1 00:00:00,600 --> 00:00:04,200 Speaker 1: Tivy and cook, David Bryan K Patrick Gillespian. It's the 2 00:00:04,200 --> 00:00:07,440 Speaker 1: bloody you project. It's jumbo up the front. Where else 3 00:00:07,480 --> 00:00:10,600 Speaker 1: would I be? We'll start with the lady in the room, height. 4 00:00:10,360 --> 00:00:13,680 Speaker 2: Tiv front and center. You never he stumbled over all 5 00:00:13,720 --> 00:00:15,320 Speaker 2: of those middle names this time. 6 00:00:15,800 --> 00:00:17,680 Speaker 1: Yeah, I don't know. I don't know. He's told me 7 00:00:17,720 --> 00:00:20,520 Speaker 1: I forget. Do you remember now? Do you remember? 8 00:00:21,160 --> 00:00:24,959 Speaker 3: I don't remember them my real one. No, I have 9 00:00:25,000 --> 00:00:28,000 Speaker 3: a real middle name. I remember. It makes that's right. 10 00:00:28,240 --> 00:00:32,760 Speaker 3: See look at Tiffany wow because it makes an embarrassing acronym. 11 00:00:33,159 --> 00:00:36,320 Speaker 1: Yeah, Dad, I thought of that attic as it came 12 00:00:36,360 --> 00:00:39,600 Speaker 1: out of your mouth. Tiff Have you been cookie? How's 13 00:00:39,680 --> 00:00:44,600 Speaker 1: the piano career, the musical career has it taken off? 14 00:00:45,360 --> 00:00:50,320 Speaker 2: It's it's volatile because I go from in a moment yeah, 15 00:00:50,360 --> 00:00:52,320 Speaker 2: because you know, I'm like a little bit impatient and 16 00:00:52,360 --> 00:00:56,400 Speaker 2: I'm like, all right, boring, next, got this mastered, And 17 00:00:56,440 --> 00:00:58,960 Speaker 2: in the moment I'm onto something new, I get frustrated. 18 00:00:58,960 --> 00:01:03,040 Speaker 2: I'm like, why is this doing even had? How could 19 00:01:03,040 --> 00:01:06,480 Speaker 2: they make it make any less sense? Music and reading music? 20 00:01:07,000 --> 00:01:10,000 Speaker 1: Really, I don't know that that's meant to be one 21 00:01:10,040 --> 00:01:14,679 Speaker 1: of the emotional and or psychological outcomes of playing music. 22 00:01:14,760 --> 00:01:17,560 Speaker 1: I feel like it's meant to do the opposite. 23 00:01:17,000 --> 00:01:20,360 Speaker 2: For one, that's where I'm at my best. 24 00:01:20,880 --> 00:01:23,320 Speaker 1: I don't know that you're meant to be competitive when 25 00:01:23,360 --> 00:01:24,760 Speaker 1: you're learning the piano tip. 26 00:01:25,160 --> 00:01:27,040 Speaker 2: I know, but that's how I do everything. 27 00:01:27,880 --> 00:01:28,600 Speaker 1: How's that going? 28 00:01:29,640 --> 00:01:29,920 Speaker 3: Well? 29 00:01:30,080 --> 00:01:34,319 Speaker 1: Really it is it? Could I run you through a. 30 00:01:36,520 --> 00:01:39,959 Speaker 3: Have I dropped in on a psychology session here or something? Ever? 31 00:01:40,920 --> 00:01:48,360 Speaker 1: Sorry? Sorry coming from Australia's leading anti psychology advocate. How 32 00:01:48,400 --> 00:01:49,920 Speaker 1: are you, sir? How's your day going? 33 00:01:50,240 --> 00:01:50,320 Speaker 3: What? 34 00:01:50,400 --> 00:01:55,040 Speaker 1: It's Wednesday? Arbo? What's going on up there? Did you 35 00:01:55,040 --> 00:01:56,640 Speaker 1: go to work today? Did you put on a suit? 36 00:01:57,920 --> 00:01:59,520 Speaker 3: I did go to work. I didn't put on a 37 00:01:59,560 --> 00:02:02,680 Speaker 3: suit because I didn't leave my office to go to work. 38 00:02:02,760 --> 00:02:04,840 Speaker 3: But yeah, I did some work. 39 00:02:05,320 --> 00:02:07,240 Speaker 1: Like an absolute grown up. Well, you wrote a good 40 00:02:07,320 --> 00:02:08,880 Speaker 1: article that I don't know when you write it, but 41 00:02:08,919 --> 00:02:09,280 Speaker 1: it went. 42 00:02:09,240 --> 00:02:12,519 Speaker 3: Up today on finish it this morning. Yes, it's been 43 00:02:12,720 --> 00:02:14,280 Speaker 3: in progress all week. 44 00:02:15,200 --> 00:02:19,440 Speaker 1: So it's on substack everyone. Doctor Gillespie, as many of 45 00:02:19,440 --> 00:02:23,160 Speaker 1: our listeners call you, Doctor Gillespie, who, just to be clear, 46 00:02:23,200 --> 00:02:28,240 Speaker 1: isn't a doctor but could be could be. Doctor Gillespie 47 00:02:28,360 --> 00:02:33,919 Speaker 1: has written an article silencing the food noise, and it's 48 00:02:34,080 --> 00:02:40,359 Speaker 1: basically the once upon a time of ozeenpic. So it's 49 00:02:40,520 --> 00:02:46,160 Speaker 1: now just so it's a g LP one what do 50 00:02:46,200 --> 00:02:46,720 Speaker 1: they call it? 51 00:02:46,760 --> 00:02:51,720 Speaker 3: And yes, yeah, yeah, agonist. 52 00:02:51,440 --> 00:02:56,400 Speaker 1: So it's it's intended purpose Originally, I think I have 53 00:02:56,480 --> 00:02:58,680 Speaker 1: not read the article. I should have. I apologize, but 54 00:02:58,720 --> 00:03:03,920 Speaker 1: it's lower blood sugar. Was that its original intent? In fact, 55 00:03:03,919 --> 00:03:06,920 Speaker 1: why don't you just tell us the story? You should 56 00:03:07,000 --> 00:03:10,640 Speaker 1: read these articles. You know, it's a place I normally do. 57 00:03:10,720 --> 00:03:15,440 Speaker 1: I had a corporate gig, Thesavo, and so I apologize. 