Speaker 1: I get a groove as it's the You Project, It's Tiff,
Speaker 1: Tiffany and Cook, It's Robert, Joseph Capuccio, Craig Anthony Harp
Speaker 1: of the bloke in the middle of the screen. If
Speaker 1: you happen to be one of us three. If not,
Speaker 1: just trust me. Let's start with the real man on
Speaker 1: the podcast tiff Good Morning.
Speaker 2: Top of the Morning, Craig Anthony Harbor.
Speaker 1: How are you? How's how things? How's your leprosy? How's
Speaker 1: your future husband? How's your cat? How's your dog? Let's
Speaker 1: just tick all the boxes.
Speaker 2: Things are tickety boo, as one of my great friends says,
Speaker 2: tickety boo, tickety shelder, little leprosy on the shoulders. Starting
Speaker 2: to calm down today, it doesn't feel so horrific.
Speaker 1: Oh, thank goodness for that. Does that mean I don't
Speaker 1: need to train in a hazmat suit anymore? Or that
Speaker 1: you's that tif? Exactly good question, Robert.
Speaker 2: I have got a I am treating a skin cancer
Speaker 2: lesion on my shoulder with some of that horrific cream
Speaker 2: that causes chaos. So yeah, it's gross, isn't it.
Speaker 1: I think you and I spoke once about skin cancer
Speaker 1: and you said you'd never been checked, Bobby, No, I
Speaker 1: never been checked. Yeah, no, fuck it, you don't want it.
Speaker 1: I mean, whats me. Well, because you did grow up
Speaker 1: in Brooklyn, you probably had like, I don't know, snow cancer,
Speaker 1: not fucking the skin cancer.
Speaker 3: So oh no, when I was when I was younger,
Speaker 3: it's so weird because like now, like I don't go
Speaker 3: to the beach.
Speaker 1: I hate the beach.
Speaker 3: I was always out on the beach in the summertime
Speaker 3: when I when I was working out at sixteen, I
Speaker 3: couldn't keep my clothes on, so middle of summer I
Speaker 3: would be outside like.
Speaker 1: Half naked all day. I mean, I feel like the
Speaker 1: beach at Coney Island is probably a bit more dirt
Speaker 1: and grain and grit than white sands. Yeah.
Speaker 3: I mean we have syringe needles in the water, or
Speaker 3: we did, so it's pretty colorful. It's different than your
Speaker 3: typical beach. It's more exciting, a lot more things going on,
Speaker 3: you know, broken glass on the sand.
Speaker 1: You gotta watch where you're walking. I still think they
Speaker 1: still comb the foreshore in Melbourne anyway, or syringes, So
Speaker 1: I don't think that's a totally an historical thing. Not
Speaker 1: in Australia anyway. But it's definitely, thankfully definitely. How the
Speaker 1: fuck do I know? I've done zero research? So this
Speaker 1: is just my fucking hypothesis, you know, when you go
Speaker 1: it's absolutely this, and then you're like, as it's coming
Speaker 1: out of young God, you go and the fact do
Speaker 1: you know have you done any research? No? I haven't.
Speaker 1: It seems to me that's better. That's I don't know.
Speaker 1: Tif does it seem like it's less of a thing
Speaker 1: than it used to be to you?
Speaker 2: Yeah, I feel like it's not on my radar.
Speaker 1: Yeah, we get we used to get quite a bit
Speaker 1: of quite a bit of info and warning and you know,
Speaker 1: be careful if you're going to the beach, wear shoes
Speaker 1: or songs, and you know, don't don't walk in the
Speaker 1: sand in bare feet, especially in certain areas that I
Speaker 1: won't mention. But ah, dear, and you had a gig
Speaker 1: today and you said to me you'd hopefully get back
Speaker 1: at eleven thirty, which is now just after eleven thirty.
Speaker 1: So you said you're in ninety you said you're a
Speaker 1: ninety percent chance, and it looks like that's one hundred percent. Now,
Speaker 1: how did your gig go.
Speaker 3: I'm almost sure I'm going to make it to this
Speaker 3: podcast it went Okay, it wasn't. It's not like a
Speaker 3: public speaking gig. It's a group coaching gig. I facilitate
Speaker 3: with a group of para professionals and teachers.
Speaker 1: Oh cool group. I love this group. They are a
Speaker 1: lot of fun to be with. I've got an interesting
Speaker 1: group that I'm chatting to. As I said to you
Speaker 1: before off air, both you in what is now about
Speaker 1: eighty minutes from now, which is a group of people
Speaker 1: who work in the addiction space. So a whole lot
Speaker 1: of kind of counselors and facilitators and workers in that space.
Speaker 1: And yeah, I'm excited because it's only like I think
Speaker 1: it's eight people or nine people just sitting in a
Speaker 1: boardroom around the table. Where. I love that, Like it's
Speaker 1: very you know, it can almost be wherever you guys
Speaker 1: want me to go, that's where we'll go. What do
Speaker 1: you want to know? Okay, so this is kind of
Speaker 1: my area of I guess expertise. What in the context
Speaker 1: of that would you like to talk about? You know?
