Speaker 1: Live on Sky News.
Speaker 2: This is Sharry Good Evening.
Speaker 3: Tonight, Labor Insiders reveal and overly confident alban Easy is
Speaker 3: drawing up a list of those he believes turned against.
Speaker 2: Him when it looked like he wouldn't win.
Speaker 3: That exclusive in a moment, and I'll reveal the gobsmacking
Speaker 3: message I received from one of the Prime Minister's top advisors.
Speaker 2: You won't believe what they've.
Speaker 3: Sent This as Peter Dutton reassure's panicked coalition voters. Ray
Speaker 3: Hadley will be on the show live to fire up,
Speaker 3: and on the show, the ABC's Media Watch defends nine
Speaker 3: journalist Nick McKenzie's self confessed breach of ethics as a
Speaker 3: lapse in judgment and.
Speaker 2: That he was just overly trusting.
Speaker 3: More on that in a moment, Plus, a submarine expert
Speaker 3: will explain what Chinese intelligence is really up to with
Speaker 3: its spy ships.
Speaker 2: That's later in the show Tonight.
Speaker 3: Albanezi seems confident on the campaign trail, but behind the
Speaker 3: scenes there's internal disunity consuming the party. Labor Inside has
Speaker 3: revealed that Albanisi, convinced he's going to win, is drawing
Speaker 3: up a list of those who turned against him when
Speaker 3: his chips were down. The vibe around Albinizi is that
Speaker 3: he's flying now. He's set to win comfortably, even pick
Speaker 3: up some seats.
Speaker 2: That's what he's.
Speaker 3: Telling people, and he's looking at who's stuck with him.
Speaker 3: During the difficult months when he was flailing politically and
Speaker 3: it looked like he was in trouble, alban Ezi and
Speaker 3: those closest to him are carefully examining who peeled off,
Speaker 3: who was with.
Speaker 2: Him and who wasn't.
Speaker 3: One labour source told me there's definitely a list being
Speaker 3: drawn up about who's stuck with him. The treasurer is
Speaker 3: not on that list. You recall how right after the
Speaker 3: twenty twenty two election, alban Ezi unceremoni nearly dumped popular
Speaker 3: political rival Tanya Plibasek from her beloved education portfolio and
Speaker 3: stuck her in a lower profile portfolio designed to hurt
Speaker 3: her support where she'd come up against the environmentalists. This
Speaker 3: is the fate that awaits those perceived to have abandoned
Speaker 3: alban Easy in recent months. Labor operative Cameron Milner said
Speaker 3: Albanisi has been known for being deeply paranoid and vengeful
Speaker 3: like this his whole political life Labor and Peace were
Speaker 3: expecting the election to go poorly, a minority government at best,
Speaker 3: and they were starting to prepare for that outcome, and
Speaker 3: even ministers were privately speaking about the prospect of a
Speaker 3: first term loss and a dut and win. Now we
Speaker 3: reported that Tony Burke was already making moves for a
Speaker 3: future potential leadership run. It's a theme others knew about.
Speaker 3: Anne was canvassed in the media. The Prime Minister was
Speaker 3: less than pleased with this. Now Labor and P Josh
Speaker 3: Burns is another who's not in Albanize's good books, all
Speaker 3: for the crime of inviting Tanya Plibisek to launch his
Speaker 3: campaign office. He wrote here on Instagram a special shout
Speaker 3: out to my friend and powerhouse Tanya Plibisek for kicking
Speaker 3: us off.
Speaker 2: And plibask meanwhile.
Speaker 3: Has posted a selfie to Instagram with the Treasurer just
Speaker 3: last week where she wrote really proud of this guy.
Speaker 4: So just coming out of the budget, super proud of
Speaker 4: what Treasurer Jim Chalmers delivered tonight.
Speaker 3: And in truth, the Prime Minister considers both Jim Chalmers
Speaker 3: and Tanya Plibisek future leadership rivals and a threat to him,
Speaker 3: perhaps because they're both quite obviously smarter than him. There
Speaker 3: was also a profile pace on Plibsek in March where
Speaker 3: a source was quoted as saying that, compared to Tanya,
Speaker 3: Albo comes across as an ineffectual buffoon.
Speaker 2: He's weak, he's.
Speaker 3: Arrogant, he can't handle criticism, and he's not connecting with
Speaker 3: the electorate to the point where Peter Dutton, of all people, could.
Speaker 2: Win the election. Albo's been a disaster. So there you go,
Speaker 2: in ineffectual buffoon.
Speaker 3: That was from a labor source, no suggestion the source
Speaker 3: was connected to Plivask Now. Plivsk in this same profile
Speaker 3: piece where she was interviewed, praised Jim Chalmers's job on
Speaker 3: the economy. And meanwhile Chalmers has fielded more than his
Speaker 3: fair share of leadership speculation.
Speaker 5: How are you feeling about the election, because if the
Speaker 5: government was to lose your favorite to become a position leader.
Speaker 6: Look, I spent all of my time thinking about the
Speaker 6: budget and the economic plan and what we would do
Speaker 6: as a government and as a country if we win
Speaker 6: the election. I spend absolutely no time thinking about what
Speaker 6: I would do if we lost the election. I'd much
Speaker 6: rather be the Treasurer of Australia than the leader of
Speaker 6: the Opposition. I enjoy the work I do for Anthony.
Speaker 6: In our team, we work very very closely together.
Speaker 3: Now, charmers can't be accused of disloyalty. This is all
Speaker 3: about the Prime ministers insecurities and who he perceives to
Speaker 3: be his rivals. Now I put questions to the Prime
Speaker 3: Minister's head of Communications today, Fiona Sugden. I asked about
Speaker 3: Albanezi in his inner circle, drawing up lists of who
Speaker 3: worked against him when it looked like his political fortunes
Speaker 3: were suffering. A response a laughing face emoji. Now this
Speaker 3: story has come from labor insiders.
Speaker 2: It's of course well sourced.
Speaker 3: Yet this is the childish response from the Prime Minister's
Speaker 3: office on day five of a five week campaign. It's extraordinary,
Speaker 3: you can genuinely say a Prime Minister's media office has
Speaker 3: never responded to questions.
Speaker 2: With an emoji before.
Speaker 3: It shows perhaps how arrogant Albert Easy is. And it
Speaker 3: comes a day after we learned he would adopt a
Speaker 3: single outcome from our Sky News antisemitism summit. It's incredibly disrespectful.
Speaker 3: But irrespective of this juvenile response, the reality is that
Speaker 3: Albinizi is carefully looking at who stood by him in
Speaker 3: the period.
Speaker 2: When it looked like momentum was against him.
