1 00:00:00,320 --> 00:00:05,080 Speaker 1: Tom Howley, Well, thanks for having me. Of course we 2 00:00:05,120 --> 00:00:07,080 Speaker 1: do know each other. We know each other's Oh, I 3 00:00:07,160 --> 00:00:09,240 Speaker 1: know you know my kids. Some of my kids are 4 00:00:09,240 --> 00:00:12,960 Speaker 1: probably all of my kids, and you're around the same 5 00:00:13,000 --> 00:00:15,159 Speaker 1: age as most of them. You are sort of a 6 00:00:15,200 --> 00:00:16,880 Speaker 1: little bit older and most of you are around about 7 00:00:16,920 --> 00:00:18,160 Speaker 1: the same ages most of at the same time. There's 8 00:00:18,200 --> 00:00:21,680 Speaker 1: not much in it, and you are the co founder 9 00:00:21,760 --> 00:00:25,280 Speaker 1: and director of a Zoro Financial. What's zero Financial doing mate? 10 00:00:25,800 --> 00:00:28,840 Speaker 2: Mate? We're a brokerage. We're down in Double Bay and 11 00:00:29,960 --> 00:00:35,159 Speaker 2: there is brokerage. What mortgage brokerage? Yeah, not brokering boats, mate, No, 12 00:00:35,720 --> 00:00:37,839 Speaker 2: not at that level yet. But we're a mortgage brokerage 13 00:00:37,920 --> 00:00:43,040 Speaker 2: predominantly residential, so consumer loans and yeah, servicing you know, 14 00:00:43,200 --> 00:00:45,919 Speaker 2: mainly i'd say Eastern suburbs, Low and North Shore in 15 00:00:45,920 --> 00:00:48,640 Speaker 2: the west. It would be sort of eighty percent of 16 00:00:48,680 --> 00:00:51,160 Speaker 2: our loans, but we service nationwide. But we're a group 17 00:00:51,200 --> 00:00:54,480 Speaker 2: of brokers down in Double Bay. 18 00:00:54,480 --> 00:00:57,000 Speaker 1: Look what's tag co found or something like that, Tom, 19 00:00:57,320 --> 00:01:00,160 Speaker 1: So you know what's it like to start? We're did 20 00:01:00,200 --> 00:01:01,319 Speaker 1: you start? Well? 21 00:01:01,360 --> 00:01:03,600 Speaker 2: I started at a friends brokridge. Actually he got me 22 00:01:03,640 --> 00:01:05,880 Speaker 2: into it. Before that, I was in funds management and 23 00:01:06,400 --> 00:01:09,240 Speaker 2: as an analyst, which basically just means you shit kicking 24 00:01:09,240 --> 00:01:11,400 Speaker 2: to put a light lead straight out of UNI. And 25 00:01:11,480 --> 00:01:14,160 Speaker 2: a friend of mine was doing consumer lending and mortgages, 26 00:01:14,200 --> 00:01:16,720 Speaker 2: I should say, And that's kicking some goals. That's there. Yeah, 27 00:01:16,760 --> 00:01:20,440 Speaker 2: as I said, James, how are you going? Yeah, so 28 00:01:20,520 --> 00:01:22,440 Speaker 2: thanks for getting me into it, as he knows. You know, 29 00:01:22,480 --> 00:01:24,920 Speaker 2: we used to spend a bit of time back at 30 00:01:24,920 --> 00:01:28,560 Speaker 2: his place putting some presentations together when he was at Oxygen, 31 00:01:29,000 --> 00:01:31,240 Speaker 2: and he got me into it. He was at Oxygen, 32 00:01:31,240 --> 00:01:32,279 Speaker 2: he was in Oxygen. Exactly. 33 00:01:32,520 --> 00:01:34,920 Speaker 1: That was the one with John McGrath, Yeah, exactly, that 34 00:01:35,000 --> 00:01:37,200 Speaker 1: was there. That was Bras Green. 35 00:01:37,319 --> 00:01:40,039 Speaker 2: What's his name, James Green used to work with you. 36 00:01:40,120 --> 00:01:44,600 Speaker 2: Back it out, James, That's not what he says. 37 00:01:45,959 --> 00:01:47,559 Speaker 1: Left, I could tell the real story. 38 00:01:47,880 --> 00:01:48,240 Speaker 2: But is it? 39 00:01:48,280 --> 00:01:50,560 Speaker 1: By the way, James, James a bloody good broker. He 40 00:01:50,680 --> 00:01:52,040 Speaker 1: understands breaking very well. 41 00:01:52,160 --> 00:01:54,720 Speaker 2: Yeah. Yeah, he's still he's still in lending. Is he 42 00:01:55,040 --> 00:01:56,440 Speaker 2: still at a lender? I think at the moment, or 43 00:01:56,480 --> 00:01:58,480 Speaker 2: he's definitely involved or something. The other day you cut 44 00:01:58,520 --> 00:02:03,480 Speaker 2: your teeth. Fo taught me and an exceptional, exceptional teacher, 45 00:02:03,520 --> 00:02:05,880 Speaker 2: and they had a great business and learned a lot 46 00:02:05,960 --> 00:02:09,239 Speaker 2: there and was there for three years. You're doing broking 47 00:02:09,280 --> 00:02:11,160 Speaker 2: and then my brother was in commercial lending its and 48 00:02:11,200 --> 00:02:15,280 Speaker 2: George he came into the business a sure and then 49 00:02:15,360 --> 00:02:18,280 Speaker 2: we ended up parting ways. In twenty sixteen, Ben and 50 00:02:18,360 --> 00:02:22,160 Speaker 2: I went down to Double Bay, got a serviced office 51 00:02:22,160 --> 00:02:24,560 Speaker 2: and started at Zora instead of started building it from there. 52 00:02:24,800 --> 00:02:27,760 Speaker 1: So do you have in terms of most people always 53 00:02:27,760 --> 00:02:31,920 Speaker 1: be interested in this, particularly the broken industry when you 54 00:02:31,960 --> 00:02:34,919 Speaker 1: start off. Yeah, it's okay to start in a service 55 00:02:34,919 --> 00:02:37,639 Speaker 1: office above the ground, above like a level one or 56 00:02:37,639 --> 00:02:40,480 Speaker 1: wherever it is. And you don't have to have an 57 00:02:40,480 --> 00:02:41,360 Speaker 1: address on the street. 58 00:02:42,000 --> 00:02:44,000 Speaker 2: No, I don't think so. We didn't need it. We 59 00:02:44,919 --> 00:02:48,919 Speaker 2: built our We built our business off the back of 60 00:02:48,960 --> 00:02:52,040 Speaker 2: referrah relationships. We didn't need a street presence. 61 00:02:52,360 --> 00:02:54,840 Speaker 1: So how do you run your business? So what your 62 00:02:54,880 --> 00:02:57,239 Speaker 1: business model? Do people come to see you now or 63 00:02:57,320 --> 00:02:58,200 Speaker 1: do you go to see them? 64 00:02:58,760 --> 00:03:00,280 Speaker 2: We do go to see them, or they can come 65 00:03:00,320 --> 00:03:01,959 Speaker 2: and see us now we've got an office where people 66 00:03:02,000 --> 00:03:03,720 Speaker 2: can come and meet us, and we are happy to 67 00:03:03,720 --> 00:03:05,480 Speaker 2: go and meet clients if they if they need us. 68 00:03:05,520 --> 00:03:08,200 Speaker 2: A lot of it is actually done remotely these days, 69 00:03:08,280 --> 00:03:09,600 Speaker 2: a lot of technology. 70 00:03:09,120 --> 00:03:10,840 Speaker 1: And all the as a zoom or something like that. 71 00:03:10,880 --> 00:03:14,760 Speaker 2: Exactly. It's all facility, it's all able to be mostly 72 00:03:14,919 --> 00:03:19,840 Speaker 2: facilitated remotely. And our business is based, you know, almost 73 00:03:20,120 --> 00:03:25,560 Speaker 2: solely off building business to business relationships with referral partners, 74 00:03:25,560 --> 00:03:27,960 Speaker 2: whether it we real estate agency accounts or financial planners. 75 00:03:28,120 --> 00:03:33,400 Speaker 2: We do have some B two C type lead generations. 76 00:03:33,000 --> 00:03:34,440 Speaker 1: And retail type stuff. 