Speaker 1: So I like those ones where it's it's almost like
Speaker 1: a meeting and you just happen to be chairing the
Speaker 1: meeting and doing the bulk of the talking. But it's
Speaker 1: sometimes you get way more kind of achieved in small
Speaker 1: group and you do a bit of that, don't you
Speaker 1: a bit of that kind of group coaching stuff?
Speaker 3: Now, actually do quite a bit of that, you know,
Speaker 3: I don't know if it's group coaching or it's more
Speaker 3: like a conversational facilitated workshop.
Speaker 1: Yeah.
Speaker 3: I find it really rewarding because when you're dealing with
Speaker 3: people who work with individuals with addiction, or people that
Speaker 3: are in the social work domain, or any type of
Speaker 3: special needs of special populations, these are people that are
Speaker 3: beautifully compassionate people that get into work like this, but
Speaker 3: they tend to find themselves I mean, you know, there's
Speaker 3: exceptions to the rule, but they tend to find themselves
Speaker 3: overworked and under resourced. And when you work with a
Speaker 3: group like that, I think it's highly impactful. Like you
Speaker 3: have eight people in the room. You know, let's assume
Speaker 3: four couldn't care less like what you spoke about a
Speaker 3: week from now right, and two of them care but
Speaker 3: they don't have the bandwidth. And another two of those
Speaker 3: eight really go out and do something different given the
Speaker 3: population that they're working with that's going to have a
Speaker 3: long term residual effect that's quite meaningful for more people
Speaker 3: than you'll ever realize. So I'm grateful that you know
Speaker 3: we can do that type of work in that environment.
Speaker 1: I think it's also like you say, it's like you
Speaker 1: might just think in a room full of eight people
Speaker 1: or me and eight, but an audience of eight, if
Speaker 1: you really resonate with one, that's twelve and a half
Speaker 1: percent of the audience, If you really connect with two,
Speaker 1: that's twenty five percent of the audience, and so on.
Speaker 1: And then you know, I wouldn't mind if I had
Speaker 1: one hundred people in a room. If I really really
Speaker 1: connected with twenty five, that's not a terrible outcome, you know,
Speaker 1: in terms of having an impact where they go do
Speaker 1: something with that. That's what I mean by that.
Speaker 3: I always had this thing where you never know who's
Speaker 3: in the room, and I learned this so oh god.
Speaker 3: Rewinding back to two thousand and two, it was the
Speaker 3: NESM International Conference and we had about memory serves me correct,
Speaker 3: roughly about five hundred people.
Speaker 1: Just tell our audience what NASM is.
Speaker 3: Oh so a NESM is a certification company. It's one
Speaker 3: of the largest and most reputable like globally I would imagine,
Speaker 3: and we put we put together this conference.
Speaker 1: You didn't finish that certification for what? Oh I'm sorry, personally,
Speaker 1: where's my head out today? I must be talking to it.
Speaker 1: You're not talking to a fitness industry audience.
Speaker 3: Yeah, it's it's the health and it's the health and
Speaker 3: fitness space. So working I would assume, still haven't been
Speaker 3: affiliated with NSM in a while, but working with you know,
Speaker 3: fitness professionals, working with personal trainers like that group. But
Speaker 3: this conference was open to talk to leadership at multiple
Speaker 3: levels of the organization, from the c suite all the
Speaker 3: way down to the trainer. And sitting in that room
Speaker 3: was Michael Ducourt, was ian O Dwyer, was Richard Boyd.
Speaker 3: Was Peter Hood who's very sadly no longer with us.
Speaker 3: Matt Coulson, Paul Taylor, not our Poultail or a different
Speaker 3: Paul Taylor or who has shockingly similar personality traits, and
Speaker 3: also from Northern Ireland. Small world anyway, And so all
Speaker 3: these people were in this room, and that one conference
Speaker 3: created multiple deals that put us in front of thousands
Speaker 3: of people in multiple countries. So you have people in
Speaker 3: the room. But a few of those people, you don't
Speaker 3: know the influence. You don't know how you're going to
Speaker 3: inspire them. They might become speakers themselves. They might go
Speaker 3: out and do something that they never thought of doing before. Right,
Speaker 3: They may go out and become someone they never would
Speaker 3: have been before they were sitting in that audience, and
Speaker 3: they might impact tens of thousands of people.
Speaker 1: So you never know who's sitting in front of you. Well,
Speaker 1: Jesus did all right, I mean it, he started off
Speaker 1: with twelve, didn't he. He's like he bikes. Just gather around.
Speaker 1: They've got some stuff, all right, So God right, got
Speaker 1: that me s o g Son of God, lean in, Judas,
Speaker 1: you can lean back, Peter, You're going to come in
Speaker 1: real handy. And they just went, this is good. We
Speaker 1: might go tell others and bibbity bobbedy boo. So that
Speaker 1: seemed to work. That's not the worst model. Not that
Speaker 1: you or I or tif are the Messiah, but we
Speaker 1: could be Messianic in our own little kind of Do
Speaker 1: you like that words of Messianic in our own little
Speaker 1: kind of you know, tunnel?
