WEBVTT - Episode 4: A Strange Getaway 0:00:00.280 --> 0:00:04.720 Listeners are advised that this podcast series Bromman contains coarse 0:00:04.840 --> 0:00:08.920 language and adult themes. This podcast series is brought to 0:00:08.920 --> 0:00:43.400 you by me Hedley Thomas and The Australian Listen Photos. 0:00:43.760 --> 0:00:45.280 Oh here we go. This is why I kept this. 0:00:46.240 --> 0:00:50.040 What you can see there? That car, I think and 0:00:50.159 --> 0:00:53.120 Murray'll be able to tell you for sure was the 0:00:53.200 --> 0:00:57.639 car that he used to go to Sydney the night 0:00:57.760 --> 0:00:58.560 she disappeared. 0:00:58.960 --> 0:01:04.080 I see on the evening of May sixteenth, nineteen ninety three, 0:01:04.240 --> 0:01:07.640 Bromwin was at home with her two daughters, next door 0:01:07.680 --> 0:01:12.360 to Murray and Devin Sandstone Crescent. John has been away 0:01:12.440 --> 0:01:16.480 in Sydney for work. He and Bromwin had formerly separated 0:01:16.560 --> 0:01:22.119 seven weeks earlier. The Winfield family car, a white Ford 0:01:22.280 --> 0:01:27.240 Falcon Sedan, was in the driveway. Murray always knew when 0:01:27.319 --> 0:01:30.560 John or Broman left the house in that car because 0:01:30.600 --> 0:01:32.080 of a distinctive noise. 0:01:32.120 --> 0:01:35.840 It made it ad litally squeaking brakes. And so that's 0:01:35.880 --> 0:01:37.600 why I was sitting here. I thought, I'll get to 0:01:37.600 --> 0:01:39.959 your Bromin's car. It's like I heard it before I 0:01:39.959 --> 0:01:43.000 saw it. So I'm sitting on the unge here two 0:01:43.040 --> 0:01:46.600 Viel's there I'm actually watching Wore the Roses. 0:01:47.960 --> 0:01:52.040 The black satirical comedy from the late eighties stars Michael 0:01:52.120 --> 0:01:56.920 Douglas and Kathleen Turner. A married couple heading towards a 0:01:57.120 --> 0:02:01.000 bitter divorce, The Roses fight to the death for the 0:02:01.080 --> 0:02:05.480 family home and its contents. I want a divorce. 0:02:06.440 --> 0:02:07.200 No, you don't. 0:02:08.760 --> 0:02:09.639 You can't have one. 0:02:12.400 --> 0:02:15.679 I've thought about this a lot. I really don't want 0:02:15.680 --> 0:02:19.120 to be married to you anymore. I may have let 0:02:19.160 --> 0:02:22.359 you have the house, but now you'll never get it. 0:02:23.880 --> 0:02:26.120 You will never get that house. 0:02:27.760 --> 0:02:28.560 Do you understand? 0:02:30.960 --> 0:02:34.040 You will never get that house. 0:02:36.120 --> 0:02:39.440 The movement and noise of the white Ford Falcon owned 0:02:39.480 --> 0:02:43.320 by his neighbors grabbed Murray's attention, and he stopped watching 0:02:43.520 --> 0:02:44.720 War of the Roses. 0:02:45.760 --> 0:02:49.560 When I heard the squeaky brakes, someone's stealing Broblem's car. 0:02:50.320 --> 0:02:53.040 Can you show me what you saw? Yes? 0:02:54.120 --> 0:02:54.160 What? 0:02:54.280 --> 0:02:56.079 The lounges used to be there, and the two v 0:02:56.200 --> 0:02:58.360 used to be there. So I've got up off that 0:02:58.400 --> 0:03:00.679 lounge when I heard the car break squeak, and I 0:03:00.800 --> 0:03:04.519 come up here and stood here. Yeah, and it was 0:03:04.560 --> 0:03:07.040 all open. I'll see the cargo out there. 0:03:07.520 --> 0:03:09.120 Let's walk outside onto the front. 0:03:09.160 --> 0:03:09.320 Law. 0:03:12.840 --> 0:03:16.720 So Jodn Broman's house. 0:03:18.280 --> 0:03:18.799 That's it there. 0:03:19.440 --> 0:03:20.560 Has the house changed much? 0:03:20.919 --> 0:03:25.680 Hasn't changed at all? Not one thing that exactly. 0:03:27.760 --> 0:03:32.080 Did you ever hear them arguing? No, so if they 0:03:32.160 --> 0:03:36.200 squabbled or fought, they were fairly quiet. Yeah, yeah, but 0:03:36.240 --> 0:03:37.400 you shouldna live far apart. 