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Speaker 1: Welcome to Fearing Greed Q and A where we ask

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Speaker 1: and answer questions about business, investing, economics, politics and more.

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Speaker 1: I'm Suan Aylmer. US President Donald Trump recently praised the

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Speaker 1: Australian superannuation system as a good plan that's worked out

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Speaker 1: very well, saying he's looking at it very seriously. But

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Speaker 1: in the United States there's already almost sixty four trillion

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Speaker 1: US dollars in retirement savings, with about seventeen trillion of

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Speaker 1: that held in iria's or independent retirement accounts. Helping invest

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Speaker 1: that money is exactly what today's guest does. Henry Yeshida

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Speaker 1: is the CEO and co founder of US fintech Rocket Dollar,

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Speaker 1: a great supporter of this podcast. Rocket Dollar allows US

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Speaker 1: investors to purchase alternative or private investments using their retirement accounts.

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Speaker 1: It's a bit like an Australian DII or a self

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Speaker 1: managed super fund account. Remember this is all general information.

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Speaker 1: You should seek professional advice for making investment decisions.

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Speaker 2: Henry, Welcome to Fear in Greed Q and a.

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Speaker 3: Thank you very much, Jeam, thanks for having me.

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Speaker 2: Look.

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Speaker 1: First up, there's a great debate in Australia or about

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Speaker 1: what retirees should invest in. There are rules and regulations,

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Speaker 1: but broadly DIY funds or iras as you call them,

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Speaker 1: can invest in alternatives. From your viewpoint, how much freedom

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Speaker 1: should the owner of an IRA or the Australian DIY

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Speaker 1: superfund have?

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Speaker 3: It may be a little bit needs to be commensurate

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Speaker 3: with the experience level and the comfort level and the

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Speaker 3: level risk that an individual's willing to take on. But

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Speaker 3: if they're comfortable with that risk and it's their money,

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Speaker 3: I think my position, in my company's position, is that

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Speaker 3: people should be fully authorized to invest in what they

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Speaker 3: like and what they think will best suit them in retirement.

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Speaker 3: And you know, hopefully that attitude is starting to come

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Speaker 3: to pass in the United States, but it's actually very

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Speaker 3: very early, not quite as advanced as where you are.

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Speaker 3: But that's just my personal belief. People should be allowed

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Speaker 3: to invest their funds in whatever they choose to invest

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Speaker 3: in for retirement.

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Speaker 1: Okay, so iras and then alternative investments within iras. How

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Speaker 1: I mean, do most people put their money in term

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Speaker 1: deposits and bonds and equities or you know, how big

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Speaker 1: is that all the alternative investment part for iras.

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Speaker 3: The alternative investment part in the US is very very tiny. So,

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Speaker 3: as you mentioned in the introduction, there's seventeen trillion dollars

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Speaker 3: that are in individual retirement accounts. So that's when an

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Speaker 3: individual has control of the moneyes that they may have

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Speaker 3: accumulated to a large degree in a company sponsored plan

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Speaker 3: or a government sponsored plan and now they have their

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Speaker 3: own direct control. But of that seventeen trillion, even though

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Speaker 3: this industry we call it self directed IRA industry in

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Speaker 3: the United States has been around for almost fifty years,

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Speaker 3: as long as the retirement plans themselves, it still only

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Speaker 3: represents about one to one and a half to two

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Speaker 3: percent of all of the seventeen trillion in IRA, so

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Speaker 3: really only two hundred to maybe four hundred billion.

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Speaker 2: It's high end, okay.

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Speaker 1: So within that alternative investment universe, I want to start

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Speaker 1: talking private credit in Australia. I've had our regulator here

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Speaker 1: has done a very big report recently on private credit,

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Speaker 1: or on public and private markets more generally, including private

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Speaker 1: credit and whether they should be regulated.

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Speaker 2: Or not, etc.

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Speaker 1: Is it a tie that you just can't hold back

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Speaker 1: private credit? I mean, where is private credit going?

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Speaker 3: Well? I think before I answer that question, I do

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Speaker 3: want to say that I think that all investments have

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Speaker 3: some level of regulation. Now, just because something may not

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Speaker 3: be regulated as your typical listed equities market, that means

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Speaker 3: that that doesn't, by virtue, just indicate that it's not regulated.

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Speaker 3: It's just regulated in a different way or regulated to

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Speaker 3: a lesser degree because the market it self just quite

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Speaker 3: may not be that mature. But the second part your

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Speaker 3: actual question is that I recently gave some comments that no,

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Speaker 3: I don't think it's it's going to go away. I

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Speaker 3: think that it's going to continue to gain more market

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Speaker 3: share in twenty twenty six, especially here in the United States,

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Speaker 3: and the amount of market share that I expect private

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Speaker 3: credit to gain in twenty twenty six will actually be

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Speaker 3: in excess to what they've gained in the last three

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Speaker 3: to five years combined, and that's already been pretty tremendous growth.

