Speaker 1: Good a, Groovers, Welcome to another installment of the new
Speaker 1: Project Tiffany and Cook over there at typ Central High.
Speaker 2: Happy Friday, Harps, good a, Peter Crone, how are you, mate?
Speaker 3: I'm good.
Speaker 4: I love now that I understand you're called hearts. Like
Speaker 4: we can we can get like a bit more intimate here.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, I'm going to call you crony because Australians
Speaker 1: always chuck a y on the indmate or an o
Speaker 1: like I get called. My mum calls me crago, my
Speaker 1: old friends call me crago or Harps. Most of my
Speaker 1: friends these days called me harps, and my super old
Speaker 1: friends called me jumbo because I was a fat little
Speaker 1: fuck at school. I thought political correctness was invented right,
Speaker 1: and so even the teachers called me jumbo. Dude like
Speaker 1: that probably wouldn't happen now.
Speaker 3: Well, you know, it depends what circle you're in.
Speaker 4: If you were hanging around with a lot of ladies,
Speaker 4: maybe the misinterpretation could serve you.
Speaker 3: Well you know what I'm saying.
Speaker 1: That probably not, probably not, But I think the confidence.
Speaker 3: Let down a big disappointment. I understand now.
Speaker 4: I appreciate the use of monikers over there. I lived
Speaker 4: in Sydney for two years, and you know, being a Brett,
Speaker 4: I think we have a natural sympatico in the way
Speaker 4: that we get along, our sprits and Aussie.
Speaker 1: So I feel like when you modify someone's name, it's
Speaker 1: just well for me anyway. If I if I modify
Speaker 1: someone's name or I adjusted a bit, it's it's a
Speaker 1: sign that I like you, or I connect with you,
Speaker 1: or I want you to be my friend or something
Speaker 1: like that. It's just there are very few, very few
Speaker 1: of my mates get called like their proper name, and
Speaker 1: if I if anyone ever calls me Craig, I feel
Speaker 1: like I've done something wrong. I feel I reprimanded.
Speaker 4: I was going to say, yeah, absolutely, I feel I
Speaker 4: feel the same.
Speaker 3: It's a term of endearment.
Speaker 4: If you can mess around with someone's name, you obviously
Speaker 4: got some degree of like closeness to them. But yeah,
Speaker 4: I've always when I work with people, Let's say someone
Speaker 4: is called Robert, you know, but their mates called them
Speaker 4: Bobby or Rob.
Speaker 3: But you know, as soon as.
Speaker 4: They hear Robert, it sort of rings with that sound
Speaker 4: of like you know, okay, you're being reprimanded for something
Speaker 4: by your mum or your dad. Like anytime you use
Speaker 4: a full name, it usually gives people a little bit
Speaker 4: of a shock down their spine and reminds them of
Speaker 4: something from their childhood.
Speaker 1: Yeah, and then if you just alter the tone and
Speaker 1: then delivery a little bit, well you out now I'm
Speaker 1: in panic stations. Great, there we go, boom, I sphink
Speaker 1: to just snapshot. There you go, nervous system. It's really
Speaker 1: good to chat to you. I must have been one
Speaker 1: of the five people in the world who didn't know
Speaker 1: of you. So I apologize because I've done a deep
Speaker 1: dive on you in the last twenty four hours and
Speaker 1: probably weren't aware of this. But you're quite smart.
Speaker 3: That is the first time I've heard that.
Speaker 4: So this is I thought I was bringing value to
Speaker 4: the show, but like little did I know.
Speaker 3: It was going to be reciprocated.
Speaker 1: So's been a positive affirmation for you because I know
Speaker 1: you struggle with self esteem and your issues. So I'm
Speaker 1: here for you and if you need a cyberspoon on
Speaker 1: the couch, I'm your guy.
Speaker 4: I did not know this was going to be a
Speaker 4: therapy session, but I'm incredibly grateful.
Speaker 1: That can be two ways. It's just how we roll.
Speaker 1: It's funny. I haven't had a job in inverted commas
Speaker 1: for thirty one years. Right, that was the last time.
Speaker 1: I figured out when I was young that I'm not
Speaker 1: I like to work, but I didn't necessarily want to
Speaker 1: have a boss. So I've worked for me for a
Speaker 1: very long time, do a range of shit. But what
Speaker 1: was your first job out of school? That's a great question.
Speaker 1: No one's actually asked me that my first job. I
Speaker 1: came a like, immediately out of university. I came to
Speaker 1: the States. Well, let me back up in university.
Speaker 4: I don't know discounts because I coached tennis for super
Speaker 4: entitled kids in an upper state New York camp who
Speaker 4: had no arms about letting me know that they were
Speaker 4: paying my salary. This is like a punk twelve year
Speaker 4: old whose dad's probably worth like six billion.
Speaker 3: But you know, so that was somewhat of a job.
Speaker 3: But it was a summer gig.
Speaker 4: But after I left, after I did my masters, my
Speaker 4: first job, I actually came to the States and I
Speaker 4: became involved in a production company and we made an
Speaker 4: absolutely terrible full length feature film.
Speaker 3: So that was.
Speaker 4: That was pro my first job, not even paid, So
Speaker 4: I don't even that qualifies but anyway.
Speaker 1: Wow, it and it's been a calamity since then. Well, yeah,
Speaker 1: just out of interest. What was your undergrad degree and
Speaker 1: what was your masters in?
Speaker 4: Undergrad was human biology and exercise physiology, and then my
Speaker 4: masters was in it.
Speaker 3: Which has got absolutely nothing to do with human biology,
Speaker 3: so people like, wait, how did that happen?
Speaker 4: The Information technology department had three categories. You could focus
Speaker 4: on business coding, or human factors like ergonomics and how
Speaker 4: do we ass human interact with computers? So I was
Speaker 4: in the latter, but it was a great It was
Speaker 4: the biggest scholarship and it had I think something like
Speaker 4: five thousand applicants for about fifty places, so everyone just
Speaker 4: wanted to get in because it was, you know, a
Speaker 4: revered course and it paid well for a student.
Speaker 1: For sure. We haven't had a totally dissimilar path. I
Speaker 1: did exercise science as my undergrad and and believe it
Speaker 1: or not, at the ripe old age of two hundred
Speaker 1: and sixty, I'm doing a PhD in neuropsychology at the moment.
Speaker 1: But wow, yeah, no idea, what.
Speaker 3: You're analyzing me right now? Oh?
Speaker 1: I am, I am so, But you're doing pretty well
Speaker 1: being analyzed by me, We're all in trouble because I'm
Speaker 1: the dumbest one in the room. Where did the fascination
Speaker 1: with the totality of the human experience, not just on
Speaker 1: a physiological level, like maybe that's a natural for curious people,
Speaker 1: because I started with bodies and then ended up working
Speaker 1: with humans, right who live in the bodies, you know,
Speaker 1: And so I always say to people anatomy and physiology
Speaker 1: is interesting, but humans are fucking fascinating. So was that
Speaker 1: just a progression for you or was there always an
Speaker 1: instinctive intuitive curiosity there.
Speaker 4: I think the former, because I could never have guessed
Speaker 4: that I would be in the position I am today,
Speaker 4: you know, with the moniker of mine, architect helping the
Speaker 4: people I am around the world, from being a young
Speaker 4: seventeen eighteen year old punk kid just you know, trying
Speaker 4: to survive. I'd been orphaned when I was very young,
Speaker 4: so I was really just literally trying to survive. So
Speaker 4: I think it's curiosity. And then I did whilst both
Speaker 4: coaching tennis, and then I did a bit of ski
Speaker 4: guiding in Europe, and I distinctly remember having two fellas
Speaker 4: who had same experience. They weren't advanced, but they weren't
Speaker 4: completing at beginners coming down. They had the same sort
Speaker 4: of physical attributes, meaning it wasn't like one was terribly
Speaker 4: out of shape and one was an athlete, but one
Speaker 4: was superrapid in the way that he approached the slope
Speaker 4: versus the other one was a lot more like, let's
Speaker 4: just go for it. And right there I could see
Speaker 4: that I had nothing to do with equipment and it
Speaker 4: had everything to do with software. Right, So you've got
Speaker 4: the same resources, but the manner by which you view
Speaker 4: your environment dictates the way that.