0:03:38.280 --> 0:03:39.240 Yeah, but I never heard it. 0:03:39.720 --> 0:03:41.800 Why did you think that it was a car theft 0:03:41.920 --> 0:03:44.160 rather than Bromin or John Travil car? 0:03:44.720 --> 0:03:47.920 Well, because it's no John was back. 0:03:48.040 --> 0:03:48.240 Yeah. 0:03:49.360 --> 0:03:52.800 Yeah. The car backed out with no lights. 0:03:52.560 --> 0:03:55.720 On, bottomed down on the road, does a big groove 0:03:55.760 --> 0:03:59.440 in the road and rolled down the hill down the 0:03:59.480 --> 0:04:01.360 bottom of he down here with no lights on. 0:04:01.480 --> 0:04:03.920 It's on, the lights on, start the engine and ran 0:04:04.000 --> 0:04:04.440 out of the way. 0:04:05.640 --> 0:04:09.000 When Murray describes the car bottoming out and leaving a 0:04:09.080 --> 0:04:12.760 groove in the road, he's describing what he believes must 0:04:12.760 --> 0:04:16.600 have happened. He distinctly heard the noise of what he 0:04:16.720 --> 0:04:20.160 says must have been the chassis or underside of the 0:04:20.200 --> 0:04:23.960 back of the car beneath the boot or trunk scraping 0:04:24.000 --> 0:04:27.560 on Bitchamen. As the car reversed from the sloping driveway 0:04:27.680 --> 0:04:30.760 and onto the road of Sandstone Crescent. 0:04:31.400 --> 0:04:33.440 The car bottomed out and strap from the road out 0:04:33.440 --> 0:04:36.839 the front. But it dug a pretty deep hole in 0:04:36.880 --> 0:04:39.680 the road. Have it occasionally spraped before? 0:04:39.760 --> 0:04:40.039 Yes? 0:04:40.640 --> 0:04:42.760 Yes, At this time when it scraped, it actually dug 0:04:42.760 --> 0:04:46.080 it with probably twenty five milad. 0:04:46.480 --> 0:04:51.159 And did you infer anything at the time that was 0:04:51.200 --> 0:04:53.960 suspicious from that scrape and that noise? 0:04:54.040 --> 0:04:57.239 And yeah? Oh for see the boots fitevy. 0:04:58.279 --> 0:05:01.560 You remember seeing the car rolling down hill headlights off 0:05:01.600 --> 0:05:07.719 and jed off. Had you seen John or Bromin driving 0:05:07.720 --> 0:05:08.920 the car down the hill like that? 0:05:09.000 --> 0:05:10.080 Pool? Nah? 0:05:10.240 --> 0:05:14.240 No, Have you ever driven down this hill without your 0:05:14.240 --> 0:05:15.200 engine and lights hill? 0:05:15.440 --> 0:05:15.839 No? 0:05:15.839 --> 0:05:17.719 No, it's pretty unusual. 0:05:17.800 --> 0:05:19.040 It's very unusual. Yeah. 0:05:19.960 --> 0:05:22.599 Yeah, And normally they would always come out of. 0:05:22.560 --> 0:05:24.760 The driveway and go up the hill. Yeah, it was 0:05:25.120 --> 0:05:25.760 an odd thing to do. 0:05:26.680 --> 0:05:28.279 Is that what made you suspicious? 0:05:29.200 --> 0:05:29.360 Oh? 0:05:29.440 --> 0:05:29.880 Definitely. 0:05:30.680 --> 0:05:34.240 At the time, I was concerned about someone steel in 0:05:34.279 --> 0:05:37.240 my car and it was Brom's car, so I got 0:05:37.279 --> 0:05:38.320 up in this twenty to eleven. 0:05:39.320 --> 0:05:41.640 That's strange for a car leaving a strong night. 0:05:43.360 --> 0:05:47.920 Murray's account of seeing and hearing the Winfield vehicle leaving 0:05:47.920 --> 0:05:51.240 the house in Sandstone Crescent on the night of Sunday, 0:05:51.400 --> 0:05:56.400 May sixteenth, nineteen ninety three, must be solid. But Bronwan 0:05:56.680 --> 0:06:00.960 wasn't driving that car. Her husband John was behind the wheel, 0:06:01.640 --> 0:06:05.520 and the reason for the car bottoming out scraping on 0:06:05.560 --> 0:06:10.760 the bitchmen. Five years after Bromwin disappeared, the detective sergeant 0:06:10.760 --> 0:06:15.240 from Ballina Police, Glenn Taylor, who led a comprehensive investigation 0:06:15.400 --> 0:06:18.880 and prepared a significant brief of evidence for an inquest, 0:06:19.200 --> 0:06:22.080 was of the view that the car