Speaker 3: Yeah, that would be that would be a massive disaster. Yeah,
Speaker 3: he's not the Messiah. He's a very naughty boy. That
Speaker 3: is that is nothing but chaos and despair, and.
Speaker 1: I don't know, maybe a little bit hilarity along the way.
Speaker 1: One hundred. I so many times, like I have, well,
Speaker 1: I think not so many times recently because I think
Speaker 1: I'm better at it, but I will put up my
Speaker 1: hand and say by periodically been terrible at reading the room,
Speaker 1: and like both of you, I'm sure at times created
Speaker 1: you know, not chaos globally, but at least with part
Speaker 1: of the audience. But I also remember lots of times
Speaker 1: when and we've spoken about this a bit, so I
Speaker 1: won't remember, I won't mention the same specific story, but
Speaker 1: at least twenty times in my life, and this is
Speaker 1: over thousands of presentations, but at least twenty times I
Speaker 1: was sure that some person in the room hated me,
Speaker 1: because that was the vibe and the energy I was getting.
Speaker 1: They hate me. They can't wait for this to be over.
Speaker 1: They think I'm a fucking idiot or something. So I'm
Speaker 1: up there concentrating on the one, not the ninety nine,
Speaker 1: and I'm telling myself a story, and I'm just struggling
Speaker 1: through to try to not completely fuck it up. And
Speaker 1: then the one comes and tells me how much they
Speaker 1: loved me or how much they loved it, and you know,
Speaker 1: I'm like, oh god, I have no idea, like sometimes
Speaker 1: especially if someone who's doing what I'm and in research,
Speaker 1: but yeah, that it's so easy to get that. How
Speaker 1: do people see me, experience me, understand me. It's so
Speaker 1: easy to get that wrong because you just misinterpret a
Speaker 1: facial expression and you don't know they could be that
Speaker 1: could be their version of I'm really fucking concentrating, but
Speaker 1: you read it as I'm really fucking mad at you,
Speaker 1: you know, or whatever, and then you run with that
Speaker 1: and that becomes your narrative for the next thirty minutes.
Speaker 1: And by the time you finish the thing, you're scared
Speaker 1: to walk to your car because you think they're going
Speaker 1: to kill you in the car park.
Speaker 3: So you know they may that could happen. You know,
Speaker 3: it's an atlandish thought, but it very well could happen.
Speaker 1: Statistically probably not high, not high, but possible.
Speaker 3: So you know what I've been thinking about talking about,
Speaker 3: like delusion, because we're you're your own multiverseign to yourself,
Speaker 3: aren't you. You're living in multiple realities at any given point.
Speaker 1: I mean, they're not.
Speaker 3: Actual realities, but perceptually it feels pretty real. And I
Speaker 3: was thinking about the podcast you did with Chris Evans,
Speaker 3: not Captain America, the Psychology Chris Evans.
Speaker 1: And I actually got his name wrong. It is Chris,
Speaker 1: but it's not Evans. It's not Evans. It's French. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
Speaker 1: it's very different. That's very different than Evans. But anyway,
Speaker 1: he was great, wasn't he. Well, I thought he was great.
Speaker 1: I love that episode.
Speaker 3: I love that he's, you know, good mates with Richard Wiseman,
Speaker 3: who's absolutely brilliant.
Speaker 1: And something he said caught my attention. It's come up.
Speaker 3: It's kind of like what you focus on is what
Speaker 3: you notice, and it brought my attention to a healthy
Speaker 3: level of delusion. We're all delusional for better or for
Speaker 3: worse about something. And I'm not talking about delusions to
Speaker 3: the point of megalomania, which is highly destructive to yourself
Speaker 3: and others. But there is a healthy level of delusion
Speaker 3: that I think is important, not for just like life trajectory,
Speaker 3: but for your own sanity, your own mental health.
Speaker 1: Give us an example, like, when I think of delusion,
Speaker 1: I think of somebody that's just kind of fucking out
Speaker 1: of their mind or they just have a very unhealthy
Speaker 1: version of reality.
Speaker 3: Okay, So just the other night, in the middle of
Speaker 3: a rainstorm, I'm walking completely naked down the road and
Speaker 3: this corpor. Oh wait, now that's a different story. That's
Speaker 3: not the one I wanted to tell anyway. So I'm
Speaker 3: driving down the road fully closed, middle of the day,
Speaker 3: very very different already, right, stories literally night and day.
Speaker 3: And I'm listening to an audio program from one of
Speaker 3: my fam my favorite speakers at the time, and I
Speaker 3: hear them talk about the Yale Study of nineteen fifty
Speaker 3: three where in nineteen fifty three they did study where
Speaker 3: they got the entire graduating cloud of Yale University and
Speaker 3: they asked them one specific question, how many of you
Speaker 3: have clearly defined goals and written plans for their achievement?
Speaker 3: And they followed these people over a span of twenty years.