Speaker 3: You actually proceed with something.
Speaker 4: So that was when I really started around, you know,
Speaker 4: age nineteen or so twenty, going deeper into well what's
Speaker 4: actually driving the show? And it sort of has been
Speaker 4: the eternal rabbit hole that I continue to go down
Speaker 4: and until such time I can fly like Neo and
Speaker 4: the Matrix, which.
Speaker 3: You know, I haven't quite mastered yet.
Speaker 1: I hope that soon because fun I would like to
Speaker 1: talk about that. Once you master that, so hurry the
Speaker 1: fuck up.
Speaker 3: You know, the powers of b would take me out immediately.
Speaker 1: Yeah, well, once you do reveal your superpower of flight,
Speaker 1: you could be a handicapped to the system, so you'll
Speaker 1: be eliminated, you know.
Speaker 3: That, absolutely, Yeah, i'd be censored for sure.
Speaker 1: What Yeah, I kind of call that thing that you're
Speaker 1: talking about the like the duality of the human experience.
Speaker 1: There's the world we live in and then the world
Speaker 1: that lives in us. Right, And I've heard you because
Speaker 1: I've done a deep dive on you. You and I
Speaker 1: are so similar in our thinking, so it might be
Speaker 1: a little bit of an echo chamber, but that's good,
Speaker 1: you know. Is there's situation, circumstance, environment, people, events, and
Speaker 1: then in the middle of that there's the processing of
Speaker 1: it all, you know, the interpret or the filter, the storyteller,
Speaker 1: the reality creator.
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, you spot on spot on, Like I'm talking
Speaker 4: to my clearly younger.
Speaker 3: Brother, clearly. You know.
Speaker 1: It was funny. I was listening this morning when I
Speaker 1: was wedging the sleep out of my eyes. You were
Speaker 1: talking to some chap I won't say who, but he
Speaker 1: was good. But he said so he said something like,
Speaker 1: I won't I won't throw him under the bus. But
Speaker 1: he went, ah, so what you mean is blah blah blah,
Speaker 1: And he totally didn't get what you were saying. And
Speaker 1: I went, nah, he didn't mean that at all, And
Speaker 1: then I was thinking, I'm going to be interested to
Speaker 1: see how you respond because the construct you were talking about,
Speaker 1: he didn't fully understand. He kind of did, but you
Speaker 1: didn't go a mate, that's not what I'm talking about
Speaker 1: at all. You went, yeah, yep, yep, you're really diplomatic.
Speaker 1: He said, I wouldn't use that term, but and then
Speaker 1: you kind of took him down a more gentle path.
Speaker 1: But it is, It can be complicated trying to understand
Speaker 1: the difference between my situation and my reality, my circumstance
Speaker 1: and my reality. You know, where I am and what
Speaker 1: I have and who I am identity, you know, disconnection
Speaker 1: between the non me stuff and the me stuff.
Speaker 3: Yeah, absolutely no, it's very slippery.
Speaker 4: It's I would say, it's one of the most convincing
Speaker 4: illusions out there, that we're a victim of circumstance.
Speaker 3: I feel the way I feel because.
Speaker 4: Fill in the blame, someone said something, someone did something,
Speaker 4: My bank account is a certain way, the current circumstances
Speaker 4: of the world, whatever it is, people truly under the
Speaker 4: impression that gives rise to our own personal experience. Now
Speaker 4: that's not to say that external factors don't have some
Speaker 4: sort of impact on us, but we are nonetheless, we
Speaker 4: are the cause. We are the source sou rcee of
Speaker 4: our own experience. And once people really get that, it's
Speaker 4: both empowering. For a lot of people, it's shocking, but
Speaker 4: it is empowering, and it really steps into the world
Speaker 4: of responsibility. To me, you're either one hundred percent responsible
Speaker 4: for your life or you're not. And if you're not,
Speaker 4: then you are at some level of victim. And that's
Speaker 4: just that's suffering and that's no fun way to live.
Speaker 1: How do we, excuse me, how do we how do
Speaker 1: we stept out of the groundhog danus of our kind
Speaker 1: of sometimes unconscious existence, like we seem to do a
Speaker 1: lot of life on autopilot, which sometimes works and sometimes doesn't.
Speaker 1: How do we become more present and aware of us
Speaker 1: in the middle of it?
Speaker 4: The word you just use there, I mean I always
Speaker 4: say the first step is awareness, right, one of my
Speaker 4: quotes I say, people can't be held accountable for that
Speaker 4: which they're oblivious to. And that's sort of got a
Speaker 4: dual prong tour, right, which is one level it breeds compassion,
Speaker 4: It gets rid of all the judgment that tends to
Speaker 4: be pretty ubiquitous around the world unfortunately, Like people are
Speaker 4: just very quick to make others wrong. And if you
Speaker 4: were in their shoes, if you had their DNA, if
Speaker 4: you've gone through every day of their life, their childhood,
Speaker 4: their teachers, their heartbreaks, their failures, you would be having
Speaker 4: the same response to whatever the circumstance is that you're
Speaker 4: judging them for right. So that breeds a lot more
Speaker 4: compassion and acceptance, and so the same holds true for ourselves,
Speaker 4: Like why do people have these self sabotaging tendencies? Why
Speaker 4: is it that the person attracts the same kind of
Speaker 4: mate that doesn't work out that they get, you know,
Speaker 4: their hostile or they cheat on them, or why is
Speaker 4: it that somebody can't get through this invisible ceiling of
Speaker 4: a pay income that they would like to get. And
Speaker 4: we've got to become aware of, Okay, what does that elicit?
Speaker 3: What does that reveal within us?
Speaker 4: That is a deep seated usually you know, I call
Speaker 4: it the subconscious constraint that we live in. It becomes
Speaker 4: this invisible prison and then we sort of skirt around
Speaker 4: that almost like we're tied to a big oak tree
Speaker 4: with a rubber band and you know, you've got your circumference,
Speaker 4: so you can function in but you can't you can't.
Speaker 3: Get much further. So its awareness, and that's the beauty
Speaker 3: of life is reflection.
Speaker 4: Relationship, an invariably romantic relationship where especially if you're in
Speaker 4: a marriage, you're kind of stuck and you kind of
Speaker 4: have to look at things a little bit more deeply
Speaker 4: than you might if you're just you know, messing around
Speaker 4: and dating a lot of people. So relationships reflection and
Speaker 4: then hopefully you know, work like mine and sounds like
Speaker 4: what you're doing to bring some inspiration and insights to people.
Speaker 1: Because we also grow up in you know, we grow
Speaker 1: up in a program, don't we, Like wherever we were
Speaker 1: whoever we were around whatever, church, synagogue, not school, university, culture,
Speaker 1: you know, friends like, we grow up being programmed, taught, told, trained,
Speaker 1: and then you wake up one day metaphorically and you're
Speaker 1: twenty or thirty or forty, and you in some ways
Speaker 1: the byproduct of all of that inbound stimuli. Yeah, and
Speaker 1: so even this, I say to people, did you choose
Speaker 1: your beliefs or did they just kind of grow there
Speaker 1: as a byproduct of you know, what you've been through. Now,
Speaker 1: do they serve you or sabotage. You tell me a
Speaker 1: little bit about beliefs and the influence that they can
Speaker 1: have on us, good or bad.
Speaker 3: I mean, spot on.
Speaker 4: You know, we are again sort of the byproduct of
Speaker 4: our environment and our conditioning. I often use the example,
Speaker 4: if I grew up in Madrid, I'd speak Spanish. You know,
Speaker 4: it's like, it's neither good nor bad. It was just
Speaker 4: what I was imbibed in as a kid. So what
Speaker 4: was the language in this case? Usually it's an emotional language.
Speaker 4: It's an energetic language that you adopted through the process
Speaker 4: of osmosis, just by virtue of the fact that your parents,
Speaker 4: your care providers, the school you went to had.
Speaker 3: A particular vibration about it.
