Speaker 1: Oh, TIF called Craig Harper, It's oh fuck, everyone knows
Speaker 1: what it is TIV.
Speaker 2: Hello, Happy Friday.
Speaker 1: I should probably be more enthusias I am enthusiastic, but
Speaker 1: I sometimes think I probably don't need to introduce the
Speaker 1: show anymore. I probably don't need to say who you are,
Speaker 1: who I am, what the show is called. Probably seven
Speaker 1: years later people know, and even the new is people.
Speaker 2: Might stumble in and go, what's this.
Speaker 1: Well they've seen that they've clicked on. Yeah, maybe maybe
Speaker 1: how are you good?
Speaker 3: Well, look, I'm good, but I've got a saw back
Speaker 3: so and it's really twingey today.
Speaker 2: So it's you know, when you got a saw back
Speaker 2: and it's shit?
Speaker 1: Yeah, where about shrawbacks? I don't think. I don't think
Speaker 1: people are now. These are first of all problems and
Speaker 1: man problems. I know, nothing compares to giving birth, and
Speaker 1: I guess at that, and but you know, pain is pain,
Speaker 1: but really bad back pain, like really acute, like fuck,
Speaker 1: I've had that few times in my life, to the
Speaker 1: point where I'm crying and I'm a grown ass man.
Speaker 1: I'm not crying balling, but there's literally tears coming out
Speaker 1: of my face because every time I move, like it's
Speaker 1: so acute, But what's going on with you?
Speaker 3: Well, I've bent over the other day to shift a
Speaker 3: weight for a client, not even heavy, just in an
Speaker 3: awkward dist position and just and it was this feeling
Speaker 3: that was like I been waiting.
Speaker 2: I've been waiting for the moment, and this is it.
Speaker 2: If here you go.
Speaker 3: And it's been so so I went to my Cairo
Speaker 3: today and it's good. It's like there's nothing like, everything's good.
Speaker 3: The system is just protecting you and now you've just
Speaker 3: got to just got to chill out, which you know
Speaker 3: I'm good at that.
Speaker 2: I'm good at that.
Speaker 3: That was so you know, I've changed my training a bit, right,
Speaker 3: I've backed it off. I'm trying to find and what's
Speaker 3: now new, the new appropriate? And I go to him
Speaker 3: and his first thing is, well, sometimes you just got
Speaker 3: arrest iff, And I'm like, Christian, I am, I am
Speaker 3: resting because and because I'm getting all defensive because I'm like,
Speaker 3: you don't understand how little I trained now compared to
Speaker 3: what I was. It's a big change. But as I
Speaker 3: was defending myself in my mind, I was like, so
Speaker 3: what did you do last week? So if you decided
Speaker 3: to do some hit training again, and in your first
Speaker 3: work out of that there was one hundred and fifty
Speaker 3: plometric box jumps that you did, and you did that
Speaker 3: same workout three more times over the next week and
Speaker 3: a bit. He also did some ninety kilo deadlifts, all
Speaker 3: things which weren't in high rotation in your previous training.
Speaker 3: So take your I am Christian and stick it up
Speaker 3: your balm.
Speaker 1: You're lying, Yes, it's not like you to be irrational
Speaker 1: or emotional at all, so I'm okay, I'm astounded, And
Speaker 1: also that you would be defensive about anything it again.
Speaker 3: So it's not until you hear your own voice stating
Speaker 3: your case that you realize you're bullshitting.
Speaker 1: Well, it's like before we were it's now one thirty eight.
Speaker 1: We were meant nine forty. We were meant to record
Speaker 1: at one thirty and I'm in there. I was in
Speaker 1: the zoom room and I'm like, where the fuck is Tiff?
Speaker 1: I was in at one twenty seven, and at one
Speaker 1: thirty three I sent you quite a self righteous message
Speaker 1: going are you coming? Like are you are you joining
Speaker 1: me today? And then you sent me one at the
Speaker 1: same time, which was pretty much where the fuck are you?
Speaker 1: And then mister self righteousness may or may not have
Speaker 1: been in the wrong zoom room, and I wanted to
Speaker 1: be mad at you. Not really, I didn't really everyone,
Speaker 1: but I wanted to blame you. And then as I
Speaker 1: was undoing that, I kind of went, yeah, I think
Speaker 1: I clicked on the wrong thing, so that'd be me,
Speaker 1: but I understand it not you. Not wanting it to
Speaker 1: be your fault, because the beauty of that when it's not,
Speaker 1: you know, when shit's happening to me and it's not
Speaker 1: my fault, well then I don't have to take responsibility,
Speaker 1: and I'm very good at that.
Speaker 3: Well, it also felt like I have really backed things
Speaker 3: off and made some you know, and I wanted to
Speaker 3: acknowledge that to myself, and I didn't want to admit
Speaker 3: that in the doing of that, I'm still I still
Speaker 3: haven't got it right.
Speaker 2: And so it's like it feels.
Speaker 3: Like admitting that I'm the problem, which I obviously am.
Speaker 3: I also can't acknowledge that I have done some really
Speaker 3: smart things with my training and movement.
Speaker 1: Yeah, of course, of course. Well I mean apart from
Speaker 1: you know, and if every now and then you have
Speaker 1: a bit of a back injury, which is somewhat debilitating,
Speaker 1: not massively debilitating. Well, in the overall scheme of things,
Speaker 1: you're going pretty good, you know, right, I was going
Speaker 1: to say you're forty two, but we all know you're
Speaker 1: not forty two?
