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Speaker 1: Wow, Greg Norman, what would say? Talking mate?

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Speaker 2: Yeah? Thank you Mark? Looking forward to So I keep

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Speaker 2: pushing myself to understand is this the right thing to do?

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Speaker 2: You know we can transition over to live right.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, let's talk about it because you know the same thing.

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Speaker 1: How did you reconcile that?

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Speaker 2: Look, I wanted to do Okay, I felt as one

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Speaker 2: of the best players in the world at the time.

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Speaker 2: We never never achieve the financial place we should have achieved.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, we mean golfers.

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Speaker 2: We meaning golfers. Yeah, best players in the world. And

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Speaker 2: why is that? Because I've been around enough to see

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Speaker 2: what the institutions have been doing to the game of golf.

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Speaker 2: And as a player who puts bums on seats and

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Speaker 2: people come through the gates, no different what Rory McElroy

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Speaker 2: did down roll Melbourne. You deserve the opportunity to maximize

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Speaker 2: your earnings. You deserve to create generational wealth, not the institutions.

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Speaker 2: So in my day, we didn't known our IP, you

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Speaker 2: know which if I had my own IP, you know,

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Speaker 2: would I be a lot wealthy of what be today?

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Speaker 2: One hundred percent? Right? But we had to sign all

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Speaker 2: those rights away. Oh really, every January we had to

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Speaker 2: sign a form. To play on the PGA Tour, you

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Speaker 2: had to give up all your.

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Speaker 1: Rights, which meant they could market you. Yes.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I got no residual percentage of it, no residuals, nothing, nothing.

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Speaker 2: What we got was the right to play. The network

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Speaker 2: deal would vast percentage of will go to our prize money. Well,

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Speaker 2: the best players, any player, you got out of your

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Speaker 2: performance is what you got out my performance on the

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Speaker 2: golf course dictator, what my endorsement deals would.

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Speaker 3: In other words, if you won or got second or third,

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Speaker 3: you got more money. But if you didn't, you didn't.

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Speaker 3: But let's say everybody went to watch you though, irrespective

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Speaker 3: of whether you play well, you were saying, there's nothing

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Speaker 3: in that for you, because you know, there's not a

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Speaker 3: lot in that for you because you didn't get in

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Speaker 3: in the top whatever.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, the performance I put in is my whatever that

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Speaker 2: reward came out of that performance, right, And I didn't

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Speaker 2: like that. I did because that's what I was doing.

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Speaker 2: But I didn't like it to create generation sort of

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Speaker 2: bit unfair, very unfair. Right, So when I started going

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Speaker 2: to when I started transitioning into the business world, and

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Speaker 2: I created the Shark logo, and I shouted, created all that.

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Speaker 2: I went, Okay, this is my only avenue to go.

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Speaker 2: I still my IP was still over here. And this

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Speaker 2: is what one of the reasons why I wanted to

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Speaker 2: do the World Tour in nineteen ninety three, for the

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Speaker 2: players to make more money, to have an equity share

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Speaker 2: in that World Tour, which I offered them Live was

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Speaker 2: the same thing. The reason why I went to Live

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Speaker 2: was to give the players an opportunity to create generational wealth.

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Speaker 2: Just look at Bryson d Chambeau today. If you didn't

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Speaker 2: come to Live, he wouldn't have his IP to do

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Speaker 2: what he's doing on YouTube. Massive, massive account for him.

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Speaker 2: I'm so happy for Bryson's eachamba. But that only happened

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Speaker 2: because we gave him that ride. Yes, we paid him

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Speaker 2: at retainer. Yes he's a captain of his team. Yes, yes,

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Speaker 2: yes he's got to play an X amount of tournaments.

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Speaker 2: We get paid for that. Okay, But when he's not

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Speaker 2: doing a live event and he's in blue jeans and

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Speaker 2: a T shirt, happy days, you go make your money

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Speaker 2: as much as you want to make. It wasn't that

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Speaker 2: way when I was a member of the PGA Tour

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Speaker 2: on he could get three exemptions to travel around the

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Speaker 2: world to supplement my income well three three and I

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Speaker 2: had to get permission from the PGA Tour to do that.

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Speaker 2: So and back in the day, Seve ballisteros and I

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Speaker 2: Seve from Europe Spain right, and myself in Australia. I

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Speaker 2: always wanted to come home to promote Australian golf, but

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Speaker 2: I had to get a release from the PGA Tour.

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Speaker 2: So Seve was the instigator of this. He created the

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Speaker 2: home exemption rule where if you're an international player, you

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Speaker 2: could actually go home or promote your tour without having

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Speaker 2: to apply for a release. Simple but so stupid and

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Speaker 2: restrictive for the institutions to do that to us. But

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Speaker 2: they wanted the Denali right, That's why they wanted the money.

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Speaker 2: So I wanted to break that.

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Speaker 1: That's pretty sort of rebellious. Is it an Australian trait?

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Speaker 2: Do you reckon me doing that?

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Speaker 1: Yeah?

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Speaker 2: I'm a disruptor. I see I see weaknesses.

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Speaker 1: And is it weakness on fairness? Is it weakness?

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Speaker 2: Because of it was unfairness. It was truly was unfair

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Speaker 2: to the players, not just Greg Norman in the day,

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Speaker 2: to everybody. You think, what if Jack Nicholas had his

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Speaker 2: own ip when he first came out there, and Arnold Palmer,

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Speaker 2: they'd be billionaires, billionaires, and yet here today the institutions

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Speaker 2: are making a lot of money. And now with Live,

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Speaker 2: I gave the players that opportunity. And look what's happened

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Speaker 2: to the PGA Tour without Live? Well? What what live

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Speaker 2: dead was? It brought private equity into our sport first

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Speaker 2: time ever in fifty four years. Outside money got invested in.

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Speaker 2: That created an ROI, an opportunity to invest production, marketing, hospitality, entertainment, fandom.

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Speaker 2: All these new places popped up innovation because of the

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Speaker 2: investment dollars that came in to Live. That's where we

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Speaker 2: put it right. We had to grow. The thing that

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Speaker 2: bothers me the most about it is the perception that

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Speaker 2: I was trying to destroy the PGA Tour. That is

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Speaker 2: the total opposite. We were trying to work within the ecosystem.

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Speaker 2: Competition's a wonderful thing. PGA Tour is seventy two holes

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Speaker 2: now Live as seventy two holes. Back in those days,

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Speaker 2: Live was entertainment, concerts, different hospitality, music, all that stuff

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Speaker 2: plus team. So the ecosystem was crying out for that

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Speaker 2: have a counterbalance, and we proved it right. But the

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Speaker 2: general public, or perception of a certain media who were

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Speaker 2: probably had to take the tack that they had to

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Speaker 2: take for certain reasons, created this angst out there in

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Speaker 2: the world of golf.

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Speaker 1: That's how media works. Yeah, exactly, if they've got to

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Speaker 1: find something.

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Speaker 2: But now look at the PGA Tour. I just complimented

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Speaker 2: Brian loydla Why because private equity came into the PGA Tour,

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Speaker 2: Because they'll live three billion dollars one point five billion

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Speaker 2: has already come in, another one point five billion two

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Speaker 2: come in. So all of a sudden, now the players

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Speaker 2: control the policy board. Now, all of sudden, players have

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Speaker 2: controlled their own destiny. Ala lujah. Yes, that's what I

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Speaker 2: wanted in nineteen ninety three, us to have control of

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Speaker 2: our own destiny. And the institutions, it's the PGA Tours,

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Speaker 2: the Professional Golfers Tour, it's not the Professional Institution Tour.

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Speaker 2: I like that. So I go gosh, finally, so still

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Speaker 2: waters run deep. I've finally gotten what I believe is

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Speaker 2: the right thing for the players, and then in turn

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Speaker 2: it's going to be the right thing for golf. Now,

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Speaker 2: PGA Tour and Live. Will they come together. I don't know.

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Speaker 1: I really doesn't matter.

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Speaker 2: It doesn't matter. They're both in their own space, both

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Speaker 2: very happy about what they're doing. And look what's happening

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Speaker 2: with PJ Tour now. They're reducing down to potentially twenty

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Speaker 2: tournaments a year. Duh, you know, and players have now

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Speaker 2: had control with their equity, they have a piece of it. Duh,

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Speaker 2: private equity. Duh. You know. All these things are like,

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Speaker 2: please sit back and look at this in a neutral,

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Speaker 2: balanced way about what has actually transpired over the last

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Speaker 2: couple of years and what had transpired for the previous

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Speaker 2: fifty four.

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Speaker 3: And I think for golfers, like look at Cam for example,

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Speaker 3: like that he's in a much better place than he's

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Speaker 3: ever been before, and a young like him putting him

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Speaker 3: in charge of a team captain, and it's cappening his

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Speaker 3: own team when he sat right there in the seat

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Speaker 3: some time ago, Like I couldn't believe the maturity which

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Speaker 3: he probably would never have got out of the Live

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Speaker 3: hadn't have existed, Like he wouldn't have got that sort

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Speaker 3: of opportunity to be part of it all and to

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Speaker 3: lead a team, et cetera. Do you think it developed

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Speaker 3: him more as a person as well as a golfer.

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Speaker 2: Because as an individual athlete, you are represented by an

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Speaker 2: agency and you have a manager or an agent representing you.

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Speaker 2: Every deal we do is a transaction. So you're a

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Speaker 2: past ruentity. And that past ruanity is if I sign

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Speaker 2: with ex company for a three year deal with a

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Speaker 2: two year option depending on my KPI performance on the

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Speaker 2: golf course, finishing the top five in the world and

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Speaker 2: one number one in the world. If I don't hit those,

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Speaker 2: I'm out. So you become very much like I said,

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Speaker 2: a pass through entity, and so you have very little

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Speaker 2: to build off except your own skill set and your

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Speaker 2: own longevity.

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Speaker 1: You become inventory. You become inventory pymetry exactly.

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Speaker 2: So when I my role when I took the role

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Speaker 2: as CEO was to talk to each one of the

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Speaker 2: captains about understanding what is like to build brand equity.

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Speaker 2: Now as an individual, when you're representing your corporations, you're

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Speaker 2: not building any equity in any brand, not yours, because

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Speaker 2: you are transaction with that corporation. Great, you're getting paid

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Speaker 2: for it. Great, you're doing a commercial or whatever it

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Speaker 2: is advertising, Great, but what is long term value? It's

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Speaker 2: short term returns with very little long term value. So

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Speaker 2: when I sat down with him, I said, guy, you've

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Speaker 2: got to understand what the value of your brand and

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Speaker 2: your team truly represents on a global basis. And with

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Speaker 2: Cam I had a serious conversation with him one on one,

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Speaker 2: and it's all about making sure you put the right

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Speaker 2: people around you, because you can't do it yourself. You

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Speaker 2: can't play golf and be the best golfer in the

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Speaker 2: world at the highest level and run a team as

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Speaker 2: well as understand marketing and branding and all this stuff.

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Speaker 2: I said, each and every one of these guys, you've

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Speaker 2: got to put a team around you. Will subsidize you

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Speaker 2: to a degree, but you've got to pay us back.

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Speaker 2: So we did that and Mike, you be surprised about

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Speaker 2: of all the captains, how many of them really embrace

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Speaker 2: it now went straight over the head, right, And you know,

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Speaker 2: it's no slide on agency as or agents. It's just

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Speaker 2: the fact that's the DNA, that's what we all grew

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Speaker 2: up in. So when you sit back and you see

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Speaker 2: the opportunity with these respective teams that live have today,

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Speaker 2: you go, these guys are really going to create generational wealth. Example,

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Speaker 2: IPL Kerry Packer what do you did with cricket? Got

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Speaker 2: away from test cricket. It created this whole new sporting dynamic.

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Speaker 2: By was it private equity? Probably was because it was

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Speaker 2: Kerry's money, right, He invested in the sport because he

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Speaker 2: could see the long term value of what he could

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Speaker 2: do with India, Pakistan, South Africa, New Zealand and Australia

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Speaker 2: go down the list of all the iconic countries who

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Speaker 2: love to play test cricket. Right, but how do you

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Speaker 2: really monetize that? Not for the institutions but for the

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Speaker 2: players form. So Kerry sat on my shoulder every day

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Speaker 2: for four year, especially early on, you know, I would

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Speaker 2: talk to him, you know, and I'd think about the

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Speaker 2: conversation to have with Kerry. So he was my you know,

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Speaker 2: rest in peace KP. But he he was my kind

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Speaker 2: of like my guiding light.

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Speaker 1: And you would say, what would you do, Kerry?

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Speaker 2: What would you what would you do? And I would

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Speaker 2: think about our conversation and then I'd remember back, I

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Speaker 2: go back and google search what happened with cricket? And

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Speaker 2: now looking fast forward to what I meant about IPL

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Speaker 2: what's the team selling for six seven, eight hundred million

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Speaker 2: dollars in India.

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Speaker 3: Look and look at the guys like Ricky Pointing and

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Speaker 3: day Warner, the amount of money they're making.

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Speaker 2: N I love it.

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Speaker 1: It's so good for him.

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Speaker 2: It's so good for them, right for their families. They're

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Speaker 2: the ones who committed to sacrifice to as a kid,

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Speaker 2: I want to be this. To get there, it's impossible

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Speaker 2: except for a few, right, so those few should receive

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Speaker 2: the bulk of the reward for their fair I'm so

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Speaker 2: happy for that. But that was Kerry. Kerry broke the

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Speaker 2: back of that now and we are doing the same

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Speaker 2: in golf, right, So happy for these captains out there

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Speaker 2: and for our investor to be able to go get

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Speaker 2: that return on that investment dollar over time. It's not

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Speaker 2: going to happen like that, Like any startup. Mark You

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Speaker 2: know that any startup, you've got to put a lot

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Speaker 2: of cap accent in the beginning before you get your return, right,

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Speaker 2: so it becomes capital intensive in the beginning to get

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Speaker 2: it off the ground. And then once you start getting

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Speaker 2: it commercialized and all that stuff, now you start seeing

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Speaker 2: the outflows being offset by the inflows. And now you

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Speaker 2: start seeing your l RP is going out a little

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Speaker 2: bit better. And now you can start seeing four or

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Speaker 2: five seven years down the line and okay, now now

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Speaker 2: the thing starts to take a bit of a turn

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Speaker 2: to the upside. So from a business perspective, a sports perspective,

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Speaker 2: you know, to see where we are today, PGA Tour

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Speaker 2: DP well to live, Golf is the benefactor. And if

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Speaker 2: golf is the benefactor, the players are the benefactor. And

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Speaker 2: you know, seeing what happened to the Australian Open, you know,

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Speaker 2: brought back great memories, right, that's the enthusiasm of the

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Speaker 2: people have seeing what happens with Live and Adelaide and

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Speaker 2: what the the premier is doing in Adelaide. He's investing

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Speaker 2: dollars for the future of Adelaide. Our economic impact for

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Speaker 2: Live is significant because when you think about it, when

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Speaker 2: comes to a city anywhere in the world, we own

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Speaker 2: the players, or said they they owned the players. Because

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Speaker 2: I'm not involved with Live anymore. Live owns the players,

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Speaker 2: Live owns the production, Live owns the marketing, Live owns this,

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Speaker 2: Live owns So you're a plug and play. So all

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Speaker 2: that cost, and it's a significant cost every week to

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Speaker 2: bring that to wherever you go in the world, is

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Speaker 2: not on any institution or state government or anything like that.

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Speaker 2: It's there. So now as the opportunity has work together

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Speaker 2: with government with locals to monetize that situation, whether it's

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Speaker 2: viik or whether it's investment dollars. And now you look

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Speaker 2: see what we've done in Adelaide. Oh my gosh. The

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Speaker 2: economic impact that we've brought to Adelaide is significant. So

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Speaker 2: that's why Premier Malanowskis can go okay, I can invest

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Speaker 2: into the future. I can do a long term contract

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Speaker 2: with Live because I see the economic impact each and

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Speaker 2: every year that we can keep building on building I'm

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Speaker 2: building on. So you know, the smart people get it,

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Speaker 2: and the smart people aren't wrong. And then four and

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Speaker 2: a half years now that I've been involved or was

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Speaker 2: involved with Live, not one person told me I was crazy.

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Speaker 2: Not one I walked this morning before coming here, having

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Speaker 2: breakfast in the hotel, two people came up, thank you

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Speaker 2: what you did for Live, for golf with Live, Thank you,

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Speaker 2: thank you, thank you. Not one person in all the

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Speaker 2: years I've been around, flying around the world has come

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Speaker 2: up to me and see, you're an absolute asshole. You've

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Speaker 2: done this, and you've done that. You destroyed the game

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Speaker 2: of golf. You've done this. Not one person in the

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Speaker 2: public world has ever said that to me. So I go, okay,

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Speaker 2: be true to yourself. I stayed true to myself. I delivered.