77 00:03:34,680 --> 00:03:37,119 Speaker 2: No, no, I mean we don't really have you walk 78 00:03:37,160 --> 00:03:40,040 Speaker 2: off the street type stuff, but we I generate a 79 00:03:40,040 --> 00:03:42,480 Speaker 2: bit of inquiry through my social media presence. But other 80 00:03:42,560 --> 00:03:46,160 Speaker 2: than that, it's all relationship and existing client referrals. 81 00:03:46,280 --> 00:03:47,800 Speaker 1: Can we explore that a little bit because I think 82 00:03:47,840 --> 00:03:49,320 Speaker 1: that's important. I think if you're broke, you've got to 83 00:03:49,320 --> 00:03:51,520 Speaker 1: know how to do this stuff. And it's easier said 84 00:03:51,560 --> 00:03:56,720 Speaker 1: than done. When you let's assume you already pass your 85 00:03:56,760 --> 00:03:58,880 Speaker 1: sort of kick off period and your start up period 86 00:03:58,920 --> 00:04:00,760 Speaker 1: and you've sort of got the got a bit rhythm 87 00:04:00,760 --> 00:04:03,520 Speaker 1: going you and your brother, and let's just put commercial side. 88 00:04:03,560 --> 00:04:07,160 Speaker 1: Just talk about Rezy for the second. How do you 89 00:04:07,200 --> 00:04:10,560 Speaker 1: build relationships with, say, or who do you build relationships with? 90 00:04:10,600 --> 00:04:12,840 Speaker 2: The first? Well, I go through this a lot with 91 00:04:13,000 --> 00:04:15,760 Speaker 2: my existing brokers. But when you think about broking seventy 92 00:04:15,800 --> 00:04:17,760 Speaker 2: five percent of all loans in Australia, they're about to 93 00:04:17,880 --> 00:04:21,240 Speaker 2: done with brokers. It's basically a staple type service that 94 00:04:21,360 --> 00:04:23,960 Speaker 2: the community needs, right and expect that and expect one 95 00:04:24,000 --> 00:04:27,200 Speaker 2: hundred percent and the community wants that, they demand it, 96 00:04:27,240 --> 00:04:28,880 Speaker 2: and that's why seventy five percent of all loans are 97 00:04:28,880 --> 00:04:30,479 Speaker 2: done through brokers. And if you want to buy a property, 98 00:04:30,520 --> 00:04:32,760 Speaker 2: unless you've won the lotter or you've come into money 99 00:04:32,839 --> 00:04:35,360 Speaker 2: or your family's got money, you do need to borrow money, right, 100 00:04:35,680 --> 00:04:37,200 Speaker 2: And so we know that the community needs it. We 101 00:04:37,279 --> 00:04:39,000 Speaker 2: know that three quarters of people are going to use 102 00:04:39,000 --> 00:04:41,320 Speaker 2: a broker. So then it's about just trying to be 103 00:04:41,360 --> 00:04:43,600 Speaker 2: the best broker that you can be and trying to 104 00:04:43,600 --> 00:04:45,599 Speaker 2: get in front of people. And the way that I 105 00:04:45,800 --> 00:04:49,400 Speaker 2: sort of encourage our brokers to build for relationships is 106 00:04:49,440 --> 00:04:51,280 Speaker 2: have a structured plan in place. What do you take 107 00:04:51,320 --> 00:04:53,640 Speaker 2: to the meeting? You know, what, how are you going 108 00:04:53,720 --> 00:04:57,520 Speaker 2: to communicate that you're a good broker in terms of 109 00:04:57,560 --> 00:05:00,840 Speaker 2: your credit policy, you and your serve in your process. 110 00:05:01,360 --> 00:05:04,719 Speaker 2: But if you have extremely good credit knowledge and very 111 00:05:04,760 --> 00:05:07,239 Speaker 2: good credit policy, and your process is good and robust 112 00:05:07,279 --> 00:05:09,680 Speaker 2: and free of errors, and you've got good attention to detail. 113 00:05:10,360 --> 00:05:15,520 Speaker 2: Then it's very easy to be considered a high quality broker, 114 00:05:15,920 --> 00:05:18,560 Speaker 2: and you don't really need to be that good at sales. 115 00:05:18,560 --> 00:05:21,320 Speaker 2: In my opinion, I think the service is what sells itself. 116 00:05:21,560 --> 00:05:24,640 Speaker 2: I think people spend so much time trying to worry 117 00:05:24,640 --> 00:05:26,880 Speaker 2: about the sales aspect, which you need to. But if 118 00:05:26,920 --> 00:05:31,839 Speaker 2: you can really focus on having exceptional credit knowledge and 119 00:05:31,960 --> 00:05:35,680 Speaker 2: process and policy policy understanding, and then getting in front 120 00:05:35,680 --> 00:05:39,920 Speaker 2: of the right business businesses who need to be able 121 00:05:39,960 --> 00:05:44,120 Speaker 2: to send their clients to reliable brokers, then you'll have 122 00:05:44,160 --> 00:05:46,520 Speaker 2: to focus less on the sales aspect, and it's about 123 00:05:47,279 --> 00:05:50,960 Speaker 2: providing a reliable solution to an account and a planner 124 00:05:50,960 --> 00:05:53,560 Speaker 2: to say, look, if you've got someone that needs lending requirements, 125 00:05:53,600 --> 00:05:57,359 Speaker 2: you know, please send them to me. But this and 126 00:05:57,400 --> 00:05:59,360 Speaker 2: this is another thing is probably a good point for people. 127 00:06:00,040 --> 00:06:02,000 Speaker 2: And a really good lesson that I've learned over time 128 00:06:02,120 --> 00:06:04,120 Speaker 2: is that things take time. You know, you can't sitt 129 00:06:04,120 --> 00:06:05,880 Speaker 2: of go I'm going to go and meet three referral 130 00:06:05,880 --> 00:06:08,320 Speaker 2: partners and all of a sudden, I've got referral relationships. No, 131 00:06:08,360 --> 00:06:10,359 Speaker 2: you've got to keep chipping, chipping, chipping, chipping, put a 132 00:06:10,360 --> 00:06:12,359 Speaker 2: plan in place so I'm going to meet I'm going 133 00:06:12,400 --> 00:06:13,920 Speaker 2: to try and meet two new referral partners a week 134 00:06:13,920 --> 00:06:15,080 Speaker 2: when I'm going to take to the meeting, what are 135 00:06:15,080 --> 00:06:18,240 Speaker 2: we going to do after the meeting? And keep going consistently. 136 00:06:18,240 --> 00:06:19,640 Speaker 2: It's not going to happen after two months, might not 137 00:06:19,680 --> 00:06:21,640 Speaker 2: even happen after six months. But you need to trust 138 00:06:21,640 --> 00:06:26,800 Speaker 2: the process and understand that people need good brokers. So 139 00:06:26,920 --> 00:06:28,800 Speaker 2: if you go out and meet enough people, you will 140 00:06:28,839 --> 00:06:31,200 Speaker 2: get results. But I feel like a lot of brokers 141 00:06:31,560 --> 00:06:33,800 Speaker 2: and maybe you can tell me if I'm wrong here, Mark, 142 00:06:33,800 --> 00:06:35,520 Speaker 2: but a lot of brokers will say, Okay, I know 143 00:06:35,600 --> 00:06:37,400 Speaker 2: what I need to do, and they'll do it for 144 00:06:37,400 --> 00:06:39,240 Speaker 2: a month or two and then they'll go, I haven't 145 00:06:39,279 --> 00:06:40,920 Speaker 2: got a riding it a referral partner. I'm not going 146 00:06:40,920 --> 00:06:43,799 Speaker 2: to do it anymore. But you got to keep going. 147 00:06:43,920 --> 00:06:45,080 Speaker 2: You just got to keep pushing. 