Speaker 2: Almost though, Huh.
Speaker 1: When's I now? I've asked her, when's the day again?
Speaker 2: Best of May?
Speaker 1: Wow, it's not far away. I'm not going to ask
Speaker 1: ever again May one. Well, I had been wondering whether
Speaker 1: or not I'd offended you because I have not seen
Speaker 1: you at the gym. It feels like a month, but
Speaker 1: it's probably a few weeks. So what have you been doing? Like,
Speaker 1: what have you changed? Because I actually want to talk
Speaker 1: to you about something today which is fucking fascinating and
Speaker 1: it's about the mind and it's about the body, and
Speaker 1: it's about training, and it's about drugs and it's a
Speaker 1: story so interesting. But what have you changed with your
Speaker 1: training and why? Well?
Speaker 3: I've changed well, because you know, I've struggled a lot
Speaker 3: over the last at least twelve months with recovery and
Speaker 3: training intensity and getting that right and fatigue and watch,
Speaker 3: you know, is this burnout?
Speaker 2: Is it perimenopause? Is it?
Speaker 1: Like?
Speaker 3: What's going on? Why am I not able to do
Speaker 3: what I could do before. And I guess just like
Speaker 3: I came back from Tazzy and the little bit of
Speaker 3: disruption with my gym closing for a few weeks meant
Speaker 3: that I had a bit of a change in things.
Speaker 3: So I decided to take some days off. So I've
Speaker 3: changed the structure of how I work, which.
Speaker 2: Is very long overdue and very grown up of me,
Speaker 2: but also.
Speaker 3: Signed up for a course, so changing the way that
Speaker 3: I work, so rather than doing everything every day, I'm
Speaker 3: trying to add structure but still keep the level of
Speaker 3: variety that I need in order to be tiff and
Speaker 3: b bit so spontaneous and not get bored. And then
Speaker 3: trying to structure what does tif's training look like now
Speaker 3: that it's different. Before it was doing something every day
Speaker 3: and I'd slott it in and be all over the
Speaker 3: place and it'd be a bit of boxing, a bit
Speaker 3: of everything, and it's like, Okay, what does my body
Speaker 3: need because I can't do that because that is burning
Speaker 3: me out. So I feel best were some high intensity training.
Speaker 3: I'm trying to reintroduce that there was a period, a
Speaker 3: little period of time where that just my body felt
Speaker 3: a level of disdain at the thought or the action
Speaker 3: of doing that.
Speaker 2: I'd want to do it.
Speaker 3: Then I'd start training and be like, I hate this.
Speaker 3: My body hates me right now. So a little bit
Speaker 3: of running in the interim and running, bit of strength
Speaker 3: and now just trying to figure out, well, if I
Speaker 3: do do HIT training doesn't have been our how long
Speaker 3: does my body want to do it? And then how
Speaker 3: much recovery do I need in order to feel great
Speaker 3: doing it because I missed Doing it makes me feel great,
Speaker 3: but I have to get the timing and intensity right.
Speaker 3: And one hundred and fifty box jumps in a session
Speaker 3: three times that week probably has come out as not
Speaker 3: being the greatest plan.
Speaker 1: Wow, who would have thought. Maybe you could have rung
Speaker 1: your friend the scientist and said, I'm thinking of going
Speaker 1: from zero zero box jumps to one hundred and fifty times.
Speaker 1: Haven't finished. Sorry we're talking while you're interrupting, right, Sorry,
Speaker 1: But you might have wrung me and said this is
Speaker 1: my plan. What do you think of my plan? And
Speaker 1: I would have gone, oh, hang on, let me think. No. No.
Speaker 1: On the outside that was used to own a jym
Speaker 1: and is a trainer and was a kind of a
Speaker 1: professional athlete. How does that girl make that decision.
Speaker 3: Because she has one set of rules for her clients,
Speaker 3: and what set of rules for her?
Speaker 1: Now, just quickly, for the thirty percent of our listeners
Speaker 1: who are going, what is HIT training? Could you just
Speaker 1: give an example of what HIT training is for our
Speaker 1: listeners who are thinking what is she? Well, if it's
Speaker 1: not running, and it's not bike and it's not lifting weights,
Speaker 1: what the fuck is it?
Speaker 3: High intensity interval training? So I was training hard for
Speaker 3: a burst of time and then recovering in between. When
Speaker 3: I say HIT training, for me, I like to do
Speaker 3: it in the form of things like kettle bells or plyometrics,
Speaker 3: jumps and things that are quite intense and explosive. But
Speaker 3: it can be. I mean, you can do HIT training
Speaker 3: with running. It's just sprint training. So it's just training
Speaker 3: at a high intensity resting in between.
Speaker 1: Yeah, interval based stuff. And so when you're back, was
Speaker 1: that its worst? How is it right now in this moment?
Speaker 1: Is it at its worst now? Or is it a
Speaker 1: bit better?
Speaker 3: I'd say it's kind of it's tinkering on it's worst
Speaker 3: still now it's gone ebbed and flowed a bit, but
Speaker 3: it's just a real you know when you get that
Speaker 3: sharp pain and it's kind of like right now, it's
Speaker 3: just there consistently. And I'm supposed to meet a friend's
Speaker 3: turning fortieth heavy birthday, Tarran.
Speaker 2: She's turning fortieth this week.
Speaker 1: But.
Speaker 3: I'm supposed to meet her tomorrow on the motorbike in
Speaker 3: back Marsh. We're going to ride to Bendigo to her play.