58 00:03:16,120 --> 00:03:18,600 Speaker 3: Okay. So it sort of started in the seventies when 59 00:03:18,639 --> 00:03:23,480 Speaker 3: they were first started fiddling around with insulin and its 60 00:03:23,520 --> 00:03:31,320 Speaker 3: counterpart of glucagon. Sorry, not glucagen. It's the They were 61 00:03:31,320 --> 00:03:35,600 Speaker 3: doing it because a brand new disease was starting to occur, 62 00:03:35,840 --> 00:03:38,760 Speaker 3: called type two diabetes. And it might seem odd to 63 00:03:38,800 --> 00:03:41,400 Speaker 3: people today to think of type two diabetes as being 64 00:03:41,520 --> 00:03:45,360 Speaker 3: a brand new disease, but it is. It really really 65 00:03:45,440 --> 00:03:48,440 Speaker 3: wasn't a problem before the early nineteen eighties when we 66 00:03:49,000 --> 00:03:54,600 Speaker 3: started taking health advice from the government and it so 67 00:03:54,680 --> 00:03:58,240 Speaker 3: scientists were tooling around with some of the hormones which 68 00:03:58,280 --> 00:04:05,520 Speaker 3: they knew were in this most particularly insulin. And you know, 69 00:04:05,600 --> 00:04:09,440 Speaker 3: insulin's main job is to move glucose out of the 70 00:04:09,440 --> 00:04:14,440 Speaker 3: bloodstream and into cells that need it. So you know, 71 00:04:14,920 --> 00:04:17,760 Speaker 3: if muscles need energy, then they put receptors up to 72 00:04:17,760 --> 00:04:21,400 Speaker 3: their cell surface, and insulin comes along and unlocks the 73 00:04:21,480 --> 00:04:24,799 Speaker 3: receptor to allow the glucose to enter. Glucose just can't 74 00:04:24,800 --> 00:04:27,560 Speaker 3: really nearly enter any cell in the body. It needs 75 00:04:27,640 --> 00:04:31,640 Speaker 3: insulin to do it. And so insulin is produced in 76 00:04:31,720 --> 00:04:36,760 Speaker 3: response to us eating stuff, and that raises our blood 77 00:04:36,800 --> 00:04:41,039 Speaker 3: sugar level, which then causes insulin to be released, and 78 00:04:41,080 --> 00:04:44,720 Speaker 3: then the insulin helps remove the glucose from the bloodstream. 79 00:04:45,120 --> 00:04:49,919 Speaker 3: But you don't want to overshoot, because you know, you 80 00:04:49,920 --> 00:04:52,359 Speaker 3: don't want all that insulin in your bloodstream running around 81 00:04:52,480 --> 00:04:56,240 Speaker 3: releasing all the glucose out, and then you've got no 82 00:04:56,240 --> 00:04:59,279 Speaker 3: glucose left in your bloodstream and you're dropped dead. So 83 00:04:59,600 --> 00:05:03,880 Speaker 3: we have a counterpart to that called gluckagon, which is 84 00:05:03,920 --> 00:05:09,000 Speaker 3: sort of anti insulin, if you like. And so when 85 00:05:09,160 --> 00:05:13,320 Speaker 3: blood sugar levels start to go too low, either because 86 00:05:13,360 --> 00:05:16,360 Speaker 3: you haven't eaten for a while or you've been exercising 87 00:05:16,480 --> 00:05:19,640 Speaker 3: like a nutbag, then your body needs to bring those 88 00:05:19,720 --> 00:05:23,719 Speaker 3: levels back up again, otherwise your brain will stop working 89 00:05:23,960 --> 00:05:30,680 Speaker 3: and other important organs will probably too. And the glugagon 90 00:05:30,880 --> 00:05:36,480 Speaker 3: travels to the liver and instructs the liver to release 91 00:05:36,600 --> 00:05:39,599 Speaker 3: some sugar back into the bloodstream, so bring the sugar 92 00:05:39,600 --> 00:05:41,960 Speaker 3: back up again. So that's what they knew in the 93 00:05:42,040 --> 00:05:48,880 Speaker 3: nineteen seventies, and they, looking at that, thought, oh, maybe 94 00:05:48,920 --> 00:05:52,600 Speaker 3: if we get to fiddle around with these hormones a bit, 95 00:05:53,880 --> 00:05:56,840 Speaker 3: maybe we'll be able to do something about type two diabetes. 96 00:05:57,040 --> 00:06:02,680 Speaker 3: Because type two diabetes is where you essentially have, you know, 97 00:06:02,839 --> 00:06:06,760 Speaker 3: the blood shower is too high, and the body becomes 98 00:06:06,800 --> 00:06:10,800 Speaker 3: effectively insulin resistant, that is, it's no longer listening to 99 00:06:10,880 --> 00:06:14,800 Speaker 3: the signal from insulin telling cells to absorb the glucose 100 00:06:14,839 --> 00:06:19,240 Speaker 3: out of the bloodstream, and having persistently glucose can start 101 00:06:19,240 --> 00:06:22,880 Speaker 3: to do real damage. So they thought, oh, well, what 102 00:06:22,920 --> 00:06:25,000 Speaker 3: if we fiddle around with the glucagon bit of that 103 00:06:25,240 --> 00:06:28,599 Speaker 3: and see if we can, you know, fix that problem 104 00:06:28,640 --> 00:06:33,000 Speaker 3: with a bit of messing about. They weren't terribly successful 105 00:06:33,080 --> 00:06:39,080 Speaker 3: doing that, but they did happen across some other substances 106 00:06:40,360 --> 00:06:45,080 Speaker 3: that were seemed to be part of the equation. They 107 00:06:45,080 --> 00:06:47,360 Speaker 3: weren't quite sure what they did, but they did notice 108 00:06:47,400 --> 00:06:50,080 Speaker 3: that one of them, in particular, one called GLP one 109 00:06:50,680 --> 00:06:57,080 Speaker 3: or glucagon like peptide one, did an interesting thing. It 110 00:06:57,160 --> 00:06:59,800 Speaker 3: seemed to be released around the same time as glucagon, 111 00:07:00,320 --> 00:07:08,080 Speaker 3: and what it did was not only suppress appetite seemingly 112 00:07:08,240 --> 00:07:12,120 Speaker 3: by sending a signal directly to the brain to tell 113 00:07:12,200 --> 00:07:16,680 Speaker 3: us to stop eating, but it also made us feel 114 00:07:16,800 --> 00:07:21,800 Speaker 3: physically full even if we weren't, so it essentially would 115 00:07:21,840 --> 00:07:25,680 Speaker 3: shut us down. It was the biochemical equivalent of I 116 00:07:25,680 --> 00:07:27,440 Speaker 3: don't know, wiring your mouth shut. 117 00:07:29,320 --> 00:07:29,480 Speaker 2: You. 118 00:07:30,080 --> 00:07:32,280 Speaker 3: If you were hit with this stuff, you couldn't eat anymore. 119 00:07:33,640 --> 00:07:37,760 Speaker 3: And so they thought, oh, this is an interesting thing. 120 00:07:38,880 --> 00:07:42,520 Speaker 3: Maybe if we gave people with type two diabetes some 121 00:07:42,560 --> 00:07:51,760 Speaker 3: of this g l P one, then they's they'd eat less, 122 00:07:51,960 --> 00:07:54,680 Speaker 3: but their blood sugar would be lower, and maybe that 123 00:07:54,720 --> 00:07:58,400 Speaker 3: would help their diabetes. So they started doing some trials. 