148 00:06:45,320 --> 00:06:49,120 Speaker 1: That's so interesting. So given there's like I think eighteen 149 00:06:49,120 --> 00:06:52,800 Speaker 1: thousand brokers out there, and as you said, they generate 150 00:06:52,880 --> 00:06:55,640 Speaker 1: seventy five percent of all mortgages mortgages going into the 151 00:06:55,640 --> 00:06:59,280 Speaker 1: banking system in this country, and there's only one other 152 00:06:59,279 --> 00:07:01,000 Speaker 1: country that's sort of similar to that, that's the UK. 153 00:07:01,080 --> 00:07:04,520 Speaker 1: Is probably even higher in the UK, it's pretty competitive 154 00:07:04,560 --> 00:07:08,440 Speaker 1: when it comes to getting referral partners. What do you 155 00:07:08,520 --> 00:07:14,760 Speaker 1: reckon your superpower is in terms of making in terms 156 00:07:14,800 --> 00:07:18,640 Speaker 1: of getting convincing someone to put you in their consideration 157 00:07:18,720 --> 00:07:20,960 Speaker 1: list of the broker they might deal with for their client. 158 00:07:21,040 --> 00:07:23,360 Speaker 1: Could be an accountant dealing with his HERK client. It 159 00:07:23,400 --> 00:07:25,560 Speaker 1: could be a lawyer dealing with his HERT client. Could 160 00:07:25,560 --> 00:07:28,440 Speaker 1: be really sad agent. What is it that you think 161 00:07:28,560 --> 00:07:31,960 Speaker 1: is your superpower and how is it and is it repeatable? 162 00:07:33,480 --> 00:07:35,680 Speaker 2: Repeatable? It's not a superpower at all. It's a bit 163 00:07:35,720 --> 00:07:39,640 Speaker 2: of planning and it's a professional approach. A lot more, 164 00:07:39,920 --> 00:07:42,480 Speaker 2: you know than that. I think most brokers rely on 165 00:07:42,520 --> 00:07:47,240 Speaker 2: that sort of friendly relationship, you know type approach which 166 00:07:47,280 --> 00:07:49,160 Speaker 2: has its place. People want to deal with people that 167 00:07:49,360 --> 00:07:52,200 Speaker 2: they want to work with and that they enjoy are 168 00:07:52,240 --> 00:07:55,440 Speaker 2: working with the like they like. Of course, but when 169 00:07:55,440 --> 00:07:56,840 Speaker 2: you're going to go meet an account and you gotta 170 00:07:56,880 --> 00:07:58,840 Speaker 2: understand he's probably had five brokers call him in the 171 00:07:58,920 --> 00:08:00,680 Speaker 2: last week. Okay, so you've got to take a bit 172 00:08:00,720 --> 00:08:03,080 Speaker 2: of a different approach. Look, listen, I know you're busy. 173 00:08:03,160 --> 00:08:04,800 Speaker 2: I don't want to waste any of your time, Okay, 174 00:08:05,000 --> 00:08:06,480 Speaker 2: I've got to I've got a few things I'd like 175 00:08:06,480 --> 00:08:08,280 Speaker 2: to tick off, tell you about who I am and 176 00:08:08,320 --> 00:08:10,080 Speaker 2: what we do and how I can add value to 177 00:08:10,080 --> 00:08:12,160 Speaker 2: your clients over and above and just trying to help 178 00:08:12,160 --> 00:08:14,760 Speaker 2: them with their loans. We can do rate reviews, you know, 179 00:08:14,800 --> 00:08:16,560 Speaker 2: I can come and meet with your clients if you need, 180 00:08:16,720 --> 00:08:20,840 Speaker 2: if you need, if you need me to, and you know, 181 00:08:21,080 --> 00:08:22,760 Speaker 2: before you go to the meeting, maybe you send them 182 00:08:22,760 --> 00:08:24,360 Speaker 2: an email about what you're going to cover in the meeting. 183 00:08:24,360 --> 00:08:26,160 Speaker 2: When you're in the meeting, you have an agenda. How 184 00:08:26,200 --> 00:08:28,280 Speaker 2: I look. Thanks so much for your time, again, very 185 00:08:28,400 --> 00:08:29,880 Speaker 2: very conscious of your time. This is what we're going 186 00:08:29,920 --> 00:08:31,440 Speaker 2: to cover is how I think we can work together, 187 00:08:31,480 --> 00:08:33,160 Speaker 2: and this is why we're different. And I'm not going 188 00:08:33,240 --> 00:08:36,080 Speaker 2: to sit here and try and you know, again waste 189 00:08:36,160 --> 00:08:37,960 Speaker 2: much of your time. And then afterwards, maybe send them 190 00:08:37,960 --> 00:08:40,520 Speaker 2: an email and then you keep them updated. 191 00:08:40,240 --> 00:08:43,520 Speaker 1: And ause you up done with market updates. 192 00:08:43,640 --> 00:08:46,400 Speaker 2: You know interest Maquari's just cut their fix rates. Bang 193 00:08:46,760 --> 00:08:49,720 Speaker 2: send a text merge out to all your accountants. West 194 00:08:49,760 --> 00:08:51,720 Speaker 2: Batch just increase their fix rates. Something to keep in 195 00:08:51,720 --> 00:08:53,679 Speaker 2: mind on send them something or hey, this is a 196 00:08:53,720 --> 00:08:56,640 Speaker 2: new policy that CBAS just release short sharp piece of 197 00:08:56,640 --> 00:08:59,079 Speaker 2: information that they might be interested in, and then give 198 00:08:59,080 --> 00:09:00,719 Speaker 2: them a call and let them know. You know, hey, look, 199 00:09:00,720 --> 00:09:02,640 Speaker 2: I'm not sure if you saw that email yesterday. Again, 200 00:09:02,720 --> 00:09:04,520 Speaker 2: not trying to waste soo much of your time. Interesting 201 00:09:04,559 --> 00:09:09,040 Speaker 2: polyc interesting policy just came out from CBA something. So 202 00:09:09,679 --> 00:09:12,839 Speaker 2: there's a very much this. You know, it's going to 203 00:09:12,920 --> 00:09:16,800 Speaker 2: take time to build that up, but over over a 204 00:09:16,880 --> 00:09:19,600 Speaker 2: not so long period mark. But these are referral parts 205 00:09:19,600 --> 00:09:22,200 Speaker 2: of Notice, well, this broke is different. He came to 206 00:09:22,240 --> 00:09:24,559 Speaker 2: my office, he had an agenda, he sent me an 207 00:09:24,559 --> 00:09:27,360 Speaker 2: email afterwards, he sent me four updates in the last 208 00:09:27,440 --> 00:09:30,080 Speaker 2: two months, and he's kept updated with me because I 209 00:09:30,080 --> 00:09:33,000 Speaker 2: can guarantee you both brokers out aren't out there doing that. 210 00:09:33,320 --> 00:09:38,120 Speaker 2: So the point of difference isn't like some major monumental secret. 211 00:09:38,679 --> 00:09:42,120 Speaker 2: It's about really thinking about what are these? You know? 212 00:09:42,120 --> 00:09:44,520 Speaker 2: How do these? How does how do you expect an 213 00:09:44,559 --> 00:09:47,840 Speaker 2: account or a financial planner to recognize that you're the 214 00:09:47,880 --> 00:09:50,560 Speaker 2: broker that they want to work with. Will show them 215 00:09:50,679 --> 00:09:52,640 Speaker 2: that you're a you're on a bit of another level. 216 00:09:52,720 --> 00:09:54,240 Speaker 2: But how do you show them that? Or you stay 217 00:09:54,240 --> 00:09:56,360 Speaker 2: in front of mine, give them valuable pieces of information 218 00:09:56,760 --> 00:10:00,280 Speaker 2: and have a very professional approach to how you operate. 219 00:10:00,360 --> 00:10:03,000 Speaker 1: And sometimes I refer to that as are you going 220 00:10:03,040 --> 00:10:05,120 Speaker 1: to be competent? So you've got to demonstrate your competency 221 00:10:05,520 --> 00:10:09,839 Speaker 1: in your subject matter, which is bank loans or what 222 00:10:09,880 --> 00:10:13,240 Speaker 1: are the bank requirements? But equally you got to show value. 