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Speaker 2: I delivered, I had a four year contract employment agreement.

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Speaker 2: I'm happy I did what I did. Do I have regrets? Zero?

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Speaker 2: Would I do it again, Yes, but I do it

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Speaker 2: a little bit differently. So it just allows me now

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Speaker 2: to walk away and say yes.

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Speaker 4: Andy Herndon, well and straight to thanks Mark, thanks for

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Speaker 4: having me take me.

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Speaker 1: Through that process. And then then then what happens at

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Speaker 1: the end of the night. So how do you feel?

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Speaker 4: So there's there's a mild to medium case of anxiety

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Speaker 4: the whole day, the whole day because you're chasing your tail.

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Speaker 4: It always feels like not being ready on time.

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Speaker 1: Not having the meals ready on time.

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Speaker 5: Correct.

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Speaker 4: So if you know, if you're not ready for the

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Speaker 4: start of that service for lunch, you don't know what

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Speaker 4: we call mes on plus, which is a French word

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Speaker 4: for everything in place. If you don't have your mes

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Speaker 4: on plus ready by the time that lunch service stuffs starts,

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Speaker 4: you're absolutely stuffed.

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Speaker 3: So the way that walks in and he puts up

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Speaker 3: the order whatever it is however that works, like what's

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Speaker 3: everyone doing if as soon as it happens, like the

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Speaker 3: starter's gun goes.

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Speaker 4: Off, Yeah yeah, yeah, so the chef will call the

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Speaker 4: ticket and if it's part of your section. So kitchens

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Speaker 4: are broken down into sections, and if it's something that's

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Speaker 4: come off your section, then you know, and then it

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Speaker 4: has to be orchestrated in a really timely fashion. Right,

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Speaker 4: So there might be a dish if your table was four,

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Speaker 4: dish might come from two or three different sections. So

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Speaker 4: someone with who's got the longest lead time will kind

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Speaker 4: of dictate that pace. Or we're going to be up

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Speaker 4: in twelve minutes, and you have to know, okay, that's

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Speaker 4: up in twelve minutes. My dish is only going to

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Speaker 4: take seven minutes to cook, so I have to mentally

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Speaker 4: click that and then start my prep, you know, three

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Speaker 4: or four minutes in so that we will meet on

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Speaker 4: the pass at the same time.

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Speaker 3: So you're thinking to yourself, I don't want to have

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Speaker 3: my thing ready in seven minutes when it's going to

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Speaker 3: take them two minutes, because my my meal is going

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Speaker 3: to be cold or not right, whatever's going to be. Yeah,

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Speaker 3: So and is there someone they're conducting the orchestra.

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Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, it depends on the structure of the kitchen.

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Speaker 4: In a big London kitchen and kitchens here as well,

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Speaker 4: there's someone running the past, a senior chef, so a

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Speaker 4: headshift or a see chef who's running the pass and

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Speaker 4: running the orchestra. You know, tickets come in and they're

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Speaker 4: kind of running and they're also yelling out checks.

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Speaker 5: So if you've got a crab dishine.

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Speaker 4: You'll be like, you know, Andy, you've got fifteen crab

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Speaker 4: dishes on order right now. You know I need three

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Speaker 4: of them up in four minutes type of thing.

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Speaker 1: What is your fuck it up?

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Speaker 3: Whats are you like you're making? I mean, you go shop,

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Speaker 3: I put the wrong sports on there, and then everyone

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Speaker 3: else is ready because the other five dishes are ready.

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Speaker 5: What happens, well, back then you've got a bollocking.

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Speaker 4: I'm going to be late and you you stuff everyone

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Speaker 4: else's order, so the whole tables everything get started again,

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Speaker 4: so you cop the bollocking.

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Speaker 5: They have to start the meals again some thing or

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Speaker 5: where they're at.

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Speaker 4: But if they're finished almost finished it, yeah they can.

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Speaker 4: They might be able to save it, but they might not.

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Speaker 4: They might, you know, because stuff just keeps cooking, right,

347
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Speaker 4: residual heat keeps cooking things.

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Speaker 5: So yeah, and then sucks it up ruins and you

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Speaker 5: let the whole team.

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Speaker 3: Now yeah, so so and then what happens when the

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Speaker 3: Soux chef food of the Dude is conducting the orchestra's

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Speaker 3: called comes in and gives you a bowlocking as you said,

353
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Speaker 3: you like punch them there, it's just funk off. Don't

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Speaker 3: talk that way, I mean, because you can't pick people's personalities.

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Speaker 4: I mean as a blues I mean, there's definitely I've

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Speaker 4: definitely seen punch on some kitchens.

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Speaker 5: Really yeah, yeah, that's cool.

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Speaker 4: But but yeah, I mean you just cop it like

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Speaker 4: you know, and I think that's the you build resilience

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Speaker 4: and the people that built resilience quick back then you

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Speaker 4: kind of went through the ranks cooker, you know, and

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Speaker 4: it's about you know, it's different to how it is now.

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Speaker 5: You kind of can't act like that, and that's a

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Speaker 5: good thing.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, So you get through that one, then you have

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Speaker 3: a little of a break and your cortisol sort of

367
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Speaker 3: starts to settle down a little bit, and all your

368
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Speaker 3: adrenaline starts to move back into the wherever it goes

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Speaker 3: to probably live and it gets to get and then

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Speaker 3: a recircle. Then it starts all over again for dinner.

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Speaker 3: And then at this stage your nervous system is exhausted

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Speaker 3: and it's like eleven or twelve o'clock at night. But

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Speaker 3: I got made to ben cook with chefs and cooking and.

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Speaker 1: They all went out.

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Speaker 5: Needs to go out, yep?

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Speaker 1: Is that normal?

377
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Speaker 5: Absolutely?

378
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Speaker 4: You know, let's got for a drink. There's a reason

379
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Speaker 4: that drug and alcohol abuse is rife in our industry,

380
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Speaker 4: and it's because of those levels of stress anxiety. And

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Speaker 4: you come off a massive.

382
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Speaker 5: High, whether it's a good high or a bad high,

383
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Speaker 5: and you're a drilling's pumping and you need something to

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Speaker 5: calm you down.

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Speaker 3: So you need and I mean as I understand it

386
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Speaker 3: because you know, many many, many many years out when

387
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Speaker 3: I was much around this area here, there is to

388
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Speaker 3: be verious famous bars. It didn't sort of stay kicking

389
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Speaker 3: off till midnight, and I used to often frequent them,

390
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Speaker 3: usually on a weekend, and then you'd see I'd run

391
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Speaker 3: into mates of mind blakes I knew who were chefs

392
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Speaker 3: and also musicians, yeah, from pubs and stuff, and they'd

393
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Speaker 3: all be just going out like I'd already had a

394
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Speaker 3: skin full by that stage, but they'd be just going out,

395
00:20:25,200 --> 00:20:28,119
Speaker 3: but they were ready to go. Yeah yeah, yeah, your

396
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Speaker 3: little new little unit community.

397
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Speaker 1: Does everyone say let's all go together?

398
00:20:33,200 --> 00:20:33,440
Speaker 6: Yeah?

399
00:20:33,440 --> 00:20:36,159
Speaker 4: Absolutely, Yeah, you end up you end up socializing with

400
00:20:36,280 --> 00:20:40,280
Speaker 4: other people from the bars, the musos, everyone that kind

401
00:20:40,320 --> 00:20:42,680
Speaker 4: of works nights because you don't start You're right, you

402
00:20:42,720 --> 00:20:45,320
Speaker 4: don't start till midnight and you'll run through.

403
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Speaker 5: Until the sun comes up.

404
00:20:47,080 --> 00:20:47,240
Speaker 2: Yeah.

405
00:20:47,320 --> 00:20:49,360
Speaker 5: Yeah, so now it's Kevin, go back to work.

406
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Speaker 1: What do they do to you?

407
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Speaker 4: I mean I suffered massively from alcoholism and drug abuse

408
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Speaker 4: for a long time, for fifteen years.

409
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Speaker 5: You know, I didn't I drunk every.

410
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Speaker 1: Day was a drug and choice when we're talking about.

411
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Speaker 4: Caucus, yeah, coke, but mainly alcohol because it's just easy

412
00:21:03,000 --> 00:21:03,280
Speaker 4: to get.

413
00:21:03,400 --> 00:21:06,040
Speaker 5: Yeah, you know, so you absolutely would have a have

414
00:21:06,080 --> 00:21:08,359
Speaker 5: a crack on the recreational stuff on the weekends, but

415
00:21:09,160 --> 00:21:10,280
Speaker 5: it was the booze that got me.

416
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Speaker 2: In the end.

417
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Speaker 3: So were you were you conscious that I got to

418
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Speaker 3: go and have a drink, because in the beginning, that's

419
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Speaker 3: talk at the beginning part. Were you consciously like I

420
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Speaker 3: got to go and have a drink because you just

421
00:21:20,880 --> 00:21:23,720
Speaker 3: need to wind down. Was that was that the theory?

422
00:21:24,240 --> 00:21:24,560
Speaker 6: I don't.

423
00:21:24,680 --> 00:21:27,240
Speaker 4: I think it was subconsciously there, but it was more

424
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Speaker 4: so just to be part of the crew.

425
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Speaker 5: Right, everyone's doing it, so you just follow it.

426
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Speaker 7: You know.

427
00:21:31,200 --> 00:21:33,440
Speaker 4: I was young as sixteen seventeen when I started working

428
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Speaker 4: in restaurants. So you just do what the older guys

429
00:21:35,640 --> 00:21:38,000
Speaker 4: are doing, and then it just becomes habit really quickly.

430
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Speaker 1: Yeah, then you become the older guy.

431
00:21:39,800 --> 00:21:42,840
Speaker 4: Yeah yeah, yeah, and then you start setting there. But

432
00:21:43,040 --> 00:21:44,920
Speaker 4: it's not even it's not even at the end as well,

433
00:21:45,840 --> 00:21:48,159
Speaker 4: even in the middle. So we do double shifts, and

434
00:21:48,400 --> 00:21:50,600
Speaker 4: so you clean down after lunch and everyone would go

435
00:21:50,640 --> 00:21:52,800
Speaker 4: to the pub, you know, three or four pints and

436
00:21:52,800 --> 00:21:53,560
Speaker 4: then go back to work.

437
00:21:53,640 --> 00:21:57,359
Speaker 1: They don't drink while cooking, or do they.

438
00:21:57,960 --> 00:21:58,160
Speaker 2: Yeah.

439
00:21:58,200 --> 00:22:00,000
Speaker 4: In the end, you start doing it because because you've

440
00:22:00,040 --> 00:22:01,840
Speaker 4: you will go and have a bear after lunch service,

441
00:22:02,240 --> 00:22:04,320
Speaker 4: and then you start sobering up during dinner service.

442
00:22:04,520 --> 00:22:04,760
Speaker 2: Good.

443
00:22:05,119 --> 00:22:07,439
Speaker 4: Yeah, so you go and find some cooking wine or whatever.

444
00:22:08,080 --> 00:22:10,040
Speaker 4: You'll be mates with the bar, you know, the person

445
00:22:10,160 --> 00:22:11,680
Speaker 4: running the bar, and you made I'll give you a

446
00:22:11,720 --> 00:22:14,480
Speaker 4: bowl of chips if you vodka, yeah, so you know,

447
00:22:14,840 --> 00:22:16,879
Speaker 4: give you a'd send you a coffee cup out, you know,

448
00:22:17,080 --> 00:22:17,960
Speaker 4: just be full of vodkos.

449
00:22:17,960 --> 00:22:21,200
Speaker 3: I have a shot and our sort of intensity and

450
00:22:21,240 --> 00:22:22,679
Speaker 3: Hector did to get for you?

451
00:22:23,119 --> 00:22:26,080
Speaker 1: I got real bat Yeah, I don't know what does

452
00:22:26,119 --> 00:22:26,400
Speaker 1: that mean?

453
00:22:26,680 --> 00:22:30,040
Speaker 4: So I was an I called myself a high functioning alcoholic,

454
00:22:30,240 --> 00:22:31,720
Speaker 4: but you know there was it was three or four

455
00:22:31,720 --> 00:22:34,159
Speaker 4: bottles of wine a day, a day, yeah, yeah, you know,

456
00:22:34,280 --> 00:22:38,359
Speaker 4: pretty pretty comfortably, but there was a per day per day. Yeah,

457
00:22:38,400 --> 00:22:40,159
Speaker 4: but you're still going up to work every day, You're

458
00:22:40,200 --> 00:22:43,680
Speaker 4: still showing up for everything. But then you know, you

459
00:22:43,800 --> 00:22:45,720
Speaker 4: kind of once you get to a certain point in life,

460
00:22:45,760 --> 00:22:48,040
Speaker 4: you go, I can't, like, there's no way my body

461
00:22:48,080 --> 00:22:49,399
Speaker 4: can handle me doing this forever.

462
00:22:49,600 --> 00:22:51,560
Speaker 1: How did you know? Like what were the signs that.

463
00:22:52,720 --> 00:22:55,119
Speaker 4: I just think you just kind of you know, you

464
00:22:55,240 --> 00:22:58,360
Speaker 4: just know when you get out of bed, you get

465
00:22:58,359 --> 00:22:58,919
Speaker 4: out of bed.

466
00:22:58,800 --> 00:23:01,680
Speaker 5: And you start drinking again. That's what happens in bed. No,

467
00:23:01,760 --> 00:23:02,880
Speaker 5: but once as soon as you get up.

468
00:23:02,840 --> 00:23:04,880
Speaker 1: So you wake up. Yeah, oh it was so got

469
00:23:04,880 --> 00:23:05,200
Speaker 1: that bad.

470
00:23:05,320 --> 00:23:06,160
Speaker 5: Yeah, you got that bad.

471
00:23:06,359 --> 00:23:09,280
Speaker 3: But drink effectively drinking all the time all the time

472
00:23:09,480 --> 00:23:13,000
Speaker 3: in term of work drunk, not drunk, but with in

473
00:23:13,040 --> 00:23:13,840
Speaker 3: the guts correct.

474
00:23:13,920 --> 00:23:15,080
Speaker 1: Yeah, And.

475
00:23:16,400 --> 00:23:18,879
Speaker 3: I guess you become so good at your craft that

476
00:23:18,960 --> 00:23:20,560
Speaker 3: it doesn't really affect anything.

477
00:23:20,800 --> 00:23:23,600
Speaker 4: No, you know, and there's there's managing it, right, so

478
00:23:24,440 --> 00:23:26,320
Speaker 4: you don't shut up drunk, but you have a little bit,

479
00:23:26,359 --> 00:23:28,920
Speaker 4: you know, just to kind of to get rid of

480
00:23:28,960 --> 00:23:31,760
Speaker 4: the hangover effectively, and then you just kind of level it,

481
00:23:31,880 --> 00:23:34,080
Speaker 4: level it all day and then you can go again.

482
00:23:34,080 --> 00:23:34,960
Speaker 5: You can stand it at night.

483
00:23:35,119 --> 00:23:37,320
Speaker 3: But as an event or something that made you decided

484
00:23:37,359 --> 00:23:38,520
Speaker 3: that's it I'm going to give do you give it

485
00:23:38,560 --> 00:23:40,080
Speaker 3: up at one in one shot?

486
00:23:40,840 --> 00:23:41,040
Speaker 2: Yeah?

487
00:23:41,080 --> 00:23:42,760
Speaker 4: I think I'd known for a long time that at

488
00:23:42,800 --> 00:23:44,840
Speaker 4: some point that you know, I'm an all or nothing

489
00:23:44,840 --> 00:23:47,000
Speaker 4: type of person. So I was like, I'm not good.

490
00:23:47,000 --> 00:23:49,800
Speaker 4: Actually yeah, I'm not one that could go. I can't

491
00:23:49,880 --> 00:23:51,720
Speaker 4: like I can just have one or two drinks. I

492
00:23:51,800 --> 00:23:53,760
Speaker 4: knew at some point I just have to stop drinking.

493
00:23:54,760 --> 00:23:56,639
Speaker 4: But when I started kind of becoming a bit of

494
00:23:56,640 --> 00:23:59,800
Speaker 4: a deck to my partner, that's what was that catalyst

495
00:23:59,840 --> 00:24:02,080
Speaker 4: to me to go, Okay, now it's time to sort

496
00:24:02,080 --> 00:24:02,440
Speaker 4: this out.

497
00:24:02,600 --> 00:24:02,760
Speaker 3: Yeah.

