WEBVTT - How Bob Brown stays optimistic 0:00:01.040 --> 0:00:06.040 Honorable Members, honorable Senators, the President of the United States 0:00:06.040 --> 0:00:09.320 of America. Way back there at the start of the 0:00:09.360 --> 0:00:13.880 two thousands of long Cane, President Bush, and he was 0:00:13.920 --> 0:00:18.239 to address the Joint Houses of Parliament. Well, of course, earlier, 0:00:18.840 --> 0:00:24.320 just months earlier, President Bush and his so called deputy sheriff, 0:00:24.640 --> 0:00:30.240 the Prime Minister of Australia, John Howard, decided to invade Iraq. 0:00:31.320 --> 0:00:34.599 And I determined that I couldn't allow that to go 0:00:34.680 --> 0:00:39.000 by without speaking up about this global breaking of the 0:00:39.080 --> 0:00:45.880 law by America and Australia. Leeis and gentlemen, Lauren and 0:00:45.880 --> 0:00:50.280 I are honoured to be in the Commonwealth of Australia. 0:00:50.800 --> 0:00:53.600 We went in and sat in the middle of the 0:00:53.640 --> 0:00:58.480 House of Representatives. I was internally in meltdown. My heart 0:00:58.560 --> 0:01:00.400 started beating. I thought it was going to come out 0:01:00.440 --> 0:01:04.280 of my chest. However, I knew if I didn't get up, 0:01:04.520 --> 0:01:09.440 I was going to forever regret it. It's the Taliban today. 0:01:09.480 --> 0:01:13.800 Saddam's regime is gone, and no wonders. 0:01:13.400 --> 0:01:19.240 Senator Brown, I warn you, Senator Brown will excuse himself 0:01:19.240 --> 0:01:25.520 from the house. Senator Brown will excuse himself from the house. 0:01:26.400 --> 0:01:31.080 I said to him, President Bush, if you abide by 0:01:31.200 --> 0:01:34.720 international law instead of breaking global r the world rule. 0:01:34.760 --> 0:01:38.679 Respect you. If you don't, it won't And three our 0:01:38.760 --> 0:01:41.120 two Australians from Guandanamo Bay. 0:01:41.880 --> 0:01:44.280 Mister speaker, I moved at Sunata's Brown and that'll be 0:01:44.319 --> 0:01:48.400 suspended from the service of the House. Questions that most 0:01:48.440 --> 0:01:49.200 would be agreed to. 0:01:49.240 --> 0:01:50.600 All those that opinions say hi. 0:01:53.080 --> 0:01:55.760 When Bob Brown spoke out against the invasion of Iraq 0:01:55.840 --> 0:01:58.120 in two thousand and three, at the height of the 0:01:58.120 --> 0:02:02.000 War on Terror, he was widely derided, mocked in the 0:02:02.040 --> 0:02:05.600 press and even abused by a young Queensland MP Peter Dutton. 0:02:05.920 --> 0:02:08.560 What you did today was a complete embarrassment, not only 0:02:08.560 --> 0:02:10.440 to yourself between Australian. 0:02:09.960 --> 0:02:12.440 People, but looking back, he says it was one of 0:02:12.480 --> 0:02:16.560 his proudest moments. Now at eighty years of age, Bob 0:02:16.680 --> 0:02:19.600 argues that speaking up in public and in private is 0:02:19.680 --> 0:02:22.200 crucial to pushing back against the strong man leaders of 0:02:22.240 --> 0:02:25.720 the day with the assaults at democracy and on the planet. 0:02:28.160 --> 0:02:33.760 From Swartz Media, I'm Daniel James. This is seven AM today. 0:02:33.960 --> 0:02:37.639 Lifelong activist and former Green's leader Bob Brown and how 0:02:37.680 --> 0:02:45.600 he takes a stand and why he's still optimistic. It's Monday, 0:02:46.080 --> 0:02:52.280 February seventeen. Bob, thanks so much for speaking with this. 0:02:53.120 --> 0:02:56.280 You've been an activist for your entire life. You've lived 0:02:56.280 --> 0:02:59.880 through different political eras. What are we facing in this 0:03:00.040 --> 0:03:01.760 moment here in twenty twenty five. 0:03:02.160 --> 0:03:08.200 Well, at the time of the greatest destruction of the 0:03:08.240 --> 0:03:12.840 global biasphere upon which we all depend for life. What 0:03:12.960 --> 0:03:17.960 we're facing is not just a mass extinction event due 0:03:18.000 --> 0:03:22.079 to climate change, but also the destruction of habitats and 0:03:22.560 --> 0:03:29.120 the increasingly evident inability of the planet to host the 0:03:29.160 --> 0:03:32.520 cause of that destruction, which is a single species, homosapiens. 