223 00:10:13,280 --> 00:10:17,200 Speaker 1: You've got to be competent plus valuable. And I quite 224 00:10:17,280 --> 00:10:21,840 Speaker 1: like your idea of sending out an email with alerts, 225 00:10:22,720 --> 00:10:26,160 Speaker 1: lending alerts, whatever it's called. How do you get their attention? Like, 226 00:10:26,240 --> 00:10:28,720 Speaker 1: because you know, like the accountant or whoever it is, 227 00:10:28,760 --> 00:10:31,240 Speaker 1: the lawyer might be getting one hundred emails a day. 228 00:10:32,520 --> 00:10:34,560 Speaker 1: Mostly it's these days reading emails is a bit of 229 00:10:34,559 --> 00:10:37,280 Speaker 1: a grudge grudge roat because you used to be fine 230 00:10:37,320 --> 00:10:39,760 Speaker 1: and exciting. Bit these days you generally speaking, you're getting 231 00:10:39,800 --> 00:10:42,520 Speaker 1: bad news in most emails. It's a problem that you've 232 00:10:42,520 --> 00:10:45,600 Speaker 1: got to solve. If you're working in a professional environment. 233 00:10:45,880 --> 00:10:48,120 Speaker 1: Generally speaking, is very rare people going hey, go and 234 00:10:48,160 --> 00:10:51,199 Speaker 1: you know what's happening Tom? You know, how's your brother's 235 00:10:51,240 --> 00:10:54,960 Speaker 1: sister or whatever. It's more about mate, you need to 236 00:10:54,960 --> 00:10:58,480 Speaker 1: sort this out or someone's pitching something to you. Yeah, 237 00:10:58,920 --> 00:11:03,800 Speaker 1: So how do you a what protocols, what platforms. Do 238 00:11:03,840 --> 00:11:05,360 Speaker 1: you use to use WhatsApp? Do you ask them for 239 00:11:05,360 --> 00:11:07,480 Speaker 1: the mobile phone? Do you ask them for the email address? 240 00:11:07,640 --> 00:11:10,000 Speaker 1: If so, if it's just email address, why do you 241 00:11:10,000 --> 00:11:13,480 Speaker 1: only do an email address? So what protocols and why? 242 00:11:14,200 --> 00:11:16,160 Speaker 1: And then how often do you hit them up? 243 00:11:17,160 --> 00:11:23,599 Speaker 2: I would say text messaging is a huge unutilized platform 244 00:11:23,640 --> 00:11:26,320 Speaker 2: to contact your referral partners. But you've got to be 245 00:11:26,320 --> 00:11:28,439 Speaker 2: conscious as well as you said that people are getting 246 00:11:28,440 --> 00:11:31,240 Speaker 2: communication left, right and center. If you're going to bombard 247 00:11:31,280 --> 00:11:35,640 Speaker 2: them with crap mine my French, then forget about it. 248 00:11:35,679 --> 00:11:37,000 Speaker 2: You know that you're going to be annoying. But I 249 00:11:37,000 --> 00:11:42,360 Speaker 2: would say one valuable piece of information via text messaging 250 00:11:42,559 --> 00:11:45,360 Speaker 2: enough or as well as an email. You could send 251 00:11:45,400 --> 00:11:47,360 Speaker 2: the email, and you could send the text to just say, 252 00:11:47,720 --> 00:11:50,080 Speaker 2: you know, I hope you're well marked. Just by the way, 253 00:11:50,160 --> 00:11:51,760 Speaker 2: I just shot your name. I just shot you an 254 00:11:51,800 --> 00:11:54,400 Speaker 2: interesting email about some policy, and I'll try and call 255 00:11:54,400 --> 00:11:56,440 Speaker 2: you next week to discuss it. Have a great week. 256 00:11:56,760 --> 00:12:00,920 Speaker 2: So people see an email and they go see But 257 00:12:00,960 --> 00:12:04,640 Speaker 2: if they text messages, people read and it's not about 258 00:12:04,679 --> 00:12:07,319 Speaker 2: bombarding them like a marketing exercise, like you're getting these 259 00:12:07,360 --> 00:12:10,920 Speaker 2: marketing texts from God knows who it's about, sort of 260 00:12:11,400 --> 00:12:14,200 Speaker 2: again being conscious of their time, understanding that they're unlikely 261 00:12:14,240 --> 00:12:16,280 Speaker 2: to open the email, and then they said to read 262 00:12:16,280 --> 00:12:18,600 Speaker 2: it and go okay, Well, he send me an email 263 00:12:18,760 --> 00:12:21,360 Speaker 2: some valuable information. He's now texting me to let me know, 264 00:12:21,480 --> 00:12:23,040 Speaker 2: and he said he's going to call me next week. 265 00:12:23,160 --> 00:12:25,720 Speaker 2: He said. It gets me a bit, doesn't he because 266 00:12:25,720 --> 00:12:27,320 Speaker 2: he knows I'm not going to read it. He knows 267 00:12:27,320 --> 00:12:28,719 Speaker 2: that he needs to text me to remind me, and 268 00:12:28,760 --> 00:12:30,600 Speaker 2: he's not going to annoy me. And that sort of 269 00:12:30,640 --> 00:12:33,880 Speaker 2: all feeds into it. So I think do you give 270 00:12:33,920 --> 00:12:34,360 Speaker 2: them the option? 271 00:12:34,440 --> 00:12:36,440 Speaker 1: Tom? I was just thinking about that when as you're 272 00:12:36,440 --> 00:12:38,080 Speaker 1: talking about do you give them the option to say? 273 00:12:39,000 --> 00:12:40,959 Speaker 1: First text? Just on LESAMBI gave our first six So 274 00:12:41,000 --> 00:12:44,960 Speaker 1: I've said you an email. Second, Then the second point 275 00:12:44,960 --> 00:12:47,480 Speaker 1: in the text might be I'll send you another text 276 00:12:47,559 --> 00:12:49,240 Speaker 1: next week to remind you so I know you're busy. 277 00:12:50,360 --> 00:12:52,200 Speaker 1: Then when you send the second text, you say, look, 278 00:12:52,360 --> 00:12:54,280 Speaker 1: I don't know if you've read it or not, but 279 00:12:54,320 --> 00:12:56,000 Speaker 1: if you have read it, could just ride back to me. 280 00:12:56,080 --> 00:12:57,439 Speaker 1: What yes or no? If you would like me to 281 00:12:57,480 --> 00:12:59,679 Speaker 1: call you. Do you give them the option to call 282 00:12:59,720 --> 00:13:01,920 Speaker 1: you backcause they might say, oh, fuck, don't call me, like, 283 00:13:02,760 --> 00:13:07,400 Speaker 1: just wipe that bit out. They might say, I don't 284 00:13:07,400 --> 00:13:08,480 Speaker 1: want to have to talk to the guy. I'm not 285 00:13:08,559 --> 00:13:11,079 Speaker 1: just I'm too busy. I'm doing all my accountant, I'm 286 00:13:11,080 --> 00:13:13,040 Speaker 1: doing a client's tax returns. I've just got too much 287 00:13:13,080 --> 00:13:16,160 Speaker 1: going on. I've got head noise or whatever. I'd rather 288 00:13:17,679 --> 00:13:20,000 Speaker 1: I can go. And yeah, I wanted you to call me, 289 00:13:20,040 --> 00:13:24,360 Speaker 1: so as opposed to you're just calling me, because that 290 00:13:24,400 --> 00:13:25,600 Speaker 1: can be a bit of a pain in the neck. 291 00:13:25,800 --> 00:13:28,560 Speaker 2: That would be even another level again, well, doctor's doing 292 00:13:28,679 --> 00:13:31,400 Speaker 2: conscious when dog's making a point for you. 293 00:13:31,120 --> 00:13:33,680 Speaker 1: You make an appointment, and doctor, they've got some automatic 294 00:13:33,720 --> 00:13:37,120 Speaker 1: software system that sends a text out of people you 295 00:13:37,160 --> 00:13:39,600 Speaker 1: have an appointment on some and so just and it's 296 00:13:39,880 --> 00:13:42,640 Speaker 1: ten am on next Friday, and it gives you put 297 00:13:42,679 --> 00:13:46,120 Speaker 1: in a while Yeah, and why and why? 298 00:13:46,360 --> 00:13:46,600 Speaker 2: Sorry? 