498
00:24:02,840 --> 00:24:05,520
Speaker 1: Yeah, so you at some stage you said, I'm just

499
00:24:05,560 --> 00:24:06,720
Speaker 1: go cock turkey.

500
00:24:06,760 --> 00:24:09,639
Speaker 4: No, And so I did what most people do, well

501
00:24:09,640 --> 00:24:10,960
Speaker 4: a lot of people do, is when I was in

502
00:24:11,000 --> 00:24:12,520
Speaker 4: trouble and realized I was in trouble and I called

503
00:24:12,520 --> 00:24:15,320
Speaker 4: my mum. I said, Mom, I need some help here.

504
00:24:15,800 --> 00:24:18,560
Speaker 4: And really lucky that I had a good support network

505
00:24:18,600 --> 00:24:21,919
Speaker 4: around me. And so they put me in touch with

506
00:24:21,920 --> 00:24:24,399
Speaker 4: the rehab center and they actually said, you know, we

507
00:24:24,440 --> 00:24:26,080
Speaker 4: can't get you in for a couple of days for

508
00:24:26,080 --> 00:24:28,679
Speaker 4: whatever reason, but don't stop drinking because of the amount

509
00:24:28,680 --> 00:24:32,360
Speaker 4: that I was drinking until they can manage it. Right, Yeah,

510
00:24:32,440 --> 00:24:35,600
Speaker 4: so they they just continue drinking. What you're doing, will

511
00:24:35,600 --> 00:24:37,479
Speaker 4: come and get you. They came to my door three

512
00:24:37,600 --> 00:24:39,520
Speaker 4: or four days later and they picked me up and

513
00:24:39,560 --> 00:24:41,919
Speaker 4: they took me in and they pump you full of

514
00:24:42,440 --> 00:24:44,320
Speaker 4: some kind of drug to basically knock you out, and

515
00:24:44,359 --> 00:24:46,720
Speaker 4: they win you off. That alcohol is really dangerous to

516
00:24:47,119 --> 00:24:49,320
Speaker 4: go if you're drinking at a really high level, it's

517
00:24:49,359 --> 00:24:52,480
Speaker 4: really dangerous to just stop. Your body can go into shops, right, Yeah,

518
00:24:52,520 --> 00:24:55,120
Speaker 4: it's quite bad, similar to heroin and that respect.

519
00:24:55,200 --> 00:24:57,760
Speaker 1: Wow, and you've been sober ever since?

520
00:24:57,920 --> 00:24:58,960
Speaker 5: Yeah? Eight years?

521
00:24:59,000 --> 00:25:02,160
Speaker 1: Congratulations? What differences made your life?

522
00:25:03,720 --> 00:25:06,880
Speaker 4: I don't even it's night and day. Yeah, it's night

523
00:25:06,920 --> 00:25:08,480
Speaker 4: and day. I don't even think about it anymore. I

524
00:25:08,640 --> 00:25:11,440
Speaker 4: never really have, Like, I just doesn't bother me people

525
00:25:11,480 --> 00:25:13,960
Speaker 4: drinking around me, his booze around whe ther time. I

526
00:25:14,000 --> 00:25:16,840
Speaker 4: have no interest in drinking. It was, but I also

527
00:25:16,880 --> 00:25:18,439
Speaker 4: don't regret it, you know, like I had a lot

528
00:25:18,480 --> 00:25:22,080
Speaker 4: of fun, but I have no interest. But it's my

529
00:25:22,119 --> 00:25:25,560
Speaker 4: life has done nothing but exponentially get better since I

530
00:25:25,560 --> 00:25:26,240
Speaker 4: stopped drinking.

531
00:25:26,400 --> 00:25:28,879
Speaker 3: Have you we're going to talk about the moment, you know,

532
00:25:28,920 --> 00:25:30,680
Speaker 3: your YouTube sort of sensation, but like.

533
00:25:33,280 --> 00:25:35,479
Speaker 1: Have you these days?

534
00:25:35,560 --> 00:25:39,480
Speaker 3: Look back and look at all the you know, well

535
00:25:39,520 --> 00:25:44,240
Speaker 3: known chefs who are still running restaurants, and we all

536
00:25:44,320 --> 00:25:47,280
Speaker 3: know all their ups and downs. You know, they could

537
00:25:47,280 --> 00:25:51,080
Speaker 3: even be on television, well known on television, and we

538
00:25:51,119 --> 00:25:55,639
Speaker 3: know some of those guys, And think to yourself, the

539
00:25:55,640 --> 00:25:58,240
Speaker 3: restaurant games, it's fucked.

540
00:25:58,640 --> 00:26:00,399
Speaker 1: It's one of the hardest games in the world.

541
00:26:00,560 --> 00:26:04,159
Speaker 3: Yeah, he got tenants, staff, he got a landlord, you've

542
00:26:04,160 --> 00:26:07,119
Speaker 3: got staff, you've got inventry, high cost of goods and

543
00:26:07,560 --> 00:26:10,160
Speaker 3: fit out costs, shit, all this shit, you know, electricity,

544
00:26:10,200 --> 00:26:14,280
Speaker 3: power and whatever, and then you might get fatted out.

545
00:26:14,320 --> 00:26:15,760
Speaker 3: So you know, you might be a fad for a month,

546
00:26:15,800 --> 00:26:17,840
Speaker 3: and then someone else opens up down the corner.

547
00:26:17,840 --> 00:26:18,639
Speaker 1: Who's the new fad.

548
00:26:19,359 --> 00:26:21,080
Speaker 3: Do you ever look back at that and say, my god,

549
00:26:21,160 --> 00:26:23,160
Speaker 3: what a shitty industry, Like I.

550
00:26:23,080 --> 00:26:26,800
Speaker 1: Mean, like, you know, hard. I don't mean bad because.

551
00:26:26,720 --> 00:26:29,480
Speaker 3: We used it, but but like a hard industry, a

552
00:26:29,480 --> 00:26:30,280
Speaker 3: hard game.

553
00:26:30,160 --> 00:26:30,960
Speaker 5: Absolutely mate.

554
00:26:31,160 --> 00:26:32,800
Speaker 4: And it's one of those things that you go grow

555
00:26:32,840 --> 00:26:36,199
Speaker 4: older and I, you know, may talk about how I

556
00:26:36,200 --> 00:26:39,040
Speaker 4: got into social media later, but it was that like

557
00:26:39,760 --> 00:26:41,480
Speaker 4: part of it was like I didn't want to work

558
00:26:41,480 --> 00:26:43,080
Speaker 4: for anyone else. I want to work for myself. And

559
00:26:43,280 --> 00:26:44,960
Speaker 4: I still back and thought, well, what do I know

560
00:26:44,960 --> 00:26:46,919
Speaker 4: how to do? I know how to run restaurants, So

561
00:26:46,960 --> 00:26:49,560
Speaker 4: I'm not I'm not going to go like, start a

562
00:26:49,560 --> 00:26:53,879
Speaker 4: restaurant and earn a salary for working one hundred and

563
00:26:53,880 --> 00:26:56,040
Speaker 4: twenty hours a week, Like it just doesn't make sense.

564
00:26:55,840 --> 00:26:57,840
Speaker 1: Right, and run all the risk as well, run all

565
00:26:57,840 --> 00:26:58,080
Speaker 1: the risk.

566
00:26:58,160 --> 00:26:58,320
Speaker 2: You know.

567
00:26:58,400 --> 00:27:01,080
Speaker 4: I'm happy to work, work, work, work, hard, work my

568
00:27:01,119 --> 00:27:03,600
Speaker 4: ass off, but if it's no reward to that, then

569
00:27:03,600 --> 00:27:06,240
Speaker 4: what's the point of doing it. But I still love

570
00:27:06,280 --> 00:27:08,840
Speaker 4: the industry, and I fully understand why people do it.

571
00:27:08,960 --> 00:27:10,760
Speaker 3: So if we pull that apart for a second. So

572
00:27:11,280 --> 00:27:13,040
Speaker 3: at some stage in your life, you've said, and I said,

573
00:27:13,080 --> 00:27:18,000
Speaker 3: I love cooking. I love people enjoying my food. Two

574
00:27:18,040 --> 00:27:22,159
Speaker 3: important things I've been creative in the form of cooking.

575
00:27:22,200 --> 00:27:25,639
Speaker 3: That's my that's my brush and canvas. I hay to

576
00:27:25,680 --> 00:27:28,359
Speaker 3: work hard. I don't want to be run a restaurant.

577
00:27:29,080 --> 00:27:31,000
Speaker 3: Is that what made you decide to get into the

578
00:27:31,040 --> 00:27:33,879
Speaker 3: social media side of cooking? Let's call it that social

579
00:27:33,920 --> 00:27:34,480
Speaker 3: media cooking.

580
00:27:34,600 --> 00:27:35,199
Speaker 5: Yeah, I was.

581
00:27:35,600 --> 00:27:37,439
Speaker 3: Did you make that decision though? Was that a like

582
00:27:37,520 --> 00:27:39,160
Speaker 3: a I'm going to do this?

583
00:27:39,920 --> 00:27:40,120
Speaker 2: Yeah?

584
00:27:40,160 --> 00:27:42,840
Speaker 5: It was. It was It was through through adversity.

585
00:27:42,960 --> 00:27:45,960
Speaker 4: So COVID happened and I was running a really large

586
00:27:45,960 --> 00:27:49,480
Speaker 4: group of restaurants that was owned by Emirates to the airline,

587
00:27:49,520 --> 00:27:52,159
Speaker 4: so we ran one hundred venues around Australia and New Zealand.

588
00:27:52,240 --> 00:27:55,439
Speaker 5: Wow, and I lost my job really quickly in COVID.

589
00:27:56,480 --> 00:27:58,320
Speaker 4: So you know, we were living in Melbourne, so me

590
00:27:58,320 --> 00:28:01,280
Speaker 4: and my partner decided going to get jobs anytime soon.

591
00:28:01,359 --> 00:28:03,560
Speaker 4: So we drove to the Sunshine Coast where she's from,

592
00:28:04,119 --> 00:28:07,119
Speaker 4: and I sat around licking my wounds for six months, thinking,

593
00:28:07,400 --> 00:28:09,679
Speaker 4: you know, this is the worst thing in the world.

594
00:28:10,320 --> 00:28:12,239
Speaker 4: And so I started looking at what I could do,

595
00:28:12,880 --> 00:28:15,000
Speaker 4: what was the next step. And it was that conscious

596
00:28:15,000 --> 00:28:17,040
Speaker 4: decision that I didn't want to work for anyone else

597
00:28:17,040 --> 00:28:18,720
Speaker 4: anymore because I felt like there's.

598
00:28:18,520 --> 00:28:20,880
Speaker 1: Actually it's important. Yeah, self employed.

599
00:28:20,600 --> 00:28:21,280
Speaker 5: Self employed.

600
00:28:21,720 --> 00:28:23,920
Speaker 4: And then I realized pretty quickly that I didn't want

601
00:28:23,960 --> 00:28:25,720
Speaker 4: the risk of running restaurants.

602
00:28:25,280 --> 00:28:27,960
Speaker 3: So that you excluded that, that's out. Ye, he worked

603
00:28:27,960 --> 00:28:28,680
Speaker 3: out what you're good at.

604
00:28:28,760 --> 00:28:29,040
Speaker 5: Yeah.

605
00:28:29,080 --> 00:28:31,760
Speaker 4: And I didn't have huge amounts of capital, so I

606
00:28:31,800 --> 00:28:35,160
Speaker 4: didn't have access to you know, you know, fifty million

607
00:28:35,160 --> 00:28:36,879
Speaker 4: bucks or anything like that. So I wasn't going to

608
00:28:36,880 --> 00:28:38,360
Speaker 4: do because the other option is that think God.

609
00:28:38,240 --> 00:28:39,640
Speaker 1: Didn't because you might have put it in a restaurant.

610
00:28:40,080 --> 00:28:43,240
Speaker 4: Exactly true, true, I'm serious, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, but

611
00:28:43,360 --> 00:28:45,400
Speaker 4: you know there was the other option. I really love

612
00:28:45,520 --> 00:28:47,640
Speaker 4: kitchen Where and Cookwhere, and I was like, well, I

613
00:28:47,720 --> 00:28:49,320
Speaker 4: kind of like kitchen where, cookwear, but I don't have

614
00:28:49,360 --> 00:28:52,200
Speaker 4: heaps of capital. It's a really capital expensive business to

615
00:28:52,240 --> 00:28:55,560
Speaker 4: get into. So I thought, and I watched a lot

616
00:28:55,560 --> 00:28:58,000
Speaker 4: of content, and I watched these guys like Josh Wiseman

617
00:28:58,160 --> 00:29:01,200
Speaker 4: and Babbush and Nick Geev and all these guys big

618
00:29:01,240 --> 00:29:04,360
Speaker 4: YouTubers and stuff, and I thought, I know how to cook. Now,

619
00:29:04,400 --> 00:29:07,200
Speaker 4: these cameras can't be that hard to figure out. I'll

620
00:29:07,240 --> 00:29:09,360
Speaker 4: start doing that. So I started making.

621
00:29:09,120 --> 00:29:12,760
Speaker 1: Tiktoks like in the COVID period. Yeah, that was like

622
00:29:12,960 --> 00:29:14,440
Speaker 1: sort of during COVID that.

623
00:29:14,560 --> 00:29:16,840
Speaker 4: Was twenty twenty at the end of COVID twenty twenty

624
00:29:16,840 --> 00:29:19,000
Speaker 4: one into twenty twenty one.

625
00:29:19,680 --> 00:29:22,200
Speaker 3: So just tell me how you start something like this,

626
00:29:22,320 --> 00:29:25,000
Speaker 3: Like do you remember your first day?

627
00:29:25,160 --> 00:29:27,200
Speaker 4: Yeah, yeah, I was living in my in law's house

628
00:29:27,320 --> 00:29:31,000
Speaker 4: and I just thought, I just forget this TikTok thing.

629
00:29:31,000 --> 00:29:34,400
Speaker 5: I need to have a hook pretty quickly. And I

630
00:29:34,680 --> 00:29:36,040
Speaker 5: can't remember. I remember.

631
00:29:36,120 --> 00:29:38,320
Speaker 4: I know what happened, took us to the put us

632
00:29:38,320 --> 00:29:40,080
Speaker 4: to the stratosphere. But the first video I think I

633
00:29:40,080 --> 00:29:41,960
Speaker 4: did was just like making fish tacos. And all I

634
00:29:41,960 --> 00:29:45,720
Speaker 4: did was just make tacos and film it and posted it,

635
00:29:45,760 --> 00:29:47,320
Speaker 4: and of course it got like three views. Now I

636
00:29:47,400 --> 00:29:48,960
Speaker 4: watched it, and then you just kind of refine it.

637
00:29:49,000 --> 00:29:50,280
Speaker 4: You go, how do I get better? How do I

638
00:29:50,320 --> 00:29:52,320
Speaker 4: get it better? Then you start learning about hooks and

639
00:29:52,320 --> 00:29:52,960
Speaker 4: stuff like that.

640
00:29:53,120 --> 00:29:56,280
Speaker 1: Then you start learning about the social medium. Yeah, you

641
00:29:56,360 --> 00:29:58,160
Speaker 1: got to learn about the medium itself.

642
00:29:57,840 --> 00:29:59,440
Speaker 5: Correctly, what works correct?

643
00:30:00,040 --> 00:30:01,280
Speaker 1: What have I got to do to make it work

644
00:30:01,320 --> 00:30:04,600
Speaker 1: for me? Tony how it Welcome to straight Talk.

645
00:30:05,240 --> 00:30:06,520
Speaker 6: Mark, It's wonderful to be with you.

646
00:30:08,120 --> 00:30:09,880
Speaker 1: But what do you think about leadership today?

647
00:30:09,960 --> 00:30:11,840
Speaker 3: I mean, what do you think cecil Rhads would think

648
00:30:11,840 --> 00:30:14,680
Speaker 3: about and of course Rhodesia used to be Rhodesion now

649
00:30:14,680 --> 00:30:20,320
Speaker 3: called Zimbabwe. What would he now think about leadership outside

650
00:30:20,360 --> 00:30:21,160
Speaker 3: of the rhodes scholarships.

651
00:30:21,160 --> 00:30:22,240
Speaker 1: But think about leadership and.

652
00:30:22,160 --> 00:30:24,000
Speaker 3: What does it mean? What does leadership mean? I don't

653
00:30:24,040 --> 00:30:25,840
Speaker 3: know what it means to someone like you.

