1
00:00:00,440 --> 00:00:04,440
Speaker 1: In this case, the prosecution relies on certain alleged conduct

2
00:00:04,559 --> 00:00:08,840
Speaker 1: by the accused as incriminating conduct, that is, as implied

3
00:00:08,880 --> 00:00:10,080
Speaker 1: admissions of guilt.

4
00:00:11,200 --> 00:00:14,720
Speaker 2: Guilt and innocence were at the heart of Justice Christopher

5
00:00:14,720 --> 00:00:18,279
Speaker 2: Bill's words today as he continued his charge to the

6
00:00:18,360 --> 00:00:21,959
Speaker 2: jury in the trial of Aaron Patterson, and for the

7
00:00:22,000 --> 00:00:24,840
Speaker 2: first time, the jury heard a role call of the

8
00:00:24,880 --> 00:00:29,639
Speaker 2: incriminating conduct allegedly committed by the accused. It was a

9
00:00:29,680 --> 00:00:33,320
Speaker 2: short session today, but Justice Bill had a lot to say.

10
00:00:34,159 --> 00:00:38,240
Speaker 2: I'm Brook Greebert Craig, and this is the mushroom cook.

11
00:00:39,720 --> 00:00:43,160
Speaker 2: I'm hearing Morewell with my colleague court reporter Laura Plossella,

12
00:00:43,280 --> 00:00:46,040
Speaker 2: and we just finished day thirty seven of the trial.

13
00:00:46,840 --> 00:00:48,919
Speaker 3: Hey there, Brooke. I don't know if our listeners can

14
00:00:48,960 --> 00:00:51,919
Speaker 3: hear this, but it has just started bucketing down in Morewell.

15
00:00:52,520 --> 00:00:54,840
Speaker 3: I don't think we've heard rain this loud the entire

16
00:00:54,880 --> 00:00:56,960
Speaker 3: time we've been here, but we will solder On.

17
00:00:57,200 --> 00:00:59,200
Speaker 2: Yes we will. It's been freezing down here.

18
00:00:59,560 --> 00:01:02,200
Speaker 3: I think today just fell shy of being the shortest

19
00:01:02,280 --> 00:01:05,360
Speaker 3: day the jury have had in the trial. I think

20
00:01:05,480 --> 00:01:07,080
Speaker 3: more than a month ago we had a day where

21
00:01:07,120 --> 00:01:10,560
Speaker 3: we only heard forty minutes of evidence, and today the

22
00:01:10,640 --> 00:01:14,839
Speaker 3: jury only heard around two hours of Justice Bill's charge.

23
00:01:14,920 --> 00:01:17,480
Speaker 3: That was because the parties had some matters they had

24
00:01:17,480 --> 00:01:20,760
Speaker 3: to work through this morning, so they were able to

25
00:01:21,000 --> 00:01:23,320
Speaker 3: enjoy a lunch break and then come in to hear

26
00:01:23,360 --> 00:01:24,280
Speaker 3: more from Justice Bill.

27
00:01:24,680 --> 00:01:27,479
Speaker 2: Yes, and that was around two fifteen today, So Justice

28
00:01:27,480 --> 00:01:30,640
Speaker 2: Bill spoke to the jury in depth about the topic

29
00:01:30,800 --> 00:01:36,080
Speaker 2: of incriminating conduct. These are his words, but not his voice.

30
00:01:36,120 --> 00:01:40,520
Speaker 1: In other words, prosecution argues that the only reasonable explanation

31
00:01:40,640 --> 00:01:43,959
Speaker 1: of the conduct alleged is that the accused knew she

32
00:01:44,080 --> 00:01:47,480
Speaker 1: was guilty of the offenses with which she's charged and

33
00:01:47,640 --> 00:01:51,240
Speaker 1: engaged in the relevant conduct in an endeavor to conceal

34
00:01:51,320 --> 00:01:55,080
Speaker 1: her guilt. The defense, on the other hand, argues that

35
00:01:55,120 --> 00:01:59,080
Speaker 1: there are other reasonable, innocent explanations for the alleged conduct

36
00:01:59,440 --> 00:02:00,960
Speaker 1: relied on by the prosecution.

