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Speaker 1: Tiffany Cook, Gray Yamba, It's Jumper, It's Fatty Harps over

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Speaker 1: here at Fatty Harp Central.

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Speaker 2: How are you, oh mate?

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Speaker 3: Now that I can see you wearing those earphones today,

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Speaker 3: I am so happy.

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Speaker 1: I know you're like a pig and shit over there

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Speaker 1: at Bloody TIFFs Central because I'm wearing the I'm wearing

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Speaker 1: my headphones that you told me to wear because otherwise

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Speaker 1: I get too far off Mike, and I do this

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Speaker 1: and it sounds terrible because my voice goes quiet, and

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Speaker 1: then I come back on and then you can hear me.

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Speaker 1: And you people who edit the show call me a

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Speaker 1: dickhead and other bad names, and so here I am.

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Speaker 3: Now that's a fib Tell everyone that you're phibbing.

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Speaker 1: Actually, you know the problem with this is I can't

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Speaker 1: actually hear myself in these earphones, but anyway can try.

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Speaker 1: And I don't know. Maybe I've got the other I

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Speaker 1: don't know. I'm just this is terrible. Don't have it

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Speaker 1: one two. I don't know. I can't hear me in there,

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Speaker 1: but anyway you can hear me. Yeah, I got a

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Speaker 1: fucking Climby start to you would think that this was

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Speaker 1: episode two, not episode nearly two thousand.

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Speaker 2: But we just each time getting better and better.

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Speaker 1: Are we are?

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Speaker 3: We are?

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Speaker 1: We don't Sometimes I listen. Sometimes I listen to myself,

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Speaker 1: like I'm you know, somebody will say something that they

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Speaker 1: heard something and they liked it, or they didn't like it,

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Speaker 1: or usually it's that they liked it, and I'm like, oh,

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Speaker 1: and then I have a listener, I'm like, ah, fuck,

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Speaker 1: that's terrible. I still don't. I still don't like listening

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Speaker 1: to myself. The only reason I will is just to

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Speaker 1: basically critique whether or not it as a show, or

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Speaker 1: whether or not you know, what I can do better

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Speaker 1: and what I'm doing that needs to change or more

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Speaker 1: of or less of? Do you listen to.

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Speaker 2: Any of the other day?

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Speaker 3: I noticed that, Like I hear myself all the time

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Speaker 3: on my show, on your show all the time. But

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Speaker 3: when I hear myself on a show I've done on

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Speaker 3: somebody else's show, yeah, it's like it's like watching an

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Speaker 3: Australian movie on TV and going, oh, we sound funny.

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Speaker 2: I go, oh, what a cringey voice, so.

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Speaker 3: Bogan, And it's likely I don't know why I noticed

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Speaker 3: it on other people's shows are not mine. There's like

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Speaker 3: some switch in my brain that goes, oh, this is

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Speaker 3: the guest and it's you, and she's a massive bogan.

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Speaker 2: Hmmmmmm embarrassing.

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Speaker 1: Well I don't. I don't think you sound like a bogan.

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Speaker 1: But you have a definitive Australian sounding voice, which I like,

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Speaker 1: I like, you know, I like that. But yeah, it's not.

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Speaker 1: It's funny because it's not bogany and it's not unsophisticated.

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Speaker 1: You have a pretty good vocabulary and you're pretty smart,

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Speaker 1: so it just happens that you have You know that

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Speaker 1: you have a very ozzy kind of pronunciation. Aren't you whole?

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Speaker 1: Now brown coal now brown cow? You know roberts Am. I, well,

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Speaker 1: she's not exactly. I mean she's she doesn't really. I mean,

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Speaker 1: you know Kate Middleton. Let's say that, yes, you know

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Speaker 1: Princess Kate. But then I'm no Princess Bill either, I

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Speaker 1: mean Prince Bill. Oh god, So you've been crook. What's

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Speaker 1: the update. It's as we record this, it's one thirty

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Speaker 1: six month, y obo. You've been crook. You've been projectile

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Speaker 1: spewing apparently, And might I say, I haven't seen you

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Speaker 1: for four or five days, and I'm glad because whatever

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Speaker 1: you got, I don't want it. And you were giving

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Speaker 1: me in some detail the kind of the whole visual

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Speaker 1: before on the phone.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, it was because it's been brutal.

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Speaker 3: It's been brutal, but the last two days I've got

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Speaker 3: the energy exeris violently ill physically for the first twelve

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Speaker 3: to twenty four hours and then in bed for a

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Speaker 3: couple of days. But like just the energy that it

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Speaker 3: takes from you, I guess dehydration, no food, throwing up

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Speaker 3: a bug in perhaps a bug in your system. I

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Speaker 3: couldn't believe how long it took me to yeah, not.

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Speaker 1: Feel like haka, Well we're recording this, Like I said,

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Speaker 1: Monday AVO early what when when was the main action?

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Speaker 2: What day was that Wednesday night?

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Speaker 1: Wow?

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Speaker 3: Yeah?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, wow, it has been a long time. Yeah, And

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Speaker 1: when did you how long did you feel terrible?

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Speaker 3: For so terrible? Thursday and most of Friday, tried to

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Speaker 3: kind of get some stuffable. I sat in this room

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Speaker 3: and did a podcast with you on Friday, and halfway through,

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Speaker 3: just even sitting in the heat and sitting up right,

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Speaker 3: I was like halfway point, I went, oh, we're fading

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Speaker 3: real fun.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, I know, it was funny because I was doing

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Speaker 1: it with someone else and you were producing, but I

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Speaker 1: was watching you because you went from looking pretty normal too.

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Speaker 1: She could die before the end of the.

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Speaker 3: Show, sick like that, and you think you're okay when

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Speaker 3: you're laying down. You're like, all right, well, come on,

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Speaker 3: we're not being sick anymore. We've had a big rest.

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Speaker 3: Let's hop up. And then you stand up and the

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Speaker 3: whole world moves a little bit in a woozy way,

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Speaker 3: and you go to this, Oh no, we can't.

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Speaker 1: How's the girl who's somewhat addicted to training? How's she

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Speaker 1: going without training for the best part of a week.

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Speaker 3: It actually wasn't bad because I haven't been as a

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Speaker 3: little training psychopath. Since I've been back. I've been more.