Speaker 4: So it becomes very insidious because unfortunately, those formative years,
Speaker 4: that piece of programming, those codes that we adopt, become
Speaker 4: so sort of we become so associated with aus though.
Speaker 3: That's who we are.
Speaker 4: And then you see people literally fighting for their beliefs,
Speaker 4: whether of course we see the whole world of dogma
Speaker 4: and religion. People will kill each other for that, which
Speaker 4: is completely nonsensical. That's pure ignorance, right, Like I'm fighting
Speaker 4: for something that invariably wasn't even a choice. It's just
Speaker 4: something that I adopted, right, But I'm willing to kill
Speaker 4: you because you believe in some other god or whatever.
Speaker 4: But beyond that, then, of course we have I would say,
Speaker 4: the more detriment mental beliefs, which are much more to
Speaker 4: do with my own persona, my view of myself, my
Speaker 4: sense of inadequacy, my feeling of insecurity as it relates
Speaker 4: to other people, or the.
Speaker 3: Environment perception of scarcity.
Speaker 4: Because we've heard that money doesn't go on trees so
Speaker 4: many times from people, and so what happens is what
Speaker 4: I would assert, the essence of life is always there.
Speaker 4: But then we get these conditioned programs that, by virtue
Speaker 4: of what they are, they're limitations. So most beliefs tend
Speaker 4: to be just by design limited because you're believing something, right,
Speaker 4: so something has some sort of construct to it. So
Speaker 4: I would say, it's almost like, who do we become
Speaker 4: beyond our beliefs?
Speaker 3: Right?
Speaker 4: That's the realm of that I play in, which is
Speaker 4: pure possibility, right, And that's what a kid is.
Speaker 3: But a kid doesn't really have beliefs.
Speaker 4: Young children don't have beliefs because they haven't been conditioned
Speaker 4: in a way that makes them assign meaning to something
Speaker 4: or give this significance to whatever it is. They still
Speaker 4: live in the world of pure curiosity and imagination. And
Speaker 4: that's why, you know, I love some of this stuff
Speaker 4: from like Einstein where he said, you know it's I'm
Speaker 4: paraphrasing him terribly, but he was less interested in knowledge
Speaker 4: and more interested in imagination.
Speaker 3: The knowing mind is stuck. You know.
Speaker 4: If you know something, well, where's the opportunity for expansion.
Speaker 4: If you don't know something, then there's an opportunity for
Speaker 4: evolution and growth.
Speaker 1: And there's what you know and what you think you know.
Speaker 1: And you know, it's interesting because I love what you said.
Speaker 1: Thank you. Also, with belief and faith and programming, you know,
Speaker 1: comes this pressure to conform and to stay in that group.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 1: So the moment that you start to and I've been
Speaker 1: in a few of those groups when I was younger,
Speaker 1: and I was in a group that you are really
Speaker 1: discouraged from thinking for yourself. Really, not only you're not
Speaker 1: discourage Not only are you discouraged, you're criticized because if
Speaker 1: you question anything, it's weakness, right, whereas I would think
Speaker 1: it's curiosity and it's perhaps intellect and a few other things.
Speaker 1: But you know, and it's funny how many people and
Speaker 1: I'm not necessarily just talking about political or religious, it
Speaker 1: could be. It could be a fitness group that's evangelical,
Speaker 1: or a nutritional group that's that's figured out the only
Speaker 1: way to do things. But the problem is that a
Speaker 1: lot of people want to belong so whether or not
Speaker 1: it's the CrossFit tribe or the vegan tribe, or the
Speaker 1: carnival tribe, or the Christian tribe or the whatever. So
Speaker 1: they're so invested in being connected and belonging and that
Speaker 1: they don't want to think beyond what they've been programmed
Speaker 1: and taught and told. And I always say to people,
Speaker 1: and do an audit. You might do an audit on
Speaker 1: everything on you know, your thoughts and beliefs and ideology,
Speaker 1: and come back and go, no, this really represents who
Speaker 1: I am, but you might not. But it's hard for
Speaker 1: some people to get They're sorry I'm talking so much,
Speaker 1: but their head around the idea that, well, one, I
Speaker 1: get my sense of self from this fucking thing. So
Speaker 1: if it's not right, then who am I?
Speaker 3: Yeah?
Speaker 1: You know, identity is tied in so much to all
Speaker 1: of this stuff for people.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's huge. I mean, we're social animals.
Speaker 4: We want to have a you know, a primal instinct
Speaker 4: of a human being is a sense of belonging, and
Speaker 4: it gives us not only a feeling of value but
Speaker 4: also security. Have a false you know, both of those
Speaker 4: might be right. Usually it's a form of pretense. It's
Speaker 4: not real security, it's not real value, but it gives
Speaker 4: the aspiration for that. And so whenever we're in this community.
Speaker 3: Regardless of what it is, it could be a gang,
Speaker 3: right Like a kid who.
Speaker 4: Was grown up in a tough area of town in
Speaker 4: any city, and he had a single parent, maybe the
Speaker 4: one parent the dad was incarcerated or.
Speaker 3: Who knows, but his sense of belonging or her sense
Speaker 3: of belonging was a local gang.
Speaker 4: It was the only way that they got any kind
Speaker 4: of attention or someone listened to them.
Speaker 3: It just led to these.
Speaker 4: Sort of nefarious behaviors of breaking into cars and stealing shit,
Speaker 4: and that was their sense of tribe.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 4: Conversely, perhaps we could argue as you know, sort of
Speaker 4: more preferred as you join a local yoga community and
Speaker 4: you learn about breath work and you become a vegan
Speaker 4: and you help the community, and you know, but it's
Speaker 4: still a sense of fundamentally a human being wanted.
Speaker 3: To feel like I belonged to something.
Speaker 4: So to give up any of that is to your point,
Speaker 4: it is a real challenge because it's like it's not
Speaker 4: giving up the community, it's giving up me.
Speaker 3: As a part of that.
Speaker 4: It's the fundamental dissolution of self, which is probably the
Speaker 4: most scary thing anyone can go to.
Speaker 3: Ironically, that's my work.
Speaker 4: Yeah, I'm once called the hit man for the ego, Like,
Speaker 4: I'm not trying to solve anyone's problems. I'm getting rid
Speaker 4: of the person they think they are that has a problem.
Speaker 4: That's an entirely different proposition. You know, there's a billion
Speaker 4: you know, literally that might be an exaggeration, but there's
Speaker 4: certainly millions of experts who will help people with their problems.
Speaker 4: My concern there is that you're actually perpetuating the idea
Speaker 4: that they think there are someone with a problem.
Speaker 3: So someone's got anxiety.
Speaker 4: Then you go and see a therapist and psychotherapist, you
Speaker 4: see a spiritual teacher, you talk to an astrologer, but
Speaker 4: all around the topic of I've got anxiety. Okay, well
Speaker 4: then you'll just get the latest on Vogue strategy. You
Speaker 4: know you should do more breath work, No, do meditation?
Speaker 4: Are you eating too much salad? Have you stopped coffee?
Speaker 4: But all that's doing is perpetuating the idea that there's
Speaker 4: a you there which is founded in some sense of insecurity.
Speaker 3: Your mind is very active about.
Speaker 4: Usually worst case scenarios in the future, and it's giving
Speaker 4: you an experience of fear right now. And until you
Speaker 4: actually negate that whole process, everything is going to be
Speaker 4: transit to them.
Speaker 3: Yes, it's a problem. I don't know if you got that.
Speaker 1: Did you get that tip? Because what was that bit?
Speaker 1: After listening carefully.
Speaker 4: I think I've got a problem, Phaps, let me solve it.
Speaker 1: Just unpacked for us, the dissolving of the self for
Speaker 1: a little bit, give us sixty seconds or as much
Speaker 1: as you want for that matter, on that. How do
Speaker 1: we begin to do that? Why do we need to
Speaker 1: do that? What does that mean?
Speaker 3: We begin with inquiry?
Speaker 4: Right, so, even during the course of this chat that
Speaker 4: I'm really enjoying and I'm glad we got to connect,
Speaker 4: maybe people will start to question already what we've said.
Speaker 3: Oh wow, yeah, why am I a member of my
Speaker 3: local church?