Speaker 3: That was all planned and I'm like, I can't. I'm
Speaker 3: not like, I can't be getting on a bike, especially
Speaker 3: not for that much time.
Speaker 1: No, that is not it. You know. It's a friend
Speaker 1: of mine. His name's Mark. He listens to this sometimes,
Speaker 1: not the Crab. Also. Mark is a friend of the
Speaker 1: Crab and mine. But he's a trade and he does
Speaker 1: stuff for me. He's amazing. Anyway, the other day he
Speaker 1: was driving his ute, his big ute with his big trailer,
Speaker 1: and someone ran up the ass of his trailer, which
Speaker 1: then smashed into his ute, like totaled his trailer. They're
Speaker 1: not sure about whether or not the ute's going to
Speaker 1: be a ride off. Anyway, I just went from one
Speaker 1: of my thirty two walks a week that I do
Speaker 1: just before this, and I bumped into him and I'd
Speaker 1: heard about the stack, but I hadn't spoken to him.
Speaker 1: He's just working eight hundred meters from my house and
Speaker 1: I'm like, should you be working? He's like, oh yeah,
Speaker 1: I if I move, I'm all right. If I sitting's
Speaker 1: no good. I'm like, okay, what did you do? You know,
Speaker 1: you know blokes that are like blokey blokes. He's a
Speaker 1: blokey bloke, bloke bloke right. I'm like, all right, well
Speaker 1: what did you do? And then he described in some detail.
Speaker 1: And then I was just looking at his body and
Speaker 1: I looked at one forearm and it's twice as big
Speaker 1: as the other forearm, and so I kind of grabbed
Speaker 1: it gently to kind of you know what they call
Speaker 1: pal pate it, which is touch it. And I'm like,
Speaker 1: I touched it. And I'm like, does this herd here
Speaker 1: in Nelly fucking fell down? I'm like, I think you've
Speaker 1: got a broken arm. I go, what did you do
Speaker 1: to this? And he's like and he described what he did,
Speaker 1: and I go, so, you know this forearm is twice
Speaker 1: as big as that forum? Yeah, yeah, I go, how
Speaker 1: sore is? It's like very I go have your hat
Speaker 1: at X ray. He's like, no, should I I'm like,
Speaker 1: I think, so, I'm not a doctor, but that looks
Speaker 1: broken as fuck to me. And then I'm like, what
Speaker 1: about here? Ribs, back, shoulder. I'm like, dude, please like
Speaker 1: and he's working, he's on the tools. He's like, I'm
Speaker 1: all right if I keep moving. Yeah, you're not You're not. No.
Speaker 1: So what's it like when you get out of bed?
Speaker 1: He goes, yeah, no good? I go what happens? He goes,
Speaker 1: it's pretty hard to get out of bed, and then
Speaker 1: it's pretty hard to stand up. I'm like, oh, well,
Speaker 1: of course you'd be at work wielding tools and doing
Speaker 1: a heavy, heavy physical jop so I know. Oh no,
Speaker 1: it's like the opposite end of the you know, like,
Speaker 1: what do they say a self care day? He's doing
Speaker 1: like a self destruction day. I'm like, dude, and I
Speaker 1: said to him, did so he saw the doctor? But
Speaker 1: I don't know, maybe he didn't. I don't know who
Speaker 1: he saw. But they didn't do any tests or X rays,
Speaker 1: and they gave him a bunch of pankiller. I'm like, so,
Speaker 1: what are you taking as Oh? Nothing, I'm like, okay, well,
Speaker 1: maybe like if the doctor gave you something, firstly, go
Speaker 1: back see the doctor again and show them your big
Speaker 1: fucking fat arm. Ah. So I'm on the side of
Speaker 1: the street in Hampton holding this bloke's arm and just
Speaker 1: poking bits of his body randomly. It would have looked interesting,
Speaker 1: trying to trying to, you know, not really but diagnose
Speaker 1: what the fuck is going on. I would not be
Speaker 1: surprised if he's got multiple fractures, like his back is
Speaker 1: really saw his shoulders fucked his elbow. His elbow could
Speaker 1: be broken as well. It's like there's I'm like, yeah,
Speaker 1: it's good to be tough, but it's also good to
Speaker 1: be you know, smart the hell speaking of training, I
Speaker 1: want to share this with you, right, So I love
Speaker 1: this Now full disclosure, everybody, Obviously, this is not what
Speaker 1: I'm about to read as written by me. It's an
Speaker 1: article that was written quite a while ago by James Clear.
Speaker 1: You know who he is, Tim, Yeah so the article.
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, yeah, So you can look it up. It's
Speaker 1: interesting to read. And what I love about this is
Speaker 1: it just reinforces. It just reinforces how fucking amazing humans
Speaker 1: are when we can get out of our own way. Now,
Speaker 1: I don't want to give you any more than that,
Speaker 1: because you're figured out as we go. So I'm just
Speaker 1: straight up reading. This is called what Happens when you
Speaker 1: Believe You're taking Steroids by James Clear. If you google that,
Speaker 1: it'll come up. Fifteen athletes were scattered around the room.
Speaker 1: Everyone was looking at Gideon Ariel. Now, Gideon Ariel is
Speaker 1: the guy who did the original research on this, is
Speaker 1: a PhD researcher. You can go and find the original paper,
Speaker 1: which I also did, but I thought i'd read this
Speaker 1: article because it's much more user friendly. So he's the
Speaker 1: lead researcher, and he also did it with I think
Speaker 1: he did the research with one of his PhD students
Speaker 1: or you know, graduate students. Anyway, So fifteen athletes were
Speaker 1: scattered around a room. Everyone was looking at Gideon Ariel.