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Speaker 3: I've been strength focused, obviously, and I did a little

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Speaker 3: strength work out this morning. I did a tiny, little,

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Speaker 3: barely barely strength work out yesterday just to move the body.

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Speaker 3: But but I mean, you just have no choice when

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Speaker 3: you feel like that, you know that there's no there's

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Speaker 3: no mucking around. I'm like, I just need to rest

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Speaker 3: and have frosty fruits and drink some more water first.

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Speaker 1: Well, you can get out and do twenty thousand steps

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Speaker 1: a day, like Jumbo.

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Speaker 2: You're stepping up a storm.

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Speaker 1: I'm all over the joint. And I said, I did

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Speaker 1: a little solo one yesterday all the day. Yeah, I

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Speaker 1: think it was yesterday Sunday. It was out just amazing.

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Speaker 1: It's like, I know I've said this, so if you

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Speaker 1: listen to the episode, I apologize, but yeah, but I

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Speaker 1: mean since I just I literally tripled my walking and

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Speaker 1: it's so good. I just feel I've already done today.

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Speaker 1: It's one thirty nine now I've done about ten thousand

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Speaker 1: steps and I'll probably do close to another ten before

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Speaker 1: i go to bed. I've got a workshop tonight. I'm

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Speaker 1: doing a potty with you. Now I've got to do

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Speaker 1: some PhD. I tell you my mom is working better

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Speaker 1: my not only just kind of creativity and clarity, but

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Speaker 1: like my ability to stay present and focus. Last night

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Speaker 1: I had a meeting with Chris, my senior supervisor, brother

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Speaker 1: Christian for my PhD. That is, in case everyone's going,

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Speaker 1: what does that mean? Does he work at Dalton have advisor? No,

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Speaker 1: this is for my study, my research, and I'm going

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Speaker 1: to be honest. I sometimes in those meetings I struggled

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Speaker 1: to stay really present because it's deep and it's long,

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Speaker 1: and it's like it's it's it's not which has got

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Speaker 1: nothing to do with him or me or it's not

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Speaker 1: fun you know me, I'm like a fucking child. Is

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Speaker 1: there any way we can make a PhD? I don't know,

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Speaker 1: like a party? No? No, none, none, And it's it's so.

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Speaker 1: And I was meeting with him last night, so I've

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Speaker 1: had a bit of a revelation. I feel like I

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Speaker 1: need to go to confession. You've never been to confession,

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Speaker 1: have you?

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Speaker 3: No?

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Speaker 1: No? No? Do you know? Do you understand the concept

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Speaker 1: in Catholicism? You would have seen it where in movies? Yeah? Yeah,

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Speaker 1: people jump into a little box, So kneeling next to

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Speaker 1: a bloke in a dress that's in another little box

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Speaker 1: next to you with a little kind of I don't know,

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Speaker 1: kind of a mesh cloth thing between so you can

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Speaker 1: hear but you can't see each other, and you confess

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Speaker 1: your sins, which I did manty times growing up. Is

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Speaker 1: how weird is that? Let's just think about that. Think

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Speaker 1: about that as a so what you do you're going,

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Speaker 1: you know, but when you're a Catholic, you don't think

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Speaker 1: about it. Oh you walk in that see that little

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Speaker 1: box over there with that little Weeni door. Yeah, you

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Speaker 1: walk in little weenie door and there's a thing we know,

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Speaker 1: and it's like kind of down on the floor and

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Speaker 1: a bit of better. Didn't you kneel on that? Okay?

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Speaker 1: And then what well, then there's another bloke next door

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Speaker 1: who's sitting on a chair and you're going to tell

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Speaker 1: him all your sins are like, oh, okay, and then

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Speaker 1: what happens? Ill then he will absolve you. What does

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Speaker 1: that mean? Oh, that means he'll clear it up with God.

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Speaker 1: He'll take them off your soul and then you're good

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Speaker 1: to go. You've had you know, it's like you've had

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Speaker 1: a spiritual transplant. You goot to go no more. And

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Speaker 1: then per chance, if you get hit by a truck

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Speaker 1: when you walk out a confession, you going to heaven.

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Speaker 1: If you get hit by a truck on the way

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Speaker 1: to confession, you're fucked because you've got these sins on

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Speaker 1: your soul. Right, So I grew up in that. It's

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Speaker 1: funny when that's all you know, you don't think, oh,

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Speaker 1: this is weird, isn't it? Like is anyone else anyone else?

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Speaker 3: Just me?

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Speaker 1: Like there's a man in there in a long black

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Speaker 1: dress with a dog collar, and I'm telling him all

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Speaker 1: this shit that I've done, or thought about, or want

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Speaker 1: to do or and he's gone hmm hmm. And then

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Speaker 1: he goes, I absolve you from your sins and name

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Speaker 1: the Father's son the Holy Spirit, and then he tells

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Speaker 1: you your penance. Do you know what that is? No,

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Speaker 1: that is the prayers that you've got to say. So

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Speaker 1: he might say something like you've got to say five

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Speaker 1: our Fathers and twenty Hail Mary's. So then you've got

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Speaker 1: to go out and you've got to kneel down and

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Speaker 1: and this is basically your your punishment or your fucking

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Speaker 1: ticket to spiritual freedom for another month or two or three.

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Speaker 1: It's just when I think about it now, I'm like,

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Speaker 1: oh God, really.

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Speaker 3: What do you reckon? That does to your so many

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Speaker 3: layers of things, like your level of perceiving wrong and

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Speaker 3: right of self, of shame, of being able to do

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Speaker 3: things and just have them absolved by telling some bloke

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Speaker 3: in a little wooden box.

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Speaker 1: Yeah. Well, it's it's funny because it's like there's a

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Speaker 1: lot of stuff that feel free to tune out listeners

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Speaker 1: because I'm going to talk a little bit about religion.

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Speaker 1: But I am fascinated because of my background in the

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Speaker 1: psychology of religion more than the theology of religion, right,

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Speaker 1: So I'm fascinated with how we think about it and

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Speaker 1: how it makes us think and belief and division and

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Speaker 1: fucking chaos and war and hatred and self righteousness and

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Speaker 1: all that which happens. As I've said to you before,

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Speaker 1: there's twelve major religions. There's over four thousand minor religions.