bottomed out because 0:06:22.160 --> 0:06:25.120 Broman's body was in the boot or the back seat. 0:06:25.839 --> 0:06:31.320 It's a very serious allegation and John Winfield emphatically denies this. 0:06:32.080 --> 0:06:35.600 But John certainly does not deny that he was driving 0:06:35.640 --> 0:06:39.600 the car about that time. In fact, he says it 0:06:39.680 --> 0:06:42.240 was him, and we're going to deal with this in 0:06:42.320 --> 0:06:47.040 detail in this episode and in the next one. First, 0:06:47.080 --> 0:06:50.479 it's important to establish the chronology of events over the 0:06:50.560 --> 0:06:54.000 Saturday and Sunday leading up to the time of about 0:06:54.160 --> 0:06:58.120 ten forty pm on Sunday when the family car left 0:06:58.560 --> 0:07:03.360 and Bromwin was never again. Will go first to the 0:07:03.360 --> 0:07:08.599 evidence of Jody, John's daughter from his first marriage. In 0:07:08.640 --> 0:07:12.120 a previous episode, you heard how Bromman had written a 0:07:12.200 --> 0:07:17.120 heartfelt letter to Jody pledging love and support for her stepdaughter, 0:07:17.280 --> 0:07:22.280 notwithstanding the breakdown of the marriage. In Jody's statement to 0:07:22.320 --> 0:07:26.360 police five years later in September nineteen ninety eight, she 0:07:26.520 --> 0:07:31.320 discloses a telephone conversation with broman on the Friday, two 0:07:31.440 --> 0:07:33.960 days before her stepmother's disappearance. 0:07:35.200 --> 0:07:37.240 I can't recall how it happened, but I rang the 0:07:37.280 --> 0:07:40.600 house at Sandstone Crescent and Bronwin answered the telephone. She 0:07:40.680 --> 0:07:42.560 told me that she'd moved back into the house with 0:07:42.640 --> 0:07:45.400 the kids and that she was staying there. She also 0:07:45.480 --> 0:07:47.520 told me that Dad was not welcome there and that 0:07:47.600 --> 0:07:50.240 he can stay in Sydney with me. She told me 0:07:50.280 --> 0:07:52.200 that she was going to get a restraining order so 0:07:52.240 --> 0:07:55.160 that he couldn't come near the house. She also told 0:07:55.160 --> 0:07:57.120 me that the house belonged to her, and I really 0:07:57.160 --> 0:07:59.480 noticed that she changed from the person who wanted us 0:07:59.480 --> 0:08:02.920 all to say close. We both started to argue because 0:08:02.920 --> 0:08:04.880 I told her that it was not her house and 0:08:04.920 --> 0:08:08.840 that it belonged to Dad, Crystal, Lauren and me as well. 0:08:09.040 --> 0:08:11.040 I also told her that it belonged to us, more 0:08:11.080 --> 0:08:13.520 so because she was the one that chose to leave. 0:08:14.760 --> 0:08:19.000 It is an interesting point. Jody is suggesting that because 0:08:19.080 --> 0:08:22.760 Bromin had decided to leave John and had moved out 0:08:22.800 --> 0:08:26.320 of the house for about seven weeks. Her entitlement to 0:08:26.400 --> 0:08:31.320 the property was diminished. John's daughter, Jody, was living in 0:08:31.360 --> 0:08:35.120 Sydney at the time of these conversations with Bromwin. She 0:08:35.280 --> 0:08:39.600 was eighteen years old and close to her dad. Jody 0:08:39.720 --> 0:08:42.640 was twenty three when she gave her statement to police 0:08:42.679 --> 0:08:46.400 in nineteen ninety eight. These are her words, it's not 0:08:46.520 --> 0:08:47.040 her voice. 0:08:48.080 --> 0:08:50.239 I asked her what had made her change her attitude 0:08:50.240 --> 0:08:52.480 so much, and she told me that the clairvoyant had 0:08:52.480 --> 0:08:54.400 told her to move back in and do all this. 0:08:55.520 --> 0:08:58.120 It developed into a very heated argument and we were 0:08:58.160 --> 0:08:59.880 yelling at each other, and she hung up on me. 0:09:00.520 --> 0:09:03.079 I immediately rang her back and the phone was engaged. 