0:03:32.560 --> 0:03:37.080 That's us. And it seems that given the troubles that 0:03:37.160 --> 0:03:41.040 the world faces, and that people feel individually, they want 0:03:41.040 --> 0:03:44.480 to vote for strong men, Donald Trump being the most 0:03:44.480 --> 0:03:49.360 notable outcome of a democratic poet, although not by any 0:03:49.440 --> 0:03:52.280 means the only one in history. They want to vote 0:03:52.280 --> 0:03:56.240 for strong men they mainly are men because they feel 0:03:56.640 --> 0:04:00.440 that in some way that transfers authority for what is 0:04:00.480 --> 0:04:05.120 happening and hopefully the fixing up of the situation to 0:04:05.200 --> 0:04:09.440 an individual in a position of greater power. Of course, 0:04:10.000 --> 0:04:10.800 that's nonsense. 0:04:11.160 --> 0:04:12.800 How do you think we got to this point? 0:04:13.280 --> 0:04:16.400 Well, look it seems to me that what's happened in 0:04:16.440 --> 0:04:20.560 America that the majority of the community there decided to 0:04:20.600 --> 0:04:24.120 allow their instinct for self to vote for Trump and 0:04:24.160 --> 0:04:28.080 bring him into power against all the things that we 0:04:28.160 --> 0:04:31.320 knew could go wrong and which are now unfolding. And 0:04:31.839 --> 0:04:35.760 heaven forbid anybody whoever supported Trump coming to me and 0:04:35.800 --> 0:04:38.000 saying I didn't know this was going to happen. It 0:04:38.120 --> 0:04:41.080 was done what eyes wide open, But it was also 0:04:41.240 --> 0:04:44.480 done in the secrecy of a ballot box where perfectly 0:04:44.600 --> 0:04:50.279 respectable people found themselves very easily able to vote for 0:04:50.279 --> 0:04:53.599 a president who was a criminal. I think also we 0:04:53.760 --> 0:04:57.919 have to not say, oh, you know, he's just trying 0:04:57.960 --> 0:05:00.279 it on. He'll fall back to some other position. There's 0:05:00.320 --> 0:05:04.719 a very big mistake in thinking that a narcissist and 0:05:04.800 --> 0:05:09.920 a bully and a personal lacking empathy is not meaning 0:05:10.480 --> 0:05:14.160 what he says. The only constraints will come from within 0:05:14.200 --> 0:05:18.200 his own camp, and they're very limited because such bullies 0:05:18.200 --> 0:05:23.360 do surround themselves with seekerphants and toadies and yes people. 0:05:23.800 --> 0:05:29.719 You see the billionaires Australian as well as American at 0:05:30.080 --> 0:05:31.120 Mara Lago. 0:05:31.760 --> 0:05:35.159 We have shades of Trump in terms of his style 0:05:35.200 --> 0:05:38.159 of leadership and politics sort of infiltrating Australia at the moment. 0:05:38.760 --> 0:05:41.280 Where do you see the threats to Australian democracy. 0:05:41.440 --> 0:05:47.080 It's interesting because we've had our democracy corporatized and the 0:05:47.120 --> 0:05:50.560 two parties getting together to pass legislation to make it 0:05:50.600 --> 0:05:54.520 harder for Independence and Greens etc. To get elected is 0:05:55.160 --> 0:05:57.640 a show of how that corporate power works. 0:05:58.560 --> 0:06:01.440 It's been described as a protect racket for the major 0:06:01.480 --> 0:06:05.000 political parties. The Labor's clinched to deal with the coalition 0:06:05.160 --> 0:06:08.080 to overhaul electoral laws in Victoria. 0:06:08.520 --> 0:06:11.960 These kinds of laws have in effect knocked Independence out 0:06:11.960 --> 0:06:15.520 of the game. It also works through the media current 0:06:15.920 --> 0:06:19.680 company accepted of course, where we see the impact that 0:06:19.680 --> 0:06:23.479 the Murdoch media has had planet wise. And there's Rupert 0:06:23.720 --> 0:06:28.280 on inauguration Day sitting next to Donald Trump in. 0:06:28.600 --> 0:06:33.960 Business publishing and probably every other Rupert is Larry pretty 0:06:34.000 --> 0:06:36.760 much in a class by himself, right, I mean, although 0:06:36.880 --> 0:06:38.960 you may have a couple of bucks more, I don't know, 0:06:39.040 --> 0:06:42.040 but what Rupert is in a class by himself is. 0:06:42.000 --> 0:06:42.960 An amazing. 