WEBVTT - Managing sleep during the festive season

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<v Speaker 1>Gooday, thanks for joining us on the body and soul

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<v Speaker 1>podcast called Healthy Ish. I'm your host of Felicity Harley.

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<v Speaker 1>How did you sleep last night? Were you really hot?

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<v Speaker 1>Perhaps you are hungover? Perhaps he had a late night. Well,

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<v Speaker 1>my guest today is going to help you manage all

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<v Speaker 1>of the above. I'm joined by Nicole Moyan. She's the

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<v Speaker 1>director of science and clinical Research at eight Sleep and

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<v Speaker 1>holds her PhD in physiology from Stanford University. She's also

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<v Speaker 1>worked at various health tech companies like Fitbit and Whoop,

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<v Speaker 1>so she knows a lot about sleep and she's going

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<v Speaker 1>to help us manage our sleep quality and our quantity

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<v Speaker 1>during the festive season. And also she gives some great

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<v Speaker 1>tips on how to set up your room for the

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<v Speaker 1>hot summer nights. Make sure you're listening to our sister podcast,

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<v Speaker 1>Extra healthy Ish, where we talk more about circadian rhythms

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<v Speaker 1>and the key factors affecting sleep. You can grab that

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<v Speaker 1>one wherevergy podcasts. Nicole, Nice to have you joining us

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<v Speaker 1>from the US. How are you?

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<v Speaker 2>Thanks for having me. I'm doing well. How are you?

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah? I'm good well, actually, thankfully I had a good

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<v Speaker 1>night sleep last night. How about you did you, yes,

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<v Speaker 1>I did. Actually, as a sleep researcher, do you feel,

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<v Speaker 1>you know, pressure to have a good night sleep or

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<v Speaker 1>how's your how do you feel about approaching your night sleep?

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<v Speaker 2>I feel since working out of sleep Company, I feel

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<v Speaker 2>much more aware of my sleep, and I think also

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<v Speaker 2>we're constantly looking at our own data as well and

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<v Speaker 2>talking about it, so then you're you're it's the first

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<v Speaker 2>thing that you look at in the morning and the

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<v Speaker 2>first thing you reflect on and think about. So it's

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<v Speaker 2>definitely changed my perspective. But I don't know if I

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<v Speaker 2>feel pressure to have a good night sleep. I just

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<v Speaker 2>know that it's essential to performing well the next day.

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<v Speaker 1>Do you have any non negotiable habits when it comes

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<v Speaker 1>to sleep that perhaps you didn't have four and now

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<v Speaker 1>you actually you know in your job you're more focused on.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, there's like what I've really noticed in tracking my

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<v Speaker 2>data is that if I'm more of like an early bedtime,

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<v Speaker 2>early riser person, and I would try to stay up

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<v Speaker 2>with other people but then still be up early, and

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<v Speaker 2>it just I finally realized from looking at my data

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<v Speaker 2>that if I don't go to sleep like between nine

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<v Speaker 2>and ten, I usually miss my a good chunk of

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<v Speaker 2>deep sleep, and I don't seem to recover that later

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<v Speaker 2>in the night. Even if I sleep later in the morning,

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<v Speaker 2>I just miss it, and so I have like I

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<v Speaker 2>just it's a bad night of sleep for me. So

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<v Speaker 2>now I've been a lot stricter about like, Okay, I

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<v Speaker 2>need to go to sleep at nine pm, even though

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<v Speaker 2>it feels really early a.

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<v Speaker 1>Lot of times, what time do you get out of bit.

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<v Speaker 2>Between five and six?

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<v Speaker 1>So it's absolutely yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so that's been my like my newer non negotiable.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah, talk to us about managing slight during this particular

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<v Speaker 1>time of year, because li's light not I mean, you

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<v Speaker 1>do want to hang out with friends, you might have

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<v Speaker 1>a few drinks, then you're sleeping. What do you how

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<v Speaker 1>do we do? How do we manage?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah? I think it's tricky and it depends on the

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<v Speaker 2>person and what their holiday festivities look like. I don't

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<v Speaker 2>know if you're familiar with the term social jet lag

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<v Speaker 2>that's come Yeah, you've heard of it. Okay, it's come

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<v Speaker 2>about in the last couple of years where if you

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<v Speaker 2>know your body is really needs this specific rhythm. We're like,

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<v Speaker 2>we pretend like we're not like little kids, but we

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<v Speaker 2>really do better on a schedule, just like little kids do.