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Speaker 1: So you know, we're talking four thousand plus religions in

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Speaker 1: the world, and for the most part, all of those

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Speaker 1: religions think they are the one true religion. And while

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Speaker 1: there might be other similar religions, you know, like even

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Speaker 1: under the banner of Christianity, which is a major religion,

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Speaker 1: they're like a bunch of different denominations or a different

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Speaker 1: versions of Christianity. And you know, like I grew up

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Speaker 1: in the Catholic Church that thought it was the one

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Speaker 1: true church, and the Church of England and Anglican and

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Speaker 1: Uniting Church and Baptist and Fundamental Christians that they were

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Speaker 1: all lost, you know, and then so too then I

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Speaker 1: went to a different church which thought, you know, and

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Speaker 1: taught and it's not. These things are not ideas or suggestions,

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Speaker 1: these are mandates. Like this is this is taught as

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Speaker 1: absolute truth. So when you grow up in an environment

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Speaker 1: that's totally familiar to you, with people that are totally familiar,

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Speaker 1: and a protocol and a culture and an energy and

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Speaker 1: a theology that you've never known anything different, Like you

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Speaker 1: don't walk out one day and go, I don't think

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Speaker 1: that's blue when you're looking at the sky, Like you

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Speaker 1: know it's blue because you know what the sky is

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Speaker 1: because someone taught you at some stage, and someone taught

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Speaker 1: you that that color is blue. Now, if you'd never

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Speaker 1: been given any information, you wouldn't know what the fuck

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Speaker 1: it was. You'd recognize it, but you wouldn't know its name.

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Speaker 1: And if you'd never heard about colors, you wouldn't know

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Speaker 1: that it was blue. But just like you know that

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Speaker 1: the sky is blue, when you are a Catholice, you

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Speaker 1: know that the priest absolves or takes away your sins

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Speaker 1: right and you never are given Nobody says, look, this

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Speaker 1: is our working kind of idea. This is the working idea.

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Speaker 1: We're not sure that it's true, but this is what

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Speaker 1: we're going with, Craig, So look, you choose for yourself.

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Speaker 1: But this is this is our current take. Nobody says that.

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Speaker 1: And so you grow up and this happens in you know,

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Speaker 1: this happens with everything. This happens with you know, different

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Speaker 1: kinds of relationships and friendship groups and vegans and carnivores

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Speaker 1: and crossfitters and endurance athletes and strength athletes and Collingwood

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Speaker 1: Football Club fans and Hawthorne for you know, and so

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Speaker 1: on and so on. It's just they're different groups of

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Speaker 1: people who believe they're the best group essentially, or they're

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Speaker 1: in the right group, as I've spoken about before, but yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's it's an interesting thing. So for me, yeah, when

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Speaker 1: and then when I started to think I'm not sure

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Speaker 1: about all this, Like if you're in a group and

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Speaker 1: you question essentially the underlying basis or principles or ideas

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Speaker 1: or philosophy or theology of the group, well you are

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Speaker 1: definitely not encouraged to question, you know. And yeah, I

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Speaker 1: just started it's like things just didn't make sense. I'm like,

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Speaker 1: I'm not even trying to be difficult or rebellious, but

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Speaker 1: like when I was young, young, it was a sin, right,

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Speaker 1: it was a sin for women to walk on the altar.

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Speaker 1: So that is the thing up the front of the church,

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Speaker 1: the altar. It was a sin in Catholicism. And then

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Speaker 1: one day I'm at church and then there's a lady

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Speaker 1: up on the altar and I'm like, Mum, I mean church.

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Speaker 1: I don't know. I was maybe eight. I go, Mom,

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Speaker 1: how come there's a lady on the altar. She goes, oh,

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Speaker 1: that's not a sin anymore. I'm like, what, Yeah, no,

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Speaker 1: the pope changed it. I'm like, what do you mean?

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Speaker 1: And I'm like, even I don't know how old I was,

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Speaker 1: but I was young. I'm thinking, well, it's either a

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Speaker 1: fucking you or it's not. Like it's a sin on Tuesday,

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Speaker 1: but it's not a sin on Wednesday? Did God sanction that? Did? Like?

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Speaker 1: Who makes these decisions? And even then I'm thinking, it

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Speaker 1: feels like people make this up as they go, you know.

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Speaker 1: And the problem even with this conversation right now is

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Speaker 1: there are people that think, you know, our listeners understandably,

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Speaker 1: just like me, they'll have a certain idea about I know,

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Speaker 1: there really is a God and the Bible really is true,

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Speaker 1: and there really is heaven and hell and judgment and

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Speaker 1: eternal damnation and heaven and you know, eternity with the

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Speaker 1: Father or there isn't that's all bullshit, or there's an Yeah,

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Speaker 1: it's kind of like that, Craig, but it's more specifically

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Speaker 1: it's like this. And so you know, when people have

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Speaker 1: their own absolute, you know, fixed idea of what is,

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Speaker 1: then you know that's where we come in for all

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Speaker 1: the bloody mayhem that we come in for, because people

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Speaker 1: are not comfortable to say, this is what I believe,

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Speaker 1: but I could be wrong, and you know that's hard.

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Speaker 1: It's like there's been many like I have been wrong

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Speaker 1: many times, and there are still things right now twenty

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Speaker 1: twenty four that I believe or I think they're true,

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Speaker 1: but I also am aware that they might not be true.

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Speaker 1: And the reason that I say that is because I've

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Speaker 1: been wrong so many times. And you have to acknowledge, like,

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Speaker 1: if you think that everything that you think is unequivocally right,

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Speaker 1: then life is going to be hard for you or

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Speaker 1: you're going to have a lot of conflict and confrontation.

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Speaker 1: And also, at the risk of sounding judge, it's extremely

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Speaker 1: arrogant and self righteous for you to think that all

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Speaker 1: of your beliefs are true and correct and absolute and

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Speaker 1: everyone in the world who doesn't think like you is wrong.

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Speaker 1: I don't know what is true, but this is what

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Speaker 1: I believe. And by the way, I could be wrong,

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Speaker 1: as I have been many times before.

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Speaker 2: Don't ever tell you that.

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Speaker 3: I worked a long time ago for a guy who

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Speaker 3: was an exclusive Brethren.

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Speaker 1: I've heard about them. That's like a pretty fundamental Christian sect.

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Speaker 3: I think. Yeah, So I worked for him. So they

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Speaker 3: and at that time they were no tech. They weren't

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Speaker 3: allowed to have TVs, mobile phones anything. I had three

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Speaker 3: mobile phones. I worked for him doing websites. He had

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Speaker 3: an IT and a website and a design company, right,

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Speaker 3: and they weren't even allowed to have mobile phones yet

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Speaker 3: he had that whole company.