654
00:30:25,920 --> 00:30:29,680
Speaker 7: Yeah, okay, Well, a leader is someone who can make

655
00:30:29,720 --> 00:30:37,040
Speaker 7: a decision that involves people other than simply himself or herself,

656
00:30:37,800 --> 00:30:42,560
Speaker 7: and can make the decision stick. So a leader's got

657
00:30:42,560 --> 00:30:46,080
Speaker 7: to know his or her own mind, has got to

658
00:30:46,080 --> 00:30:53,360
Speaker 7: be capable of turning thoughts into resolutions, communicating successfully those

659
00:30:53,440 --> 00:31:00,960
Speaker 7: resolutions to others, and encouraging, inspiring, persuading others to join

660
00:31:01,080 --> 00:31:06,480
Speaker 7: in with those resolutions. That's essentially leadership. And whether the lead.

661
00:31:06,800 --> 00:31:10,600
Speaker 7: Whether leadership is exercised in persuading your mates that we

662
00:31:10,600 --> 00:31:13,080
Speaker 7: should go and see film X rather than film why?

663
00:31:13,760 --> 00:31:17,760
Speaker 7: Where the leadership is exercised in getting together a group

664
00:31:17,760 --> 00:31:21,840
Speaker 7: of people to go on a holiday, whether it's starting

665
00:31:21,920 --> 00:31:28,480
Speaker 7: a business, whether it's leading a country. Leadership is exercised

666
00:31:28,520 --> 00:31:30,640
Speaker 7: in all sorts of different ways, by all sorts of

667
00:31:30,640 --> 00:31:33,840
Speaker 7: different people. But without leadership, nothing happens.

668
00:31:33,840 --> 00:31:36,840
Speaker 3: So where does courage fit in in leadership that virtus

669
00:31:36,840 --> 00:31:39,240
Speaker 3: because you know, I just don't think we talk about

670
00:31:39,280 --> 00:31:43,840
Speaker 3: virtues enough. But where does the virtue of courage fit

671
00:31:43,920 --> 00:31:47,719
Speaker 3: into leadership? For rates, they running a country. Let's not

672
00:31:47,880 --> 00:31:49,400
Speaker 3: decide who's going to go to the movies. Let's just

673
00:31:49,400 --> 00:31:51,880
Speaker 3: say we're running country because that's your area of expertise,

674
00:31:52,000 --> 00:31:57,480
Speaker 3: or you're certainly your former expertise. And you mentioned a

675
00:31:57,560 --> 00:32:00,000
Speaker 3: number of other former prime ministers in the same case

676
00:32:00,080 --> 00:32:04,480
Speaker 3: agree or leaders of the opposition, you would have seen

677
00:32:04,520 --> 00:32:05,320
Speaker 3: common traits?

678
00:32:06,360 --> 00:32:07,480
Speaker 1: Was courage or common trait?

679
00:32:07,920 --> 00:32:10,640
Speaker 7: I think courage is an important part of good leadership.

680
00:32:11,880 --> 00:32:17,920
Speaker 7: I think courage is pretty rare. It was Lord Slim

681
00:32:17,960 --> 00:32:21,320
Speaker 7: who said moral courage is a far higher and rarer

682
00:32:21,400 --> 00:32:25,640
Speaker 7: virtue than physical courage. It was our old friend, father

683
00:32:25,680 --> 00:32:30,160
Speaker 7: Emmett Costello, who used to frequently quote an obscure French

684
00:32:30,240 --> 00:32:33,640
Speaker 7: cardinal that I'd never heard of, but nevertheless Emmett loved.

685
00:32:33,360 --> 00:32:36,600
Speaker 1: His phrase, being a Jesuit priest for review.

686
00:32:36,760 --> 00:32:42,920
Speaker 7: Yes, Emmett kept quoting this cardinal pa from the nineteenth

687
00:32:43,000 --> 00:32:47,320
Speaker 7: century who said, prudence is everywhere, courage is nowhere.

688
00:32:47,960 --> 00:32:49,600
Speaker 2: We will all die of prudence.

689
00:32:49,760 --> 00:32:53,040
Speaker 7: And I must say, I think that's quite a useful

690
00:32:53,040 --> 00:32:57,840
Speaker 7: reminder that prudence is a virtue, but it's not the

691
00:32:57,920 --> 00:33:03,000
Speaker 7: only virtue. Courage is equally and no less important.

692
00:33:02,960 --> 00:33:05,680
Speaker 3: Because I mean, I will come back to you your

693
00:33:05,720 --> 00:33:07,680
Speaker 3: history a second, because I want to know more about it.

694
00:33:07,720 --> 00:33:11,959
Speaker 3: But just on that topic, I think it was Aristotles

695
00:33:12,000 --> 00:33:15,560
Speaker 3: said that there was the courage was He talked about

696
00:33:15,600 --> 00:33:22,360
Speaker 3: the golden mean, which was the point between reckless or fearless.

697
00:33:23,960 --> 00:33:26,600
Speaker 3: Fearless reckless or I should say, which is down one

698
00:33:26,680 --> 00:33:28,720
Speaker 3: end of the scale and on the other end of

699
00:33:28,720 --> 00:33:32,840
Speaker 3: the scale, was you know you were coward and courage

700
00:33:32,880 --> 00:33:34,840
Speaker 3: was the gold means somewhere sat somewhere in between, not

701
00:33:34,880 --> 00:33:38,160
Speaker 3: in the middle, but somewhere and different for everybody. But

702
00:33:38,240 --> 00:33:42,720
Speaker 3: if you're becoming a leader of a country, it would

703
00:33:42,720 --> 00:33:46,720
Speaker 3: seem to me that finding that golden mean as a

704
00:33:46,840 --> 00:33:49,080
Speaker 3: leader of the country, as a prime minister leading your

705
00:33:49,120 --> 00:33:51,040
Speaker 3: party in this case in Australia.

706
00:33:51,120 --> 00:33:53,400
Speaker 1: In america's leading the country a bit different.

707
00:33:53,640 --> 00:33:57,400
Speaker 3: But do you think that we've lost that courage a

708
00:33:57,400 --> 00:33:57,800
Speaker 3: little bit?

709
00:33:57,880 --> 00:34:01,920
Speaker 7: Well, if you look at our political leadership, I think

710
00:34:01,960 --> 00:34:07,520
Speaker 7: that it peaked in the Hawk Howard era Hawk and

711
00:34:07,640 --> 00:34:13,360
Speaker 7: Howard each in his own way, they were both very,

712
00:34:13,640 --> 00:34:18,360
Speaker 7: very effective and quite brave prime ministers. Hawk defied labor

713
00:34:18,440 --> 00:34:24,560
Speaker 7: orthodoxy to i guess, deregulate the labor market, to privatize

714
00:34:24,760 --> 00:34:30,960
Speaker 7: or begin privatization processes, to reduce tariffs, to keep the

715
00:34:31,080 --> 00:34:35,600
Speaker 7: unions more or less in their lane. And then Howard

716
00:34:35,680 --> 00:34:38,319
Speaker 7: did things like introduced work for the doll he brought

717
00:34:38,320 --> 00:34:43,919
Speaker 7: in tax reform, he reformed the waterfront. Hawk did most

718
00:34:43,960 --> 00:34:47,120
Speaker 7: of his reforms with the support of the Coalition, so

719
00:34:48,200 --> 00:34:52,000
Speaker 7: at one level they were easier to do because they

720
00:34:52,040 --> 00:34:54,920
Speaker 7: weren't opposed in the Parliament the way Howard's reforms were

721
00:34:54,920 --> 00:34:58,920
Speaker 7: ferociously opposed by the Labor Party. But nevertheless, I wouldn't

722
00:34:59,040 --> 00:35:04,640
Speaker 7: underestimate the courage that both Hawk and Keating showed in

723
00:35:04,760 --> 00:35:12,120
Speaker 7: the economic sphere, because, frankly, it's a very unusual labor

724
00:35:12,200 --> 00:35:15,640
Speaker 7: leader who can get out of the old Marxist capital

725
00:35:15,760 --> 00:35:21,399
Speaker 7: versus labor paradigm and appreciate that workers do best when

726
00:35:21,480 --> 00:35:26,560
Speaker 7: the boss does well too. So we had a quarter

727
00:35:26,640 --> 00:35:32,800
Speaker 7: century of good leadership, really excellent, outstanding leadership under Hawk

728
00:35:33,000 --> 00:35:37,719
Speaker 7: and Howard. I think it's been of lesser quality since then,

729
00:35:38,000 --> 00:35:44,040
Speaker 7: and that's not because the individuals are necessarily of lesser caliber,

730
00:35:44,680 --> 00:35:49,520
Speaker 7: But I suspect there's certainly been less courage, and I

731
00:35:49,520 --> 00:35:51,440
Speaker 7: think in some instances less character.

732
00:35:51,680 --> 00:35:56,080
Speaker 3: And how much do you think courage is or courage

733
00:35:56,160 --> 00:36:01,239
Speaker 3: derives from what is possible? So it would seem to me,

734
00:36:01,560 --> 00:36:05,160
Speaker 3: particularly these days, with the ability to know what people

735
00:36:05,200 --> 00:36:11,120
Speaker 3: think polls, polling, and the ability to try and satisfy

736
00:36:11,840 --> 00:36:13,960
Speaker 3: as many people as you possibly can in order to

737
00:36:14,080 --> 00:36:15,960
Speaker 3: stay in government, because if you're not in government, you

738
00:36:15,960 --> 00:36:18,920
Speaker 3: can't make change. How much do you think courage is

739
00:36:18,920 --> 00:36:24,960
Speaker 3: being diluted by more information and not as ideologically based

740
00:36:25,640 --> 00:36:27,439
Speaker 3: as it would have maybe in the past.

741
00:36:28,000 --> 00:36:32,160
Speaker 7: I think political leadership is more difficult today because social

742
00:36:32,200 --> 00:36:35,080
Speaker 7: media and the twenty four to seven news cycle means

743
00:36:35,080 --> 00:36:37,880
Speaker 7: that you tend to be more distracted. I mean, in

744
00:36:38,000 --> 00:36:41,520
Speaker 7: Howard's time, you basically have to worry about the nightly

745
00:36:41,600 --> 00:36:46,600
Speaker 7: newses and the morning's papers. But you're constantly being besieged

746
00:36:46,719 --> 00:36:50,840
Speaker 7: by the media today. So I think in one sense

747
00:36:51,040 --> 00:36:56,920
Speaker 7: leadership is more difficult. But what do you want in

748
00:36:57,000 --> 00:37:01,240
Speaker 7: a leader? You want character, you want conviction, you want courage,

749
00:37:01,719 --> 00:37:05,560
Speaker 7: you want judgment, and frankly, you also want luck.

750
00:37:05,800 --> 00:37:07,600
Speaker 6: Some people have it, some people don't.

751
00:37:09,320 --> 00:37:11,719
Speaker 2: But I think that.

752
00:37:13,800 --> 00:37:19,799
Speaker 7: Far too often these days, politicians consult the polls, they

753
00:37:19,840 --> 00:37:25,840
Speaker 7: consult the focus group, and they allow themselves not to

754
00:37:25,880 --> 00:37:30,040
Speaker 7: give the public what the public needs, but they try

755
00:37:30,080 --> 00:37:32,840
Speaker 7: to give the public what the public wants.

756
00:37:33,000 --> 00:37:35,200
Speaker 2: Now, we're all.

757
00:37:35,120 --> 00:37:38,279
Speaker 7: Human, so we tend to want to have our cake

758
00:37:38,280 --> 00:37:41,680
Speaker 7: and eat it too. And the truth is you can't

759
00:37:41,840 --> 00:37:46,880
Speaker 7: mostly do that. You've got to make choices, often hard choices.

760
00:37:46,960 --> 00:37:48,200
Speaker 5: And in the.

761
00:37:48,120 --> 00:37:51,960
Speaker 7: Hawk Howard era, there was a greater tendency on the

762
00:37:52,000 --> 00:37:56,960
Speaker 7: part of our leadership to say, look, this is what's

763
00:37:57,080 --> 00:38:00,480
Speaker 7: right for the country, this is the argument in favor,

764
00:38:01,840 --> 00:38:06,520
Speaker 7: and they would prosecute the case. That's much less common.

765
00:38:06,600 --> 00:38:10,240
Speaker 7: I mean, let's take the vexed subject of climate change

766
00:38:10,280 --> 00:38:16,640
Speaker 7: for instance. Now the Liberal Party is having a huge

767
00:38:18,440 --> 00:38:24,080
Speaker 7: internal discussion at the moment about energy and climate policy.

768
00:38:27,680 --> 00:38:33,880
Speaker 7: One of the reasons why we are so angst written

769
00:38:34,600 --> 00:38:39,840
Speaker 7: over abandoning the straight jacket of net zero is because

770
00:38:40,040 --> 00:38:44,560
Speaker 7: we think the public have been totally if you're like,

771
00:38:46,080 --> 00:38:50,040
Speaker 7: they've basically been brainwashed into excepting that there is a

772
00:38:50,080 --> 00:38:54,799
Speaker 7: climate crisis. Now, I don't think there is a climate crisis.

773
00:38:55,480 --> 00:38:59,719
Speaker 7: I think reducing emissions is nice to do, but I

774
00:39:00,200 --> 00:39:03,759
Speaker 7: think it's something that should dominate our policy making, as

775
00:39:03,760 --> 00:39:09,200
Speaker 7: it does right now. I think what the Coalition should

776
00:39:09,200 --> 00:39:13,560
Speaker 7: be prepared to do is to say, look, frankly, net

777
00:39:13,680 --> 00:39:16,839
Speaker 7: zero is leading us down a path of economic ruin.

778
00:39:17,680 --> 00:39:18,799
Speaker 2: We have to abandon it.

779
00:39:20,320 --> 00:39:25,200
Speaker 7: My former colleagues are very worried that doing this will

780
00:39:25,560 --> 00:39:29,839
Speaker 7: cost them seats and prevent them from winning the so

781
00:39:29,960 --> 00:39:34,400
Speaker 7: called Teal seats back. But if it's actually right, I

782
00:39:34,440 --> 00:39:38,120
Speaker 7: think the important thing is to make the case and

783
00:39:38,320 --> 00:39:41,560
Speaker 7: argue it day in day out between now and.

784
00:39:41,600 --> 00:39:42,280
Speaker 2: The next election.

785
00:39:43,040 --> 00:39:45,640
Speaker 7: And if you fail and you still believe it's right,

786
00:39:46,040 --> 00:39:48,960
Speaker 7: keep arguing it. I mean, take the GST for instance.

787
00:39:49,000 --> 00:39:53,640
Speaker 7: The GST, or at least a general Goods and Services tax,

788
00:39:53,800 --> 00:39:56,880
Speaker 7: was first proposed by Keating at the time of the

789
00:39:57,000 --> 00:40:02,160
Speaker 7: tax summit in nineteen eighty five. The Prime Minister Hawk

790
00:40:02,600 --> 00:40:05,000
Speaker 7: decided it was a step too far. That was when

791
00:40:05,040 --> 00:40:13,719
Speaker 7: I suppose Hawk's caution and judgment trumped Keating's innovation and

792
00:40:14,040 --> 00:40:19,560
Speaker 7: political courage. Then the GST was proposed by John Houston,

793
00:40:19,600 --> 00:40:24,760
Speaker 7: as you'd remember Mark in the Fight Back Package, and Keating,

794
00:40:24,840 --> 00:40:29,239
Speaker 7: having supported it back in eighty five, ferociously opposed it

795
00:40:29,280 --> 00:40:33,840
Speaker 7: in the ninety three election, and then Eventually, the GST

796
00:40:34,200 --> 00:40:38,000
Speaker 7: was brought in because John Howard had the guts to

797
00:40:38,080 --> 00:40:40,240
Speaker 7: take it to the people in the nineteen ninety eight election.