Speaker 3: He's noting who was preening their own leadership credentials or
Speaker 3: cozying up to an alternative leader. This isn't about loyalty though,
Speaker 3: It's about disunity. Now it shows how for Albinizi, politics
Speaker 3: isn't about the governing of the nation. It's about personal
Speaker 3: factions and vendettas he accused Peter Dutton both yesterday and
Speaker 3: today of measuring the curtains in the lodge or in
Speaker 3: Kiribilly House. But Albanez he is already looking at who
Speaker 3: to promote and demote from the ministry based on perceived loyalty,
Speaker 3: based on who launched their campaign or who told journalists
Speaker 3: they had leadership ambitions. This is toxic disunity from labor
Speaker 3: right at the start of an election campaign. And if
Speaker 3: the Prime Minister isn't careful, his hubris an appetite for
Speaker 3: revenge will come back to bite him now. The ABC
Speaker 3: last night on its Media Watch program went pretty lightly
Speaker 3: on journalist Nick McKenzie over the sensational audio in which
Speaker 3: he admitted to breaching his own ethics during their war
Speaker 3: crimes case against Ben Roberts Smith. Now, the worst that
Speaker 3: Media Watch host Linton Besser said about Mackenzie was that
Speaker 3: he had a lapse in judgment and perhaps he was
Speaker 3: over trusting.
Speaker 7: It was a private conversation which Mackenzie could not have
Speaker 7: known was being recorded, but these words would prove a
Speaker 7: major lapse of judgment from such an experienced player. Mackenzie's
Speaker 7: misguided and over trusting assurances to a witness.
Speaker 3: Yep, a lapse in judgment and over trusting assurances.
Speaker 2: Well, how did the ABC.
Speaker 3: Not take Mackenzie to task for failing to publicly explain
Speaker 3: what he meant when he said he breached his ethics? No,
Speaker 3: I shouldn't tell you.
Speaker 7: I've just breached my ethics doing that Like this is
Speaker 7: where like this is the leadership position.
Speaker 8: Now if he knew that, impeat to you that.
Speaker 1: Yep.
Speaker 3: Media Watch directed questions during his program to me to
Speaker 3: Nine's witness, who nine claims is a victim of domestic violence.
Speaker 7: So we contacted Person seventeen to ask for access to
Speaker 7: the full tape. She declined to respond to our queries.
Speaker 3: To the West Australian newspaper and to Nine itself. I
Speaker 3: think it's telling that Media Watch thinks everyone else has
Speaker 3: questions to answer except the very person at the center
Speaker 3: of the story, the journalist who admits in a secret
Speaker 3: recording to breaching his own ethics. Now Bessa has told
Speaker 3: us today he did put questions to Mackenzie and that
Speaker 3: Nine responded. But in Nine's response they simply accused other
Speaker 3: media of a smear campaign. It's a laughable response to
Speaker 3: the very revelation of serious recordings that have now sparked
Speaker 3: a fresh Federal court hearing. But it's not really good enough,
Speaker 3: is it for Australia's most celebrated journalists to refuse to
Speaker 3: publicly answer questions about what he means when he said
Speaker 3: he breached his ethics in a way that would have
Speaker 3: displeased his lawyers.
Speaker 2: Of course, he used more colorful language.
Speaker 3: Now can you imagine if a NewsCorp journalist, God Forbid,
Speaker 3: had been caught such a tape. Media Watch would have
Speaker 3: had a field day, as would The Guardian, Criichie and Nine.
Speaker 3: Yet the ABC last night even defended Mackenzie over the
Speaker 3: part of the audio recording where he divulged details of
Speaker 3: a sensitive an ongoing police investigation.
Speaker 7: But Mackenzie was embellishing because he himself had already published
Speaker 7: to the world details of two live AFP investigations into
Speaker 7: Ben Robert Smith in the two years prior. And while
Speaker 7: it's true there'd been no reporting that AFP agents had
Speaker 7: moved into the building, a detail Sharry Markson pointed out
Speaker 7: in her statement to Media Watch, Robert Smith had already
Speaker 7: been tipped off about the AFP's surveillance and was using
Speaker 7: bernafines to avoid it, which Markson failed to tell her viewers.
Speaker 3: Now, just a reminder, here's what Mackenzie did say on
Speaker 3: that secret recording.
Speaker 1: No one knows about the police investigation.
Speaker 9: It's extensive.
Speaker 3: If I'm going place.
Speaker 10: Investigation, phone tabs, task force, a whole new task.
Speaker 1: Force has been still love in Brisbane, an entire new
Speaker 1: task force.
Speaker 8: There's police living in his apartment block under assumed identities
Speaker 8: as we speak, like the guides.
Speaker 3: Okay, But according to Media Watch, Mackenzie was just embellishing
Speaker 3: and somehow this was turned into a criticism of me.
Speaker 3: Now to be clear, as better acknowledged, Mackenzie divulged details
Speaker 3: of undercover officers living with false or assumed identities in
Speaker 3: Ben Roberts Smith's own apartment block, and yes, this could
Speaker 3: have jeopardized the police operation. Media Watch also claimed last
Speaker 3: night that obtaining the legal strategy in relation to Person
Speaker 3: seventeen wouldn't have made a jot of difference to the
Speaker 3: outcome of the war crimes case.
Speaker 7: And it's hard to see how those first person accounts
Speaker 7: are in any way change by Mackenzie's misguided and over
Speaker 7: trusting assurances to a witness he knew to be unreliable
Speaker 7: and who made not a jot of difference to the
Speaker 7: final outcome.
Speaker 3: Now in the judgment, the judge said that he did
Speaker 3: not accept Robert Smith's evidence regarding Person seventeen, although he
Speaker 3: did not find her evidence sufficiently reliable to accept that
Speaker 3: her serious allegations were true. What we don't know is
Speaker 3: whether his rejection of Robert Smith's evidence on that issue
Speaker 3: might have influenced the judge's view of Ben Robert Smith's
Speaker 3: credibility when it came to the war crimes witnesses. You
Speaker 3: can never know how much this influence would have extended.
Speaker 3: There's also the question of whether other legal strategy was
Speaker 3: obtained by nine and provided by Emma Roberts or her
Speaker 3: friend as Ben Robert Smith's father, the former Justice of
Speaker 3: the Supreme Court, Len Roberts, said there are questions about
Speaker 3: what legal strategies of Ben's was Mackenzie referring to, and
Speaker 3: how did knowledge of them affect the conduct of the
Speaker 3: case before Justice Pisanco worryingly that might be impossible to know.
Speaker 3: The issue is whether or not it resulted in an
Speaker 3: unfair trial, and he said there were questions too about
Speaker 3: what privileged information or material Ben's ex wife, Emma and
Speaker 3: her friend Danielle Scott told Mackenzie or gave to him. Further,
Speaker 3: if Mackenzie was prepared to speak to P seventeen as
Speaker 3: he did on the recording, did he have similar conversations
Speaker 3: with other witnesses, If so, who and what did he
Speaker 3: say to them? Now During a legal challenge, as you know,
Speaker 3: Ben Robert Smith's lawyers argued that his email account had
Speaker 3: been accessed at least one hundred and one times, including
Speaker 3: by his ex wife's friend Danielle Scott, and Emma later
Speaker 3: admitted that she had allowed her close friend Danielle to
Speaker 3: access her ex husband's email accounts, but she said only
Speaker 3: in relation to their marriage breakdown. So there's now been
Speaker 3: an admission that ben Robert Smith's emails were accessed in
Speaker 3: relation to Person seventeen and in relation to the marriage breakdown.
