1 00:00:00,680 --> 00:00:03,520 Speaker 1: Well, we're very active managers. So we don't just sit 2 00:00:03,600 --> 00:00:05,880 Speaker 1: in and come mov bank all year and get three 3 00:00:05,920 --> 00:00:08,720 Speaker 1: and a half percent cash yield. That's not great, as 4 00:00:08,760 --> 00:00:11,360 Speaker 1: you said, I mean, what we do is actively trade 5 00:00:11,360 --> 00:00:15,920 Speaker 1: our strategy to maybe get Conwolf banks vital dividend, which 6 00:00:16,000 --> 00:00:18,160 Speaker 1: was paid a couple of months so back, and then 7 00:00:18,239 --> 00:00:20,880 Speaker 1: we'll potentially sell out of the sell down our holding 8 00:00:20,960 --> 00:00:24,000 Speaker 1: and move into other stocks paying dividends at other times 9 00:00:24,000 --> 00:00:27,200 Speaker 1: of the year. So we actively trade to try and 10 00:00:27,280 --> 00:00:30,840 Speaker 1: get capture more dividends, and that way we can generate 11 00:00:30,920 --> 00:00:33,599 Speaker 1: a lot higher income than the market, because, as you've said, 12 00:00:33,640 --> 00:00:35,879 Speaker 1: the market's income now is pretty lousy. 13 00:00:36,320 --> 00:00:37,319 Speaker 2: The reality is. 14 00:00:38,760 --> 00:00:40,840 Speaker 1: There's only so much you can do that the market 15 00:00:40,880 --> 00:00:44,840 Speaker 1: yields well cash yield actually our latest numbers of three 16 00:00:44,840 --> 00:00:47,840 Speaker 1: point seven percent. We can get a couple percent more 17 00:00:47,840 --> 00:00:50,520 Speaker 1: by doing this rotation, but as there is a limit 18 00:00:50,560 --> 00:00:53,080 Speaker 1: to how much you can get, and the reality is 19 00:00:53,120 --> 00:00:55,400 Speaker 1: we've beholden to the amount of dividends that are being 20 00:00:55,400 --> 00:00:58,560 Speaker 1: paid and we'd certainly like dividends to increase, but for 21 00:00:58,640 --> 00:01:02,840 Speaker 1: dividends to increase, earnings need to increase because that's how 22 00:01:02,880 --> 00:01:06,120 Speaker 1: companies can pay uvans and for that to happen, we 23 00:01:06,160 --> 00:01:09,640 Speaker 1: need to see the economy being stronger, and hopefully we 24 00:01:09,720 --> 00:01:13,360 Speaker 1: will see rates falling fairly stood and hopefully the economy 25 00:01:13,400 --> 00:01:15,640 Speaker 1: will start to well get back to a normal pace 26 00:01:15,640 --> 00:01:17,960 Speaker 1: of growth and companies can expand their earnings. 27 00:01:18,360 --> 00:01:21,240 Speaker 3: Have you seen any and I doubt the banks are 28 00:01:21,240 --> 00:01:24,160 Speaker 3: in this group, but have you Are you aware of 29 00:01:24,240 --> 00:01:28,840 Speaker 3: any stocks that fit that description that the yield is 30 00:01:29,280 --> 00:01:33,400 Speaker 3: healthy as good as anyone else, but their forecast, their 31 00:01:33,440 --> 00:01:37,000 Speaker 3: compound annual growth forecasts are at the level you'd like 32 00:01:37,040 --> 00:01:39,720 Speaker 3: to see the whole market. Are the companies that are 33 00:01:39,760 --> 00:01:43,520 Speaker 3: outstanding there? We don't like to give too many stock 34 00:01:43,600 --> 00:01:45,840 Speaker 3: chips of the trust. No, I don't mean this is 35 00:01:46,000 --> 00:01:48,320 Speaker 3: fact on the public record. I mean I'm thinking of someone. 36 00:01:48,840 --> 00:01:50,720 Speaker 3: I saw a piece recently where someone looked at the 37 00:01:50,760 --> 00:01:53,640 Speaker 3: whole top fifty on an income basis and who would 38 00:01:53,680 --> 00:01:59,720 Speaker 3: grow and they found three three that matched their criteria 39 00:01:59,760 --> 00:02:00,760 Speaker 3: for income growth. 