Speaker 3: Nineteen seventy three, they interviewed the surviving. You know, not
Speaker 3: a couple of people died tragic accidents, unlikely, possible, and
Speaker 3: they basically tracked them. And what they found that in
Speaker 3: nineteen fifty three, only three percent of the graduating class
Speaker 3: of Yale had clearly defined goals and written plans for
Speaker 3: their achievement, which I kind of thought, stay with me,
Speaker 3: was a little bit odd that you would go to
Speaker 3: an Ivy League school and not have a clear goal
Speaker 3: about where you're going in life. But that's what they found.
Speaker 3: And in nineteen seventy three, twenty years later, what they
Speaker 3: discovered was the three percent that had clearly defined, written
Speaker 3: goals were earning more than the other ninety seven percent combined. Yeah,
Speaker 3: and then in another audio program, I was listening to
Speaker 3: the Harvard study which pretty much did the same thing,
Speaker 3: and they had very similar findings. Now, the problem with
Speaker 3: that is neither of those studies ever took place.
Speaker 1: It's an urban legend.
Speaker 3: Yale or Harvard have no record of any of that
Speaker 3: research ever being done. And that was exposed in a
Speaker 3: Fast Company article by Lawrence Taybeck. And what's interesting about
Speaker 3: that is I didn't know that that was false, and
Speaker 3: I thought, wow, So all you really need to do
Speaker 3: is have a clearly defined goal and have detailed plans
Speaker 3: for the achievement of that goal, and being willing to
Speaker 3: work really hard and put in the effort. And it's
Speaker 3: not a matter of if, it's a matter of when.
Speaker 3: Look at these two studies, and I went from being
Speaker 3: this kid with brain damage, no real impressive educational background
Speaker 3: to achieving the top goals on my life in just
Speaker 3: a few years. And I was basing that on a delusion.
Speaker 3: It was a completely delusional belief. But like we've talked
Speaker 3: about Tiff and I manifesting, like what does it mean?
Speaker 1: Was it not mean?
Speaker 3: And say every time something would happen that would get
Speaker 3: in the way of my trajectory, I just thought, oh, well, I'm.
Speaker 1: Learning from this.
Speaker 3: I could adapt, I can learn new skills. I never
Speaker 3: for a second took it as oh, well, maybe I'm
Speaker 3: not cut out for this, because I thought, I'm amazing
Speaker 3: at this. If anybody else can do it, I can
Speaker 3: do it. And you know, this is just math. Look
Speaker 3: at the studies, complete bullshit. But that healthy dose of
Speaker 3: delusion served me really well until I was as company
Speaker 3: it is.
Speaker 1: That is a great story and a great explanation. Thank you,
Speaker 1: It really is. And it's a it's kind of a
Speaker 1: plus a boat. It's almost like a career plus a
Speaker 1: boat because you believe, if I'm taking this pill of
Speaker 1: goals and structure and process and timeline, and I keep
Speaker 1: taking this pill, then this will be the outcome.
Speaker 3: Well yeah, yeah, so and it was even because of that,
Speaker 3: I had a major setback. So this I had just
Speaker 3: been I had just left the military. And when I
Speaker 3: say left the military, I had just been asked to
Speaker 3: leave the military because of Tourette's. So and I got
Speaker 3: out and I had no job, and a friend of
Speaker 3: mine said, you know, I've got this perfect position.
Speaker 1: It pays exceedingly well.
Speaker 3: And it was this really high profile CEO, and so
Speaker 3: like I didn't have a call to drive out to
Speaker 3: this place. I spent hours on a bus getting out
Speaker 3: to this guy. Finally made it over there, sat down
Speaker 3: in the interview and he was asking me a little
Speaker 3: bit about my life goals. And I had on me
Speaker 3: my briefcase and in there I had like ten pages
Speaker 3: of written out plans. He took a look at my
Speaker 3: goals and the plans and the strategies. I looked up
Speaker 3: and he said, there's no way I'm going to hire you.
Speaker 1: This is just not the job for.
Speaker 3: You, because you are so clear on what it is
Speaker 3: you want. Nah, you shouldn't be working for anybody else
Speaker 3: right now.
Speaker 1: You should be focusing on.
Speaker 3: Making this happen, and I was like dead broke, Like
Speaker 3: I had just about enough money to get home that day,
Speaker 3: buy myself a cup of coffee. And Tuesdays were my
Speaker 3: favorite days because it was ninety nine cent whopper day,
Speaker 3: so for a dollar ninety eight I could buy two whoppers.
Speaker 3: I didn't have to eat for another twenty four hours.
Speaker 3: So I was in dire straits and losing that job
Speaker 3: for me, I was like, oh my god, this is
Speaker 3: this is perfect evidence. He said I'm doing so well
Speaker 3: with this goal setting thing, He's not even going.
Speaker 1: To hire me.
Speaker 3: And so like this epic failure somebody needed desperately inspired
Speaker 3: me somebody, and all of these failures where like nothing
Speaker 3: was going my way, I misinterpreted that evidence.