Speaker 3: If McKenzie admits to obtaining the legal strategy in relation
Speaker 3: to Person seventeen, it raises questions about whether other legal
Speaker 3: strategy or emails were also provided. Now nine is now
Speaker 3: trying to separate the domestic violence allegations relating to Person
Speaker 3: seventeen from the war crimes Once, but it was nine
Speaker 3: that wanted to use unproven domestic violence allegations to further
Speaker 3: trash Robert Smith's reputation. They joined the two accusations war
Speaker 3: crimes and domestic violence, but they're now trying to separate
Speaker 3: them and say that they're unconnected to the case.
Speaker 2: Now I have learned that.
Speaker 3: Nick mackenzie has been backgrounding journalists against Person seventeen, his own,
Speaker 3: who he claimed was a victim of domestic violence. He's
Speaker 3: been telling journalists that she's psychotic, she was his witnessed.
Speaker 2: Now.
Speaker 3: I asked nine about this today and in response, Nine
Speaker 3: sent me the same statement that they've been sending versions
Speaker 3: of to all media for over a week now. They
Speaker 3: refuse to answer specific questions or address the new issues
Speaker 3: that have been raised in recent days now, I personally
Speaker 3: think there's a long way to go in this story.
Speaker 3: From nine's end, What did nine know about McKenzie's admissions
Speaker 3: that he obtained Robert Smith's legal strategy? Did he obtain
Speaker 3: the legal strategy in relation to other areas? Aside from
Speaker 3: person seventeen, hows nine investigated this at all?
Speaker 2: How could they.
Speaker 3: Come out to defend McKenzie so quickly if they hadn't
Speaker 3: done a proper investigation into his self confessed breach of ethics?
Speaker 2: And if they have, what did the investigation find?
Speaker 3: When was this investigation and was the nine board made
Speaker 3: aware of it?
Speaker 2: And when?
Speaker 3: These are all questions I have been and will continue
Speaker 3: to pursue now. Just to be clear, I don't have
Speaker 3: a side here. I've got no issue with either Ben, Robert.
Speaker 2: Smith or Nick McKenzie.
Speaker 3: I'm a journalist and I'm reporting on a highly concerning
Speaker 3: tape where a reporter admits to breaching his ethics in
Speaker 3: pursuit of a war hero who he claimed committed war crimes.
Speaker 3: And I also think that if you're going to doggedly
Speaker 3: pursue a Victoria Cross recipient and accuse him of war crimes.
Speaker 3: You have to play fair, and Mackenzie, in his own
Speaker 3: words on the tape, claims to have access Robert Smith's
Speaker 3: confidential legal strategy from his ex wife and her friend,
Speaker 3: and that wouldn't seem to be playing fair. We need
Speaker 3: to know if anything else was accessed and how far
Speaker 3: this went. So let's return to the election campaign now,
Speaker 3: and joining me is Liberal Senator Holly Hughes and Skyney's
Speaker 3: contributor Steve Price.
Speaker 2: Welcome to you both.
Speaker 11: Well.
Speaker 3: Peter Darton was in Victoria today trying to wider down
Speaker 3: concerns about slipping Pole numbers and he was also wants
Speaker 3: to win over marginal seats in Melbourne.
Speaker 2: Here he was with Andrew Clennel.
Speaker 5: Today, Labor see you personally as a drag on the
Speaker 5: Liberal vote in Victoria.
Speaker 12: What do you say to that, Well, I've seen the
Speaker 12: Prime Minister's numbers and I wouldn't be scribing too much
Speaker 12: of I as a PM about his position. He's not
Speaker 12: far off where to CID realities and Victoria at the moment.
Speaker 12: And people know in relation to this project that if
Speaker 12: you vote for Anthony Obernizi, you're voting against this Melbourne
Speaker 12: rail link and the airport link.
Speaker 5: How many seeds are you going to win here?
Speaker 1: I hope to win.
Speaker 12: I think we can win a number of seats and
Speaker 12: I think we can form government, as I've said consistently,
Speaker 12: and we will demonstrate to Victorians and Austrains that there
Speaker 12: is a much better way for our country.
Speaker 3: All right, Well, Steve Price, we just heard Darton say
Speaker 3: there that he's hoping to win a number of seats Victoria.
Speaker 3: This is really the hope for the coalition side. What's
Speaker 3: your reaction to the mood.
Speaker 2: On the ground.
Speaker 5: Labour's completely toxic the brand in Victoria. You and I've
Speaker 5: talked about this before, Shari, I mean the dissenter Allen government.
Speaker 5: They're polling numbers are atrocious. She's not been able to
Speaker 5: con the public like Daniel Anders was able to do.
Speaker 5: The suburban rail loop, which now we know is not
Speaker 5: going to be funded by a coalition government if it
Speaker 5: gets elected, is a mess. There's a big hole in
Speaker 5: the ground. It's costing billions and billions of dollars. No
Speaker 5: one wants to go from Cheltenham to box Hill, and
Speaker 5: Cinda Allen's determined to hold herself to it. So what's
Speaker 5: happened here? Is Peter Dutton, I think very cleverly has
Speaker 5: said okay, we'll put money into other projects, but not
Speaker 5: this one. But Victorians have got a great history of
Speaker 5: money being ripped up and wasted on things that never happened.
Speaker 5: I mean you go all the way back to when
Speaker 5: Daniel Andrews became premier here. He ripped up and wasted
Speaker 5: a billion dollars of taxpayers money by not building a freeway.
Speaker 5: He then spent eight hundred million dollars giving the Commonwealth
Speaker 5: Games to Glasgow in Scotland. So there's nothing about labor
Speaker 5: that people in this state enjoy, and I think in
Speaker 5: the outer suburbs, particularly with the petrol exercise policy, which
Speaker 5: I'll being interested in what Holly says about how that's biting.
Speaker 5: That is going to be the big thing. People filling
Speaker 5: their cars up three days a week to sit on
Speaker 5: the Monash Freeway for an hour and a half every
Speaker 5: day in and out burning up petrol. They know that
Speaker 5: the tank of petrol that they are going to get
Speaker 5: a discount from Peter Dunton is well worth it and
Speaker 5: I think he will win a swager seats in Melbourne.
Speaker 3: Now, Holly, I was speaking earlier in the show about
Speaker 3: labor disunity. How's the coalition feeling, how a Liberal MP's
Speaker 3: feeling given the polling does show there has been a
Speaker 3: recovery for labor.
