules and individuals can be
Speaker 10: sacrificed to the collective. He was perfectly happy for that
Speaker 10: to be when he got promoted. Now he's going around winching.
Speaker 10: He was a minister of no particular outstanding virtue. I
Speaker 10: can't think of the thing he did that is notable,
Speaker 10: can you?
Speaker 1: No?
Speaker 3: Are you not the one thing to be?
Speaker 7: You know, he was there, and I think the reason
Speaker 7: he was sacked he was sacked because somebody else had
Speaker 7: more ambition.
Speaker 1: And that's bad.
Speaker 10: Well, no, it's not. I mean people are sacked and
Speaker 10: people more ambition going all the time, David, you know that.
Speaker 10: But when it's a principle of the Collectivist.
Speaker 7: Party, that's right, that's exactly right.
Speaker 10: The left wing is now dominant in this party, and
Speaker 10: that's a real worry for us, a real woe for us.
Speaker 10: Albanezi has control of the National Executive, which he chairs.
Speaker 10: He blindly says, oh preference has nothing to do with me,
Speaker 10: when it's everything to do with him. But we know
Speaker 10: he's a liar in the lodge. He hasn't changed, nothing's changed,
Speaker 10: and when we look at the way in which the
Speaker 10: policies that we're likely to have to deal with aregain
Speaker 10: to come our way, it is very damaging and worrying
Speaker 10: for Australa and that's where we ought to be putting
Speaker 10: our attention, like the tax on unrealized capital gains, which
Speaker 10: should have been front and center of the opposition campaign
Speaker 10: during the election.
Speaker 4: This is why the coalition they got to get themselves
Speaker 4: together pretty quickly because it's another three years of Anthony Arbereze,
Speaker 4: as you said, the liar in the lodge, So the
Speaker 4: change nothing, nothing has changed, unfortunately. David Elliot, Browl and Bishop.
Speaker 4: Good to have you both on. Thank you so much
Speaker 4: for joining me on the show this evening. Well for
Speaker 4: more now on leadership reaction from inside the coalition itself.
Speaker 4: I'm now joined by Senator Dave Sharma. Senator, it's good
Speaker 4: to catch up with you. Thanks so much for joining me. Well,
Speaker 4: you're happy with today's outcome. Is Susanly the right choice
Speaker 4: for the party.
Speaker 9: I think she's an excellent choice. She's got vast experience
Speaker 9: to sell a number of portfolios, has a.
Speaker 1: Huge amount of life experience.
Speaker 9: She knows the country well, she knows a members well,
Speaker 9: She's traveled extensively. She's got a strong intellect, she's got
Speaker 9: an intellectual curiosity, and she's very keen to united us
Speaker 9: to make us a disciplined, competitive force that is a
Speaker 9: credible opposition and a strong alternative government.
Speaker 3: Will she stay there for the whole three years? Yes,
Speaker 3: she will, and you're confident of that.
Speaker 9: I am confident of that. Look, I think you know,
Speaker 9: leadership balanced by their nature, you know their device, because
Speaker 9: people choose to back a different side. But I'm quite
Speaker 9: confident in all my conversations with my colleagues that the
Speaker 9: thing that we can agree most firmly on is we
Speaker 9: need to be you know, we need to be a
Speaker 9: stronger alternative to the labor government, and we need to
Speaker 9: have a more competitive offering to these shoining people next
Speaker 9: time around. And I think you know now that this
Speaker 9: the leadership has been decided, we will all get behind
Speaker 9: our new leaders sousainly, and I know she will do
Speaker 9: her up most to harness the talents of everyone in
Speaker 9: the party room to make sure that we are that
Speaker 9: competitive political force.
Speaker 3: But what does that competitive political force look like in
Speaker 3: your view? Is it bold policies?
Speaker 4: How are you going to get to that point where
Speaker 4: you go, yes, we have a team that actually has
Speaker 4: genuine chances of re election.
