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Speaker 1: Appoche Production. Welcome to another episode of Brave Always, the

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Speaker 1: CEO series. This series, we launch into the new world

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Speaker 1: of brave leadership.

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Speaker 2: Happy people create happy businesses.

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Speaker 1: True emotionally intelligent leadership.

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Speaker 2: I've picked up vomit once on our about our fourth

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Speaker 2: flight and everybody thought, well, if it's good enough for him,

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Speaker 2: I can do it Now.

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Speaker 1: We will be joined by culture and leadership experts and

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Speaker 1: some superstar CEOs who will courageously tell us the truth

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Speaker 1: behind their brave leadership journeys. Welcome to another episode of

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Speaker 1: Brave Always. Today, I am thrilled to be joined by

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Speaker 1: the CEO of the Australian Grand Prix Corporation, Travis Alt.

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Speaker 1: Travis has had nearly thirty years at the helm of

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Speaker 1: some of Australia's largest sporting institutions during some of the

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Speaker 1: most turbulent times, a sporting fanatic and a hugely well

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Speaker 1: respected leader for his authenticity and energy. I am pretty

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Speaker 1: pumped to have you on here today, so welcome Travis.

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Speaker 2: Thanks for having memro. I'm looking forward to it.

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Speaker 1: Travis. In my experience interviewing people of your professional calub

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Speaker 1: there's this lovely little link which often is like humble beginnings.

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Speaker 1: I don't know. That's what I've experienced, that sort of

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Speaker 1: shakes how they ended up leading later in life. Now

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Speaker 1: I know you were born in Tatura, Victoria, small rural town.

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Speaker 1: I think it's like less than five thousand people. When

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Speaker 1: I googled what's Tatura famous for a little pub appeared.

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Speaker 1: I'm assuming it's more than that. Is it? This famous

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Speaker 1: little pub is there?

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Speaker 2: It's got three pubs. It's had three thousand, six hundred

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Speaker 2: people for as long as I'm sort of know, which

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Speaker 2: means I don't count very often. They're very humble beginning.

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Speaker 2: It's very fortunate. But I grew up in a small town,

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Speaker 2: was raised. You know, they say it takes a village.

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Speaker 2: I was raised by the Tatura community, very grounded upbringing,

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Speaker 2: very fortunate. I never sort of missed any opportunities or

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Speaker 2: without anything. But my parents are still into Tura. Yeah

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Speaker 2: I get back there. Yeah. It was a very sporting,

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Speaker 2: very outdoor upbringing, and there's a lot of that still

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Speaker 2: in May now. It's particularly in my leadership.

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Speaker 1: Did you always envisage leaving like? Was it I'm never

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Speaker 1: going to stay here?

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Speaker 2: Like?

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Speaker 1: Did you have grand plans quite young to say I

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Speaker 1: want to get out of here and get to the

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Speaker 1: big smoke.

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Speaker 2: Maybe, I mean I my definition of the big smoke

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Speaker 2: when I was into Tura was some smaller than Melbourne.

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Speaker 2: No one felt really big when I was a child,

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Speaker 2: and so I actually went to university in Bendigo. Three

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Speaker 2: thousand people to a sixty or seventy thousand people was

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Speaker 2: a much more palatable step than going straight to Melbourne.

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Speaker 2: And so I went to the University at Latrobe in

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Speaker 2: Bendigo allowed me to come back on weekends and play sport,

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Speaker 2: and it was nice stepping stone for them. What was

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Speaker 2: the big smoke some years after that?

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Speaker 1: Yeah, right, I mean I feel for me in particular.

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Speaker 1: Always having a strong male role model when you're younger

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Speaker 1: is a big part of helping people shape how they

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Speaker 1: grow up. Who was yours? Was that your dad? Was

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Speaker 1: it somebody else in the community. What did they teach you?

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Speaker 2: Certainly my father to some degree, he taught me a

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Speaker 2: lot about hard work, hard work and being relationship focused.

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Speaker 2: I've got an older brother three years older than me.

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Speaker 2: He probably paved the way for me and I still

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Speaker 2: talked very regularly and look up to him and what

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Speaker 2: he does in his career, and so probably him, as

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Speaker 2: much as anyone, is sort of the person that's shaped

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Speaker 2: me very early on. You always want to be like

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Speaker 2: your older brother, and I tookaly wanted to be that,

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Speaker 2: but also that the local football club, local cricket club.

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Speaker 2: As I was sort of coming through the ranks, you'd

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Speaker 2: always have people go to take you under their arm.

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Speaker 2: And developed a lot of friendships and great memories through

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Speaker 2: playing football. But I was never going to create a

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Speaker 2: career through playing sport right And in fact, I never

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Speaker 2: really had ambitions of working in sport. It just wasn't

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Speaker 2: a natural pathway that was in front of me. I

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Speaker 2: saw of fell into it, which I'm sure we'll get to.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, yeah, well, I was going to say, and then

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Speaker 1: you decided to become an accountant. I actually find it

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Speaker 1: really funny. There's so many CEOs of interview who always

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Speaker 1: sat as accountants, and so I'm trying to figure out

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Speaker 1: is that like you just had a passion for numbers,

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Speaker 1: or is this like some long term strategy that you

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Speaker 1: know you're going to end it at the top and

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Speaker 1: you need to start off as an accountant.

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Speaker 2: I think it's the thing you do when you don't

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Speaker 2: know what you want to do is that it was

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Speaker 2: for me. I didn't really know what I wanted to

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Speaker 2: do post doing Year twelve or post university. So I

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Speaker 2: thought having a really good grounding in finance was going

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Speaker 2: to be important and it would open up more opportunities.

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Speaker 2: And then I knew were available at the time, and

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Speaker 2: so I went off and did a Bachelor of Business

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Speaker 2: at the Trophy Bendigo and it's always been a good grounding.

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Speaker 2: I went and worked in a chartered accounting firm. That

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Speaker 2: was my first opportunity. I was there for three or

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Speaker 2: four years and you love it, I did. I love it.

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Speaker 2: I think it was a really good background. I worked

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Speaker 2: in audit and so the beauty of or it was,

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Speaker 2: yes fully faces a bit. The beauty of order for

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Speaker 2: me was that you get exposed a whole lot of

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Speaker 2: different businesses and so you work on different things all

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Speaker 2: the time. And that's how I got my first role

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Speaker 2: at the Essiden football Club. I was their author. Yeah,

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Speaker 2: so I was really fortunate. I worked from the large

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Speaker 2: charter of the canning firms in Melbourne. I've got sent

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Speaker 2: to London for a while to their sister firm for

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Speaker 2: someone from Tatura that was a big move and it

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Speaker 2: was a great experience. Came back and you got approached

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Speaker 2: to join the Essendon Football Club and so I thought

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Speaker 2: why not? And that's how I ended up in sport.

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Speaker 2: So when people say, hey, did you get in sport?

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Speaker 2: Tell me the pathway to get in the sport. I'm

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Speaker 2: not the person to talk to you in terms of

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Speaker 2: how I got into sport. I sort of fell into

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Speaker 2: it and there have been there ever since.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, right, okay, there you go. You did play a

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Speaker 1: number of key roles during your tenure at the NFL.

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Speaker 1: From COO I think it was an incident as well,

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Speaker 1: and then obviously the inaugural CEO at the Gold Coast

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Speaker 1: Suns to CFO and GM at d AFL. So now

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Speaker 1: that you've left the world of football, looking back, what

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Speaker 1: did it teach you about great leadership?

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Speaker 2: Lots? I think sport is a wonderful environment to learn

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Speaker 2: about leadership, learn about team, learn about social license, about

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Speaker 2: the role that you play that exists beyond what you

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Speaker 2: directly think your day to day job is. And so

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Speaker 2: if you think about from a working in clubs is

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Speaker 2: quite different than working at the AFL. From a helper perspective,

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Speaker 2: working at both clubs taught me a lot, probably maybe

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Speaker 2: in some cases different things because of my role. My

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Speaker 2: first sort of foray into AFL was Esthmate Football Club,

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Speaker 2: very successful, big club. You get to see athletes coming

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Speaker 2: together as a team and achieving incredible things and some

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Speaker 2: of the things that sit within that leadership. We had

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Speaker 2: Kevin Sheedy as our coach for twenty five years, incredibly

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Speaker 2: successful coach, and I learned a whole lot from how

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Speaker 2: he went about leading the team. It's the best example

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Speaker 2: you'll get a high performance, high performance environment. These guys

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Speaker 2: are trying to get better every day, they're getting marked publicly,

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Speaker 2: there's a big spotlight on them. So from an understanding

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Speaker 2: how teamwork works, the importance of culture, that was really important.

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Speaker 2: So my transition was I was at the Essenmon Football

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Speaker 2: Club for eleven years. I had been approached to be

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Speaker 2: a successor to the CEO, Peter Jackson, who's been there

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Speaker 2: for some time. I thought, given that I'd sort of

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Speaker 2: fallen into the role that I was in, that I

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Speaker 2: should probably go through a process somewhere to hone my

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Speaker 2: interview skills. The role came up to be the CEO

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Speaker 2: of the Gold Coast Suns, and I thought, I'll jump

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Speaker 2: into that process. It would just be good experience for me.

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Speaker 2: I had no really intention of moving too Queensland, but

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Speaker 2: I thought, it'll just make me think a little bit

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Speaker 2: about who I am, I'm good at when I need

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Speaker 2: to get better at what skills I have, And it did.

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Speaker 2: I went from a long list to over a period

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Speaker 2: of time, a pretty short list. And as I've got

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Speaker 2: down to that short list, it's sort of dawned on

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Speaker 2: me that what of incredible experiences would be to really

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Speaker 2: step outside my comfort zone? Strange It would be much

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Speaker 2: easier probably stay at the Essident Football Club. There's one

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Speaker 2: hundred years of history, there's a whole framework that you

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Speaker 2: operate within, there's a big supporter base. But I decided

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Speaker 2: towards the end of the interview process for the Gold

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Speaker 2: Coast Suns that I really wanted the job. Sort of

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Speaker 2: built this plan that I thought that it would be

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Speaker 2: exciting to execute. It would completely take me out of

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Speaker 2: my comfort zone. I hadn't been a CEO before, so

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Speaker 2: not only would I be a CEO, but in a

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Speaker 2: new organization, in a new in an area that hadn't

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Speaker 2: had it so forty ten before. And so I tell

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Speaker 2: us a bit about me, probably that I like to

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Speaker 2: step out of white culport zone.