Speaker 1: I was completely on the right track. How old were
Speaker 1: you at this How old were you at this stage,
Speaker 1: very early twenties. Yeah, when you said you got kicked
Speaker 1: out of the military for having turettes, I just pickeded
Speaker 1: you walking around the yard with your with your rifle
Speaker 1: above your head gun, fucked the enemy, fucked the enemy,
Speaker 1: you know something like that. That would have been right.
Speaker 1: That's I don't know that that doesn't really.
Speaker 3: Work very well, I'm standing I'm standing at GQ in
Speaker 3: General Quarters. Everybody silent and attention, and I'm just go
Speaker 3: shitt know that, Yeah that that that kind of stuff
Speaker 3: doesn't work. That wasn't my issue in the military. It
Speaker 3: was that my rate was Corman. I was in the Navy,
Speaker 3: so Corman's kind of like a medic, and there's just
Speaker 3: so much attention to detail, Like if you put a
Speaker 3: tourniquet on somebody, you've got to write that time, like
Speaker 3: somewhere visible on their body, like their forehead, so people
Speaker 3: know when that tourniquet needs to be removed or you're
Speaker 3: going to cross somebody their limbs.
Speaker 1: It was like you are a walking liability. Really why yeah?
Speaker 1: Why why? Because with touretts you have lack of impulsivity.
Speaker 3: Obsessive compulsive disorder comes along with that very serious ADHD.
Speaker 1: Would you said lack of impulsivity, I would say you
Speaker 1: would be lack of impulse control, like increased impulsivity. Yeah. Sorry,
Speaker 1: I'm a little.
Speaker 3: Bit a little bit foggy today, but yeah, So there's
Speaker 3: a whole suite of symptoms that come with turettes that
Speaker 3: are just not ideal when you need to be like
Speaker 3: highly focused for a long period of time with extreme
Speaker 3: attention to detail, which is what was required at my rate,
Speaker 3: and like, yeah, you're you're out.
Speaker 1: So what a grid idea that you become a spiker
Speaker 1: who stands in front of audiences and needs to be
Speaker 1: calm and clear and articulate and make sense and not
Speaker 1: lose your shits and be assessed by five hundred people
Speaker 1: in a moment that doesn't seem naturally. You've seen me
Speaker 1: present to an audience before you of these things. No
Speaker 1: you no, no, no, you're very good. But you know,
Speaker 1: the funny thing with you is, and this is a compliment. Yeah,
Speaker 1: you can be scatty as fuck and then get on
Speaker 1: stage and you're the opposite. It's like you're just a bit,
Speaker 1: or you can be just a bit. You know, all
Speaker 1: the things that you are, you know, a bit distracted,
Speaker 1: a bit, a bit caught up in the moment, or
Speaker 1: a bit worried, or a bit anxious or a bit
Speaker 1: and then you get called out and you go out.
Speaker 1: And usually nearly every time I've seen you, especially the
Speaker 1: time where I flew you out and you did some
Speaker 1: work for me or work with me, I should say,
Speaker 1: at one of my weekends yeah, where you. Yeah, every
Speaker 1: time you were just you would get into flow pretty
Speaker 1: quickly and you're just in state, and everybody knew you
Speaker 1: by that. You know, there's one hundred and thirty people
Speaker 1: on the weekend, and by the end of the first
Speaker 1: night everyone knew you. By the second day, everybody was
Speaker 1: chatting to you and you were chatting everyone else. And yeah,
Speaker 1: like you just really have this capacity to turn on
Speaker 1: that switch whatever it is.
Speaker 3: Well, that environment is the perfect environment for someone with
Speaker 3: TARATS because when you are focused single mindedly on something
Speaker 3: that you were interested in, and that's combined with physicality,
Speaker 3: like exerting physical effort and like you now, it feels
Speaker 3: like you're around a marathon at the end of training day,
Speaker 3: you're putting out a lot of energy. It's the perfect
Speaker 3: environment to bring your brain online when you have TUATS.
Speaker 3: So sitting down and doing a spreadsheet is horrible. Standing
Speaker 3: on stage a lot more conducive.
Speaker 1: Yeah, one hundred percent. So Tiff, like in the you've
Speaker 1: been doing getting in front of audiences for a while,
Speaker 1: but in the last year, especially if focused, I would
Speaker 1: say almost on a professional level, your primary focus has
Speaker 1: been building that developing skills. You know, figuring out what
Speaker 1: you're going to talk about and not talk about, and
Speaker 1: building connection and rapport and brand and like what have
Speaker 1: you learned? Like what are you better at now than
Speaker 1: say three years ago, or what did you need to
Speaker 1: learn and perhaps unlearn from a perspective of connecting with
Speaker 1: an audience, whether it's three or three hundred.
Speaker 2: Maybe a different or a better view of the container
Speaker 2: of what I'm presenting my content, what and how I'm
Speaker 2: presenting content.
Speaker 1: Okay, I think, yeah.
Speaker 2: Having a better plan around that, having a better idea
Speaker 2: of how to communicate it, what to link it to,
Speaker 2: just all that, I think, Yeah, I think maybe an
Speaker 2: outside view of that of how I am experienced.
Speaker 1: Because initially I.
