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Speaker 1: You can listen to the Front on your smart speaker

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Speaker 1: every morning to hear the latest episode. Just say play

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Speaker 1: the news from the Australian. From the Australian, here's what's

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Speaker 1: on the Front. I'm Claire Harvey. It's Wednesday, August fourteen.

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Speaker 1: A law firm that tried to fight the deportation of

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Speaker 1: a domestic violence offender has been slated by the tribunal

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Speaker 1: hearing immigration claims. The Administrative Appeals Tribunal said the law

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Speaker 1: firm had attempted to manipulate the tribunal with lies about

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Speaker 1: the man's case. That's an exclusive live now at the

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Speaker 1: Australian dot com dot au. Scott Morrison has entered the

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Speaker 1: Brittany Higgins defamation trial, and the former Prime Minister says

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Speaker 1: his former minister Linda Reynolds should never have called Higgins

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Speaker 1: a lying cow. Today all the action from the Supreme Court.

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Speaker 1: Brittaney Higgins was one of the most junior staffers in

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Speaker 1: the government of Scott Morrison, but she had probably the

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Speaker 1: biggest impact.

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Speaker 2: I have listened to Brittany. Jenny and I spoke last

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Speaker 2: night and she said to me, you have to think

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Speaker 2: about this as a father first, what would you want

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Speaker 2: to happen if it were our girls. Jenny has a

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Speaker 2: way of clarifying things.

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Speaker 1: In the days after Brittney Higgins went public in February

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Speaker 1: twenty twenty one with her claim to have been raped

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Speaker 1: two years earlier in the office of her boss, Senator

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Speaker 1: Linda Reynolds, her story became the only story in Canberra.

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Speaker 3: On What day did the minister first become aware of

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Speaker 3: allegations of rape made by her former staff member.

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Speaker 4: What action did the minister take.

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Speaker 5: As a result, What was the reason for his employment

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Speaker 5: ended and did he resign or.

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Speaker 1: Was he sacked? Labor pushed Linda Reynolds hard on what

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Speaker 1: she'd done to help Higgins after discovering the young woman

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Speaker 1: was claiming to have been raped by a fellow staffer,

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Speaker 1: Bruce Lammon, on the sofa in Reynold's own ministerial suite.

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Speaker 1: Reynolds said she did everything she could to assist Higgins,

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Speaker 1: but wanted her to get professional.

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Speaker 3: Help on her couch in her ministerial office.

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Speaker 5: What action did the minister take as a result. The

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Speaker 5: alleged rapist has been described as the Minister's favorite. Did

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Speaker 5: the minister consider it odd that her favorite go to

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Speaker 5: person would resign on the spot for a security breach

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Speaker 5: without a conversation with her.

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Speaker 1: So much has happened since then. The Morrison government was

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Speaker 1: turfed out. In twenty twenty two, Bruce Lammon was found

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Speaker 1: by the Federal Court to have, on the balance of

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Speaker 1: probabilities raped Brittaney Higgins, of finding Lehman has always denied

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Speaker 1: and which he's appealing. And now Linda Reynolds is suing

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Speaker 1: Brittany Higgins and her husband David Charraz not over the

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Speaker 1: rape claim, but over social media posts in which she

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Speaker 1: says they accused her of being a hypocrite and a

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Speaker 1: boss who did nothing to help her vulnerable young employee.

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Speaker 6: This is from a current Australian senator who continues to

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Speaker 6: harass me through the media and in the Parliament instead

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Speaker 6: of solving the problem. There are people who would prefer

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Speaker 6: to just silence victims.

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Speaker 7: There is a very real chance Linda Reynolds will be

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Speaker 7: called to court this year to answer questions on her

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Speaker 7: involvement in Britain. Higgins feeling pressured by her office not

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Speaker 7: to continue with a complaint to police.

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Speaker 1: Higgins and Shiraz are mounting a truth defense in the

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Speaker 1: defamation case, being heard in the WA Supreme Court. They're

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Speaker 1: seeking to demonstrate that Linda Reynolds really did fail in

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Speaker 1: her duty of care to Higgins. Between Higgins's version of

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Speaker 1: events and Reynolds, there are some small differences, like exactly

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Speaker 1: when Higgins told her bosses she believed she'd been raped,

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Speaker 1: and there are enormous gulfs like Higgins's claims she was

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Speaker 1: told to stop talking about the rape. I would try

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Speaker 1: and raise it, and I would try and bring it up.