Speaker 9: Well, look, I don't have all the answers this evening,
Speaker 9: but it starts with acknowledging that the comprehensiveness of our
Speaker 9: loss and where we performed were just you know, both
Speaker 9: geographically and demographically. And why the messages and policies where
Speaker 9: we're putting forward we're not resonating with the Australian public.
Speaker 9: I mean, you know, traditionally, since MEN'SI has founded made
Speaker 9: a point of representing the forgotten people. We've had habits Batlands,
Speaker 9: we've had Scott Morrison's quiet Australians. You know, these are
Speaker 9: the people who live in the suburbs of our cities,
Speaker 9: who have a mortgage, who often have both partners at work,
Speaker 9: who have young children, who have been struggling with the
Speaker 9: cost of living, have been struggling with high energy prices,
Speaker 9: you know, who struggle with traffic on the roads, who
Speaker 9: struggle with the concept of their children being able to
Speaker 9: afford at home those that are sorts of voters. We
Speaker 9: need to be addressing their real life concerns and priorities,
Speaker 9: and I think, you know, we need to improve our
Speaker 9: policy offering to do that. That's going to take some time.
Speaker 9: I don't pretend that'll all be unveiled in the next
Speaker 9: week or two. We need to do some pretty deep reflection,
Speaker 9: review and internal discussion and consolidation. But I'm confident we
Speaker 9: can do it.
Speaker 4: One of those policies is, of course, on energy. It's
Speaker 4: a big one. Will you stick with nuclear?
Speaker 9: Well, if that's sort of a decision for men, As
Speaker 9: Susan said this morning, this morning or this afternoon just
Speaker 9: after the leadership, it's normal after a loss like this
Speaker 9: to review all of.
Speaker 1: Your policies, and I expect we'll be doing all that.
Speaker 9: I mean, what we will want to be putting forward
Speaker 9: is a credible alternative energy policies to label that will
Speaker 9: help make electricity affordable again, and power affordable, make sure
Speaker 9: our manufacturers who rely on energy as and input can
Speaker 9: be internationally competitive and that brings down emissions over time.
Speaker 9: But in a way that is working with the grain
Speaker 9: of technology and what is available and what's commercially competitive.
Speaker 4: I want to answer your Senate colleague. James McGraw wrote
Speaker 4: to Liberal members today saying that what the Liberal Party
Speaker 4: needs to focus on is it moving left, is it
Speaker 4: moving right? It's about how it does politics. How does
Speaker 4: it need to change how it does politics? In your view,
Speaker 4: I'm curious to get your answer.
Speaker 9: Well, I thought James made a thoughtful contribution, and I
Speaker 9: think it's too often these election post mortems can find
Speaker 9: themselves on one dimension only, which is where you position ideologically.
Speaker 9: I think our challenge is really to modernize, and that
Speaker 9: means staying true to our principles, saying true to our values,
Speaker 9: but making sure they are translated into policies that are
Speaker 9: important to their lives and priorities and pressure points at
Speaker 9: everyday Australians, and to make sure that we're a discipline
Speaker 9: and effective campaign fighting machine. I mean, James has a
Speaker 9: lot of experience in our partying machinery and the functioning
Speaker 9: of our state divisions, and I think it's clear that
Speaker 9: the competitiveness of how we run campaigns has diminished over
Speaker 9: the last few cycles, and we need to have a
Speaker 9: better organizational performance, and that's internal.
Speaker 1: Change and internal review.
Speaker 9: But that's a key part of being a successful political pay.
Speaker 3: Yeah. Absolutely, well, look the road's long ahead, but look
Speaker 3: fingers crossed.
Speaker 4: Dave Sharma, good to see you. Thanks very much for
Speaker 4: joining me on the show. This evening, well still to come.
Speaker 4: Does a liberal party need female quotas if it wants
Speaker 4: to be re elected?
Speaker 3: We'll have a fascinating debate coming up.
Speaker 4: But first, another agency warns our Triple A credit rating
Speaker 4: is at risk. Former Treasury Secretary David Pearl joins me
Speaker 4: to discuss what reckless labor spending may cost us.
