WEBVTT - Who knew the CFMEU's dirty secrets? 0:00:01.280 --> 0:00:10.680 From Schwartz Media. I'm Daniel James. This is seven AM. 0:00:10.960 --> 0:00:15.080 This week nine yewspapers published detailed allegations of widespread corruption, 0:00:15.400 --> 0:00:19.239 criminal infiltration, and a gamut of other nefarious activities within 0:00:19.280 --> 0:00:23.200 the ranks of the CFMAU. Stories of underworld figures trading 0:00:23.239 --> 0:00:26.200 their leather for high viz bucky helmets for hard hats, 0:00:26.520 --> 0:00:28.920 all in order it is alleged to get a slice 0:00:28.960 --> 0:00:33.159 of the biggest pie of all taxpayer funded projects. The 0:00:33.200 --> 0:00:37.279 scandal is set off wave after wave of ramifications. Who knew, what, 0:00:37.440 --> 0:00:39.440 when and when it all means for some of the 0:00:39.520 --> 0:00:44.520 largest infrastructure projects this country has ever seen. Today Martin 0:00:44.560 --> 0:00:47.760 Mackenzie Murray on the fallout from the scandal and its 0:00:47.800 --> 0:01:08.240 potential ramifications. It is Friday, nineteenth of July. Martin Australia's 0:01:08.319 --> 0:01:12.480 highest profile union, the Construction, Forestry and Maritime Employees young 0:01:12.520 --> 0:01:16.120 in to see if MU has been thrust into the spotlight, 0:01:16.280 --> 0:01:19.120 this time against its will, with a range of allegations 0:01:19.160 --> 0:01:23.039 of corruption and other nefarious activities relating to organized crime. 0:01:23.600 --> 0:01:25.319 It's a story almost as big as some of the 0:01:25.360 --> 0:01:26.360 egos involved. 0:01:26.640 --> 0:01:28.640 What's happened so last Friday? 0:01:28.920 --> 0:01:32.959 The head of the Victoria, Tasmania CFMAU branch John Secker 0:01:33.600 --> 0:01:35.520 announced his resignation. 0:01:36.080 --> 0:01:38.600 Well, I'm stepping down as the secretary of this union 0:01:39.840 --> 0:01:42.600 as of tonight. I'm just sick of all the stories. 0:01:42.640 --> 0:01:44.960 I'm sick of all the false allegations, and I'm sure 0:01:44.959 --> 0:01:47.920 the members are too, so Hopefully by me stepping down 0:01:48.000 --> 0:01:51.840 it'll actually stop some of these just malicious and false 0:01:51.840 --> 0:01:53.200 accusations to just keep. 0:01:53.160 --> 0:01:57.080 He was preempting a series of kind of squalid revelations 0:01:57.120 --> 0:01:59.680 revealed by several nine reporters. 0:02:00.120 --> 0:02:03.520 A once proud union that defends the rights of workers 0:02:03.960 --> 0:02:07.360 on the take and in bed with criminals. 0:02:07.520 --> 0:02:08.440 It's rotten to the core. 0:02:08.880 --> 0:02:12.720 You've got standover going on extortion, going on contracts being 0:02:12.760 --> 0:02:14.359 awarded that shouldn't be awarded. 0:02:14.560 --> 0:02:18.000 It involves the kind of intimate infiltration of organized crime, 0:02:18.080 --> 0:02:23.240 especially bikies, into the CFMEU, their use as security and 0:02:23.360 --> 0:02:27.080 shop stewards, something that's caused immense resentment and sometimes fear 0:02:27.200 --> 0:02:32.279 amongst CFMEU officials. A kind of cozy network of kickbacks, 0:02:32.480 --> 0:02:37.720 that is, secret arrangements with builders to favor contracts. And 0:02:37.760 --> 0:02:39.600 I think significance to all of this as well is 0:02:39.639 --> 0:02:44.760 it's implications for the Victorian government and its ambitious big build. 0:02:44.960 --> 0:02:47.280 Take for example, the big build that goes on here 0:02:47.520 --> 0:02:51.120 in Victoria. They're going to do some building or construction somewhere. 