Speaker 13: Yeah, look, I mean I think everyone was aware that
Speaker 13: we would always see a tightening up of the polls
Speaker 13: as soon as the election was called. I think for
Speaker 13: a lot of people, and us included in the bubble,
Speaker 13: we've all been looking at this for months and months
Speaker 13: and months now in anticipation of the election being called.
Speaker 13: There's a lot of Australians out there doing it really
Speaker 13: tough on cost of living. You know, there were some
Speaker 13: box pops the day after the budget and people like,
Speaker 13: what's the budget?
Speaker 2: What are you talking about? They didn't even know what
Speaker 2: it was on.
Speaker 13: It's so so, I think, and they have the same
Speaker 13: vote as you and I, But so I think the
Speaker 13: mood is good.
Speaker 2: The mood is positive.
Speaker 13: We know that we have a huge battle ahead of us.
Speaker 13: Twenty two seats is an enormous ask. There hasn't been
Speaker 13: a first term government kicked out since nineteen thirty one.
Speaker 13: This is a very big ask and we certainly are
Speaker 13: the underdogs. But we know that Australians just can't of
Speaker 13: Ford three more years of this government in the way
Speaker 13: they've already destroyed our country and what they will continue
Speaker 13: to do the wrecking ball through.
Speaker 3: Now we've been talking about the terrifying prospect of if
Speaker 3: there is a minority government cobbled together with the Greens. Well,
Speaker 3: Adam about the leader of the Greens, would play a
Speaker 3: big role in that. He's now come out and we
Speaker 3: mentioned this briefly on the show last night. He's insinuated
Speaker 3: that Israel is somehow to blame for her mass, the
Speaker 3: terror groups, executions of the brave Palestinians who protested against
Speaker 3: the terror group. I mean, Steve, this is just beyond
Speaker 3: the pale. This is appalling and we need to see
Speaker 3: this strongly condemned by senior government ministers.
Speaker 5: Yes, the Prime Minister should come out and condemn it.
Speaker 5: Everybody should come out and condemn it. Adam Bant, really
Speaker 5: he is such a destructive politician. I mean, he holds
Speaker 5: this seat in Melbourne and he's held it for a
Speaker 5: number of elections. Now that's a very very Green seat
Speaker 5: and so he's going to get re elected. But to
Speaker 5: come out and say something like that, I mean part
Speaker 5: of the problem though is and I think Hollywood agree
Speaker 5: with this that if you talk to young people, the
Speaker 5: Greens brand is still somehow seen as some sort of
Speaker 5: friendly environmental party, whereas we know that they are a
Speaker 5: dangerous bunch of activists. I do think because I talked
Speaker 5: to them. I talked to a nineteen year old kid
Speaker 5: tonight who said, oh, well, the Greens are going to
Speaker 5: save the planet. They still believe that. They don't see
Speaker 5: that the Greens have been involved in all this activism
Speaker 5: about Palestine and bants going on. They're blaming Israel for
Speaker 5: what happened on October seven. The young people still look
Speaker 5: at Greens and go, Okay, they're going to help with
Speaker 5: windmills and solar panels and we're all going to live
Speaker 5: happily ever after. Trust me, that's what they think.
Speaker 2: There haven't been an environmental party for a very very
Speaker 2: long time.
Speaker 13: And you know, we know with there's zelotry over climate change.
Speaker 13: You know, if there's a koala habitat in the way
Speaker 13: of a transmission line or a solar farm, well goodbye koalas.
Speaker 13: So they're very much got their sort of triangle of priorities,
Speaker 13: and climate change is at the top. Forget about everything else,
Speaker 13: and you know, the environment has more further and further
Speaker 13: down that list.
Speaker 2: But I think Stave's right.
Speaker 13: You know, young people, whether it's there, indoctrinated through a
Speaker 13: Marxist education system. They then go to a university system
Speaker 13: where they continue to be fed this left wing ideology
Speaker 13: and rubbish. And so I think my daughter's going to
Speaker 13: vote for the first time this election now.
Speaker 2: I've met her. She's not voting for the she is
Speaker 2: not voting Greens. But all of my kids know.
Speaker 13: That if they want to be disinherited, not that there's
Speaker 13: a lot there, but you know, vote for the Greens.
Speaker 13: But my daughters makes me very very proud.
Speaker 2: The fact that she's not there wonderful. But you know,
Speaker 2: I'm talking to her, but also her friends.
Speaker 13: We had a couple over tonight and I was with
Speaker 13: one this afternoon and making sure that parents are having
Speaker 13: those conversations with their kids about the destruction that the
Speaker 13: Greens will create.
Speaker 2: They will kill.
Speaker 13: These kids, but they will literally kill these kids future.
Speaker 2: It's they are the.
Speaker 13: Magic putting economic party. I mean, they honestly think everything
Speaker 13: should be free, free dental stub your toe, get an
Speaker 13: MDIs like.
Speaker 10: You know.
Speaker 13: They are unbelievable in their economic recklessness, just.
Speaker 2: Very quickly thirty seconds.
Speaker 3: Steve, there's a polling in the Cinni Morning Herald today
Speaker 3: that suggests that Australians really don't like what they see
Speaker 3: when it comes to the United States president. How do
Speaker 3: you think this is playing out with the election campaign here?
Speaker 5: Well, I think the way it's playing out here is
Speaker 5: the big problem for Anthony Albanese. You can't get Donald
Speaker 5: Trump to answer the phone. But I think Holly's party
Speaker 5: needs to concentrate in on this. The tariff decisions will
Speaker 5: come out on Thursday. But the only Australian Donald Trump
Speaker 5: is aware of currently is Minwu Lee, who won the
Speaker 5: Houston Open golf tournament on the weekend, and there's probably
Speaker 5: going to be favorite in the Master's golf when it
Speaker 5: happens in a week's time. Donald Trump won't even talk
Speaker 5: to Anthony Albanese. When did we last have an Australian
Speaker 5: Prime minister who could not get the US President on
Speaker 5: a phone call?
Speaker 2: Agreed story I broke.
Speaker 3: And yet Holly, this is playing out badly for Peter Darton.
Speaker 13: Look and I think that Labor are going to try
Speaker 13: Peter Dutton Donald Trump, But I think what if you
Speaker 13: notice Donald Trump, he was about making America great again.
Speaker 13: He wasn't about I'm going to make it great for
Speaker 13: all my friends as well. And I think what Australians
Speaker 13: are missing is we need someone that's going to stand
Speaker 13: up and say we're going to make Australia great again.
Speaker 13: And I think that's where Peter Dutton can really use
Speaker 13: that strength and he will stand up for Australians. He'll
Speaker 13: stand for the economy in our national security, not that
Speaker 13: little handsome boy who will be busy sucking up to China.