299 00:13:46,880 --> 00:13:48,040 Speaker 1: I mean, do you ever do that sort of stuff? 300 00:13:48,040 --> 00:13:48,760 Speaker 1: You ever thought about that? 301 00:13:48,840 --> 00:13:51,960 Speaker 2: I haven't, But I think that's even a valuable thing. Again, 302 00:13:52,040 --> 00:13:54,480 Speaker 2: because then they're sort of going, I don't want him 303 00:13:54,520 --> 00:13:56,360 Speaker 2: to call, and he knows that I might not, you know, 304 00:13:56,520 --> 00:13:58,560 Speaker 2: so I don't want her to call or whatever. But 305 00:13:59,360 --> 00:14:01,840 Speaker 2: you know, that's that all feeds into it again. But 306 00:14:01,880 --> 00:14:04,440 Speaker 2: I think the emailing with the text messaging is valuable 307 00:14:04,520 --> 00:14:06,679 Speaker 2: and it's really a front of mine thing, and you've 308 00:14:06,679 --> 00:14:08,880 Speaker 2: got to keep in mind they might see the email, 309 00:14:08,920 --> 00:14:10,880 Speaker 2: they might not get the email. They might be sitting 310 00:14:10,920 --> 00:14:13,480 Speaker 2: with a client when your text comes to yah. You know, 311 00:14:13,760 --> 00:14:15,480 Speaker 2: they might be sitting with a client when the email 312 00:14:15,520 --> 00:14:18,000 Speaker 2: comes through, and then the text comes the next day, 313 00:14:18,160 --> 00:14:20,840 Speaker 2: so you sort of that's another thing you got to 314 00:14:20,840 --> 00:14:23,720 Speaker 2: be conscious of if you're sending these prompts to people 315 00:14:24,000 --> 00:14:26,280 Speaker 2: a lot of the time. A lot of the time 316 00:14:26,320 --> 00:14:30,000 Speaker 2: because I understand it happens to me personally. You'll be 317 00:14:30,040 --> 00:14:33,000 Speaker 2: with a client they'll say I need a contact for 318 00:14:33,040 --> 00:14:34,840 Speaker 2: so and so, and off the top of your head, 319 00:14:34,920 --> 00:14:36,880 Speaker 2: you know you've got five people you could refer them to, 320 00:14:36,960 --> 00:14:40,080 Speaker 2: but you just don't quite which one's going to be best. 321 00:14:40,320 --> 00:14:42,640 Speaker 2: And that would be the same with accountants and planners. 322 00:14:43,000 --> 00:14:45,120 Speaker 2: They'll sort of go well, which broken And a lot 323 00:14:45,120 --> 00:14:46,600 Speaker 2: of the time it's about just being in front of 324 00:14:46,640 --> 00:14:48,400 Speaker 2: mind and if they can know they can rely on 325 00:14:48,480 --> 00:14:50,640 Speaker 2: you and they've just received your email or your text, 326 00:14:50,920 --> 00:14:52,800 Speaker 2: you're the person that will pop into their head. 327 00:14:53,040 --> 00:14:55,840 Speaker 1: Do you guys sit on a platform aggregator's platform. 328 00:14:56,200 --> 00:14:58,200 Speaker 2: We are we aggregate through Connective. 329 00:14:58,320 --> 00:15:01,000 Speaker 1: You go through Connective, we aggregate through How do you 330 00:15:01,080 --> 00:15:05,360 Speaker 1: how do you and your brokers? What's your process of 331 00:15:05,400 --> 00:15:08,200 Speaker 1: keeping up keep you on top of apart from your software, 332 00:15:08,240 --> 00:15:12,280 Speaker 1: but how do you keep on top of loan features, 333 00:15:12,280 --> 00:15:16,880 Speaker 1: loan changes? What's your sort of process and or your rhythm? 334 00:15:17,080 --> 00:15:18,800 Speaker 1: Like you every Monday morning, do you all get together 335 00:15:18,840 --> 00:15:21,520 Speaker 1: and say, look what's changed today or on the weekend, 336 00:15:21,640 --> 00:15:23,520 Speaker 1: or what should you fixed rate at west Bag or whatever? 337 00:15:23,960 --> 00:15:24,680 Speaker 1: How do you do that? 338 00:15:25,240 --> 00:15:29,280 Speaker 2: Well, we have a very collaborative environment in our business. 339 00:15:29,560 --> 00:15:32,560 Speaker 2: We've got twelve accredited loan writers and they've got their 340 00:15:32,600 --> 00:15:35,440 Speaker 2: own various teams, and we're all based. We're all essentially 341 00:15:35,440 --> 00:15:38,960 Speaker 2: in one office, so we're sharing information about rates. We 342 00:15:39,120 --> 00:15:41,640 Speaker 2: get a bank in every week. Okay, so we get 343 00:15:41,720 --> 00:15:44,040 Speaker 2: a bank in every Tuesday to come and talk to us. 344 00:15:44,040 --> 00:15:45,960 Speaker 2: Any of the banks, any of the banks, you know, 345 00:15:46,000 --> 00:15:48,200 Speaker 2: whether it's you know, it could be Son called bank, 346 00:15:48,240 --> 00:15:50,080 Speaker 2: wes CBO, whoever's. 347 00:15:49,520 --> 00:15:50,240 Speaker 1: Called the BDM in. 348 00:15:50,600 --> 00:15:52,160 Speaker 2: We get the BDM in to come and tell us 349 00:15:52,160 --> 00:15:54,640 Speaker 2: about their products into and that keeps the relationship. 350 00:15:54,640 --> 00:15:56,160 Speaker 1: What's that rhythm look like, Tom? Is that a Monday 351 00:15:56,160 --> 00:15:57,200 Speaker 1: morning or it doesn't. 352 00:15:56,960 --> 00:15:58,320 Speaker 2: Matter, Tuesday eleven o'clock. 353 00:15:58,680 --> 00:16:00,000 Speaker 1: Of course, everyone knows there's an appointment. 354 00:16:00,400 --> 00:16:03,360 Speaker 2: It's pretty regular. Every every week we're getting a bank in. 355 00:16:03,400 --> 00:16:05,120 Speaker 2: It might move here and there, but every week we're 356 00:16:05,120 --> 00:16:07,760 Speaker 2: getting a bank in. And sometimes it's two a week. 357 00:16:07,840 --> 00:16:10,160 Speaker 2: And it could be could be a different could be 358 00:16:10,160 --> 00:16:12,880 Speaker 2: a private lender or something like that. But we're getting 359 00:16:12,960 --> 00:16:16,240 Speaker 2: lenders into the office and they're because we all sort 360 00:16:16,280 --> 00:16:18,680 Speaker 2: of because we give them value in terms of being 361 00:16:18,680 --> 00:16:21,080 Speaker 2: able to see a lot of brokers at once, not 362 00:16:21,120 --> 00:16:23,040 Speaker 2: a lot, but you know that's a lot. 363 00:16:24,240 --> 00:16:25,880 Speaker 1: It's a lot of brokes at once in one shop. 364 00:16:26,200 --> 00:16:28,800 Speaker 2: So they they you know, they're happy to come, and 365 00:16:28,840 --> 00:16:31,560 Speaker 2: we try and make it valuable for them by giving 366 00:16:31,560 --> 00:16:33,480 Speaker 2: them a you know, putting a photo together and giving 367 00:16:33,520 --> 00:16:37,440 Speaker 2: them some marketing as well, giving them some coverage. And 368 00:16:37,440 --> 00:16:39,480 Speaker 2: and that's one way we stay on top of it. 369 00:16:39,520 --> 00:16:44,800 Speaker 2: But we're very conscious of sharing policy and process and 370 00:16:44,880 --> 00:16:50,000 Speaker 2: sorry rates and everything in our business communication platforms, you know, 371 00:16:50,000 --> 00:16:53,400 Speaker 2: whether it be Microsoft Teams or whatever. So that's and 372 00:16:53,440 --> 00:16:55,240 Speaker 2: then when we have our broker meeting once a month 373 00:16:55,600 --> 00:16:59,200 Speaker 2: or our company meeting, we have an agenda and in 374 00:16:59,240 --> 00:17:04,119 Speaker 2: that agenda is relevant policy or rate changes, and my 375 00:17:04,760 --> 00:17:06,920 Speaker 2: personal team and my brother's team we add to that 376 00:17:07,119 --> 00:17:09,360 Speaker 2: and we cover off any major changes that we think 377 00:17:09,400 --> 00:17:10,479 Speaker 2: everyone should be aware of. 378 00:17:10,640 --> 00:17:14,680 Speaker 1: So your your business, you guys moved into equipment financiet 379 00:17:14,680 --> 00:17:15,600 Speaker 1: have you doing any equipment? 