Speaker 1: We're going to give you steroids, he told them. It
Speaker 1: was nineteen seventy two, an Ariel was conducting a study
Speaker 1: on athletic performance with his research partner, there you go,
Speaker 1: William Saville. On this particular day, the two men were
Speaker 1: offering the athletes an interesting proposition. Now I can give
Speaker 1: you a bit more context because I know the background.
Speaker 1: So they weren't necessarily athletes per se, but they were
Speaker 1: people who trained regularly, and I think they all had
Speaker 1: a minimum of two years training before this research was done.
Speaker 1: It's about strength training, and so they all had a
Speaker 1: fair level of strength, a fair level of conditioning. There
Speaker 1: were no absolute novices or beginners, so you could say,
Speaker 1: for the most part, they were experienced weight trainers. Now,
Speaker 1: with that in mind, somebody who's already training a lot
Speaker 1: that are about to go into a study where they're
Speaker 1: going to do the same lifts they've been doing for
Speaker 1: the last two to ten years, you wouldn't expect a
Speaker 1: lot of gains to happen because they're already doing all
Speaker 1: that stuff anyway. It's not like anything new is being introduced.
Speaker 1: So that's the background. So on this day, the two
Speaker 1: men were offering the athletes an interesting proposition. Ariel explain
Speaker 1: that the study would last for eleven weeks. The athletes
Speaker 1: would lift weights for the first seven weeks, and those
Speaker 1: who made the most improvement during that the seven week
Speaker 1: period they would be rewarded with dianabol, which is an
Speaker 1: anabolic steroid, for the final four weeks of training. So
Speaker 1: the gist of it is, all these dudes got together,
Speaker 1: they were going to train for seven weeks, and whoever
Speaker 1: improved got the best improvements, the greatest adaptation, the biggest
Speaker 1: numbers over the seven weeks. They would then be put
Speaker 1: on an anabolic steroid for the final four weeks, all
Speaker 1: under control conditions, all done with ethical approval from the
Speaker 1: research from the the research lab in the university. So
Speaker 1: all tikety boot, all scientific, right. What the athletes didn't
Speaker 1: know was that the researchers were lying to them. After
Speaker 1: the initial seven week training period, the scientists randomly subject
Speaker 1: selected six athletes as the winners. However, despite being told
Speaker 1: that they were getting real steroids, the athletes actually received
Speaker 1: placebo pills. What happened next surprised everyone. Four weeks later,
Speaker 1: when the researchers conducted the final testing, the athletes set
Speaker 1: all time personal records in every exercise test. And so
Speaker 1: this is all the tests and all the athletes. Now
Speaker 1: what I'm about to give you is the average across
Speaker 1: the group. So this is not the best athletes, This
Speaker 1: is the average across the group. So in the seven
Speaker 1: weeks when they were just training with nothing for what
Speaker 1: they believed nothing, which it was before the steroids in
Speaker 1: inverted commas, the lifters added on average two point six
Speaker 1: kilos to their squat, So over seven weeks, their squat
Speaker 1: went up two point six kilos in seven weeks, which
Speaker 1: is really pretty minimal on average. And then after they
Speaker 1: took their four weeks, which is not much more than
Speaker 1: half the time, After they did their four weeks of
Speaker 1: taking steroids, nudge nudge, wink wink, they added on average
Speaker 1: eighteen point nine kilos. Right now, Remember, in seven weeks,
Speaker 1: they added two point six kilos to their best lift. Now,
Speaker 1: in four weeks, which is about half the time, they
Speaker 1: added forty one point eight pounds or eighteen point nine
Speaker 1: kilos of weight to their best squad. Now that's a
Speaker 1: seven times increase in gain in half the time, right,
Speaker 1: just over half the time. What was the difference, Same
Speaker 1: guys doing the same lifts, under the same conditions. Everything
Speaker 1: was the same. The only variables is that they thought
Speaker 1: they were on drugs that would make them stronger now,
Speaker 1: and they got way stronger. The same happened with the
Speaker 1: second exercise. During the first seven weeks, the lifters increased
Speaker 1: their bench press by four point five kilos, so that's
Speaker 1: drug free four point five kilos in seven weeks. And
Speaker 1: after the next four weeks believing they were on steroids,
Speaker 1: the athletes added on average thirteen point three so a
Speaker 1: three time improvement in half the time with no drugs
Speaker 1: thinking they were taking drugs. Now, this one's fucking amazing.
Speaker 1: On military press, which is it's a shoulder press every
Speaker 1: one where you've got the bar just sitting at the
Speaker 1: top of your chest where I'm showing Tiff like she
Speaker 1: needs me to fucking show her, but anyway, and so
Speaker 1: you push the bar straight up vertically from the top
Speaker 1: of your chest. That's called a military press, or it's
Speaker 1: a form of a shoulder press. Right. So on military
Speaker 1: press they increased by an average of zero point seven
Speaker 1: of a kilo. It's a hard lift, by the way.