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Speaker 2: That's what we did.

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Speaker 3: And sometimes they would take us out for a company lunch,

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Speaker 3: and the girls that work for him, he would say,

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Speaker 3: I need you guys to walk like three meters behind,

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Speaker 3: because if anyone from my church sees me, I'll get in.

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Speaker 2: A lot of trouble.

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Speaker 1: So he was basically living a double life.

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Speaker 3: Yeah, and then eventually I remember him one day saying, oh,

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Speaker 3: mobile phones are allowed now, mobile phones, they're not banned

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Speaker 3: in the religion anymore. Because obviously someone in the real

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Speaker 3: and decided that they they're not a sin.

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Speaker 2: I don't know. It was really interesting.

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Speaker 1: This is the thing, is like when you behave a

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Speaker 1: certain way when one group of people are looking, and

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Speaker 1: then when they're not looking, you behave a certain another way.

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Speaker 1: You know, at the very least you're not living your values,

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Speaker 1: you know, in one area in one of those groups.

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Speaker 3: You know, Yeah, who's recently found the Good Lord.

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Speaker 1: Jesus Jordan Peterson?

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Speaker 3: Oh?

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Speaker 2: Has he? Russell Brand?

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Speaker 1: Yeah? Follow him? Yeah, he's got the whole god thing.

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Speaker 1: Do you know who baptized him in a river on

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Speaker 1: his own property? Bear grills really really yeah? Wow, Yeah,

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Speaker 1: he's getting higher on the Messiah fire. Old Russell, He's

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Speaker 1: just he's just, you know, if loving the lord's wrong,

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Speaker 1: I don't want to be right, brothers and sisters. He's

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Speaker 1: he's going hard, I mean real hard, you know, I

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Speaker 1: kind of you know, whether or not somebody is a

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Speaker 1: Christian or an atheist, or a Muslim, or a Buddhist

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Speaker 1: or a Seventh Adventist or a Mormon or a scientologist

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Speaker 1: or whatever, or a fucking vegetarian. What I look at

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Speaker 1: is one, are you doing any harm to anyone else?

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Speaker 1: And if the answer is no, I'm like cool. And

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Speaker 1: then what else I look at is what is the

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Speaker 1: net result of this thing that you are now doing

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Speaker 1: that you weren't doing? Is your life better? Without condoning

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Speaker 1: or accepting or supporting or saying whether or not he's

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Speaker 1: right or wrong, I would look at him and you know,

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Speaker 1: try to I guess, observe over time whether or not

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Speaker 1: he his life and his output, and how the fuck

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Speaker 1: I would measure that I don't know. But if he

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Speaker 1: genuinely seems to be doing better things, doing better himself less,

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Speaker 1: self absorbed, less selfish, less addictive, he's talk he talks

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Speaker 1: about all this stuff all the time, then you go cool.

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Speaker 1: Well for him, that is great. You know, there's another

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Speaker 1: guy called Sam Harris. Have you heard of Sam Harris?

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Speaker 1: So Sam Harris does very well, for the most part,

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Speaker 1: very anti religion. But it's not just that he's he's

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Speaker 1: he understands that some people get a lot of benefit

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Speaker 1: from religion, but his against the fundamental We're absolutely right,

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Speaker 1: they're absolutely wrong. And you know, because the truth is,

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Speaker 1: the uncomfortable truth for religious people, including me, is that

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Speaker 1: we don't have proof of a god, you know, and

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Speaker 1: if we had absolute proof, then there would be no

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Speaker 1: need for faith, because faith is literally believing in something

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Speaker 1: for which you have no evidence. Right now, that doesn't

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Speaker 1: mean there isn't a God. It just means that we

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Speaker 1: all believe in or some of us believe in this,

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Speaker 1: this deity, this entity, this supernatural something that we can't

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Speaker 1: and there's no consensus. By the way, four thousand religions

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Speaker 1: refer to part one of the podcasts. You know, like,

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Speaker 1: there's no consensus, there's only divergence and disagreement and separation,

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Speaker 1: you know. So, But I think, I think with whatever

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Speaker 1: you know, whether or not it's strength training or Christianity,

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Speaker 1: or whether or not it's living in a fucking kibbutz

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Speaker 1: in Israel, or it's it's leaving a certain job and

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Speaker 1: working in nature, I think, what is the thing that

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Speaker 1: you were doing now that you weren't doing, and what

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Speaker 1: is the net result in terms of the quality of

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Speaker 1: your life and the quality of your physical, mental, and

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Speaker 1: emotional health and also your impact on others.

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Speaker 3: M I wonder like things like religion can become very

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Speaker 3: all encompassing, and then that's what I think can shift

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Speaker 3: your views or relationship with a lot of different things

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Speaker 3: and I think that's where it, like I noticed. I

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Speaker 3: said to my one of my clients this morning, I said,

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Speaker 3: I'm gonna have to unfollow a bunch of pages that

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Speaker 3: I've been supporting on social media because like around violence

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Speaker 3: against women and women's deaths and things, because there's been

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Speaker 3: so much of it lately, and after seeing that dude

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Speaker 3: in the flesh the other day, my internal reaction, it's

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Speaker 3: just starting to give me this cognitive bias and this kind.

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Speaker 1: Of need to explain to people that dude in the flesh.

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Speaker 2: Sorry.

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Speaker 3: So I pulled up at the lights next to the

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Speaker 3: man who was let out on bail, who was charged

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Speaker 3: with hiding Isla Belle's Isla Belle Isla Belle's body after

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Speaker 3: being murdered, and it's just it's really shifted me. And

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Speaker 3: I've noticed that, and I was just like, it's making

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Speaker 3: me angry, and it's and it's making me have reactions

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Speaker 3: to things, and it's just kind of there's this underlying

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Speaker 3: buzz there and I'm like, I'm just gonna have to

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Speaker 3: unfollow all the pages is that show me that stuff

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Speaker 3: for a little while. Not that I don't support it

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Speaker 3: or care about it, but I just like I said

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Speaker 3: with religion, it's just it's becoming a bit all encompassing

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Speaker 3: and making me, I don't know, it's interesting.