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Speaker 4: Then it was always it always sort of came back

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Speaker 4: to sort of being a mere issue, and I said,

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Speaker 4: if you can't deal with it, then you can leave.

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Speaker 1: Higgins says she was told she could drop the matter

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Speaker 1: or give up her job. She said it was crystal

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Speaker 1: clear this was a political problem for the government. Linda

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Speaker 1: Reynolds says that is one hundred percent sent untrue. She

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Speaker 1: sacked Bruce Lammon the day she found out he'd entered

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Speaker 1: Parliament with Higgins after hours. Reynolds says she did everything

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Speaker 1: to encourage Higgins to go to the police and to

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Speaker 1: support her when Higgins decided not to go ahead. Here's

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Speaker 1: some of what Reynolds told the court in the trial's

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Speaker 1: opening days. We've used a voice actor.

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Speaker 4: I had no reason then or now to doubt her

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Speaker 4: memories of rape, but everything else she said I.

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Speaker 1: Knew wasn't true.

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Speaker 4: What had I missed for her to now think that

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Speaker 4: was all true?

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Speaker 1: Talking about the social posts, Reynolds said, I.

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Speaker 4: Just felt like one of those punching clowns at the fairground.

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Speaker 4: You get punched down and you have to get up smiling.

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Speaker 4: Then you get punched down again, and punched down again,

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Speaker 4: and punched down again.

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Speaker 1: Enter Scott Morrison.

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Speaker 3: I consider Linda a good friend and a very trustworthy colleague.

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Speaker 1: That's a voice actor bringing you the former PM's words

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Speaker 1: from the court where he's been called by barristers for

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Speaker 1: Linda Reynolds. He said he had had no idea back

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Speaker 1: in twenty nineteen that there was an allegation of rape.

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Speaker 3: Had the matter been brought to my attention in twenty nineteen,

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Speaker 3: a process would have followed to understand what had occurred

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Speaker 3: and what the deficiencies were and how we may have

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Speaker 3: dealt with it at that time.

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Speaker 1: Rachel Young, sc BARRISTIFFA. Reynolds asked Morrison whether he was

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Speaker 1: disappointed Reynolds didn't tell him about the alleged rape at

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Speaker 1: the time.

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Speaker 3: Yes, initially I was, but as events transpired, Senator Reynolds

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Speaker 3: chose not to do that out of respect for the

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Speaker 3: confidence they'd entered into with Miss Higgins, so that was

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Speaker 3: a dilemma.

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Speaker 1: Morrison said this about Brittany Higgins feeling she was not supported.

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Speaker 3: I stress I never saw that as a failing of

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Speaker 3: Senator Reynolds. I saw that as a failure of the

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Speaker 3: process to support each of them in what was a

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Speaker 3: highly sensitive, vulnerable and difficult situation.

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Speaker 1: He described the Labour Party's intense questioning of Reynolds in

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Speaker 1: Parliament like bias.

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Speaker 3: There was quite aggressive questioning and very coordinated questioning taking place.

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Speaker 3: I went and saw her immediately after question time and

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Speaker 3: she was in a very distressed state. I expressed my

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Speaker 3: strong support for her to help her get through this.

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Speaker 3: It was intending to discredit her and weaponize the issue

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Speaker 3: for political purposes, to discredit the Senator, the government and myself.

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Speaker 1: In March twenty twenty one, The Australian broke an exclusive

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Speaker 1: in her ministerial office, Linda Reynolds called Brittany Higgins a

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Speaker 1: lying cow. Reynolds has told this trial she was talking

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Speaker 1: about Higgins's claim that Reynolds had mishandled the allegations. Reynolds

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Speaker 1: says she wasn't denying Higgins's claim to have been raped.

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Speaker 1: Reynolds gave a ten thousand dollars donation to a women's

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Speaker 1: shelter after Higgins threatened to sue over the remark. In

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Speaker 1: the witness box on Tuesday, Scott Morrison was cross examined

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Speaker 1: by Rachel Young, sc council for Higgins, about that we've

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Speaker 1: used voice actors.