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Speaker 1: And getting that vibe.

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Speaker 2: It's probably where I learned best and perform best. And

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Speaker 2: so I was fortunate enough to get the role. And

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Speaker 2: so Gold Coast was a bit more about learning about me,

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Speaker 2: learning about leadership in a setting where I have a

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Speaker 2: truly blank canvas. And so that was a wonderful experience

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Speaker 2: of sort of five or six years of setting up

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Speaker 2: the Gold Coast sons.

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Speaker 1: So like, I have to ask this because I mean, one,

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Speaker 1: I think that's great in terms of listeners, like go

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Speaker 1: for interviews that you don't even think you're going to

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Speaker 1: get as part of the experience. I mean, obviously you

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Speaker 1: don't know what's going to happen. A lot of people

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Speaker 1: don't do that right. They want to be completely lined

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Speaker 1: up and ready for the job. Okay, we've got to

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Speaker 1: talk about this thing. Obviously I read online you like

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Speaker 1: being nervous or you enjoy it, which comes with this.

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Speaker 1: You know you love putting yourself at eat comfort zone.

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Speaker 1: From a neurological perspective, the brain doesn't often like that naturally,

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Speaker 1: right in at the anytime things are different from familiarity,

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Speaker 1: the brain goes ear reject that. So how have you

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Speaker 1: hacked this? It's just like you just were born with

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Speaker 1: an ability to go anything that feels different, uncomfortable, challenging,

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Speaker 1: I gravitate towards or is this something that you go

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Speaker 1: through with some inner narrative that makes you do this?

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Speaker 1: Because it's actually not that common.

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Speaker 2: Now, I've asked myself the same question, because it's not

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Speaker 2: always you know, sometimes I put myself in a positions

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Speaker 2: I want to do. It is and Gold Coast was

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Speaker 2: an example of that. I'm not sure why that is

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Speaker 2: the case. I do know though, that I thrive in

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Speaker 2: those environments. Okay, I thrive in an environment where there

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Speaker 2: is uncertainty, where I feel like I'm being stretched. That

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Speaker 2: was the best example of that Gold Coast. It also

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Speaker 2: occurred when I left the AFL. Yes, I stayed in sport,

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Speaker 2: but I knew not much about the sport. So I

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Speaker 2: always look for those opportunities and I think it's satisfying,

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Speaker 2: it's invigorating. It really tests me, but I enjoy it.

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Speaker 1: So where do self doubt play in your life? Travis? Then, seriously,

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Speaker 1: at some point you could have gone as it's actually

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Speaker 1: a very good idea. Am I going to fail? What

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Speaker 1: are people going to think?

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Speaker 2: Yeah? It exists in my life, Absolutely it does. I'm

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Speaker 2: a big believer in reflecting. Okay, not in any great

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Speaker 2: formal way, but you know, often when I make a

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Speaker 2: big decision, or I need to make a big decision,

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Speaker 2: I often want to spend a bit of time just

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Speaker 2: reflect on how when about that decision I made? What

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Speaker 2: I do it differently when I was at the Goldco Suns,

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Speaker 2: we knew there was going to be a tough start.

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Speaker 2: The way when I'm building the team is that weren't

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Speaker 2: going to win very often early on, hopefully built some momentum,

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Speaker 2: and so I remember early days we'd have a staff

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Speaker 2: maning every Monday and we'd have a difficult game on

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Speaker 2: the weekend and get it in front of the staff.

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Speaker 2: And so we are exactly where we need to be,

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Speaker 2: where exactly where thought we'd be. We've got all LEAs

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Speaker 2: steps in place, but know what we're doing, It'll be fine.

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Speaker 2: Because I needed them to believe where we are going.

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Speaker 2: I remember ginning in my car driving home, thinking, Holy help,

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Speaker 2: are we where we need to be right now? Am

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Speaker 2: I doing this the right way? What could I do

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Speaker 2: differently and better. But I needed to project that self confidence.

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Speaker 2: You need to be real and authentic about where we are.

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Speaker 2: But also your role as a leader is to make

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Speaker 2: sure that people have confidence and where we're going. And

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Speaker 2: so there's no doubt sometimes sort of behind the wall

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Speaker 2: a but you sit back and question yourself. I actually

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Speaker 2: think that's quite healthy. I'm actually comfortable that I don't

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Speaker 2: have self doubted accept that it paralyzes me, but I

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Speaker 2: certainly have self doubt that keeps my feet on the

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Speaker 2: ground because when you're leading in sport is a lot

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Speaker 2: of scrutiny. There's sort of low barriers to entry for

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Speaker 2: people to provide their opinions about how they think you're

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Speaker 2: going with your role, and so if you wanted to

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Speaker 2: jump online in any important time, particularly in my role

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Speaker 2: at the AFL, I had a lot of people telling

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Speaker 2: me how to do my job, although I haven't done

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Speaker 2: a very good job. And so there's a real balance

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Speaker 2: between having some people around you that you rely on

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Speaker 2: to give you feedback, being able to do that yourself,

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Speaker 2: look yourself in the mirror and have pretty honest conversation

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Speaker 2: with how you're going, but not then sort of extending

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Speaker 2: that to listen to every voice that's coming through just

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Speaker 2: his noise, because then you will start to paralyze yourself.

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Speaker 2: And that's been the sort of learning for me over

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Speaker 2: a long period of time.

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Speaker 1: Yeah, amazing, there's a bit of ted Lasso in there

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Speaker 1: around the positivity. I remember talking to a friend of

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Speaker 1: yours who was part of their Goldkos Sons and he

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Speaker 1: would lose it every time you guys would lose a

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Speaker 1: game like freak Out, And I was thinking, well, in

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Speaker 1: your position, like did you sit there on Saturday nights

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Speaker 1: and Friday night's going, oh God, can't lose this one?

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Speaker 2: You have those, I mean, that's sport. Being a leader

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Speaker 2: in sport in some ways, your job is to keep

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Speaker 2: things calm's highest people think they are, the lows is

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Speaker 2: not as low as they are, and to have a

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Speaker 2: consistency in terms of how you're leading that isn't necessarily

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Speaker 2: attached to how you went on the weekend. And so

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Speaker 2: I think one of the things I've developed over twenty

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Speaker 2: five plus years of working in sport is the ability

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Speaker 2: to sort of remain calm when everything else around yous areen.

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Speaker 1: But I love that. So you mentioned before about authenticity,

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Speaker 1: So I wanted to touch on that because in my

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Speaker 1: Brave model of leadership, the A is authenticity, which for

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Speaker 1: me I defined it as I'm going to choose the

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Speaker 1: opportunity to connect over the chance of rejection. Right, and

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Speaker 1: you being in such a high profile public role, there

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Speaker 1: has to be some challenges with being completely authentic at times,

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Speaker 1: so saying exactly what you want to say, showing your emotions.

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Speaker 1: Do you feel that there are times where you were like,

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Speaker 1: I'm not being as authentic as I want to because

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Speaker 1: I can't.

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Speaker 2: There's a difference between not being authentic as opposed to

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Speaker 2: not being able to share all the information you might

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Speaker 2: want to share. So I'd like to say that I

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Speaker 2: would be authentic pretty much all the time, and sometimes

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Speaker 2: that is by saying that, actually, sorry, I can't answer

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Speaker 2: that question. I can't share that information. And so it's

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Speaker 2: a really good question in the sense that you're always

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Speaker 2: a balance between being really honest with people without being

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Speaker 2: able to telling everything they want to know because people's

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Speaker 2: livelihoods are involved, or there's sensitive information that you can't

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Speaker 2: share at that point in time. That happens a lot,

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Speaker 2: particularly in my AFL role. But if you can stand

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Speaker 2: up in the most difficult times and share that information,

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Speaker 2: whether it's with your staff or whether it's with the media,

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Speaker 2: to be able to say, hey, I know that you

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Speaker 2: would like to help this information. Some of it I

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Speaker 2: have something that I don't Some of the stuff I

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Speaker 2: have I can't share with you. I'd found over time

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Speaker 2: that that builds a bit of trust that tends to

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Speaker 2: be accepted in the context of sort of authenticity.

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Speaker 1: You might have been the first one to say that.

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Speaker 1: I think it's a very big lesson, and authenticity is

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Speaker 1: sometimes saying actually can't give you that information, versus pretending

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Speaker 1: or going down some other pathway. I think that's when

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Speaker 1: people get it wrong. You can say I don't know

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Speaker 1: or I can't tell you. There's a great takeaway for people.

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Speaker 1: So obviously, over this entire period of career, can you

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Speaker 1: think of one particular time where you felt really exposed

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Speaker 1: and vulnerable.

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Speaker 2: Yeah. I think my experience of leading to Gold Coast

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Speaker 2: SUMS was a bit like that, because you're building everything

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Speaker 2: with scratched But probably the better example is during COVID,

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Speaker 2: during the pandemic, when my role at the AFL was

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Speaker 2: running finance, running broadcasting, running fixturing, and I've seen the

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Speaker 2: club relationships, which puts you right in the center for

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Speaker 2: better or worse of all the issues will trying to

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Speaker 2: solve during COVID. So I just felt a huge sense

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Speaker 2: of responsibility. Initially, that's responsibility was to keep the game going,

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Speaker 2: to make sure that we could pay our people and

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Speaker 2: the clubs could pay their players and staff, that we

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Speaker 2: could continue playing week in week out. That responsibility quickly

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Speaker 2: shifted from that to a sense of responsibility because people

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Speaker 2: were looking at football and other forms of sport for

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Speaker 2: a sense of hope because I were locked in the

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Speaker 2: homes all day and so the ability to at the

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Speaker 2: end of a day turn the television on and watch

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Speaker 2: their team play was something more than just that. And

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Speaker 2: I was getting that feedback pretty early on during the

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Speaker 2: pandemic that please keep the game going because it's the

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Speaker 2: one thing that is a bit of a showing light

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Speaker 2: for us at the moment. And I felt that sense

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Speaker 2: of respon's ability before. And so that was probably the example

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Speaker 2: where it's like I've got a job to do here.