Speaker 4: Or why do I go to this particular group, or
Speaker 4: is it true that I actually ascribed to this religion
Speaker 4: just because my parents did?
Speaker 3: So Inquiry is.
Speaker 4: The first thing, and I always ask people to put
Speaker 4: a question mark at the end of any of their problems,
Speaker 4: you know, and it starts to at least open up
Speaker 4: a conversation about is this actually a truth? So that's
Speaker 4: the sort of that I would say, that's how we
Speaker 4: get the ball rolling and why. To me, it's important,
Speaker 4: as I was saying earlier, For the most part, any
Speaker 4: kind of belief is by design a limitation which is
Speaker 4: in complete contrast and conflict with what I assert is
Speaker 4: our nature, which is boundless. So you take the infinite,
Speaker 4: the eternal, the limitless, which I'm ascribing to our true
Speaker 4: soul nature, and then you look through a lens of
Speaker 4: a mind that's been created with these conditioned limitations.
Speaker 3: That's the square Pegan round hole right there.
Speaker 4: So if I'm boundless, but I'm looking through a lens
Speaker 4: of feeling limited, that equates to human suffering. And then
Speaker 4: you have the litany of ways that people try and
Speaker 4: resolve that through alcohol, smoking, weed, prescribed drugs, whatever their
Speaker 4: sort of topic, their escape du jour is. For them,
Speaker 4: but meanwhile they haven't actually discovered their true nature. That,
Speaker 4: to me, is the whole journey of being human.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 4: It's not about becoming famous, getting some level of status
Speaker 4: and getting a lot of money, although that's the game
Speaker 4: most people are playing. To me, the real game of
Speaker 4: being human is discovering freedom, which is my main product,
Speaker 4: which is tapping into reminding yourself, remembering the essence of
Speaker 4: who you are versus the limited persona you've become associated with,
Speaker 4: thinking that's who you are. That's the game of spiritual
Speaker 4: evolution right there.
Speaker 1: I love that. That's so interesting. In one of my
Speaker 1: I can't remember which one. I've written a few books,
Speaker 1: but in one I don't know, I don't know. But anyway,
Speaker 1: I wrote a conversation, a shudo conversation about a guy
Speaker 1: because I had a version of this so many times
Speaker 1: in the older days when people would come into I
Speaker 1: owned a bunch of gyms, but they're all pt facilities,
Speaker 1: and people would come in and we'd do a catch
Speaker 1: up and I'd say, tell me about tell me about you,
Speaker 1: and they'd always tell me about their job, their bank balance,
Speaker 1: or the car or their kids. They'd tell me about
Speaker 1: everything except them yeah, and I'd go, all right, well,
Speaker 1: none of that's you, that's all your stuff. That's cool,
Speaker 1: well done, but tell me about you. And then they
Speaker 1: tell me about their age. They tell me they used
Speaker 1: to smoke, but they don't go, well, you're not an age,
Speaker 1: and you're not a habit and you're not a bank balance.
Speaker 1: You're not even a body, and you're not a career,
Speaker 1: not a title, and you're not a qualification. And it
Speaker 1: just opens so many doors to so many weird and
Speaker 1: fun conversations where I would just take the piss a
Speaker 1: little bit.
Speaker 3: But yeah, so let's.
Speaker 1: Think about this, like we never think, well that's a
Speaker 1: big statement. We rarely think about who we are beyond
Speaker 1: our thought or our thoughts about who we are, or
Speaker 1: our programming or our you know that all that kind
Speaker 1: of typical stuff that we think we are.
Speaker 3: Yeah.
Speaker 4: Yeah, most people are walking around sort of somewhat zombie
Speaker 4: state with very automatic reactions. It's just external trigger and
Speaker 4: internal response, you know. And it's you can walk into
Speaker 4: a restaurant, I say, and if I went up to
Speaker 4: the table and I was sort of somewhat derogatory or
Speaker 4: hostile to each of the tables, I say, hey, you're
Speaker 4: a fucking idiot. You look like an idiot. Depending on
Speaker 4: who I'm speaking to, they're just going to have their
Speaker 4: natural reaction.
Speaker 1: You know.
Speaker 4: If it's someone who's on a first date and maybe
Speaker 4: he's a quiet fella, he might be shy and he
Speaker 4: doesn't quite know what to do and he's embarrassed. Maybe
Speaker 4: it's an older couple and he can't quite hear me,
Speaker 4: so he's not so offended, or he calls the manager over.
Speaker 3: Then if I go to the big, you.
Speaker 4: Know, CrossFit dude who's got his tats, he might get
Speaker 4: up and try and punch me, you know, but no
Speaker 4: one has a choice. It's all reaction. Like to me,
Speaker 4: in that situation, it would still be part of someone's conditioning.
Speaker 4: Real freedom would be someone who could just listen but
Speaker 4: be unaffected. So that's where I can be with my
Speaker 4: environment and go oh wow, interested, like there's no actual
Speaker 4: immediate threat, Like I'm not trying to knife anyone. I'm
Speaker 4: just saying something. And this is where I think human
Speaker 4: beings really struggle, especially men. Is the capacity to listen,
Speaker 4: just to and listen is a broad sense. It's not
Speaker 4: just what some one says is listen to your environment,
Speaker 4: like what's happening on where are you being triggered? That
Speaker 4: goes back to your question earlier of like how do
Speaker 4: we get beyond this identity? It's like, well, fundamentally, where
Speaker 4: do you get upset about shit? That's your opportunity to
Speaker 4: see that you are not recognizing your own magnificence.
Speaker 1: You know. That is so true? Like especially, I don't
Speaker 1: like the term personal development or self help, but let's
Speaker 1: call it growth, let's call it. But all these ideas
Speaker 1: that we talk about on shows like this, and you
Speaker 1: talk to people about, and I talk to people about,
Speaker 1: like we're all champions at personal growth. When the sun
Speaker 1: shining and the birds are singing and the winds at
Speaker 1: our back and fucking life is good. But it's in
Speaker 1: the middle of the shit. It's in the messages, the chaos,
Speaker 1: the mayhem, the uncertainty, the suffering, the pain that we
Speaker 1: get an opportunity to put these things into practice, Yep,
Speaker 1: to walk out and talk. You know.
Speaker 4: Yeah, the quote I use as smooth sea's never made
Speaker 4: a good sailor.
Speaker 1: Yeah, it's so true. It's where did your where did
Speaker 1: your personal philosophy develop from? Has been? Has it been
Speaker 1: through a lot of exposure to just a lot of
Speaker 1: people and a lot of interact How much of it
Speaker 1: has been learned as in sitting, reading, paying attention, listening,
Speaker 1: and how much of it has been experiential you learned
Speaker 1: by doing, by being in the middle of stuff.
Speaker 4: Yeah, a great question, And of course it's going to
Speaker 4: be somewhat anecdotal or arbitrary, but I would say, I
Speaker 4: would I would asserted most of it is intuition and experience,
Speaker 4: Like for whatever reasons, like why could Tiger Woods do
Speaker 4: what he did or any of these athletes that you know,
Speaker 4: Roger Federer and ten and like, you know, there's a
Speaker 4: certain gift that I've been blessed with in the way
Speaker 4: that my mind can just like look at things and
Speaker 4: break them apart and unpack them. And I think by
Speaker 4: virtue of what we were just discussing a shit ton
Speaker 4: of adversity. Honestly, there's been my greatest teacher. You know,
Speaker 4: Mum dies when I'm seven, that dies when I'm seventeen.
Speaker 4: I'm an only kid. Like, there was just sheer terror
Speaker 4: and survival at that point, which to me was akin
Speaker 4: to what the experience of the ego is, which is
Speaker 4: this perception of an isolated unit that's trying to survive, right,
Speaker 4: But mine was visceral. So I think for me that
Speaker 4: was in a way that I couldn't fully fathom at
Speaker 4: the time, was the catalyst for me to really discover
Speaker 4: who I was beyond fear.
Speaker 3: So that was very visceral for sure.