0:09:03.480 --> 0:09:05.360 I kept trying, but she must have left the phone 0:09:05.360 --> 0:09:09.040 off the hook. The following day, which would have been Saturday, 0:09:09.160 --> 0:09:12.280 fifteenth of May nineteen ninety three, I rang the Lennox 0:09:12.280 --> 0:09:15.160 head house before I went to work. It would have 0:09:15.200 --> 0:09:17.520 been before nine am when I spoke to Cristel and 0:09:17.559 --> 0:09:19.240 she told me that Bronwin had gone out for the 0:09:19.320 --> 0:09:22.439 day and would not be returning until four o'clock that afternoon. 0:09:23.679 --> 0:09:26.280 At that stage, Cristel was about ten years of age 0:09:26.320 --> 0:09:29.960 and Lauren was five. I asked Cristel who was minding them, 0:09:29.960 --> 0:09:32.160 and she told me that she was minding Lauren and 0:09:32.200 --> 0:09:34.200 that it was great because she had never been left 0:09:34.200 --> 0:09:37.319 alone before. I told Christel that I wanted to talk 0:09:37.360 --> 0:09:40.520 to her mother when she got home. When I terminated 0:09:40.520 --> 0:09:42.960 the phone call and told Dad, he appeared to be 0:09:43.160 --> 0:09:45.360 very stressed out about it because they had never been 0:09:45.440 --> 0:09:47.679 left alone before and he was so far away. 0:09:49.080 --> 0:09:51.920 It's hard to know what to make of this claim 0:09:52.000 --> 0:09:54.800 by Jody that Bronwin was going to leave her two 0:09:55.000 --> 0:09:59.760 children alone in the house through Saturday. Everybody who has 0:09:59.800 --> 0:10:03.079 to to me and to the police has stressed how 0:10:03.160 --> 0:10:09.320 responsible Bromwin was. If anything, Bromwin was overly protective. That's 0:10:09.360 --> 0:10:13.040 the message I took from all of these conversations with witnesses, 0:10:13.679 --> 0:10:16.120 and they ranged from those who were close to her 0:10:16.240 --> 0:10:19.319 to others who didn't know her well but just saw 0:10:19.360 --> 0:10:24.360 her attentiveness. You heard from Virginia Bevis in the previous 0:10:24.400 --> 0:10:27.800 episode when she mentioned that her daughter had babysat on 0:10:27.840 --> 0:10:31.040 the Saturday night when broman went to the birthday party 0:10:31.160 --> 0:10:37.000 in Lennox. Virginia remembers Bromwin disclosing that her stepdaughter Jody 0:10:37.160 --> 0:10:40.240 had telephoned the house after broman and the girls had 0:10:40.320 --> 0:10:43.959 moved back into Sandstone Crescent, and. 0:10:44.000 --> 0:10:46.800 Jodi rang it when she moved back in and said, 0:10:46.840 --> 0:10:48.640 how do you move back in Dad's house? 0:10:48.880 --> 0:10:50.160 Because she told me that too. 0:10:51.960 --> 0:10:52.600 Why would that be? 0:10:52.800 --> 0:10:54.240 How do you She was furious. 0:10:54.400 --> 0:10:59.360 Yeah, John had said something to Jody, and Jody rang 0:10:59.400 --> 0:11:01.839 Bromwin in the abused and. 0:11:01.920 --> 0:11:03.040 I remember. 0:11:04.320 --> 0:11:08.400 Virginia told me something else, which underlines how careful Bromwin 0:11:08.720 --> 0:11:12.960 was with her daughters, Crystal and Lauren. Just before Bromwin 0:11:13.160 --> 0:11:16.240 left for the birthday party on the Saturday evening, she 0:11:16.400 --> 0:11:19.600 walked with her daughters to the nearby home of Virginia 0:11:19.840 --> 0:11:21.280 and her husband Lee. 0:11:21.840 --> 0:11:25.400 She was really nervous, and my husband kept on telling 0:11:25.320 --> 0:11:27.480 her how great she looked, and it'd be great. 0:11:27.640 --> 0:11:29.240 And it wasn't that. 0:11:29.240 --> 0:11:30.840 Late that night that we saw. 0:11:32.240 --> 0:11:36.320 The reason for the brief meeting was simple. Bromwin had 0:11:36.400 --> 0:11:39.679 already made an arrangement for her girls to be babysat 0:11:39.760 --> 0:11:42.400 by Virginia and Lee's daughter Celeste. 