798
00:40:40,440 --> 00:40:45,000
Speaker 7: So the GST was an idea that even its proponents

799
00:40:46,000 --> 00:40:51,160
Speaker 7: eventually shied away from. Then it was an idea that

800
00:40:51,360 --> 00:40:57,640
Speaker 7: was ferociously fought about, initially in success, unsuccessfully, finally successfully,

801
00:40:58,120 --> 00:41:03,400
Speaker 7: and now it's totally did. So it is possible to

802
00:41:03,520 --> 00:41:09,400
Speaker 7: put forward policy initiatives that you think are right but

803
00:41:09,560 --> 00:41:13,479
Speaker 7: which are fiercely resisted, and you just argue your way

804
00:41:14,040 --> 00:41:18,560
Speaker 7: through to success. And it is the mark of a

805
00:41:18,600 --> 00:41:24,759
Speaker 7: successful country that it can make tough decisions and that

806
00:41:24,800 --> 00:41:29,480
Speaker 7: its leaders can successfully persuade people to change their minds

807
00:41:29,480 --> 00:41:35,880
Speaker 7: on things. And I think that if you believe as

808
00:41:35,960 --> 00:41:39,919
Speaker 7: I do, that reducing emissions is no more than nice

809
00:41:39,960 --> 00:41:44,520
Speaker 7: to do. If you think that the important thing for

810
00:41:44,600 --> 00:41:49,720
Speaker 7: the long term well being of our country is economic growth,

811
00:41:50,320 --> 00:41:54,520
Speaker 7: more jobs, more successful and more dynamic industries, all of

812
00:41:54,560 --> 00:41:58,759
Speaker 7: which requires an abundance of cheap and reliable power, all

813
00:41:58,800 --> 00:42:04,160
Speaker 7: of which requires canntinuing our mineral resources, agricultural, et cetera. Development,

814
00:42:04,600 --> 00:42:08,279
Speaker 7: If you think this is necessary, well, and if you

815
00:42:08,320 --> 00:42:11,400
Speaker 7: think that the net zero straight jacket is gravely impeding

816
00:42:11,440 --> 00:42:11,879
Speaker 7: all of this.

817
00:42:12,320 --> 00:42:14,360
Speaker 2: Well, then you should be prepared to argue the case.

818
00:42:14,760 --> 00:42:16,240
Speaker 1: And that's that's leadership.

819
00:42:16,440 --> 00:42:17,239
Speaker 2: That's leadership.

820
00:42:18,560 --> 00:42:23,400
Speaker 1: Matt and Jack, Welcome to straight talk boys. How do

821
00:42:23,480 --> 00:42:25,880
Speaker 1: YouTube like there's one cut on solely?

822
00:42:25,880 --> 00:42:28,560
Speaker 3: In other words, you're both good at the same thing,

823
00:42:28,719 --> 00:42:30,359
Speaker 3: or is one good at something else and the other

824
00:42:30,360 --> 00:42:31,120
Speaker 3: one's not so good?

825
00:42:31,200 --> 00:42:31,879
Speaker 5: It's a good question.

826
00:42:32,560 --> 00:42:36,000
Speaker 8: It's like, I feel like we do even each other out. Like, say,

827
00:42:36,040 --> 00:42:38,680
Speaker 8: for instance, I'm really keen to do something. He'll be like, no, Like,

828
00:42:38,719 --> 00:42:41,080
Speaker 8: we make sure we get to the right decision. So

829
00:42:41,080 --> 00:42:43,200
Speaker 8: I'd be like, say, for instance.

830
00:42:43,360 --> 00:42:45,720
Speaker 9: Someone's a peasant with someone's an Optimists in a certain situation.

831
00:42:45,800 --> 00:42:46,760
Speaker 1: Yeah, but you just swap it around.

832
00:42:47,080 --> 00:42:49,120
Speaker 8: And if he's really keen, I'm like, well, I don't

833
00:42:49,120 --> 00:42:51,719
Speaker 8: think we should do this, just so we really understand

834
00:42:51,800 --> 00:42:53,000
Speaker 8: what we're about to go into.

835
00:42:53,400 --> 00:42:54,480
Speaker 9: So it's like he's like the.

836
00:42:54,400 --> 00:42:55,279
Speaker 1: Prose of things we can do.

837
00:42:55,440 --> 00:42:57,920
Speaker 8: You know, we can make this and this could take

838
00:42:58,000 --> 00:43:00,680
Speaker 8: us to hear and we can make this kind of whatever.

839
00:43:00,920 --> 00:43:03,520
Speaker 8: And then I'll be like, but then you know this

840
00:43:03,640 --> 00:43:07,239
Speaker 8: might happen, like they might not like that, and it's been.

841
00:43:07,120 --> 00:43:09,759
Speaker 3: A different bin deal, but the reverse if you come

842
00:43:09,840 --> 00:43:12,000
Speaker 3: with the idea, because he's one of you more the

843
00:43:12,040 --> 00:43:12,720
Speaker 3: ideas person.

844
00:43:14,080 --> 00:43:17,320
Speaker 9: Really yeah, both, honestly both. It's so we're like fifty

845
00:43:17,360 --> 00:43:20,880
Speaker 9: to fifty to a team. It's not like someone's sitting

846
00:43:20,880 --> 00:43:22,560
Speaker 9: at the computer while the other one's out in the streets,

847
00:43:22,560 --> 00:43:24,399
Speaker 9: say it's selling. Yeah, it's not like that at all.

848
00:43:24,440 --> 00:43:27,759
Speaker 9: It's just like super collaborative. It depends what it is.

849
00:43:28,040 --> 00:43:30,480
Speaker 8: Yeah, you know, so you you were more like the

850
00:43:30,520 --> 00:43:35,000
Speaker 8: travel This travel business is more Jack's idea, and then

851
00:43:35,680 --> 00:43:37,879
Speaker 8: I don't know, I might You'll be.

852
00:43:37,840 --> 00:43:38,960
Speaker 9: At the product.

853
00:43:39,040 --> 00:43:39,680
Speaker 1: He's more product.

854
00:43:40,880 --> 00:43:44,160
Speaker 9: Honestly that it's like it's just difficult in the same person,

855
00:43:44,200 --> 00:43:45,160
Speaker 9: but we switch it around.

856
00:43:45,360 --> 00:43:48,160
Speaker 8: It's wild and like we would like even skins, like

857
00:43:48,480 --> 00:43:50,160
Speaker 8: he'll think of one and then the next one.

858
00:43:50,200 --> 00:43:52,440
Speaker 9: I might think of MYX one. It just like just

859
00:43:52,480 --> 00:43:53,359
Speaker 9: depends what we're doing.

860
00:43:53,480 --> 00:43:57,280
Speaker 3: You like just naturally creative dudes, Like you're just sitting

861
00:43:57,320 --> 00:43:58,840
Speaker 3: there think about all this ship all the time.

862
00:43:58,840 --> 00:43:59,879
Speaker 9: In your head twenty four seven.

863
00:44:00,080 --> 00:44:04,200
Speaker 3: It's a great place to be and sometimes live together

864
00:44:04,239 --> 00:44:07,120
Speaker 3: like that, Like because effectively you guys are like, let's

865
00:44:07,120 --> 00:44:09,600
Speaker 3: call it a startup, but it's a really successful startup.

866
00:44:09,680 --> 00:44:12,120
Speaker 3: There's been a up for years, but it's a successful

867
00:44:12,160 --> 00:44:14,239
Speaker 3: startup and you live together, you're talking about it or

868
00:44:14,320 --> 00:44:16,719
Speaker 3: stuff for you watching each other, you're throwing the share

869
00:44:16,800 --> 00:44:17,520
Speaker 3: in front of each other.

870
00:44:17,560 --> 00:44:18,000
Speaker 1: What about this?

871
00:44:18,239 --> 00:44:19,960
Speaker 3: Then you've got your other mates there who are probably

872
00:44:19,960 --> 00:44:24,440
Speaker 3: involved in you said involved verious businesses. If you're if

873
00:44:24,440 --> 00:44:28,840
Speaker 3: you're sitting there trying to today to map out for

874
00:44:28,920 --> 00:44:32,040
Speaker 3: a young entrepreneur or a young entrepreneurs who want to

875
00:44:32,080 --> 00:44:36,920
Speaker 3: be successful, would you say that living together and working

876
00:44:36,960 --> 00:44:42,799
Speaker 3: together and nearly like being one person is really yeah?

877
00:44:42,840 --> 00:44:43,840
Speaker 3: Like you married couple, Nelly?

878
00:44:44,600 --> 00:44:46,560
Speaker 1: Is that like? Is that do you reckon?

879
00:44:46,640 --> 00:44:50,040
Speaker 3: That's one of the non negotiables and being successful for

880
00:44:50,120 --> 00:44:52,200
Speaker 3: what you guys have done a.

881
00:44:52,200 --> 00:44:52,719
Speaker 5: Lot, a lot.

882
00:44:52,960 --> 00:44:55,920
Speaker 9: I think it to work. Partnering up with someone is

883
00:44:56,719 --> 00:45:00,759
Speaker 9: can work so heavily in your failure if it's right person. Yeah,

884
00:45:00,760 --> 00:45:03,480
Speaker 9: But to find that right person, he's about one in

885
00:45:03,480 --> 00:45:06,160
Speaker 9: one hundred, I mean could be more. But like I

886
00:45:06,200 --> 00:45:08,120
Speaker 9: know all of our we we've got ten of our

887
00:45:08,160 --> 00:45:10,160
Speaker 9: best mates. We're all best friends. Like I'm just as

888
00:45:10,160 --> 00:45:11,920
Speaker 9: close with all my mates as I'm with our can

889
00:45:12,239 --> 00:45:13,560
Speaker 9: But I don't think I can work with any of them,

890
00:45:13,600 --> 00:45:15,600
Speaker 9: even though I love them, could not do it with

891
00:45:15,600 --> 00:45:17,960
Speaker 9: the way we work to outther it's just so unique

892
00:45:17,960 --> 00:45:19,960
Speaker 9: and it's taken a long time to get to a

893
00:45:20,000 --> 00:45:20,920
Speaker 9: place of you.

894
00:45:20,880 --> 00:45:22,920
Speaker 1: Know, it's a lot of like compromising.

895
00:45:22,960 --> 00:45:25,120
Speaker 9: You have to do so much every day, like NonStop,

896
00:45:25,200 --> 00:45:25,759
Speaker 9: you do.

897
00:45:25,840 --> 00:45:26,839
Speaker 1: I feel like punching in the head.

898
00:45:27,719 --> 00:45:30,319
Speaker 9: Not that bad, but we disagree on heaps. But yeah,

899
00:45:30,520 --> 00:45:32,759
Speaker 9: if you don't come to a solution quick and get

900
00:45:32,800 --> 00:45:34,960
Speaker 9: over it, then we have to find each other. Funny,

901
00:45:35,000 --> 00:45:36,800
Speaker 9: we have to make business desistants together. We have to

902
00:45:36,840 --> 00:45:40,040
Speaker 9: live together, we have to everything. Drive the car together

903
00:45:40,160 --> 00:45:42,959
Speaker 9: twenty four seven, like travel together. When the going's tough,

904
00:45:43,040 --> 00:45:45,680
Speaker 9: you're together. When you disagree, you're together. So it's like

905
00:45:45,960 --> 00:45:47,839
Speaker 9: you've just got to find We've just figured it out

906
00:45:47,880 --> 00:45:50,319
Speaker 9: over like all these years how to And at the

907
00:45:50,320 --> 00:45:52,359
Speaker 9: start it was actually a bit different. I was more way,

908
00:45:52,400 --> 00:45:54,880
Speaker 9: a lot more dominant, would you agree? And you were

909
00:45:54,960 --> 00:45:57,640
Speaker 9: kind of just like going with the flow. And then

910
00:45:58,120 --> 00:46:01,200
Speaker 9: now it's it's what just said before. It's like fifty

911
00:46:01,239 --> 00:46:02,840
Speaker 9: to fifty everything. It's so weird.

912
00:46:02,840 --> 00:46:05,480
Speaker 8: But yeah, like on business calls and stuff, Jack would

913
00:46:05,480 --> 00:46:07,360
Speaker 8: definitely take the lead because I'm like, people, please, I

914
00:46:07,520 --> 00:46:10,920
Speaker 8: wouldn't want to like upset anyone, and they're kind of

915
00:46:10,960 --> 00:46:13,960
Speaker 8: like hard to like, you know, I wouldn't want to

916
00:46:13,960 --> 00:46:16,560
Speaker 8: offend anyone and stuff. And then now I've kind of

917
00:46:16,600 --> 00:46:20,360
Speaker 8: like you kind of just realized business isn't it's not

918
00:46:20,360 --> 00:46:23,279
Speaker 8: from personal. You must got to fucking say what you

919
00:46:23,320 --> 00:46:26,640
Speaker 8: want or how you wanted to do it. And yeah,

920
00:46:26,800 --> 00:46:28,440
Speaker 8: so I feel like I've learned from that, like I

921
00:46:28,480 --> 00:46:30,680
Speaker 8: need to like step up more so, But what.

922
00:46:30,560 --> 00:46:33,440
Speaker 3: Have you guys learned about yourself? Like leak, now, what

923
00:46:33,480 --> 00:46:34,080
Speaker 3: have you been in business?

924
00:46:34,080 --> 00:46:34,359
Speaker 6: How long?

925
00:46:34,400 --> 00:46:34,520
Speaker 2: Now?

926
00:46:34,680 --> 00:46:35,719
Speaker 1: Six seven years?

927
00:46:36,160 --> 00:46:36,640
Speaker 5: Yeah?

928
00:46:36,680 --> 00:46:38,160
Speaker 9: Five six years? Six years?

929
00:46:38,480 --> 00:46:42,400
Speaker 1: So like sitting as your thirty year olds? Yeah, what

930
00:46:42,640 --> 00:46:43,760
Speaker 1: have you learn about yourselves?

931
00:46:44,600 --> 00:46:46,719
Speaker 8: I think at the start, like I was really like

932
00:46:47,320 --> 00:46:49,919
Speaker 8: wasn't confident at all, always second guess and like kind

933
00:46:49,920 --> 00:46:51,719
Speaker 8: of just like imposter syndrome.

934
00:46:51,920 --> 00:46:54,680
Speaker 9: Yeah, and we're now we've been here for a bit longer.

935
00:46:54,719 --> 00:46:57,680
Speaker 8: I feel a bit more confident in like, no, I

936
00:46:57,760 --> 00:47:00,480
Speaker 8: kind of know what is the right decision with the beer,

937
00:47:00,560 --> 00:47:01,799
Speaker 8: Like I say, like, oh, no, we should do it

938
00:47:01,800 --> 00:47:04,280
Speaker 8: like this, so we should do it that. And about

939
00:47:04,280 --> 00:47:07,560
Speaker 8: the start, you wouldn't you're just so unsure of yourself,

940
00:47:07,680 --> 00:47:10,399
Speaker 8: But now a bit more sure of ourselves and kind

941
00:47:10,440 --> 00:47:12,239
Speaker 8: of even we've just got a new management and you

942
00:47:12,280 --> 00:47:15,400
Speaker 8: just know what you want and and who you want

943
00:47:15,560 --> 00:47:16,160
Speaker 8: to be around.

944
00:47:16,280 --> 00:47:16,480
Speaker 3: Yeah.

945
00:47:16,560 --> 00:47:20,200
Speaker 9: Yeah, someone's saying to quote the other day, this woman

946
00:47:20,560 --> 00:47:23,120
Speaker 9: she does a lot of brand work in America for

947
00:47:23,200 --> 00:47:26,080
Speaker 9: like the Kardashians and stuff, and she's very successful, runs

948
00:47:26,120 --> 00:47:28,279
Speaker 9: own business and stuff. And she was going into a

949
00:47:28,360 --> 00:47:30,360
Speaker 9: meeting and she was a CEO, but she was just

950
00:47:30,560 --> 00:47:33,520
Speaker 9: freaking out all the time. And then her husband is

951
00:47:33,600 --> 00:47:36,040
Speaker 9: also kind of like a mentoring person. He was like,

952
00:47:36,440 --> 00:47:40,720
Speaker 9: you're walking in there with a with a employee mindset,

953
00:47:40,760 --> 00:47:43,759
Speaker 9: not a CEO mindset. Yeah, and it just changed straight away.

954
00:47:43,800 --> 00:47:45,840
Speaker 9: She's like, oh my god, that's so true. And I

955
00:47:45,840 --> 00:47:48,400
Speaker 9: felt that is imposter syndrome in a way. And we've

956
00:47:48,760 --> 00:47:51,279
Speaker 9: we've had that. He's a lot, you know, but then

957
00:47:51,280 --> 00:47:53,839
Speaker 9: we've figured out now it's like from the start, we've

958
00:47:53,840 --> 00:47:56,200
Speaker 9: always made decisions to be long term. Always like we've

959
00:47:56,239 --> 00:47:57,840
Speaker 9: had a lot of offers with stuff, as you do,

960
00:47:57,880 --> 00:48:00,320
Speaker 9: if you've got to follow me, and we've all always

961
00:48:00,320 --> 00:48:02,320
Speaker 9: being like, no, if it's not right, don't do it. It

962
00:48:02,160 --> 00:48:03,840
Speaker 9: doesn't the gut feeling is not there, don't do it.

963
00:48:03,880 --> 00:48:06,520
Speaker 9: And who are going into business with is because they're

964
00:48:06,520 --> 00:48:08,839
Speaker 9: a good person and we know them and we trust them,

965
00:48:08,840 --> 00:48:10,040
Speaker 9: and they don't just have a flash.