Speaker 4: There's been some teachings like no one that I met,
Speaker 4: they've all since passed, But like traditional Indian gurus, like
Speaker 4: the real spiritual cats who knew what they were talking about.
Speaker 4: I've read some of the you know, a lot of
Speaker 4: their books, and then of course I've done a handful
Speaker 4: of different workshops and stuff and more contemporary teachers. I've
Speaker 4: enjoyed some of their stuff, But I would say, like
Speaker 4: an eighty twenty split, like where it's just for whatever reasons,
Speaker 4: life decided to put me on this journey of having
Speaker 4: to face a ton of shit and find the lily
Speaker 4: pad on the other side of it.
Speaker 1: You know, how did mum and dad dying mum at
Speaker 1: seven and your dad at seventeen? What did that? What
Speaker 1: did that do? How did that that's by the way,
Speaker 1: I'm so sorry to hear that, but it is what
Speaker 1: it is. How How did that influence you shape, you change,
Speaker 1: you mold.
Speaker 4: You thank you first of all, my mum when I
Speaker 4: was seven, I really don't think I knew how to
Speaker 4: process that like a seven year old boy, like I know,
Speaker 4: she had been sick because she had cancer to ask
Speaker 4: you answer your question of how so she had been
Speaker 4: sick for a while. She was bedridden for a good
Speaker 4: year plus, and they were trying to do all these
Speaker 4: alternative things. They would go to lurds, you know, with
Speaker 4: the side of the Virgin Mary. It was beyond the
Speaker 4: world of chemo and stuff like that. But my dad's
Speaker 4: he went he worked on the boats, you know, the
Speaker 4: ferries that go between England and France and England and Belgium,
Speaker 4: and it was a huge disaster in eighty seven where
Speaker 4: one of them capsized in the Belgium harbor. And you
Speaker 4: know a lot of people have got the image emblazoned
Speaker 4: in their mind because it was pretty horrific where you
Speaker 4: got this huge ferry on its side, but half of
Speaker 4: the boat is still because the harbor isn't as deep
Speaker 4: obviously as the ocean.
Speaker 3: So anyway, he was the chief.
Speaker 4: Engineer on that boat, and there was a few hundred
Speaker 4: people that died during that disaster, so that one definitely had.
Speaker 3: More of a mark for a couple of reasons.
Speaker 4: One it was he and I, so obviously we'd become
Speaker 4: incredibly close. I was older, you know, I'd had a
Speaker 4: decade just with my dad and just by virtue of
Speaker 4: the fact that he went to work one day said
Speaker 4: I love you and I'll see you tomorrow and that
Speaker 4: never happened.
Speaker 3: So with my mom, to.
Speaker 4: Certain degree, there's this period that we were aware of
Speaker 4: the fact that things weren't looking good with my dad,
Speaker 4: healthy vitals as best we knew. He was only forty
Speaker 4: nine years old, goes to work and never comes back.
Speaker 4: So in terms of how it impacted me or how
Speaker 4: that shaped me again, like I was saying, excuse me,
Speaker 4: like I was saying earlier, I don't fully know to
Speaker 4: what degree I could truly comprehend the impact it had
Speaker 4: other than what I was describing to you, which I
Speaker 4: can remember standing in my bedroom that I've grown up
Speaker 4: in as a kid by myself one day and having
Speaker 4: that visceral experience of I'm by myself, like as an experience, right,
Speaker 4: and it was the worst like feeling any human could have,
Speaker 4: which goes back to our topic about belonging, right, Like,
Speaker 4: we don't want to be alone. It's the second law
Speaker 4: of thermodynamics. You know, you put any objects into isolation.
Speaker 4: This is what they do in incarceration.
Speaker 3: Right.
Speaker 4: What's the worst thing you can be is put in
Speaker 4: solitary confinement because then there's a natural atrophy.
Speaker 3: Of that thing, there's no sense of belonging.
Speaker 4: You look at couples who might have been mare for
Speaker 4: fifty years, one of them dies, the other one usually
Speaker 4: dies within a month, you know, because their sense of
Speaker 4: like companionship and camaraderie has gone. So this is what
Speaker 4: I help people to do, is get beyond the feeling
Speaker 4: of isolation.
Speaker 3: So I would say what it did.
Speaker 4: Do for me was breed a massive amount of compassion
Speaker 4: and patience with people, because I really get it beyond
Speaker 4: the oh I understand, which a therapist might tell you,
Speaker 4: like no.
Speaker 3: I physically was there.
Speaker 4: So I understand that you feel like no one loves you,
Speaker 4: You're not good enough, You're never going to make it.
Speaker 4: Like so I think in ways that again I couldn't
Speaker 4: fully articulate because I think much of it was just unconscious.
Speaker 4: My brad, you know, it bred for me a huge
Speaker 4: amount of love compassion, patience, and probably capacity to just
Speaker 4: deal with life and keep opening up to possibility.
Speaker 1: Seventeen is such I mean at any age, of course,
Speaker 1: you know, but at seventeen, you're not a kid and
Speaker 1: you're not a man. You're kind of straddling that space.
Speaker 1: You what did you do? Did you move in with someone?
Speaker 1: Did you like just I'm just interested practically in that
Speaker 1: next twelve months, what did you do?
Speaker 3: Well?
Speaker 4: At that point, my dad had met someone who'd moved
Speaker 4: in with us, so they weren't married, but so you know,
Speaker 4: there was an adult call it a step mum or whatever.
Speaker 4: We weren't super close, but you know, there was somebody
Speaker 4: who provided and could get food.
Speaker 3: And you know, then the community.
Speaker 4: I lived on a very small road in a small village,
Speaker 4: so there was also a lot of support. I had
Speaker 4: mates who lived on the same street, so their parents
Speaker 4: sort of became pseudo parents. And then soon after I
Speaker 4: got you know, a job quote unquote. You know, this
Speaker 4: was before university. I took a year out, a gap year,
Speaker 4: which I know is pretty common in the UK and Australia,
Speaker 4: and so I you know, I started a firm for
Speaker 4: myself and I lived in the house and Then as
Speaker 4: soon as I went to UNI when I was nineteen,
Speaker 4: so you know, a year or so after, I pretty
Speaker 4: much that was it. You know, I kind of left
Speaker 4: the nest. I would come home for the holidays, Christmas
Speaker 4: and summer, but even in the summer, that's when I
Speaker 4: went to coach tennis in America. So I was from
Speaker 4: that point forward, I was pretty much on my own.
Speaker 1: When did you when did you begin to question, you know,
Speaker 1: all this or explore all this existential stuff of who
Speaker 1: am I beyond my whatever am my looks or my
Speaker 1: tennis or my you know whatever, like all that kind
Speaker 1: of normal stuff where you started to go deep for yourself.
Speaker 1: I'll just interrupt one second, interrupt myself. I remember being
Speaker 1: at a party when I was I think I was
Speaker 1: eight years old, a fat of the eight year old
Speaker 1: in a room with all these fifty year olds, and
Speaker 1: I remember looking around at all the fifty year olds
Speaker 1: and having this awareness that this is weird and all
Speaker 1: these people are pretending because I know a lot of
Speaker 1: these people and when they're not here doing this, they're
Speaker 1: not like this right. And I went and I didn't,
Speaker 1: you know, I'm just I just had awareness that that
Speaker 1: guy and him and her and her. They're not like that,
Speaker 1: but they're in front of these other people like role
Speaker 1: playing this persona. I'm like, what the fuck is all
Speaker 1: this about? When did that kind of curiosity into human
Speaker 1: thinking and behaving and relationships and existence? When did that,
Speaker 1: you know, catch fire?
Speaker 4: My first year at UNI, I actually just recently, about
Speaker 4: a year ago, found notes, written notes from when I
Speaker 4: was eighteen nineteen, sitting under a tree, the quintessential sort
Speaker 4: of image of these two clowns, very Buddha esque, me
Speaker 4: and my mate Guy, and we would talk about these
Speaker 4: big questions and the nature of consciousness.
Speaker 3: So I really attribute a lot of.
Speaker 4: My introduction, the foray into this conversation to my friend
Speaker 4: Guy back then and now with you know, without putting,
Speaker 4: without showing my age, it was good three decades ago.
