WEBVTT - Chat GPT’s new erotica mode

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<v Speaker 1>I'm Daniel James and you're listening to seven am. The

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<v Speaker 1>creators of chat GPT have just made a surprising announcement.

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<v Speaker 1>Erotica is coming to the world's most popular AI platform.

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<v Speaker 1>It's the latest step in a transformation of the Internet,

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<v Speaker 1>where artificial intelligence is shaping not just what we read

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<v Speaker 1>or search, but how we think, feel and even form relationships.

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<v Speaker 1>Today Associated editor for Kroarkey Cam Wilson on open AI's

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<v Speaker 1>bold new direction, the mental health rists behind the decision,

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<v Speaker 1>and what happens when the world's most powerful chatbot starts

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<v Speaker 1>getting personal. It's Wednesday, November five, Cam, open Ai, the

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<v Speaker 1>creators of chat GBT have announced the w rolling out

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<v Speaker 1>Erotica on the platform. What have they said about how

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<v Speaker 1>it will work and more? They're making this change at

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<v Speaker 1>this point in time.

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<v Speaker 2>So Sam Moltman, one of the co founders and the

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<v Speaker 2>lead of open ai, announced that the organization is going

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<v Speaker 2>to make some changes to its while we popular chat

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<v Speaker 2>jipt product, which it released in twenty twenty two. He said,

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<v Speaker 2>with reference to some mental health issues that have been

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<v Speaker 2>linked to use of its chatbot, that the organization open

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<v Speaker 2>ai had been successfully able to mitigate those.

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<v Speaker 3>There are fifteen thousand people a week that commit suicide,

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<v Speaker 3>about ten percent of the world talking and charge of BET.

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<v Speaker 3>That's like fifteen hundred people a week that are assuming

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<v Speaker 3>this is right, that are talking to Chaga bet and

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<v Speaker 3>still committing suicide. At the end of it, they probably

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<v Speaker 3>talked about it and we probably didn't save their lives.

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<v Speaker 3>Maybe we could have said something better, maybe we could

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<v Speaker 3>have been more proactive.

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<v Speaker 2>And also because of a new approach to it where

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<v Speaker 2>they are going to start age gating the chatbot and

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<v Speaker 2>trying to figure out us ages and restricting certain functions

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<v Speaker 2>so users, Sam Oltman said, it's time to let adults

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<v Speaker 2>be adults, and so we're going to allow chat chipet

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<v Speaker 2>the products that's used for everything from office productivity to search,

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<v Speaker 2>to also write erotica for our adult users.

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<v Speaker 1>So we'll get to this idea of educating a little

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<v Speaker 1>bit later on, but first, can you just lay out

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<v Speaker 1>for me what open ais founder Sam Milton means when

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<v Speaker 1>he talks about their previous attempts to deal with mental

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<v Speaker 1>health issues.

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<v Speaker 4>Yeah.

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<v Speaker 2>One of the biggest stories over the last year or

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<v Speaker 2>so with these AI chapots has been how AI chapots

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<v Speaker 2>appeared to have been playing a role in fueling egging

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<v Speaker 2>on people's mental health breakdowns. There's been examples of people

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<v Speaker 2>killing themselves citing chat jipt as part of the involvement

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<v Speaker 2>and involved in that has been this kind of often

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<v Speaker 2>sickophantic or encouraging relationship from chapbot.

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<v Speaker 5>Like many teens, Adam Rain started using chat gpt for homework,

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<v Speaker 5>which his parents Matt and Maria supported as their son

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<v Speaker 5>as innocent questions like can you become a doctor with

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<v Speaker 5>a biocam degree.

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<v Speaker 2>There's quite a high profile case on in the US

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<v Speaker 2>at the moment where the parents of a child who

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<v Speaker 2>who killed themselves are suing open Ai because they said

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<v Speaker 2>your product actually helped him along this path by giving

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<v Speaker 2>information about how to kill himself.

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<v Speaker 5>This morning, chat GBT hit with a scathing new lawsuit

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<v Speaker 5>alleging it helped a sixteen year old boy die by suicide.