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Speaker 1: Well, and I think also, like we're not we're not

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Speaker 1: pretending that those things don't happen. Of course they happen,

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Speaker 1: and they're terrible, and you know, whatever we can do

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Speaker 1: to support women in this and to stop all the

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Speaker 1: evil bullshit. But I think there is and not just

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Speaker 1: with that, but there is a danger when you look

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Speaker 1: at the world through a certain lens all the time. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: like that's the only lens you look through as the

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Speaker 1: I don't fucking trust anyone lens and and every every

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Speaker 1: person is a potential predator and or every male and

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Speaker 1: you know, part of me understands that. But it's going

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Speaker 1: to be hard for humility to progress because you know,

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Speaker 1: it's it's and so it's it's like, it's it's dichotomy

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Speaker 1: because on the the one hand, yes, we've got to

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Speaker 1: be aware and we've got to keep pushing these messages,

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Speaker 1: but also there are you know, there are some good men. Yeah,

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Speaker 1: hopefully hopefully I'm one of them. You know, it's like

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Speaker 1: and it's it's yeah, it is as like and also

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Speaker 1: and let me just say, I think unequivocally women have

429
00:24:22,080 --> 00:24:25,000
Speaker 1: it harder than men. So there's no sympathy being sought here.

430
00:24:26,040 --> 00:24:29,359
Speaker 1: But men are still killing themselves three to one, you know,

431
00:24:29,560 --> 00:24:35,840
Speaker 1: it's seventy five percent men committing suicide. And it's like this,

432
00:24:36,880 --> 00:24:41,959
Speaker 1: it's like, yeah, but they're men. Though, It's like, well, yeah,

433
00:24:42,040 --> 00:24:46,320
Speaker 1: I get it, but who's saying that. Well, it doesn't

434
00:24:46,480 --> 00:24:51,480
Speaker 1: you know, it doesn't get much attention compared to the

435
00:24:51,600 --> 00:25:02,159
Speaker 1: attention that that and like, firstly, all all the heinous

436
00:25:02,160 --> 00:25:04,800
Speaker 1: stuff that's happening to women and girls, it needs all

437
00:25:04,840 --> 00:25:07,560
Speaker 1: their attention, and it deserves all their attention. It should,

438
00:25:08,640 --> 00:25:12,240
Speaker 1: but there's a and I could be wrong, but to me,

439
00:25:12,320 --> 00:25:14,960
Speaker 1: it seems like if you're a man and you're talking

440
00:25:14,960 --> 00:25:17,159
Speaker 1: about how hard it is to be a man, people like,

441
00:25:17,280 --> 00:25:19,320
Speaker 1: fuck off, you're a man. And by the way, you're

442
00:25:19,359 --> 00:25:21,159
Speaker 1: a white man and you're a middle aged man, so

443
00:25:21,280 --> 00:25:24,879
Speaker 1: fuck off. Like, but the truth is that men and women,

444
00:25:25,280 --> 00:25:30,080
Speaker 1: children and adults, you know, all cultures, all religions, like,

445
00:25:30,119 --> 00:25:34,000
Speaker 1: we're all humans and all people suffer. And it's not

446
00:25:34,040 --> 00:25:38,439
Speaker 1: that one is less or more important. But you know,

447
00:25:38,880 --> 00:25:44,440
Speaker 1: like I get a lot of messages from people saying,

448
00:25:45,960 --> 00:25:48,320
Speaker 1: like the Jamie steedman that we had on the other day,

449
00:25:48,480 --> 00:25:49,879
Speaker 1: and it was great chat, and we're going to get

450
00:25:49,920 --> 00:25:52,639
Speaker 1: him back and it's in a great and important conversation.

451
00:25:52,720 --> 00:25:56,720
Speaker 1: We're going to have more. But I probably get fifty

452
00:25:56,760 --> 00:26:01,040
Speaker 1: emails from people saying talk about that, do that, but

453
00:26:02,000 --> 00:26:06,480
Speaker 1: maybe not one to fifty about men. It's like, and

454
00:26:06,560 --> 00:26:09,879
Speaker 1: it isn't that men are more important at all, But

455
00:26:10,160 --> 00:26:13,040
Speaker 1: I just think we need to have conversations all round,

456
00:26:13,320 --> 00:26:18,239
Speaker 1: and we need to try to understand what's happening. You know,

457
00:26:19,240 --> 00:26:21,240
Speaker 1: can I tell you an interesting story. I haven't told

458
00:26:21,280 --> 00:26:25,840
Speaker 1: you this. No, I haven't told you this. So the

459
00:26:25,880 --> 00:26:28,640
Speaker 1: other day I was doing one of my walks right,

460
00:26:29,720 --> 00:26:33,359
Speaker 1: and to me, this is like, I don't even know

461
00:26:33,440 --> 00:26:36,240
Speaker 1: I fuck it. This is just absolutely true. So however

462
00:26:36,280 --> 00:26:38,880
Speaker 1: it comes out everyone, I'm not trying to make any

463
00:26:38,920 --> 00:26:42,119
Speaker 1: particular point, but this is just my experience. So it

464
00:26:42,200 --> 00:26:45,040
Speaker 1: was on Saturday two days ago. I was walking down

465
00:26:45,080 --> 00:26:49,240
Speaker 1: Hampton Street, so not far from where I live, and

466
00:26:49,400 --> 00:26:52,600
Speaker 1: out the front of Saint Vincent de Paul. Right, I

467
00:26:52,680 --> 00:26:55,960
Speaker 1: had my headphones on, so over your headphones, and I

468
00:26:56,280 --> 00:27:00,600
Speaker 1: s walked past and I just kind of vaguely heard commotion,

469
00:27:00,880 --> 00:27:03,879
Speaker 1: which is hard to hear with my earphones on. And

470
00:27:03,920 --> 00:27:09,320
Speaker 1: I turned around and there was like what looked to

471
00:27:09,359 --> 00:27:15,040
Speaker 1: be like a sixtysh year old lady wrestling with what

472
00:27:15,160 --> 00:27:23,520
Speaker 1: looked like a thirty year old young man twenty five

473
00:27:23,680 --> 00:27:29,439
Speaker 1: or something like, skinny dude, glasses. Not the kind of

474
00:27:29,440 --> 00:27:32,280
Speaker 1: guy that is going to be looking for a fight.