380 00:17:15,600 --> 00:17:16,840 Speaker 2: We don't do equipment finance. 381 00:17:17,000 --> 00:17:18,119 Speaker 1: Were doing commercials? 382 00:17:18,359 --> 00:17:20,680 Speaker 2: We do a bit of commercial, but it's a small piece. 383 00:17:20,480 --> 00:17:24,400 Speaker 1: Of our Your brothers doing res or he's running where 384 00:17:24,440 --> 00:17:27,120 Speaker 1: would be our business would be between ninety ninety five 385 00:17:27,119 --> 00:17:31,679 Speaker 1: percent resys. And how you find the market, Like, how 386 00:17:31,680 --> 00:17:33,040 Speaker 1: are you finding it at the moment, because you know 387 00:17:33,040 --> 00:17:35,119 Speaker 1: you're not not you're in double baby, You're not just 388 00:17:35,160 --> 00:17:37,560 Speaker 1: doing double bay. You know, in fact, double bay loans 389 00:17:37,560 --> 00:17:39,600 Speaker 1: are probably the hardest loans to do because they're usually 390 00:17:39,680 --> 00:17:40,440 Speaker 1: larger loans. 391 00:17:41,920 --> 00:17:42,399 Speaker 2: Many around. 392 00:17:43,359 --> 00:17:47,119 Speaker 1: Like you know you've got usually you've got complicated trust 393 00:17:47,119 --> 00:17:50,399 Speaker 1: structures and all sorts of things going on. But how 394 00:17:50,400 --> 00:17:54,000 Speaker 1: are you finding the market with your borrower community? So 395 00:17:54,280 --> 00:17:56,040 Speaker 1: give me a snap shoulder your borrow community. Where we 396 00:17:56,080 --> 00:17:58,640 Speaker 1: talk about average loan million two million, what we're looking. 397 00:17:58,480 --> 00:18:00,760 Speaker 2: At something like that. Our average loan across the business 398 00:18:00,840 --> 00:18:02,720 Speaker 2: is probably a million. Mine's probably a bit high it's 399 00:18:02,720 --> 00:18:05,520 Speaker 2: probably closer to one and a half in my team, 400 00:18:05,600 --> 00:18:09,479 Speaker 2: but it's I think there's people still out there who 401 00:18:09,560 --> 00:18:12,720 Speaker 2: are active, but it is certainly as in borrowers borrowers. Yeah, 402 00:18:12,760 --> 00:18:17,840 Speaker 2: there's definitely volume around in our markets. I think there 403 00:18:17,880 --> 00:18:21,680 Speaker 2: people there's less propensity to act quickly at the moment 404 00:18:21,720 --> 00:18:24,000 Speaker 2: because there's a bit of uncertainty. I think people understand 405 00:18:24,080 --> 00:18:26,600 Speaker 2: that there's you know, the markets, it's a bit softer. 406 00:18:27,080 --> 00:18:29,719 Speaker 2: It's a bit softer in our markets. It is in 407 00:18:29,760 --> 00:18:32,600 Speaker 2: some markets around Australia. It's it's absolutely gun ho at 408 00:18:32,600 --> 00:18:34,679 Speaker 2: the moment. It has been all year, but around the 409 00:18:34,760 --> 00:18:37,560 Speaker 2: Sydney market it's been a bit softer and the choiced 410 00:18:37,960 --> 00:18:40,040 Speaker 2: one hundred percent, the expensive end has been coming off. 411 00:18:40,080 --> 00:18:43,760 Speaker 2: The lower end's actually been performing relatively well. But there's 412 00:18:43,760 --> 00:18:46,280 Speaker 2: a there's increased supply, isn't there. So I think there's 413 00:18:46,800 --> 00:18:49,080 Speaker 2: something between ten and twenty percent more supply in the 414 00:18:49,080 --> 00:18:50,560 Speaker 2: market than the five year average at the moment. I 415 00:18:50,640 --> 00:18:52,040 Speaker 2: know the exact figure, but I know that there is 416 00:18:52,080 --> 00:18:55,520 Speaker 2: an increased supply out there, and I think the momentums 417 00:18:55,880 --> 00:18:58,960 Speaker 2: sort of started to come out a little bit and 418 00:18:59,359 --> 00:19:02,320 Speaker 2: people set are realizing that maybe these rate cuts. You know, 419 00:19:02,320 --> 00:19:03,520 Speaker 2: it's not going to be December, but it's not going 420 00:19:03,520 --> 00:19:04,840 Speaker 2: to be fair, but it's going to be a bit longer. 421 00:19:05,400 --> 00:19:08,720 Speaker 2: So there's definitely people out there buying property, for sure, 422 00:19:08,800 --> 00:19:11,720 Speaker 2: but it's a little bit slower and there's more supply 423 00:19:11,840 --> 00:19:13,040 Speaker 2: probably less less demand. 424 00:19:13,160 --> 00:19:17,480 Speaker 1: What are you feeling finding with some people get pre approvals? 425 00:19:18,240 --> 00:19:19,920 Speaker 1: Are you getting You're spending a lot of time on 426 00:19:19,960 --> 00:19:21,360 Speaker 1: pre approvals that don't. 427 00:19:21,160 --> 00:19:23,040 Speaker 2: Settle big time. Yeah, we do. 428 00:19:23,160 --> 00:19:25,080 Speaker 1: As a persenergy total business. Now, is it much greater 429 00:19:25,119 --> 00:19:25,760 Speaker 1: than it ever has been? 430 00:19:27,160 --> 00:19:30,800 Speaker 2: I don't think it's it's much greater. Necessarily, We're always 431 00:19:30,880 --> 00:19:34,359 Speaker 2: doing pre approvals because we are. We do work with 432 00:19:34,400 --> 00:19:36,840 Speaker 2: a lot of real estate agents as as our referral partners, 433 00:19:36,880 --> 00:19:39,600 Speaker 2: and we're always happy to get people preapproved if they 434 00:19:39,640 --> 00:19:41,600 Speaker 2: want to be actively looking in the market. But yeah, 435 00:19:41,600 --> 00:19:44,080 Speaker 2: there's so much of that of getting people approved and 436 00:19:44,080 --> 00:19:47,080 Speaker 2: they're not finding property. I feel I feel like unfortunately 437 00:19:47,119 --> 00:19:49,639 Speaker 2: that's I don't know if that's something that we can 438 00:19:49,720 --> 00:19:53,320 Speaker 2: necessarily get around in our industry's mark because if people 439 00:19:53,320 --> 00:19:55,199 Speaker 2: want to get themselves approved to go and by property 440 00:19:55,240 --> 00:19:57,879 Speaker 2: and instead of say we'll come back to them and 441 00:19:57,920 --> 00:19:59,960 Speaker 2: you find something, you just risk someone else is going 442 00:19:59,960 --> 00:20:00,320 Speaker 2: to to do it. 443 00:20:00,600 --> 00:20:03,960 Speaker 1: Yeah, you got to do them yeah, yeah, yeah try 444 00:20:03,960 --> 00:20:06,600 Speaker 1: and you've got It's a bit of a lucky because 445 00:20:06,600 --> 00:20:08,320 Speaker 1: one of the things about pre approvals that I've noticed 446 00:20:08,359 --> 00:20:11,160 Speaker 1: is a year ago, the people who are pre approving 447 00:20:11,920 --> 00:20:15,240 Speaker 1: went to auction, but the pre approval they got wasn't 448 00:20:15,320 --> 00:20:17,560 Speaker 1: enough to buy the propert because the property went much higher. 