Speaker 3: Welcome back to the program. To some business news.
Speaker 4: Now, the markets are cheering after the US and China
Speaker 4: agreed to wind back. There were talitory tariffs for at
Speaker 4: least ninety days. Donald Trump has also scaled back his
Speaker 4: comments on Beijing.
Speaker 10: European Union is in many ways nastier than China.
Speaker 4: Okay, joining me now to discuss this is Former Treasury
Speaker 4: Assistant Secretary David Pearl, David, good to see Thank you
Speaker 4: for joining me.
Speaker 3: Is a trade war really winding down? What's your take
Speaker 3: on it?
Speaker 13: Thanks for having me on. It's a pretty significant development.
Speaker 13: If we just go back a couple of months, we
Speaker 13: had Donald Trump announcing his Liberation Day tariffs against China
Speaker 13: and the rest of the world, and he's now completely
Speaker 13: climbed down from that. I think the agreement with the
Speaker 13: Chinese was it inevitable because leaving aside Donald Trump's retric
Speaker 13: about trade balances, the US and China are mutually dependent
Speaker 13: on each other. And to the extent that this agreement
Speaker 13: has forestalled and the possibility of a breakdown, it's.
Speaker 1: Fantastic news for Australia.
Speaker 13: That said, the uncertainty that we've seen will continue because
Speaker 13: Trump's approach to trade is messy and bordering on chaotic.
Speaker 13: I'm hoping that Trump, being a pragmatist, is stepping back
Speaker 13: from his protectionism and he'll focus from now on the
Speaker 13: more constructive, economically sensible parts of his program, tax reductions
Speaker 13: for American companies and individuals and also energy deregulation, and
Speaker 13: leaves protectionism, which is just corporate welfare to one side.
Speaker 3: Yeah, I mean that's a good point.
Speaker 4: So they've got this ninety day pause, though, is it
Speaker 4: at all going to have an impact on our economy here?
Speaker 13: If there was a disorderly decoupling between the US and China,
Speaker 13: it would have made poor Keating's Banana a public moment
Speaker 13: in the nineteen eighties.
Speaker 1: A walk in the park.
Speaker 13: It would have been an existential event for Australia. The
Speaker 13: fact that that is now unlikely is positive news for
Speaker 13: this country. But as I said before, if you're renegotiating
Speaker 13: the terms of global international trade, it's going to be
Speaker 13: messy and uncertain for quite some time. But if the
Speaker 13: US and China can re establish their trade and financial relationships,
Speaker 13: that gives a solid baseline, if you like, for the
Speaker 13: Australian economy.
Speaker 3: Yeah, okay, we'll be watching that one with a lot
Speaker 3: of interest.
Speaker 4: Now, look, labor has excessively spent over the last three
Speaker 4: years and it's now been calling to question with a
Speaker 4: second credit rating agency warning that our triple A credit
Speaker 4: rating could actually be on the line. Fitch Rating Sovereigns
Speaker 4: director Jeremy told Business Now it could actually be in
Speaker 4: jebety in the medium term.
Speaker 3: This is what he said.
Speaker 14: When we think about Australia's public finances, Australia compared to
Speaker 14: its Triple A peers.
Speaker 1: Is somewhat towards the weaker.
Speaker 14: And when we look at the level of the physical deficit,
Speaker 14: which we think about a general government deficit level including
Speaker 14: state and federal governments, that's running close to three percent
Speaker 14: this year, and the triple A median is more around
Speaker 14: one percent deficit level.
Speaker 4: David, look that there have been so many cash splashes
Speaker 4: by labor. This election plus the last three years, as
Speaker 4: I said, has seen record government spending. It's been out
Speaker 4: of control. How much of an impact is this having.
Speaker 1: It's certainly having an impact.
Speaker 13: It's attracted the attention of the credit ratings agencies, But
Speaker 13: the credit ratings agencies and their individual ratings for economies
Speaker 13: are quite superficial.
Speaker 1: If Fitch and.