Speaker 2: Have been walking into rooms where I am already known,
Speaker 2: already have relationships and I know or I am speaking
Speaker 2: to a particular theme in regards to that. And then
Speaker 2: when you work more in the professional space, you're stepping
Speaker 2: out with your own content to rooms that you have
Speaker 2: not yet developed any rapport with. So I think it
Speaker 2: takes there's a lot more to be aware of.
Speaker 1: Yes, it's a lot called that. We call that a
Speaker 1: warm room and a cold room.
Speaker 2: Yeah, I just said that, wouldn't it yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1: So when I go into a warm room, I could
Speaker 1: take a dump on stage and people be like, oh, look,
Speaker 1: how well is shits? That's fucking amazing. Yes, I'll buy
Speaker 1: three books. Right of course, I'm exaggerating, And just if
Speaker 1: you're coming to a fewre event, I probably won't do that.
Speaker 1: But in it like a corporate cold audience, especially a
Speaker 1: big group like a conference where it's a bunch of
Speaker 1: businesses and you're speaking to lots of people in a
Speaker 1: big room and four people know you, or you know,
Speaker 1: like less than one percent maybe of the audience know you.
Speaker 1: Oh yeah you. It is just a completely different energy
Speaker 1: and you have to do all of this work to
Speaker 1: begin to get to the point that you have instantly
Speaker 1: with a warm audience, you know, to get that energy
Speaker 1: and that rapport and that trust and that respect. Because
Speaker 1: I'm just a six year old, you know, fucking buffhead
Speaker 1: with a shaved head on stage, and you know, it's like,
Speaker 1: I don't if I saw me walking up, I'd be like, yeah,
Speaker 1: I don't know. Let's see, let's see.
Speaker 2: What do you need to know about me in order
Speaker 2: for me to speak on this the way I want
Speaker 2: to speak about it. People are going to need to
Speaker 2: know things about me because they don't already know me.
Speaker 1: Yes, yes, yeah, that's that's so true. What about you
Speaker 1: with a cold audience, Bobby, or a warm audience? Uh yeah.
Speaker 3: Traditionally I would say it doesn't it didn't make a
Speaker 3: difference for me because you said it did not or
Speaker 3: it did did not make a difference. I didn't care,
Speaker 3: like I was just happy to be, you know, speaking
Speaker 3: in front of an audience, and a lot of times
Speaker 3: a cold audience, it's it's brand new because there's always
Speaker 3: this communication between you and the audience, even if even
Speaker 3: if the audience is not speaking, they're just sitting there silently,
Speaker 3: they're communicating and you feel it, Like you talk about
Speaker 3: that all the time now, sometimes you misread the communication
Speaker 3: like Okay, these people think I'm a complete muppet and
Speaker 3: they're just loving it. But there is communication happening there.
Speaker 3: One of the best speakers I have ever worked with
Speaker 3: is a guy in the name of You probably know
Speaker 3: this guy, Tom Plumber, Thomas Plumber and the health and
Speaker 3: Fitness industring.
Speaker 1: Yeah yeah, I don't. Yeah, I don't know him personally,
Speaker 1: but I know who he is. Yep.
Speaker 3: Like there was a rumor going around that Tom's like
Speaker 3: a vampire, Like well into his sixties, he would be
Speaker 3: up all night entertaining students, entertaining participants, Like he'd go
Speaker 3: to bed at two o'clock in the morning, he'd wake
Speaker 3: up at five am, go for a run, get on
Speaker 3: stage first thing in the morning, be on stage all day,
Speaker 3: and just mesmerize people.
Speaker 1: And he was saying once that you know.
Speaker 3: He has this belief I am the best, Like I
Speaker 3: am the best speaker in my space. Now is that delusional?
Speaker 3: I mean maybe, like how would you even determine who's
Speaker 3: the best? Like what would be what would be the
Speaker 3: method of evaluation for that?
Speaker 1: And there's always someone better for you, better than you.
Speaker 3: But he is extraordinarily good at what he does because
Speaker 3: it's that belief system that he has that allows him
Speaker 3: to bring all of himself, with no hesitation, no insecurity whatsoever,
Speaker 3: into the front room and that really connects with people.
Speaker 1: And then the irony.
Speaker 3: Is because he so holds that belief it's not about him.
Speaker 3: He's lost in himself and disappears within a few minutes.
Speaker 3: He is totally connected to that audience, and it's that
Speaker 3: belief system that's the connector and if he walks into
Speaker 3: an audience and you know, he's not creating that effect
Speaker 3: in a room. Him believing that he is the best,
Speaker 3: he's able to be resilient and adapt to that, you know.
Speaker 1: Relatively quickly.
Speaker 3: So it goes back to that what is a healthy
Speaker 3: like what do you believe about yourself?
