1 00:00:00,360 --> 00:00:10,200 Speaker 1: Thanks doing this. That's right, death and destruction from The Australian. 2 00:00:10,280 --> 00:00:13,360 Speaker 1: This is the weekend edition of The Front. I'm Claire Harvey. 3 00:00:15,880 --> 00:00:19,600 Speaker 1: Vivian Westwood, the designer so daring she made the rest 4 00:00:19,640 --> 00:00:23,079 Speaker 1: of fashion look frumpy forever, is the subject of a 5 00:00:23,160 --> 00:00:27,280 Speaker 1: new exhibition at the National Gallery of Victoria. The NGV 6 00:00:27,560 --> 00:00:31,520 Speaker 1: is one Australian arts institution that always seems to get 7 00:00:31,560 --> 00:00:35,840 Speaker 1: it right. Fresh from its blockbuster shows on Japanese artist 8 00:00:36,040 --> 00:00:42,519 Speaker 1: Yayoi Kosama, French Impressionism and Gabrielle Coco Chanel, today Culture 9 00:00:42,600 --> 00:00:46,200 Speaker 1: editor Milander Rout joins me to discuss why this show, 10 00:00:46,400 --> 00:00:49,919 Speaker 1: which also features the work of Comte de Garson visionary 11 00:00:49,920 --> 00:00:56,840 Speaker 1: designer Ray Kawakubo, is a summer must see. Milander Route 12 00:00:56,880 --> 00:00:59,200 Speaker 1: is The Australian's Culture editor and she's here to talk 13 00:00:59,240 --> 00:01:03,280 Speaker 1: about one of the great icons of fashion, Melanda, who 14 00:01:03,360 --> 00:01:04,520 Speaker 1: was Vivian Westwood. 15 00:01:05,120 --> 00:01:07,680 Speaker 2: Well, she was an extraordinary designer. It kind of came 16 00:01:07,760 --> 00:01:11,000 Speaker 2: through London in the punk rock era through her connection 17 00:01:11,080 --> 00:01:13,880 Speaker 2: with the Sex Pistols, and so she really represented that 18 00:01:13,920 --> 00:01:17,559 Speaker 2: time of change in the eighties and pushing fashion, really 19 00:01:17,640 --> 00:01:18,919 Speaker 2: pushing the boundaries on everything. 20 00:01:22,840 --> 00:01:31,440 Speaker 1: Stuff stuffy, Yeah. She and one of her husbands, Malcolm McLaren, 21 00:01:31,600 --> 00:01:34,399 Speaker 1: the singer from the Sex Pistols, owned a shop in 22 00:01:34,600 --> 00:01:37,119 Speaker 1: what was then a very sort of fancy part of 23 00:01:37,200 --> 00:01:40,759 Speaker 1: London and it had various names, one of them was Sex. 24 00:01:42,319 --> 00:01:46,319 Speaker 1: Great name for a shop. Absolutely, Why was she so different? 25 00:01:46,480 --> 00:01:49,040 Speaker 1: What was different about Vivian Westwood? I think she just 26 00:01:49,160 --> 00:01:52,800 Speaker 1: really challenged everything. And that's what those amazing fashion designers 27 00:01:52,840 --> 00:01:55,480 Speaker 1: which you see in so many fashion exhibitions, they stand 28 00:01:55,520 --> 00:01:59,400 Speaker 1: out because they disrupt. From Chanelle who put women in 29 00:01:59,520 --> 00:02:02,000 Speaker 1: little black dresses before they couldn't wear black cas it 30 00:02:02,040 --> 00:02:05,600 Speaker 1: was something associated with morning, and even putting women in pants. 31 00:02:05,640 --> 00:02:08,680 Speaker 1: The fashion designers really do disrupt, and they disrupt what 32 00:02:08,720 --> 00:02:18,359 Speaker 1: people wear and what was considered appropriate attire. Westwood came 33 00:02:18,400 --> 00:02:22,200 Speaker 1: along in the seventies when fashion was generally relaxing. You know, 34 00:02:22,280 --> 00:02:24,919 Speaker 1: people were wearing kaftans, they were wearing their hair out 35 00:02:24,960 --> 00:02:27,680 Speaker 1: that already burned their bras, and she kind of brought 36 00:02:27,800 --> 00:02:30,880 Speaker 1: back a lot of structured but also kind of shredded 37 00:02:30,919 --> 00:02:31,440 Speaker 1: the clothes. 