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<v Speaker 2>And so as a result, OpenAI has started to release

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<v Speaker 2>features to kind of deal with these mental health problems,

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<v Speaker 2>and so, you know, in August this year they released

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<v Speaker 2>features that for example, they said that they were going

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<v Speaker 2>to use their systems to try and detect where the

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<v Speaker 2>people were spending long sessions on there not getting sleep,

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<v Speaker 2>having manic episodes and rather than having the chatbots as

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<v Speaker 2>they often want to do to kind of encourage people's

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<v Speaker 2>matic episodes, but to actually instead say, hey, you should

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<v Speaker 2>probably take a break. We don't really want using this anymore.

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<v Speaker 2>They also have even said that in some cases the

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<v Speaker 2>AI chatbots will alert authorities, and they also been talking

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<v Speaker 2>about introducing some parental controls.

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<v Speaker 4>So chat jipt is part of all of this.

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<v Speaker 2>Is said, we're also going to make it possible so that,

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<v Speaker 2>you know, you can have some oversight over how children

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<v Speaker 2>are using this app, which is still available to anyone

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<v Speaker 2>over the age of thirteen, And so Sam Moltman is saying,

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<v Speaker 2>we've dealt with these mental health issues, We've got them

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<v Speaker 2>under control, and so as a result, we can loosen up.

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<v Speaker 4>Our chat jipt to let adults be adults.

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<v Speaker 1>So they're changing the way the bot works to loosen

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<v Speaker 1>the way users can engage with it. What's behind that

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<v Speaker 1>loosening in your view cam?

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<v Speaker 2>Yeah, So, I mean, you know, I mentioned before this

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<v Speaker 2>kind of dependency and some really severe mental health issues

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<v Speaker 2>that had kind of come into the four with some

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<v Speaker 2>high profile incidents, but there was this kind of broader

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<v Speaker 2>thing where people just started observing that like that, a

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<v Speaker 2>lot of people seem to be developing quite strong like

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<v Speaker 2>dependence on earlier.

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<v Speaker 4>Versions of chat ChiPT.

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<v Speaker 2>A lot of that was linked around a previous version

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<v Speaker 2>of chat Chipity, which was Chatchiput four O, which was

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<v Speaker 2>very popular because it was notoriously sycophantic.

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<v Speaker 4>It was always saying, you know, whatever you would say.

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<v Speaker 2>Would be like, that's a great idea, you're very wise.

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<v Speaker 2>May I suggest that you do X Y Z, which

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<v Speaker 2>you know, if you think about it, For the average user,

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<v Speaker 2>that might make you feel good. Maybe that keeps you

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<v Speaker 2>a little bit on the app a little bit longer.

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<v Speaker 2>That maybe means that you want to subscribe so you're

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<v Speaker 2>not limited with your use in the free version. But

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<v Speaker 2>in some cases were people perhaps were vulnerable or just

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<v Speaker 2>for whatever reason, people were developing these very bizarre relationships

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<v Speaker 2>where you know, they were spending hours and upon hours

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<v Speaker 2>on them.

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<v Speaker 4>They were kind of.

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<v Speaker 2>Developing what people named ai psychosis, where they were talking

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<v Speaker 2>about theories of recursion and quantum physics and saying that

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<v Speaker 2>they'd uncovered secrets of the universe or new scientific discoveries

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<v Speaker 2>when they actually hadn't.

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<v Speaker 4>And so this chatbot, which was notoriously.

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<v Speaker 2>Very friendly and very very affirming, had led them down

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<v Speaker 2>this path of abnormal behavior.

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<v Speaker 4>So that was a previous chat chiput.

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<v Speaker 2>And so when open i released a new version in

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<v Speaker 2>the middle of this year, it was supposed to be

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<v Speaker 2>an improved version, but one big change that came with

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<v Speaker 2>it was that the feel of this version was different.