Speaker 3: Like he he would.
Speaker 4: Only eat food that if it dropped on the ground
Speaker 4: it would grow at some point, Like, I mean, that's
Speaker 4: that's pretty advanced.
Speaker 3: But back then, right that, I'm sure he did.
Speaker 4: I mean we went for currently sometimes you know, he
Speaker 4: broke his philosophy, but the fact that that he was
Speaker 4: even introduced as a potential he wanted to have food
Speaker 4: that had parma and energy in it.
Speaker 3: So that's when I started.
Speaker 4: And that really was, as I said, sort of the
Speaker 4: portal into this whole world of wow, am I?
Speaker 3: Who am I? Why are we here?
Speaker 4: It was just beautiful. Like I listen. I had a
Speaker 4: great time at college. You know, I definitely had my
Speaker 4: first share of libations with the boys at the weekend,
Speaker 4: and but then I really spent a lot more time
Speaker 4: diving into the nature of life itself and quantum physics
Speaker 4: and you know, my life, my background had obviously lent
Speaker 4: itself to a lot of that because there wasn't I
Speaker 4: wasn't prey to what we were talking about earlier, the
Speaker 4: conditions of my family. And in one way, if we
Speaker 4: want to look at this karmically, it might sound like okay.
Speaker 4: On the human level, yes, this was very difficult for
Speaker 4: Peter Crone, but I would have served for the spirit
Speaker 4: that is my nature. It was actually quite liberating that
Speaker 4: the calma of my parents that they chose to incarnate
Speaker 4: me but then step aside, right, And again I'm not
Speaker 4: saying for them that was a conscious choice, but it
Speaker 4: did actually what did it do?
Speaker 3: For sure?
Speaker 4: It was incredibly vulnerable because I didn't have the blanket
Speaker 4: of security from parents. But by the same token, it
Speaker 4: was incredibly opening because if my dad was alive, I
Speaker 4: just know the fact that I idolized him. You know,
Speaker 4: he was a loving man. But my mind, to your point,
Speaker 4: would have been much more interested in the pretense, just
Speaker 4: like you're an eight year old with all these fifty
Speaker 4: year olds, knowing that they're full of shit. I would
Speaker 4: have been much more interested in having a career that
Speaker 4: I thought my dad would have wanted me to have,
Speaker 4: which is of course very stereotypical.
Speaker 3: He would have never wanted that.
Speaker 4: He loved me for me, but in a way that
Speaker 4: now you know, I can recognize. I never had to
Speaker 4: fall prey to those pressures of lineage or generation gaps
Speaker 4: where you're supposed to follow in the footsteps of somebody,
Speaker 4: and I kind of just had to make it up
Speaker 4: by myself. So so anyway, long, we did answer your question,
Speaker 4: but started when I was nineteen, and it really opened
Speaker 4: up this this geyser of inquiry about you know, who
Speaker 4: the hell are we, why are we here? And why
Speaker 4: are most people full of shit?
Speaker 1: That's the guyser that opened up via guy.
Speaker 3: Yes there it is. That's why it's called geyser. Most
Speaker 3: people don't know that that is.
Speaker 1: The origin, that is the etymology of that word. And
Speaker 1: you're welcome world.
Speaker 4: Yeah, some people say, some people say geezer, but that's
Speaker 4: more like East London, you know, that's like you.
Speaker 1: Fucking geezer, don't you fucking or mean I'll kick you
Speaker 1: in the dick.
Speaker 4: Yeah, that's different, that's different, but it's still you're having
Speaker 4: this wealth of information, but it's a derogatory form.
Speaker 1: So fucking geezer, right, you fucking geeze, don't you guyser.
Speaker 4: It's like it's the same, it's content coming at you,
Speaker 4: but it's much more philanthropic. It makes an impact, it
Speaker 4: makes it different. Yeah, so anyway, I'm glad we broke
Speaker 4: that down.
Speaker 1: Now everyone's going there both fuck wits, that's what everyone's doing.
Speaker 1: But that's hilarious and we don't care what you think.
Speaker 1: You know what I do love though about guy. I'm
Speaker 1: always saying to people and myself, you know, hang out
Speaker 1: with people who don't think like you. Hang out with
Speaker 1: people who don't share your lifestyle or necessarily your beliefs
Speaker 1: or values or attitude or operating system. Not all the time,
Speaker 1: but sometimes and try to do it with a really
Speaker 1: open mind and just be present. And I live across
Speaker 1: the road from I live on a street with one
Speaker 1: million cafes, and across the road from me is a dude,
Speaker 1: karl Ed his name is, who owns the cafe, who's awesome,
Speaker 1: and he's got another guy that works for him, Muhammed.
Speaker 1: And every time, so well, nearly every time I go over,
Speaker 1: because I don't know much about Islam, right. I grew
Speaker 1: up in a very Christian family and a Catholic family,
Speaker 1: and a very I went. You know, I did the
Speaker 1: whole rounds, right, and I've done probably like you have,
Speaker 1: Buddhism one oh one and a fair bit of things.
Speaker 1: But I don't know much about Islam. And so every
Speaker 1: time I go there, I go, you've got to teach
Speaker 1: me something. Tell teach me one thing. Every time I
Speaker 1: come and get my coffee about Islam, right, And that's
Speaker 1: so I walk in, he makes my coffee and he goes,
Speaker 1: all right, this is what I want to tell you.
Speaker 1: And I love it because I'm exposing myself to new
Speaker 1: ideas and thinking and philosophy and theology and ideology and lifestyle.
Speaker 1: But I just think there's real value for all of
Speaker 1: us broadly, not because we want to become them or
Speaker 1: become like them necessarily, or adopt or adapt necessarily, but
Speaker 1: rather just to stack a step out of the echo
Speaker 1: chamber that is our day to day you know.
Speaker 4: Well, it breeds empathy, sympathy, compassion, understanding. Like I was
Speaker 4: saying earlier, if you had the DNA of a human being,
Speaker 4: you were brought up by their parents, you went to
Speaker 4: their school, you had their trials and tribulations. You might
Speaker 4: be judging them at this point as a forty fifty
Speaker 4: sixty year old, but they have no choice, and you
Speaker 4: would be making the same choice with their conditioning, right,
Speaker 4: So it just breeds a lot more compassion, you know,
Speaker 4: like you understand why people think, feel and behave the
Speaker 4: way they do because of their fundamental beliefs. And if
Speaker 4: you're not willing to dig into understanding what their fundamental
Speaker 4: beliefs are, then you're probably just going to be in
Speaker 4: juxtaposition and judging people, which agren creates all the hostility
Speaker 4: we have the world. As you said, there's a lot
Speaker 4: of people I know who do shit that I just
Speaker 4: have no interest in, but at least I understand why
Speaker 4: they do it, you know, we don't have to adopt
Speaker 4: those behaviors, but boy, can I have a greater sense
Speaker 4: of empathy to realize why they struggle with what they
Speaker 4: struggle with, why they choose to do what they do,
Speaker 4: and it that that for me, is a much more
Speaker 4: compassionate way to deal with humans.
Speaker 1: I think also Pete Pa c s mate Cock. Yeah,
Speaker 1: I think also that people confuse. I understand that with
Speaker 1: I condone that yes, absolutely, yeah, you know, and it's
Speaker 1: like I understand war, but I fucking hate it. I
Speaker 1: understand violence, but I abhor it. People. You know, you
Speaker 1: can't overcome what you don't understand by the way, you know,
Speaker 1: like you know, we seeking to understand things doesn't mean
Speaker 1: I want to become that or I want to adopt
Speaker 1: or adapt into that, you know, it's like I need to.
Speaker 1: I'm really interested in how people think. Even if I
Speaker 1: think they're thinking is completely fucked and toxic, I'm still
Speaker 1: interested because I want to understand that, you know, especially
Speaker 1: with my research, I want to understand where this person
Speaker 1: is at and how they got there without judgment, just awareness.