Speaker 13: Moody's opened up the books and looked more closely, they'd
Speaker 13: see that we have three fiscal time bombs. One our
Speaker 13: addiction to entitlement spending including the ndis, which our official
Speaker 13: forecasts assume will grow at only eight percent of year
Speaker 13: instead of fourteen percent. We also assume a further decade
Speaker 13: of bracket creep paid by a shrinking proportion of the
Speaker 13: working age population. We assume no further increase in defense spending,
Speaker 13: and our national productivity performance to be far better than
Speaker 13: it has been in the last decade. So if you
Speaker 13: actually unpack each of those assumptions, our medium term fiscal
Speaker 13: outlook is very poor and triple A rating is actually
Speaker 13: a positive gloss.
Speaker 4: Yeah, look it's not good news, but look I think
Speaker 4: hardly surprising given the cash splashes. I mean not just federally,
Speaker 4: but we also saw it in state budget. It was
Speaker 4: completely out of control. Before we let you go, David,
Speaker 4: I want to get your thoughts on Susan Lee becoming
Speaker 4: opposition leader. I mean, this could be in deed a
Speaker 4: time for renewal for the party. But what do they
Speaker 4: need to focus on, and especially by way of economic policy,
Speaker 4: because I mean the economy's meant to be a key
Speaker 4: platform for the Conservatives.
Speaker 3: We haven't seen it in recent years. But what do
Speaker 3: they need to do, do you think?
Speaker 13: Well, firstly, tear up Peter Dutton's economic playbook from the
Speaker 13: last election, which would have raised income taxes, matched labor's
Speaker 13: cash splash dollar for dollar, and done nothing about our
Speaker 13: addiction to spending.
Speaker 1: So put that one to side. That to one side.
Speaker 13: I just emphasized three points for the new leadership team. One,
Speaker 13: don't forget that tax is the natural territory for liberal
Speaker 13: or conservative political movements. Not only does it make sense economically,
Speaker 13: we shouldn't forget that both the Whole Keeping and the
Speaker 13: Howard government placed tax form and in particular the reduction
Speaker 13: of high income tax burdens, at the center of their
Speaker 13: growth agendas. So let's not forget that. I think the
Speaker 13: opposition to do that. But tax is also a political issue.
Speaker 13: Every Australian or most Australians pay tax. Very few Australians
Speaker 13: think they should pay more. Yet if we have a
Speaker 13: decade of bracket creep, the average tax rate paid by
Speaker 13: Australians will rise by fifteen percent. So I think the
Speaker 13: opposition should say bracket creep will not be tolerated anymore,
Speaker 13: just as we don't tolerate not indexing pensions. It's a
Speaker 13: moral issue, not just an economic issue.
Speaker 1: The other point I'd make is fairness.
Speaker 13: Labour's definition of fairness is let's allocate favors and subsidies
Speaker 13: to identity groups based on some assumed moral superiority. The
Speaker 13: liberals should emphasize a quality of opportunity in meritocracy. Not
Speaker 13: only are they liberal and good conservative values, they are
Speaker 13: Australian values, and I think they've lost sight of that.
Speaker 13: And that's a very clear way to differentiate themselves from
Speaker 13: their opponents.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 4: I think that's a really fair point. It's going to
Speaker 4: be an interesting three years ahead. David Pearl, nice to see,
Speaker 4: Thanks so much for joining me this evening. Well don't
Speaker 4: go anywhere. Is the Misinformation Bill coming back? I'll talk
Speaker 4: to John Story from the Institute of Public Affairs about
Speaker 4: what Michelle.
Speaker 3: Rowland's promotion means.
Speaker 4: First, the incredible reunion of the last American hostage held
Speaker 4: by Hamas with his family. Christy McSweeney and Lisa Goddard
Speaker 4: are coming up after the break.
Speaker 3: Welcome back.
Speaker 4: Let's jump straight back into it with my panel, PR
Speaker 4: Council Managing Director Christy McSweeney and a Dooni medias. Lisa Goddard,
Speaker 4: Hi to both of you. Thank you so much for
Speaker 4: joining me on the show. Look, we need to start
Speaker 4: with the Coalition's leadership results. Of course, Susan Lee elected
Speaker 4: Liberal leader today.