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<v Speaker 2>And so all of these people who have these very

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<v Speaker 2>strong relationships with the previous chat rept seemed quite happy

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<v Speaker 2>about it, because it's almost like their friend had just disappeared.

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<v Speaker 2>There was this big kind of backlash, and ultimately Sam

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<v Speaker 2>Oltman and the open ai team said, hey, we're actually

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<v Speaker 2>going to ow our new products. You know, this improved

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<v Speaker 2>product act like our previous ones, the ones that were

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<v Speaker 2>key to these strong relationships between people and the chatbot,

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<v Speaker 2>because we think that essentially, if people want that, why

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<v Speaker 2>shouldn't we give.

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<v Speaker 4>It to them.

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<v Speaker 1>Coming up, open ai claims it was founded to benefit humanity.

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<v Speaker 1>Now it's transitioned to for profit. Cam let's talk about

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<v Speaker 1>open ai. How has it changed as a company since

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<v Speaker 1>I first started.

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<v Speaker 4>So this is a really really interesting part of this

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<v Speaker 4>whole story.

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<v Speaker 2>Open ai was founded in twenty fifteen, and back then

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<v Speaker 2>it really encapitulated this idea of AI safety.

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<v Speaker 6>So we have always viewed our kind of role on

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<v Speaker 6>the world in our mission as we want to just

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<v Speaker 6>increase the innovation output of the world, and that is

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<v Speaker 6>good because it's intellectually interesting.

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<v Speaker 2>People who'd been interested in artificial intelligence had long spoken about, well,

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<v Speaker 2>what happens when artificial intelligence gets really smart? What happens

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<v Speaker 2>when it becomes capable enough to take over the world,

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<v Speaker 2>What happens when it becomes capable enough to convince people

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<v Speaker 2>that it is alive and they will form relationships with them.

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<v Speaker 2>So they had long been an interest in saying, how

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<v Speaker 2>can we not only develop this technology, but making sure

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<v Speaker 2>that when we usher in whatever this new era is,

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<v Speaker 2>it will be done in a safe way. Open ai,

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<v Speaker 2>when it was founded in twenty fifteen, was very much

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<v Speaker 2>about that. You know, even the name open ai is

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<v Speaker 2>this idea that we will be sharing all this information

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<v Speaker 2>the world. The whole point is to find out about

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<v Speaker 2>how to use AI better to share it with everyone.

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<v Speaker 2>It was founders and nonprofit and the idea that we'd

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<v Speaker 2>all be able to benefit from that as long as

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<v Speaker 2>it's done in the right way.

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<v Speaker 6>I think the only way that you kind of stay

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<v Speaker 6>in the stable configuration is if you can have a

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<v Speaker 6>lot more innovation and everyone's life can get better every year,

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<v Speaker 6>and you have to growth that way.

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<v Speaker 4>So that's what we'd like to do.

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<v Speaker 2>And so that was seven years a century of the

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<v Speaker 2>company not producing any consumer products. It was putting out

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<v Speaker 2>research developing technologies until twenty twenty two when it released

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<v Speaker 2>chat jipt at the end of the year.

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<v Speaker 4>You know, now the.

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<v Speaker 2>Most fastest growing consumer product of all time. It now

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<v Speaker 2>has like eight hundred million users. It's got contracts with businesses,

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<v Speaker 2>it has actually signed its first contract with the Australian

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<v Speaker 2>federal government.

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<v Speaker 7>The government's job which we embrace, the responsibility that we

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<v Speaker 7>embraces to find that middle path so that we can

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<v Speaker 7>get all of the game changing benefits from artificial intelligence

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<v Speaker 7>in our economy and in our society without dismissing or

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<v Speaker 7>ignoring the risks including.