0:11:43.320 --> 0:11:45.920 It was probably Mant sevenish that we saw that she 0:11:46.040 --> 0:11:46.440 come over. 0:11:47.640 --> 0:11:49.360 Haw'd she see excited? 0:11:51.200 --> 0:11:53.160 She was only coming over to pick up our daughter 0:11:53.280 --> 0:11:57.319 to take her back there across the road to babysit. 0:11:57.960 --> 0:12:00.119 That's why I said she'd never leave those kids. 0:12:00.600 --> 0:12:02.160 And she carried the kids in too. 0:12:02.559 --> 0:12:05.160 It was about her wanting to look after your daughter 0:12:05.240 --> 0:12:07.320 and hers. Yeah at the same time. 0:12:08.200 --> 0:12:11.840 Yeah, yeah, no, she brought him in. 0:12:12.200 --> 0:12:14.920 You just found that was reinforcement with or view that 0:12:14.960 --> 0:12:16.040 she was a very dating mother. 0:12:16.240 --> 0:12:20.320 Oh god, Ja, even at work at Eden's, it's a 0:12:20.520 --> 0:12:22.800 nursing Lauren on her breaks. 0:12:22.840 --> 0:12:25.960 And then she wouldn't leave those kids for the world. 0:12:27.559 --> 0:12:30.199 You saw her being fairly devoted with her kids. 0:12:32.120 --> 0:12:35.360 Just knock on the door. She carried Lauren in and 0:12:35.360 --> 0:12:37.200 they were all round way in the world. 0:12:37.960 --> 0:12:38.599 She would lead it. 0:12:39.280 --> 0:12:40.480 But I never saw her again. 0:12:42.080 --> 0:12:45.800 Several hours before Virginia saw her for the last time, 0:12:45.960 --> 0:12:50.360 Bronwyn telephoned the home of Richard and Jane Johnston in Sydney. 0:12:51.360 --> 0:12:55.040 Richard Johnston is a cousin of John Winfield, and Richard's 0:12:55.040 --> 0:12:59.559 wife Jane had become Bromwin's friend. They lived close by 0:12:59.720 --> 0:13:02.720 in the shire and even shared a home there for 0:13:02.760 --> 0:13:05.080 a month and a half while John was building the 0:13:05.120 --> 0:13:09.800 house in Sandstone Crescent, Lennox Head. These are the words 0:13:09.840 --> 0:13:13.560 of Richard and Jane Johnston. These are not their voices. 0:13:14.520 --> 0:13:16.560 I became a bit of a confidant to Bronwyn and 0:13:16.640 --> 0:13:19.080 I got to know her extremely well. We would often 0:13:19.080 --> 0:13:21.320 talk on the telephone, and it was mostly for an 0:13:21.320 --> 0:13:24.560 hour at a time. When Bronwyn moved to Lennox Head, 0:13:24.840 --> 0:13:28.160 we still kept in constant contact. In fact, no longer 0:13:28.160 --> 0:13:30.120 than a month would go by without a phone call. 0:13:31.080 --> 0:13:33.440 I noticed that the telephone calls from Bronwyn during the 0:13:33.480 --> 0:13:36.280 latter part of nineteen ninety two and the early part 0:13:36.320 --> 0:13:41.079 of nineteen ninety three contained more specific complaints. These complaints 0:13:41.120 --> 0:13:44.920 concerned the possibility of violence. She would often state to 0:13:44.960 --> 0:13:47.160 me that she was scared of John and worried that 0:13:47.240 --> 0:13:50.120 he would hit her, Although she never ever told me 0:13:50.160 --> 0:13:52.360 that he did, and I'm sure she would have if 0:13:52.400 --> 0:13:55.720 it had occurred. She did inform me after Christmas that 0:13:55.840 --> 0:13:58.440 year he had backed her up against the kitchen cabinets 0:13:58.480 --> 0:14:00.840 and raised his hand as if to hit her, but 0:14:00.920 --> 0:14:04.400 then just walked away. She would always tell me during 0:14:04.400 --> 0:14:07.400 these conversations that she felt like leaving John, and at 0:14:07.400 --> 0:14:09.319 one point I told her to leave if it was 0:14:09.400 --> 0:14:12.560 really as bad as she said. She would also tell 0:14:12.600 --> 0:14:14.719 me that John would keep her short of money and 0:14:14.800 --> 0:14:17.240 wouldn't let her have any more than about thirty dollars 0:14:17.320 --> 0:14:20.040 in her purse. She would have to account for every 0:14:20.120 --> 0:14:22.600 cent that he had given her, and she had to 0:14:22.640 --> 0:14:25.360 ask for everything she needed. She couldn't just go and 0:14:25.440 --> 0:14:28.440 draw money from the bank. She did say on one 0:14:28.480 --> 0:14:31.200 occasion that John would not give her any money because 0:14:31.200 --> 0:14:33.000 he wanted to make sure she couldn't leave. 