Speaker 3: Christy will start with you.
Speaker 15: What's your reaction. Is she the right choice to lead
Speaker 15: the party? I think she's a sensible choice. I think
Speaker 15: it's a centrist choice. I think it is very symbolic
Speaker 15: that the Coalition has elected its first female leader. Is
Speaker 15: it a bit of a glass cliff situation?
Speaker 3: Look?
Speaker 15: Probably, But I don't know if you've been into the
Speaker 15: Liberal party room and you are confronted with a photo
Speaker 15: wall of men, and it will be great that the
Speaker 15: coalition can finally have a woman on that wall. And
Speaker 15: of course it has been the case at a state level.
Speaker 15: We've had leaders and Senate leaders as well, and it's
Speaker 15: been amazing. So it's not a be all and end all,
Speaker 15: but that is one good point in terms of is
Speaker 15: it a unifying decision. We'll have to wait and see
Speaker 15: how long the factions give her before that starts, but
Speaker 15: I think she did very well today in the press conference.
Speaker 3: I was quite impressed. We'll see, We'll certainly see, Lisa,
Speaker 3: what's your take on it. Look, I think she has
Speaker 3: work to do.
Speaker 12: She's been in Parliament now for more than twenty years
Speaker 12: and I did a strawman pole around the office today
Speaker 12: and some people down in the foyer they didn't know
Speaker 12: who she was. And the other big point was they
Speaker 12: didn't know how to pronounce her last name. So looking
Speaker 12: at someone who look, I think it's great that they've
Speaker 12: put a woman in that position. I don't like the
Speaker 12: fact that every headline is screaming it's the first female
Speaker 12: because I do think it comes down to merit. But look,
Speaker 12: she's there. I think what we need to judge her
Speaker 12: on is not her gender, but what she can actually
Speaker 12: do about. As Christy said, unifying the party and having
Speaker 12: some really tough conversations about what policy are they going
Speaker 12: to come forward with, because today there were no real
Speaker 12: answers on that.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and that's exactly what I said as well in
Speaker 3: my editorial. There were no clear answers. And I agree.
Speaker 3: You know, Lisa, I don't care what the gender of
Speaker 3: a person is in that high level position.
Speaker 4: I don't care as long as they can do the job,
Speaker 4: and as long as they got there through merit, I
Speaker 4: couldn't care less whether they're male or female.
Speaker 3: I totally agree.
Speaker 4: Now, look, let's talk about gender quotas, because Christy, you
Speaker 4: had an interesting article in the AFI yesterday you said,
Speaker 4: to win them, I suggest we embrace women who could
Speaker 4: win us those seats and understand that we need to
Speaker 4: help them gain the experience and the networks in the
Speaker 4: party to be visible, recognized and chosen. If that means
Speaker 4: given them a man and dated female position to win
Speaker 4: an election, so be it. Christy, are you advocating for
Speaker 4: gender quotas? Do you think that that is the way
Speaker 4: forward for the Liberal Party and why?
Speaker 15: Well, one, I think it's time something happened. I have
Speaker 15: sat in pre selections for over twenty five years. The
Speaker 15: only women who get pre selected are ones that have
Speaker 15: the time to lean in to undertake all the impossible
Speaker 15: tasks that gets you to the front of the queue
Speaker 15: where you can tick off the list of and it's
Speaker 15: going to state counsel an admin committee all day on
Speaker 15: a Saturday, it's going to three meetings a week, it's
Speaker 15: going to various other things. There is a reality that
Speaker 15: women raising children and holding down a career aren't able
Speaker 15: to do those things. So the women that get pre selected,
Speaker 15: and I'm not saying women don't, are women that are
Speaker 15: able to undertake those tasks that allow them to be
Speaker 15: visible and then considered worthy enough for people who make
Speaker 15: this selection because they have completed that checklist. There is
Speaker 15: just a reality that the women that we want to represent,
Speaker 15: us women of working age, who are rising families like
Speaker 15: the Labor Party, are not able to get through in
Speaker 15: that selection structure. It's not about merit, it's about addressing
Speaker 15: that selection.