Speaker 3: Indeed, and it's not Clive Palmer who's taking over that
Speaker 3: slogan either.
Speaker 13: Oh all right, Trump at Patriots I still don't understanding.
Speaker 2: So frustrating, Holly. Here's Steve Price. Great to see you both.
Speaker 1: Thanks Erry.
Speaker 3: Now, today's RBA decision left interest rates on hold, and
Speaker 3: it may have been an election shaping decision. Here was
Speaker 3: the Governor, Michelle Bullock making that call.
Speaker 4: We've come a long way and it hasn't been easy,
Speaker 4: but we have made good progress on bringing inflation down
Speaker 4: and keeping unemployment low. This is a good position for
Speaker 4: the economy to be in as we are aproach a
Speaker 4: period of uncertainty. But we have to be careful not
Speaker 4: to get ahead of ourselves. Inflation pressures remain and cost
Speaker 4: of living pressures are still very real for many Australians.
Speaker 3: All right to discuss, let's bring in Farmer Treasury Assistant
Speaker 3: Secretary David Pearl.
Speaker 2: David, great to see you again.
Speaker 3: Look what's your take on the RBA's decision today. Does
Speaker 3: this show that their rate cut at the last board
Speaker 3: meeting was the wrong decision?
Speaker 9: Absolutely, Sharry. As you reported very well at the time,
Speaker 9: the decision the RBA board made in February was probably
Speaker 9: the worst one I've ever seen. It was an unjustified
Speaker 9: rate cut based on the RBA board zone criteria, as
Speaker 9: I said on your program at the time, and it
Speaker 9: wasn't urgent. If the RBA wanted to be more convinced
Speaker 9: that inflation was under control, they could have waited until
Speaker 9: the next quarterly inflation read out in May. So, frankly,
Speaker 9: the credibility of the RBA board was damaged in February,
Speaker 9: and that's why I didn't think there was any chance
Speaker 9: they would go anywhere near cutting the interest rate again.
Speaker 9: Today they've got some credibility to make.
Speaker 3: Up, credibility to make up tough words. Look, the fact
Speaker 3: that the rates cuts weren't even discussed today. Do you
Speaker 3: think this leads to the case that there might have
Speaker 3: been some political interference from the Treasury secretary you worked
Speaker 3: closely with, Stephen Kennedy. Do you think this is something
Speaker 3: that should be investigated.
Speaker 9: It should be, although there are tight lips in central
Speaker 9: banking and Treasury circles. As you know, Let's go back
Speaker 9: to the cameras being in the room. To me, that
Speaker 9: was the absolute give way, and I know that you
Speaker 9: hit upon this too, Sharry.
Speaker 2: There are two.
Speaker 9: Scenarios with the cameras being in the room, which was unprecedented.
Speaker 9: I don't remember it happening recently. No, it's not not
Speaker 9: what banks do. There are two scenario. One Stephen Kennedy
Speaker 9: or Jim Charmers pressured Michelle Bullock to go against her
Speaker 9: own institution's interests and let the cameras in, knowing that
Speaker 9: the rate cut was.
Speaker 2: In the can.
Speaker 9: Or two, Michelle Bullock, under her own initiative welcome those
Speaker 9: cameras in without any political pressure. And frankly, I don't
Speaker 9: believe the latter. So I don't know whether there's ever
Speaker 9: going to be a smoking gun. We might have to
Speaker 9: wait for some post election deep throats to start speaking up.
Speaker 9: But that decision stank. It was an urgent, it wasn't warranted.
Speaker 9: And if you look at the RBA board statement today, Sharry,
Speaker 9: they say where on hold activity is picking up in
Speaker 9: the economy, the labor market is still tight, with labor
Speaker 9: shortages in some parts of the economy, and productivity is flatlining.
Speaker 9: So even though wages are moderating, the cost pressure from
Speaker 9: wages is rising. On the other side of the equation,
Speaker 9: you've got the Trump un certainly effect. I get that,
Speaker 9: but looking purely at the Australian economy, there's still not
Speaker 9: a compelling reason. And let's not forget that after the
Speaker 9: energy price supports are removed at the end of this year,
Speaker 9: a headline inflation rate will be above three percent for
Speaker 9: the twelve months beyond that. So I'll leave it at that.
Speaker 9: I think it wasn't a very good decision, but the
Speaker 9: Trump uncertainty is clearly weighing on their minds at the moment.
Speaker 3: Well, yeah, Michelle Bilick did address that. Here's which you
Speaker 3: had to say about the tariffs.
Speaker 4: The impact on inflation is less certain because, on the
Speaker 4: one hand, if supply.
Speaker 2: Dominates.
Speaker 4: So if the impact on tariffs on supply dominates, then
Speaker 4: you might see arise in inflation. But it's also possible
Speaker 4: that trade diversion might end up with cheaper goods coming
Speaker 4: into Australia, So there's competing impacts there.
Speaker 3: What do you think about the impact of the tariffs.
Speaker 3: I mean, there's the Alimini and steel tariffs. There could
Speaker 3: be further tariffs, although as they reported last night, it
Speaker 3: looks like Australia might get an exemption.
Speaker 9: The economic impact is really through China. If there's any
Speaker 9: uncoupling between the US and China, the two most significant
Speaker 9: economies in the global economy, Australia would be seriously affected.
Speaker 9: People forget that the US and China have interlocking economic interests.
Speaker 9: The US consumer has been the source of demand for
Speaker 9: Chinese goods, and the Chinese government or Chinese investors have
Speaker 9: lent money to the US government to fund its deficits.
Speaker 9: So if you uncouple, if you pull that apart, Australia
Speaker 9: would suffer enormously. Now we're not close to that yet,
Speaker 9: but if the Liberation Day tariff announcement later this week
Speaker 9: results in escalating trade measures, then there'll be a supply
Speaker 9: shop for the world economy and for the Australian economy ultimately,
Speaker 9: and that will make things very difficult because when there's
Speaker 9: a supply shock, just as like we saw with Opek
Speaker 9: in the seventies, output and activity comeback and prices go up.
Speaker 9: So not a good.
Speaker 3: Time, all right, David Pearl, former Assistant Treasury Secretary, appreciate
Speaker 3: your time. Now still to come the war of words
Speaker 3: over where Peter Dutton would.
Speaker 2: Live if he wins the next election.
Speaker 3: Well, Albert took another site today and radio legend Ray
Speaker 3: Hadley will be live in studio for his no holds
Speaker 3: barred analysis on the election. Don't miss it, that's next,
Speaker 3: welcome back. Well, the Prime Minister is clearly trying to
Speaker 3: keep the campaign conversation on health, rolling out the tried
Speaker 3: and tested medi scare campaign. Now his other pointed whack
Speaker 3: at Peter Dutton has been rebuking Dudden's claimed that he'd
Speaker 3: live in Kurabilly and Sydney, not in the Canberra bubble
Speaker 3: if he wins. He was alb and easy on about
Speaker 3: this again today and now.