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<v Speaker 2>But at the same time, it's a company almost caught

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<v Speaker 2>between its past and its future, where it was like

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<v Speaker 2>we're going to do things safely, we're going to do

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<v Speaker 2>things slowly, we're going to help the world. Now it's

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<v Speaker 2>a very much a closed company that is producing a

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<v Speaker 2>product with the intention of making money, and it is

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<v Speaker 2>doing it in a way that it's releasing a lot

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<v Speaker 2>of features that increasingly people who are following it are

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<v Speaker 2>criticizing as being very unsafe. But it is a long

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<v Speaker 2>way from that early company who said let's be careful,

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<v Speaker 2>let's do things in a way to kind of help others,

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<v Speaker 2>to we're competing, we have to be the first because

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<v Speaker 2>if we don't, someone else will be and that's our

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<v Speaker 2>commercial loss.

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<v Speaker 1>And it's now a far more creative space with a

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<v Speaker 1>lot more competitors tell me about how they might be

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<v Speaker 1>impacting some of open AI's decisions.

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<v Speaker 4>So I mean, there's all kinds of competitors.

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<v Speaker 2>El Musk has his own competitor, Xai, which now owns

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<v Speaker 2>the company forming known as Twitter, has this consumer AI

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<v Speaker 2>product called Groc. Has very few safety guardrails. You know,

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<v Speaker 2>it for a long time, has kind of done explicit content.

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<v Speaker 2>In fact, a recent Groc version that was released a

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<v Speaker 2>couple of months ago would produce explicit images of people.

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<v Speaker 2>It will also even released like you know, a cartoon

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<v Speaker 2>anime girlfriend Avatar as its front and was trained to

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<v Speaker 2>kind of have these very erotic conversations with their users,

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<v Speaker 2>so you know, at the same time, we're having all

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<v Speaker 2>these fears about AI psychosis that chet Chepy team was

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<v Speaker 2>dealing with. El must Xai was out there being like,

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<v Speaker 2>not only do we not care about that, but we're

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<v Speaker 2>actually going to try and encourage.

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<v Speaker 4>These kind of relationships with our users.

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<v Speaker 1>And so these changes to chat GPT coming at a

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<v Speaker 1>time when the whole Internet is changing. We're seeing social

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<v Speaker 1>media age restrictions coming into place here in Australia and

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<v Speaker 1>as you say, chat GPT will start age gating its users.

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<v Speaker 1>What do you think the impact of all this will be.

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<v Speaker 2>I think it's worth pretty this in perspective that pretty

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<v Speaker 2>much as long as we've had mass communications, some kinds

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<v Speaker 2>of content has been restricted based on age. You know,

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<v Speaker 2>we've had TV ratings and movie ratings, and you know

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<v Speaker 2>they're often restricted.

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<v Speaker 4>You know, movie theaters would check your ID.

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<v Speaker 2>Or video shops would say, hey, I'm sorry, you shouldn't

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<v Speaker 2>be you know, taking a copy home of basic instinct

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<v Speaker 2>or whatever. The Internet was not really part of that

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<v Speaker 2>for the last twenty five years for a variety of reasons,

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<v Speaker 2>including the fact that for a long time it was

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<v Speaker 2>kind of niche. But now, over the last few years

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<v Speaker 2>we've kind of seen a growing push to say, hey,

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<v Speaker 2>we actually just can't let kids do whatever on the Internet.

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<v Speaker 2>And so now it's kind of seeing Australia as one

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<v Speaker 2>of the kind of leading countries in this, but many

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<v Speaker 2>now around the world and putting requirements that technology companies

0:11:49.679 --> 0:11:51.440
<v Speaker 2>need to do more than what they've done in the

0:11:51.480 --> 0:11:54.439
<v Speaker 2>past to check people's ages. We don't know exactly what

0:11:54.520 --> 0:11:56.000
<v Speaker 2>they'll be doing, but if we look at some of

0:11:56.040 --> 0:11:59.840
<v Speaker 2>the other major tech companies like Meta, like Google, they

0:11:59.880 --> 0:12:03.920
<v Speaker 2>are building things that will flag younger users and eventually,

0:12:03.920 --> 0:12:05.920
<v Speaker 2>if they believe that, they are say you've got to

0:12:05.960 --> 0:12:08.200
<v Speaker 2>do something more significant than just saying your age to

0:12:08.240 --> 0:12:09.920
<v Speaker 2>prove your age, and it may even end up being