966
00:48:10,040 --> 00:48:10,319
Speaker 5: You can't.

967
00:48:10,320 --> 00:48:11,840
Speaker 9: They're talking shit and they've got all this money. We

968
00:48:11,840 --> 00:48:13,680
Speaker 9: don't give a shit about that. And we've always gone

969
00:48:13,719 --> 00:48:16,479
Speaker 9: into business for that one reason. It's never let us down,

970
00:48:16,880 --> 00:48:19,799
Speaker 9: even with like management anything. It's not just to beer.

971
00:48:19,840 --> 00:48:22,920
Speaker 9: It's like or the travel company, it's TV shows a bit.

972
00:48:23,120 --> 00:48:25,640
Speaker 9: Anything we work on is about the person you're working

973
00:48:25,640 --> 00:48:27,479
Speaker 9: with and the gut feeling of there.

974
00:48:29,000 --> 00:48:31,719
Speaker 8: It's just them because it honestly is like you're going

975
00:48:31,760 --> 00:48:34,280
Speaker 8: into like a family, because like when you're doing business,

976
00:48:34,320 --> 00:48:36,280
Speaker 8: it's like you become family because you we're just talking

977
00:48:36,360 --> 00:48:39,239
Speaker 8: every day. So you need that person to be like

978
00:48:39,719 --> 00:48:41,480
Speaker 8: you know, you want to gel with them or think

979
00:48:41,480 --> 00:48:42,680
Speaker 8: they're a good person because and.

980
00:48:42,640 --> 00:48:44,400
Speaker 9: You want to win together. You want to win with

981
00:48:44,480 --> 00:48:45,799
Speaker 9: someone that you don't even like, like.

982
00:48:45,760 --> 00:48:47,759
Speaker 1: You got to like them exactly, got to like them.

983
00:48:47,800 --> 00:48:50,320
Speaker 9: Their values are in place and they're not just fake

984
00:48:50,480 --> 00:48:52,960
Speaker 9: because you're a lot of people try and just they

985
00:48:53,000 --> 00:48:54,960
Speaker 9: show boat and then you can kind of sit down

986
00:48:55,000 --> 00:48:56,360
Speaker 9: with lunch with them and you're like, oh wow, this

987
00:48:56,400 --> 00:48:57,719
Speaker 9: could be cool. They're yeah, you can do whatever you

988
00:48:57,719 --> 00:48:59,360
Speaker 9: want to have all this money, blah blah blah, and

989
00:48:59,400 --> 00:49:01,040
Speaker 9: then you trying to like suck them out for a

990
00:49:01,080 --> 00:49:03,799
Speaker 9: bit and you're like, you're tossay, you're not real at all,

991
00:49:03,920 --> 00:49:06,560
Speaker 9: You're a fraud, like you're faith And then then six

992
00:49:06,560 --> 00:49:08,880
Speaker 9: months later you realize something someone tells you like, oh

993
00:49:08,960 --> 00:49:10,359
Speaker 9: my god, we're lucky. We didn't do that.

994
00:49:11,880 --> 00:49:12,799
Speaker 1: For a thirty year old, though.

995
00:49:12,840 --> 00:49:15,719
Speaker 3: It's pretty amazing to be able to have experience enough,

996
00:49:16,120 --> 00:49:19,319
Speaker 3: have experienced enough to be able to say no, who's

997
00:49:19,360 --> 00:49:21,319
Speaker 3: a toss on, who's a fake and fraud like that.

998
00:49:21,440 --> 00:49:23,400
Speaker 3: That's pretty cool, Like nobody people get to do that

999
00:49:23,440 --> 00:49:25,440
Speaker 3: at thirty or have done it by thirty.

1000
00:49:26,320 --> 00:49:28,040
Speaker 9: You know, we've got so we've been surrounded by such

1001
00:49:28,040 --> 00:49:30,200
Speaker 9: good people growing up in a hometown and like a

1002
00:49:30,200 --> 00:49:32,800
Speaker 9: small coastal town of good family and friends, so you

1003
00:49:32,880 --> 00:49:35,080
Speaker 9: kind of know how to read people and who's fake.

1004
00:49:35,120 --> 00:49:37,920
Speaker 9: And we've always had a strong friend group where we

1005
00:49:37,920 --> 00:49:39,719
Speaker 9: weren't chopping and changing friends every day.

1006
00:49:39,840 --> 00:49:42,000
Speaker 3: So you like, do your friends tip your so that

1007
00:49:42,680 --> 00:49:45,880
Speaker 3: the person a good a pretty good judge.

1008
00:49:45,640 --> 00:49:49,400
Speaker 9: Carried we all know, Yeah, that we all kind of know,

1009
00:49:49,719 --> 00:49:53,080
Speaker 9: and we've like we're lucky. We blew up mid twenties

1010
00:49:53,160 --> 00:49:56,200
Speaker 9: and not eighteen, because we wouldn't be we wouldn't be

1011
00:49:56,239 --> 00:49:59,160
Speaker 9: this smart. We're not smart at all. But like in

1012
00:49:59,200 --> 00:50:01,520
Speaker 9: the sense of what you're talking about, we wouldn't have

1013
00:50:01,560 --> 00:50:03,400
Speaker 9: any idea. We'd just be like, yeah, we'll do whatever

1014
00:50:03,640 --> 00:50:05,760
Speaker 9: for as we blew up later on, we've been trading

1015
00:50:05,880 --> 00:50:08,400
Speaker 9: for years and years and years, and we've been humbled

1016
00:50:08,520 --> 00:50:09,840
Speaker 9: and we knew what we didn't want to go back to,

1017
00:50:09,960 --> 00:50:11,520
Speaker 9: and so we were like, this is going to be

1018
00:50:11,560 --> 00:50:12,880
Speaker 9: long term and we've got to make sure of it.

1019
00:50:12,920 --> 00:50:14,880
Speaker 9: And how we make sure of it is reading people

1020
00:50:14,920 --> 00:50:17,960
Speaker 9: and making sure we're not just going to buy a

1021
00:50:18,080 --> 00:50:20,279
Speaker 9: dream that someone sells. Yeah, that's fake.

1022
00:50:21,800 --> 00:50:23,719
Speaker 1: Michell paying Welcome to straight Talk.

1023
00:50:24,000 --> 00:50:25,239
Speaker 10: Thank you, thanks for having me.

1024
00:50:26,080 --> 00:50:31,200
Speaker 1: And you love racing. You love horse racing, you love winning,

1025
00:50:33,280 --> 00:50:35,240
Speaker 1: You just love the sport. Generally. It's in your blood

1026
00:50:35,239 --> 00:50:36,200
Speaker 1: that you've been brought up with it.

1027
00:50:36,080 --> 00:50:39,279
Speaker 3: It is so powerful that pretty much nothing is going

1028
00:50:39,320 --> 00:50:42,920
Speaker 3: to stop me from doing. Whether it's fear, you know,

1029
00:50:43,080 --> 00:50:47,200
Speaker 3: the danger, the fact that you're female, you know the

1030
00:50:47,200 --> 00:50:50,000
Speaker 3: odds are against you even getting the getting the ride

1031
00:50:50,560 --> 00:50:53,719
Speaker 3: in the first place, whether you're going to look after

1032
00:50:53,760 --> 00:50:58,760
Speaker 3: your weight, you've had number of falls? Is that always

1033
00:50:58,920 --> 00:51:01,800
Speaker 3: overriding everything else? The fact that I love the sport

1034
00:51:01,840 --> 00:51:02,800
Speaker 3: and that's what I want to do.

1035
00:51:03,239 --> 00:51:07,640
Speaker 1: Yeah, so fun, so much conviction towards it and it's fun.

1036
00:51:07,760 --> 00:51:10,080
Speaker 1: Is it just because it's fun? Or is this is me?

1037
00:51:10,600 --> 00:51:14,560
Speaker 3: I define myself Michelle Paint. I am a jockey and

1038
00:51:14,640 --> 00:51:15,520
Speaker 3: I win races.

1039
00:51:16,880 --> 00:51:20,040
Speaker 10: To be honest, I always thought after riding, I could

1040
00:51:20,040 --> 00:51:23,000
Speaker 10: go on and do something else. So many things. I

1041
00:51:23,000 --> 00:51:25,719
Speaker 10: don't think that's definitive, but it was something that I

1042
00:51:25,719 --> 00:51:30,040
Speaker 10: found a passion in and loved, and I think how

1043
00:51:30,120 --> 00:51:32,840
Speaker 10: lucky I was to live a life of excitement like that.

1044
00:51:34,680 --> 00:51:37,320
Speaker 10: The feeling that you get when you cross the line,

1045
00:51:37,520 --> 00:51:40,200
Speaker 10: you know you've you've really helped that horse to achieve

1046
00:51:40,280 --> 00:51:45,000
Speaker 10: and win the race, and all the owners, the amount

1047
00:51:45,000 --> 00:51:47,120
Speaker 10: of effort the trainers put in, the stuff at home,

1048
00:51:48,200 --> 00:51:51,240
Speaker 10: everything that's involved, and to see that, you know, the

1049
00:51:51,280 --> 00:51:54,440
Speaker 10: happiness on their faces when you come back in. You

1050
00:51:54,480 --> 00:51:56,920
Speaker 10: can't put a price on that. It's it's unbelievable. And

1051
00:51:57,480 --> 00:51:59,279
Speaker 10: to have a job where you go to work and

1052
00:51:59,280 --> 00:52:02,359
Speaker 10: you're excited and you know it's so fun, like it's

1053
00:52:03,239 --> 00:52:05,120
Speaker 10: you know, not a job, you know, even though you

1054
00:52:05,800 --> 00:52:10,719
Speaker 10: basically starving yourself and you're exercising off no energy because

1055
00:52:10,719 --> 00:52:13,319
Speaker 10: you can't eat much, and sometimes you might be lying

1056
00:52:13,360 --> 00:52:15,080
Speaker 10: on the couch. I think I cannot be bothered to

1057
00:52:15,080 --> 00:52:16,360
Speaker 10: get up and go for a roun. But you just

1058
00:52:16,360 --> 00:52:18,400
Speaker 10: got to will yourself and get out there, because if

1059
00:52:18,440 --> 00:52:20,520
Speaker 10: you don't make the weight or you're not fit enough,

1060
00:52:20,560 --> 00:52:24,200
Speaker 10: you don't have a job. So I just can't self

1061
00:52:24,239 --> 00:52:27,200
Speaker 10: so lucky to have found, you know, a passion that

1062
00:52:27,239 --> 00:52:27,880
Speaker 10: I could.

1063
00:52:29,160 --> 00:52:31,120
Speaker 5: Be so excited about having.

1064
00:52:31,760 --> 00:52:35,080
Speaker 3: Part of being successful is actual fitness, Like I'm I

1065
00:52:35,080 --> 00:52:37,759
Speaker 3: guess we're talking about aerobic fitness. A grip strength probably

1066
00:52:37,800 --> 00:52:40,440
Speaker 3: pretty important strength and your legs to be able to

1067
00:52:40,480 --> 00:52:44,280
Speaker 3: stay on the horse. How important is that in terms

1068
00:52:44,280 --> 00:52:48,640
Speaker 3: of like your regime or during the week and before

1069
00:52:48,680 --> 00:52:51,120
Speaker 3: the race. So I'm assuming you're racing on a Saturday.

1070
00:52:51,680 --> 00:52:53,560
Speaker 3: So like I say, the big race is coming up

1071
00:52:53,600 --> 00:52:54,279
Speaker 3: in a month.

1072
00:52:55,400 --> 00:52:56,320
Speaker 1: Do you like a fighter?

1073
00:52:56,400 --> 00:52:57,960
Speaker 3: You sort of say, Okay, I've got a month to

1074
00:52:57,960 --> 00:53:00,200
Speaker 3: get ready for this really big race, So I'm going

1075
00:53:00,200 --> 00:53:03,200
Speaker 3: to go into a proper environment. Now I'm going to

1076
00:53:03,320 --> 00:53:05,840
Speaker 3: do this every single day of the week. You know,

1077
00:53:06,080 --> 00:53:07,759
Speaker 3: if you've got to like a ritual when you go

1078
00:53:07,800 --> 00:53:10,839
Speaker 3: through for that month, for example, before the Melbourne Couple,

1079
00:53:10,880 --> 00:53:12,360
Speaker 3: before whatever big event.

1080
00:53:12,200 --> 00:53:12,919
Speaker 1: You're going to go in.

1081
00:53:14,280 --> 00:53:16,319
Speaker 10: I think if you want to be a jockey and

1082
00:53:16,360 --> 00:53:18,480
Speaker 10: achieve at the top level, you've got to dedicate your

1083
00:53:18,520 --> 00:53:21,719
Speaker 10: life to it. One thing I learned which I took

1084
00:53:21,760 --> 00:53:23,600
Speaker 10: away from my falls was that you have to have

1085
00:53:23,640 --> 00:53:26,640
Speaker 10: a balance. From a young age, I was so determined

1086
00:53:26,640 --> 00:53:29,280
Speaker 10: to do well. I didn't want to take any holidays.

1087
00:53:29,320 --> 00:53:31,759
Speaker 10: I was just wanting to do you know, well, and

1088
00:53:32,400 --> 00:53:35,280
Speaker 10: not risk having time away that I get forgotten about.

1089
00:53:35,560 --> 00:53:37,400
Speaker 10: All the hard work you put in would be go

1090
00:53:37,520 --> 00:53:40,760
Speaker 10: to waste. But having the falls, you had no choice.

1091
00:53:40,800 --> 00:53:43,280
Speaker 10: You were forced to have that time. And I traveled,

1092
00:53:43,440 --> 00:53:46,640
Speaker 10: got to see the world and realized that there was

1093
00:53:46,680 --> 00:53:49,360
Speaker 10: something in that. Then really thought maybe that happened for

1094
00:53:49,400 --> 00:53:52,080
Speaker 10: a reason. Maybe it showed me that there's more to

1095
00:53:52,160 --> 00:53:55,520
Speaker 10: life than riding and racing every day. And from then

1096
00:53:55,600 --> 00:53:57,680
Speaker 10: I sort of tried to take a holiday every winter

1097
00:53:57,719 --> 00:54:01,120
Speaker 10: when I could, and basically now every winter from that

1098
00:54:01,160 --> 00:54:04,600
Speaker 10: went somewhere different in the world and explored and traveled

1099
00:54:04,640 --> 00:54:06,719
Speaker 10: and grew in myself a lot of the time on

1100
00:54:06,760 --> 00:54:08,560
Speaker 10: my own, because I thought that would be a better

1101
00:54:08,560 --> 00:54:10,480
Speaker 10: way to do it, you meet people you're forced to,

1102
00:54:12,239 --> 00:54:15,200
Speaker 10: so it's all about the balance. But then when you're

1103
00:54:15,200 --> 00:54:17,640
Speaker 10: in it, you're you're totally in it. You don't you

1104
00:54:17,680 --> 00:54:20,920
Speaker 10: don't hard. They can go out dinner. You know. I

1105
00:54:21,000 --> 00:54:24,120
Speaker 10: didn't get to see my friends from school nearly all

1106
00:54:24,120 --> 00:54:26,279
Speaker 10: of my teenage years because I was so you know,

1107
00:54:26,520 --> 00:54:28,839
Speaker 10: dedicated to the job. But you want to do well,

1108
00:54:28,880 --> 00:54:32,120
Speaker 10: you have to do well, and that's getting up early.

1109
00:54:32,719 --> 00:54:34,800
Speaker 10: You've got to do the work behind the scenes to

1110
00:54:35,200 --> 00:54:37,319
Speaker 10: get the opportunities, to get the race rides, to get

1111
00:54:37,320 --> 00:54:40,600
Speaker 10: your fitness up. There's only so much fitness you can

1112
00:54:40,600 --> 00:54:44,000
Speaker 10: get from track work because it's not like under race pressure.