0:06:44.360 --> 0:06:48.800 You just see this arrogant belief that if you're rich, 0:06:48.880 --> 0:06:50.839 you must be a good manager, and therefore you must 0:06:50.839 --> 0:06:55.120 be a person who's somehow, with biblical references thrown in, 0:06:55.520 --> 0:06:57.719 able to run the world better than the other people 0:06:57.800 --> 0:07:00.200 who you see around. And if there's one thing these 0:07:00.240 --> 0:07:05.000 folk despise, it's wisdom, a greater wisdom than their own, 0:07:05.200 --> 0:07:08.920 and compassion, a feeling of sympathy and empathy for people 0:07:08.960 --> 0:07:11.200 who are not doing as well. They don't have it, 0:07:11.280 --> 0:07:13.960 they don't want it, and they arrogate to themselves the 0:07:14.040 --> 0:07:16.280 power to run other people's lives. And that's not what 0:07:16.320 --> 0:07:17.480 a democracy is about. 0:07:20.560 --> 0:07:23.200 So how to be an optimist in the face of 0:07:23.240 --> 0:07:33.400 all of this? That's after the break, Bob. You're an 0:07:33.400 --> 0:07:36.679 optimist by nature, but given everything we're facing in twenty 0:07:36.720 --> 0:07:39.680 twenty five, how do you retain that optimism? 0:07:40.360 --> 0:07:43.360 Well, it's easier than being pessimistic, and it really is 0:07:43.360 --> 0:07:46.400 an empirical choice. I mean, it's a determined choice. I 0:07:46.480 --> 0:07:52.000 spent a decade clinically depressed as a young followed because 0:07:52.040 --> 0:07:56.960 of the Cold War and in personal circumstances, but realized 0:07:57.000 --> 0:07:59.800 towards the end of that that it was getting me nowhere, 0:08:00.000 --> 0:08:02.280 and it wasn't doing much for the people around me either. 0:08:02.800 --> 0:08:07.160 So hauling out of that by looking at what you 0:08:07.280 --> 0:08:11.400 can change for the better within your own orbit of 0:08:11.480 --> 0:08:15.000 power if you like, or influence and going for that 0:08:15.840 --> 0:08:20.080 put the bigger troubles you can't fix on the shelf. 0:08:21.080 --> 0:08:23.360 You can't, of course take them out of your mind, 0:08:23.760 --> 0:08:25.800 but get on with the things that you can change. 0:08:25.800 --> 0:08:28.760 And we have to be optimistic that there is time. 0:08:29.120 --> 0:08:32.840 And I'm forever telling other folk, don't allow anxiety to 0:08:32.960 --> 0:08:36.920 overtake you. Take the time to have parties, to have fun, 0:08:37.080 --> 0:08:41.680 to travel, to get your certificate or your degree, to 0:08:41.720 --> 0:08:47.280 find good companions, because otherwise, if things are so urgent 0:08:48.000 --> 0:08:50.640 that you can't afford to do that, then I think 0:08:50.800 --> 0:08:53.360 we just could give up. And I'm not one for 0:08:53.400 --> 0:08:57.400 giving up. I am one for saying to people, use 0:08:57.440 --> 0:09:02.400 your intelligence to override this instinct for greed which is 0:09:02.559 --> 0:09:06.280 currently ruling the world, and which is leading us into 0:09:06.360 --> 0:09:10.600 such poor circumstances. It is for us to speak up 0:09:11.000 --> 0:09:14.800 and to be confrontational. I mean, after all, these brutes 0:09:15.040 --> 0:09:18.559 are confrontational. They're straight out I want this and I'm 0:09:18.600 --> 0:09:20.720 going to have this. Well they have to be told, well, 0:09:20.720 --> 0:09:23.839 you're not getting it, because we want something different, and 0:09:24.120 --> 0:09:27.360 we have to be all in our own little circle 0:09:27.480 --> 0:09:31.800 and in our own way standing up and making account 0:09:31.800 --> 0:09:33.160 because history depends on it. 0:09:35.760 --> 0:09:39.720 Can you explain what being confrontational looks like, what speaking 0:09:39.720 --> 0:09:40.360 out looks like. 0:09:40.720 --> 0:09:46.079 Confrontational means looking eye to eye, not being a seve best. 0:09:46.280 --> 0:09:50.959 It doesn't mean being aggressive, it doesn't mean being violent, 0:09:51.200 --> 0:09:55.680 fact it's non violent. But it does mean asserting your 0:09:55.800 --> 0:09:59.880 equal authority with are they human beings, and in places 0:10:00.080 --> 0:10:04.360 of elected authority, asserting your equal authority