0:12:09.960 --> 0:12:12.120
<v Speaker 2>like you've got to put in your ide I think

0:12:12.120 --> 0:12:14.240
<v Speaker 2>that we are kind of seeing this transition. The last

0:12:14.280 --> 0:12:16.440
<v Speaker 2>twenty five years of the Internet has been a blip

0:12:17.160 --> 0:12:19.480
<v Speaker 2>kind of in human history. I think from now we

0:12:19.559 --> 0:12:22.480
<v Speaker 2>are seeing the Internet will be much more firmly broken

0:12:22.520 --> 0:12:26.600
<v Speaker 2>into content that will be restricted to certain age groups.

0:12:26.679 --> 0:12:29.760
<v Speaker 1>And cam as more and more people engage with chatbots

0:12:29.760 --> 0:12:32.360
<v Speaker 1>on a regular basis, whether it be through more these

0:12:32.360 --> 0:12:35.760
<v Speaker 1>more explicit developments or otherwise, how do you think it's

0:12:35.800 --> 0:12:38.719
<v Speaker 1>going to reshape our human relationships.

0:12:39.080 --> 0:12:41.839
<v Speaker 4>What could possibly go wrong? What could possibly go wrong?

0:12:42.240 --> 0:12:44.080
<v Speaker 2>We're always alarmists, but I think we kind of have

0:12:44.120 --> 0:12:46.240
<v Speaker 2>to be, because you know, I like to think about

0:12:46.280 --> 0:12:49.400
<v Speaker 2>how technology can be used to help us. But we

0:12:49.400 --> 0:12:53.080
<v Speaker 2>shouldn't be blindly optimistic because the companies that are releasing

0:12:53.120 --> 0:12:57.520
<v Speaker 2>these products have certain incentives that aren't necessarily aligned with

0:12:57.640 --> 0:12:58.720
<v Speaker 2>incentives of you and I.

0:12:59.200 --> 0:13:00.640
<v Speaker 4>You know, open Aye, which has.

0:13:00.520 --> 0:13:03.600
<v Speaker 2>A trillion dollars of bills lined up to run these

0:13:03.679 --> 0:13:06.080
<v Speaker 2>services that it's promised, has to get people to use

0:13:06.080 --> 0:13:09.360
<v Speaker 2>its products. It has to get people to subscribe to

0:13:09.440 --> 0:13:11.800
<v Speaker 2>spend much more than they're already spending. You know, the

0:13:11.800 --> 0:13:14.640
<v Speaker 2>incentives are obviously aligned for them to be like, well,

0:13:14.640 --> 0:13:17.640
<v Speaker 2>how can we get people really valuing our products, perhaps

0:13:17.760 --> 0:13:21.360
<v Speaker 2>even addicted to our products? They and Sam Oltman said

0:13:21.400 --> 0:13:23.480
<v Speaker 2>in this original post that we started off this conversation

0:13:23.559 --> 0:13:27.800
<v Speaker 2>with we're not trying to usage max beautiful, yeah, which

0:13:27.840 --> 0:13:30.040
<v Speaker 2>is like, we're not trying to get people to maximize

0:13:30.080 --> 0:13:32.600
<v Speaker 2>the amount of time they're spending on it. But getting

0:13:32.679 --> 0:13:36.120
<v Speaker 2>chatbots to do things that take over from other parts

0:13:36.160 --> 0:13:38.360
<v Speaker 2>of your life is one way. You know, we only

0:13:38.440 --> 0:13:40.320
<v Speaker 2>have a certain amount of hours in the day, that

0:13:40.400 --> 0:13:42.520
<v Speaker 2>means less time for other things. I don't want to

0:13:42.520 --> 0:13:45.800
<v Speaker 2>be completely negative. I think there are values in this technology.

0:13:46.120 --> 0:13:49.040
<v Speaker 4>But here's the thing. I think what I always bring

0:13:49.080 --> 0:13:49.520
<v Speaker 4>it back.