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Speaker 3: A minister calling anyone a cow, particularly female, was unacceptable.

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Speaker 1: Particularly in respect to a rape complainant.

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Speaker 3: Oh host of things, but I found this statement by

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Speaker 3: miss Reynolds to be particularly out of character. It's not

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Speaker 3: okay for ministers to speak this way about anyone. She

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Speaker 3: referred to her as a cow, and that was absolutely

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Speaker 3: outrageous and one shouldn't do that. And she apologized, and

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Speaker 3: I thought that was the end of that.

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Speaker 1: Did you tell Senator Reynolds to apologize?

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Speaker 3: I didn't have to.

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Speaker 1: Did you tell her to apologize?

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Speaker 3: I didn't have to.

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Speaker 1: Young wanted to know if Morrison considered standing Reynolds down.

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Speaker 3: It was a statement completely out of character, made in

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Speaker 3: a private setting. One would not expect to be made public.

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Speaker 3: If all members of Parliament had their comments made public,

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Speaker 3: we would not have a single member serving in Parliament.

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Speaker 1: Morrison described his meeting with Britney Higgins in April twenty

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Speaker 1: twenty one, and he seemed bemused about the topics that

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Speaker 1: interested Higgins.

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Speaker 3: I do know Miss Higgins seemed very agitated around the

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Speaker 3: arbitrary nature of dismissal. When staff members are accused of

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Speaker 3: something and ministers dismissed them. That's essentially what happened. Another

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Speaker 3: member of staff involved in these matters was dismissed.

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Speaker 1: He's talking about Bruce Lamon, who was told to pack

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Speaker 1: up his stuff as soon as Senator Reynolds became aware

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Speaker 1: he'd entered Parliament after hours.

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Speaker 3: I was surprised this seemed dominant in her mind, but

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Speaker 3: that's what she wanted to focus.

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Speaker 1: On, Morrison said. As the situation unfolded, he realized he'd

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Speaker 1: have to move Reynolds out of the Critical Defense portfolio

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Speaker 1: because her mental health had been so seriously affected.

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Speaker 3: She was quite visibly stressed and in a highly fragile

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Speaker 3: emotional state. When I went to see her, I was

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Speaker 3: unaware of her cardiac condition. It was brought to my

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Speaker 3: attention with her permission sometime later. I remember for a

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Speaker 3: period there we were very fearful that Senator Reynolds that

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Speaker 3: this could be a fatal outcome for her. She took

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Speaker 3: sick leave as she should. She was not capable of

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Speaker 3: continuing her duties in her physical and mental state. I

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Speaker 3: appointed an acting Minister with the hope and intention that

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Speaker 3: Reynolds would be able to continue to serve in that role.

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Speaker 3: She was given the Government Services role, which was also important,

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Speaker 3: but not at the stress levels of the Defense portfolio.

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Speaker 1: In March twenty twenty one, Peter Dutton took over the

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Speaker 1: Defense portfolio. Morrison said he believed Higgins's claim of rape

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Speaker 1: had been used to attack the government, saying he'd seen.

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Speaker 3: It was intended to discredit her. It was the weaponizing

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Speaker 3: of this issue for political purposes to discredit both Senator

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Speaker 3: Reynolds and the government and by extinction myself.

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Speaker 1: Morrison said. Brittney higgins suggestion in the Project interview that

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Speaker 1: Reynolds or the government had tried to cover up the rape.

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Speaker 3: Was completely and utterly false.

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Speaker 1: Coming up, Scott Morrison makes it clear he's not going

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Speaker 1: to take the blame. The big stories in this giant

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Speaker 1: drama are always broken by The Australian. Join ours subscribers

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Speaker 1: for a lot less than the cost of a coffee

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Speaker 1: a day at The Australian. We'll be back after this break.

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Speaker 1: In cross examination, Rachel Young, sc Council for Brittany Higgins

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Speaker 1: asked Scott Morrison whether the review of workplace culture he

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Speaker 1: initiated in twenty twenty one was just a stunt. Morrison

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Speaker 1: denied that.