475
00:27:32,400 --> 00:27:36,200
Speaker 1: I wouldn't think, right anyway, I'm looking and then she's

476
00:27:36,359 --> 00:27:40,240
Speaker 1: screaming and he's like no, and then just I didn't

477
00:27:40,280 --> 00:27:42,720
Speaker 1: know what was going on. And there's a cafe right there,

478
00:27:43,680 --> 00:27:47,040
Speaker 1: and then this lady's over the face having a sandwich.

479
00:27:47,040 --> 00:27:49,000
Speaker 1: She's got sandwich coming out of her mouth, and she

480
00:27:49,160 --> 00:27:53,639
Speaker 1: starts screaming at the guy to stop attacking her and

481
00:27:53,680 --> 00:27:55,879
Speaker 1: all this, and then all these people are screaming at

482
00:27:55,920 --> 00:27:59,359
Speaker 1: this dude. And anyway, what happened was there was a

483
00:27:59,400 --> 00:28:03,720
Speaker 1: really expense handbag in the Saint Vincent de Paul, which

484
00:28:03,760 --> 00:28:06,760
Speaker 1: was worth apparently thousands of dollars. It's like a designer

485
00:28:06,760 --> 00:28:10,440
Speaker 1: bag that somebody must have. Anyway, this lady stole it.

486
00:28:11,760 --> 00:28:15,119
Speaker 1: So this lady stole the handbag, and the dude was

487
00:28:15,160 --> 00:28:20,720
Speaker 1: stopping the thief, right, So she was stealing this handbag

488
00:28:21,080 --> 00:28:24,680
Speaker 1: and one of the shop assistants, a lady, asked him

489
00:28:24,720 --> 00:28:28,920
Speaker 1: to stop her, to stop her stealing, so he followed

490
00:28:28,920 --> 00:28:31,880
Speaker 1: her out and grabbed the bag. Now, all everybody did

491
00:28:32,000 --> 00:28:34,399
Speaker 1: was they wanted to beat up the dude. And I'm like,

492
00:28:36,440 --> 00:28:38,959
Speaker 1: she was a thief. He was trying to stop a thief,

493
00:28:39,040 --> 00:28:43,040
Speaker 1: but because he was a guy, everybody wanted to punch him.

494
00:28:43,600 --> 00:28:45,440
Speaker 1: And I'm like, hang on, hang on, hang on, what's

495
00:28:45,480 --> 00:28:48,040
Speaker 1: going on? Hang on? And then just as I kind

496
00:28:48,040 --> 00:28:49,920
Speaker 1: of I didn't do anything, by the way, I didn't

497
00:28:49,920 --> 00:28:52,960
Speaker 1: fix save anyone, but as I moved in, and then

498
00:28:53,040 --> 00:28:57,000
Speaker 1: she just bolted, and I'm like, you don't always know

499
00:28:57,120 --> 00:29:01,360
Speaker 1: the story, you know, It's like this poor little dude,

500
00:29:01,480 --> 00:29:04,840
Speaker 1: he was borderline having a breakdown, and there's no way

501
00:29:04,880 --> 00:29:07,880
Speaker 1: he would have intervened. And then this lady, fortunately, the

502
00:29:07,960 --> 00:29:10,760
Speaker 1: lady in the store who asked him, she came out

503
00:29:10,800 --> 00:29:12,760
Speaker 1: and said thank you, you're a hero, and gave him

504
00:29:12,760 --> 00:29:16,000
Speaker 1: a hug, and it was all good. But I'm like, yeah,

505
00:29:16,080 --> 00:29:20,640
Speaker 1: because at the just initially like everybody was just ready

506
00:29:20,640 --> 00:29:23,720
Speaker 1: to take this dude to the ground, but it was

507
00:29:23,760 --> 00:29:26,640
Speaker 1: actually what everyone thought was going on wasn't going on.

508
00:29:26,760 --> 00:29:29,760
Speaker 1: So you know, and of course I'm always going to

509
00:29:29,760 --> 00:29:33,040
Speaker 1: default to protecting the woman, of course, of course. And

510
00:29:33,120 --> 00:29:35,160
Speaker 1: I was ready to fucking grab him by the hair

511
00:29:35,200 --> 00:29:37,479
Speaker 1: and pull him to the ground and then but I

512
00:29:37,520 --> 00:29:41,320
Speaker 1: didn't actually know what was going on. Yeah, and then

513
00:29:41,520 --> 00:29:45,920
Speaker 1: I went ah, oh, so yeah, anyway, that was my Saturday,

514
00:29:46,520 --> 00:29:46,880
Speaker 1: as my.

515
00:29:46,920 --> 00:29:48,760
Speaker 2: Saturday, watch a Saturday.

516
00:29:49,120 --> 00:29:52,400
Speaker 1: I know, I know, it's fucking busy. I've had a

517
00:29:52,400 --> 00:29:55,160
Speaker 1: couple of I've I know, we've got about five minutes ago.

518
00:29:55,400 --> 00:29:58,720
Speaker 1: I've had an interesting I had a meeting last night

519
00:29:58,760 --> 00:30:03,640
Speaker 1: with my told you, with my supervisor, Christian, and I've

520
00:30:03,680 --> 00:30:06,760
Speaker 1: got about six months to go. You know, Christian trained

521
00:30:06,800 --> 00:30:11,240
Speaker 1: at the gym. I've got about six months to go. Now.

522
00:30:11,520 --> 00:30:16,040
Speaker 1: It's fair to say everyone, I haven't been breaking any

523
00:30:16,200 --> 00:30:25,520
Speaker 1: academic records. It's like if my PhD is everest. I'm

524
00:30:25,520 --> 00:30:32,320
Speaker 1: about one hundred meters above base camp. And while i

525
00:30:32,400 --> 00:30:35,560
Speaker 1: have made progress, I mean, I've look in my defense,

526
00:30:35,640 --> 00:30:38,560
Speaker 1: your honor, I've all the research that I had to do,

527
00:30:38,640 --> 00:30:41,480
Speaker 1: the studies I had to conduct, I've conducted them. You

528
00:30:41,600 --> 00:30:44,680
Speaker 1: have to pass for academic milestones. I've passed all them

529
00:30:44,720 --> 00:30:47,960
Speaker 1: in front of a board. But I'm on the home straight.