0:13:49.360 --> 0:13:52.640
<v Speaker 2>To is when you have eight hundred million people using

0:13:52.640 --> 0:13:55.240
<v Speaker 2>a product, there are going to be people in that

0:13:55.280 --> 0:13:59.120
<v Speaker 2>population who are vulnerable. And my question is, in the

0:13:59.360 --> 0:14:04.800
<v Speaker 2>pursuit of maximizing profits to try and pay these enormous

0:14:04.800 --> 0:14:06.600
<v Speaker 2>bills that they have lined up that they just need

0:14:06.640 --> 0:14:11.280
<v Speaker 2>to continue existing, do those people become essentially a casualty?

0:14:11.559 --> 0:14:13.720
<v Speaker 2>Do they become the cost of doing business for a

0:14:13.760 --> 0:14:16.160
<v Speaker 2>company that still think that they're kind of doing good

0:14:16.480 --> 0:14:19.480
<v Speaker 2>and they, as the company has become more commercial, have

0:14:19.800 --> 0:14:22.840
<v Speaker 2>justified more and more of what they do is well, like, yes,

0:14:22.920 --> 0:14:25.080
<v Speaker 2>some people are falling in love with this, some people

0:14:25.320 --> 0:14:27.800
<v Speaker 2>are clearly having mental health issues, but there's a lot

0:14:27.800 --> 0:14:31.280
<v Speaker 2>of benefit for other people, so it's justified. I think

0:14:31.320 --> 0:14:33.800
<v Speaker 2>the problem is with how this company has been operating

0:14:33.960 --> 0:14:36.080
<v Speaker 2>and the danger of this technology and how the incentives

0:14:36.080 --> 0:14:39.160
<v Speaker 2>are is that will the people who run these things

0:14:39.200 --> 0:14:42.120
<v Speaker 2>become more and more blind to the vulnerable people say

0:14:42.240 --> 0:14:45.400
<v Speaker 2>they're not their problem in their pursuit of just trying.

0:14:45.040 --> 0:14:47.640
<v Speaker 4>To make their company exist. And I think that's a really,

0:14:47.680 --> 0:14:49.200
<v Speaker 4>really dangerous place to be in.

0:14:52.240 --> 0:14:54.640
<v Speaker 1>Cameron. On that happy note, thanks so much for your time.

0:14:55.080 --> 0:14:56.000
<v Speaker 4>By Potua. Thank you.

0:15:07.520 --> 0:15:10.600
<v Speaker 1>Also in the news, Jamie Mellen has become the second

0:15:10.600 --> 0:15:13.480
<v Speaker 1>female jockey to ever win the Melbourne Cup. Her win

0:15:13.640 --> 0:15:17.120
<v Speaker 1>yesterday on half Yours at Flemington came ten years after

0:15:17.160 --> 0:15:19.800
<v Speaker 1>Michelle Payne made history as the first woman to win.

0:15:20.520 --> 0:15:22.240
<v Speaker 1>Mallam said she knew she was going to win and

0:15:22.240 --> 0:15:25.080
<v Speaker 1>when she passed her husband Ben, who was also racing.

0:15:27.720 --> 0:15:30.000
<v Speaker 1>Amit's rates have been left on holds at three point

0:15:30.080 --> 0:15:33.560
<v Speaker 1>six percent. The Reserve Bank's decision not the lower rates

0:15:33.560 --> 0:15:36.760
<v Speaker 1>comes after news inflation has jumped much higher than the

0:15:36.840 --> 0:15:40.440
<v Speaker 1>RBA had expected. The RBA Governor Michelle Bullich said the

0:15:40.480 --> 0:15:43.360
<v Speaker 1>board didn't consider a cup, only reasons to hold it

0:15:43.400 --> 0:15:46.400
<v Speaker 1>where it is. The RBA Board will meet once more

0:15:46.440 --> 0:15:50.240
<v Speaker 1>this year. I'm Daniel James. This is seven AM. Thanks

0:15:50.280 --> 0:15:57.680
<v Speaker 1>for listening.