0:02:51.440 --> 0:02:54.400 Contract will go out, the usual people will apply, there 0:02:54.400 --> 0:02:57.920 will be pressure from within the other companies won't get 0:02:57.960 --> 0:02:59.720 a look in. You've got to be with the CFMAU. 0:03:00.080 --> 0:03:02.640 And then there's John Saka's personal behavior as well. 0:03:03.160 --> 0:03:04.720 What message was that sending. 0:03:05.320 --> 0:03:07.920 Well, I think the message is quite clear, and that 0:03:08.200 --> 0:03:09.840 was you speak out against us. 0:03:10.160 --> 0:03:12.600 We know where you are and we can get to you. 0:03:12.760 --> 0:03:13.919 We know where you live. Now. 0:03:14.160 --> 0:03:16.160 Saker is a man who for a long time has 0:03:16.200 --> 0:03:21.000 denied so I mean countless allegations of his own capacity 0:03:21.040 --> 0:03:26.120 for thuggery and vindictiveness. And even amongst those inside the 0:03:26.240 --> 0:03:30.079 union who knew what was coming, I knew how severe 0:03:30.480 --> 0:03:34.000 the allegations were that would be raised. We're still surprised 0:03:34.040 --> 0:03:38.840 at Sakka's resignation, so accustomed were they to his pugnacity, 0:03:38.880 --> 0:03:42.839 his stubbornness, his ability to survive any number of scandals. 0:03:43.320 --> 0:03:46.760 So, as you said, in one of these allegations, the 0:03:46.800 --> 0:03:52.280 once immovable John Seca resigned effectively immediately. What other for 0:03:52.480 --> 0:03:53.400 that has there been. 0:03:53.760 --> 0:03:58.160 It's been considerable to say, to say the least. Where 0:03:58.200 --> 0:03:58.640 to begin. 0:04:00.240 --> 0:04:05.600 Interestingly, the CFMU is National Secretary Zack Smith. He became very, 0:04:05.880 --> 0:04:11.720 very anxious and wanted to preempt any federal intervention. He 0:04:11.800 --> 0:04:15.160 does this by coming out earlier this week and saying 0:04:15.160 --> 0:04:18.760 that the national branch would assume administrative control of the 0:04:18.800 --> 0:04:22.000 Victorian branch, and he goes on a media blitz. 0:04:22.360 --> 0:04:25.320 Zack Smith is the National Secretary of the cfimyun our 0:04:25.400 --> 0:04:26.880 guest sax Smith, Welcome. 0:04:26.720 --> 0:04:29.240 Good morning, Patricia Tony. Now this was kind of this 0:04:29.360 --> 0:04:30.839 desperate hal Mary Pass. 0:04:30.920 --> 0:04:35.400 I think to preempt whatever federal intervention might occur, including 0:04:35.400 --> 0:04:39.720 the nuclear option of total deregistration of the Union. And 0:04:40.120 --> 0:04:44.919 what transpires is zax Smith effectively humiliating himself attempting to 0:04:44.960 --> 0:04:47.400 hold two irreconcilable positions. 0:04:48.279 --> 0:04:51.159 So one is that the allegations. 0:04:50.560 --> 0:04:54.599 Are so severe, the degradation of the Union so great, 0:04:54.960 --> 0:04:58.080 that it requires this dramatic intervention of the national branch 0:04:58.080 --> 0:04:59.599 assuming administrative control. 0:05:00.200 --> 0:05:03.320 Well, as part of this administration, I'm in the process 0:05:03.320 --> 0:05:07.640 of standing up an investigative process to investigate any allegations, 0:05:07.680 --> 0:05:11.400 to test them, and obviously if there's any wrongdoing found, 0:05:11.760 --> 0:05:14.800 people will be removed from our ranks. 0:05:14.800 --> 0:05:18.680 On the same hand, in the same breath, Zach Smith 0:05:19.160 --> 0:05:23.440 celebrates John Sacker and says his legacy will be an 0:05:23.480 --> 0:05:28.000 admirable one. He proposes John Sacker as a working class hero, 0:05:28.560 --> 0:05:33.880 and unsurprisingly, the journalists there was a particularly humiliating interview 0:05:33.880 --> 0:05:35.600 on the Today Show with Karl Stefanovic. 