530
00:30:48,000 --> 00:30:50,400
Speaker 1: In that I need to be writing up everything. I

531
00:30:50,480 --> 00:30:53,200
Speaker 1: need to be writing a systematic literature view, a couple

532
00:30:53,280 --> 00:30:57,040
Speaker 1: of empirical papers. That just means a research paper that

533
00:30:57,120 --> 00:31:00,920
Speaker 1: you write explaining and dissecting the research that you did,

534
00:31:01,320 --> 00:31:03,800
Speaker 1: so two of them, and then a thesis, which is

535
00:31:03,840 --> 00:31:08,120
Speaker 1: basically the story of my entire PhD journey. Let's just

536
00:31:08,320 --> 00:31:13,200
Speaker 1: stay tiff. Based on where I'm at, I've probably got

537
00:31:13,360 --> 00:31:17,280
Speaker 1: a good twelve to eight month's work left and it's

538
00:31:17,280 --> 00:31:19,640
Speaker 1: all got to be handed in in six months. So

539
00:31:19,760 --> 00:31:25,360
Speaker 1: let's also say that Christian kind of in the nicest

540
00:31:25,400 --> 00:31:30,760
Speaker 1: way possible when get your shit together, like get your

541
00:31:30,760 --> 00:31:34,600
Speaker 1: shit together? And he's literally said to me, how many

542
00:31:34,680 --> 00:31:39,520
Speaker 1: hours every day can you commit to your PhD? Like

543
00:31:39,560 --> 00:31:43,320
Speaker 1: how many days? And it's like pretty much, you said

544
00:31:43,320 --> 00:31:45,840
Speaker 1: to me, you need to be doing four to six hours,

545
00:31:45,880 --> 00:31:48,760
Speaker 1: seven days a week for the next six months. And

546
00:31:48,800 --> 00:31:52,400
Speaker 1: I'm like, I know, I know, So today was I mean,

547
00:31:52,440 --> 00:31:55,240
Speaker 1: I've been working. It's just and it's no excuse. But

548
00:31:55,440 --> 00:31:58,760
Speaker 1: the problem is me. But I do work full time,

549
00:31:58,760 --> 00:32:00,720
Speaker 1: and I do do seven podcast a week, and I

550
00:32:00,760 --> 00:32:03,960
Speaker 1: do fly around Australia, and I have probably bitten off

551
00:32:03,960 --> 00:32:06,320
Speaker 1: more than I can chew a little bit, but nonetheless,

552
00:32:06,760 --> 00:32:10,160
Speaker 1: so I got reprimanded by in a nice way but

553
00:32:10,280 --> 00:32:13,800
Speaker 1: totally deserving. Right, I am one hundred percent the fault

554
00:32:14,400 --> 00:32:18,680
Speaker 1: at the problem and then the other night or the

555
00:32:18,720 --> 00:32:22,760
Speaker 1: other day. This is confession, right, So we're back to

556
00:32:22,920 --> 00:32:26,160
Speaker 1: part two of the episode confession, so it comes to

557
00:32:26,200 --> 00:32:31,360
Speaker 1: the full circle. I don't even yeah, I just want

558
00:32:31,400 --> 00:32:34,000
Speaker 1: to share this because I've felt bad for two days,

559
00:32:34,720 --> 00:32:40,640
Speaker 1: fucking terrible, right, So I'll tell you who af faired,

560
00:32:40,680 --> 00:32:42,800
Speaker 1: but I'm not going to on air. So I am.

561
00:32:43,800 --> 00:32:46,800
Speaker 1: I was chatting with some friends of mine, a couple,

562
00:32:47,960 --> 00:32:52,280
Speaker 1: and I said something that was It was said in jest,

563
00:32:53,280 --> 00:32:58,040
Speaker 1: but it was me. Remember I told you when I

564
00:32:58,080 --> 00:33:01,080
Speaker 1: was young, I had this sole wise dude in my

565
00:33:01,120 --> 00:33:02,720
Speaker 1: life said to me, you know, you need to be

566
00:33:02,800 --> 00:33:05,120
Speaker 1: careful with your mouth because you can build.

567
00:33:04,920 --> 00:33:07,000
Speaker 2: People up or tear them down.

568
00:33:07,120 --> 00:33:09,280
Speaker 1: Yeah, tear them down. And I'm like, yeah, I know,

569
00:33:09,600 --> 00:33:15,200
Speaker 1: and and I and I spend my life trying to

570
00:33:15,320 --> 00:33:17,680
Speaker 1: encourage and support people and build them up, and I

571
00:33:17,760 --> 00:33:21,840
Speaker 1: feel like that's my mission. But sometimes like a little

572
00:33:21,920 --> 00:33:24,920
Speaker 1: door opens and I'll be a smartass or I'll crack

573
00:33:24,960 --> 00:33:28,160
Speaker 1: it whatever that in hindsight, right, So I did that.

574
00:33:28,320 --> 00:33:33,560
Speaker 1: I said something and one hundred percent my bad wasn't

575
00:33:33,600 --> 00:33:36,640
Speaker 1: meant to be hurtful, wasn't meant to be, but looking

576
00:33:36,680 --> 00:33:43,680
Speaker 1: back now, it was, it was, and I felt bad

577
00:33:43,840 --> 00:33:47,520
Speaker 1: to it. I apologized, and I even I've sent two

578
00:33:47,560 --> 00:33:52,600
Speaker 1: messages apologizing and also apologized in the moment like seventeen

579
00:33:52,640 --> 00:33:54,960
Speaker 1: seconds later. But you know when you're just like, I'm

580
00:33:55,000 --> 00:33:58,440
Speaker 1: one hundred percent at fault. I fucked up. I've been

581
00:33:58,520 --> 00:34:02,400
Speaker 1: hating myself for two days because I'm like, I'm the

582
00:34:02,440 --> 00:34:05,400
Speaker 1: guy who tells you how to be aware of how

583
00:34:05,440 --> 00:34:10,280
Speaker 1: you're coming across, Like that's literally your fucking PhD, you idiot.

584
00:34:11,440 --> 00:34:14,919
Speaker 1: And I just said something that, when in my head

585
00:34:14,920 --> 00:34:17,360
Speaker 1: and coming out of my mouth, was meant to be

586
00:34:19,480 --> 00:34:21,520
Speaker 1: like a bit of the equivalent of a verbal punch

587
00:34:21,560 --> 00:34:24,960
Speaker 1: on the shoulder, you know whatever. But it wasn't. It wasn't,

588
00:34:25,040 --> 00:34:28,359
Speaker 1: and there was yeah, And once it's done, you can't

589
00:34:28,440 --> 00:34:34,040
Speaker 1: undo it. And so that's my little confession. I feel

590
00:34:34,080 --> 00:34:37,080
Speaker 1: fucking terrible. Anyway. All I can do to fix it

591
00:34:37,120 --> 00:34:40,560
Speaker 1: I've done. I've sent multiple messages. I apologized.