Speaker 1: That's something that's dawning on me increasingly. That's a really
Speaker 1: interesting thing that that what you just did push so
Speaker 1: many buttons in me, good and bad. Well not good
Speaker 1: and bad. But just like if I thought in my
Speaker 1: field I was the best speaker in Australia, which, for
Speaker 1: everyone's clarity, I do not, right, I for sure would
Speaker 1: not say that. I yeah, I just think which he
Speaker 1: does it and it seems to be working for him,
Speaker 1: and that's cool. I feel like in Australia, if you
Speaker 1: went I am the best in Australia at what I do,
Speaker 1: I think more people would disrespect you than respect you
Speaker 1: and think you're a narcissist. Which I'm not saying. I'm
Speaker 1: not saying he shouldn't do that.
Speaker 3: I reason, but here's here's something that here's something that
Speaker 3: has happened to me in my journey. First of all,
Speaker 3: like Tom was sharing that with me. He doesn't get
Speaker 3: up in front of an audience say I am the best,
Speaker 3: different he is the best, or it's about him. He
Speaker 3: just understands that there is an internal priming and a
Speaker 3: belief about who you are that essentuates all of your
Speaker 3: attributes and gets all of the background noise and just
Speaker 3: and insecurities out of the way, because that's a veiled.
Speaker 3: So imagine you've got your audience in front of you,
Speaker 3: You're standing on stage, every thought that you have about you,
Speaker 3: Oh my god, do they like me? Is this audience
Speaker 3: did that joke?
Speaker 1: Land? Am I getting accepted? What are the evls like?
Speaker 3: All that shit is thickening that veil. You got to
Speaker 3: find a way to remove that veil. And I used
Speaker 3: to get up in front of audiences, and I believe
Speaker 3: that I was very, very good because I believe that
Speaker 3: nothing was coming from me, like it wasn't my talent
Speaker 3: or my ability. I felt that I was so committed
Speaker 3: and passionate about what I was doing that I was
Speaker 3: in antenna. I was just transmitting and as long as
Speaker 3: as long as that channel was open, somebody in that
Speaker 3: room was going to be profoundly impacted. Not by what
Speaker 3: I had to say, but by the environment I created
Speaker 3: and the insights that emerge from my mouth and inside
Speaker 3: the minds of the people in front of me, and
Speaker 3: then I'm very much of that mindset where I could
Speaker 3: spoil it's nothing of this is about you. You know,
Speaker 3: you're not the best, You're not this. Just get up there,
Speaker 3: do your job. You know, don't like, don't read your
Speaker 3: own headlines. And sometimes what's really weird is it decreased
Speaker 3: my connection to the audience because.
Speaker 1: I would walk out.
Speaker 3: I would be walking toward the stage thinking something along
Speaker 3: the lines of Okay, here I am, and that would
Speaker 3: remove all of that internal noise, so that the second
Speaker 3: I got on the stage, that shift went from here
Speaker 3: I am to looking at my audience and going, oh, wow,
Speaker 3: there you are. And that is where I believe you
Speaker 3: need to be. And it's about like, what do you
Speaker 3: believe about your ability? It's not it's not thinking you're
Speaker 3: better than anyone else you're or you're worth more, or
Speaker 3: what you have to say is more important. It's about
Speaker 3: what do I have to do to kind of increase
Speaker 3: this connection to where I can disappear and just completely
Speaker 3: trust the process.
Speaker 1: Yeah, uh yeah, I think I understand that, and I
Speaker 1: think I don't know that that's going to work for
Speaker 1: the average punt to though, who's trying to figure out
Speaker 1: what the fuck am I talking about? How long have
Speaker 1: I got to go? Have I covered this yet? Have
Speaker 1: I covered that? Like I think for a lot of
Speaker 1: people who are not where you are, which is at
Speaker 1: a high level that you know, just becoming an antenna
Speaker 1: or a conduit and it's not coming from me, it's
Speaker 1: coming through me and all that. I understand that because
Speaker 1: I have the same experience at times where I feel
Speaker 1: like this is happening despite me, not because of me.
Speaker 1: But I don't know that that is like you can't
Speaker 1: teach people to be that or do that because you
Speaker 1: have a lot of people getting up who lack confidence,
Speaker 1: lack skill like experience, lack stage presence, lack situational awareness.
Speaker 1: They have all of these things going on, so they're
Speaker 1: just you know, trying to figure it out in real time.
Speaker 1: And I think the like, how do we build rapport, connection, trust,
Speaker 1: deliver a good presentation, make a difference, you know, connect
Speaker 1: amazingly with the one percent or the five percent. I
Speaker 1: just think that there's so many ingredients in that recipe
Speaker 1: that what you're what you're saying is true, and also
Speaker 1: in other news it's not true for these people, perhaps
Speaker 1: you know what I'm saying.
Speaker 3: And in my mind, that's all the more reason why
Speaker 3: it's important because then their structure, there's how do you
Speaker 3: go out and research the information? How do you put
Speaker 3: it together in a framework that makes sense when.
Speaker 1: You deliver that? How do you make why how do
Speaker 1: you test.
Speaker 3: To understand whether or not you're audience isn't even getting
Speaker 3: the point? So there's all this stuff around building content,
Speaker 3: and then there's all this stuff around how you deliver content.
Speaker 1: And if you're thinking about all of these.
Speaker 3: Things when you're trying to like organize all this information
Speaker 3: in your head, you're gonna choke. It's just too much.