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Speaker 2: That is probably one of more important jobs that I've

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Speaker 2: ever done in my career.

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Speaker 1: In terms of dealing with that. Was the certain things

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Speaker 1: you did in your life to help you manage that stress.

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Speaker 2: I think we'd all give examples of what we did

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Speaker 2: during the pandemic that didn't didn't work for me is

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Speaker 2: very obvious, but it worked out pretty quickly that you know.

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Speaker 2: The things that put me in a position to lead

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Speaker 2: well is I need sleep, We've got to eat well,

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Speaker 2: I need exercise. And so a couple of those got

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Speaker 2: taken away from me really quickly during the pandemic. Were

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Speaker 2: working pretty silly hours, like a lot of people were exercised,

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Speaker 2: were difficult, and so I put myself in a hole

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Speaker 2: pretty quickly, and I needed to then try and at

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Speaker 2: least get two of those back together again and put

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Speaker 2: myself in a position where I can make myself available

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Speaker 2: to lead. That was sort of the key pillar is

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Speaker 2: how do I get myself right first? Because we were

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Speaker 2: asking a lot about each other during those times, and

361
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Speaker 2: there was a lot of stress, and then it became

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Speaker 2: a bit about team. There was a small group of

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Speaker 2: us who realized on each other. There was displays of

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Speaker 2: vulnerability during COVID that I've not seen before. We really

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Speaker 2: got into each other's lives, were in lounge rooms every

366
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Speaker 2: day on teams goals, and we got to see first

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Speaker 2: hand the impact of the pandemic on people's personal lives,

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Speaker 2: and so I have a sense of connection with maybe

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Speaker 2: half a dozen people through that period that is much

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Speaker 2: deeper than you would normally have in any normal work

371
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Speaker 2: setting that still exists today. You know, there's times that

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Speaker 2: I felt really vulnerable. There's times also when I was

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Speaker 2: probably my st rewarding part of my career.

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Speaker 1: So after twenty five years and leadership roles, you obviously

375
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Speaker 1: had your site set on the top job at the AFL,

376
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Speaker 1: and I think a lot of people had bets on

377
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Speaker 1: you getting that role, and I think it was pretty hard.

378
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Speaker 1: Youous twelve month recruitment process that you went through, and

379
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Speaker 1: then obviously you did miss out on the role. So

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Speaker 1: resilience for me is key when it comes to great leadership.

381
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Speaker 1: You know, obviously bouncing back is one thing, but also

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Speaker 1: preparing yourself for the obstacles. So I'm interested to know

383
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Speaker 1: how did you prepare for a twelve month recruitment process

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Speaker 1: and all that came with, And then I guess how

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Speaker 1: did you process the disappointment of it not happening and

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Speaker 1: bounce back from that.

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Speaker 2: Yeah, I don't think I did prepare for a twelve

388
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Speaker 2: month that's probably more than that if you're going to

389
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Speaker 2: put yourself in a process to be the CEO of

390
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Speaker 2: the AFL, and you know it's going to come with

391
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Speaker 2: some scrutiny, and scrutiny wasn't something that was foreign to me.

392
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Speaker 2: I've worked in footy for twenty years and so I

393
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Speaker 2: knew a lot about being judged publicly on a regular basis,

394
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Speaker 2: and I had a tight group around me that would

395
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Speaker 2: support me through that. I probably thought, there's a three

396
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Speaker 2: or four month process coming up, but I'm going to

397
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Speaker 2: come into some scrutiny. I just need to focus on

398
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Speaker 2: what I can control. But then it became much longer.

399
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Speaker 2: I think one of my strengths because of the roles

400
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Speaker 2: that I've had, is I'm quite resilient. I can generally

401
00:16:32,721 --> 00:16:35,841
Speaker 2: decipher between what's real and what's noise and the voices

402
00:16:35,881 --> 00:16:38,561
Speaker 2: that I care about. What starts to impact you is

403
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Speaker 2: when others close to you are impacted. And so when

404
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Speaker 2: you start to find and what got a bit more

405
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Speaker 2: difficult towards the end of it is you'd find that

406
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Speaker 2: you know, whether it's your family, close friends, you could

407
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Speaker 2: see that they were probably out of care for me.

408
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Speaker 2: But starting to be impacted by starting to engage in

409
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Speaker 2: what was going on social media, and that was the

410
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Speaker 2: time I was like, oh, this is a bit bigger

411
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Speaker 2: than me, and I just need to be careful of

412
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Speaker 2: what I'm putting others through. It was difficult because I

413
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Speaker 2: hadn't really invested in getting the role. You have to

414
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Speaker 2: do if you'ren apply for all that, you have to really

415
00:17:05,721 --> 00:17:08,321
Speaker 2: invest in as a long process. I'd enjoyed my time

416
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Speaker 2: at the AFL and credible twenty five years in the AFL.

417
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Speaker 2: I wouldn't change one thing, but you saw it going

418
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Speaker 2: knowing that you know, as they guarantees. So when I

419
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Speaker 2: found out I didn't get it, I quickly dusted myself off.

420
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Speaker 2: The guy got the role, Andrew Dillon. He's a post

421
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Speaker 2: friend of mine. You wouldn't find a better person. I

422
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Speaker 2: was equally happy for Andrew to get that role. Spend

423
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Speaker 2: there for a long time and you'll do a really

424
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Speaker 2: good job. And so up against tough competition, you got

425
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Speaker 2: to accept that. The question for me was sort of

426
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Speaker 2: what now. That was a good question because I had

427
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Speaker 2: convinced myself I wanted to sort step into that old

428
00:17:37,080 --> 00:17:39,640
Speaker 2: leadership role again. One thing about a twelve month process.

429
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Speaker 2: Is you spend a lot of time thinking about what

430
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Speaker 2: you bring to the table, what you love, what's your

431
00:17:43,801 --> 00:17:46,481
Speaker 2: environments worked for you. I was pretty sure coming out

432
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Speaker 2: of that process that I wanted to step back into

433
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Speaker 2: a CEO role.

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Speaker 1: Yeah right, okay.

435
00:17:50,281 --> 00:17:52,000
Speaker 2: And I could have stayed in the a fil industry.

436
00:17:52,041 --> 00:17:54,081
Speaker 2: I could have stayed int the AFL, could have went

437
00:17:54,120 --> 00:17:56,400
Speaker 2: back to running a club. Those opportunities are putting in

438
00:17:56,481 --> 00:17:59,720
Speaker 2: front of me. And then the opportunity to become the

439
00:17:59,761 --> 00:18:02,401
Speaker 2: CEO of the Australian Pre Corporation came up. In fact,

440
00:18:02,481 --> 00:18:04,960
Speaker 2: it came up about a month or two before the

441
00:18:05,080 --> 00:18:08,840
Speaker 2: af process. And I had said to the transparent, I

442
00:18:08,880 --> 00:18:12,080
Speaker 2: had said to the recruiter, I am twelve or fourteen

443
00:18:12,080 --> 00:18:14,281
Speaker 2: months into a process here. I'm not going to hedge

444
00:18:14,281 --> 00:18:16,921
Speaker 2: my bets now. So as much as running the strain

445
00:18:16,961 --> 00:18:19,840
Speaker 2: Gold pre is a very attractive proposition, thank you, but

446
00:18:19,921 --> 00:18:22,400
Speaker 2: no thank you, because I don't want to hedge my bets.

447
00:18:22,481 --> 00:18:23,921
Speaker 2: I'm a sort of all in guy and I'm all

448
00:18:23,961 --> 00:18:26,041
Speaker 2: here now. I didn't get the role. I got a

449
00:18:26,041 --> 00:18:28,400
Speaker 2: phone call from the recruiter. It become very public quickly

450
00:18:28,761 --> 00:18:30,361
Speaker 2: till after day or two I've got a phone call

451
00:18:30,400 --> 00:18:32,920
Speaker 2: to say, hey, bad news for you, good news for us.

452
00:18:33,201 --> 00:18:35,561
Speaker 2: We want you back in the process. The process hadn't

453
00:18:35,640 --> 00:18:37,921
Speaker 2: been completed, and so I jumped in at the back

454
00:18:38,041 --> 00:18:41,360
Speaker 2: end of this role. And it's another example stepping out

455
00:18:41,360 --> 00:18:43,601
Speaker 2: of my comfort zone. It would have been much easier

456
00:18:43,600 --> 00:18:46,680
Speaker 2: for me to stay in the AFL industry, but this

457
00:18:46,801 --> 00:18:49,120
Speaker 2: was a different role and had opened up other opportunities

458
00:18:49,281 --> 00:18:50,920
Speaker 2: and it tested be a game. It put me in.

459
00:18:51,481 --> 00:18:53,561
Speaker 1: And also, I think exactly what happened to you in

460
00:18:53,600 --> 00:18:56,321
Speaker 1: the process for the Goldcrows Sons, the process and going

461
00:18:56,321 --> 00:18:58,080
Speaker 1: through the interview helped you realize, actually, I do want

462
00:18:58,080 --> 00:19:00,121
Speaker 1: to be a CEO, and I can't then go back

463
00:19:00,120 --> 00:19:02,041
Speaker 1: into something that's different. I have to ask, you know,

464
00:19:02,041 --> 00:19:04,641
Speaker 1: we all know you can't have it all supposedly, what's

465
00:19:04,721 --> 00:19:06,561
Speaker 1: the you have to pay for success?