37
00:02:02,040 --> 00:02:04,920
Speaker 2: Justice Bill then went on to outline what the prosecution

38
00:02:05,160 --> 00:02:06,320
Speaker 2: claims in the case.

39
00:02:07,120 --> 00:02:08,800
Speaker 3: And this is where he made his way through that

40
00:02:08,919 --> 00:02:11,560
Speaker 3: role call you mentioned at the top of the episode, Brook,

41
00:02:12,000 --> 00:02:13,920
Speaker 3: and I'll run through it today just like he did.

42
00:02:14,000 --> 00:02:16,760
Speaker 3: He pretty much put it together as a list. And

43
00:02:16,880 --> 00:02:20,040
Speaker 3: while the jury have obviously heard evidence around all of

44
00:02:20,040 --> 00:02:23,480
Speaker 3: these points and The prosecution referred to all of these

45
00:02:23,480 --> 00:02:26,840
Speaker 3: points in their closing address. This was the first time,

46
00:02:27,240 --> 00:02:29,880
Speaker 3: at least in my memory, that these points have been

47
00:02:29,919 --> 00:02:32,840
Speaker 3: put to the jury one after the other. So again

48
00:02:32,880 --> 00:02:35,720
Speaker 3: before I launch in, these are all of the allegations

49
00:02:35,760 --> 00:02:39,600
Speaker 3: of incriminating conduct that the prosecution alleged were committed by

50
00:02:39,720 --> 00:02:43,800
Speaker 3: Erin after the lunch. So they say she lied about

51
00:02:43,840 --> 00:02:48,280
Speaker 3: being unwell and was faking deathcat mushroom poisoning. She lied

52
00:02:48,320 --> 00:02:52,480
Speaker 3: about using dried mushrooms from an Asian grosser. She refused

53
00:02:52,520 --> 00:02:56,240
Speaker 3: treatment on her first presentation to hospital and discharged herself

54
00:02:56,280 --> 00:03:00,160
Speaker 3: against medical advice. She was reluctant to accept treatment on

55
00:03:00,200 --> 00:03:04,120
Speaker 3: her second presentation to hospital. She was reluctant to obtain

56
00:03:04,200 --> 00:03:07,720
Speaker 3: treatment for her children. She lied about feeding her children

57
00:03:07,760 --> 00:03:10,520
Speaker 3: the leftovers of the beef Wellington with the mushrooms and

58
00:03:10,560 --> 00:03:14,480
Speaker 3: pastry scraped off. She reset Phone B, a phone she

59
00:03:14,560 --> 00:03:19,480
Speaker 3: handed to police multiple times. She disposed of her dehydrator

60
00:03:19,560 --> 00:03:23,720
Speaker 3: at the local tip. She provided police phone B instead

61
00:03:23,760 --> 00:03:27,200
Speaker 3: of phone A, her usual phone. She lied about her

62
00:03:27,240 --> 00:03:30,239
Speaker 3: phone number ending in eight three five during her record

63
00:03:30,240 --> 00:03:34,480
Speaker 3: of interview, and finally she lied about never having foraged

64
00:03:34,480 --> 00:03:37,360
Speaker 3: for mushrooms and never having owned a dehydrator.

65
00:03:38,360 --> 00:03:41,280
Speaker 2: Justice Bill then said that he would summarize the evidence

66
00:03:41,400 --> 00:03:45,240
Speaker 2: relating to each allegation, and he started with Aaron refusing

67
00:03:45,280 --> 00:03:49,480
Speaker 2: treatment on her first presentation to hospital and discharging herself

68
00:03:49,560 --> 00:03:51,120
Speaker 2: against medical advice.

69
00:03:51,920 --> 00:03:54,560
Speaker 3: He took them back to the evidence of doctor Chris Webster,

70
00:03:55,200 --> 00:04:00,360
Speaker 3: doctor Fronica Foot, and nurse Kylie Ashton, among others. After

71
00:04:00,400 --> 00:04:02,920
Speaker 3: he summarized the evidence, he then moved on to the

72
00:04:03,040 --> 00:04:06,440
Speaker 3: arguments from the prosecution about this allegation. Here is what

73
00:04:06,520 --> 00:04:06,880
Speaker 3: he said.