all the way 0:10:04.360 --> 0:10:08.760 down the line with those other elected representatives. And we're 0:10:08.880 --> 0:10:13.040 schooled to be good, to be nice, to be decent, 0:10:13.520 --> 0:10:19.280 to listen, and that's fine in a working community. But 0:10:19.400 --> 0:10:22.720 these brutes of the extreme right now taking over the 0:10:22.720 --> 0:10:27.080 world and potentially this country, don't believe in any of that. 0:10:27.360 --> 0:10:31.479 They believe in repression. They believe in shutting up opponents, 0:10:31.840 --> 0:10:35.040 locking them up, jailing them and getting them off the 0:10:35.040 --> 0:10:38.079 streets and out of the way. And we can't allow 0:10:38.440 --> 0:10:41.000 that to happen. We cannot just stand by and allow 0:10:41.040 --> 0:10:44.800 that to happen. So being confrontational simply means saying what 0:10:44.920 --> 0:10:48.880 you think when the opportunity arises to those who are 0:10:48.920 --> 0:10:51.839 going the wrong direction, at whatever level they might be. 0:10:51.880 --> 0:10:54.280 It might be just people who want a vote for 0:10:54.800 --> 0:10:59.240 the extreme right. It might be in newspaper columns, it 0:10:59.320 --> 0:11:02.079 might be at the low church or sports club. Don't 0:11:02.200 --> 0:11:05.280 listen in silence to somebody saying, oh, well, it'll be 0:11:05.320 --> 0:11:07.839 good for us if we have a prime minister who's 0:11:08.480 --> 0:11:11.920 obsequius to Trump and does all the right trade deals 0:11:12.240 --> 0:11:16.319 and gets this more money. No it won't. The fractioning 0:11:16.400 --> 0:11:21.280 and loss of our hard for rights in Australia are 0:11:21.280 --> 0:11:26.160 more important than that. And let me tell you, Daniel, 0:11:26.240 --> 0:11:32.000 I look back at the almost unthinkable destruction of Aboriginal 0:11:32.040 --> 0:11:36.080 society in Tasmania in the eighteen twenties and thirties, and 0:11:37.440 --> 0:11:40.600 you know, a whole island of people destroyed within a 0:11:40.600 --> 0:11:44.520 couple of decades at the point of a gun and otherwise. 0:11:45.000 --> 0:11:47.760 And there were three landowners who kept writing to the 0:11:47.760 --> 0:11:50.319 papers who said this is wrong, we shouldn't be doing that. 0:11:50.679 --> 0:11:54.880 And I take great spirit from those because I knew 0:11:55.120 --> 0:11:58.520 they would be copying it back in their time. And 0:11:58.600 --> 0:12:03.640 now it's our time and we're challenged and it's up 0:12:03.640 --> 0:12:06.120 to all of us. 0:12:07.640 --> 0:12:09.640 Bob Brown, thank you so much for your time. 0:12:10.320 --> 0:12:11.760 A great pleasure to thank you, Daniel. 0:12:26.880 --> 0:12:29.760 Also in the news today, Peter Dutton says he may 0:12:29.800 --> 0:12:32.920 replace US Ambassador Kevin Rudd if he wins the election. 0:12:33.840 --> 0:12:37.080 Prior to his time as ambassador, Rudd described Donald Trump 0:12:37.120 --> 0:12:39.760 as a trader to the West and the most destructive 0:12:39.800 --> 0:12:43.880 president in history. Anthony Alberanezi has maintained support for Rudd 0:12:43.880 --> 0:12:46.480 in the role, but Peter Dunton says if Rudd doesn't 0:12:46.520 --> 0:12:49.640 have access and influence in Washington, he would need to go. 0:12:50.520 --> 0:12:53.880 Dunton's comments follow a campaign in the Murdoch Press calling 0:12:53.880 --> 0:12:56.839 for Rudd to be recalled as ambassador. You can read 0:12:56.880 --> 0:13:01.360 about that campaign in the Saturday Paper. And temporary residents 0:13:01.360 --> 0:13:05.480 of Australia will be banned from buying existing homes. The move, 0:13:05.520 --> 0:13:08.520 which was unveiled by Housing Minister Clara O'Neil on Sunday, 0:13:09.040 --> 0:13:12.040 will take effect on April one and last until the 0:13:12.080 --> 0:13:15.120 end of March twenty twenty seven. It prohibits any foreign 0:13:15.200 --> 0:13:18.240 investor or foreign owned company from buying and existing dwelling. 0:13:18.960 --> 0:13:23.400 Peter Dutton unveiled a similar plan last year. I'm Daniel James. 0:13:23.480 --> 0:13:32.960 This is seven am. Thanks for listening.