466
00:19:07,041 --> 00:19:10,041
Speaker 2: It's a really good question. I think sport demands a

467
00:19:10,080 --> 00:19:12,001
Speaker 2: lot of you, and so if you're in a leading sport,

468
00:19:12,001 --> 00:19:13,640
Speaker 2: it's not a nine to five thing. It's sort of

469
00:19:13,681 --> 00:19:16,360
Speaker 2: your life. I know that, particularly early on in my

470
00:19:16,360 --> 00:19:18,521
Speaker 2: careers when children were growing up, I wasn't there from

471
00:19:18,521 --> 00:19:20,561
Speaker 2: as much as I would like either, whether I was

472
00:19:20,880 --> 00:19:24,360
Speaker 2: physically there or not. I think when you are in sport,

473
00:19:24,400 --> 00:19:26,600
Speaker 2: you're surrounded by it all the time. There's an expectation

474
00:19:26,721 --> 00:19:28,401
Speaker 2: you're on all the time, and so I think if

475
00:19:28,400 --> 00:19:30,760
Speaker 2: you had your time again, I think as more mature

476
00:19:30,840 --> 00:19:33,200
Speaker 2: person now I might do that a bit differently. I

477
00:19:33,201 --> 00:19:34,840
Speaker 2: don't give a chance to do that, but that's something

478
00:19:34,880 --> 00:19:36,880
Speaker 2: I thought about that it owns a lot of you,

479
00:19:37,120 --> 00:19:38,680
Speaker 2: and I gave it a lot back, and you need

480
00:19:38,721 --> 00:19:39,840
Speaker 2: to if you're to be successful.

481
00:19:39,880 --> 00:19:41,641
Speaker 1: I want to talk to a quickly that empathy, which

482
00:19:41,681 --> 00:19:44,401
Speaker 1: I think is like a superpower quite frankly, and probably

483
00:19:44,400 --> 00:19:46,921
Speaker 1: the one thing most leaders struggle the most, and kind

484
00:19:46,961 --> 00:19:49,640
Speaker 1: of fully understanding that ability to hold space for people's

485
00:19:49,640 --> 00:19:53,041
Speaker 1: emotions and not necessarily fixing it. It's often widely known

486
00:19:53,080 --> 00:19:55,600
Speaker 1: that males can struggle with expressing their emotions more than women.

487
00:19:55,721 --> 00:19:57,440
Speaker 1: How did you find that in the AFL. Is there

488
00:19:57,481 --> 00:19:59,521
Speaker 1: a culture of suck it up, don't talk about it?

489
00:19:59,880 --> 00:20:02,240
Speaker 1: What did you see shift over twenty five years in

490
00:20:02,241 --> 00:20:02,720
Speaker 1: that space?

491
00:20:03,041 --> 00:20:04,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, go back a step. That's certainly how I was

492
00:20:04,681 --> 00:20:07,080
Speaker 2: raised a boy growing up in the country, work hard,

493
00:20:07,321 --> 00:20:09,641
Speaker 2: suck it up with any issues, toughen up a bit,

494
00:20:09,721 --> 00:20:12,400
Speaker 2: and so I certainly started that way, and I've seen

495
00:20:12,400 --> 00:20:15,561
Speaker 2: things change during my time at the AFL incredibly in

496
00:20:15,681 --> 00:20:19,440
Speaker 2: terms of the expectations around being vulnerable or the accepted sorry.

497
00:20:19,561 --> 00:20:23,400
Speaker 2: The diversity of workforces now in all forms has changed things.

498
00:20:23,561 --> 00:20:26,961
Speaker 2: When I reflect back on my career, I think early

499
00:20:27,001 --> 00:20:29,840
Speaker 2: on in my leadership journey, I was incredibly judgmental. I

500
00:20:29,840 --> 00:20:31,921
Speaker 2: had views of things that this is how things needed

501
00:20:31,961 --> 00:20:34,041
Speaker 2: to be and it wasn't really The one thing that

502
00:20:34,120 --> 00:20:36,241
Speaker 2: changed that is my daughter has a disability, which was

503
00:20:36,241 --> 00:20:38,001
Speaker 2: born with a disability, and so I had this sort

504
00:20:38,001 --> 00:20:40,161
Speaker 2: of moment where it's like, it's not actually like black

505
00:20:40,160 --> 00:20:42,441
Speaker 2: and white, and it gave me a totally different perspective

506
00:20:42,481 --> 00:20:45,200
Speaker 2: on the world. And so going from someone who's judgmental

507
00:20:45,241 --> 00:20:46,801
Speaker 2: and you know, look for the people that look a

508
00:20:46,801 --> 00:20:49,160
Speaker 2: bit more like me and lead a bit more like me,

509
00:20:49,360 --> 00:20:51,681
Speaker 2: to look for the person in the corner who's not

510
00:20:51,801 --> 00:20:54,681
Speaker 2: necessarily engagement has something to offer. And so I would

511
00:20:54,681 --> 00:20:58,321
Speaker 2: see more possibility and opportunity in people that I did previously.

512
00:20:58,640 --> 00:21:01,080
Speaker 2: And so it wasn't directly shaped by my career, was

513
00:21:01,080 --> 00:21:03,641
Speaker 2: more shaped by my personal experience. And I think empathy

514
00:21:03,681 --> 00:21:07,120
Speaker 2: now notwithstanding sort of where I came from, is probably

515
00:21:07,120 --> 00:21:09,521
Speaker 2: one of my strengths, and sometimes it's a strength overplayed.

516
00:21:09,721 --> 00:21:12,241
Speaker 2: I get feedback sometimes that, you know, when I'm making

517
00:21:12,241 --> 00:21:14,281
Speaker 2: really tough people decisions, I just want to give someone

518
00:21:14,281 --> 00:21:16,400
Speaker 2: a chance. I really do. I want to try and

519
00:21:16,441 --> 00:21:18,001
Speaker 2: see if we can find a way to get the

520
00:21:18,001 --> 00:21:20,400
Speaker 2: best of them. Yeah, and sometimes it doesn't work. But

521
00:21:20,521 --> 00:21:22,160
Speaker 2: I do know when it doesn't work, and I have

522
00:21:22,201 --> 00:21:24,680
Speaker 2: to have those conversations that I don't enjoy that I

523
00:21:24,721 --> 00:21:26,761
Speaker 2: know that I've given them every chance, and that just

524
00:21:26,761 --> 00:21:28,921
Speaker 2: comes from a deeper place that's been my chow.

525
00:21:29,001 --> 00:21:32,281
Speaker 1: I love that. That's beautiful. Yeah, and you're right, I'm sure. Yeah,

526
00:21:32,321 --> 00:21:34,680
Speaker 1: having experienced those challenges that you daughter would have gone through,

527
00:21:34,721 --> 00:21:37,001
Speaker 1: you'd have a whole different perspective, all right. So in

528
00:21:37,041 --> 00:21:40,080
Speaker 1: twenty twenty three points the CEO role of Australian Grand

529
00:21:40,080 --> 00:21:43,441
Speaker 1: Prix amazing. So while still in sport, a completely different

530
00:21:43,481 --> 00:21:46,241
Speaker 1: ball game. I actually started watching the Netflix for me

531
00:21:47,761 --> 00:21:51,001
Speaker 1: and I ended up becoming obsessed with it, like it's

532
00:21:51,041 --> 00:21:53,561
Speaker 1: really fascinating to me, like in my head. And I

533
00:21:53,561 --> 00:21:55,801
Speaker 1: think it's because my boys were watching it and it

534
00:21:55,840 --> 00:21:57,160
Speaker 1: was a bit like, oh, this is going to be

535
00:21:57,160 --> 00:21:59,801
Speaker 1: cars going around a circuit to be honest, and then

536
00:21:59,840 --> 00:22:01,680
Speaker 1: you start watching it and you're just like, this is

537
00:22:01,721 --> 00:22:05,281
Speaker 1: a whole nother thing, Like it's a massive teams thought,

538
00:22:05,360 --> 00:22:08,121
Speaker 1: like it couldn't get more like down to the pet changes.

539
00:22:08,561 --> 00:22:12,720
Speaker 1: It's competitive, like insane competitive. I mean, we've watched Ricardo

540
00:22:12,840 --> 00:22:14,241
Speaker 1: and all this kind of stuff happened. Like if you're

541
00:22:14,281 --> 00:22:17,360
Speaker 1: not top of the game, you're out, Like it's just insane.

542
00:22:17,681 --> 00:22:20,160
Speaker 1: You said first of all that you weren't particularly like

543
00:22:20,241 --> 00:22:22,281
Speaker 1: huge into motorsport. I didn't know a ton about it.

544
00:22:22,441 --> 00:22:24,401
Speaker 1: So what have you learned in this space of time

545
00:22:24,400 --> 00:22:25,481
Speaker 1: that you've been here over twelve months?

546
00:22:25,481 --> 00:22:27,681
Speaker 2: And when it comes to the sport, like you, I

547
00:22:27,721 --> 00:22:30,201
Speaker 2: was introduced to the sport with any depth anyway through

548
00:22:30,281 --> 00:22:32,521
Speaker 2: Drivers Survive. I live near the circuit and so we've

549
00:22:32,521 --> 00:22:34,440
Speaker 2: been quite a number of times. Yeah, but it was

550
00:22:34,441 --> 00:22:36,321
Speaker 2: actually my wife who would say to me, Hey, when

551
00:22:36,360 --> 00:22:38,561
Speaker 2: you finishing work, this next episode of Drive Survives out

552
00:22:38,561 --> 00:22:41,401
Speaker 2: and watch what's happened to you. And so that's how

553
00:22:41,600 --> 00:22:43,961
Speaker 2: I had some knowledge of F one and there working

554
00:22:44,001 --> 00:22:45,840
Speaker 2: is of F one. But when I stepped into the role,

555
00:22:45,880 --> 00:22:47,281
Speaker 2: one of the things I'm really clear about through my

556
00:22:47,321 --> 00:22:49,681
Speaker 2: interview process and when I first spoke to my team

557
00:22:49,761 --> 00:22:51,761
Speaker 2: is I don't know much about motorsport. I don't know

558
00:22:51,801 --> 00:22:53,600
Speaker 2: much about F one. I know a little bit about

559
00:22:53,600 --> 00:22:56,241
Speaker 2: how sport works and how you create product and connected

560
00:22:56,281 --> 00:22:59,160
Speaker 2: with a fan base and commercialize it. I've done that