Speaker 3: So there's one why am I here? What am I
Speaker 3: looking to give?
Speaker 1: Right? Two? What's the objective? Like when I step on
Speaker 1: on that stage?
Speaker 2: Like?
Speaker 1: Am I here to have fun? Am I here just
Speaker 1: to shit? Think about like.
Speaker 3: Your best date you've ever had where you couldn't say
Speaker 3: the wrong thing and the two of you were really laughing.
Speaker 1: It's like, oh my god, where have you been all
Speaker 1: my life?
Speaker 3: You didn't come in there with a ten point plan
Speaker 3: like okay, this is my this is my plan and
Speaker 3: my framework for a perfect date. And you weren't antenna.
Speaker 3: It wasn't coming from you. Was it was flowing through you.
Speaker 3: Everything you have learned, every interaction you ever had, you
Speaker 3: weren't in in the way. And that's the problem. How
Speaker 3: do you get yourself out of the way is just
Speaker 3: as important as how do you develop the skill sets
Speaker 3: so that you deliver something of value. All that stuff
Speaker 3: needs to be done off the stage, and I have
Speaker 3: to bring all that stuff on the stage with you
Speaker 3: all the time.
Speaker 1: I think the juxtaposition is that, you know, on the
Speaker 1: one hand, you want to be in flow, you want
Speaker 1: to be authentic, you want to read the room, you
Speaker 1: want to kind of just go where you go. But also,
Speaker 1: you know, we're we're taught at when you know, young
Speaker 1: ish or young ish in the the kind of the
Speaker 1: space speakers are taught about structure and you know, come
Speaker 1: up with five key messages, build on this, do that,
Speaker 1: do that, you know, which is all very cognitive, right,
Speaker 1: But then when I'm at my best, I'm less cognitive,
Speaker 1: more creative. Yeah, you know, I'm more, I'm more and instinctive,
Speaker 1: but building a framework and building a process and a
Speaker 1: timeline and kind of a plan is the opposite of
Speaker 1: being in flow. It's the opposite of, you know, of creativity.
Speaker 1: So I think it's that. And again I don't think
Speaker 1: it's all about one or the other. It's that convergence
Speaker 1: of brain stuff and creative stuff left right brain. You know,
Speaker 1: it's definitely both or storytelling.
Speaker 3: I kind of feel like that both of that, the
Speaker 3: both of those domains are mutually dependent upon one another.
Speaker 3: Like I've got to go through the structuring and that
Speaker 3: framework and that process, like cognitive process of organizing a
Speaker 3: talk and practice that enough in a relatively safe, but
Speaker 3: you know, hopefully a little bit intimidating of an environment, so.
Speaker 1: I can let that shit go.
Speaker 3: Like if I want to get really good at skiing,
Speaker 3: I'm going to work with the ski instructor of ski coach.
Speaker 3: Hopefully that individual understands a lot about human biomechanics and
Speaker 3: aerodynamics and they're going to pass that information onto me.
Speaker 1: And there is a.
Speaker 3: Very specific way I need to stand and hinge my
Speaker 3: hips and all that stuff. I don't know, I'm that scared,
Speaker 3: But when I'm on that black double diamond, I hope.
Speaker 3: I'm not thinking about all that stuff because I'm going
Speaker 3: to die. I just I have to use all the
Speaker 3: stuff that I've trained for.
Speaker 1: Yeah. Yeah, Unfortunately, I've got to pull the pin because
Speaker 1: I'm going to go and talk to some people. Tiff,
Speaker 1: is there anything that you'd like to enlighten us with
Speaker 1: before we go? Any words of wisdom guidance for either Robert, myself,
Speaker 1: the listeners. I mean, no pressure, but if you could
Speaker 1: share one gem, that'd be great.
Speaker 2: There's one gym slip slop slap herbs.
Speaker 1: Okay, slip slop slap. I will remember that I'm in
Speaker 1: the car, not on a motorbike, so I should be okay, Bobby,
Speaker 1: tell people where they can find you, and by that,
Speaker 1: I'm in electronically, not physically. I'm on the corner of
Speaker 1: K streets.
Speaker 3: Yeah, anyway, don't know what I'm talking about.
Speaker 1: I'm on Instagram. Come find me on Instagram. I like Instagram. Also,
Speaker 1: you have a podcast, I do. I do think I
Speaker 1: knew that. So yeah, I've got a fucking pull teeth.
Speaker 3: I got it and it's called the Self Help bandidote
Speaker 3: and I have a website called the Self hel band
Speaker 3: todote dot com.
Speaker 1: And how ironic that you can't help yourself when I
Speaker 1: give you an opportunity to do so. At the end
Speaker 1: of the podcast, you fuck an idiot. We need most Yeah,
Speaker 1: but you're my idiot.
Speaker 3: I love you, and it's a self help antidote, so
Speaker 3: basically I'm right on target.
Speaker 1: That's it for the antithesis of helping oneself. Love you, mate, Tiffany,
Speaker 1: and cook your ace. Thank you, will see you next time. Everyone,