Speaker 5: We're going to have a Queen Zone who sees himself
Speaker 5: as been the Prime Minister of Sydney as well.
Speaker 8: If Peter Dutton is elected. I see myself.
Speaker 1: I'm a proud Sydney Sider as a Prime Minister for Australia.
Speaker 3: And joining us now is radio legend Ray Hardley Ray.
Speaker 3: Great to see you again.
Speaker 11: I missed you last week with all the budget coverage,
Speaker 11: but we're back this week. He's grasping a straw as
Speaker 11: the Prime Minister, identifying Peter Dutton as a Queenslander. Of
Speaker 11: course you're going to have to live at Kirribilly House.
Speaker 11: I mean it's just a fighter com plea if you're Prime.
Speaker 3: Minister, unless you're Malcolm Turmble, of course, and you've got
Speaker 3: the mansion on the harbor, a better house, waterfront match.
Speaker 11: Well, I think I saw the worst impersonation I've seen.
Speaker 11: There a lot of people that did Donald Trump magnificently
Speaker 11: both here in the US. I saw the worst impersonation
Speaker 11: of ever seen at the National Press Club from the
Speaker 11: former Prime minister.
Speaker 1: But you see Malcolm does this all the time.
Speaker 11: Don't forget that as a Prime minister he's responsible for
Speaker 11: snowy two. It started at two billion only about seven
Speaker 11: years ago, eight years ago. Then it went to six
Speaker 11: Now it's up to thirteen, and we don't. And when
Speaker 11: it's going to be finished, they keep the boring machines
Speaker 11: keep falling in holes. Now you look at prime ministers
Speaker 11: like John Howard, the gun buyback, Julia Gillard, God bless her,
Speaker 11: the child sex abuse. Of course we're all commission legacies.
Speaker 11: His legacy is a hole on the ground that's not
Speaker 11: going anywhere, that's costing about eight.
Speaker 1: Times more than we thought it would cost, low out.
Speaker 2: In time and cost.
Speaker 3: And yet he thinks his advice about submarines is better.
Speaker 11: Than orcast You see what Shariov studied this extensively. He
Speaker 11: suffers with a thing called relevance deprivation syndrome. Now, when
Speaker 11: I retired full time from media, I was very scared
Speaker 11: that I'd also suffer, so I sought.
Speaker 1: Legal help about it and medigal help.
Speaker 11: And they said, Ray, look, because you've been a media
Speaker 11: commentator for over thirty five years, you're allowed to still
Speaker 11: come on to Shari's program and talk about things without
Speaker 11: being diagnosed with relevant deprivation syndrome. Unfortunately, for Kevin Rudd
Speaker 11: and Malcolm Turble, they suffer greatly with it. It's diagnosed,
Speaker 11: but nothing's done about it.
Speaker 3: And the thing is right, in his current role as
Speaker 3: the United States Ambassador.
Speaker 2: To Washington, he can't say much.
Speaker 3: He can't get on their Twitter saying undiplomatic things. Can
Speaker 3: you imagine how hard it would be every night.
Speaker 11: Was swindling around in Vegas in his attire of I
Speaker 11: think Aaron Williams or boots like a Williams and his genes,
Speaker 11: looking a real hipster, the rudster.
Speaker 1: But yeah to him, no, no.
Speaker 11: I had a conversation with him a long time ago
Speaker 11: about pink bats and that's the last time I spoke
Speaker 11: about the four young men lost their lives by Peter
Speaker 11: Garrett's insanity, and then, to his credit, rud stopped it.
Speaker 11: But Rudd must be really wanting to tweet or ex
Speaker 11: or whatever you do these days about how funny is
Speaker 11: turnbulls impersonation. But it's a bit delicate given he's the
Speaker 11: ambassador that's got to deal with Trump. And look, whether
Speaker 11: you're live Donald Trump, or you don't like Donald Trump,
Speaker 11: or you think he's crazy, he is the president of
Speaker 11: the free nation, the largest nation in the world, the
Speaker 11: free nation. He's been elected, and we've got to deal
Speaker 11: with him. We've got to try and argue about Taris.
Speaker 11: We've got to try and argue about getting more support
Speaker 11: for defense submarines, as you've mentioned, and so you can't
Speaker 11: just put a red rag in front of him, you know,
Speaker 11: and say he get this up here for the red,
Speaker 11: call him.
Speaker 2: A village idiot, or say he's it traded to the West.
Speaker 2: Those insults that we've seen.
Speaker 3: Now I want to ask you about, coming back to
Speaker 3: the local election campaign, this story that your colleague Ben
Speaker 3: Fordaen broke this morning about the Teal candidate Nicole Buell.
Speaker 11: Yeah, well he gets some good emails, Ben, and having
Speaker 11: worked with him for more than a decade, he's feracious
Speaker 11: on these. But look, this is the Teal candidate for
Speaker 11: Bradfield and that's a second crack at it now.
Speaker 2: But this is a Liberal seat. Paul Fletcher's retire.
Speaker 11: He lost a lot of ground in twenty twenty two
Speaker 11: but retained at her expense.
Speaker 1: But she's a Teal now.
Speaker 11: The Teals are captain, coach and sole selectors for political
Speaker 11: correctness and wakeness, so by any standard, in case people
Speaker 11: in other parts of Australia haven't caught up with it,
Speaker 11: she got a haircut by a nineteen year old teenager
Speaker 11: at a salon on the northern side of Sydney. Apparently
Speaker 11: it was a very good haircut, but you'd be able
Speaker 11: to explain to me, Sharry, I think ladies normally have
Speaker 11: a wash than a cut.
Speaker 1: Is that how it works normally?
Speaker 3: Yes?
Speaker 1: Right, Well, blakes don't do that.
Speaker 11: You're just gonna get your haircut, hair wash, you wash
Speaker 11: it when you get hand to get all the loose.
Speaker 2: You've never heard this before. Men don't get a shampilla.
Speaker 1: You've led a very sheltered life.
Speaker 11: Maybe where I go, where it's only fifteen or twenty
Speaker 11: dollars for SENI is maybe that's.
Speaker 1: Why it is. But anyway, so you get your hair
Speaker 1: washed and cut.
Speaker 11: So she then looks at the nineteen year old hairdresser
Speaker 11: and says that haircut's amazing.
Speaker 1: And I didn't have to have sex with you. Now.
Speaker 11: That wasn't acceptable to a teenager, of course, not in
Speaker 11: nineteen sixty, let alone in twenty twenty five. And here
Speaker 11: is a woman who's part of a team hypocrisy, be
Speaker 11: thy name, political correctness, wakeness, who thought it was a
Speaker 11: joke and funny. She's now apologized. She's been barred by
Speaker 11: the salon. They don't want that sort of person coming
Speaker 11: to the salon. But I mean, you throw that in
Speaker 11: with the Teels. Mike Kennan Brooks. I spoke about him.