0:05:36.279 --> 0:05:39.239 They ridicule him the appropriate action. So essentially, you're taking 0:05:39.279 --> 0:05:41.239 the I know nothing of defense. 0:05:41.839 --> 0:05:47.000 Well, well, Carl, that's not an accurate reflection. No, wait 0:05:47.040 --> 0:05:49.240 a second, let's be very clear on this, right, you're 0:05:49.240 --> 0:05:50.360 putting words into my mouth. 0:05:50.360 --> 0:05:53.599 And now the other kind of transparent absurdity here is 0:05:53.640 --> 0:05:58.400 that he asserts that the union itself can investigate itself. 0:05:58.760 --> 0:06:01.880 How in any reasonable world can you be trusted in 0:06:01.920 --> 0:06:05.400 any credible way to conduct your own inquiry into your 0:06:05.400 --> 0:06:07.200 own union's alleged corruption. 0:06:07.680 --> 0:06:11.719 Well, like I said, this investigation will have independence, This 0:06:11.800 --> 0:06:16.719 investigation will draw out, drawing outside expertise and legal advice 0:06:17.400 --> 0:06:19.840 and outside scrutiny to get to the bottom of any 0:06:19.839 --> 0:06:20.920 alligation independent. 0:06:20.960 --> 0:06:24.359 Also, now this is laughed at. It's laughed at, in 0:06:24.360 --> 0:06:25.480 fact by the federal government. 0:06:25.600 --> 0:06:29.760 Tony Burke, the Employment Minister and Workplace Relations Minister begins 0:06:29.800 --> 0:06:34.560 the process of appointing an independent administrator. What's more, he 0:06:34.680 --> 0:06:38.400 asks the Australian Federal Police to investigate the union. 0:06:39.560 --> 0:06:42.200 The General Manager of the Fairwork Commission is the best 0:06:42.279 --> 0:06:48.440 person placed to take this action. The action does have 0:06:48.720 --> 0:06:52.240 a series of complexities under the Fair Work Act, a 0:06:52.240 --> 0:06:56.080 series of various conditions that the General Manager is currently 0:06:56.120 --> 0:06:58.040 taking advice on elsewhere. 0:06:58.200 --> 0:07:04.560 The new South Wales Premier and Victorian Premiere disavow the CFMAU. 0:07:04.760 --> 0:07:07.440 They say that they will not be accepting any donations 0:07:07.480 --> 0:07:12.800 from them. Victoria Police says it's undertaking several investigations, including 0:07:12.840 --> 0:07:17.000 one into Derek Christopher, who was a sort of protege 0:07:17.080 --> 0:07:20.120 of John Seckers and his presumptive successor. 0:07:20.920 --> 0:07:24.280 So the fall it has been far and wide. What 0:07:24.360 --> 0:07:26.520 about the union itself. If you've been speaking to people 0:07:26.600 --> 0:07:29.080 within the union, what's been their reaction. 0:07:29.680 --> 0:07:32.000 There's a pretty I mean, for some weeks now, I've 0:07:32.000 --> 0:07:36.760 been speaking with a considerable number of union officials and members, 0:07:36.800 --> 0:07:41.160 both current and former. There's been a consistent theme that 0:07:41.480 --> 0:07:46.840 their emotions are intensely conflicted. They have gratitude for the 0:07:46.920 --> 0:07:50.680 journalists who have done this great reporting. There's some relief 0:07:51.080 --> 0:07:56.440 that this extreme and dramatic public exposure has happened. There's 0:07:56.480 --> 0:08:02.160 some fear from whistleblowers of vengeance, of revenge. There's also 0:08:02.240 --> 0:08:05.320 great kind of shame and sadness at the degradation of 0:08:05.400 --> 0:08:05.960 their union. 0:08:06.800 --> 0:08:08.360 And there's also a lot of exhaustion. 