561
00:22:59,160 --> 00:23:01,241
Speaker 2: for a long time, but I'm going to need to

562
00:23:01,281 --> 00:23:03,721
Speaker 2: rely on you for your motorsport expertise. And having been

563
00:23:03,761 --> 00:23:06,241
Speaker 2: in the AFIL industry for twenty five years, you don't

564
00:23:06,281 --> 00:23:08,321
Speaker 2: know the answer to everything, but you know how to

565
00:23:08,321 --> 00:23:10,400
Speaker 2: get the answer. It's like everything's one or two phone

566
00:23:10,400 --> 00:23:12,201
Speaker 2: calls away, like I know who to call to work

567
00:23:12,241 --> 00:23:15,720
Speaker 2: out that thing. I remember early days leaving work thinking

568
00:23:16,160 --> 00:23:17,920
Speaker 2: I don't know the answer to this question and I

569
00:23:17,921 --> 00:23:20,001
Speaker 2: don't know to call. You feel pretty vulnerable at times,

570
00:23:20,001 --> 00:23:23,001
Speaker 2: and so I had a completely different mindset stepping into

571
00:23:23,201 --> 00:23:25,240
Speaker 2: this role that I had. I didn't give enough respect

572
00:23:25,241 --> 00:23:26,840
Speaker 2: to the industry to come up with the speed with

573
00:23:26,961 --> 00:23:29,920
Speaker 2: how the industry works. A bit of the history was

574
00:23:29,921 --> 00:23:31,840
Speaker 2: really important. I felt like to respect the history of

575
00:23:31,840 --> 00:23:34,681
Speaker 2: the organization and the sport. So I've done a lot

576
00:23:34,681 --> 00:23:37,041
Speaker 2: of reading, a little bit of travel to other events

577
00:23:37,281 --> 00:23:39,600
Speaker 2: to try and understand F one, and we do the

578
00:23:39,640 --> 00:23:42,160
Speaker 2: Moto GP down of Philip Ailin It's been a lot

579
00:23:42,160 --> 00:23:44,840
Speaker 2: of time with people. We're very fortunate we have Mark

580
00:23:44,840 --> 00:23:47,201
Speaker 2: Webber as the past F one driver on our board,

581
00:23:47,241 --> 00:23:49,561
Speaker 2: and we have Doing as a five time world champion

582
00:23:49,600 --> 00:23:52,001
Speaker 2: Moto GP writer on our board, and I've been incredible.

583
00:23:52,080 --> 00:23:53,880
Speaker 2: I'm sure some of the times when I ask questions

584
00:23:53,921 --> 00:23:56,080
Speaker 2: are like, that is ridiculous question, but they humor me.

585
00:23:56,400 --> 00:23:59,801
Speaker 2: And so I've had a coming up eighteen months now, right,

586
00:23:59,921 --> 00:24:04,041
Speaker 2: eighteen months of just absorbing information. The first six months

587
00:24:04,241 --> 00:24:07,240
Speaker 2: I really just say back ask questions. I made a

588
00:24:07,241 --> 00:24:08,960
Speaker 2: commitment to the board that it wouldn't change too much

589
00:24:09,001 --> 00:24:10,761
Speaker 2: in the first six months. I would just sort of

590
00:24:11,001 --> 00:24:13,121
Speaker 2: make sure I knew enough before I did anything. I'm

591
00:24:13,160 --> 00:24:16,001
Speaker 2: going to my second F one in forty days time.

592
00:24:16,241 --> 00:24:17,441
Speaker 2: I feel like I've got a bit of a sense

593
00:24:17,521 --> 00:24:19,681
Speaker 2: now of how it works, and if it doesn't work,

594
00:24:19,681 --> 00:24:21,561
Speaker 2: this one's on me. So I've been there long enough

595
00:24:21,561 --> 00:24:23,641
Speaker 2: and I feel like I can start to make a difference.

596
00:24:24,041 --> 00:24:26,760
Speaker 1: Yeah, amazing. And I suppose like obviously that level of

597
00:24:26,880 --> 00:24:29,561
Speaker 1: honesty and vulnerability to say, hey, I'm not an expert

598
00:24:29,561 --> 00:24:31,361
Speaker 1: in this field. What kind of reception did you get

599
00:24:31,360 --> 00:24:33,041
Speaker 1: from that being so honest about that?

600
00:24:33,201 --> 00:24:36,640
Speaker 2: Yeah, a bit of surprise, I think because historically leaders

601
00:24:36,640 --> 00:24:38,041
Speaker 2: of the Grand Prix come from some a bit or

602
00:24:38,041 --> 00:24:40,440
Speaker 2: a motors background and that had been suitable and done

603
00:24:40,481 --> 00:24:42,840
Speaker 2: an incredible job. The past had done a wonderful job.

604
00:24:43,001 --> 00:24:45,121
Speaker 2: I'd inherit an event that was doing really well, really

605
00:24:45,120 --> 00:24:47,721
Speaker 2: well run. But the opportunity was to take learning from

606
00:24:47,761 --> 00:24:49,840
Speaker 2: other sports, I think, other events that working how we

607
00:24:49,880 --> 00:24:52,001
Speaker 2: grow and so I think for some of them it's

608
00:24:52,001 --> 00:24:53,640
Speaker 2: a good question for them, probably, but for some of

609
00:24:53,681 --> 00:24:56,160
Speaker 2: them it was quite refreshing to say someone's coming in

610
00:24:56,321 --> 00:24:58,200
Speaker 2: not to tell me how to do my job, but

611
00:24:58,521 --> 00:25:00,841
Speaker 2: how to focus on the role I have and how

612
00:25:00,840 --> 00:25:02,521
Speaker 2: we create a bit of a longer term vision here

613
00:25:02,681 --> 00:25:05,440
Speaker 2: and the right environment for people. And so that's been

614
00:25:05,481 --> 00:25:06,921
Speaker 2: an adjustment for them.

615
00:25:07,241 --> 00:25:09,321
Speaker 1: But I think that's very very true, is that. I mean,

616
00:25:09,360 --> 00:25:11,281
Speaker 1: we all think the safety in someone who's known the

617
00:25:11,321 --> 00:25:13,721
Speaker 1: industry for years, but the same token, then there is

618
00:25:13,761 --> 00:25:16,600
Speaker 1: an element of, yeah, not letting people do their jobs's

619
00:25:16,681 --> 00:25:18,720
Speaker 1: interfering too much, whereas that's not what you're here to do.

620
00:25:18,840 --> 00:25:20,760
Speaker 1: You're just here to lead them in the best way possible.

621
00:25:20,880 --> 00:25:23,321
Speaker 2: So there's no risk of me being a micromanager right now.

622
00:25:23,321 --> 00:25:24,160
Speaker 1: No, it doesn't sound like it.

623
00:25:24,201 --> 00:25:26,360
Speaker 2: Name can't because I don't know the details, and so

624
00:25:26,600 --> 00:25:29,000
Speaker 2: I think they're enjoying the freedom of that. But it's

625
00:25:29,041 --> 00:25:31,401
Speaker 2: also an obligation for me to understand enough about their

626
00:25:31,481 --> 00:25:34,441
Speaker 2: roles in the industry that I can support them, challenge them,

627
00:25:34,561 --> 00:25:35,600
Speaker 2: and provide a bit of direction.

628
00:25:35,961 --> 00:25:37,481
Speaker 1: Have you sat in the car yet?

629
00:25:37,600 --> 00:25:38,961
Speaker 2: I haven't sat in the F one car, And in fact,

630
00:25:39,001 --> 00:25:40,521
Speaker 2: I'm probably a bit tall to sit in the F

631
00:25:40,561 --> 00:25:43,361
Speaker 2: one cars. I wouldn't go out there. Generally that mark

632
00:25:43,360 --> 00:25:46,080
Speaker 2: web is probably my light. But yeah, they're pretty tight

633
00:25:46,201 --> 00:25:49,201
Speaker 2: in those cars. I've been in a supercar, certainly tested

634
00:25:49,281 --> 00:25:49,880
Speaker 2: my courage.

635
00:25:49,961 --> 00:25:52,161
Speaker 1: Now. I think it's widely known that culture is driven

636
00:25:52,160 --> 00:25:54,521
Speaker 1: from the top, and you know, you've held many top

637
00:25:54,561 --> 00:25:57,240
Speaker 1: positions that would have directly impacted the culture. Do you

638
00:25:57,281 --> 00:25:59,640
Speaker 1: have like a you know, an approach to this, Like,

639
00:25:59,721 --> 00:26:01,880
Speaker 1: you know, is it kind of very organic? Just you

640
00:26:01,921 --> 00:26:04,361
Speaker 1: know Travis's character, I mean, you are a character. You've

641
00:26:04,360 --> 00:26:07,880
Speaker 1: got some very strong positive leadership qualities. I can imagine

642
00:26:07,961 --> 00:26:11,361
Speaker 1: naturally it would probably create a very trust built culture.

643
00:26:11,681 --> 00:26:13,521
Speaker 1: But do you have particular strategies that you like to

644
00:26:13,561 --> 00:26:15,640
Speaker 1: go into organizations and put in place, Like are you

645
00:26:15,640 --> 00:26:17,960
Speaker 1: sort of like I need this to happen. These rituals

646
00:26:17,961 --> 00:26:19,720
Speaker 1: are things that I just always do wherever I go.