449 00:20:18,119 --> 00:20:20,160 Speaker 1: Now the people getting in pre approval is going to auction, 450 00:20:20,359 --> 00:20:22,160 Speaker 1: but they're not buy because they think it's too expensive 451 00:20:22,200 --> 00:20:24,439 Speaker 1: and they could buy cheaper. So they actually got a 452 00:20:24,440 --> 00:20:27,000 Speaker 1: pre approval, but they think, like there wasn't many people 453 00:20:27,119 --> 00:20:30,160 Speaker 1: bidding on that property, I might pull back and then 454 00:20:30,200 --> 00:20:33,280 Speaker 1: the propertly just sits there for sale. So are you 455 00:20:33,320 --> 00:20:35,280 Speaker 1: are you? You guys talk to real estate agents some 456 00:20:35,560 --> 00:20:37,880 Speaker 1: What are the real estate agents saying that you talk to. 457 00:20:37,960 --> 00:20:40,480 Speaker 2: I think they're saying that it's much harder to put 458 00:20:40,520 --> 00:20:42,959 Speaker 2: a transaction together at the moment. I think vendors, if 459 00:20:43,000 --> 00:20:45,440 Speaker 2: they don't have to sell, a sort of a little 460 00:20:45,440 --> 00:20:49,280 Speaker 2: bit reluctant to meet the market, and but the buyers, 461 00:20:49,359 --> 00:20:52,560 Speaker 2: because they have more choice, a bit a bit slower 462 00:20:52,560 --> 00:20:54,639 Speaker 2: as you think to sort of go walk. I'm going 463 00:20:54,840 --> 00:20:58,080 Speaker 2: I'm going to rush a way for something else. So yeah, 464 00:20:58,560 --> 00:21:00,760 Speaker 2: from what I'm hearing, there's maybe one or two good 465 00:21:00,760 --> 00:21:04,640 Speaker 2: buyers on each property, although I think there was fifty 466 00:21:04,680 --> 00:21:07,479 Speaker 2: people at an auction I saw on at the weekend 467 00:21:07,680 --> 00:21:09,600 Speaker 2: or a couple of weekends ago around Clovely. 468 00:21:09,720 --> 00:21:13,520 Speaker 1: So I think there's that's a bit special Chloe special 469 00:21:14,000 --> 00:21:16,440 Speaker 1: those sorts of environments. There's only so many houses and 470 00:21:16,520 --> 00:21:20,840 Speaker 1: the pretty special environments. That's their outlies. I would have 471 00:21:20,880 --> 00:21:21,480 Speaker 1: thought they are. 472 00:21:21,520 --> 00:21:23,760 Speaker 2: And I think if they're priced, you know, they sort 473 00:21:23,800 --> 00:21:25,960 Speaker 2: of they guide them pretty low to get a lot 474 00:21:25,960 --> 00:21:29,960 Speaker 2: of inquiry and it ended up going pretty pretty high 475 00:21:30,000 --> 00:21:34,679 Speaker 2: over the guide. But generally I think there's not, you know, 476 00:21:35,000 --> 00:21:39,200 Speaker 2: the same buyer pool proportionally to the amount of properties 477 00:21:39,240 --> 00:21:42,120 Speaker 2: as there was, and things are probably taking a little 478 00:21:42,119 --> 00:21:42,840 Speaker 2: bit longer to sell. 479 00:21:42,960 --> 00:21:45,800 Speaker 1: What's your view that you're telling your clients? We have 480 00:21:45,840 --> 00:21:47,560 Speaker 1: to wrap up. What's your view your telling clients or 481 00:21:47,560 --> 00:21:50,520 Speaker 1: your businesses zero financial? What are you telling your clients 482 00:21:50,520 --> 00:21:52,960 Speaker 1: relative to where they think rates where you think rates 483 00:21:53,000 --> 00:21:54,800 Speaker 1: are going to head next year in twenty twenty five. 484 00:21:55,000 --> 00:21:57,400 Speaker 2: Well, yeah, it's an interesting one because I think there's 485 00:21:57,400 --> 00:22:00,679 Speaker 2: so many factors that play at the moment, and I 486 00:22:00,680 --> 00:22:03,840 Speaker 2: think the markets are currently expecting cut middle of the year, 487 00:22:03,880 --> 00:22:05,600 Speaker 2: and I think the major banks are basically pushed back 488 00:22:05,640 --> 00:22:08,879 Speaker 2: their expectations between fab and May now. But I really, 489 00:22:08,920 --> 00:22:11,480 Speaker 2: I mean, is there any major reason to cut interest rates? Mark? 490 00:22:11,480 --> 00:22:13,879 Speaker 2: And Well, we also to sit here and say, oh, 491 00:22:13,880 --> 00:22:15,640 Speaker 2: it'd be great to cut rates, But I think as 492 00:22:15,680 --> 00:22:18,640 Speaker 2: a borrower and a buyer, I said to think to myself, well, Okay, 493 00:22:18,640 --> 00:22:20,399 Speaker 2: if they did cut rates, what's they going to do. 494 00:22:20,440 --> 00:22:21,640 Speaker 2: It's going to I'm going to be able to borrow 495 00:22:21,680 --> 00:22:24,000 Speaker 2: a bit more, and market's going to run away from 496 00:22:24,040 --> 00:22:26,399 Speaker 2: me as well. What happens. Yeah, I don't know if 497 00:22:26,400 --> 00:22:28,040 Speaker 2: it's I don't know if everyone should. I don't know 498 00:22:28,119 --> 00:22:30,480 Speaker 2: unless unless you're in like financial hardship and you need 499 00:22:30,560 --> 00:22:32,520 Speaker 2: rates to be coming down and you want to get relief, 500 00:22:32,520 --> 00:22:34,639 Speaker 2: which I'm sure a lot of people do of course. 501 00:22:35,320 --> 00:22:38,480 Speaker 2: But as a buyer, you know, wanting rates to come 502 00:22:38,560 --> 00:22:41,160 Speaker 2: down so I can borrow more to buy, I think 503 00:22:41,200 --> 00:22:44,000 Speaker 2: you just you know, there's two sides of that story. 504 00:22:44,200 --> 00:22:47,679 Speaker 1: For the price just restructures exactly, just resets. Yeah, and 505 00:22:47,720 --> 00:22:49,359 Speaker 1: you end up paying the same aunt per month because 506 00:22:49,400 --> 00:22:52,240 Speaker 1: instead of you're paying your interest rates lower but to 507 00:22:52,240 --> 00:22:54,959 Speaker 1: borrow more. Yeah, which basically means you're paying the same 508 00:22:55,000 --> 00:22:57,920 Speaker 1: amount per month. Generally speaking, there's not much in it, no, 509 00:22:58,280 --> 00:23:00,560 Speaker 1: there Sometimes there's a bit of an opportunit unity that 510 00:23:01,640 --> 00:23:04,720 Speaker 1: prices don't go up, you know, if you're really clever 511 00:23:05,480 --> 00:23:08,080 Speaker 1: and you get there whilst there's a bit of supply 512 00:23:08,160 --> 00:23:10,720 Speaker 1: in the market, like around Christmas time this year, for example, 513 00:23:11,040 --> 00:23:12,800 Speaker 1: and you find the house that you actually want to 514 00:23:12,800 --> 00:23:17,520 Speaker 1: buy but it hasn't sold. And if if you somehow 515 00:23:17,600 --> 00:23:19,879 Speaker 1: managed to exchange out and say, look, I'll do a 516 00:23:19,880 --> 00:23:23,200 Speaker 1: settlement in four months time, and you know, miraculously the 517 00:23:23,480 --> 00:23:26,959 Speaker 1: resulting drops of rates in March or something before you settle, 518 00:23:27,520 --> 00:23:30,320 Speaker 1: then you've probably done well. That's a proper arbitrage. And 519 00:23:30,359 --> 00:23:32,280 Speaker 1: you're coming out of a stockbroke environment, you know what 520 00:23:32,280 --> 00:23:35,560 Speaker 1: that means. But that's a rare thing. So it's really 521 00:23:35,560 --> 00:23:39,879 Speaker 1: hard arbitrage. Asset markets like mortgage are lending property markets. 