1113
00:54:44,239 --> 00:54:47,399
Speaker 10: You're not you're obviously training the horse, you're holding them,

1114
00:54:47,400 --> 00:54:53,200
Speaker 10: your positions in the same point, but there's no nerves,

1115
00:54:53,239 --> 00:54:57,040
Speaker 10: the dealing with adrenaline. There's nothing like race fitness. But

1116
00:54:57,120 --> 00:54:59,400
Speaker 10: you can help yourself at home by doing I found

1117
00:54:59,440 --> 00:55:01,839
Speaker 10: for me the best way. I'm definitely not a very

1118
00:55:01,840 --> 00:55:06,880
Speaker 10: good athlete, so to train harder, lots of high intensity works,

1119
00:55:06,880 --> 00:55:13,680
Speaker 10: sprint work, short sharp intervals, just any basic strength work

1120
00:55:13,719 --> 00:55:16,160
Speaker 10: that related to riding. You didn't want to be using

1121
00:55:16,160 --> 00:55:18,240
Speaker 10: false muscles, so you didn't want to be building muscles

1122
00:55:18,239 --> 00:55:21,480
Speaker 10: that weren't going to help your riding train specific exactly

1123
00:55:21,760 --> 00:55:24,920
Speaker 10: for what your sport is exactly. And that's like a

1124
00:55:24,960 --> 00:55:27,360
Speaker 10: lot of core strength, obviously, a lot of arm strength,

1125
00:55:27,520 --> 00:55:31,279
Speaker 10: chin ups, you know, really have to use all your

1126
00:55:31,360 --> 00:55:34,520
Speaker 10: muscles in your body. Really when you're in that riding

1127
00:55:34,560 --> 00:55:37,760
Speaker 10: position and you're holding the horse, you're using everything without

1128
00:55:37,800 --> 00:55:40,480
Speaker 10: your your knowledge. Even so with that, you've got to

1129
00:55:40,480 --> 00:55:42,439
Speaker 10: be very agile because you want to be a part

1130
00:55:42,480 --> 00:55:44,200
Speaker 10: of the horse. You don't want them to even know

1131
00:55:44,239 --> 00:55:46,440
Speaker 10: you're you're on them. You don't want to be like

1132
00:55:46,719 --> 00:55:49,040
Speaker 10: you go for a run and you got some keys

1133
00:55:49,040 --> 00:55:52,480
Speaker 10: in your pocket, sort of unbalancing your stride or whatever.

1134
00:55:52,560 --> 00:55:54,480
Speaker 10: You want to be with them as one so that

1135
00:55:54,520 --> 00:55:57,920
Speaker 10: you can get the best out of them. So for me,

1136
00:55:58,000 --> 00:55:59,920
Speaker 10: the best way I found was to do the truck

1137
00:56:00,200 --> 00:56:02,080
Speaker 10: that you had to do. Sometimes we had to do

1138
00:56:02,120 --> 00:56:04,799
Speaker 10: too much, Like for example, some days I'd ride twenty

1139
00:56:04,800 --> 00:56:07,360
Speaker 10: horses in the morning and before you go to the races.

1140
00:56:07,600 --> 00:56:09,439
Speaker 10: That was an extame before you go to the race, Yeah,

1141
00:56:09,440 --> 00:56:11,520
Speaker 10: that was an extreme day, like one of you know,

1142
00:56:11,600 --> 00:56:16,000
Speaker 10: the toughest usually be five to ten or fifteen and

1143
00:56:16,080 --> 00:56:18,160
Speaker 10: then you might have a little work out at home,

1144
00:56:18,280 --> 00:56:20,279
Speaker 10: have a little sauna or a spy to lose the

1145
00:56:20,280 --> 00:56:22,799
Speaker 10: weight that you need to lose. Sometimes you felt better

1146
00:56:22,800 --> 00:56:24,600
Speaker 10: if you had that anyway, even if you didn't have

1147
00:56:24,640 --> 00:56:27,680
Speaker 10: to lose weight, because your body was more prepared. I

1148
00:56:27,840 --> 00:56:32,600
Speaker 10: found it helped me and then yeah, off to the races.

1149
00:56:32,640 --> 00:56:36,440
Speaker 10: But as I got older and didn't have to ride

1150
00:56:36,440 --> 00:56:38,720
Speaker 10: as much track work to get the opportunity as probably

1151
00:56:39,080 --> 00:56:43,680
Speaker 10: more post Marlbourne Cup, I realized it was easier to

1152
00:56:43,760 --> 00:56:47,160
Speaker 10: have a balance of track work, training yourself and then

1153
00:56:47,200 --> 00:56:50,560
Speaker 10: going to the races. So one of the toughest things

1154
00:56:50,600 --> 00:56:53,840
Speaker 10: about being female riders you had to really work hard

1155
00:56:54,000 --> 00:56:57,000
Speaker 10: behind the scenes. It's why I was riding twenty horses

1156
00:56:57,000 --> 00:57:00,120
Speaker 10: the morning to get the opportunities. But your big ad

1157
00:57:00,120 --> 00:57:01,520
Speaker 10: by the time we get to the races, you know,

1158
00:57:01,560 --> 00:57:04,520
Speaker 10: there's only so much exercise and work your body and

1159
00:57:04,560 --> 00:57:07,840
Speaker 10: your muscles can do, especially on very limited food. So

1160
00:57:09,280 --> 00:57:10,840
Speaker 10: all those things you just have to work out and

1161
00:57:10,920 --> 00:57:13,799
Speaker 10: learn along the way, and you know you have to

1162
00:57:13,880 --> 00:57:16,640
Speaker 10: really want it because you can't maintain that kind of

1163
00:57:16,720 --> 00:57:17,600
Speaker 10: lifestyle otherwise.

1164
00:57:17,840 --> 00:57:20,160
Speaker 3: If you just talk quickly about the Melbourne Cup, win

1165
00:57:21,000 --> 00:57:25,680
Speaker 3: princip Penzance, do you remember the first time you saw

1166
00:57:26,960 --> 00:57:31,280
Speaker 3: met the principendance, met the horse, and did you feel

1167
00:57:31,320 --> 00:57:33,280
Speaker 3: an immediate empathy towards that animal.

1168
00:57:34,800 --> 00:57:36,920
Speaker 10: I'm not even joking. The first time I saw him

1169
00:57:37,000 --> 00:57:39,560
Speaker 10: was at a real little country track called Kollak. We

1170
00:57:39,560 --> 00:57:42,800
Speaker 10: were doing trials. I was coming back from another injury

1171
00:57:43,760 --> 00:57:46,680
Speaker 10: and I said to his trainer Darren, were, such, that's

1172
00:57:46,680 --> 00:57:48,640
Speaker 10: a nice horse. He was just on the other side

1173
00:57:48,680 --> 00:57:50,520
Speaker 10: of the mountainyd and he said, yeah, he's really nice.

1174
00:57:50,720 --> 00:57:52,959
Speaker 1: It's a nice horseman. From your point of view.

1175
00:57:52,920 --> 00:57:54,960
Speaker 10: An athlete, you look at it, you can see it

1176
00:57:55,040 --> 00:57:57,600
Speaker 10: in three seconds. Do that horse move as well? Like

1177
00:57:57,760 --> 00:58:01,280
Speaker 10: everything works together. Got a nice big deep girth, which

1178
00:58:01,280 --> 00:58:04,840
Speaker 10: means I've got big lungs, big heart can fit in there.

1179
00:58:06,360 --> 00:58:09,880
Speaker 10: Everything's just efficient. And you could just tell the way

1180
00:58:09,920 --> 00:58:12,080
Speaker 10: he walked, and he was bold. He was really bold

1181
00:58:12,240 --> 00:58:15,280
Speaker 10: and wanted to get home, wanted to get on with

1182
00:58:15,320 --> 00:58:17,920
Speaker 10: the job. Like he was bought by a guy called

1183
00:58:18,000 --> 00:58:19,680
Speaker 10: John Foot, who bought him because he said he walked

1184
00:58:19,720 --> 00:58:21,840
Speaker 10: through He'd run through a brick wall. He was that

1185
00:58:21,960 --> 00:58:25,000
Speaker 10: bold kind of horse. He said, yeah, no, he's a

1186
00:58:25,040 --> 00:58:27,040
Speaker 10: really nice horse. You can see how it goes. So

1187
00:58:27,080 --> 00:58:29,560
Speaker 10: I was trialing him this day. He hadn't had a

1188
00:58:29,640 --> 00:58:33,320
Speaker 10: race at this point, and we were later in the

1189
00:58:33,360 --> 00:58:35,560
Speaker 10: day and a bit unusual, but the track got a

1190
00:58:35,600 --> 00:58:37,360
Speaker 10: bit slippery as the day went on and we were

1191
00:58:37,360 --> 00:58:40,040
Speaker 10: out wider, so usually on the course as a canber,

1192
00:58:40,120 --> 00:58:42,160
Speaker 10: but because we were out so wide, the Campra was

1193
00:58:42,240 --> 00:58:44,800
Speaker 10: running down the other way. As we were around in

1194
00:58:44,840 --> 00:58:47,880
Speaker 10: the corner with the greasy ground, he slipped and lost

1195
00:58:47,920 --> 00:58:50,560
Speaker 10: his balance and I swear I felt my knee and

1196
00:58:50,640 --> 00:58:52,400
Speaker 10: he touched the ground because he went down that far.

1197
00:58:52,480 --> 00:58:54,760
Speaker 10: But he picked himself back up, and he was just

1198
00:58:54,840 --> 00:58:58,520
Speaker 10: so athletic and I hadn't come off him and got

1199
00:58:58,560 --> 00:59:02,360
Speaker 10: himself back into striding. A few strides picked up, sprinted

1200
00:59:02,440 --> 00:59:04,400
Speaker 10: and gallus the line finished second and I was like,

1201
00:59:04,440 --> 00:59:06,800
Speaker 10: oh my god, what is this horse, because they just

1202
00:59:06,840 --> 00:59:10,720
Speaker 10: don't do that, and he said, yeah, he's a nice thought.

1203
00:59:10,800 --> 00:59:13,480
Speaker 10: So it kept trying to keep with him because I

1204
00:59:13,520 --> 00:59:15,760
Speaker 10: thought he was pretty special. You know, you don't come

1205
00:59:15,800 --> 00:59:19,600
Speaker 10: across that very often in your career, and I've said

1206
00:59:19,600 --> 00:59:22,640
Speaker 10: many times like through my riding career, I rode seven

1207
00:59:22,680 --> 00:59:26,480
Speaker 10: and a half thousand races and probably over thirty thousand horses,

1208
00:59:26,840 --> 00:59:29,520
Speaker 10: even more in track work, and probably five in the

1209
00:59:29,560 --> 00:59:32,720
Speaker 10: lifetime gave you that X factor feel, and he did

1210
00:59:32,720 --> 00:59:36,520
Speaker 10: that right from the start his very first trial that

1211
00:59:36,600 --> 00:59:39,200
Speaker 10: I rode. So he was just a remarkable horse, an

1212
00:59:39,320 --> 00:59:42,920
Speaker 10: unbelievable athlete, had a will to win, to want to

1213
00:59:42,960 --> 00:59:45,640
Speaker 10: do it, sometimes too much, he wanted to overdo it.

1214
00:59:45,720 --> 00:59:48,439
Speaker 10: So I think we were a good balance being sort

1215
00:59:48,440 --> 00:59:51,680
Speaker 10: of soft touch with him and kind and you're always

1216
00:59:51,680 --> 00:59:53,480
Speaker 10: talking to him and patting him and stuff like that.

1217
00:59:53,600 --> 00:59:57,160
Speaker 10: So yeah, it was just an unbelievable journey. And to

1218
00:59:57,800 --> 01:00:00,040
Speaker 10: think I come across a horse like that and later.

1219
00:59:59,800 --> 01:00:00,480
Speaker 1: In my career.

1220
01:00:00,880 --> 01:00:04,120
Speaker 3: So when you win something as famous in Australia as

1221
01:00:04,160 --> 01:00:06,760
Speaker 3: the Melbourne Cup and probably even globally in the horse

1222
01:00:06,840 --> 01:00:12,439
Speaker 3: racing world, what's the deal when you is the race

1223
01:00:12,640 --> 01:00:13,840
Speaker 3: when it's over and you know.

1224
01:00:13,880 --> 01:00:14,680
Speaker 1: You can see you won.

1225
01:00:15,520 --> 01:00:17,439
Speaker 3: Is it a bit of an anti climax because most

1226
01:00:17,480 --> 01:00:20,600
Speaker 3: of the thrillers during the race, or do you have

1227
01:00:21,160 --> 01:00:22,919
Speaker 3: or is it as big a thrill when they sort

1228
01:00:22,920 --> 01:00:24,880
Speaker 3: of announce it you're the winner and you know you won,

1229
01:00:25,000 --> 01:00:28,640
Speaker 3: But where's the thrill lie in the race itself and

1230
01:00:28,680 --> 01:00:32,680
Speaker 3: winning it actually taking him through to win, or is

1231
01:00:32,720 --> 01:00:35,760
Speaker 3: it when it's all over and it's relief where's the

1232
01:00:35,800 --> 01:00:36,400
Speaker 3: biggest thrill?

1233
01:00:37,520 --> 01:00:40,560
Speaker 10: Honestly, I sit here right now today and can tell

1234
01:00:40,600 --> 01:00:42,920
Speaker 10: it gives me like butterflies in my stomach to think

1235
01:00:42,960 --> 01:00:46,400
Speaker 10: that I still have been lucky enough to win a

1236
01:00:46,440 --> 01:00:48,160
Speaker 10: great race. It was a dream of mine from a

1237
01:00:48,200 --> 01:00:51,800
Speaker 10: five year old, so to think twenty five years later

1238
01:00:52,120 --> 01:00:55,240
Speaker 10: I was able to cross that line in front on him,

1239
01:00:55,520 --> 01:00:58,840
Speaker 10: it blows me away. So honestly, I can't say the

1240
01:00:58,880 --> 01:01:02,800
Speaker 10: feelings died down. It was an absolute well wind from

1241
01:01:02,800 --> 01:01:08,280
Speaker 10: the moment I got off, And it's amazing to think

1242
01:01:08,320 --> 01:01:10,720
Speaker 10: that one race can change your life like it has. Obviously,

1243
01:01:10,920 --> 01:01:15,400
Speaker 10: film being made, second book that I've written, been part

1244
01:01:15,400 --> 01:01:22,080
Speaker 10: of writing with the writer, and yeah, just incredible. Like, honestly,

1245
01:01:22,080 --> 01:01:23,480
Speaker 10: I can't believe it.

1246
01:01:23,560 --> 01:01:24,520
Speaker 1: Did it change a world much?

1247
01:01:24,600 --> 01:01:27,400
Speaker 3: I mean, apart from all the opportunities you obviously obviously get,

1248
01:01:27,440 --> 01:01:31,280
Speaker 3: apart from the factor you you now stand for something

1249
01:01:31,320 --> 01:01:35,560
Speaker 3: in relation to horse racing, with women involved in horse racing,

1250
01:01:35,600 --> 01:01:40,760
Speaker 3: particularly as jockeys. But how did it defect your life?

1251
01:01:41,320 --> 01:01:41,480
Speaker 7: Was it?

1252
01:01:41,720 --> 01:01:44,240
Speaker 1: Apart from the obvious positives? Many negatives come with that

1253
01:01:44,240 --> 01:01:46,080
Speaker 1: sort of stuff, like being in the limelight. How do

1254
01:01:46,120 --> 01:01:46,800
Speaker 1: you feel about that?

1255
01:01:48,240 --> 01:01:51,280
Speaker 10: I've sort of been prepared for the limelight through my career,

1256
01:01:52,320 --> 01:01:55,000
Speaker 10: just with earlier successes, so I was pretty okay with that.

1257
01:01:55,840 --> 01:01:59,960
Speaker 10: As in media, Yeah, with media, sort of being stopped

1258
01:02:00,080 --> 01:02:02,400
Speaker 10: on the street become something I struggled with because I'm

1259
01:02:02,400 --> 01:02:05,320
Speaker 10: a pretty private person. You know, as a jockey, you're

1260
01:02:05,360 --> 01:02:09,080
Speaker 10: self employed, you really focused, busy at your job, keeps

1261
01:02:09,120 --> 01:02:13,240
Speaker 10: yourself pretty quiet because usually you're hungry, so you don't

1262
01:02:13,280 --> 01:02:18,360
Speaker 10: have much conversation. It's taken away your personality. So I

1263
01:02:18,400 --> 01:02:21,760
Speaker 10: found it really tough, challenging. But the way I looked

1264
01:02:21,760 --> 01:02:22,800
Speaker 10: at it is you've got to take the good with

1265
01:02:22,840 --> 01:02:26,040
Speaker 10: it bad. People were lovely everywhere it went, you know,

1266
01:02:26,160 --> 01:02:30,680
Speaker 10: congratulations are so exciting, so inspired by when I couldn't

1267
01:02:30,680 --> 01:02:35,280
Speaker 10: believe it, you know, the amount of good feeling that

1268
01:02:35,320 --> 01:02:38,760
Speaker 10: I got from it and people's reactions. So yeah, it

1269
01:02:38,800 --> 01:02:41,680
Speaker 10: was tough, but like you said, like I said, sorry,

1270
01:02:43,560 --> 01:02:46,720
Speaker 10: people were amazing and just blew me away. But I

1271
01:02:46,760 --> 01:02:49,600
Speaker 10: got tired also, so I just had to go home

1272
01:02:49,800 --> 01:02:51,840
Speaker 10: and rest a lot of the time because it was

1273
01:02:51,920 --> 01:02:53,640
Speaker 10: just a bit overwhelming to take on.