Speaker 4: Yeah, and that's what I would call acceptance with the
Speaker 4: capital A. You know, it's then that really is an
Speaker 4: iteration of love, right, Like I tell people I love everyone,
Speaker 4: it doesn't mean I want to hang out with them. Yeah,
Speaker 4: you know, there's my acceptance of something or someone, and
Speaker 4: then there's my personal preference that is part of that.
Speaker 4: I'm not going to invite someone who does Heroin over
Speaker 4: to my house for Christmas, but I can have love
Speaker 4: and compassion for for that. That's where they are, and
Speaker 4: I am in acceptance of that. First of all, the
Speaker 4: audacity of a human being to think that they.
Speaker 3: Know how everybody else should act.
Speaker 4: Like when you really get that when they're complaining about
Speaker 4: a parent, a spouse, a loved one or whoever, there's
Speaker 4: this undercurrent of audacity that is implying that we mighty
Speaker 4: old me know how the world should be. It's like
Speaker 4: I didn't get the memo that Harps was in charge
Speaker 4: of the universe, you know. It's like, of course, if
Speaker 4: you are, then then please give me my marching orders.
Speaker 4: I'm sorry if I've been out of line, you know,
Speaker 4: but it just it's very humbling, you know. And I
Speaker 4: think the greatest, the most intelligent people on this planet,
Speaker 4: who at least have some semblance of spirituality or connected
Speaker 4: to their heart also have a huge amount of humility,
Speaker 4: which is that we're really tiny compared to not only
Speaker 4: the planet, but the planet is a spec relative to
Speaker 4: our solar system. Our solar system is a spec relative
Speaker 4: to the universe. So if you're sitting on this ball
Speaker 4: of mud thinking that you know how your freaking neighbors
Speaker 4: should be taking care of the hedge, I mean, good
Speaker 4: luck to you. You're gonna, you know, end up with
Speaker 4: some liver crhosis based on how much you're going to
Speaker 4: be drinking from your frustrations.
Speaker 3: Well, that's just the ausy way.
Speaker 1: Anyway we're gonna sure is we're going to call this
Speaker 1: episode You're insignificant. Well, okay, we're going to wind up,
Speaker 1: but I want to ask you a couple of things
Speaker 1: before we go. The idea of being people's balk or
Speaker 1: people struggle with this idea of of objectivity. One of
Speaker 1: the things I ask audience is when we actually have
Speaker 1: audience and we're not in lockdown. Back in nineteen seventy five,
Speaker 1: the last time I did a live gig, I ask
Speaker 1: a room full of people, put up your hand if
Speaker 1: you think your open mind are objective, And everyone puts
Speaker 1: up their hand, and I go, well, none of you
Speaker 1: are right, and they all crack the shits and I go,
Speaker 1: but neither am I. So it's okay, we're the same.
Speaker 1: But this trying to help people to understand the subjectivity
Speaker 1: of being human and the human experience, and understanding that
Speaker 1: we all process everything through our own window of understanding
Speaker 1: and values and beliefs and biases and fears and ideas
Speaker 1: and ideologies. How do we I mean this is a
Speaker 1: question without notice. I don't even know if you have
Speaker 1: a thought on it, But how do we become less
Speaker 1: looking through our window and more open to be able
Speaker 1: to understand others and genuinely less attached to being right?
Speaker 1: Like so many fucking Australians want to be right. I'm
Speaker 1: like chee. It's like an addiction because not being right
Speaker 1: means I'm wrong, and being wrong means fuck, I feel vulnerable.
Speaker 1: I don't want to feel vulnerable. So despite the evidence,
Speaker 1: you're all wrong and I'm right.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's the number one priority of the ego.
Speaker 4: It's the way that it justifies any sense of self worth,
Speaker 4: which is pretty pathetic, but nonetheless it's human.
Speaker 3: So for that reason we have love and compassion.
Speaker 4: Right, But I think you know that's one of the
Speaker 4: first introductions to perhaps becoming somewhat evolved is to realize,
Speaker 4: like how petty that particular behavior adaptation is to insecurity
Speaker 4: is like, well, if I can make my wife wrong,
Speaker 4: if I can make my kids wrong, if I can
Speaker 4: make my boss wrong, then at least I get some
Speaker 4: sort of sense of self value. And if that's really
Speaker 4: the only way then I'm going to get self value,
Speaker 4: then my life isn't going to amount to much. So
Speaker 4: I think that just to notice the behavior first of all,
Speaker 4: is can be quite revelatory for people, and they go,
Speaker 4: holy shit, you know that's pretty childish, honestly, Yeah, But
Speaker 4: to your point of how do we get beyond that
Speaker 4: that actually start to step into open or being open,
Speaker 4: I think the funny thing is it's almost like you
Speaker 4: don't have to worry about it because you're fucked either way, right, Like,
Speaker 4: I'll give you a story. I can remember Klein came
Speaker 4: to me. He wasn't married, but he had a child
Speaker 4: with a woman, and his family very very traditional Catholic,
Speaker 4: you know, big he had I think four or five siblings,
Speaker 4: and they were getting together for Thanksgiving.
Speaker 3: Now they knew this woman was around.
Speaker 4: It wasn't like it was a secret that they had
Speaker 4: a kid, but there was some sort of energy of
Speaker 4: contention about the fact that he wasn't married and they'd
Speaker 4: had a kid, you know, relative to the beliefs of Catholicism.
Speaker 4: So he came to me knowing that his relationship was
Speaker 4: on the skits, like she was very difficult to deal with,
Speaker 4: you know, he knew that it was coming to an end.
Speaker 4: So his question was, I don't know whether to go
Speaker 4: with her to Thanksgiving because then it will give the
Speaker 4: impression that everything's fine when it's not. But if I
Speaker 4: don't go with her, then they're going to wonder what's
Speaker 4: going on. Right, So this is how the brain works, right,
Speaker 4: it's zeros and ones, zeros and ones binary, And this
Speaker 4: is why we realize that anyone who comes from the
Speaker 4: computer world is full of shit. In case everyone gets
Speaker 4: that reference, it's zeros and ones doesn't work, you know,
Speaker 4: this is this is not a mechanical world. We're on
Speaker 4: a quantuant level. So I said to him, listen, it
Speaker 4: doesn't matter. He's like, well, what do you mean it
Speaker 4: doesn't This is big, This is big. I said no,
Speaker 4: because you're looking in the wrong place.
Speaker 3: Right.
Speaker 4: Did you watch her Raiders of the Lost Arc? Do
Speaker 4: you remember that with Harrison full who didn't bro one
Speaker 4: of the greatest movies. Right, And there's a scene where
Speaker 4: they're the French archaeologist who's his nemesis, who's got all
Speaker 4: the machines and like that's representing corporate Americas digging for
Speaker 4: the art and he and his like girlfriend and that's about.
Speaker 3: It, and he's got that chubby guy who's helping him.
Speaker 4: They suddenly realize looking at the map of where the
Speaker 4: arc is, they're not actually digging in the right place.
Speaker 4: And his words, they're digging in the wrong place. And
Speaker 4: you get this euphoric feeling like, oh my god, they're
Speaker 4: digging in the wrong place.
Speaker 3: So this is what people do. They dig in the
Speaker 3: wrong place.
Speaker 4: With some resolution to something without getting into the deeper
Speaker 4: levels of why they have the problem in the first place.
Speaker 3: Right. So I went to my guy and I said, listen,
Speaker 3: it doesn't matter. He's like, what do you mean?
Speaker 4: I said, until you realize that the deeper issue is
Speaker 4: that you don't feel loved and accepted by your own
Speaker 4: family to be honest enough with whatever you're dealing with.
Speaker 3: You're not perfect you're not supposed to have got it
Speaker 3: all right, that's where your issue is.
Speaker 4: And he's like, you're so right, he said, you know,
Speaker 4: I felt completely estranged from my family for many years.
Speaker 4: I'm like, yeah, because you've got self judgment. You never
Speaker 4: got married, and you're in this dialogue that keeps you separate.
Speaker 3: They love you. Maybe that's not what they wanted for you,
Speaker 3: but that's the issue. Take it or don't take it.
Speaker 4: You still have to face the fundamental, deep principle that you.
Speaker 3: Don't feel loved. So to go back to your question,
Speaker 3: how do we find this openness? Don't worry.