124 00:07:58,520 --> 00:08:03,040 Speaker 3: It actually did, by the way. So the trouble with 125 00:08:03,160 --> 00:08:08,520 Speaker 3: it was that it doesn't last very long in the body. 126 00:08:10,520 --> 00:08:14,559 Speaker 3: So they gave it to people. It normalized their blood 127 00:08:14,600 --> 00:08:21,000 Speaker 3: sugar levels, it made them feel full, but it was 128 00:08:21,400 --> 00:08:24,840 Speaker 3: gone in minutes. It had a half life of minutes 129 00:08:24,880 --> 00:08:30,360 Speaker 3: in the bloodstream. Mostly because we have a thing naturally 130 00:08:30,360 --> 00:08:33,440 Speaker 3: occurring called DPP four, which I'm sure you're all terribly 131 00:08:33,440 --> 00:08:36,240 Speaker 3: interested in, but it's kind of a molecular pac Man 132 00:08:36,280 --> 00:08:40,120 Speaker 3: that goes around eliminating GLP one. Because this is all 133 00:08:40,160 --> 00:08:43,640 Speaker 3: supposed to be being done in real time adjustments minute 134 00:08:43,640 --> 00:08:45,880 Speaker 3: to minute in the human body. You know, you've got 135 00:08:45,880 --> 00:08:48,439 Speaker 3: a bit too much blood sugar adjusted one way, got 136 00:08:48,480 --> 00:08:51,000 Speaker 3: a little too little adjusted the other way, and so 137 00:08:51,040 --> 00:08:54,000 Speaker 3: the body is really good at balancing those things, and 138 00:08:54,040 --> 00:08:57,520 Speaker 3: so pumping us full of one of those hormones, which 139 00:08:57,559 --> 00:09:01,160 Speaker 3: is what they were doing, didn't really work very well 140 00:09:01,200 --> 00:09:03,480 Speaker 3: because the body said, ah, there's too much of that hormone. 141 00:09:03,520 --> 00:09:05,920 Speaker 3: I'll just go and clean that up, and it did 142 00:09:05,960 --> 00:09:08,880 Speaker 3: so within minutes. So the only real way it could 143 00:09:08,920 --> 00:09:11,800 Speaker 3: be effective was to put someone on a drip where 144 00:09:11,840 --> 00:09:15,080 Speaker 3: they were being continuously infused with it, and yes, then 145 00:09:15,120 --> 00:09:19,840 Speaker 3: it did work. But that's not a particularly practicable, practical, 146 00:09:20,320 --> 00:09:24,200 Speaker 3: or saleable way of managing type two diabetes. So this 147 00:09:24,240 --> 00:09:29,360 Speaker 3: is where the drug companies got involved, In particular, Novo 148 00:09:30,040 --> 00:09:32,599 Speaker 3: Nordisk always get their name wrong. Is Nova Nordisk I 149 00:09:32,679 --> 00:09:36,880 Speaker 3: think it was who said let's have a look at 150 00:09:36,920 --> 00:09:39,400 Speaker 3: this let's see if we can crack this nut about 151 00:09:39,559 --> 00:09:41,559 Speaker 3: not having to have people tended to have dripped the 152 00:09:41,600 --> 00:09:45,360 Speaker 3: whole time just to have this effect. And what they 153 00:09:45,360 --> 00:09:48,760 Speaker 3: did is they managed to engineer a fatty coating to 154 00:09:49,080 --> 00:09:52,360 Speaker 3: the GLT one that stopped it being destroyed by the 155 00:09:52,440 --> 00:09:56,679 Speaker 3: DPP four and it would last thirteen hours rather than 156 00:09:57,200 --> 00:10:01,440 Speaker 3: a minute. So suddenly you've got something that you could 157 00:10:01,520 --> 00:10:07,000 Speaker 3: inject that will last a day effectively because the rest 158 00:10:07,000 --> 00:10:10,640 Speaker 3: of the time you're asleep, And now you've got a 159 00:10:10,679 --> 00:10:14,760 Speaker 3: marketable drug. So that's what they first came out with 160 00:10:15,400 --> 00:10:20,959 Speaker 3: in the nineties I think it was, And from there 161 00:10:21,280 --> 00:10:26,280 Speaker 3: the development took it further and said, hey, all right, 162 00:10:26,559 --> 00:10:30,160 Speaker 3: we're making lots of money from that. What if we 163 00:10:30,160 --> 00:10:32,400 Speaker 3: could do something that didn't have to be injected daily 164 00:10:32,600 --> 00:10:35,720 Speaker 3: because even that's still a big ask, just say to 165 00:10:35,760 --> 00:10:38,240 Speaker 3: someone with type to diabetes where you do have to 166 00:10:38,280 --> 00:10:42,320 Speaker 3: inject this thing every day. And there was the other 167 00:10:42,360 --> 00:10:46,600 Speaker 3: little problem, which is that, rather like GLP one, it 168 00:10:46,640 --> 00:10:49,960 Speaker 3: also tended to make people extremely nauseous to the point 169 00:10:49,960 --> 00:10:53,960 Speaker 3: of vomiting. Remembering that one of the effects of this thing, 170 00:10:54,080 --> 00:10:56,679 Speaker 3: GLP one, is to make us feel full, and if 171 00:10:56,760 --> 00:11:00,320 Speaker 3: you are on a continuous infusion of this. It is 172 00:11:00,480 --> 00:11:02,320 Speaker 3: like you have just eaten the biggest meal of your 173 00:11:02,360 --> 00:11:05,280 Speaker 3: life the entire time, and a lot of people's reaction 174 00:11:05,360 --> 00:11:09,400 Speaker 3: to that is to vomit. So they feel so nauseous 175 00:11:09,440 --> 00:11:13,040 Speaker 3: and so sick from being so full feeling that they vomit. 176 00:11:13,200 --> 00:11:15,760 Speaker 3: So that's a bit of a nasty side effect as well, 177 00:11:15,960 --> 00:11:17,760 Speaker 3: which limited its use. But it was a little bit 178 00:11:17,840 --> 00:11:19,600 Speaker 3: less with the one that they made that had the 179 00:11:19,600 --> 00:11:23,920 Speaker 3: fatty covering and that lasted thirteen hours. Wind forward a 180 00:11:23,920 --> 00:11:29,160 Speaker 3: bit and they eventually cracked the problem, came up with 181 00:11:29,200 --> 00:11:32,160 Speaker 3: a better version of it, one that would last an 182 00:11:32,280 --> 00:11:36,160 Speaker 3: entire week before it was destroyed by the body. And 183 00:11:36,200 --> 00:11:40,920 Speaker 3: that's what we call a zenpic now. And so suddenly 184 00:11:41,000 --> 00:11:44,880 Speaker 3: they'd created all of this time while all this research 185 00:11:45,000 --> 00:11:47,080 Speaker 3: was going on. Of course, diabetes begetting worse and worse 186 00:11:47,120 --> 00:11:49,719 Speaker 3: and worse and worse at an exponential race. So we're 187 00:11:49,720 --> 00:11:52,400 Speaker 3: gone from the nineteen eighties where it barely existed. They're 188 00:11:52,400 --> 00:11:54,200 Speaker 3: doing all this research. By the time we get into 189 00:11:54,240 --> 00:11:59,080 Speaker 3: the early noughties, then there's a market. Then there's a 190 00:11:59,120 --> 00:12:02,480 Speaker 3: real market, and suddenly they've got a license to print money. 