Speaker 3: It is about structure.
Speaker 15: I'm recognizing recognizing that it isn't the right one.
Speaker 3: Merit is a wonderful blanket argument to have.
Speaker 15: I think it's you have to understand that, understand the
Speaker 15: new wants of the selection structure, that the fact is
Speaker 15: women in our party aren't working and raising families like.
Speaker 3: They are in the Labor Party. I take a point
Speaker 3: we have to look at that.
Speaker 4: Understand why I take your point on that, Christie, But
Speaker 4: as a woman, I find it highly offensive that a
Speaker 4: woman should get a role not based on a merit,
Speaker 4: not based on how good she is, not based on
Speaker 4: how hard she's worked, but the fact that she is
Speaker 4: a woman.
Speaker 3: I just find that so offensive in this day and age.
Speaker 3: And if that's the case.
Speaker 15: If that's not, that's choose people. If that's how you
Speaker 15: may as well don't choose people.
Speaker 3: Yeah. Sorry, I just want to move on because we
Speaker 3: don't have a lot of time.
Speaker 4: And I do take your point, Christy, and I get
Speaker 4: what you're saying, But Lisa, what are your thoughts on this?
Speaker 12: Christy is absolutely right when you sit in those branch meetings,
Speaker 12: it is about winning people over it and our goodness
Speaker 12: knows how many five dollars raffle tickets you have to
Speaker 12: buy while you attend those branches. Christy will tell you
Speaker 12: about that. But look, there are two things here. One
Speaker 12: it has to be on merit. You have to rise
Speaker 12: to the top based on your experience, based on your knowledge,
Speaker 12: based on the fact that you understand your community and
Speaker 12: that you can give something back to your community and
Speaker 12: actually changes country for the best. However, when it comes
Speaker 12: to pre selection, when it comes to looking at what
Speaker 12: candidate are you going to put forward A and you
Speaker 12: did a study, predominantly those women get the tough seats.
Speaker 12: We don't always get the winnable easy seats. You put
Speaker 12: into a position where it's going to be a tough fight.
Speaker 12: You're looking at having to ether, put your business on hold,
Speaker 12: stand down from your job, so financially, how do you
Speaker 12: then manage your life. I have to put yourself forward
Speaker 12: for pre selection and then go out there in campaign.
Speaker 12: So it is a really tough one you have to balance. Yes,
Speaker 12: we want the best candidates on merit.
Speaker 3: Fullies back that.
Speaker 12: However, they need to look at the party structure and
Speaker 12: think about how do we pre select women who are
Speaker 12: good on merit and put them into seats.
Speaker 3: That are winnable.
Speaker 12: If we truly want women in the Parliament and the
Speaker 12: greater numbers. It's not about quotas, it's about putting them
Speaker 12: into the seats.
Speaker 10: That are winnable.
Speaker 4: I agree, and it all does come down to selection.
Speaker 4: I do agree with that, and I think that there
Speaker 4: will be a real rethink come the next election. And
Speaker 4: there were a lot of really good female candidates out there.
Speaker 4: I don't think that they were given the opportunity to
Speaker 4: really shine throughout this campaign, and that is the sad part.
Speaker 3: But we'll see what happens. We have run out of time.
Speaker 4: Christy mcsweety and Lisa God we love a good debate.
Speaker 4: I like having you both on. Thank you very much
Speaker 4: for joing to be on the show.
Speaker 11: We do, we do.
Speaker 3: We absolutely that we do get along. Really stay with us.
Speaker 3: Still to come.
Speaker 4: We thought the Misinformation Bill was dead, but its strongest
Speaker 4: advocate is now the Attorney General. Is the fight for
Speaker 4: free speech back on? We'll find out next Welcome back. Well,
Speaker 4: we've rightly been focused on Labour's factional war over the
Speaker 4: new ministerial roles, but one controversial appointment needs more focus
Speaker 4: and that's Michelle Roland talking taking on the role of
Speaker 4: Attorney General from Mark Dreyfus. Now you recall this is
Speaker 4: the same person that was Labour's face for the Misinformation Bill,
Speaker 4: and we know how fired up Labor is about.