Speaker 4: Life will give you shit to handle, to see where
Speaker 4: you're not open. So it goes back to wherever you
Speaker 4: get triggered, wherever you get upset, wherever you suffer. Now,
Speaker 4: of course the issue, a lot of people deny it.
Speaker 4: They don't look at it, They drink, they smoke, they
Speaker 4: avoid it.
Speaker 3: Right.
Speaker 4: Well, you know, to me, fears are the greatest thing
Speaker 4: that we can be given because it shows us where
Speaker 4: we're not actually understanding our own magnificence. So fears are
Speaker 4: the catalyst for our own awakening. So stop avoiding fears
Speaker 4: and jump straight into them.
Speaker 1: You're quite good at this. I've got a name for you.
Speaker 1: I think you should I've got to label a moniker.
Speaker 1: I think you should take it for a test drive've
Speaker 1: maybe use it. You're welcome. I think you should call
Speaker 1: yourself the mind architect.
Speaker 3: Wow, did you just come up with that? Yeah? Like
Speaker 3: that me.
Speaker 4: I can see why. I can see why that jumbo
Speaker 4: eight year old in that room could really like analos
Speaker 4: do this analysis of these adults around him. You've got
Speaker 4: some sort of like gem of genius in you that
Speaker 4: I just don't even know how to articulate.
Speaker 1: I try not to wheel it out much. It's a
Speaker 1: gift and it's intimidating for others. So I keep that
Speaker 1: shit low key because I want you to keep feeling special.
Speaker 1: So You're welcome.
Speaker 4: You are, you are your eggs Son borderline sort of
Speaker 4: Samaritan saint like like Tiff, you know, the fact that
Speaker 4: she puts up with you.
Speaker 1: I'm like at the intersection of the Delli Lama, Jesus, Aristotle, Epictitis,
Speaker 1: and Marcus Aurelius, just a bit of everything.
Speaker 3: And Debbie from Debbie does Dallas's.
Speaker 1: Just you know, just a bit of fun and fucking
Speaker 1: and Humphrey Bear who you don't know.
Speaker 4: Who that is, but a no, I remember him the best,
Speaker 4: actually the best. I was actually once accused of being
Speaker 4: a love child after share just because it was funny
Speaker 4: by the Financial Times in the UK. The journalist said,
Speaker 4: meeting Peter Crohne is like meeting Buddha, Einstein and Austin
Speaker 4: Powers at the same time.
Speaker 3: Yeah, baby, yeah.
Speaker 1: Yeah, Well do you feel randy, baby? I love that
Speaker 1: that is. You should definitely put that on a T
Speaker 1: shirt and wear that shit around.
Speaker 4: I thought it was kind of perfect because, like, you know,
Speaker 4: Buddha's all the spiritual shit. Einstein, let's get into the
Speaker 4: actual practical part of being human and physics, and then
Speaker 4: Einstein's like.
Speaker 3: Yeah, let's shag and let's not take things too seriously. Baby,
Speaker 3: It's all about love. Yeah, you know.
Speaker 1: So anyway, I think that all of that stuff can coexist, right.
Speaker 1: I think we can be deep thinkers, and we can
Speaker 1: be loving and kind and compassionate and clever and funny
Speaker 1: and inappropriate. You know. I feel some people feel compelled
Speaker 1: to be a certain way. I'm spiritual, are you like?
Speaker 1: Even the fact that you say I'm spiritual maybe makes
Speaker 1: me think you're not but or whatever, you know, just
Speaker 1: this whole thing of being able to be yourself whatever
Speaker 1: that means. Mate, I love talking to you. You are really,
Speaker 1: really an interesting person. And I didn't know, but now
Speaker 1: I know, and I've checked you out. You're amazing, and
Speaker 1: you're doing great work, and you're an I mean, I
Speaker 1: know you know all this shit, but I love the
Speaker 1: way that you communicate what can be complicated things in
Speaker 1: a very digestible way. Tell people where they can catch
Speaker 1: up with you, follow you, you know, connect with you
Speaker 1: well personally.
Speaker 3: Thank you. It means a lot. It's been a pleasure.
Speaker 4: Obviously we'd never had the chance to chat before, but
Speaker 4: I feel we could chat for a few hours and
Speaker 4: meet your friend over at the coffee shop and talk
Speaker 4: about Islam and whatever. But they can find me at
Speaker 4: Peter Crone Officials, Instagram and then just my website Petercrone
Speaker 4: dot com. I think Peter Crone and mine architect on Facebook.
Speaker 4: I'm not a big Facebook person, you know. If people
Speaker 4: prefer that method of connection, that's where they can find me.
Speaker 1: You're fantastic. If you stay on the call for one
Speaker 1: minute after we sign off, that'd be great, Tiff, Thank you.
Speaker 2: Thanks halfs. Thanks Peter, it was excellent, Tiff.
Speaker 4: I mean, I saw you make a couple of notes
Speaker 4: or maybe you're just writing love notes to a boyfriend
Speaker 4: or something.
Speaker 3: I don't know, but did you capture something of profound
Speaker 3: interest there?
Speaker 2: I actually do you know? What I found interesting is
Speaker 2: when I reached out to you, I had this not
Speaker 2: a hesitation, but I thought, you're so similar in what
Speaker 2: you talk about to Craig. But what I loved especially
Speaker 2: with this and we had, you know, a lot of
Speaker 2: a lot of different people on but you guys have
Speaker 2: these similar concepts, but you're you articulate them so differently.
Speaker 2: And I really loved this conversation a lot. But he
Speaker 2: did fail to ask one really important question that I
Speaker 2: need to right now, and that is who has signed
Speaker 2: the boxing glove behind you?
Speaker 4: Ah, the powers of observation? He is still early. Craig's
Speaker 4: got to like, he's got to wipe his glassle So
Speaker 4: so I'll give you a I'll give you a guest.
Speaker 3: Oh Ali.
Speaker 1: Done? Oh wow? Well what you mean?
Speaker 3: Ali?
Speaker 2: G right?
Speaker 3: Like answer? Yeah? What's his name?
Speaker 1: Cohen, Sasha Basha Cohen, whatever his name is, Sasha Baron Cohen.
Speaker 1: I think Aaron he's funny. Well, TIFs a boxer, so
Speaker 1: she loves.
Speaker 4: Oh all right, Well, if ever I come down there,
Speaker 4: which would be a joy to connect at some point,
Speaker 4: As I said, it'd be fun to have a coffee.
Speaker 4: Then I'll make sure I don't do anything to piss
Speaker 4: off TIF.
Speaker 1: Yeah, that's why we work remotely because she punches me
Speaker 1: in the face when I shit her, which is pretty often.
Speaker 1: She's quite aggressive. She smiles and stuff because you're here.
Speaker 1: But it's a fucking show.
Speaker 3: Yeah again.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah, one thing, Champion before we go. You've got
Speaker 1: a program coming up. Tell us a little bit about
Speaker 1: that and how people might get involved.
Speaker 3: I do, thank you. It's it's been fun.
Speaker 4: I've done these workshops, certainly through this whole COVID period
Speaker 4: where people have struggled with stuff, and so we've got
Speaker 4: one coming up middle of June. I'll confirm the date.
Speaker 4: But it's on anxiety.
Speaker 3: You know.
Speaker 4: I realized that I speak to a lot of these things,
Speaker 4: relationship health, but something that really plagues everybody is that
Speaker 4: arena of worry, concern, apprehension, fear and anxiety. So it's
Speaker 4: only a couple of hours, but it's usually very profound.
Speaker 4: I'm actually going to unpack the precursors to why anyone
Speaker 4: worries about anything as part of our subconscious so incredibly powerful.
Speaker 1: So great, I might even come. Obviously it's online. I
Speaker 1: actually might come. Can I get a discount or anything?
Speaker 3: Is there? Yeah, I'll send you the family mates.
Speaker 1: Great, all right, mate, perfect mate, stay on the call.
Speaker 1: Thank you so much for spending some time with us
Speaker 1: on the You project.
Speaker 3: Yeah, and welcome, Thanks me.
Speaker 1: Thanks everyone,