592
00:34:42,320 --> 00:34:46,520
Speaker 3: Human God, if there's one thing that I say, it

593
00:34:46,640 --> 00:34:51,400
Speaker 3: is people in my life can can make any mistake

594
00:34:52,239 --> 00:34:56,680
Speaker 3: as long as they own up to it and fix

595
00:34:56,719 --> 00:35:01,520
Speaker 3: it and be honest. But I can't tolerate stuff behind

596
00:35:01,719 --> 00:35:04,279
Speaker 3: you know, behind your back, or being said or or

597
00:35:04,320 --> 00:35:08,120
Speaker 3: you know, like untruths, and so I think completely forgivable,

598
00:35:08,200 --> 00:35:12,600
Speaker 3: especially see seventeen seconds lady. I went, oh, that's I knew.

599
00:35:13,440 --> 00:35:17,080
Speaker 1: I knew, and then I saw that, so it's a couple.

600
00:35:17,120 --> 00:35:19,759
Speaker 1: I saw the look on her face and I went, oh,

601
00:35:20,040 --> 00:35:25,080
Speaker 1: that did not that wasn't and it wasn't. It wasn't like, oh,

602
00:35:25,200 --> 00:35:28,319
Speaker 1: she just took it the wrong way. Oh you know,

603
00:35:28,400 --> 00:35:30,120
Speaker 1: it wasn't that. It was me. It was all me,

604
00:35:30,239 --> 00:35:31,520
Speaker 1: and I totally own it.

605
00:35:32,160 --> 00:35:33,960
Speaker 3: Got on you for owning up and got on you

606
00:35:34,040 --> 00:35:35,720
Speaker 3: for Yeah, I think.

607
00:35:35,560 --> 00:35:37,799
Speaker 2: That take could be, but it still does.

608
00:35:37,840 --> 00:35:42,120
Speaker 3: To deflect, it's really easy to deflect and go they're precious.

609
00:35:42,160 --> 00:35:45,280
Speaker 3: It's easy to say that than to say I shouldn't

610
00:35:45,280 --> 00:35:46,120
Speaker 3: have done that and I'm.

611
00:35:46,080 --> 00:35:49,560
Speaker 1: Sorry, Yeah that look I know, I mean, but I

612
00:35:50,880 --> 00:35:52,480
Speaker 1: hope I do that all the time, like when I

613
00:35:52,520 --> 00:35:55,360
Speaker 1: fuck up, which is less these days than I used to,

614
00:35:55,440 --> 00:35:59,000
Speaker 1: but I still fuck up. And I you know, I

615
00:35:59,040 --> 00:36:03,440
Speaker 1: think that that part of the you know, part of

616
00:36:03,440 --> 00:36:06,879
Speaker 1: what we're about which is personal and professional development and

617
00:36:07,239 --> 00:36:10,840
Speaker 1: you know whatever, it is the human experience. If you

618
00:36:10,880 --> 00:36:12,880
Speaker 1: don't ever fuck up, or you don't ever own up

619
00:36:12,880 --> 00:36:15,279
Speaker 1: to fucking up, then you probably fuck up a lot,

620
00:36:16,080 --> 00:36:21,799
Speaker 1: you know, and you probably deluded. But I feel bad

621
00:36:21,800 --> 00:36:23,480
Speaker 1: that I did it, But I feel more bad that

622
00:36:23,520 --> 00:36:27,520
Speaker 1: I hurt her. I fucking hate hurting people, and I did.

623
00:36:27,600 --> 00:36:30,759
Speaker 1: I heard her, I heard her feelings, and yeah, I

624
00:36:30,920 --> 00:36:33,640
Speaker 1: fuck if I could take back that moment in time,

625
00:36:34,080 --> 00:36:37,960
Speaker 1: which I can't. But anyway, so that's me off to

626
00:36:38,040 --> 00:36:40,520
Speaker 1: the rumor mirrors for a fucking look at myself again.

627
00:36:41,320 --> 00:36:45,640
Speaker 3: I'd give you your penance, but I don't know any

628
00:36:46,000 --> 00:36:47,400
Speaker 3: nursery rhymes or something.

629
00:36:49,320 --> 00:36:50,879
Speaker 1: All right, and what's on for you? For the rest

630
00:36:50,920 --> 00:36:52,040
Speaker 1: of day, I put.

631
00:36:51,960 --> 00:36:54,360
Speaker 3: A knuckle down and catch up on all this lost time.

632
00:36:54,440 --> 00:36:56,959
Speaker 3: I've just got to do some planning and editing and.

633
00:36:57,920 --> 00:36:58,840
Speaker 2: Grown up staff.

634
00:37:00,480 --> 00:37:03,480
Speaker 1: Well goodye gum drops, all right, Well thanks for listening,

635
00:37:04,160 --> 00:37:04,880
Speaker 1: Father tiff.

636
00:37:07,400 --> 00:37:08,359
Speaker 2: It's my pleasure son.

637
00:37:09,680 --> 00:37:12,040
Speaker 1: Say three Hail Marys and funk off your little sinner,

638
00:37:12,520 --> 00:37:20,080
Speaker 1: your little sinner, dirty little sinner. Oh it's so funny

639
00:37:20,120 --> 00:37:23,319
Speaker 1: now when I think back, literally it doesn't matter. I

640
00:37:23,360 --> 00:37:25,719
Speaker 1: can't say I can't. I'm going to get in trouble again.

641
00:37:26,200 --> 00:37:28,960
Speaker 1: Fucking hell, I'm gonna have to get I'm gonna have

642
00:37:28,960 --> 00:37:33,239
Speaker 1: to filter myself more. I'll tell you, I'll tell you

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00:37:33,280 --> 00:37:36,439
Speaker 1: our air. We're probably losing bloddy listeners that are rapid

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00:37:36,520 --> 00:37:37,320
Speaker 1: rad as we speak.

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00:37:38,120 --> 00:37:40,640
Speaker 2: Thanks TIV, Thanks Harps, Thanks everyone,