191 00:12:04,160 --> 00:12:07,760 Speaker 3: Then they paid close attention to something they had noticed 192 00:12:07,800 --> 00:12:11,000 Speaker 3: in some of the earlier studies, which is, not only 193 00:12:11,040 --> 00:12:15,559 Speaker 3: did it seem to hold people's type two diabetes in check, 194 00:12:16,320 --> 00:12:18,720 Speaker 3: they seem to lose a lot of weight while they 195 00:12:18,760 --> 00:12:23,280 Speaker 3: were consuming it. And I guess that's not unexpected, you know, 196 00:12:23,480 --> 00:12:26,520 Speaker 3: if you're having something that makes you feel full to 197 00:12:26,559 --> 00:12:29,560 Speaker 3: the point where you want to throw up, you've got 198 00:12:29,600 --> 00:12:35,439 Speaker 3: to eat less. So and then suddenly they found out 199 00:12:35,440 --> 00:12:37,880 Speaker 3: that if you increase the dose a bit, you can 200 00:12:37,920 --> 00:12:40,120 Speaker 3: really up that weight loss into the sort of ten 201 00:12:40,200 --> 00:12:44,199 Speaker 3: to fifteen percent range for most people. And that's products 202 00:12:44,240 --> 00:12:46,840 Speaker 3: like Wegovi, for example, which is a higher dose version, 203 00:12:47,840 --> 00:12:50,800 Speaker 3: and it has approval to be sold as a weight 204 00:12:50,840 --> 00:12:53,480 Speaker 3: loss medication, at least in the United States. 205 00:12:53,520 --> 00:12:54,360 Speaker 1: So it. 206 00:12:56,000 --> 00:13:00,600 Speaker 3: That's how we've gotten to today, which is first of all, 207 00:13:00,640 --> 00:13:03,000 Speaker 3: just trying to find a way to do something about 208 00:13:03,000 --> 00:13:05,880 Speaker 3: the hormones and fix type two diabetes, which was then 209 00:13:06,400 --> 00:13:09,359 Speaker 3: not much of a problem but was clearly a growing problem. 210 00:13:09,880 --> 00:13:12,000 Speaker 3: Now we've got an epidemic of type two diabetes and 211 00:13:12,040 --> 00:13:14,440 Speaker 3: it's getting worse by the minute. And we've also got 212 00:13:14,480 --> 00:13:17,240 Speaker 3: an epidemic of obesity, and it's getting worse by the minute. 213 00:13:17,360 --> 00:13:21,280 Speaker 3: And this drug appears to address both of them, at 214 00:13:21,360 --> 00:13:24,440 Speaker 3: least as long as you keep taking the drug. So 215 00:13:25,679 --> 00:13:28,120 Speaker 3: it is unfortunately the case that as soon as you 216 00:13:28,240 --> 00:13:32,440 Speaker 3: stop injecting this stuff, your body goes back to the 217 00:13:32,440 --> 00:13:33,040 Speaker 3: way it was. 218 00:13:34,160 --> 00:13:37,400 Speaker 1: But I just ask, and so is the weight loss 219 00:13:37,480 --> 00:13:41,640 Speaker 1: mechanism is essentially just because people are consuming less calories, 220 00:13:41,679 --> 00:13:44,240 Speaker 1: so still energy in and out is the I. 221 00:13:44,200 --> 00:13:48,480 Speaker 3: Mean it's to do. It does have an effect on 222 00:13:48,559 --> 00:13:52,000 Speaker 3: the brain's appetite control system a little as well, but 223 00:13:53,000 --> 00:13:56,720 Speaker 3: it's a transient effect. The primary effect of it is 224 00:13:56,760 --> 00:13:59,800 Speaker 3: that you feel so full that you couldn't eat anything anyway. 225 00:14:00,280 --> 00:14:04,000 Speaker 1: So I guess it messes also with grellin and you know, 226 00:14:04,040 --> 00:14:06,720 Speaker 1: the hunger hormone, and I think it's leptin, the society 227 00:14:06,800 --> 00:14:10,040 Speaker 1: hormone or whatever like, so people. 228 00:14:09,920 --> 00:14:13,440 Speaker 3: Part of that matrix of the hormones of appetite. 229 00:14:13,559 --> 00:14:17,440 Speaker 1: Yes, and then so people, I mean, what unless I'm 230 00:14:17,480 --> 00:14:19,280 Speaker 1: missing something and I don't know. So this is a 231 00:14:19,360 --> 00:14:22,720 Speaker 1: legit question because I've done this is my first real 232 00:14:22,800 --> 00:14:25,560 Speaker 1: lesson in ozen pic Like, I had a vague idea 233 00:14:25,840 --> 00:14:28,760 Speaker 1: and I knew that it was originally designed for blood 234 00:14:28,760 --> 00:14:33,600 Speaker 1: sugar regulation or flurering. You know, blood sugar blah blah blah. 235 00:14:33,680 --> 00:14:36,840 Speaker 1: But and for type two diabetics, which is, as you said, 236 00:14:36,920 --> 00:14:42,640 Speaker 1: is basically a new new condition. But like, ultimately the 237 00:14:42,680 --> 00:14:45,800 Speaker 1: weight loss is still coming because or it's still a 238 00:14:45,800 --> 00:14:48,880 Speaker 1: byproduct of people just consuming less food. 239 00:14:49,240 --> 00:14:54,640 Speaker 3: Correct, Yeah, it's the it's the biochemical equivalent of stomach stapeling. 240 00:14:55,640 --> 00:14:57,280 Speaker 1: So you know that. 241 00:14:58,840 --> 00:15:01,360 Speaker 3: You could be just as a active by wiring people's 242 00:15:01,360 --> 00:15:07,760 Speaker 3: mouth shut. It's the same essential principle, except you're doing 243 00:15:07,760 --> 00:15:15,080 Speaker 3: it with drugs rather than physical impairments. So it's that's 244 00:15:15,120 --> 00:15:18,080 Speaker 3: the principle of it, and it's effective for as long 245 00:15:18,360 --> 00:15:22,880 Speaker 3: as you keep taking it or can tolerate it, remembering 246 00:15:22,920 --> 00:15:25,280 Speaker 3: that the nausea thing is still there and some people 247 00:15:25,400 --> 00:15:27,600 Speaker 3: can't tolerate that. Think. 248 00:15:27,920 --> 00:15:30,840 Speaker 1: I think the lie though, is, oh, this drug makes 249 00:15:30,880 --> 00:15:35,520 Speaker 1: you lose weight. Well, well, this drug makes you less hungry, 250 00:15:35,800 --> 00:15:38,080 Speaker 1: and what makes you lose weight is the fact that 251 00:15:38,120 --> 00:15:43,560 Speaker 1: you're fucking eating less, Like you're consuming less calories because 252 00:15:43,600 --> 00:15:47,760 Speaker 1: you feel somewhere between full and sick and nauseous. And 253 00:15:47,800 --> 00:15:52,320 Speaker 1: I'm reading the side effects here constipated, fatigued. Fuck. You know, 254 00:15:52,480 --> 00:15:56,960 Speaker 1: it's like like the real reason that you're losing weight 255 00:15:57,200 --> 00:16:00,880 Speaker 1: is just because you're reducing your calories, which and I 256 00:16:00,920 --> 00:16:03,680 Speaker 1: know people will jump up and down, but you can 257 00:16:03,800 --> 00:16:05,560 Speaker 1: kind of do that without these drugs. 