38 00:02:31,560 --> 00:02:34,519 Speaker 2: Yes, absolutely, and she really messed with the feminine shapes 39 00:02:34,560 --> 00:02:39,040 Speaker 2: and put people in corsets and giant, huge, massive heels 40 00:02:39,080 --> 00:02:42,400 Speaker 2: and obviously that famous scene where Naomi Campbell fell over 41 00:02:43,080 --> 00:02:46,920 Speaker 2: on the runway wearing these insane within Westwood shoes. 42 00:02:47,600 --> 00:02:48,760 Speaker 1: There's nothing you can do. 43 00:02:48,919 --> 00:02:52,320 Speaker 3: I'm wearing rubber stockings, so I couldn't feel my toes 44 00:02:52,520 --> 00:02:54,440 Speaker 3: and I couldn't really feel my feet. 45 00:02:54,360 --> 00:02:57,079 Speaker 1: And so I went down. But it's okay. I got 46 00:02:57,120 --> 00:02:58,640 Speaker 1: back up and I finished my walk. 47 00:02:59,360 --> 00:03:02,080 Speaker 2: Afterwards, she told a reporter that she likes putting women 48 00:03:02,200 --> 00:03:04,840 Speaker 2: in huge hills because they deserve to be idolized on 49 00:03:04,880 --> 00:03:06,680 Speaker 2: a platform, So that's how she saw it. 50 00:03:09,760 --> 00:03:12,800 Speaker 1: Probably the dress that she has designed that's been seen 51 00:03:12,840 --> 00:03:16,919 Speaker 1: the most is one of Carrie Bradshaw's wedding dresses in 52 00:03:17,080 --> 00:03:19,320 Speaker 1: Sex and the City. Tell me about that dress. 53 00:03:19,160 --> 00:03:21,880 Speaker 2: Well, it's just I mean, there's a beautiful picture of 54 00:03:21,919 --> 00:03:24,800 Speaker 2: her running away from the wedding after a big unfortunately, 55 00:03:25,040 --> 00:03:27,480 Speaker 2: you know, decides not to turn up, which is awful. 56 00:03:28,520 --> 00:03:42,800 Speaker 3: Carry I freaked out for a minute, but I'm reading now, Carrie, 57 00:03:42,880 --> 00:03:48,280 Speaker 3: I'm sorry, but it's just structured and it's over the 58 00:03:48,280 --> 00:03:49,400 Speaker 3: top and it's beautiful. 59 00:03:49,840 --> 00:03:52,160 Speaker 2: She was also known for tartan, which was a significant 60 00:03:52,160 --> 00:03:54,680 Speaker 2: motif in her collections as well. But there was an 61 00:03:54,680 --> 00:03:58,560 Speaker 2: amazing again pictures of Kate Moss walking down in this 62 00:03:58,640 --> 00:04:02,600 Speaker 2: insane huge dress. So it's all about volume and presence 63 00:04:02,640 --> 00:04:03,240 Speaker 2: and being there. 64 00:04:03,640 --> 00:04:05,560 Speaker 1: Yeah, that scene in Sex and the City, it's got 65 00:04:05,640 --> 00:04:08,080 Speaker 1: kind of miss Havisham vibes, hasn't it. She's been jilted 66 00:04:08,240 --> 00:04:10,880 Speaker 1: at the Altar, and Sex and the City is really 67 00:04:10,960 --> 00:04:14,760 Speaker 1: about kind of sexual independence and sexual freedom. I thought 68 00:04:14,800 --> 00:04:16,719 Speaker 1: the dress was a bit of a throwback to that 69 00:04:16,800 --> 00:04:20,239 Speaker 1: kind of Deckenzian idea of she wanted the princess fantasy 70 00:04:20,279 --> 00:04:22,080 Speaker 1: and she didn't get it. It was a princess dress. 71 00:04:22,200 --> 00:04:24,680 Speaker 2: Yeah, but it's not because Vivian west would turn that 72 00:04:24,760 --> 00:04:27,600 Speaker 2: upside down. I feel like by kind of sexualizing that 73 00:04:27,960 --> 00:04:30,599 Speaker 2: or sexualizing that, but it's given women the power to 74 00:04:30,640 --> 00:04:33,320 Speaker 2: wear corsets as opposed to being told to wear them, 75 00:04:33,520 --> 00:04:35,320 Speaker 2: wearing them because they look fabulous and they make us 76 00:04:35,320 --> 00:04:37,520 Speaker 2: look fabulous. So I kind of buy that idea, but 77 00:04:37,560 --> 00:04:39,640 Speaker 2: I also think that it's just over the top and 78 00:04:39,880 --> 00:04:41,120 Speaker 2: women dressing for themselves. 