Speaker 1: So remembering that had already been doing all of these lifts, now,
Speaker 1: in the seven week initial phase of the trial, where
Speaker 1: they knew they weren't taking drugs, the average improvement was
Speaker 1: a mere point seven of a kilo. Now, then during
Speaker 1: the four weeks, again about half the time where they
Speaker 1: believed they were on drugs, the average improvement was seven
Speaker 1: point six kilos, which is a one thousand percent improvement
Speaker 1: on the preceding seven weeks. So they ten exed it.
Speaker 1: It went from point seven to seven point six, which
Speaker 1: is a ten x improvement in four weeks over seven
Speaker 1: So so what does it tell us? Well, and there's
Speaker 1: no opinion in this, there's no there's just data. So
Speaker 1: the evidence was clear every athlete, every athlete got fundamentally
Speaker 1: much stronger because they believed they were taking steroids. So
Speaker 1: whatever had to happen psychologically, physiologically, and so there's a
Speaker 1: bunch of theories around this, but I think that the
Speaker 1: implications for us are and we could talk about, you know,
Speaker 1: the psychological physiological link and what might be happening. But
Speaker 1: I think the implication and the one of the many
Speaker 1: takeaways is, oh, when I believe that i can do
Speaker 1: this amazing shit, right because I've got this magic drug
Speaker 1: in my body that I know. Oh, I know about steroids.
Speaker 1: They make you stronger, and I'm on them, so I'm
Speaker 1: going to get stronger. So there's this correlation between absolute
Speaker 1: expectation and belief and output and outcome. Like there's no hesitation,
Speaker 1: there's no self doubt because all of the six participants
Speaker 1: new in inverted commas, they had this they have this
Speaker 1: hormonal advantage. Well, actually that just been lied to how
Speaker 1: fucking great is that?
Speaker 3: Do you reckon any of that comes into How beginners,
Speaker 3: when you first start training, you get such great adaptation
Speaker 3: to weight training, and then once you're you're a seasoned
Speaker 3: like strength trainer, you don't get quite the games. Do
Speaker 3: you reckon? There's anything that comes into just because all
Speaker 3: of a sudden, it's like I never used to do
Speaker 3: this stuff.
Speaker 2: Oh now I do this stuff.
Speaker 3: I'm going to get strong, and then it becomes something
Speaker 3: you just do every day and it's just the normal
Speaker 3: in your mind.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Look, I think also, I mean, we do know
Speaker 1: purely just from the physiology point of view, you're going
Speaker 1: to make. You know, if you do everything properly, you're
Speaker 1: going to make your greatest games in the first six
Speaker 1: months because you're starting at zero. But I do think that,
Speaker 1: you know, like there are times when for example, last week, Yeah,
Speaker 1: so I typically do when I do chins, I do
Speaker 1: typically sets of you've seen me, I do sets of
Speaker 1: eight to ten, right, And last week I was in
Speaker 1: the gym and I looked up at the clock and
Speaker 1: I had to I think I had to actually race
Speaker 1: back to do a podcast with you. I was like
Speaker 1: three minutes late leaving the gym, and I'd realized I
Speaker 1: hadn't done any chins, and I went, right, I'm just
Speaker 1: going to do one max set. Now, Normally eight to
Speaker 1: ten is hard, but I knew that I could only
Speaker 1: do one set because I didn't have time. And I
Speaker 1: did seventeen, right, So I did about double what I
Speaker 1: normally do. But I thought, well, I've only got one minute,
Speaker 1: I've only got one set, so I'll fucking blow him
Speaker 1: my back apart. I'll do everything I can. And so
Speaker 1: the sixty one year old body with fucked everything did
Speaker 1: seventeen proper chins, right. And it's not like all of
Speaker 1: a sudden I've got more strength, or I've got better
Speaker 1: genetics or but it's just funny when you go, I'm
Speaker 1: gonna Now, if you had to come up to me
Speaker 1: at number seventeen and said here's a thousand bucks, do
Speaker 1: three more, I could not have done it. I couldn't
Speaker 1: have done it.
Speaker 2: Do you have a number in your head?
Speaker 1: No? No, I just went, I'm just well, I was.
Speaker 1: I think I was thinking fifteen, but I thought I'm
Speaker 1: probably not going to get there. Yeah, and I got
Speaker 1: to thirteen with relative ease. You know. Anyway, my point
Speaker 1: is like a completely different Like I didn't go in
Speaker 1: thinking eight to ten. I just went, ah, fuck, I
Speaker 1: need to If I can only do one set, it
Speaker 1: better be an amazing set or I'm going to get
Speaker 1: no benefit, you know. And I just think I love
Speaker 1: this story because you know, it's not about drugs, and
Speaker 1: it's not about how much they lifted or didn't lift.
Speaker 1: It's about, Oh, isn't it amazing? And we've had this
Speaker 1: with Jeffrey Riddeger and numerous other people talking about place Ebos.
Speaker 1: It's just incredible when you go, ah, what could I
Speaker 1: actually do if I get my mind out of the way,
Speaker 1: or perhaps even better, I get my mind totally on
Speaker 1: board where my self belief or my expectation is in
Speaker 1: a way different place. Now.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it reminds me of I've been revisiting one of
Speaker 3: Brene Brown Brown's books and she was talking about this
Speaker 3: part where she was researching and asking everybody and having
Speaker 3: this real grapple with herself like do you really think
Speaker 3: people are doing their best? And like she talks about
Speaker 3: being in with her therapist and she's like, do you
Speaker 3: really think everyone's doing their best?
Speaker 2: Like trying their best? And she was grappy.