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<v Speaker 2>And if we keep that schedule, our body becomes very

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<v Speaker 2>attuned to it, and all the functions within your body

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<v Speaker 2>work really well, your circuitian rhythm. And the second we

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<v Speaker 2>try to deviate from that, all these things in your

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<v Speaker 2>body change, right and trying to adapt to it. And

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<v Speaker 2>so that's true for sleep. So if you stay up

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<v Speaker 2>one to two hours later, it's almost like you traveled

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<v Speaker 2>time zones to a new place, which is why they

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<v Speaker 2>call it social jet lag, because now you're trying to

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<v Speaker 2>stay up later, but then you're still your body is

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<v Speaker 2>still on a different time zone. So that's one thing

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<v Speaker 2>that can if you can try to instead of staying

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<v Speaker 2>up late, if you're not a late night person, meet

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<v Speaker 2>people for coffee or a run or something during the

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<v Speaker 2>day so you can kind of keep your routine. That's helpful.

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<v Speaker 2>Easier said than done. Alcohol You've probably heard most of them,

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<v Speaker 2>but try to mix a drink of water with a

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<v Speaker 2>drink of a glass of wine or a beer, and

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<v Speaker 2>then having electrolytes can really help you. So drinking electrolytes

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<v Speaker 2>before you go to sleep and then potentially when you

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<v Speaker 2>wake up as well, because alcohol dehydrates you. That can

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<v Speaker 2>really help. And then eating before you drink too can

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<v Speaker 2>be helpful to help absorb that alcohol.

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<v Speaker 1>Can we just go back to the first one. I

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<v Speaker 1>want to ask you a question about that that's really interesting.

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<v Speaker 1>So our body basically can get used to a certain

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<v Speaker 1>time frame as to how we sleep or routine and schedule. Yeah,

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<v Speaker 1>and how quickly does it fall apart? Is it after?

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<v Speaker 1>You know, if you have one light night on a

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<v Speaker 1>Thursday and one late night on a Friday, is that

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<v Speaker 1>is the weekend gone basically? Or And how long does

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<v Speaker 1>it take to recover?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, So there's there's some research showing that even just

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<v Speaker 2>one hour of sleep debt. So if you're off by

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<v Speaker 2>one hour, let's say you stay up an hour later

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<v Speaker 2>and you wake up at your normal time, so you

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<v Speaker 2>lose an hour of sleep that night, it can take

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<v Speaker 2>up to four days to recover that one hour of

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<v Speaker 2>sleep debt, So it can it can add up pretty quickly.

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<v Speaker 2>So yeah, to answer your question, it just depends on

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<v Speaker 2>the person and whether you can recover that leak with

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<v Speaker 2>a nab or something else. But generally it compounds pretty fast.

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<v Speaker 1>What about sleep ins? Are they useful? Can they be

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<v Speaker 1>more detrimental. You know, if you do have a late

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<v Speaker 1>night and you want to sleep, you better just you know,

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<v Speaker 1>you automatically wake up at say six thirty, if that's

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<v Speaker 1>what time you would, and you know often you're well myself,

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<v Speaker 1>well like okay, just try and go back to sleep,

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<v Speaker 1>and then I do, and then I wake up at

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<v Speaker 1>eight thirty? Is can that be more detrimental? You better

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<v Speaker 1>get am I better getting up at six thirty and

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<v Speaker 1>just getting on with my day even though I might

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<v Speaker 1>feel like crap.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, I think no, if you're going to feel like crap,

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<v Speaker 2>I think sleep in and getting that extra sleep is good, right,

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<v Speaker 2>But in general, trying to keep your body on that

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<v Speaker 2>same rhythm, it is going to be really helpful.

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<v Speaker 1>Yeah. Rhythm is based now down here in Australia, not

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<v Speaker 1>where you are in Chicago. It's pretty damn hot right now,

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<v Speaker 1>and I think that can be well, that can break

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<v Speaker 1>heavic on you sleep at night. Talk to us about

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<v Speaker 1>optimal sleeping temperatures and how we can things we can

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<v Speaker 1>do to sleep better in the heat.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah. So this is a great question, and there's a

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<v Speaker 2>lot of research showing that sleeping in the heat is

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<v Speaker 2>actually much worse for you than sleeping in the cold.