647
00:26:20,041 --> 00:26:22,520
Speaker 2: Yeah, I think so. And whether I've articulated them that

648
00:26:22,561 --> 00:26:24,761
Speaker 2: way or a document or don't know, But I would

649
00:26:24,840 --> 00:26:27,600
Speaker 2: say firstly that you have an enormous responsibility as a

650
00:26:27,681 --> 00:26:30,840
Speaker 2: leader to role model what you want. And so there's

651
00:26:30,840 --> 00:26:32,600
Speaker 2: that sort of saying. A friend of mine who was

652
00:26:32,600 --> 00:26:34,160
Speaker 2: a bit of a mentor of mine says that what

653
00:26:34,241 --> 00:26:36,561
Speaker 2: walks in the leader's runs and the teams, and so

654
00:26:36,640 --> 00:26:38,801
Speaker 2: that notion. No matter whether you you like or know,

655
00:26:39,041 --> 00:26:41,360
Speaker 2: people watching what you do, and they may believe what

656
00:26:41,521 --> 00:26:43,400
Speaker 2: you say, but they'll always believe what you do. And

657
00:26:43,441 --> 00:26:45,880
Speaker 2: so I'm a big believer that of sort of leading

658
00:26:45,880 --> 00:26:48,640
Speaker 2: through standard setting what standard do you expect? And so

659
00:26:48,640 --> 00:26:50,480
Speaker 2: the only want to do that is through communication. So

660
00:26:50,521 --> 00:26:52,321
Speaker 2: I like, you know, my management team meetings to have

661
00:26:52,321 --> 00:26:55,120
Speaker 2: conversations about how we're going, how are we leading, how

662
00:26:55,160 --> 00:26:56,880
Speaker 2: you think we're going in terms of our values, and

663
00:26:56,880 --> 00:26:58,600
Speaker 2: which ones we're doing really well at, which ones you

664
00:26:58,600 --> 00:27:00,120
Speaker 2: think we can get better at, and so just making

665
00:27:00,160 --> 00:27:03,240
Speaker 2: sure this room on the agenda for those conversations. I

666
00:27:03,321 --> 00:27:06,121
Speaker 2: believe in sometimes you got to make conversations about where

667
00:27:06,120 --> 00:27:08,001
Speaker 2: you want to go and which people are sort of

668
00:27:08,041 --> 00:27:10,480
Speaker 2: on board with that, around your value setting. If you

669
00:27:10,481 --> 00:27:13,761
Speaker 2: make exceptions of those things, then people will really doubt

670
00:27:14,241 --> 00:27:17,640
Speaker 2: whether it's authentic and whether it's really what the organization

671
00:27:17,721 --> 00:27:20,521
Speaker 2: stands for. And so it's about standard setting, it's about

672
00:27:20,640 --> 00:27:22,960
Speaker 2: being consistent. You can't pick and choose. I think is

673
00:27:23,001 --> 00:27:25,480
Speaker 2: really important. But I think the most important thing for me,

674
00:27:25,880 --> 00:27:27,680
Speaker 2: it's something I'm very proud of what I left the

675
00:27:27,721 --> 00:27:30,241
Speaker 2: AFL and I'm certainly seeing it here is the ability

676
00:27:30,241 --> 00:27:33,521
Speaker 2: to crate, invite where people can be themselves. This notion

677
00:27:33,561 --> 00:27:35,520
Speaker 2: of creating a culture that works for me is not

678
00:27:35,561 --> 00:27:37,600
Speaker 2: really what it's about. We have a culture here, we

679
00:27:37,600 --> 00:27:39,920
Speaker 2: had before I started. So it was really coming in

680
00:27:39,961 --> 00:27:41,801
Speaker 2: and trying to understand what really works well for you?

681
00:27:42,160 --> 00:27:45,200
Speaker 2: What is about this organization that you really love? You

682
00:27:45,241 --> 00:27:47,720
Speaker 2: would like me to keep pushing along emphasizing, and what

683
00:27:47,801 --> 00:27:49,801
Speaker 2: is that that you don't like? And how can I

684
00:27:49,801 --> 00:27:51,681
Speaker 2: as a leader help with that? Rather than here, I am,

685
00:27:51,761 --> 00:27:53,880
Speaker 2: this is my value set, this is the culture you

686
00:27:53,921 --> 00:27:55,640
Speaker 2: need to have. It was a lot more trying to

687
00:27:55,761 --> 00:27:58,681
Speaker 2: extract and understand as a leader, how can I give

688
00:27:58,721 --> 00:28:01,360
Speaker 2: my people the best environment that I can, so they

689
00:28:01,360 --> 00:28:03,920
Speaker 2: can bring all of themselves to work and collectively we

690
00:28:03,921 --> 00:28:05,761
Speaker 2: can do something pretty special. I don't know if to

691
00:28:05,801 --> 00:28:06,601
Speaker 2: ask your question, but.

692
00:28:07,561 --> 00:28:09,680
Speaker 1: It's beautiful and I think it's such a thing because

693
00:28:09,921 --> 00:28:12,281
Speaker 1: in order to let people be themselves right, they have

694
00:28:12,321 --> 00:28:14,360
Speaker 1: to feel comfortable. And like I've done a lot of

695
00:28:14,360 --> 00:28:17,281
Speaker 1: these kind of interviews and there are some where I'm

696
00:28:17,321 --> 00:28:19,640
Speaker 1: not as comfortable as I am, Like right now, I

697
00:28:19,681 --> 00:28:22,161
Speaker 1: feel completely comfortable. I'd probably go waffling down a trail

698
00:28:22,241 --> 00:28:24,360
Speaker 1: with you because you make me feel that way, and

699
00:28:24,400 --> 00:28:26,961
Speaker 1: it's interesting. Then what is it? It's non judgment, it's

700
00:28:27,281 --> 00:28:29,640
Speaker 1: you know, I mean, there's vulnerability and openness and communication.

701
00:28:29,761 --> 00:28:31,321
Speaker 1: So I think if you're modeling that at the top,

702
00:28:31,360 --> 00:28:33,761
Speaker 1: it's no doubt that the culture will kind of form

703
00:28:33,761 --> 00:28:36,041
Speaker 1: itself from that. How do you then ensure that the

704
00:28:36,080 --> 00:28:39,281
Speaker 1: people that work for you are equally as passionate or

705
00:28:39,321 --> 00:28:41,481
Speaker 1: share these same beliefs as you like? How't even sure

706
00:28:41,481 --> 00:28:42,041
Speaker 1: that happens?

707
00:28:42,601 --> 00:28:44,641
Speaker 2: That's the trick, isn't that? It is in a couple

708
00:28:44,681 --> 00:28:47,720
Speaker 2: of ways. One is articulating really clearly what that looks like,

709
00:28:48,601 --> 00:28:50,601
Speaker 2: so that the expectations are clear that no one can

710
00:28:50,641 --> 00:28:52,321
Speaker 2: say how I didn't realize that you wanted us to

711
00:28:52,361 --> 00:28:54,720
Speaker 2: do that or lead that way, or that was important

712
00:28:54,761 --> 00:28:57,881
Speaker 2: for the organization. So having those conversations, we had lots

713
00:28:57,921 --> 00:28:59,481
Speaker 2: of them. We've had lots of them in my first

714
00:28:59,481 --> 00:29:02,161
Speaker 2: eighteen months, just to explore what it looks like. Because

715
00:29:02,161 --> 00:29:05,761
Speaker 2: I think the transformation comes in conversation, So serving those

716
00:29:05,801 --> 00:29:08,960
Speaker 2: conversations and not always easy conversations, but if you do

717
00:29:08,961 --> 00:29:11,280
Speaker 2: them regularly, they get normalized. And so that has been

718
00:29:11,321 --> 00:29:13,561
Speaker 2: part of it, a bit of feedback. And then what

719
00:29:13,641 --> 00:29:15,921
Speaker 2: I do, as an example, is every three or four

720
00:29:15,961 --> 00:29:18,960
Speaker 2: weeks in my diary is an hour with six to

721
00:29:19,041 --> 00:29:21,921
Speaker 2: eight staff randomly selected, or I have a coffee with

722
00:29:22,001 --> 00:29:25,041
Speaker 2: six to eight stuff okay. And it's a way just

723
00:29:25,081 --> 00:29:27,681
Speaker 2: to keep my team accountable but the organization and to

724
00:29:27,681 --> 00:29:29,960
Speaker 2: make sure I stay close to what's happening. As a CEO,

725
00:29:30,121 --> 00:29:33,521
Speaker 2: sometimes you can become very removed actually what's going on

726
00:29:33,561 --> 00:29:36,561
Speaker 2: in the organization. There's set questions. I asked, you know,

727
00:29:37,001 --> 00:29:39,761
Speaker 2: what's changing, what's changing for the better, What do we

728
00:29:39,801 --> 00:29:41,480
Speaker 2: need to focus more on? If you or me, what

729
00:29:41,481 --> 00:29:43,480
Speaker 2: would you be doing? And it just ends up like this,

730
00:29:43,561 --> 00:29:45,841
Speaker 2: It ends up being a conversation. But I get really

731
00:29:45,921 --> 00:29:49,641
Speaker 2: valuable feedback because my team sees things, my direct reports

732
00:29:49,681 --> 00:29:51,801
Speaker 2: these things in a certain way, and sometimes the staff

733
00:29:51,801 --> 00:29:54,561
Speaker 2: don't see that way. And it's like gives the ability

734
00:29:54,601 --> 00:29:56,521
Speaker 2: to go back in a very constructive way and say, hey,

735
00:29:56,641 --> 00:29:58,361
Speaker 2: I know we think we're off heading in this direction,

736
00:29:58,921 --> 00:30:02,041
Speaker 2: but my coffee catch ups telling me that we're missing

737
00:30:02,041 --> 00:30:04,881
Speaker 2: something over here. It's very non personal. It's sort of

738
00:30:04,921 --> 00:30:06,361
Speaker 2: like it's a bit of a barometer for me, and

739
00:30:06,441 --> 00:30:08,361
Speaker 2: I find that really valuable. It's the best hour of

740
00:30:08,441 --> 00:30:10,761
Speaker 2: sort of my month. It's their twelve months a year.