522 00:23:39,880 --> 00:23:42,239 Speaker 1: That's the hardest things in the world to do. So 523 00:23:42,280 --> 00:23:44,800 Speaker 1: what would you say to somebody last question, But what 524 00:23:44,800 --> 00:23:46,880 Speaker 1: would you say to somebody you know, you've got your 525 00:23:46,920 --> 00:23:51,040 Speaker 1: experience in this environment, who's waiting to time the market. 526 00:23:51,119 --> 00:23:52,240 Speaker 1: What would you ask I. 527 00:23:52,119 --> 00:23:55,679 Speaker 2: Think that's one of the one of the just timing 528 00:23:55,720 --> 00:23:58,240 Speaker 2: the marketing property is very hard. I think your property 529 00:23:58,280 --> 00:24:01,480 Speaker 2: is a long term investment. And you know, you would 530 00:24:01,480 --> 00:24:04,879 Speaker 2: have expected the market to come off when they've increased 531 00:24:04,960 --> 00:24:07,000 Speaker 2: rates from point one percent up to four point three 532 00:24:07,119 --> 00:24:10,240 Speaker 2: five over two years, but you know, it sort of 533 00:24:10,440 --> 00:24:13,000 Speaker 2: came off briefly and then you know it's twenty one 534 00:24:13,000 --> 00:24:16,000 Speaker 2: months have basically increases. So I think timing the market 535 00:24:16,160 --> 00:24:18,479 Speaker 2: is really is a really dangerous thing to do because 536 00:24:18,920 --> 00:24:23,600 Speaker 2: psychologically it's hard to do. And you know, when do 537 00:24:23,640 --> 00:24:25,160 Speaker 2: you buy, are you waiting for it to go down, 538 00:24:25,600 --> 00:24:27,480 Speaker 2: You're waiting for it to turn I think you really 539 00:24:27,560 --> 00:24:30,119 Speaker 2: need to take a long term view and just and 540 00:24:30,160 --> 00:24:32,680 Speaker 2: buy when you're ready. But also understand the dynamics of 541 00:24:32,720 --> 00:24:35,919 Speaker 2: play here. You know, we've had borroing capacities come off 542 00:24:35,920 --> 00:24:38,200 Speaker 2: thirty percent, We've had interest rates basically go through the 543 00:24:38,280 --> 00:24:41,400 Speaker 2: roof in a very short period, and the market has 544 00:24:41,440 --> 00:24:43,720 Speaker 2: been really resilient. And you've got to understand as well 545 00:24:43,760 --> 00:24:46,119 Speaker 2: that it's not about whether you think the market should 546 00:24:46,160 --> 00:24:49,440 Speaker 2: go down or not. But you know, the policy makers 547 00:24:49,560 --> 00:24:52,199 Speaker 2: are incentivized to not let the market go down. So 548 00:24:52,280 --> 00:24:54,399 Speaker 2: even you know, even in the in the wake of 549 00:24:54,920 --> 00:24:57,840 Speaker 2: borroing capacities and rates going up and an inflation crisis. 550 00:24:58,200 --> 00:25:01,040 Speaker 2: You know, we've also had massive increase in that migration 551 00:25:01,160 --> 00:25:04,120 Speaker 2: numbers into the country and that sort of I think 552 00:25:04,400 --> 00:25:07,159 Speaker 2: propped up the property market to some degree. So you 553 00:25:07,240 --> 00:25:09,600 Speaker 2: really just don't know how things are going to play out. 554 00:25:09,600 --> 00:25:10,800 Speaker 2: You might think the market is going to go down 555 00:25:10,840 --> 00:25:12,000 Speaker 2: it ends up going the other way, or you might 556 00:25:12,000 --> 00:25:13,199 Speaker 2: think it's going to go up and ends up going 557 00:25:13,240 --> 00:25:15,120 Speaker 2: the other way. But one thing that people can be sure, 558 00:25:15,160 --> 00:25:17,080 Speaker 2: and I think maybe you're going either agree or disagree 559 00:25:17,119 --> 00:25:18,960 Speaker 2: with me here, if you take a ten or twenty 560 00:25:19,080 --> 00:25:20,959 Speaker 2: year view, and probably a twenty year view is safer, 561 00:25:21,359 --> 00:25:23,880 Speaker 2: you're probably going to be extremely confident unless you've bought 562 00:25:24,240 --> 00:25:27,520 Speaker 2: really the wrong asset, that you're going to be well 563 00:25:27,520 --> 00:25:29,919 Speaker 2: ahead over the long term. But who knows what happens 564 00:25:29,920 --> 00:25:31,280 Speaker 2: in between. So you said, have got to cut the 565 00:25:31,320 --> 00:25:34,800 Speaker 2: noise out, and as long as you can borrow responsibly 566 00:25:35,040 --> 00:25:38,479 Speaker 2: and take a long term view and understand the product 567 00:25:38,560 --> 00:25:40,520 Speaker 2: that you're buying in the areas and the demographics and 568 00:25:40,560 --> 00:25:43,800 Speaker 2: do your research properly, I think timing the market is 569 00:25:44,119 --> 00:25:47,280 Speaker 2: lower down the priority than the time actually in the market. 570 00:25:47,640 --> 00:25:51,000 Speaker 1: I think I think that's a good summation. In other words, 571 00:25:51,440 --> 00:25:53,920 Speaker 1: buy when you can afford it, afford to buy when 572 00:25:53,920 --> 00:25:55,399 Speaker 1: you can afford to meet the repayments on the loan 573 00:25:55,440 --> 00:25:59,159 Speaker 1: that's been preapproved or approved to you, and by when 574 00:25:59,200 --> 00:26:02,520 Speaker 1: you find the property sit and a story, Yeah, don't 575 00:26:02,560 --> 00:26:04,080 Speaker 1: overthink it. 576 00:26:04,080 --> 00:26:07,080 Speaker 2: It's harder to find the one that actually suits you 577 00:26:07,119 --> 00:26:10,879 Speaker 2: than it is to figure out what the timing. 578 00:26:10,240 --> 00:26:12,119 Speaker 1: And try and beat the market, because you'll beat the 579 00:26:12,119 --> 00:26:15,320 Speaker 1: market over time, but you won't be the market day one. Yeah, 580 00:26:15,400 --> 00:26:16,040 Speaker 1: that's pretty hard. 581 00:26:16,240 --> 00:26:18,640 Speaker 2: One little story mark is that I heard a few 582 00:26:18,640 --> 00:26:21,879 Speaker 2: people just you know, selling when these rates were going up, 583 00:26:21,920 --> 00:26:24,960 Speaker 2: thinking I'll buy back in when it's lower, and unfortunately 584 00:26:25,040 --> 00:26:27,560 Speaker 2: it went against them. Who would have thought market was 585 00:26:27,600 --> 00:26:29,239 Speaker 2: going to go up in the wake of all these 586 00:26:29,240 --> 00:26:31,240 Speaker 2: interest right increases, And that's what can happen. But the 587 00:26:31,320 --> 00:26:37,800 Speaker 2: psychological actual the how detrimental that can be on someone psychologically. 588 00:26:37,800 --> 00:26:40,200 Speaker 1: As long as you rebuy when you sell, you're okay. 589 00:26:40,200 --> 00:26:42,560 Speaker 1: But if you sell and don't rebind your station on 590 00:26:42,640 --> 00:26:46,400 Speaker 1: the bank, then then you're right. Now in Australia, particularly 591 00:26:46,400 --> 00:26:47,560 Speaker 1: here in Sydney, you've lost out. 592 00:26:47,800 --> 00:26:49,680 Speaker 2: Yeah, you're battling. 593 00:26:49,600 --> 00:26:52,239 Speaker 1: Tom Hawley in nearly called Janus, Tom Howley, that's your 594 00:26:52,320 --> 00:26:55,560 Speaker 1: uncle for your late uncle Tom Holly from Missouri Financial. 595 00:26:55,600 --> 00:26:58,800 Speaker 2: Great to see mate, Cheers Mark. Thanks mate,