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<v Speaker 2>And I think a lot of that is because after

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<v Speaker 2>a certain point, you can't like remove more clothing or bedding,

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<v Speaker 2>you're kind of stuck, Whereas when it's cold you can

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<v Speaker 2>keep adding more layers or more blankets. And so generally

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<v Speaker 2>that there's a wide range of comfortable temperatures from seventeen

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<v Speaker 2>C all the way to twenty eight C. Twenty eight

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<v Speaker 2>C is like if you have no clothing and bedding,

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<v Speaker 2>that is deemed to be the comfortable temperature if you're

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<v Speaker 2>sleeping naked, and there's studies doing that there. So fourteen

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<v Speaker 2>to nineteen C is pretty comfortable if you are where

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<v Speaker 2>like normal bedding clothing, having light layers is going to

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<v Speaker 2>be helpful for you to regulate temperature throughout the night.

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<v Speaker 2>And there's actually research since you're in Sydney, coming out

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<v Speaker 2>of University of Sydney from Olliej's lab. I don't know

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<v Speaker 2>if you're familiar with him, but he's really working on

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<v Speaker 2>climate change and heat related topics, and he's shown that

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<v Speaker 2>having a pedestal or ceiling fan in the room can actually,

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<v Speaker 2>like on medium setting, can really help you stay cool

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<v Speaker 2>and you can keep you from using the AC until

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<v Speaker 2>you reach about twenty six twenty seven C. So instead

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<v Speaker 2>of using the AC earlier in the night, you can

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<v Speaker 2>turn on a fan that will help you stay cool

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<v Speaker 2>as well. And then of course there's how heat camass

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<v Speaker 2>capacity mattresses or like what we have a temperature regulating

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<v Speaker 2>mattress which can also help you stay cool throughout the night.

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<v Speaker 1>Is sleepy and I say bad? Is it? Can it

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<v Speaker 1>affect your sleep?

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<v Speaker 2>No, it's fine. I haven't seen anything. I mean, I

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<v Speaker 2>haven't seen anything that would impact your sleep negatively unless

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<v Speaker 2>it's really really cold. But even then, sleeping in the

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<v Speaker 2>cold hasn't hasn't been shown to be detrimental, unless it's

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<v Speaker 2>like causing you to wake up more often because it's

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<v Speaker 2>too cold.

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<v Speaker 1>Now you've got a pretty exciting job. I mean, you're

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<v Speaker 1>in the research. You're in the forefront of, well, the

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<v Speaker 1>development of slate research a part of it. Actually, that's

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<v Speaker 1>really great, great study out of Sydney UNI. What else

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<v Speaker 1>is out there? What is there anything exciting you research

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<v Speaker 1>into slate that you're specifically across or reading about.

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, so we are. I mean we've been pioneering modifying

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<v Speaker 2>the temperature of your bed based on the sleep stage

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<v Speaker 2>that you're in. And this came initially out of some

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<v Speaker 2>labs at Northwestern that showed that having cooler temperatures earlier

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<v Speaker 2>in the night can improve your deep sleep. So they

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<v Speaker 2>boost your deep sleep, and naturally, your core body temperature

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<v Speaker 2>is going down in the beginning of the night and

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<v Speaker 2>then it starts to get warmer before you wake up,

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<v Speaker 2>and as it drops down, that's when you get most

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<v Speaker 2>of your deep sleep. So we've essentially modified now we

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<v Speaker 2>did talked to what temperature you are, what sleep stage

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<v Speaker 2>you're in real time, and then modify the temperature of

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<v Speaker 2>your bed to help promote more time in each sleep stage.

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<v Speaker 2>So that's really what we've been working on pioneering at

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<v Speaker 2>the forefront of sleep.

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<v Speaker 1>Nice. It was lovely having you on Healthyah Nicole, Thank

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<v Speaker 1>you for joining us.

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<v Speaker 2>Thank you for having me.

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<v Speaker 1>Well friends. Looks like it takes a few days to

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<v Speaker 1>catch up on that late night sleep or that hangover.

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<v Speaker 1>Oh yeah, it takes me a few days hangover front. Anyway,

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<v Speaker 1>if you did enjoy this chat, you can rate and

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<v Speaker 1>review this episode, subscribe to this podcast anything else, hit

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<v Speaker 1>Body and Soul dot com dot follows on socials. You

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<v Speaker 1>can DM me at Felicity Halle check in our print edition,

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<v Speaker 1>which is out in your local Sunday paper, and until tomorrow,

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<v Speaker 1>stay healthy.