0:08:08.440 --> 0:08:11.720 I mean it, really, I don't think I can overstate this, 0:08:11.880 --> 0:08:15.480 that the intensity of conflicted emotions that members are feeling 0:08:15.520 --> 0:08:18.720 now is really considerable, as well as the uncertainty about 0:08:18.760 --> 0:08:22.880 kind of what comes next and how reform might occur, 0:08:23.280 --> 0:08:29.880 if at all. But there's also this bitter incredulity that 0:08:29.960 --> 0:08:32.800 it has taken journalists and not any number of law 0:08:32.920 --> 0:08:36.920 enforcement agencies or governments or statutory. 0:08:36.280 --> 0:08:37.600 Bodies to do this. 0:08:38.840 --> 0:08:46.120 The reporting has been immense, necessary, impressive, but the dubiousness 0:08:46.120 --> 0:08:50.280 of the CFMEU, the funk of corruption, the infiltration of 0:08:50.400 --> 0:08:54.920 organized crime, is one of Victoria's worst kept secrets. 0:08:57.200 --> 0:09:00.240 After the break the title links between the cme you 0:09:00.320 --> 0:09:04.000 and the Victorian labor government. How close is too close? 0:09:14.760 --> 0:09:17.600 At the heart of a lot of this activity in Victoria, 0:09:17.679 --> 0:09:23.640 in particular Marty, has been the activity around what Victoria 0:09:23.760 --> 0:09:26.200 calls the Big build what is the big build, what 0:09:26.240 --> 0:09:29.720 are the projects involved? And how is the CFMU inserted 0:09:29.760 --> 0:09:33.079 itself as a player in these massive projects. 0:09:33.600 --> 0:09:41.760 The Victorian Labor government's signature was this greatly ambitious infrastructure project, roads, tunnels, 0:09:42.160 --> 0:09:47.360 round networks and the CFMU is formally affiliated with the 0:09:47.440 --> 0:09:51.320 Labor Party. It comprises a part of the Labour's left faction. 0:09:52.440 --> 0:09:56.280 As such, it has an influence in preselections, it can 0:09:56.360 --> 0:10:00.760 influence policy. It's also a substantial donor to the Labor Party. 0:10:01.120 --> 0:10:04.320 In fact, in twenty twenty two, the CFMU was the 0:10:04.440 --> 0:10:08.240 largest donor to Daniel Andrew's reelection campaign. In the same year, 0:10:08.280 --> 0:10:11.040 it donated about a million dollars to the Federal Labor Party. 0:10:12.120 --> 0:10:14.640 In August last year, there is the funeral for John 0:10:14.679 --> 0:10:18.760 Seka's father, who himself was a construction worker. The Underworld 0:10:18.760 --> 0:10:21.679 figure Mick Gaddo, whose SECA often used as a kind 0:10:21.679 --> 0:10:27.240 of fixer or negotiator, publicly expresses his condolences to setcam Now. 0:10:27.280 --> 0:10:30.760 On the other end of the spectrum of authority in Victoria, 0:10:31.480 --> 0:10:35.760 just center Alan, the Premier before becoming Premier, was infrastructure Minister. 0:10:36.360 --> 0:10:40.640 She's married to a former CFMEU union boss. Pays her 0:10:40.720 --> 0:10:44.160 fealty and attends the funeral. So I think in just 0:10:44.200 --> 0:10:48.120 that one day, this funeral, you have this neat demonstration 0:10:48.200 --> 0:10:52.960 of Setka's influence. But the Victorian Labor Government's not wanted 0:10:53.559 --> 0:10:58.080 the cfmeu's obstruction. It has not wanted its ambitions thwarted 0:10:58.120 --> 0:11:02.559 by industrial action, and as a result, the Labor Party 0:11:02.559 --> 0:11:04.240 has kind of turned a blind eye. 0:11:04.480 --> 0:11:07.880 I have zero tolerance for this sort of behavior. I've 0:11:07.920 --> 0:11:12.680 asked the Labor Party's National Executive to move to immediately 0:11:12.720 --> 0:11:17.319 suspend the construction division from the Victorian Labor Party. 0:11:17.840 --> 0:11:21.600 There's this kind of familiar pattern that occurs following public 0:11:21.640 --> 0:11:28.360 scandal and its politicians express fox shock and condemnation and surprise. 