Speaker 9: Misinformation, misinformation, misinformation, the misinformation, the misinformation which is there
Speaker 9: so misinformation?
Speaker 1: Yes?
Speaker 3: So do we really think one attempt to get it
Speaker 3: through Parliament is the end of it?
Speaker 4: I don't, especially with then you found majority in the
Speaker 4: lower House and the Greens, who of course supported the bill,
Speaker 4: hold the.
Speaker 3: Balance of power in the Senate.
Speaker 4: Joining me now is John's story from the Institute of
Speaker 4: Public Affairs, an organization that did so much to highlight
Speaker 4: the dangers of that bill when Labour tried to pass it.
Speaker 4: Welcome to the show, Thanks for joining me. How conconed
Speaker 4: are you that it could be making a comeback?
Speaker 6: I think a lot of people are concerned that the
Speaker 6: thumping electoral victory that Labor had a week and a
Speaker 6: half ago will enable them to push forward a far
Speaker 6: more radical agenda than they did in.
Speaker 1: Their first term.
Speaker 6: And there's no doubt that if Labor could, they would
Speaker 6: implement far more radical internet censorship laws than Australia currently has.
Speaker 6: Now there's every sign now that they have that large majority,
Speaker 6: they will do that. What are those signs? Well, the
Speaker 6: first one was Labor never repudiated the misinformation and disinformation
Speaker 6: built when it failed to pass the Senate last year.
Speaker 6: Michelle rowl and the Communications Minister at the time, said
Speaker 6: how important it was to protect democracy from misinformation and
Speaker 6: disinformation and that they are a threat to national security. However,
Speaker 6: we don't have the numbers in the Senate. That's hardly
Speaker 6: a repudiation. That's hardly saying look, we've listened to the
Speaker 6: concerns about free speech and we're ditching this policy. It
Speaker 6: suggests if we get another chance or do it again.
Speaker 6: The other sign is the promotion of Michelle Rowland to
Speaker 6: Attorney General. Her signature policy as Communications Minister was the
Speaker 6: failed attempt to introduce misinformation laws, and for that failure
Speaker 6: she's been promoted. So these are all signs that need
Speaker 6: to be put to the Prime Minister. Do you intend
Speaker 6: to introduce these laws into Parliament again?
Speaker 3: I completely agree. Look, I think it is a real
Speaker 3: worry overall.
Speaker 4: What sort of free speech battles do you see now
Speaker 4: on the horizon we spoke about misinformation, Labor has been
Speaker 4: dipping into this issue. How do you see this playing out.
Speaker 6: Well, we've got some important court cases at the moment
Speaker 6: dealing with the powers of the E Safety Commissioner. One
Speaker 6: thing I think Anthony Albanezi may have learned from his
Speaker 6: first term where he's election night he said, oh, we're
Speaker 6: going to introduce this voice, and it was this radical
Speaker 6: propos I think he might be a little more subtle
Speaker 6: this time. It may be that they don't introduce a
Speaker 6: misinformation bill by just reintroducing the old bill. What it
Speaker 6: could be is that enhancing the powers of the E
Speaker 6: Safety Commissioner to effectively give her powers over misinformation. There's
Speaker 6: currently a review of the Online Safety Act, and some
Speaker 6: of the proposals in that review sound awfully like what
Speaker 6: was proposed under the Misinformation Bill.
Speaker 4: Yeah, it's almost by stealth, I would say, John Story,
Speaker 4: good to catch up. Thank you so much for joining
Speaker 4: me on the show this evening. And that's all we've
Speaker 4: got time for this evening.
Speaker 3: Thank you for your time, Sharry Marks, and we'll be
Speaker 3: back on deck tomorrow. Stay tuned. Paul Murray is next