Speaker 11: I'm doing a piece for the Daily Telegraph, dot com,
Speaker 11: dot au and their app and I spoke about it yesterday.
Speaker 11: The Teals are all about climate. That's basically climate two
Speaker 11: thousand climate. They're all about climate gritty, yes, and look,
Speaker 11: I'm not dirty on billionaires buying jets. That's what billionaires do.
Speaker 11: But here he is, on one hand saying.
Speaker 1: We've got to do this. We've got to do that.
Speaker 11: We've got to do this, We've got to do that,
Speaker 11: We've got to really rain in everything. He buys a
Speaker 11: jet to take his kids to the Formula one where
Speaker 11: he sponsors the Williams team apparently, and thinks that's going
Speaker 11: to pass muster. I mean, and then tips I think
Speaker 11: in twenty twenty two the second largest benefactor of the Teals.
Speaker 1: I mean, if you're a fair egan Teal.
Speaker 11: If you should say, look, Mike, it's really generous of you,
Speaker 11: but we can't take that money off you while you're
Speaker 11: flying around the world in your private jet.
Speaker 1: It just doesn't it doesn't make any sense, No.
Speaker 3: Exactly because they I think they've criticized in the past
Speaker 3: the Liberal Party for taking money linked to coal companies
Speaker 3: and the like, so that is Hypocrisy'd be interested to see, though,
Speaker 3: if Mike connan Brooks is donating to the tills this
Speaker 3: time around.
Speaker 11: It's something I'm going to Maybe he'll just take them
Speaker 11: to various things in a jet so they don't have
Speaker 11: to get on Quantus Virgin or Jetstar and just one
Speaker 11: final thing. I was waiting to come on and heard
Speaker 11: my former colleague and dear old mate Steve Price, Yes,
Speaker 11: who unlike me, has got angrier, has he's got older. However,
Speaker 11: that's the story for me.
Speaker 2: He's not retired like you now.
Speaker 11: No, no, no, he'll do it eventually. But you see,
Speaker 11: Victoria will be crucial I think in this election. I
Speaker 11: was talking about it yesterday, thirty eight seats in Victoria,
Speaker 11: and Steve confirmed what I thought, and he knows a
Speaker 11: lot more about Victoria than I ever would. That sixteen
Speaker 11: could be up for grabs there and that could swing
Speaker 11: it the way of Peter Dutton, which is almost beyond
Speaker 11: my comprehension. The Victoria could deliver a liberal national Party
Speaker 11: government given their record running.
Speaker 2: I mean sixteen has got a bit.
Speaker 3: They might pick up eight surely in Victoria, but sixteen
Speaker 3: would be unheard of.
Speaker 11: Well you need a five percent swing. That's what Peter
Speaker 11: Dutton needs. And I said yesterday in the Telly that
Speaker 11: made a combination of Harry Houdini and David Copperfield to
Speaker 11: pull some magic out of the magic round, because that's
Speaker 11: what happened in the NRL on that May weekend.
Speaker 3: But just quickly, what do you think about if you
Speaker 3: went to the Prime Minister's office for a response and
Speaker 3: they texted you back a laughing face emoji.
Speaker 2: Isn't that disrespectful?
Speaker 1: Well at least i'd answer them. They never used to
Speaker 1: answer me so smiling image. You would put me.
Speaker 11: In front of my normal response, which was neil zero zilch.
Speaker 3: Fair enough, all right, Ray Hadley, thank you for coming on.
Speaker 3: So you're on in the Telegraph online every.
Speaker 11: Day every day at twelve oh one and talking about
Speaker 11: basically what we're talking about tonight, the election campaign?
Speaker 2: Are those will see you back here next week.
Speaker 1: I'll be here for sure. Thanks a lot, all.
Speaker 2: Right, Still to come.
Speaker 3: A submarine expert reveals how Chinese spy ships can monitor
Speaker 3: or even sabotage cables around the world.
Speaker 2: Plus, on the eve of Trumps.
Speaker 3: Liberation Day, is labor doing enough to protect Australia Foreign
Speaker 3: Shadow Foreign Minister David Coleman will be up next, and
Speaker 3: joining me now is Shadow Foreign Affairs Minister David Coleman. David,
Speaker 3: good to see you again at the start of the
Speaker 3: election campaign. Look, we just saw we had the budget
Speaker 3: handed down last week and yet the Albanezy government has
Speaker 3: continued its funding of ANRA.
Speaker 2: This is the aid.
Speaker 3: Agency that we know has been linked to terrorism to Hermas.
Speaker 3: You know, this is a shocking judgment call to continue.
Speaker 2: This isn't it?
Speaker 10: Yes, it is shari.
Speaker 2: This is wrong.
Speaker 10: This is very simple. This should not be happening. The
Speaker 10: government committed additional funding in the budget, so another twenty
Speaker 10: million dollars. This is the organization where nine employees were
Speaker 10: sacked on suspicion of being involved in the October seven massacres.
Speaker 10: It appears the only consequence for those employees was losing
Speaker 10: their job. They don't appear to have been prosecuted. There
Speaker 10: doesn't appear to be a referral for prosecution. There is
Speaker 10: no way that Australia should be giving money to UNRA.
Speaker 10: We should be giving money to organizations that provide humanitarian support.
Speaker 10: That's important, and humanitarian support is needed in Gaza, but
Speaker 10: absolutely not through UNRA.
Speaker 3: The Prime Minister has compared Australia's naval actions in the
Speaker 3: South China see in near Taiwan in international waters to
Speaker 3: what this Chinese scientific research vessel is doing in our
Speaker 3: territorial waters.
Speaker 2: Do you think this is the same.
Speaker 10: No, it's not. And look it's pretty obvious what's going
Speaker 10: on here, Shari. The Prime Minister is trying to minimize
Speaker 10: the significance of this vessel. It is concerning, just like
Speaker 10: the circumnavigation of Australia was concerning. This is the guy
Speaker 10: who had to be told by Virgin Airlines pilot that
Speaker 10: live firing exercises were being conducted off our coast. He
Speaker 10: is just all over the place in this area. And
Speaker 10: it would be bad enough if this was any matter
Speaker 10: in the remit of the Prime Minister. But these are
Speaker 10: obviously very important matters. They are serious matters and the
Speaker 10: PM sits completely all over the shop.
Speaker 3: I reported last night that Kevin Right has been begging
Speaker 3: the Trump administration for a tariff exemption.
Speaker 2: Before the election.
Speaker 3: Do you think Australia is doing enough to secure a
Speaker 3: tariff reprieve from the Trump administration.
Speaker 10: Yeah, it seems like a pretty low energy effort, Shari,
Speaker 10: the PM said on Sundays, relying on officials. As we know,
Speaker 10: there's been no visit, there's been no recent phone call.