258 00:16:06,600 --> 00:16:09,840 Speaker 3: Yeah, And in fact, you can do it with weight 259 00:16:09,880 --> 00:16:11,880 Speaker 3: loss shakes for example, for as long as you can 260 00:16:11,920 --> 00:16:15,200 Speaker 3: tolerate that. I'm not believing, I'm not advocating for them. 261 00:16:15,600 --> 00:16:18,960 Speaker 3: I'm just saying that they're the same essential principle, which 262 00:16:19,000 --> 00:16:23,800 Speaker 3: is you just drastically reduce what you're consuming and then 263 00:16:23,880 --> 00:16:27,320 Speaker 3: you will lose weight. There is another way to lose weight, 264 00:16:27,360 --> 00:16:29,880 Speaker 3: which is stop consuming things which mess up your appetite 265 00:16:29,960 --> 00:16:35,840 Speaker 3: control system, like fructose, and this doesn't help that at all. 266 00:16:36,320 --> 00:16:38,480 Speaker 3: You can still you know, if the three grams of 267 00:16:38,480 --> 00:16:42,760 Speaker 3: stuff that you can tolerate is fructose, then you're not 268 00:16:42,880 --> 00:16:46,240 Speaker 3: changing anything about what you're consuming. You'll still lose weight 269 00:16:47,520 --> 00:16:50,720 Speaker 3: because how much you can consume will be controlled. But 270 00:16:51,360 --> 00:16:53,880 Speaker 3: the damage that's being done in there by the sugar 271 00:16:53,920 --> 00:16:57,120 Speaker 3: a you know, which is you know, fatty, liver disease, 272 00:16:57,880 --> 00:17:03,120 Speaker 3: kidney disease, hypertension, disease, all of those good things that 273 00:17:03,200 --> 00:17:07,560 Speaker 3: sugar brings to us are all still there, but it's 274 00:17:07,640 --> 00:17:12,200 Speaker 3: being masked by this drug which is hiding the obvious symptom, 275 00:17:12,400 --> 00:17:15,960 Speaker 3: which is that you look fat or that you've got 276 00:17:16,000 --> 00:17:20,200 Speaker 3: type two diabetes. So masking those symptoms is not very helpful. 277 00:17:21,920 --> 00:17:25,960 Speaker 3: You're still doing the damage, you're just hiding it. And 278 00:17:26,880 --> 00:17:29,040 Speaker 3: that's I guess the point of the article I wrote, 279 00:17:29,040 --> 00:17:36,840 Speaker 3: which is to say, let's understand that this is like 280 00:17:36,920 --> 00:17:39,760 Speaker 3: having a boat with a leak in it and then 281 00:17:39,880 --> 00:17:42,240 Speaker 3: putting a pump in, and so the boat still keeps 282 00:17:42,280 --> 00:17:44,879 Speaker 3: working for as long as the pump keeps working because 283 00:17:44,920 --> 00:17:46,920 Speaker 3: it doesn't fill with water and sink to the bottom. 284 00:17:47,520 --> 00:17:50,720 Speaker 3: But as soon as you turn the pump off, you've 285 00:17:50,720 --> 00:17:52,400 Speaker 3: still got a boat with a leak in it. And 286 00:17:52,880 --> 00:17:55,359 Speaker 3: that's what's going on here, only it's worse in that 287 00:17:55,400 --> 00:17:59,040 Speaker 3: the pump is also hiding some other things that are occurring, 288 00:17:59,320 --> 00:18:03,239 Speaker 3: which woul whether you were on this stuff or not, 289 00:18:03,400 --> 00:18:06,240 Speaker 3: if you continue to consume the seed, oils or sugar 290 00:18:06,920 --> 00:18:10,520 Speaker 3: that are causing the underlying metabolic conditions. Remembering that we're 291 00:18:10,560 --> 00:18:14,480 Speaker 3: talking about a condition type two diabetes and obesity, both 292 00:18:14,480 --> 00:18:19,600 Speaker 3: conditions that barely existed prior to nineteen eighty barely existed, 293 00:18:20,080 --> 00:18:24,439 Speaker 3: and I know that for all of us living now, 294 00:18:24,880 --> 00:18:29,240 Speaker 3: it seems like they've been there forever, but they really haven't. 295 00:18:29,840 --> 00:18:36,280 Speaker 3: And the fact that that's the case stops us looking 296 00:18:36,359 --> 00:18:40,399 Speaker 3: for the solution to the problem, stops us looking at 297 00:18:40,440 --> 00:18:43,800 Speaker 3: the cause, stops us trying to repair the hole in 298 00:18:43,840 --> 00:18:47,560 Speaker 3: the boat that's causing the leak, and diverts us to 299 00:18:47,720 --> 00:18:51,720 Speaker 3: investing in better and better pumps to disguise it. Yeah. 300 00:18:52,200 --> 00:18:56,840 Speaker 1: Yeah, And I think also it's worth noting that when 301 00:18:56,880 --> 00:19:00,159 Speaker 1: people lose weight quickly, like a lot of weight the 302 00:19:00,240 --> 00:19:05,840 Speaker 1: short time, generally what they're losing in order is water, muscle, 303 00:19:06,040 --> 00:19:10,600 Speaker 1: and fat in that order. And then when they regain it, 304 00:19:10,840 --> 00:19:17,040 Speaker 1: which is not inevitable but common, they regain water, fat, muscle. 