0:14:34.360 --> 0:14:38.000 When Richard Johnston spoke to police, he explained that when 0:14:38.120 --> 0:14:41.600 he and Jane had last visited Bromwin and John in 0:14:41.600 --> 0:14:44.120 the Lennox in October the previous year. 0:14:44.880 --> 0:14:47.760 There was some fiction between them. I recall that it 0:14:47.840 --> 0:14:50.680 was a very uncomfortable evening. I did not see any 0:14:50.720 --> 0:14:53.600 physical contact between them, but there seemed to have been 0:14:53.680 --> 0:14:55.440 some verbal confrontation between them. 0:14:55.440 --> 0:15:00.080 Earlier, Richard told police about the call that he received 0:15:00.520 --> 0:15:02.480 the day before Bronwyn vanished. 0:15:03.400 --> 0:15:05.840 The next time I had any contact was on Saturday, 0:15:05.920 --> 0:15:09.200 May fifteen, nineteen ninety three. I was at home when 0:15:09.200 --> 0:15:12.560 Bronwyn rang on the telephone and asked for Jane. This 0:15:12.640 --> 0:15:15.320 would have been somewhere between two thirty and three pm 0:15:15.440 --> 0:15:19.320 in the afternoon. I told Bronwyn that Jane was overseas 0:15:19.640 --> 0:15:22.800 but would be back in a few weeks. Bronwyn seemed 0:15:22.880 --> 0:15:25.600 very upset on the telephone, and I asked her, could 0:15:25.600 --> 0:15:28.560 I have Jane ring her. Bronwyn said for me not 0:15:28.640 --> 0:15:32.000 to worry and she would ring her later. I did 0:15:32.000 --> 0:15:34.600 not know why Bronwyn was upset, but I could tell 0:15:34.680 --> 0:15:38.240 something was bothering her by the tone of her voice. 0:15:38.360 --> 0:15:42.520 Richard and Jane had emigrated from the United Kingdom several 0:15:42.640 --> 0:15:46.960 years earlier, and coincidentally, Richard flew to the UK on 0:15:47.160 --> 0:15:50.880 May sixteen, and he and Jane returned to Australia in 0:15:51.000 --> 0:15:55.360 June of that year, nineteen ninety three. By then, Bronwyn 0:15:55.400 --> 0:15:56.920 had been missing for a month. 0:15:57.760 --> 0:16:00.240 I have never had any contact with Bronwyn since what's 0:16:00.320 --> 0:16:03.200 the last phone call on May fifteen, nineteen ninety three. 0:16:03.920 --> 0:16:06.280 John has told me that he has had no contact 0:16:06.320 --> 0:16:07.160 with Bronwyn either. 0:16:09.080 --> 0:16:11.120 I feel certain that if she was still alive, she 0:16:11.160 --> 0:16:14.040 would have made contact with her children if nobody else. 0:16:14.800 --> 0:16:17.200 She was a very devoted mother, and I am certain 0:16:17.240 --> 0:16:19.120 that she would not have left the children willingly. 0:16:20.520 --> 0:16:24.280 Shortly before the release of this episode, for Cristel assured 0:16:24.360 --> 0:16:27.480 friends and family of her hopes for a result from 0:16:27.480 --> 0:16:31.360 the podcast investigation into the disappearance of her mother, Bronwyn. 0:16:32.240 --> 0:16:35.880 Cristel does not know what happened to her mother. She 0:16:36.040 --> 0:16:40.520 likes to post photographs of her. More photos, including some 0:16:40.760 --> 0:16:43.920 Crystal has never seen, are being sent in now by 0:16:44.000 --> 0:16:47.800 people who knew Bronwyn. Some of the images include Crystal 0:16:47.840 --> 0:16:51.480 from when she was a little girl. I doubt Cristel 0:16:51.520 --> 0:16:54.560 will talk on the record in this podcast, and I 0:16:54.720 --> 0:16:58.760 haven't asked her to be a participant. It's well understood 0:16:58.800 --> 0:17:01.720 on Bromwyn's side of the family that Crystal doesn't want 0:17:01.760 --> 0:17:06.399 to upset her sister Lauren or her stepfather, John Winfield. 