74
00:04:07,560 --> 00:04:11,720
Speaker 1: The prosecution argued that the only reasonable explanation for her

75
00:04:11,840 --> 00:04:17,120
Speaker 1: unwillingness to receive emergency treatment and her discharging herself against

76
00:04:17,160 --> 00:04:21,240
Speaker 1: medical advice is that she knew she hadn't consumed death

77
00:04:21,279 --> 00:04:25,520
Speaker 1: cap mushrooms because she had deliberately poisoned her guests with

78
00:04:25,640 --> 00:04:29,640
Speaker 1: death cap mushrooms, making sure she did not also consume

79
00:04:29,720 --> 00:04:30,359
Speaker 1: the toxins.

80
00:04:30,720 --> 00:04:34,360
Speaker 3: He also took them to the arguments from the defense, and.

81
00:04:34,279 --> 00:04:38,120
Speaker 1: In brief, the defense argued that a reasonable explanation for

82
00:04:38,200 --> 00:04:41,720
Speaker 1: refusing to receive treatment was that she found it difficult

83
00:04:41,760 --> 00:04:45,120
Speaker 1: to accept that she could have suffered death cap mushroom

84
00:04:45,200 --> 00:04:48,400
Speaker 1: poisoning she wasn't informed to the full extent of the

85
00:04:48,400 --> 00:04:51,719
Speaker 1: medical conditions of the lunch guests. She did not come

86
00:04:51,760 --> 00:04:54,520
Speaker 1: prepared to be admitted overnight, but she was led to

87
00:04:54,520 --> 00:04:58,760
Speaker 1: believe it involved transfer to a tertiary hospital, he added,

88
00:04:59,480 --> 00:05:03,160
Speaker 1: and to assess this all in the context of her

89
00:05:03,279 --> 00:05:07,479
Speaker 1: having a history of discharging herself against medical advice and

90
00:05:07,600 --> 00:05:09,480
Speaker 1: second guessing medicos.

91
00:05:09,560 --> 00:05:12,800
Speaker 3: Incriminating conduct was the last topic Justice Bihal spoke about

92
00:05:12,800 --> 00:05:15,080
Speaker 3: today and was only able to make his way through

93
00:05:15,080 --> 00:05:18,839
Speaker 3: the evidence of one of the eleven allegations. He will

94
00:05:18,880 --> 00:05:23,680
Speaker 3: return to summarizing the rest tomorrow, but earlier Justice Bill

95
00:05:23,880 --> 00:05:27,800
Speaker 3: returned to the topic of expert evidence, in particular the

96
00:05:27,880 --> 00:05:32,440
Speaker 3: testimony of senior digital forensics officer Charman fox Henry from

97
00:05:32,520 --> 00:05:33,560
Speaker 3: Victoria Police.

98
00:05:34,120 --> 00:05:37,359
Speaker 2: And just to remind our listeners, mister fox Henry was

99
00:05:37,400 --> 00:05:42,280
Speaker 2: one of the officers who examined devices seized from Aaron's home, just.

100
00:05:42,279 --> 00:05:45,960
Speaker 3: As he did yesterday with digital forensics expert Matthew Cerell.

101
00:05:46,920 --> 00:05:50,280
Speaker 3: Justice Beal reminded the jury of his qualifications and how

102
00:05:50,279 --> 00:05:53,480
Speaker 3: long he had spent at Victoria Police. He told them

103
00:05:53,480 --> 00:05:55,880
Speaker 3: that mister fox Henry moved across to the cyber crime

104
00:05:55,920 --> 00:05:59,360
Speaker 3: squad in July twenty three, and did not have any

105
00:05:59,360 --> 00:06:02,479
Speaker 3: of the qualificationations he now holds when he received the

106
00:06:02,520 --> 00:06:05,520
Speaker 3: devices the next month. In a similar fashion to how

107
00:06:05,520 --> 00:06:09,960
Speaker 3: he dealt with doctor Currel's evidence yesterday, Justice Beale summarized

108
00:06:10,040 --> 00:06:13,520
Speaker 3: what mister fox Henry said about the cooler Master computer

109
00:06:14,080 --> 00:06:16,600
Speaker 3: that was seized from Aaron's house, as well as a

110
00:06:16,640 --> 00:06:20,160
Speaker 3: Samsung tablet and phone B. As part of his summary,

111
00:06:20,520 --> 00:06:24,080
Speaker 3: Justice Beial also referred to Erin's evidence, where she said

112
00:06:24,080 --> 00:06:26,719
Speaker 3: it was possible she may have used the cooler Master

113
00:06:26,800 --> 00:06:30,360
Speaker 3: computer to visit the I Natchalist website on May twenty eight,

114
00:06:30,520 --> 00:06:33,600
Speaker 3: twenty twenty two, and how she admitted to factory resetting

115
00:06:33,600 --> 00:06:36,880
Speaker 3: Phone B in a panic while police were searching her home.