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Speaker 3: I just think that it's here to stay. That you

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Speaker 3: have on the one side, investors who are yield starved,

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Speaker 3: and then you have individuals, institutions and projects that actually

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Speaker 3: need the funding. So when you have this sort of

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Speaker 3: win win on both sides of a marketplace, there's nowhere

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Speaker 3: to go demand, is there both sides of the party.

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Speaker 3: Both parties are interested in doing this, so this market

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Speaker 3: is going to continue to grow. And in the United States,

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Speaker 3: this market is actually still supported by a large a

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Speaker 3: lot of the large incomebent financial services institutions, so they

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Speaker 3: themselves are involved in private credit, which is another validation

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Speaker 3: point for me to think that it's just going to

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Speaker 3: continue to grow as well.

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Speaker 1: Why they because, certainly in Australia banking because often because

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Speaker 1: of regulatory action, it's just harder to lend to that

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Speaker 1: middle market. Is how a banks in the US involved

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Speaker 1: in private credit.

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Speaker 3: So the banks themselves are participating in this, so they're

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Speaker 3: choosing themselves. It's very similar in the equity side, where

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Speaker 3: companies are still working with large incumbent and financial institutions, banks,

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Speaker 3: investment banks and so forth, but they're working with them

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Speaker 3: in a different way other than just going to an

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Speaker 3: initial public offering or in this case of public bond

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Speaker 3: offering in the fixed income space for credit purposes. So

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Speaker 3: the large banks are still involved. And what's really making

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Speaker 3: this market grow is again people are able to circumvent

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Speaker 3: in the middle market banks that want to serve these institutions.

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Speaker 3: The reason why it's been going slow is not so

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Speaker 3: much because there hasn't been demanded. It's actually just kind

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Speaker 3: of hard to find the opportunities and match up let's

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Speaker 3: say an organization or an institution that's looking to get

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Speaker 3: that credit, and then a middle market bank for them

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Speaker 3: to find that institution to give the credit too. So

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Speaker 3: I would say it's a lack of velocity in identifying

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Speaker 3: the matches needed for transaction to take place, more than

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Speaker 3: probably regulatory items that slow this down.

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Speaker 1: Okay, private equity, what's your taket? Certainly here and I'm

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Speaker 1: sure it's the same in the US. A lot of

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Speaker 1: dry padder in private equity at the moment. People have

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Speaker 1: saying struggle to deploy, but struggle to find the opportunities

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Speaker 1: that they want, and also struggle to exit. In Australia

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Speaker 1: as well, what's the outlok for private equity.

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Speaker 3: Well, you know, exits people got a little bit spoiled.

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Speaker 3: So I think that you know, people had expectations that

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Speaker 3: exit opportunities would come faster than they normally would, but

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Speaker 3: you know, back to reality, these are long cycle investments.

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Speaker 3: They take time, and you're right, there is a build

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Speaker 3: up of dry powder which I think will get deployed

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Speaker 3: in twenty twenty six and beyond in the near future

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Speaker 3: because a couple of things. One, there's pressure from the

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Speaker 3: limited partners who've provided this private equity that hey, you

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Speaker 3: can't just sit on the sidelines and not deploy the

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Speaker 3: capital that we gave to you. We gave it to

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Speaker 3: here for growth purposes. You need to go find these opportunities.

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Speaker 3: And at the same time, the private equity operators and

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Speaker 3: the issuers themselves are in a position now where they're

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Speaker 3: great discounts. So like in a lot of investment markets

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Speaker 3: right now, there's opportunities in almost every asset class except

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Speaker 3: maybe publicly listed securities in the United States, to purchase

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Speaker 3: at an opportunity and at a discount to even ten twelve,

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Speaker 3: twenty twenty five months ago. Other than public equities, I

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Speaker 3: would venture to guess that almost all asset classes are

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Speaker 3: actually trading at a discount to what they might have

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Speaker 3: been two years ago.

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Speaker 2: Okay, that leads me to gold as an asset class

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Speaker 2: that has.

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Speaker 3: Okay, maybe another one that hasn't had that.

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Speaker 1: Yes, the extension of the real but you are a

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Speaker 1: belavor in gold, you still think it's got further to run.

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Speaker 3: I do, so I've given lots of comments in gold

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Speaker 3: in twenty twenty four and twenty twenty five, and have

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Speaker 3: just been kind of calling new all time highs along

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Speaker 3: the way. It's just kind of the perfect storm of

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Speaker 3: inflation that just doesn't seem to go away no matter

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Speaker 3: what we do, whether it's deploying the tried and true,

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Speaker 3: you know, rate cuts, it's just continuing to linger on.

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Speaker 3: You overlay that against just some sort of global macroeconomic

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Speaker 3: uncertainty type of scenario or conflict around the world. At

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Speaker 3: the same time, it's just pushing central banks to purchase more.