0:17:07.680 --> 0:17:10.720 Lauren hasn't had contact with her mom's side of the 0:17:10.760 --> 0:17:14.679 family for three decades, but Cristel is close to the 0:17:14.760 --> 0:17:19.359 read relations. In Cristel's recent message to her friends and 0:17:19.440 --> 0:17:23.920 family via Facebook, she posted some happy photographs of herself. 0:17:24.640 --> 0:17:26.840 She wrote, I just want. 0:17:26.680 --> 0:17:29.159 To thank everyone that has reached out to me this 0:17:29.280 --> 0:17:32.719 week to see how I'm doing. In conjunction with the 0:17:32.760 --> 0:17:37.760 recent Headley Thomas podcast release of my mother's disappearance. It 0:17:37.800 --> 0:17:42.399 has not been easy all these years. I chose not 0:17:42.520 --> 0:17:46.199 to be involved in it for various reasons. However, I 0:17:46.320 --> 0:17:49.520 do have a few theories on her disappearance based on 0:17:49.600 --> 0:17:53.280 my own life experiences, and maybe someone out there knows 0:17:53.280 --> 0:17:57.480 the truth. Maybe we can finally solve this mystery and 0:17:57.520 --> 0:18:01.679 put it all behind us. It's been so nice to 0:18:01.720 --> 0:18:05.520 reconnect with so many of you, and. 0:18:05.680 --> 0:18:09.560 Now weekends with Peter Vegan on four VC. 0:18:11.359 --> 0:18:14.199 Good Morning, Brisbane, Happy Saturday. It is the first of 0:18:14.320 --> 0:18:16.919 June and the first day of whinther It's the case 0:18:17.040 --> 0:18:19.880 of Bronwyn Winfield, who went missing from her home in 0:18:20.200 --> 0:18:24.280 Lennox Head thirty one years ago, leaving behind her two 0:18:24.359 --> 0:18:27.960 children and never to be heard from again. I listened 0:18:28.000 --> 0:18:30.919 to that Bronwen podcast yesterday and for people on the 0:18:30.920 --> 0:18:34.760 outside that don't understand how we work. If we're trying 0:18:34.800 --> 0:18:36.760 to get a family to speak about, whether it's a 0:18:36.760 --> 0:18:39.440 cold case an accident, at times you have to offer 0:18:39.480 --> 0:18:43.080 them a guarantee or a result, and families expect that 0:18:43.119 --> 0:18:45.000 if they do speak to you, that something is going 0:18:45.040 --> 0:18:47.520 to happen. How difficult is it for you Headley, to 0:18:47.520 --> 0:18:50.040 sit down with a family and not be able to 0:18:50.040 --> 0:18:52.320 guarantee that there's going to be an outcome if they 0:18:52.359 --> 0:18:53.160 tell their story. 0:18:53.520 --> 0:18:54.640 I have a general rule. 0:18:54.720 --> 0:18:58.480 I don't want to raise expectations to such a level 0:18:58.520 --> 0:19:02.520 that they believe they're definitely going to get justice that 0:19:02.560 --> 0:19:06.440 they believe has been denied for sometimes decades. I assure 0:19:06.480 --> 0:19:11.399 them that I'll give it absolute total commitment. It will 0:19:11.400 --> 0:19:16.040 bring mistiness who knows something, who have never talked before 0:19:16.520 --> 0:19:19.800 out of the woodwork. It causes people who have been 0:19:19.880 --> 0:19:23.720 keeping secrets a long time to think, I don't want 0:19:23.760 --> 0:19:27.040 to do this anymore. I actually want to tell Headley 0:19:27.160 --> 0:19:31.040 or the cops something that I saw or heard, something. 0:19:30.800 --> 0:19:31.760 That might be relevant. 0:19:32.080 --> 0:19:35.440 And that's why it's never too late with these cases. 0:19:35.520 --> 0:19:41.359 There's always a possibility of more and fresh, better information 0:19:41.800 --> 0:19:46.320 being produced. Unfortunately, a lot of cold cases that they 0:19:46.359 --> 0:19:50.439 can just age and go stale in an unsolved homicide 0:19:50.480 --> 0:19:55.520 squad's filing cabinet where there are so many of these. 