Speaker 3: She was like, I don't like she couldn't handle everyone's
Speaker 3: going like yeah, yeah, And then she asked her husband
Speaker 3: and he thought about it for ages, and then he goes,
Speaker 3: I don't know, but I know that when I believe,
Speaker 3: when I think that people are doing their best, my
Speaker 3: life's better.
Speaker 2: And I loved that.
Speaker 3: It's like the power of what you choose to believe
Speaker 3: if you analyze it, like, if I choose to believe
Speaker 3: that everyone is doing their best, then I can be
Speaker 3: more empathetic, then my life can be better. It doesn't matter,
Speaker 3: Like the only thing that matters is the difference it
Speaker 3: makes to your life.
Speaker 1: Oh, there's a couple of things in that. I thought
Speaker 1: you were going to go somewhere different with that, because
Speaker 1: like what came up for me was when I think
Speaker 1: of am I doing my best? I'm like, is this
Speaker 1: absolutely the best I could humanly do? Well, no, I'm
Speaker 1: not doing my best? Then, do you know what I mean? Yeah?
Speaker 1: But I also understand it turned around and I think, also,
Speaker 1: you know, what is the best for you today Friday
Speaker 1: might not be the same what is the best for
Speaker 1: you on Monday? Because I'm Monday. Your back's a bit better,
Speaker 1: You've had a great sleep, you've been laughing your off.
Speaker 1: You fucking you're happy as a pig in shits. Your
Speaker 1: energy is through the roof. So your Monday best could
Speaker 1: be quite different to your Friday best. I don't think
Speaker 1: our best, whatever we're talking about, is a constant. I
Speaker 1: think it's a variable based on a bunch of other variables.
Speaker 3: You know, Yeah, everything that's going on for people, and
Speaker 3: you know, like where they're at. But and just the
Speaker 3: idea of judgment, like a what sort of person am
Speaker 3: I when I have judgment on others? What's really going
Speaker 3: on inside my mind? And how does that affect me?
Speaker 1: Yeah? And also I mean, now getting philosophical, like what
Speaker 1: does it matter, like Craig, if you do seven eight
Speaker 1: chins or three sets of eight in the grand scheme
Speaker 1: of things, does it fucking matter? Oh? Probably not? Probably not.
Speaker 1: Like being functional and being somewhat strong and being able
Speaker 1: to do you know, having a body at sixty odd
Speaker 1: that works? Okay, that's the main thing, isn't it.
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 1: I guess so, you know, so there's it's almost like that. Well,
Speaker 1: so you know your job, yeah yeah, yeah, for the
Speaker 1: most part, enjoy it, yep, And you make pretty good
Speaker 1: dough yep, so it's all okay, right, It's like, so
Speaker 1: you don't need three times the income or no, no,
Speaker 1: and nothing wrong with making three times, but you go
Speaker 1: does it? Like, is the angst is the effort? Is
Speaker 1: the And sometimes the answer is yes, it's all worth it.
Speaker 1: But There's been a bunch of things that I've done
Speaker 1: over the years where I've fucking nearly killed myself to
Speaker 1: do the thing. And then I did the thing, and
Speaker 1: then I went, why do I do that?
Speaker 2: I was on a you.
Speaker 3: Know, on a ride the other day, a pushbuck ride,
Speaker 3: and I was just letting my mind wonder and thinking
Speaker 3: about things, and I was kind of analyzing my mindset
Speaker 3: and my current like what am I doing, what are
Speaker 3: my goals? Where am I at? How is my life?
Speaker 3: How do I think? And I was like, do I
Speaker 3: I wonder how much of my drive and ambition shifts
Speaker 3: to hold on to some sort of belief that exists
Speaker 3: around whether or not I'm allowed.
Speaker 2: To be happy?
Speaker 3: Because I was out for a ride and I'd had
Speaker 3: a huge week of focusing differently and doing lots of work,
Speaker 3: and you know, I was like, this is good, right now,
Speaker 3: I have this moment of time I can just go
Speaker 3: outside and go for a ride by myself and be
Speaker 3: in the sun, and how beautiful. And there was this
Speaker 3: underlying oh, out in the sun, just going for a ride.
Speaker 3: I hope no one rings you and asks you what
Speaker 3: you're doing. There was almost a thought of it, like
Speaker 3: someone rings you and ask you what you're doing? Like
Speaker 3: who are you to? I was like this, what is
Speaker 3: that like? And how much of that drives my business
Speaker 3: and everything that I do? Like it's quite comfort It
Speaker 3: was pretty confronting.
Speaker 1: Yeah, what's the origin story for that? Because that is
Speaker 1: that's almost sl oh Well, if you're not being productive
Speaker 1: and effective and efficient, then you should feel bad, you
Speaker 1: should feel guilty, you should feel convicted, Like what's that about?
Speaker 3: Yeah, and I think that can fall into self sabotage
Speaker 3: at times or that or just I don't know, Like
Speaker 3: we make decisions to prove an unconscious point, and what
Speaker 3: if the unconscious point I'm trying to prove is you'll
Speaker 3: never be enough and you don't really deserve to be happy,
Speaker 3: So keep striving for shit that lives just outside of
Speaker 3: that happiness because you're not allowed to be you're not
Speaker 3: allowed to live inside the happiness realm.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's interesting.
Speaker 2: By the way, to would agree, but well.