116
00:06:37,480 --> 00:06:40,119
Speaker 3: Justice Beale then turned to how the jury can use

117
00:06:40,200 --> 00:06:43,240
Speaker 3: this expert evidence from mister fox Henry. This is what

118
00:06:43,320 --> 00:06:43,719
Speaker 3: he said.

119
00:06:44,040 --> 00:06:48,320
Speaker 1: The issues that his opinions bear upon include whether you

120
00:06:48,400 --> 00:06:52,360
Speaker 1: can reasonably infer that on twenty eight May twenty twenty two,

121
00:06:52,920 --> 00:06:57,560
Speaker 1: the accused sought information on the I Naturalist website regarding

122
00:06:57,560 --> 00:07:00,760
Speaker 1: the locations of deathcap mushrooms in victorm Arrea. For a

123
00:07:00,800 --> 00:07:05,640
Speaker 1: second time, whether the accused access to Christine Mackenzie's post

124
00:07:05,680 --> 00:07:09,560
Speaker 1: on I Naturalist of the Observation of deathcap Mushrooms in

125
00:07:09,600 --> 00:07:14,160
Speaker 1: Locke Reserve on eighteen April twenty twenty three, whether she

126
00:07:14,200 --> 00:07:17,480
Speaker 1: sourced death cap mushrooms in Locke on twenty eight April

127
00:07:17,560 --> 00:07:21,480
Speaker 1: twenty twenty three, whether she accessed doctor May's post on

128
00:07:21,640 --> 00:07:26,160
Speaker 1: Iron Naturalist of the Observation of deathcap Mushrooms in Nielsen Street,

129
00:07:26,160 --> 00:07:30,400
Speaker 1: Outrim on twenty one May twenty twenty three, whether she

130
00:07:30,560 --> 00:07:34,160
Speaker 1: sourced or attempted to source deathcap mushrooms in Locke on

131
00:07:34,240 --> 00:07:38,000
Speaker 1: twenty two May twenty twenty three, and whether she sourced

132
00:07:38,160 --> 00:07:41,840
Speaker 1: or attempted to source deathcap mushrooms in Autrim on twenty

133
00:07:41,920 --> 00:07:46,120
Speaker 1: two May twenty twenty three, and whether she deliberately and

134
00:07:46,160 --> 00:07:50,080
Speaker 1: knowingly put death cap mushrooms into the beef. Wellington's served

135
00:07:50,080 --> 00:07:52,800
Speaker 1: to the lunch guests on twenty nine July.

136
00:07:53,240 --> 00:07:55,640
Speaker 3: But he also reminded the jury that there was no

137
00:07:55,680 --> 00:07:59,320
Speaker 3: evidence in this case of erin seeing the posts by

138
00:07:59,320 --> 00:08:02,080
Speaker 3: Miss mcken's and doctor May, So.

139
00:08:02,160 --> 00:08:04,559
Speaker 2: After just two hours of being in court, the jury

140
00:08:04,640 --> 00:08:05,400
Speaker 2: was done for the day.

141
00:08:06,160 --> 00:08:08,600
Speaker 3: Before they left, Justice Biale told them that he wouldn't

142
00:08:08,600 --> 00:08:12,240
Speaker 3: be completing his charge tomorrow. He then said, you can

143
00:08:12,280 --> 00:08:14,520
Speaker 3: live in Hope, which prompted laughs from the jurors.

144
00:08:15,160 --> 00:08:18,920
Speaker 2: So we'll be back tomorrow with more of Justice Bill's charge.

145
00:08:19,160 --> 00:08:22,480
Speaker 2: Thanks brook In the meantime, go to the mushroomcook dot

146
00:08:22,520 --> 00:08:23,880
Speaker 2: com dot au for more