79 00:04:52,240 --> 00:04:54,839 Speaker 1: We're talking about Vivian Westwood because there's a new show 80 00:04:55,000 --> 00:04:58,800 Speaker 1: at the National Gallery of Victoria, the NNGV. The NNGV 81 00:04:58,960 --> 00:05:01,680 Speaker 1: keeps getting it right blockbuster shows, doesn't it. 82 00:05:01,760 --> 00:05:05,560 Speaker 2: Absolutely, It's definitely the standout gallery around Australia in terms 83 00:05:05,640 --> 00:05:08,720 Speaker 2: of their numbers that come in and the visitors that 84 00:05:08,839 --> 00:05:12,960 Speaker 2: get They've also had blockbusters from Chanelle. This year they 85 00:05:13,040 --> 00:05:17,120 Speaker 2: had the French Impressionists. So they're very good at presenting 86 00:05:17,160 --> 00:05:20,479 Speaker 2: exhibitions that are accessible to everybody and that everyone wants 87 00:05:20,520 --> 00:05:21,239 Speaker 2: to go and see. 88 00:05:23,800 --> 00:05:26,120 Speaker 1: They don't seem to be bound up in the kind 89 00:05:26,160 --> 00:05:29,600 Speaker 1: of fear of showing something that's too popular, which seems 90 00:05:29,600 --> 00:05:31,280 Speaker 1: to be a concern with some galleries. 91 00:05:31,560 --> 00:05:31,760 Speaker 4: Yeah. 92 00:05:31,800 --> 00:05:34,000 Speaker 2: Absolutely, I mean it's that idea that you can have 93 00:05:34,160 --> 00:05:37,160 Speaker 2: extraordinary art and you can also have art that's popular. 94 00:05:37,240 --> 00:05:40,000 Speaker 2: Just because it's popular doesn't mean it's an inferior version 95 00:05:40,080 --> 00:05:42,560 Speaker 2: of art. But a lot of our arts companies around 96 00:05:42,600 --> 00:05:44,680 Speaker 2: the country are kind of suffering. A lot of galleries 97 00:05:44,680 --> 00:05:48,120 Speaker 2: are in deficit, a lot of opera companies, ballet companies 98 00:05:48,279 --> 00:05:50,919 Speaker 2: and the MTV is kind of the shining beacon of 99 00:05:51,760 --> 00:05:54,520 Speaker 2: It is incredible in terms of the exhibitions and the 100 00:05:54,520 --> 00:05:56,760 Speaker 2: people that come through. And isn't that the main idea 101 00:05:56,800 --> 00:05:58,480 Speaker 2: that the more people that see the art better. 102 00:06:01,120 --> 00:06:03,599 Speaker 1: One of our reporters, Rosemary Neil, has been doing a 103 00:06:03,680 --> 00:06:06,840 Speaker 1: very close look at what's going wrong with arts companies. 104 00:06:07,000 --> 00:06:10,080 Speaker 1: Is it about that balance between the expectation of government 105 00:06:10,160 --> 00:06:11,880 Speaker 1: support and selling tickets. 106 00:06:12,000 --> 00:06:14,240 Speaker 2: I think so, But there's a whole lot of things 107 00:06:14,240 --> 00:06:17,440 Speaker 2: that have happened since post COVID. People aren't going out 108 00:06:17,480 --> 00:06:19,919 Speaker 2: as much. We have obviously a cost of living crisis 109 00:06:19,960 --> 00:06:23,440 Speaker 2: as well. So what Rosemary explored is the reasons behind that. 110 00:06:23,640 --> 00:06:26,680 Speaker 2: And you know, construction costs for the new wing at 111 00:06:26,680 --> 00:06:29,320 Speaker 2: the Art Gallery of New souft Wales running that new wing. 112 00:06:29,680 --> 00:06:32,760 Speaker 2: Everything's going up and up, and the ticket sales really 113 00:06:32,800 --> 00:06:35,240 Speaker 2: aren't matching that. So they're relying more and more on 114 00:06:35,279 --> 00:06:39,440 Speaker 2: government funding, and they're relying more on philanthropic funding. So 115 00:06:39,960 --> 00:06:42,600 Speaker 2: it's a multi layered and complex issue. And one of 116 00:06:42,640 --> 00:06:45,760 Speaker 2: the solutions suggested by the New Softwales government in a 117 