0:11:29.600 --> 0:11:33.800 But the possibility of deniability is utterly, utterly implausible. 0:11:34.520 --> 0:11:37.440 Politically, of course, this is manner from heaven for the 0:11:37.480 --> 0:11:42.400 federal opposition, in particular, how are they capitalizing the Labour's 0:11:42.440 --> 0:11:45.800 close historical ties to the CFMAU and what are they 0:11:45.880 --> 0:11:47.680 saying about how this looks for Labor. 0:11:48.280 --> 0:11:53.360 Yeah, there's unsurprisingly an amount of political theater at the moment. 0:11:53.960 --> 0:11:54.480 That's sad. 0:11:54.520 --> 0:11:59.840 The Opposition have very substantial legitimate criticism of the Labor Party. 0:12:00.520 --> 0:12:05.320 The Labor Party's affinity with the CFMU is well established. 0:12:06.559 --> 0:12:09.280 The bit of political theater that is a little frustrating 0:12:09.880 --> 0:12:12.719 is the status of the ABCC, the Australian Building and 0:12:12.840 --> 0:12:19.480 Construction Commission, which the Albanese government dissolved last year, and 0:12:19.520 --> 0:12:21.520 it was conceived as a kind of watchdog of the 0:12:21.559 --> 0:12:25.600 construction industry. Now the Liberal Party at the moment are 0:12:25.640 --> 0:12:29.920 saying that the dissolution of the ABCC is proof of 0:12:30.040 --> 0:12:34.760 Labour's indifference to corruption in the industry. The problem with 0:12:34.800 --> 0:12:38.640 that argument is that the ABCC did exist for a 0:12:38.720 --> 0:12:42.480 number of years during John Setka's twelve year reign, so 0:12:42.760 --> 0:12:45.320 I'm not quite sure what the ABCC was for, if 0:12:45.360 --> 0:12:48.600 not to investigate the allegations that have been added by 0:12:48.679 --> 0:12:50.560 nine in the past week. 0:12:51.000 --> 0:12:55.280 Again, it goes to the incredulity around how it took 0:12:55.320 --> 0:12:59.880 the Fourth of State to air these allegations. The work 0:13:00.000 --> 0:13:02.720 Place Relations Minister Tony Burkers said that there will be 0:13:02.720 --> 0:13:06.480 an independent investigation. How much confidence do you have in 0:13:06.520 --> 0:13:10.280 the integrity of that investigation and as chances of finding 0:13:10.360 --> 0:13:11.080 any wrongdoing? 0:13:11.679 --> 0:13:13.640 I think we might have some confidence now. And the 0:13:13.679 --> 0:13:16.079 reason I say that is a certain threshold has been 0:13:16.080 --> 0:13:19.680 crossed now, So I think there's been plausible deniability for 0:13:19.720 --> 0:13:24.280 a long time. There's been years of willful ignorance, but 0:13:24.440 --> 0:13:28.120 courtesy of the great reporting of the nine reporters, a 0:13:28.200 --> 0:13:31.800 public threshold has now been crossed, and I think coming 0:13:31.880 --> 0:13:38.280 with that is a public expectation of substantial intervention. So 0:13:38.360 --> 0:13:41.920 the independent administrator will be appointed, the Fair Work Commission 0:13:41.960 --> 0:13:47.360 will make an application to a court for that. There's 0:13:47.440 --> 0:13:50.960 certain kind of formal disavowals now from the Labor Party 0:13:51.280 --> 0:13:54.400 about the CFMU. So look, in short, I think we 0:13:54.440 --> 0:13:58.320 can have some confidence, but to reflect again the frustrated 0:13:58.360 --> 0:14:03.080 members who internally have been attempting to fight corrupt forces 0:14:03.120 --> 0:14:07.120 within their union. It shouldn't have taken this long, and 0:14:07.160 --> 0:14:09.880 it shouldn't have been wholly dependent upon journalists. 