Speaker 10: It's very low energy. The more positive news is reports
Speaker 10: out of the US suggest that the focus of these
Speaker 10: tariffs will be on the so called Dirty fifteen countries
Speaker 10: with large, large tariff duties on the United States. We're
Speaker 10: not one of those countries. We've got a free trade
Speaker 10: agreement with the US and the US has got a
Speaker 10: trade surplus with US, so very strong arguments for Australia
Speaker 10: and some of that reporting out of the US is encouraging.
Speaker 10: And let's hope that Australia is exempted, although if we are,
Speaker 10: I don't think that will be due to the efforts
Speaker 10: of our low energy prime minister.
Speaker 2: Yeah.
Speaker 3: Indeed, and the Prime Minister has asked a lot about
Speaker 3: his handling of the US president today at the press conference.
Speaker 2: How do you think he has responded to this?
Speaker 3: I mean, we know we can't get the president of
Speaker 3: the United states on the phone. What more should he
Speaker 3: be doing and what would you do if you were
Speaker 3: Foreign Affairs minister.
Speaker 10: Yeah, well, it's really important chart that we have to
Speaker 10: respond to the world as it is not how we
Speaker 10: might like it to be. And obviously the Prime Minister,
Speaker 10: as a fifty four year old deputy prime former deputy
Speaker 10: Prime minister, made very disparaging comments about the president. That
Speaker 10: probably doesn't help in building a relationship. To be frank,
Speaker 10: we know that Peter Dutton successfully built relationships with both
Speaker 10: the Trump administration and the Biden administration, got big deals done,
Speaker 10: and that's what we do. We'll disagree where we have to,
Speaker 10: but engage in a mature and sensible way. Our relationship
Speaker 10: goes back many decades. It is a crucial relationship, but
Speaker 10: it needs energy and it needs maturity and we don't
Speaker 10: see that from this government.
Speaker 2: All right, David Coleman, appreciate your time. Thank you.
Speaker 3: Now after the break and expert reveals the secret activity
Speaker 3: Chinese spyships have been engaged in.
Speaker 2: That's next.
Speaker 3: Let's bring you now the CEO of Tealercommunications Industry, Peak
Speaker 3: Body Communications Alliance, Luke Coleman.
Speaker 2: Luke, great to see you. Now you do a lot
Speaker 2: of work.
Speaker 3: You're an expert when it comes to submarine cable security issues. Now,
Speaker 3: is this an innocuous ship that we're seeing circumnavigating southern Australia.
Speaker 3: What sort of activities could Chinese intelligence be undertaking on
Speaker 3: vessels like this.
Speaker 8: We have seen examples from around the world of where
Speaker 8: what appears to be a civilian vessel or a research
Speaker 8: vessel has accidentally dropped its anchor and cut through submarine cables.
Speaker 8: It happened late last year in the Baltic Sea, it
Speaker 8: has happened more recently in Taiwan, and so I think
Speaker 8: that we should really see this as a bit of
Speaker 8: an alarm bell going off that we have a vessel
Speaker 8: that is very close to critical infrastructure off the coast
Speaker 8: of Australia. These submarine cables carry ninety nine percent plus
Speaker 8: of Australia's Internet traffic. It is the very definition of infrastructure,
Speaker 8: and so Australia really does need to step up its
Speaker 8: efforts to protect these cables. Most people wouldn't realize that
Speaker 8: there are about twelve cables coming into Australia today that
Speaker 8: carry almost all of our Internet traffic. If you cut
Speaker 8: those twelve cables, you cut Australia off from the world.
Speaker 3: So what more can we be doing so we know,
Speaker 3: just to backtrack of it, we know this Chinese vessel
Speaker 3: is charting a similar cost to the root of our
Speaker 3: deep sea internet cables. As you've been saying, what more
Speaker 3: can we do though to protect the cables.
Speaker 8: Well, Australia has a thing called submarine cable protection zones.
Speaker 8: We have two zones off the coast of Sydney where
Speaker 8: most of those cables come in. We have one zone
Speaker 8: off the coast of Perth. But the fact is those
Speaker 8: zones haven't been updated since two thousand and seven. Think
Speaker 8: of how far internet connectivity has come from two thousand
Speaker 8: and seven to twenty twenty five. We've got cables that
Speaker 8: land in Darwin, that land in Port Headland, in Marucci Door,
Speaker 8: We've got cables that are planned to land in Melbourne
Speaker 8: going over to New Zealand. Yet we don't have protection
Speaker 8: zones in any of those places. So not only do
Speaker 8: we need more protection zones, but we need active monitoring
Speaker 8: of those protection zones. At the moment you submit an
Speaker 8: application to get a cable landed in a protection zone,
Speaker 8: but then there is no actual protection offered. Nobody is
Speaker 8: monitoring those zones. Nobody is enforcing those zones. In fact,
Speaker 8: only recently we saw two major submarine cables off the
Speaker 8: coast of Perth that were cut by a ship's anchor.
Speaker 8: This is a very regular occurrence, about eighty percent of
Speaker 8: cables that are damaged when a ship drops its anchor
Speaker 8: in a storm. Now that might appear to be perfectly innocent,
Speaker 8: it may well be malicious. It's hard to tell in
Speaker 8: a lot of circumstances. But the fact is we don't
Speaker 8: have anybody patrolling these zones, enforcing ships that need to
Speaker 8: be out of these zones to be actively protecting those cables.
Speaker 3: Luke, when you say that this could have been vicious,
Speaker 3: was this done by a foreign vessel, a Chinese ship
Speaker 3: or was it via local Australian ship.
Speaker 8: I'm not actually accusing any malicious activity in this instance,
Speaker 8: but we do see around the world that there have
Speaker 8: been accusations of malicious activity from what would appear to
Speaker 8: be a cargo ship or a civilian vessel which drops
Speaker 8: its anchor and cuts through submarine cables. The point that
Speaker 8: I'm really seeking to enforce here is there is no
Speaker 8: active enforcement regime in those cable protection zones. So not
Speaker 8: only do we not have enough cable protection zones in Australia,
Speaker 8: but we don't have agencies actively enforcing them to ensure
Speaker 8: that chips aren't dropping their anchors, whether they're doing that
Speaker 8: innocently because there's a storm and they need to quickly anchor,
Speaker 8: or if it is in the case of malicious activity,
Speaker 8: we do need to be taking a much more proactive
Speaker 8: role to ensuring that this critical infrastructure stays online.
Speaker 3: Really appreciate your insights tonight, Luke. Absolutely fascinating. Thank you
Speaker 3: for joining us. Terrifying stuff, especially when you think of
Speaker 3: Albaniz he just dismissed it or he didn't even know
Speaker 3: which agency was in charge. Now I've got to congratulate
Speaker 3: Paul Murray. Awesome pub tests with Dutton last night and
Speaker 3: here he is