Speaker 1: You know, it's somebody. Somebody said, I think this is
Speaker 1: a funny thing. Right. That doesn't happen a lot, but
Speaker 1: it happens somewhat regularly where because I do a lot
Speaker 1: of talking with people, as you do, and you know,
Speaker 1: I regularly, at least four or five days a week,
Speaker 1: I talk to someone who's really not in a great place, right,
Speaker 1: And some times those conversations are twenty minutes and sometimes
Speaker 1: they're two hours, right, And I love that, and that's
Speaker 1: a privilege, and that's part of part of what I
Speaker 1: think I meant to be doing, as fluffy as that sounds.
Speaker 1: But every now and then someone comes up to me
Speaker 1: and goes, are you okay though, which is nice, right,
Speaker 1: and I go, yeah, I am. And then they're like, yeah, cool,
Speaker 1: I know you say that, but are you right? And
Speaker 1: you know, when you think you're okay, but then you're like, well, fuck,
Speaker 1: maybe I'm not, like can hell, They're looking at me
Speaker 1: like I'm actually not, but I don't know it, you know,
Speaker 1: And then I go, fuck, am I all right? And
Speaker 1: I think the fact like that whole happiness is such
Speaker 1: a weird construct it's such a weird. I know it
Speaker 1: seems like not weird, but I reckon it's weird because well,
Speaker 1: what like if we associate happiness with an emotion or
Speaker 1: a feeling or a state or a moment in time one,
Speaker 1: what does that feel like experientially for Tiff? What does
Speaker 1: it feel like for our listener? What does it feel
Speaker 1: like for me?
Speaker 4: And is it is it like is it like that?
Speaker 4: Is it like joy? Is it like just calmness? Is
Speaker 4: it contentment?
Speaker 1: And for me, the feeling that is the most enjoyable
Speaker 1: probably not the right word, but the feeling that I
Speaker 1: enjoy the most is almost like a mix between calm,
Speaker 1: contentment and relief, you know, where there's just do you
Speaker 1: ever get home from a big run and you just
Speaker 1: sit down and it's like you just fucked, but you
Speaker 1: feel it's like a great fucked. It's like all the
Speaker 1: anxieties out of your body, all the nerves all that,
Speaker 1: and you're just like it's like a kind of a bliss.
Speaker 1: Yeah right, I love that that bliss where I'm not happy,
Speaker 1: Like I'm definitely not unhappy, but it's not like I'm like, oh, yeah,
Speaker 1: fucking the hell, come on? Yeah, Like that's not going
Speaker 1: on at all. It's just this deep sense of gratitude.
Speaker 1: And I know this sounds fucking cheesy, but contentment bliss
Speaker 1: come like for me, that's my version of my happy place,
Speaker 1: Like that whole kind of euphoric joy punching the air.
Speaker 1: I don't get that that much. Yeah.
Speaker 3: Yeah, Like I feel like happiness is would be so
Speaker 3: different for different people, because for some people, the feeling
Speaker 3: that we describe might be something that's interpreted by way
Speaker 3: of just hitting pause on the anxiety, the worry or
Speaker 3: the state of tension. It's like, oh, when that disappears,
Speaker 3: it's like toxic relationships. Oh when something disappears and then
Speaker 3: I feel good for them and I feel familiar. So oh,
Speaker 3: this is happiness just because that feeling of anxiety disappeared.
Speaker 1: Yes, yes, I was thinking yesterday about I'm always writing
Speaker 1: articles which eventually get turned into a chat with you, right,
Speaker 1: or or or a solo episode or a or part
Speaker 1: of a workshop. But I was thinking about this idea
Speaker 1: of for one of the better term shiny things, right,
Speaker 1: all the shiny like I reckon.
Speaker 2: My blood love shiny things.
Speaker 1: Yeah, I know, Yeah, you're the fucking shiny thing. Queen,
Speaker 1: what's that over there?
Speaker 2: What's that?
Speaker 3: What's that?
Speaker 1: What's that? Right? And I was thinking about how much
Speaker 1: it's almost like and this is not about you, this
Speaker 1: is about all of us at some stage, me included.
Speaker 1: But it's also it's almost like the seduction of the superficial.
Speaker 1: It's like I need that. Oh I want that fuck
Speaker 1: And then I get it and I'm like, yeah, but
Speaker 1: that didn't. Yeah that's not enough. I need more. I
Speaker 1: need another one. I need fucking a bigger one, you know,
Speaker 1: And I'm you know, I've done that mile life with shit.
Speaker 1: And then you go, all right, all right, well, what
Speaker 1: is what is that about? You know where you're you're
Speaker 1: kind of trying to do a deep dive or I've
Speaker 1: been doing a bit of a somewhat deep dive under
Speaker 1: trying to get underneath my my motivators, you know, like
Speaker 1: you know, you talk philosophically about I want to help people,
Speaker 1: I want to do this, I want to do that.
Speaker 1: Do you like, do you though, or do you just
Speaker 1: say that because you sound good when you say that,
Speaker 1: because you know, there are times when the evidence in
Speaker 1: my life is not always in alignment with what's coming
Speaker 1: out of my gob trying to sound good on a podcast.
Speaker 1: Just go look in the garage at the four motorbikes,
Speaker 1: right that might you might go, I don't know, mister
Speaker 1: deep and spiritual, what the fuck are all these about?
Speaker 4: You know?