00:06:45,760 --> 00:06:48,000 Speaker 2: summit that was held earlier in the year was tax breaks, 118 00:06:48,000 --> 00:06:51,400 Speaker 2: so tax reform to encourage more donations. But there is 119 00:06:51,400 --> 00:06:53,880 Speaker 2: this idea that the government can't keep funding them to 120 00:06:53,960 --> 00:06:56,440 Speaker 2: the level they need, and the shortfall between the government 121 00:06:56,440 --> 00:06:58,359 Speaker 2: funding and the money that they can get from ticket 122 00:06:58,400 --> 00:07:00,000 Speaker 2: sales is just widening. 123 00:07:05,880 --> 00:07:09,880 Speaker 1: Coming up the real business model behind the catwalk craziness. 124 00:07:23,480 --> 00:07:25,680 Speaker 1: Some Vivian Westwood clothes might be hard to wear or 125 00:07:25,680 --> 00:07:27,960 Speaker 1: hard to sell in a short. But they're nothing compared 126 00:07:27,960 --> 00:07:31,239 Speaker 1: to Conde Garson, which is part of the show as well. 127 00:07:31,760 --> 00:07:35,880 Speaker 2: Yes, Conde Gassons is done by Ray Kawakubo and her 128 00:07:36,080 --> 00:07:39,600 Speaker 2: work is displayed alongside Vivian Westwood, and the curators at 129 00:07:39,600 --> 00:07:42,640 Speaker 2: the MGV thought they were a good companion piece because 130 00:07:42,720 --> 00:07:45,400 Speaker 2: Vivian was so dramatic with shapes as well. But Conde 131 00:07:45,440 --> 00:07:48,040 Speaker 2: Gassons is insane, like they're the pictures of the rain 132 00:07:48,040 --> 00:07:49,400 Speaker 2: Way where you think, I don't even know how they 133 00:07:49,480 --> 00:07:51,600 Speaker 2: got that dress on that person or how they walk 134 00:07:51,640 --> 00:07:55,800 Speaker 2: in it. And she really disrupted this idea of shapes 135 00:07:55,880 --> 00:07:58,800 Speaker 2: and what women should wear and messing with the body 136 00:07:58,840 --> 00:08:00,520 Speaker 2: shape and all that kind of stuff. So they're going 137 00:08:00,560 --> 00:08:02,280 Speaker 2: to look quite spectacular next to each other. 138 00:08:02,640 --> 00:08:04,679 Speaker 1: It makes me wonder a little bit about the business 139 00:08:04,720 --> 00:08:07,680 Speaker 1: of fashion when you see these outlandish fashion shows which 140 00:08:07,680 --> 00:08:10,560 Speaker 1: are just about getting vision on the TV news and 141 00:08:10,640 --> 00:08:17,120 Speaker 1: photos in the magazines. That's about selling perfume scarves. Yeah, no, 142 00:08:17,240 --> 00:08:20,560 Speaker 1: maybe wristwatches, accessories. It's not actually about selling those clothes, 143 00:08:20,600 --> 00:08:20,840 Speaker 1: is it. 144 00:08:20,920 --> 00:08:21,040 Speaker 4: No. 145 00:08:21,160 --> 00:08:23,040 Speaker 2: And it's funny because there was a scene in The 146 00:08:23,080 --> 00:08:27,240 Speaker 2: Devil Wears Prada where Meryl Streep's character explains the fashion 147 00:08:27,280 --> 00:08:31,400 Speaker 2: ecosystem to Anne Hathaway's character, the editorial assistant who has 148 00:08:31,400 --> 00:08:32,440 Speaker 2: no idea about fashion. 149 00:08:32,640 --> 00:08:34,600 Speaker 4: What you don't know is that that sweater is not 150 00:08:34,720 --> 00:08:38,480 Speaker 4: just blue. It's not to Requois, it's not Lapist, it's 151 00:08:38,520 --> 00:08:42,560 Speaker 4: actually Cerulian. And you're also blithely underware of the fact 152 00:08:42,640 --> 00:08:45,439 Speaker 4: that in two thousand and two Oscar Laurenta did a 153 00:08:45,480 --> 00:08:47,719 Speaker 4: collection of Cerulian gowns, and then I think it was 154 00:08:47,760 --> 00:08:52,240 Speaker 4: Eve Salaol, wasn't it who showed Cerulian military jackets, and 155 00:08:52,280 --> 00:08:54,800 Speaker 4: then Cerullian quickly showed up in the