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Speaker 3: It was important because we needed to make sure that

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Speaker 3: the processes and supports that were available to everyone who

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Speaker 3: could be potentially having to deal with the situation like

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Speaker 3: this were adequate. The public nature of this was not

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Speaker 3: the motive. The issue was the motive, and the need

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Speaker 3: to deal with it was the motive.

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Speaker 1: Young began grilling Morrison about one of the lines of inquiry.

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Speaker 1: Morrison said he didn't think the questions were relevant.

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Speaker 3: It doesn't relate to the conduct of Senator Reynolds.

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Speaker 1: The judge weighed in, Sorry, mister Morrison, you don't have

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Speaker 1: a choice unless there's an objection to the question, and

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Speaker 1: there hasn't been. I would be grateful if you could answer.

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Speaker 1: Young asked Morrison whether the review found Parliament's processes for

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Speaker 1: handling serious allegations were inadequate.

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Speaker 3: Well, yes, I think that has probably been the case

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Speaker 3: for a very long time, and the culture in Parliament

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Speaker 3: had improved, but clearly not enough.

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Speaker 1: Scott Morrison has always made it clear in this matter

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Speaker 1: he's not going to take the blame. In February twenty

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Speaker 1: twenty one, he told the Parliament he'd spoken to Fiona Brown,

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Speaker 1: who was Linda Reynolds chief of staff at the time

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Speaker 1: of the twenty nineteen incident.

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Speaker 2: I have had these conversations, mister Speaker with the member

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Speaker 2: of staff members of mine, I said, there'd been many conversations.

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Speaker 2: I'm happy to indicate that I've had conversations about the

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Speaker 2: support provided by the member of my staff. Now, she

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Speaker 2: missed speaker was working as the chief of staff to

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Speaker 2: the midst of the defense industry at the time. Now

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Speaker 2: I have discussed that matters with her and the support provided,

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Speaker 2: and she indeed.

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Speaker 1: As the implication was that Brown had been reprimanded last

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Speaker 1: week in court, Linda Reynolds said Scott Morrison had been

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Speaker 1: very sympathetic to her.

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Speaker 4: Scott came in, he'd come straight over from question time.

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Speaker 4: He talked with me He was incredibly compassionate. He was

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Speaker 4: sharing with me just how difficult it was for him

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Speaker 4: being accused of covering up a rape, and how difficult

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Speaker 4: it was for his girls.

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Speaker 1: But Fiona Brown has previously told The Australian Morrison in fact,

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Speaker 1: never had a real conversation with her about the scandal.

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Speaker 1: Brown insists to this day Brittany Higgins never expressly told

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Speaker 1: her I was raped. She took Higgins to the police

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Speaker 1: office in Parliament and when Higgins said she didn't want

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Speaker 1: to pursue a complaint, Brown left it at that. We've

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Speaker 1: used a voice actor to bring you Fiona Brown's words.

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Speaker 1: She's describing Morrison's conduct in February twenty twenty one, by

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Speaker 1: which time Brown was working in Morrison's office.

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Speaker 8: I remember him coming back after question time on that Thursday,

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Speaker 8: and for the first time he said how are you.

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Speaker 8: He has never sat down or even walked by and

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Speaker 8: had a proper discussion with me after the issue exploded.

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Speaker 8: The most discussion I ever had with him was in

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Speaker 8: that moment. That was the extent of it, A two

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Speaker 8: minute conversation, Hi, Fiona, how are you? I said, Oh,

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Speaker 8: it's pretty tough, and I apologized to him. I said,

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Speaker 8: I'm sorry they're using me to get to you. I'm

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Speaker 8: really sorry about that. But she never never told me.

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Speaker 8: And then the only thing he says in relation to

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Speaker 8: this matter ever is we've spoken. That's it. We've spoken,

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Speaker 8: haven't we, and then he walked off.

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Speaker 1: Brown said, when she read what Morrison had said in

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Speaker 1: parliament about her, that was it.

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Speaker 8: I realized at that moment that I was collateral damage.

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Speaker 8: I was devastated. I felt grubby.

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Speaker 1: Thanks for joining us on the front. Keep up with

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Speaker 1: live updates from this trial at the Australian dot Com

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Speaker 1: Dot You