305 00:19:17,480 --> 00:19:21,000 Speaker 1: And so somebody who's gone through rapid weight loss, whatever 306 00:19:21,000 --> 00:19:24,280 Speaker 1: the means of the rapid weight loss was, that you 307 00:19:24,320 --> 00:19:27,399 Speaker 1: can find, for example, you know, somebody might start it. 308 00:19:27,520 --> 00:19:30,480 Speaker 1: Let's just say one hundred kilos. They lose twenty kilos 309 00:19:30,520 --> 00:19:32,439 Speaker 1: in eight weeks, which is two and a half kilos 310 00:19:32,440 --> 00:19:35,240 Speaker 1: a week, which is too quick. Generally, they lose a 311 00:19:35,240 --> 00:19:38,240 Speaker 1: lot of weight, and a fair percentage of that is 312 00:19:38,320 --> 00:19:41,840 Speaker 1: lane tissue, is muscle, and then they regain the weight 313 00:19:42,600 --> 00:19:45,320 Speaker 1: because the wedding's over, or the school reunion or the 314 00:19:45,359 --> 00:19:48,560 Speaker 1: whatever is over and then they end up back at 315 00:19:48,560 --> 00:19:51,240 Speaker 1: one hundred kilos, but now they've got a higher body 316 00:19:51,280 --> 00:19:54,600 Speaker 1: fat percentage at the same weight because in this yo 317 00:19:54,720 --> 00:19:59,560 Speaker 1: yoing cycle they've lost lane tissue and that as well. 318 00:20:00,040 --> 00:20:03,240 Speaker 3: It's because you're not, once again not addressing the fundamental 319 00:20:03,280 --> 00:20:06,320 Speaker 3: reason why you needed to lose weight in the first place, 320 00:20:07,640 --> 00:20:12,359 Speaker 3: which is that something is malfunctioning in your environment that's 321 00:20:12,440 --> 00:20:15,320 Speaker 3: causing you to eat more than you should. Something is 322 00:20:15,400 --> 00:20:20,159 Speaker 3: interfering with your appetite control system. And believe it or not, 323 00:20:20,200 --> 00:20:24,560 Speaker 3: we have a perfectly functional appetite control system. It's all 324 00:20:24,600 --> 00:20:28,720 Speaker 3: controlled by hormones. It's all perfectly well regulated. As long 325 00:20:28,840 --> 00:20:32,520 Speaker 3: as we don't mess with it, we will stop eating 326 00:20:32,520 --> 00:20:34,720 Speaker 3: when we've had enough. We will know exactly how many 327 00:20:35,119 --> 00:20:39,560 Speaker 3: calories is enough because our appetite control system will shut 328 00:20:39,640 --> 00:20:44,080 Speaker 3: us down. The only time that doesn't happen is when 329 00:20:44,200 --> 00:20:48,240 Speaker 3: we do something that breaks our appetite control system. So 330 00:20:50,040 --> 00:20:53,000 Speaker 3: that's the fundamental thing, and it's a problem also even 331 00:20:53,200 --> 00:20:56,960 Speaker 3: with most dietary prescriptions these days, whether it's will go 332 00:20:57,000 --> 00:21:00,000 Speaker 3: over you or anything else, which is there's this fundamental 333 00:21:00,240 --> 00:21:03,680 Speaker 3: thing assumption that what you've got to do to lose 334 00:21:03,720 --> 00:21:06,640 Speaker 3: weight is get in there and manually start counting calories, 335 00:21:06,640 --> 00:21:11,680 Speaker 3: which is idiotic because you don't do it when you're 336 00:21:11,840 --> 00:21:15,560 Speaker 3: wanting to put on height. So when you're growing, you know, 337 00:21:16,280 --> 00:21:19,160 Speaker 3: you didn't start out, you know, the fabular six foot 338 00:21:19,200 --> 00:21:23,159 Speaker 3: five you are. You started out significantly smaller than that, 339 00:21:23,200 --> 00:21:27,600 Speaker 3: and your body automatically allocated calories and resources to get 340 00:21:27,640 --> 00:21:30,600 Speaker 3: you to the height that your hormones programmed you to be. 341 00:21:31,080 --> 00:21:34,240 Speaker 3: But somehow when we and nobody would argue with me 342 00:21:34,320 --> 00:21:36,840 Speaker 3: there if I said that to them. But for somehow, 343 00:21:36,880 --> 00:21:40,160 Speaker 3: when we're talking about growing vertical, of growing horizontally rather 344 00:21:40,160 --> 00:21:44,399 Speaker 3: than vertically, suddenly it willpower is required. It's like, in 345 00:21:44,520 --> 00:21:47,600 Speaker 3: order to be six foot five, you had to will 346 00:21:47,640 --> 00:21:51,399 Speaker 3: yourself to that height, and that's nonsense. You are that 347 00:21:51,520 --> 00:21:56,919 Speaker 3: height because hormones made you that height, and the same 348 00:21:57,119 --> 00:22:01,760 Speaker 3: goes for diet. There's this building in assumption that fault 349 00:22:01,880 --> 00:22:05,479 Speaker 3: is involved, that in some way you are a weak person. 350 00:22:05,720 --> 00:22:08,679 Speaker 3: If you're overweight that you are, you know you have 351 00:22:08,760 --> 00:22:13,159 Speaker 3: some sort of moral fault, And bizarrely, it's a moral 352 00:22:13,160 --> 00:22:15,720 Speaker 3: fault that's really only occurred in the population in the 353 00:22:15,760 --> 00:22:18,560 Speaker 3: last fifty years. Prior to that, no one even gave 354 00:22:18,560 --> 00:22:21,600 Speaker 3: it a moment's thought because prior to that, there was 355 00:22:21,680 --> 00:22:25,640 Speaker 3: no significant corruption of our appetite control system, and our 356 00:22:25,680 --> 00:22:30,320 Speaker 3: bodies did what they did, which is, they allowed us 357 00:22:30,359 --> 00:22:32,720 Speaker 3: to eat when we needed to eat, and they stopped 358 00:22:32,800 --> 00:22:34,920 Speaker 3: us eating when we'd had enough, and no one knew 359 00:22:34,960 --> 00:22:37,399 Speaker 3: how to counter calorie and never needed to. 360 00:22:39,600 --> 00:22:42,119 Speaker 1: Yeah. I saw a photo the other day of I 361 00:22:42,160 --> 00:22:44,959 Speaker 1: don't know if you've seen that you too, I don't know. 362 00:22:45,040 --> 00:22:47,280 Speaker 1: I don't know whether it was doctored, but it looked legit. 363 00:22:47,400 --> 00:22:51,080 Speaker 1: It was like a photo of a bunch of ossies 364 00:22:51,119 --> 00:22:53,800 Speaker 1: on the beach in nineteen sixty three. It was like 365 00:22:54,040 --> 00:22:54,960 Speaker 1: hundreds of people. 366 00:22:55,400 --> 00:22:57,200 Speaker 3: Yeah, I've seen the phone. 367 00:22:56,920 --> 00:22:58,760 Speaker 1: Ever, Yeah, everyone in shape. 368 00:22:59,119 --> 00:23:02,840 Speaker 3: Yep, you know, not necessarily in shape. 369 00:23:02,920 --> 00:23:05,000 Speaker 1: I mean, well, what I mean is there was they 370 00:23:05,000 --> 00:23:08,919 Speaker 1: won't overweight, no apparent obedity, is what I'm saying. 371 00:23:10,280 --> 00:23:12,679 Speaker 3: And you don't need photos to see that. There's very 372 00:23:12,720 --> 00:23:18,040 Speaker 3: good statistics on it. So the reality is that our 373 00:23:18,119 --> 00:23:24,040 Speaker 3: current environment and our current population, this is the first 374 00:23:24,040 --> 00:23:27,360 Speaker 3: time in human history that we've had any more than 375 00:23:27,400 --> 00:23:30,800 Speaker 3: about ten percent of the human population overweight or obese. 