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Speaker 3: Central banks purchase more. Price gets pushed up. Individuals have

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Speaker 3: easier and broader access to go into precious metals, so

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Speaker 3: that again is pushing the price pricing pressure up, and

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Speaker 3: I think that'll continue to happen in twenty twenty six.

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Speaker 3: And I've been telling people that when you see temporary

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Speaker 3: pullbacks in the price, that's when you might look at

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Speaker 3: entry opportunities if you've never actually established a position before,

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Speaker 3: and that's usually the case with an individual investor, not

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Speaker 3: so much a central banker and institution, but any temporary

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Speaker 3: price pullback might present an opportunity as an entry point

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Speaker 3: to begin some diversification to that asset class.

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Speaker 2: Okay, real estate, and I mean location, location, location. We

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Speaker 2: love our real estate here.

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Speaker 1: A lot of DIY funds have real estate within the

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Speaker 1: funds in the US at least, though, you think that

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Speaker 1: it will be a great opportunity the next twelve months

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Speaker 1: or sir.

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Speaker 3: Well, I think that right now, and even myself, I'm

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Speaker 3: actually closing on just a single investment property next week,

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Speaker 3: in just a few days now I think about it,

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Speaker 3: so my closing date is coming up. Some allocating funds

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Speaker 3: to that. But I think that people will look back

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Speaker 3: ten years from now and look at it as the

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Speaker 3: single greatest opportunity to have entered some place in the

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Speaker 3: real estate market. It would be in twenty twenty five,

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Speaker 3: twenty twenty six, just like it was in two thousand,

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Speaker 3: two thousand and eight. So you talk to anyone in

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Speaker 3: the year twenty fifteen to twenty twenty, if they purchased

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Speaker 3: or entered in two thousand and eight to twenty ten,

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Speaker 3: they felt like it was just a great opportunity. And

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Speaker 3: I'd probably say that. You know, location, location, location used

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Speaker 3: to be the three key factors for real estate, but

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Speaker 3: I think it might be now location, location, and entry

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Speaker 3: value might be the third one.

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Speaker 1: Okay, let's bring this all together. If I'm investing in

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Speaker 1: twenty twenty six in my DII fund or an IRA

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Speaker 1: in the US, is it time to move more into

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Speaker 1: alternatives away from the whole sixty forty kind of theme

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Speaker 1: which seems to have been.

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Speaker 2: Held water for decades? Really, but is it time to

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Speaker 2: move on?

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Speaker 3: Is it has been time to move on? And this

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Speaker 3: has been a secular trend that's been happening since the

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Speaker 3: turn of the century. When I started my career in

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Speaker 3: the financial services industry, there were three times as many

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Speaker 3: publicly traded listed securities in the United States as there

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Speaker 3: are today now. Oddly enough, the package products ETFs some

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Speaker 3: mutual funds have act actually now have tripled the amount

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Speaker 3: of listings out there as there are publicly traded stocks.

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Speaker 3: And that sixty forty portfolio the forty always represented public

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Speaker 3: fixed income investments as a diversified and non correlated asset

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Speaker 3: to your public equities. Well, mathematically that has been less

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Speaker 3: and less the case over the last twenty twenty five,

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Speaker 3: twenty six years now in this century. So if you

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Speaker 3: are truly trying to achieve portfolio diversification, now whether you

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Speaker 3: have an opinion on whether alternative investments are right or wrong, dangerous, risky, unregulated,

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Speaker 3: whatever that opinion may be of your own. If you

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Speaker 3: were looking for pure diversification purposes, you have to go

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Speaker 3: somewhere where you can go into an investment that would

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Speaker 3: zag when the stock market zigs. And right now, public

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Speaker 3: fixed income has not been the case for the last

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Speaker 3: twenty five years, and that's been declining over time, and

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Speaker 3: you have to go elsewhere in the place to go.

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Speaker 3: The only place to go, probably at this point, would

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Speaker 3: be non listed private investments. So some of the asset

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Speaker 3: classes we talked about precious metals, private equity, private credit,

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Speaker 3: and just general alternative and private investments, which is what

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Speaker 3: we represent at rocket Dollar and what we allow our

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Speaker 3: customers to do.

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Speaker 2: Henry, thank you for talking to Hear and Greed.

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Speaker 3: Thank you, Thanks Sean.

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Speaker 1: As Henry Ishida, co founder of Rocket Dollar, a great

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Speaker 1: supporter of this podcast joining me from Austin, Texas. And

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Speaker 1: a reminder to seek your own advice before making investment decisions.

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Speaker 1: If you've got something you'd like to know, then send

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Speaker 1: through your question on LinkedIn, Instagram, Facebook, or at Fearinggreed

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Speaker 1: dot com dot a you. I'm Chanelmer, and this is

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Speaker 1: fear and greed, Q and DA