741
00:30:11,001 --> 00:30:13,921
Speaker 2: It's the staff. I sort of building trust in the

742
00:30:13,961 --> 00:30:16,161
Speaker 2: process that hate things are happening out of this, so

743
00:30:16,201 --> 00:30:18,081
Speaker 2: I can see that things are changing when I offer

744
00:30:18,121 --> 00:30:20,321
Speaker 2: my opinion. It's a long way to answering a question,

745
00:30:20,361 --> 00:30:21,960
Speaker 2: which is I'm going to work really closely with my

746
00:30:22,001 --> 00:30:25,480
Speaker 2: direct reports to understand how they're leading. And that's a

747
00:30:25,521 --> 00:30:27,961
Speaker 2: one to one thing. That's not a group conversation because

748
00:30:28,001 --> 00:30:30,240
Speaker 2: they all lead differently. Their teams have different needs from

749
00:30:30,281 --> 00:30:33,721
Speaker 2: their leaders, but also then from beneath. It's just making

750
00:30:33,761 --> 00:30:35,480
Speaker 2: sure that what I'm hearing and what they're telling me

751
00:30:35,881 --> 00:30:37,161
Speaker 2: is validated.

752
00:30:36,601 --> 00:30:38,841
Speaker 1: In that Kudos to utro It says brilliant, because people

753
00:30:38,881 --> 00:30:41,001
Speaker 1: manage up very well, right, And we've seen this time

754
00:30:41,041 --> 00:30:43,240
Speaker 1: and time again where you know, they'll tell you what

755
00:30:43,281 --> 00:30:45,401
Speaker 1: you want to hear, but they're not reflecting you down below,

756
00:30:45,401 --> 00:30:47,321
Speaker 1: and it does actually cause us massive block So I

757
00:30:47,361 --> 00:30:49,801
Speaker 1: think that's a beautiful loop and it keeps everyone accountable.

758
00:30:49,801 --> 00:30:52,321
Speaker 1: So I love that. So then what if and I'm

759
00:30:52,361 --> 00:30:54,601
Speaker 1: just asking this more hypothetically back you said about the

760
00:30:54,641 --> 00:30:56,281
Speaker 1: fact that empathy is a big thing for you and

761
00:30:56,321 --> 00:30:58,681
Speaker 1: you keep giving people chances and that, So how do

762
00:30:58,721 --> 00:31:01,561
Speaker 1: you deal with having those conflict difficult conversations? You might

763
00:31:01,601 --> 00:31:03,440
Speaker 1: have to let someone go, you know what I mean,

764
00:31:03,481 --> 00:31:05,561
Speaker 1: they haven't performed. Is that something you're still struggle with

765
00:31:05,721 --> 00:31:06,881
Speaker 1: or I.

766
00:31:06,761 --> 00:31:08,881
Speaker 2: Don't enjoy it? And I would say, if you do,

767
00:31:09,241 --> 00:31:10,401
Speaker 2: you probably a bit strange.

768
00:31:10,641 --> 00:31:12,161
Speaker 1: I agree, you up being the wrong role.

769
00:31:12,201 --> 00:31:14,161
Speaker 2: I don't like it. Often tell them when I have

770
00:31:14,201 --> 00:31:16,961
Speaker 2: the conversation, I don't enjoy these conversations that it would

771
00:31:16,961 --> 00:31:18,921
Speaker 2: be difficult for you. It's also difficult for me, and

772
00:31:19,041 --> 00:31:21,081
Speaker 2: just been honest about that. I think if you're honest,

773
00:31:21,521 --> 00:31:23,841
Speaker 2: I think if they can tell that you're also finding

774
00:31:23,881 --> 00:31:26,641
Speaker 2: the conversation difficult, I need to go into those conversations

775
00:31:26,721 --> 00:31:30,801
Speaker 2: knowing that I've given them every chance. Yeah, and they'veset expectations.

776
00:31:31,121 --> 00:31:33,240
Speaker 2: What is unfair is if they say, I didn't know

777
00:31:33,281 --> 00:31:35,200
Speaker 2: that's what you wanted from me. If you had have

778
00:31:35,201 --> 00:31:37,001
Speaker 2: told me that, I would have done something different. So

779
00:31:37,041 --> 00:31:39,200
Speaker 2: that to answer your question, I if I had to

780
00:31:39,201 --> 00:31:41,281
Speaker 2: have a few of them over the years.

781
00:31:41,041 --> 00:31:43,801
Speaker 1: It's more that obviously you're willing to right, it's willing

782
00:31:43,841 --> 00:31:45,841
Speaker 1: to have those difficult conversations when you have to, when

783
00:31:45,881 --> 00:31:48,960
Speaker 1: someone's not representing the values of the organization or you know,

784
00:31:49,081 --> 00:31:49,601
Speaker 1: staying alone.

785
00:31:49,681 --> 00:31:52,521
Speaker 2: Yeah. The thing for me is I find that they're

786
00:31:52,561 --> 00:31:55,401
Speaker 2: easier if you're having them along the way. Yeah, Rather

787
00:31:55,441 --> 00:31:58,641
Speaker 2: this big surprise conversation, I'm offering them conversations with someone

788
00:31:58,681 --> 00:32:01,081
Speaker 2: to say, hey, I just observed the conversation or hoy

789
00:32:01,161 --> 00:32:02,801
Speaker 2: in that meeting. Do you think we could have done

790
00:32:02,801 --> 00:32:05,641
Speaker 2: that differently? Was your observation of it? It tends to

791
00:32:05,681 --> 00:32:07,641
Speaker 2: be hopefully, if you're doing your job well enough that

792
00:32:08,201 --> 00:32:10,841
Speaker 2: by the time the difficult conversation comes, they know why

793
00:32:10,921 --> 00:32:12,521
Speaker 2: you want to catch up with them. They're like, yep,

794
00:32:12,561 --> 00:32:14,200
Speaker 2: I get it. We've talked about this a lot. I

795
00:32:14,281 --> 00:32:16,481
Speaker 2: might not agree with the decision but I see where

796
00:32:16,481 --> 00:32:18,401
Speaker 2: you're coming from because we've talked about it before. Rather

797
00:32:18,441 --> 00:32:21,161
Speaker 2: than this big moment of hey, I've been watching you

798
00:32:21,201 --> 00:32:23,200
Speaker 2: for twelve months and yet I don't have things and

799
00:32:23,241 --> 00:32:25,281
Speaker 2: now you're gone. That wouldn't sit well with me either.

800
00:32:25,481 --> 00:32:27,561
Speaker 1: No, absolutely, I think it might be time for me

801
00:32:27,601 --> 00:32:29,801
Speaker 1: to pose a difficult question for you. So I heard

802
00:32:29,801 --> 00:32:32,280
Speaker 1: this question posed by a Harvard psychologist the other day,

803
00:32:32,321 --> 00:32:36,121
Speaker 1: and I'd love to ask you this, Travis, Why should

804
00:32:36,161 --> 00:32:37,481
Speaker 1: anyone be led by you?

805
00:32:37,921 --> 00:32:39,761
Speaker 2: The first thing I'd say is that being a leader

806
00:32:40,001 --> 00:32:42,841
Speaker 2: is an enormous privilege and it comes with enormous responsibility.

807
00:32:42,921 --> 00:32:45,200
Speaker 2: The same professor will team that leadership doesn't come with

808
00:32:45,241 --> 00:32:47,361
Speaker 2: a title. People can choose to be led by you

809
00:32:47,481 --> 00:32:49,121
Speaker 2: or not. It could be their boss, it doesn't mean

810
00:32:49,121 --> 00:32:51,161
Speaker 2: you're their leader. And I think part of it is

811
00:32:51,401 --> 00:32:54,361
Speaker 2: if I start with me understanding the responsibility that comes

812
00:32:54,361 --> 00:32:56,760
Speaker 2: with being a leader. You are looking after people's careers,

813
00:32:56,761 --> 00:32:59,401
Speaker 2: looking after people's livelihoods. People when they come in through

814
00:32:59,401 --> 00:33:02,161
Speaker 2: the door impacted being what's going on in their personal lives,

815
00:33:02,161 --> 00:33:04,601
Speaker 2: and so I feel like I have that responsibility to

816
00:33:04,601 --> 00:33:07,641
Speaker 2: make sure that I am caring environment for them, but

817
00:33:07,681 --> 00:33:10,321
Speaker 2: also providing them enough challenge that they develop and so forth.

818
00:33:10,321 --> 00:33:12,641
Speaker 2: And so why should someone be led by me? Hopefully

819
00:33:12,641 --> 00:33:15,441
Speaker 2: because they have someone who cares about them as an individual,

820
00:33:15,761 --> 00:33:18,601
Speaker 2: have someone who takes an interest in their career. Sometimes

821
00:33:18,681 --> 00:33:20,760
Speaker 2: that is or often that is not within the organization.

822
00:33:21,001 --> 00:33:23,361
Speaker 2: Often you're encouraging people to think about roles outside the

823
00:33:23,481 --> 00:33:25,520
Speaker 2: organization because it's best for them. It may not be

824
00:33:25,521 --> 00:33:28,641
Speaker 2: best for the organization right now. Someone who While I'm

825
00:33:28,681 --> 00:33:31,881
Speaker 2: strong on accountability, hopefully I'm equally strong on support. And

826
00:33:31,921 --> 00:33:33,601
Speaker 2: I like to push the boundaries of it. I like

827
00:33:33,641 --> 00:33:36,321
Speaker 2: to change things. I like to innovate, I like to

828
00:33:36,361 --> 00:33:39,801
Speaker 2: test people. And I get enormous satisfaction when somebody you've

829
00:33:39,841 --> 00:33:42,441
Speaker 2: worked with before goes off and gets an amazing role

830
00:33:42,761 --> 00:33:44,001
Speaker 2: and you think you might have just played a really

831
00:33:44,041 --> 00:33:46,641
Speaker 2: small part in helping get them to that spot. And

832
00:33:46,721 --> 00:33:49,081
Speaker 2: if I ask others about what they think about all that,

833
00:33:49,601 --> 00:33:51,601
Speaker 2: but it's something I think a lot about. It's something

834
00:33:51,641 --> 00:33:53,361
Speaker 2: I think a lot about as my role as a leader,

835
00:33:53,641 --> 00:33:56,441
Speaker 2: that it's not just a right, it's a privilege, and

836
00:33:56,481 --> 00:33:58,681
Speaker 2: that I need to turn up every day one thing

837
00:33:58,681 --> 00:34:01,081
Speaker 2: I do. I'm very intentional about how I show up,

838
00:34:01,201 --> 00:34:03,081
Speaker 2: and so I will think on the way into work,

839
00:34:03,161 --> 00:34:04,721
Speaker 2: what do my team need from me today? How do

840
00:34:04,801 --> 00:34:06,601
Speaker 2: I need to show up? What's happening at the moment

841
00:34:06,641 --> 00:34:09,281
Speaker 2: that might be important for them, that might influence how

842
00:34:09,321 --> 00:34:11,281
Speaker 2: I show up. And I think that's important because that's

843
00:34:11,281 --> 00:34:13,001
Speaker 2: the decision you get to make as a leader, is

844
00:34:13,321 --> 00:34:15,241
Speaker 2: they will take cues from how I show up, and

845
00:34:15,281 --> 00:34:17,961
Speaker 2: so what's happening in sort of broader enviru it's pretty important.