376 00:23:33,640 --> 00:23:37,359 Speaker 3: But we're up around seventy percent, and that's not ringing 377 00:23:37,400 --> 00:23:40,399 Speaker 3: alarm bells, people looking at that and saying, oh, well, 378 00:23:40,480 --> 00:23:42,760 Speaker 3: there must be some sort of moral turpitude, there must 379 00:23:42,800 --> 00:23:44,960 Speaker 3: be some sort of fault, a lack of willpower. These 380 00:23:44,960 --> 00:23:49,320 Speaker 3: are obviously weak willed individuals, And that's nonsense. It were 381 00:23:49,359 --> 00:23:52,320 Speaker 3: this anything other than something that you could look down 382 00:23:52,400 --> 00:23:57,920 Speaker 3: upon people about, were this growing an extra arm or whatever, 383 00:23:58,520 --> 00:24:01,320 Speaker 3: we'd be trying to solve it. We'd actually be looking 384 00:24:01,320 --> 00:24:04,320 Speaker 3: at the real causes and we'd be sorting it out. 385 00:24:05,000 --> 00:24:07,680 Speaker 3: But for some reason, when it's something that you can 386 00:24:07,760 --> 00:24:12,800 Speaker 3: sneer at people about and have a judgment about, suddenly, oh, 387 00:24:12,800 --> 00:24:14,639 Speaker 3: well that's just because they're weak willed. 388 00:24:17,080 --> 00:24:23,280 Speaker 1: Yeah. Interesting, Wow, it's that kind of you know, the 389 00:24:23,720 --> 00:24:27,399 Speaker 1: inability to feel satisfied. You know that some people like 390 00:24:27,440 --> 00:24:30,760 Speaker 1: where some people eat and it's like it's never enough, 391 00:24:31,320 --> 00:24:33,520 Speaker 1: not because as you said, they're weak willed or they've 392 00:24:33,560 --> 00:24:39,040 Speaker 1: got some psychological issue, but because that satiety they don't 393 00:24:39,080 --> 00:24:39,920 Speaker 1: experience it. 394 00:24:40,320 --> 00:24:43,639 Speaker 3: No, that doesn't because they have a malfunctioning appetite control system. 395 00:24:43,680 --> 00:24:47,520 Speaker 3: And you can actually make this happen, like in animal experience, 396 00:24:47,560 --> 00:24:49,320 Speaker 3: you can make it happen. You can disable the part 397 00:24:49,320 --> 00:24:55,120 Speaker 3: of the brain that does control the appetite and they 398 00:24:55,119 --> 00:24:57,560 Speaker 3: can't stop. Anyone who's ever owned a laborador knows this. 399 00:24:58,520 --> 00:25:03,399 Speaker 3: You know, they're unable to be satisfied until they finished 400 00:25:03,400 --> 00:25:05,520 Speaker 3: eating your socks and all the pebbles in the garden 401 00:25:05,640 --> 00:25:09,400 Speaker 3: and half your car. You know. It's it's an actual 402 00:25:09,440 --> 00:25:12,919 Speaker 3: malfunction in the human brain, and you can make it happen, 403 00:25:13,280 --> 00:25:16,080 Speaker 3: and we are making it happen. We know we can 404 00:25:16,119 --> 00:25:18,800 Speaker 3: make it happen just by giving humans fructose, which is 405 00:25:19,160 --> 00:25:21,399 Speaker 3: half of sugar, and there's forty grams of it in 406 00:25:21,480 --> 00:25:25,040 Speaker 3: everyone's you know, sorry, not forty grams, forty tea spoons 407 00:25:25,080 --> 00:25:29,919 Speaker 3: of it in everyone's diet today. So giving some giving 408 00:25:29,960 --> 00:25:33,160 Speaker 3: everybody forty tea spoons a day of something that we 409 00:25:33,280 --> 00:25:37,800 Speaker 3: know in affects appetite control, you should not be surprised, 410 00:25:37,840 --> 00:25:40,320 Speaker 3: so that we would then have an appetite control problem. 411 00:25:40,920 --> 00:25:43,680 Speaker 1: Forty tea spoons of sugar a day, So a tea 412 00:25:43,680 --> 00:25:46,320 Speaker 1: spoon is five grams. That's two hundred grams of sugar 413 00:25:46,359 --> 00:25:46,760 Speaker 1: a day. 414 00:25:46,880 --> 00:25:52,440 Speaker 3: Four grams, yeah, so four sixty yeah, and people will have. 415 00:25:52,359 --> 00:25:54,439 Speaker 1: One hundred and sixty grams in a month. 416 00:25:55,000 --> 00:25:56,720 Speaker 3: Yeah. But people will say that sort of thing to 417 00:25:56,720 --> 00:25:59,040 Speaker 3: me when I give that statistic and if I point 418 00:25:59,040 --> 00:26:01,560 Speaker 3: a couple of things out, So for example, if you 419 00:26:01,680 --> 00:26:05,960 Speaker 3: sat down to breakfast of a Heart foundation to prove 420 00:26:06,000 --> 00:26:09,119 Speaker 3: breakfast cereal, say something like a Sultana brand and a 421 00:26:09,160 --> 00:26:11,880 Speaker 3: glass of orange juice, you're at twenty tea spoons right there. 422 00:26:14,600 --> 00:26:18,439 Speaker 3: That's before you go near a Mars bar or a 423 00:26:18,480 --> 00:26:21,240 Speaker 3: coke or pushback on the breakfast table. Okay, So it 424 00:26:21,320 --> 00:26:24,639 Speaker 3: is very easy to get there on healthy food. 425 00:26:25,680 --> 00:26:29,680 Speaker 1: Okay. So and again everyone, we're not recommending, we're not. 426 00:26:30,520 --> 00:26:33,119 Speaker 1: So can you give us a snapshot of somebody for 427 00:26:33,200 --> 00:26:37,800 Speaker 1: somebody who's listening to this, who is resonating with what 428 00:26:37,880 --> 00:26:42,439 Speaker 1: you're saying. And I haven't actually asked you your opinion 429 00:26:42,680 --> 00:26:46,040 Speaker 1: of ozeenpic, but is there Do you have a pros 430 00:26:46,080 --> 00:26:51,000 Speaker 1: and cons list of a zempic of people using it 431 00:26:51,119 --> 00:26:54,880 Speaker 1: or are you just like no. 432 00:26:53,560 --> 00:26:58,359 Speaker 3: No, it's good for what it was invented for, which 433 00:26:58,440 --> 00:27:01,119 Speaker 3: is it is. When you can compare it to most 434 00:27:01,160 --> 00:27:04,600 Speaker 3: of the drugs which are available for controlling type two diabetes, 435 00:27:05,240 --> 00:27:10,240 Speaker 3: it is significantly more effective than most of them. But 436 00:27:10,800 --> 00:27:12,919 Speaker 3: you have to go in with your eyes open and 437 00:27:13,119 --> 00:27:21,040 Speaker 3: understand it's not fixing anything. It's controlling and the methodology 438 00:27:21,160 --> 00:27:24,320 Speaker 3: for actually fixing type two diabetes is to change what 439 00:27:24,359 --> 00:27:29,720 Speaker 3: you're eating. Yeah, So as a holding pattern, it's clearly 440 00:27:29,760 --> 00:27:33,560 Speaker 3: good science. It clearly does what's advertised in the box. 441 00:27:33,800 --> 00:27:36,480 Speaker 3: I'm less keen on it as a weight loss solution 442 00:27:36,840 --> 00:27:39,600 Speaker 3: because it's not a solution to anything. It's a masking. 