1274
01:02:53,960 --> 01:02:55,680
Speaker 3: You sort of like have to perform a little bit

1275
01:02:55,680 --> 01:02:57,880
Speaker 3: when you do something really good, and everybody sort of

1276
01:02:57,920 --> 01:03:00,520
Speaker 3: wants to acknowledge it and you hold up in a

1277
01:03:00,600 --> 01:03:01,400
Speaker 3: bit of a pedestal.

1278
01:03:01,840 --> 01:03:04,680
Speaker 10: That was one thing sorry that people used to be

1279
01:03:04,800 --> 01:03:07,000
Speaker 10: so excited when they met me, and I feel like

1280
01:03:07,000 --> 01:03:09,120
Speaker 10: I let them down because I was like, thanks very much,

1281
01:03:09,480 --> 01:03:11,640
Speaker 10: but I couldn't be impressive right then and there, so

1282
01:03:11,720 --> 01:03:15,640
Speaker 10: I found it quite tough at the time that I

1283
01:03:15,680 --> 01:03:17,520
Speaker 10: was letting them down. They're like, oh my god, but

1284
01:03:17,560 --> 01:03:19,440
Speaker 10: what you did. Were so excited and again I'd say

1285
01:03:19,440 --> 01:03:21,760
Speaker 10: thank you very much, and they'd say it again sometimes

1286
01:03:21,760 --> 01:03:24,080
Speaker 10: and I'm like, I can't say anything more than thanks

1287
01:03:24,200 --> 01:03:27,600
Speaker 10: very much. Like I felt the pressure to live up

1288
01:03:27,640 --> 01:03:30,240
Speaker 10: to their excitement. That was really draining and tough.

1289
01:03:30,760 --> 01:03:35,080
Speaker 1: John laws Lawsy well too straight talk mate, Mark, How

1290
01:03:35,080 --> 01:03:35,520
Speaker 1: are you doing?

1291
01:03:36,680 --> 01:03:39,800
Speaker 3: Do you worry about where everybody's going to vote for

1292
01:03:39,840 --> 01:03:42,080
Speaker 3: someone like Trump to put him into by such a

1293
01:03:42,080 --> 01:03:42,800
Speaker 3: big majority.

1294
01:03:44,200 --> 01:03:48,280
Speaker 6: No, I don't worry about it because it's going to

1295
01:03:48,280 --> 01:03:50,880
Speaker 6: be a long time before it affects Australia. And I

1296
01:03:50,960 --> 01:03:55,520
Speaker 6: think Australia is a very strong, little strong country and

1297
01:03:55,560 --> 01:03:57,840
Speaker 6: I don't think we'll accept anything that we don't choose

1298
01:03:57,880 --> 01:04:01,520
Speaker 6: to accept. I don't think we'll be overrun by the

1299
01:04:01,560 --> 01:04:02,880
Speaker 6: whims of Donald Trump.

1300
01:04:03,720 --> 01:04:04,400
Speaker 1: I read some of that.

1301
01:04:04,400 --> 01:04:12,320
Speaker 3: You've interviewed seventeen prime ministers. I get excited one interview two.

1302
01:04:12,840 --> 01:04:15,440
Speaker 3: You've interviewed seventeen prime minister's astrain prim I.

1303
01:04:15,440 --> 01:04:18,720
Speaker 6: Think it's more than seventeen seventeen.

1304
01:04:18,400 --> 01:04:23,320
Speaker 3: And of which twice was Kevin Rudd. In those seventeen

1305
01:04:23,360 --> 01:04:29,439
Speaker 3: prime ministers. Is there any any standouts that you write here?

1306
01:04:30,520 --> 01:04:37,280
Speaker 6: Oh, yeah, Paul Keating as a standout, alaricon, alaricon as

1307
01:04:37,440 --> 01:04:38,280
Speaker 6: a great brain.

1308
01:04:38,960 --> 01:04:40,480
Speaker 1: Yeah, you're plenty going on up there.

1309
01:04:40,520 --> 01:04:45,560
Speaker 6: And then great brain Malcolm Fraser. I admired greatly and

1310
01:04:45,600 --> 01:04:49,880
Speaker 6: spent a lot of time with Malcolm Fraser. Most of them.

1311
01:04:49,880 --> 01:04:53,160
Speaker 6: I've got on very well with got Whitlam. I had

1312
01:04:53,160 --> 01:04:56,840
Speaker 6: a New Year's Eve with got Whitlam in Paris in

1313
01:04:57,360 --> 01:05:04,240
Speaker 6: his propellatial Paris own. He and my wife at that time,

1314
01:05:04,480 --> 01:05:09,480
Speaker 6: and Margaret and Goffell had New Year's Eve together, which

1315
01:05:09,520 --> 01:05:11,640
Speaker 6: was great. Yes, I've known a lot of prime ministers,

1316
01:05:12,040 --> 01:05:15,160
Speaker 6: and I've been very close to quite a few prime ministers.

1317
01:05:16,400 --> 01:05:19,320
Speaker 3: If we look at Paul Keating because he went to

1318
01:05:19,360 --> 01:05:21,160
Speaker 3: my school. Actually he was a few years ahead of me,

1319
01:05:21,440 --> 01:05:25,200
Speaker 3: but he was the as I recall it, the I

1320
01:05:25,200 --> 01:05:27,640
Speaker 3: don't know what it was the head of the student

1321
01:05:27,720 --> 01:05:30,840
Speaker 3: Representative council. Even in those days he was sort of

1322
01:05:30,960 --> 01:05:34,840
Speaker 3: very much aware of unionism and sort of you know

1323
01:05:35,080 --> 01:05:37,240
Speaker 3: what should be done in relation to making things better

1324
01:05:37,240 --> 01:05:39,640
Speaker 3: at the university at the school.

1325
01:05:40,800 --> 01:05:41,920
Speaker 1: But Paul was always.

1326
01:05:41,600 --> 01:05:44,200
Speaker 3: Really smart at school, Like it was well known that

1327
01:05:44,240 --> 01:05:46,240
Speaker 3: poor Keating was one of the smart kids at school.

1328
01:05:48,680 --> 01:05:52,320
Speaker 3: In terms of his policy in Australia, he was big

1329
01:05:52,360 --> 01:05:55,360
Speaker 3: between eighty seven and nineteen eighty seven and to their

1330
01:05:55,960 --> 01:05:58,800
Speaker 3: nineteen eighty seven and nineteen ninety six.

1331
01:06:01,920 --> 01:06:07,120
Speaker 1: Do you think that Paul was too honest for his

1332
01:06:07,160 --> 01:06:07,600
Speaker 1: own good?

1333
01:06:07,800 --> 01:06:11,200
Speaker 3: And why say that? Why say that is because I

1334
01:06:11,240 --> 01:06:16,080
Speaker 3: remember two things that he said that were turned against him.

1335
01:06:16,440 --> 01:06:19,440
Speaker 3: The first was, this is the recession we had to

1336
01:06:19,480 --> 01:06:24,320
Speaker 3: have ye and on show. And he also said in

1337
01:06:24,360 --> 01:06:26,400
Speaker 3: your show the sothing about the Banana Republic. Yeah, he

1338
01:06:26,440 --> 01:06:32,520
Speaker 3: said that, and but over time they were used against him.

1339
01:06:32,640 --> 01:06:36,040
Speaker 3: The medium then turned those around. And I think anyway,

1340
01:06:36,080 --> 01:06:37,720
Speaker 3: and I think one of the reasons he lost the

1341
01:06:37,760 --> 01:06:41,440
Speaker 3: election as Prime minister when he was Prime minister was

1342
01:06:41,640 --> 01:06:48,720
Speaker 3: largely because of his intellectual honesty and no regard for

1343
01:06:50,920 --> 01:06:54,840
Speaker 3: what the fallout might be by being intellectually honest.

1344
01:06:54,840 --> 01:06:56,320
Speaker 1: Because he had a huge intellect.

1345
01:06:56,440 --> 01:07:02,440
Speaker 3: Still that was obviously, whereas today you never hear prime

1346
01:07:02,480 --> 01:07:06,760
Speaker 3: ministers doing saying anything that's even slightly dangerous.

1347
01:07:07,760 --> 01:07:09,520
Speaker 1: And even slightly dangerous.

1348
01:07:09,840 --> 01:07:16,800
Speaker 6: Yeah, I mean John Howard certainly wasn't a worse was he.

1349
01:07:16,800 --> 01:07:19,760
Speaker 6: He said what he wanted to say and said it

1350
01:07:19,800 --> 01:07:24,120
Speaker 6: pretty well. I admired and still do admire John Howard,

1351
01:07:25,360 --> 01:07:29,920
Speaker 6: and I admired and do admire Paul Keating. Paul Keating

1352
01:07:29,960 --> 01:07:34,280
Speaker 6: had a brain like a steel trap. You know, he

1353
01:07:34,480 --> 01:07:38,360
Speaker 6: was onto everything. He was very highly, highly intelligent. Still is.

1354
01:07:38,440 --> 01:07:41,120
Speaker 6: I presume I don't see him much these days.

1355
01:07:41,400 --> 01:07:44,600
Speaker 3: I had lunch with him three or four years ago,

1356
01:07:44,920 --> 01:07:49,080
Speaker 3: and he's and we had it in a place in Bondi,

1357
01:07:49,280 --> 01:07:53,440
Speaker 3: and he's quite amazing. He pulled out a photo copy

1358
01:07:53,960 --> 01:08:00,640
Speaker 3: of a newspaper Financial Review front page, the note on

1359
01:08:00,720 --> 01:08:06,960
Speaker 3: it written in his writing, and he showed it to me.

1360
01:08:07,880 --> 01:08:09,800
Speaker 3: I don't know how he kept it. It was from

1361
01:08:09,880 --> 01:08:12,640
Speaker 3: nineteen ninety six or nineteen ninety five or something like that.

1362
01:08:12,720 --> 01:08:15,760
Speaker 3: The paper was back, and it was twenty years before

1363
01:08:15,840 --> 01:08:18,280
Speaker 3: I'd seen him. But he was able to find this

1364
01:08:18,320 --> 01:08:22,280
Speaker 3: because we're going to have lunch and on it was

1365
01:08:22,320 --> 01:08:31,920
Speaker 3: a reference to his economic policy about deregulation, and sort

1366
01:08:31,960 --> 01:08:34,360
Speaker 3: of the point he was trying to make was one

1367
01:08:34,360 --> 01:08:38,120
Speaker 3: of the reasons my business was very successful lending money

1368
01:08:38,160 --> 01:08:42,000
Speaker 3: to people to buy houses, was because of his change

1369
01:08:42,400 --> 01:08:43,559
Speaker 3: in economic policy.

1370
01:08:44,439 --> 01:08:46,800
Speaker 1: And it's true what he said was true.

1371
01:08:47,000 --> 01:08:52,880
Speaker 3: But my point is he's so smart and so intellectually

1372
01:08:53,000 --> 01:08:57,840
Speaker 3: organized that he knew how to put his hand on

1373
01:08:57,920 --> 01:09:01,960
Speaker 3: this photocopy of this front page or the Financial View

1374
01:09:02,240 --> 01:09:05,320
Speaker 3: quoting him back in nineteen ninety six.

1375
01:09:07,040 --> 01:09:09,160
Speaker 1: That's scary smart.

1376
01:09:09,479 --> 01:09:12,120
Speaker 3: Yeah, And I don't think most people give him the

1377
01:09:12,160 --> 01:09:18,479
Speaker 3: credit for being as smart or as intellectually voluminous as

1378
01:09:18,520 --> 01:09:22,600
Speaker 3: he was. And I don't think we have anybody in

1379
01:09:22,640 --> 01:09:24,759
Speaker 3: the last ten years.

1380
01:09:25,880 --> 01:09:27,519
Speaker 6: Don't underrestimate John Howard.

1381
01:09:27,760 --> 01:09:30,720
Speaker 3: No, I can't remember how far back John goes now,

1382
01:09:30,760 --> 01:09:34,760
Speaker 3: but definitely John Howard is up there, definitely, and Peter

1383
01:09:34,840 --> 01:09:38,880
Speaker 3: Costello in terms of his portfolio too. Definitely, but they're

1384
01:09:38,880 --> 01:09:42,000
Speaker 3: more too. Yeah, there were two thousand and between two

1385
01:09:42,000 --> 01:09:44,240
Speaker 3: thousand and two thousand and five, I think, yeah, maybe

1386
01:09:44,760 --> 01:09:48,240
Speaker 3: they're definitely the last twenty years Howard's been around, But

1387
01:09:48,360 --> 01:09:50,960
Speaker 3: past that, I don't know if we've really had anybody

1388
01:09:52,000 --> 01:09:52,639
Speaker 3: who had.

1389
01:09:52,439 --> 01:09:56,240
Speaker 1: That sort of I don't think we have either bandwidth.

1390
01:09:57,240 --> 01:10:02,960
Speaker 6: You know, I don't think we have either. Yeah, I'm

1391
01:10:03,000 --> 01:10:07,559
Speaker 6: trying to think of somebody. Rud No, thank you.

1392
01:10:10,360 --> 01:10:16,599
Speaker 1: Morrison No alban Albani.

1393
01:10:17,920 --> 01:10:21,400
Speaker 6: Yeah, interesting character Alberisi, very very nice man.

1394
01:10:22,160 --> 01:10:26,160
Speaker 1: Everyone says love him as a bloke. Everyone, I don't

1395
01:10:26,160 --> 01:10:26,439
Speaker 1: really know.

1396
01:10:26,560 --> 01:10:29,599
Speaker 3: Everyone tells me that he's a good person, a good bloke.

1397
01:10:32,640 --> 01:10:36,679
Speaker 3: I wonder whether or not he's got a massive machine

1398
01:10:36,680 --> 01:10:40,360
Speaker 3: behind him, though, which is trying to please everybody, because

1399
01:10:40,360 --> 01:10:42,799
Speaker 3: I mean, the Labor Party is a pretty tough environment

1400
01:10:42,840 --> 01:10:45,280
Speaker 3: to be in, especially with the unions.

1401
01:10:47,040 --> 01:10:49,040
Speaker 6: I think I think he's a pretty safe sort of

1402
01:10:49,080 --> 01:10:53,439
Speaker 6: fellow Albanese, you know, I think that he's a you

1403
01:10:53,479 --> 01:10:56,880
Speaker 6: can count on him. I don't think he vacillates a

1404
01:10:56,920 --> 01:11:01,360
Speaker 6: great deal, whereas a lot of politicians do by necessity

1405
01:11:01,600 --> 01:11:02,920
Speaker 6: because they go with the crowd.

1406
01:11:03,840 --> 01:11:07,680
Speaker 3: That's very interesting because because I wonder whether or not

1407
01:11:08,360 --> 01:11:13,559
Speaker 3: politics has become about popularist what's popular? You know, what

1408
01:11:13,760 --> 01:11:16,800
Speaker 3: is popular? And are are we just voting for what's

1409
01:11:16,840 --> 01:11:24,000
Speaker 3: popular today? Because the average voter doesn't really I don't know,

1410
01:11:24,680 --> 01:11:27,280
Speaker 3: we don't the average voter, not not older people like me,

1411
01:11:27,360 --> 01:11:29,800
Speaker 3: but the average voter, the younger voter, they just go

1412
01:11:29,880 --> 01:11:30,920
Speaker 3: with what's in it for me.

1413
01:11:30,880 --> 01:11:31,320
Speaker 1: Sort of thing.

1414
01:11:32,680 --> 01:11:35,040
Speaker 3: Do you, I mean, you're on being observer of people

1415
01:11:35,040 --> 01:11:36,920
Speaker 3: for a long long time. And what do you think

1416
01:11:36,920 --> 01:11:39,759
Speaker 3: about the average voter today and politics generally?

1417
01:11:39,800 --> 01:11:40,200
Speaker 1: I mean, do you?

1418
01:11:40,720 --> 01:11:42,599
Speaker 6: I think a lot of a lot of the average

1419
01:11:42,640 --> 01:11:45,920
Speaker 6: voters today couldn't give a fuck, you know. I think

1420
01:11:45,960 --> 01:11:51,679
Speaker 6: that they're very lais are fair about voting. It's something

1421
01:11:51,720 --> 01:11:53,240
Speaker 6: that is an accepted way of life.