0:14:10.520 --> 0:14:12.800 And so Marty, finally, what does this all mean for 0:14:12.840 --> 0:14:16.640 the future of the CFMEU itself and its workers. Do 0:14:16.679 --> 0:14:19.040 you think it will survive? And what are the ramifications 0:14:19.080 --> 0:14:21.800 for the building industry in particular if it doesn't. 0:14:22.400 --> 0:14:25.760 Well, Tony Bok has now ruled out dear registration, which 0:14:25.800 --> 0:14:29.400 is a great relief to many. But as I said before, 0:14:29.440 --> 0:14:33.800 I've been having lengthy conversations with a large number of officials, 0:14:34.640 --> 0:14:38.600 and I often ask them about reform, what it might 0:14:38.680 --> 0:14:43.160 look like, how likely it might be, and there's great 0:14:43.280 --> 0:14:46.720 uncertainty about that. There's a mix of optimism and pessimism. 0:14:47.360 --> 0:14:51.000 This is a union, certainly in Victoria, that has been 0:14:51.040 --> 0:14:56.040 assiduously stacked with loyalists. So if you remove them, you're 0:14:56.080 --> 0:15:01.880 removing most people. There's also great fear of retribution. There's 0:15:01.880 --> 0:15:07.120 some pretty serious people involved in these allegations, and so 0:15:07.240 --> 0:15:13.200 that kind of fear helps retard reform. Some union officials say, 0:15:14.280 --> 0:15:17.960 so there's enormous uncertainty at the moment. I'll tell you 0:15:18.000 --> 0:15:19.880 what one official told me yesterday. 0:15:19.880 --> 0:15:24.000 It's that it's at best two or three years away. 0:15:25.240 --> 0:15:28.360 That is the proper reformation of this union, such as 0:15:28.400 --> 0:15:29.720 its degradation at the moment. 0:15:32.160 --> 0:15:34.120 Martin, thank you for your time. Thank you. 0:15:46.560 --> 0:15:50.440 Also in the use today, Foreign Affairs Minister Penny Wongs 0:15:50.560 --> 0:15:54.680 is Israel's operation in Gaza quote must stop after some 0:15:54.720 --> 0:15:58.320 of the fierce bombardments in months have killed hundreds of civilians. 0:15:58.760 --> 0:16:01.320 In a series of posts to w X, Wong reiterated 0:16:01.360 --> 0:16:05.400 Australia support for an immediate cease fire and condemned operations, 0:16:05.440 --> 0:16:10.160 including many near schools. UNRWA says that seventy percent of 0:16:10.160 --> 0:16:12.480 his schools have been bombed, with around ninety five percent 0:16:12.480 --> 0:16:15.480 of those being used as displacement shelters at the time 0:16:15.520 --> 0:16:19.120 of their attack, and the nervous JD Vance took the 0:16:19.160 --> 0:16:22.320 stage the Republican National Convention for the first time as 0:16:22.360 --> 0:16:24.680 Donald Trump's running mate, in front of a crowd of 0:16:24.680 --> 0:16:28.560 supporters sporting ear bandages in a tribute to Trump. It 0:16:28.680 --> 0:16:31.760 comes as President Joe Biden test positive for COVID a 0:16:31.760 --> 0:16:35.040 mid reports from both New York Times and CNN that 0:16:35.080 --> 0:16:37.320 he has become more receptive to calls to drop out 0:16:37.320 --> 0:16:40.960 of the race. Seven Am is a daily show from 0:16:41.000 --> 0:16:44.120 Schwartz Media and The Saturday Paper. He is produced by 0:16:44.200 --> 0:16:49.359 Kara Jensen, McKinnon, Shane Anderson, Zolton, Fecho and Zia and Tangarral. 0:16:49.920 --> 0:16:53.000 A senior producer is quest Endgate. A technical producer is 0:16:53.000 --> 0:16:56.640 Atticus Bastow. Sarah mcvee is a head of audio. Eric 0:16:56.720 --> 0:17:00.000 Jensen is an editor in chief. Mixing by Travis Evans, 0:17:00.240 --> 0:17:04.080 Adigas Basto and Saltan Veccio. Our theme music is by 0:17:04.119 --> 0:17:08.760 Ned Beckley and Josh Hogan of Envelope Bordeo. I'm Daniel James. 0:17:08.920 --> 0:17:15.560 This is seven AM. See you next week.