0:19:56.160 --> 0:20:00.720 What the podcast investigations can do is all of the 0:20:00.760 --> 0:20:06.680 information in a coherent way over multiple episodes and attract 0:20:06.880 --> 0:20:08.400 witnesses who have never talked. 0:20:08.200 --> 0:20:11.560 Before for people that may not be aware of Bromwin Winfield. 0:20:11.640 --> 0:20:13.280 She was a young mother that lived in the town 0:20:13.359 --> 0:20:16.720 of lenox Head in New South Wales, a very small town. 0:20:17.240 --> 0:20:19.520 Head Lee a lot of people would find it difficult 0:20:19.520 --> 0:20:22.159 to keep secrets in a town like Lenox Head. But 0:20:22.200 --> 0:20:26.040 once again we have this, Oh the mother just took 0:20:26.080 --> 0:20:27.040 off mentality. 0:20:27.960 --> 0:20:33.760 How deeply stupid is that proposition? Then somebody could just 0:20:33.800 --> 0:20:37.439 sort of start again without the children that they've always 0:20:37.520 --> 0:20:42.439 dosed on, without leaving any trace, any evidence of life. 0:20:43.640 --> 0:20:47.960 And in Bromin's case, she's a very dedicated mother of two. 0:20:48.640 --> 0:20:49.760 Why would she take off? 0:20:50.000 --> 0:20:51.960 For someone to think that the mother would just leave 0:20:52.000 --> 0:20:55.760 their children a devoted mother. We hope that some good 0:20:55.840 --> 0:20:57.479 and I'm sure it will will come out of this 0:20:57.520 --> 0:20:58.439 podcast series. 0:20:58.640 --> 0:21:00.280 I really appreciate pir Thank you. 0:21:02.000 --> 0:21:05.399 This podcast series may be the last chance to solve 0:21:05.440 --> 0:21:10.640 a mystery spanning three decades, the last opportunity for Bromwin's 0:21:10.680 --> 0:21:13.600 family and loved ones and friends to know the truth. 0:21:14.320 --> 0:21:18.439 If you know something about Bromwin, about her marriage, about 0:21:18.440 --> 0:21:22.000 her fate that you believe could make some difference, even 0:21:22.040 --> 0:21:26.639 a small difference, then send me an email confidentially. The 0:21:26.680 --> 0:21:31.920 address is Bromwyn at the Australian dot com dot au. 0:21:56.200 --> 0:21:59.639 Let's go back to the police statement of John's daughter Jody, 0:22:00.240 --> 0:22:02.800 describing the events of the Saturday afternoon. 0:22:03.920 --> 0:22:06.600 I started ringing at four pm, and from memory, I 0:22:06.600 --> 0:22:08.520 think she answered and hung up when she heard my 0:22:08.640 --> 0:22:11.480 voice because she knew what was going to happen. I 0:22:11.520 --> 0:22:13.679 tried ringing her straight after, but she must have left 0:22:13.720 --> 0:22:15.639 the phone off the hook again. It was off the 0:22:15.640 --> 0:22:18.640 hook all night. I told Dad and he made arrangements 0:22:18.640 --> 0:22:21.720 to fly to Balaner the following day. I felt that 0:22:21.800 --> 0:22:23.840 I was out of the situation then when Dad was 0:22:23.880 --> 0:22:26.120 going back home to sort it out, so I left 0:22:26.160 --> 0:22:29.040 it to him. I can't recall whether I tried ringing 0:22:29.080 --> 0:22:33.359 the following day. The following afternoon, Sunday, May sixteenth, nineteen 0:22:33.440 --> 0:22:36.159 ninety three, I drove Dad to the Sydney Airport so 0:22:36.200 --> 0:22:37.760 that he could catch the plane to Balliner. 0:22:39.119 --> 0:22:41.280 The last time I spoke to bron was on the Saturday. 0:22:42.160 --> 0:22:46.440 We then later found out that she had a shift 0:22:47.320 --> 0:22:51.760 at the takeaway shop on the Sunday afternoon, and the 0:22:51.800 --> 0:22:55.160 girls were at home playing with the next door neighbor 0:22:55.200 --> 0:22:58.000 on the life side, Debbie's kids, and Debbie was looking 0:22:58.040 --> 0:22:59.879