846
00:34:18,041 --> 00:34:20,041
Speaker 1: Well, my last two Christians for you are I want

847
00:34:20,041 --> 00:34:22,321
Speaker 1: to know because it's just so much in your life,

848
00:34:22,321 --> 00:34:24,281
Speaker 1: so much in your mind. You're looking after everybody else.

849
00:34:24,601 --> 00:34:26,681
Speaker 1: What keeps Travis up at night? Or does Travis sleep

850
00:34:26,761 --> 00:34:27,361
Speaker 1: quite well? Oh?

851
00:34:27,361 --> 00:34:28,881
Speaker 2: Don't sleep so well? All sleep better?

852
00:34:29,201 --> 00:34:30,641
Speaker 1: Is your mind thinking? Is it what it is? Or

853
00:34:30,641 --> 00:34:31,841
Speaker 1: are you one of those thing it is?

854
00:34:32,001 --> 00:34:33,761
Speaker 2: Yeah, yeah, I'm up. It's not unusual for me to

855
00:34:33,761 --> 00:34:35,361
Speaker 2: get up at the middle of night and write some stuff

856
00:34:35,361 --> 00:34:37,361
Speaker 2: down or think through things. So I'm not the role

857
00:34:37,401 --> 00:34:39,281
Speaker 2: model for this stuff. I can see the way you'll

858
00:34:39,281 --> 00:34:39,561
Speaker 2: get me.

859
00:34:41,001 --> 00:34:43,761
Speaker 1: I don't sleep at all, Like my brain goes crazy

860
00:34:43,761 --> 00:34:46,241
Speaker 1: if it was wondering with someone that gives so much

861
00:34:46,281 --> 00:34:48,641
Speaker 1: to others and there's so much considerations, like I was

862
00:34:48,681 --> 00:34:51,521
Speaker 1: just interested, because often sleep is the time where you know,

863
00:34:51,601 --> 00:34:53,281
Speaker 1: we can't wind it down and we're still thinking so

864
00:34:53,361 --> 00:34:54,201
Speaker 1: much about other people.

865
00:34:54,361 --> 00:34:57,440
Speaker 2: Yeah, that's so for me. My wine downtime is exercise. Okay,

866
00:34:57,481 --> 00:34:59,641
Speaker 2: I really liked exercise, and so if I go cycle

867
00:34:59,681 --> 00:35:01,361
Speaker 2: a bit now, and so if I'm out with mate Psyche,

868
00:35:01,481 --> 00:35:03,841
Speaker 2: I'm not thinking about work stuff. I am actually engaging

869
00:35:03,841 --> 00:35:05,321
Speaker 2: with them and a bit of fun in the band, yeah,

870
00:35:05,321 --> 00:35:07,201
Speaker 2: what I enjoy. So sleep is not that for me.

871
00:35:07,481 --> 00:35:09,921
Speaker 2: I'll often be thinking about things, and so I can

872
00:35:10,001 --> 00:35:11,201
Speaker 2: sort of go to bed with a head full of

873
00:35:11,281 --> 00:35:12,841
Speaker 2: work and wake up with her for work. And so

874
00:35:13,441 --> 00:35:15,601
Speaker 2: that's on why I sort of to do itet better

875
00:35:15,641 --> 00:35:17,761
Speaker 2: at There's lots of things that keep me out at night.

876
00:35:17,841 --> 00:35:19,521
Speaker 2: It's probably what motivates me, to be honest, I'm not

877
00:35:19,521 --> 00:35:21,881
Speaker 2: one that sort of relaxes too much in a sense

878
00:35:21,921 --> 00:35:23,841
Speaker 2: of personally or professionally. I always like the things I

879
00:35:23,841 --> 00:35:25,440
Speaker 2: want to do differently or better, or things I haven't

880
00:35:25,481 --> 00:35:27,961
Speaker 2: done yet, and that's probably just make yeah fair enough.

881
00:35:28,081 --> 00:35:30,440
Speaker 1: And my last question for you is, let's cast your

882
00:35:30,441 --> 00:35:33,961
Speaker 1: mind back to how old, shall we say, eighteen year

883
00:35:34,001 --> 00:35:36,761
Speaker 1: old Travis, what's the best advice you'd give.

884
00:35:36,681 --> 00:35:39,281
Speaker 2: Him from what you know now, I think the first

885
00:35:39,281 --> 00:35:42,281
Speaker 2: one is just to take opportunities they come. My career

886
00:35:42,601 --> 00:35:44,601
Speaker 2: hasn't been a straight line. I'm a big believer in

887
00:35:44,641 --> 00:35:46,401
Speaker 2: sort of building the base, and so I've got to

888
00:35:46,401 --> 00:35:49,440
Speaker 2: dis role with a whole lot of different experiences which

889
00:35:49,441 --> 00:35:51,641
Speaker 2: hopefully help my sort of toolkit that I've got today.

890
00:35:51,801 --> 00:35:53,961
Speaker 2: And so I'm a big believer that an opportunity might

891
00:35:54,001 --> 00:35:55,641
Speaker 2: not be obvious, but take it if it comes. I

892
00:35:55,641 --> 00:35:57,441
Speaker 2: remember when I was at university. I was two and

893
00:35:57,481 --> 00:35:59,201
Speaker 2: a half years in. The guy I was living with,

894
00:35:59,201 --> 00:36:01,921
Speaker 2: a very smart guy going to be very successful, came

895
00:36:01,921 --> 00:36:03,681
Speaker 2: to me and said, one of the bigg accounting firms

896
00:36:03,721 --> 00:36:06,321
Speaker 2: in Melbourne is offered me a job finished six months early.

897
00:36:06,521 --> 00:36:08,361
Speaker 2: And it was really hard to get into accounting firms

898
00:36:08,361 --> 00:36:11,761
Speaker 2: back then in the chartered world. That's this incredible world done.

899
00:36:11,881 --> 00:36:13,001
Speaker 2: So I'm not going to take it. I'm going to

900
00:36:13,001 --> 00:36:16,161
Speaker 2: finish my Uni right, And so went to bed, got

901
00:36:16,161 --> 00:36:18,001
Speaker 2: out the next morning and I said to him, that

902
00:36:18,041 --> 00:36:20,001
Speaker 2: doesn't make sense to me. You're going to do that?

903
00:36:20,241 --> 00:36:22,361
Speaker 2: Can I speak to that person and see if I'll

904
00:36:22,361 --> 00:36:24,281
Speaker 2: give me the job? Right? And he's like, oh, I know,

905
00:36:24,361 --> 00:36:25,921
Speaker 2: Like that's a friend of the family and the guy's

906
00:36:25,921 --> 00:36:27,441
Speaker 2: a partner, and I said, just let me have a

907
00:36:27,521 --> 00:36:29,001
Speaker 2: chat to it. And that's how I got my first job.

908
00:36:29,121 --> 00:36:31,001
Speaker 2: I rang up and said, I know you're going to

909
00:36:31,001 --> 00:36:32,801
Speaker 2: give the job to Andy, but he doesn't want it.

910
00:36:32,841 --> 00:36:34,841
Speaker 2: I want it. This guy's like what he said, coming

911
00:36:34,841 --> 00:36:36,361
Speaker 2: to have a meeting with me. I went met with him.

912
00:36:36,521 --> 00:36:38,321
Speaker 2: This is the twenty year old mate.

913
00:36:38,441 --> 00:36:38,881
Speaker 1: Wow.

914
00:36:39,041 --> 00:36:40,441
Speaker 2: And so a bit of bolder said, a bit of

915
00:36:40,481 --> 00:36:42,521
Speaker 2: just there's opportunity everywhere if you look for And so

916
00:36:42,521 --> 00:36:44,201
Speaker 2: that's what I'd say to an eighteen year old is

917
00:36:44,681 --> 00:36:46,440
Speaker 2: keep your eyes open. But I've been minded to watch

918
00:36:46,441 --> 00:36:48,001
Speaker 2: in front of you. It might I'll be obvious the

919
00:36:48,041 --> 00:36:50,681
Speaker 2: next step. But just take things and work out later

920
00:36:50,681 --> 00:36:52,081
Speaker 2: how are you going to do them? And so I've

921
00:36:52,081 --> 00:36:55,481
Speaker 2: had a career of being offered things in addition to

922
00:36:55,521 --> 00:36:57,481
Speaker 2: my role, a new roles like yeah, Bugret, I'm going

923
00:36:57,481 --> 00:36:59,241
Speaker 2: to do that and I'll work out later on holme,

924
00:36:59,241 --> 00:37:01,281
Speaker 2: I actually I can do it. Yeah, And so that

925
00:37:01,321 --> 00:37:03,281
Speaker 2: would be the number one piece of advice for me

926
00:37:03,441 --> 00:37:04,081
Speaker 2: when I was eighteen.

927
00:37:04,201 --> 00:37:07,601
Speaker 1: That's amazing, Travis. It has been an absolute pleasure talking

928
00:37:07,641 --> 00:37:10,281
Speaker 1: to you. I'm so excited for your year and watching

929
00:37:10,281 --> 00:37:12,441
Speaker 1: what happens. So thank you so much for taking the

930
00:37:12,441 --> 00:37:13,480
Speaker 1: time to talk to me. It's been great.

931
00:37:13,481 --> 00:37:14,681
Speaker 2: Thanks. I appreciate you having me all