collections of eight 156 00:08:54,840 --> 00:08:58,959 Speaker 4: different designers. I'm going to filter down through the department 157 00:08:59,040 --> 00:09:03,640 Speaker 4: stores and then trickled on down into some tragic casual 158 00:09:03,679 --> 00:09:05,760 Speaker 4: corner where you no doubt fished it out of some 159 00:09:06,160 --> 00:09:10,360 Speaker 4: clearance bin. However, that blue represents millions of dollars and 160 00:09:10,520 --> 00:09:14,400 Speaker 4: countless jobs. And it's sort of comical how you think 161 00:09:14,440 --> 00:09:16,440 Speaker 4: that you've made a choice that exempts you from the 162 00:09:16,440 --> 00:09:20,080 Speaker 4: fashion industry, when in fact you're wearing a sweater that 163 00:09:20,160 --> 00:09:23,240 Speaker 4: was selected for you by the people in this room 164 00:09:23,960 --> 00:09:25,200 Speaker 4: from a pile of stuff. 165 00:09:27,400 --> 00:09:30,520 Speaker 2: Is these shows at the top they set the tone. 166 00:09:30,640 --> 00:09:32,920 Speaker 2: They have these insane, crazy garments. They may pick up 167 00:09:32,920 --> 00:09:35,200 Speaker 2: a color or a cut, but we will all be 168 00:09:35,280 --> 00:09:38,760 Speaker 2: wearing those clothes, just not straight off the runway. They 169 00:09:38,760 --> 00:09:41,680 Speaker 2: may get knocked off by Zara. Most likely we were 170 00:09:41,679 --> 00:09:43,840 Speaker 2: in a couple of years later. So they are more 171 00:09:43,880 --> 00:09:46,720 Speaker 2: than just images. They do impact how we all dress. 172 00:09:47,000 --> 00:09:49,560 Speaker 2: They just filter through the high street labels, and the 173 00:09:49,600 --> 00:09:53,120 Speaker 2: high street labels take inspiration from that, and then sometimes 174 00:09:53,360 --> 00:09:57,120 Speaker 2: movie makers will take inspiration from that, or fashion shows 175 00:09:57,160 --> 00:09:59,040 Speaker 2: will be inspired by a movie. So it's this kind 176 00:09:59,040 --> 00:10:01,880 Speaker 2: of cultural eco system that although we are not walking 177 00:10:01,880 --> 00:10:06,560 Speaker 2: around in Vivian Westwood and Condegasons, their designs and their 178 00:10:06,640 --> 00:10:10,480 Speaker 2: inspiration will eventually filter down to what we wear. 179 00:10:10,679 --> 00:10:12,960 Speaker 1: And also we might not be able to afford a 180 00:10:13,080 --> 00:10:16,720 Speaker 1: Dior suit or Oceanelle dress, but we can buy a lipstick. 181 00:10:16,400 --> 00:10:18,000 Speaker 2: Yes, and as ire a knockoff. 182 00:10:25,040 --> 00:10:29,800 Speaker 1: Milanderraut is The Australian's Culture Editor. The exhibition Westwood Kawakubo 183 00:10:30,200 --> 00:10:33,600 Speaker 1: is on from December seventh, twenty twenty five, to April nineteen, 184 00:10:33,720 --> 00:10:37,520 Speaker 1: twenty twenty six at the National Gallery of Victoria. You 185 00:10:37,559 --> 00:10:40,360 Speaker 1: can read all Australia's best coverage of the arts and 186 00:10:40,640 --> 00:10:44,320 Speaker 1: entertainment right now at the Australian dot com dot au 187 00:10:44,520 --> 00:10:47,640 Speaker 1: slash culture, or by picking up a copy of the 188 00:10:47,640 --> 00:10:51,800 Speaker 1: Weekend Australian. This episode of the Front was produced and 189 00:10:51,920 --> 00:10:55,600 Speaker 1: hosted by me Claire Harvey, with editing and sound designed 190 00:10:55,679 --> 00:10:58,679 Speaker 1: by Tiffany Dimak. Thanks for joining us on the Front 191 00:10:58,720 --> 00:11:02,840 Speaker 1: this week. Our team also includes Kristen Amiot, Leat Sammaglu, 192 00:11:02,960 --> 00:11:06,920 Speaker 1: Josh Burton, Stephanie Coombs and Jasper Leek, who also wrote 193 00:11:07,040 --> 00:11:07,640 Speaker 1: our music.