443 00:27:40,680 --> 00:27:42,560 Speaker 3: It's like, and I don't know if we've talked about 444 00:27:42,560 --> 00:27:43,879 Speaker 3: this another time, and if not, we can do it 445 00:27:43,920 --> 00:27:47,040 Speaker 3: another time. It's exactly the same as putting teenage girls 446 00:27:47,040 --> 00:27:50,080 Speaker 3: on the pill and then missing and then missing some 447 00:27:50,160 --> 00:27:53,720 Speaker 3: fairly significant medical problems because you've masked so many of 448 00:27:53,720 --> 00:27:54,359 Speaker 3: the symptoms. 449 00:27:55,320 --> 00:27:59,399 Speaker 1: Yeah, if do you know anyone? Obviously, without mentioning names 450 00:27:59,400 --> 00:28:00,520 Speaker 1: who you uses it. 451 00:28:01,359 --> 00:28:04,439 Speaker 2: I have been told of people that have tried it 452 00:28:04,440 --> 00:28:07,960 Speaker 2: for a short period of time. I'm not a fan. 453 00:28:11,840 --> 00:28:12,879 Speaker 1: I've stopped using it. 454 00:28:12,960 --> 00:28:16,359 Speaker 2: Yeah, she needs I just had to get myself down 455 00:28:16,400 --> 00:28:19,280 Speaker 2: into a respectable weight category. David. 456 00:28:19,880 --> 00:28:23,720 Speaker 3: Yeah, I see. Craig hasn't stopped using and he's still 457 00:28:23,720 --> 00:28:27,119 Speaker 3: going yeah. Yeah, you're waste away, Craig. If you if 458 00:28:27,160 --> 00:28:27,920 Speaker 3: you can't using that. 459 00:28:27,880 --> 00:28:32,040 Speaker 1: Stuff, you know, well, I think I think Tiff is 460 00:28:32,040 --> 00:28:38,240 Speaker 1: the labrador in this cruise so definitely if anyone, well, 461 00:28:38,280 --> 00:28:40,440 Speaker 1: you definitely don't need it because you do eat a lot, 462 00:28:40,480 --> 00:28:43,520 Speaker 1: but you don't you don't gain weight, do you per se? 463 00:28:44,160 --> 00:28:44,400 Speaker 3: No? 464 00:28:44,480 --> 00:28:47,880 Speaker 2: Not not so much like I. I just have a Yeah, 465 00:28:47,960 --> 00:28:50,000 Speaker 2: I'm a I'm a feeder. I eat a lot, I 466 00:28:50,120 --> 00:28:50,520 Speaker 2: ate a lot of. 467 00:28:51,640 --> 00:28:55,200 Speaker 3: That could be a combination of two things. Firstly, you 468 00:28:55,200 --> 00:28:58,520 Speaker 3: know lumber lumberjacks have fifty eight hundred day calorie diets 469 00:28:58,640 --> 00:29:01,400 Speaker 3: right because they do may do a lot of exercise, 470 00:29:01,760 --> 00:29:04,840 Speaker 3: and Tiffany may well be in that category. And she 471 00:29:05,040 --> 00:29:07,560 Speaker 3: just may be genetically blessed too, where she's just really 472 00:29:07,560 --> 00:29:10,520 Speaker 3: inefficient with her calories and has to eat a lot 473 00:29:10,800 --> 00:29:12,800 Speaker 3: or can't maintain a reasonable body weight. 474 00:29:14,000 --> 00:29:17,240 Speaker 1: Isn't it funny to think that somebody that gains weight easily, 475 00:29:19,200 --> 00:29:21,720 Speaker 1: they could survive in the bush longer than you, tiff 476 00:29:21,920 --> 00:29:22,840 Speaker 1: like you and me. 477 00:29:24,480 --> 00:29:27,320 Speaker 2: Because I'd be so hungry that I would go away 478 00:29:27,360 --> 00:29:28,400 Speaker 2: with them just through. 479 00:29:28,240 --> 00:29:31,320 Speaker 1: You'd eat them. If I got up to twenty percent 480 00:29:31,360 --> 00:29:33,520 Speaker 1: body fat and you got up to twenty percent body 481 00:29:33,560 --> 00:29:36,880 Speaker 1: fat and we went and got lost bloody hiking, you'd 482 00:29:36,920 --> 00:29:37,600 Speaker 1: die before me. 483 00:29:39,000 --> 00:29:41,920 Speaker 2: I'd have to drive to go and find food. 484 00:29:42,960 --> 00:29:45,880 Speaker 1: And imagine all the energy you'd expend doing it, that's true. 485 00:29:45,880 --> 00:29:51,560 Speaker 3: Well after she'd eaten you, she'd then move on to 486 00:29:51,680 --> 00:29:57,000 Speaker 3: finding other stuff to eat. So you know that show alone. 487 00:29:57,080 --> 00:29:59,360 Speaker 3: I think the third series of it, I think starts 488 00:29:59,360 --> 00:30:03,320 Speaker 3: this week on SBS. It's I think, yeah, the one, 489 00:30:03,480 --> 00:30:06,760 Speaker 3: the one who wins is the one who put on 490 00:30:06,800 --> 00:30:09,600 Speaker 3: the more weight before they started. Usually you know they're 491 00:30:09,600 --> 00:30:12,240 Speaker 3: the one of going in carrying forty extra kilos because 492 00:30:12,280 --> 00:30:14,520 Speaker 3: it seems to be mostly a starvation contest. 493 00:30:15,000 --> 00:30:18,160 Speaker 1: Have you seen that show? Tip? No, No, it's brutal. 494 00:30:18,320 --> 00:30:24,760 Speaker 1: It's brutal. They absolutely yeh. Always good to chat, sir. 495 00:30:25,520 --> 00:30:28,320 Speaker 1: Where can people find all of your stuff? If they 496 00:30:28,360 --> 00:30:29,600 Speaker 1: want to go and have a little bit of a 497 00:30:29,680 --> 00:30:32,480 Speaker 1: read of your fine work. 498 00:30:32,800 --> 00:30:35,920 Speaker 3: Go look for me on substack. The thing is called 499 00:30:36,040 --> 00:30:39,480 Speaker 3: raisin Hell, but you could also just find me on 500 00:30:39,520 --> 00:30:40,880 Speaker 3: Facebook and there's links to it there. 501 00:30:41,880 --> 00:30:44,920 Speaker 1: Perfect. We'll say goodbye, fair but once again, thank you sir. 502 00:30:45,280 --> 00:30:47,520 Speaker 3: See you next time, solute pleasure, See you next time.