Speaker 1: And I'm like, yeah, what And it's not I mean,
Speaker 1: I don't think. Yeah, I don't know. It's an interesting
Speaker 1: thing to try to have. And again, this is not
Speaker 1: self loathing, but to try to have a level of
Speaker 1: real self awareness that is almost unnew, like an unnew
Speaker 1: level where you're like, oh, we're not beating yourself up,
Speaker 1: but you're also not giving yourself a break. Because I
Speaker 1: think there are times when we need to give ourselves
Speaker 1: a break of course, bit of self care, bit of
Speaker 1: self love, of course, but I also think there are
Speaker 1: times when you've got to go, nah, Craig, you're a
Speaker 1: bit full of shit.
Speaker 3: Yeah, yeah, that was another. I guess it feels relatable
Speaker 3: to when I was writing and thinking deeply and I
Speaker 3: was thinking about like me and my independence and that
Speaker 3: I've just done a session on boundaries with my coaching group,
Speaker 3: so I was thinking about that and the work I've
Speaker 3: had to do in life, because boundaries was one of
Speaker 3: the biggest lessons I had to learned, and I was
Speaker 3: just thinking, like, one part of me is really aware
Speaker 3: of how self ish self like, I look after like
Speaker 3: in an independent way selfish, I look after me. I'm
Speaker 3: very protective, I've been I have to be really aware
Speaker 3: of that. But also I was reflecting on at the
Speaker 3: very same time that lack of boundaries and the putting
Speaker 3: myself last, like putting everyone else first and prioritizing what
Speaker 3: everyone else's needs. And I was like, well, because that's
Speaker 3: the opposite of selfish. So are you selfish or aren't
Speaker 3: you selfish? Like how do these two aspects of you
Speaker 3: even live in the one moment? And how can you
Speaker 3: not be.
Speaker 2: Aware of that? And you have to figure out how
Speaker 2: they even work together.
Speaker 3: Yes, they sit for they feel like the polar opposite.
Speaker 3: I'm like, oh, I believe it's they come out in
Speaker 3: different moments. Oh, I'm really selfish because that fits the
Speaker 3: narrative in a moment, But then in another moment, Oh,
Speaker 3: I've got no boundaries, you know, I just I'm all
Speaker 3: about everybody else.
Speaker 2: It's like, well, yeah, what's the where's the truth live?
Speaker 1: I want to I want to read you something which
Speaker 1: kind of insects with what we're talking about a bit
Speaker 1: I'm writing. I haven't named Tom Melissa this because she'll
Speaker 1: sack me. But I've started writing a book, but I
Speaker 1: don't have time to write a book. What it's, don't you?
Speaker 2: Bloody schoolwork mate?
Speaker 1: My schoolwork? Yeah? My pants. Well, it's like sometimes I
Speaker 1: have an idea, well all the fucking time.
Speaker 2: Sometimes sometimes you have an idea.
Speaker 1: I know it's too fertile. I get out of the shower.
Speaker 1: I have a big white wood in my bedroom which
Speaker 1: is eight feet long. I often walk dripping two because
Speaker 1: I don't want all the shit that's in my head.
Speaker 1: So I walk wet on the carpet and then I
Speaker 1: just write this shit so I can get it. I
Speaker 1: need a whiteboard in the bathroom, That's what I need.
Speaker 3: You need to not tell visual stories like that for
Speaker 3: us visual humans that are all listening to the show
Speaker 3: right now, with pictures we never needed.
Speaker 1: As are you saying that me walking from the shower,
Speaker 1: dripping wet as its.
Speaker 2: Move on with the story.
Speaker 1: Okay, well we can't all be fucking awesome. Can we.
Speaker 2: Tell me you've got a teel around you?
Speaker 1: Yeah? Of course, yep, now of course, Oh there's nothing
Speaker 1: inappropriate hanging out because that's what I that's what anyway,
Speaker 1: this is much more savory than what we're talking about.
Speaker 1: So I was putting down some shit I was writing about,
Speaker 1: you know, pursuant to the shiny things idea, one of
Speaker 1: the core teaching. So this is in a Buddhism. One
Speaker 1: of the core teachings of Foreknoble Truths says that suffering
Speaker 1: is caused by craving, including craving for success, for praise,
Speaker 1: for recognition, that is, chasing the stuff. Chasing that stuff
Speaker 1: endlessly is part of what keeps us stuck in dissatisfaction.
Speaker 1: Buddhism doesn't reject success, but redefines it from having to
Speaker 1: being fucking love that it invites people to trade the
Speaker 1: appearance of success for the experience of peace. In the
Speaker 1: way success is often defined by accumulation of titleswell status,
Speaker 1: In Buddhism, success is measured by reduction, not accumulation, reduction
Speaker 1: of ego, of craving of suffering. Buddhism teaches it the
Speaker 1: more we cling to external validation, the further we drift
Speaker 1: from peace. True success in this tradition has nothing to
Speaker 1: do with being seen or celebrated, and everything to do
Speaker 1: with being free, free from comparison, and less driving and
Speaker 1: the need to prove ourselves. How good's that?
Speaker 3: I love that you remind me of a quote I
Speaker 3: fell in love with recently. There was something along the
Speaker 3: lines of the rich man is not he who has
Speaker 3: the most, but he who needs the less the least.
Speaker 1: Yeah, love it, love it.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: Well on that very fucking spiritual come by, you know moment.
Speaker 1: Let's not think about me walking out of the shower
Speaker 1: to write shit on the whiteboard. Let's erase that. Let's
Speaker 1: get back on this wisdom that we just shared. And
Speaker 1: for you visual learners, I'm sorry. Ah wow. We'll see
Speaker 1: you next time.
Speaker 2: Thanks tip, Thanks Hart