40 00:02:00,800 --> 00:02:03,600 Speaker 4: I mean, that is it? That grim? 41 00:02:03,640 --> 00:02:06,600 Speaker 1: Look, it's pretty tough out there because the bank's earnings 42 00:02:06,600 --> 00:02:09,600 Speaker 1: are pretty flat, albeit they have low bad debts, so 43 00:02:09,639 --> 00:02:11,840 Speaker 1: people will worry they were going to have a collapse 44 00:02:11,880 --> 00:02:14,720 Speaker 1: at earnings, but their earnings are still fairly strong at 45 00:02:14,800 --> 00:02:17,480 Speaker 1: strong high levels, but they're not growing substantially. 46 00:02:18,080 --> 00:02:19,000 Speaker 2: Resource stocks. 47 00:02:19,360 --> 00:02:21,880 Speaker 1: Most commodity prices are down, but I would say one 48 00:02:21,919 --> 00:02:24,760 Speaker 1: are the bright areas there are going to name stocks, 49 00:02:24,800 --> 00:02:27,519 Speaker 1: but gold prices have held up very well, and the 50 00:02:27,600 --> 00:02:31,600 Speaker 1: sort some very large increases in dividends, albeit from phairly 51 00:02:31,680 --> 00:02:33,840 Speaker 1: small levels in gold stocks. 52 00:02:34,280 --> 00:02:34,520 Speaker 2: Right. 53 00:02:35,760 --> 00:02:38,400 Speaker 1: And an area that a year or two back was 54 00:02:38,440 --> 00:02:42,600 Speaker 1: struggling was the utilities, but the likes of AGL and Origin, 55 00:02:42,680 --> 00:02:44,959 Speaker 1: the prices are growing, they're starting to make more money. 56 00:02:45,080 --> 00:02:47,600 Speaker 1: And like the insurance for the last couple of years, 57 00:02:47,639 --> 00:02:51,000 Speaker 1: but it's probably getting towards the end of the insurance cycle. 58 00:02:51,080 --> 00:02:53,960 Speaker 1: But I'm sure your listeners all know the insurers have 59 00:02:54,040 --> 00:02:56,560 Speaker 1: been jacking up their prices and insurance premiums have been 60 00:02:56,600 --> 00:02:59,120 Speaker 1: growing well. One way to heats that is to be 61 00:02:59,520 --> 00:03:01,160 Speaker 1: an invest an insurance company. 62 00:03:01,800 --> 00:03:02,040 Speaker 2: Rise. 63 00:03:02,360 --> 00:03:04,360 Speaker 3: Okay, just before we go to the break, can I 64 00:03:04,400 --> 00:03:08,560 Speaker 3: ask you about the banks? Everyone got it wrong? Right, 65 00:03:08,639 --> 00:03:12,520 Speaker 3: not almost everyone? I mean, And I did some coverage 66 00:03:12,560 --> 00:03:15,200 Speaker 3: on this, and maybe I was lucky, but I remember 67 00:03:15,240 --> 00:03:17,480 Speaker 3: thinking I actually did a piece one night one weekend 68 00:03:17,480 --> 00:03:19,440 Speaker 3: and said I've just seen yet another one of these 69 00:03:19,480 --> 00:03:20,440 Speaker 3: stoff broken rodes. 70 00:03:20,520 --> 00:03:23,000 Speaker 4: Sell all your banks. And I was. 71 00:03:23,040 --> 00:03:26,239 Speaker 3: Saying to our readers, don't take this, read this in context. 72 00:03:26,240 --> 00:03:29,560 Speaker 3: This is an institutional broker dropping to institutional investors. They 73 00:03:29,560 --> 00:03:31,799 Speaker 3: trade in and out of banks. If you're a long 74 00:03:31,880 --> 00:03:34,840 Speaker 3: term heroldholder of the bank, be very careful about selling banks. 75 00:03:35,080 --> 00:03:37,640 Speaker 3: As it turned out, banks were, I mean, way better 76 00:03:37,680 --> 00:03:40,160 Speaker 3: than I thought. I thought that they just wouldn't fall, 77 00:03:40,480 --> 00:03:43,360 Speaker 3: as these brokers had suggested a few months ago, And 78 00:03:43,400 --> 00:03:45,320 Speaker 3: it turned out that not only did they not fall, 79 00:03:45,360 --> 00:03:49,400 Speaker 3: they've been absolutely maybe absolutely unbelievable, haven't they really? For 80 00:03:49,480 --> 00:03:52,360 Speaker 3: big four banks that were the business is only ticking 81 00:03:52,360 --> 00:03:56,440 Speaker 3: along really on many fronts. But the share price surging 82 00:03:56,520 --> 00:04:00,000 Speaker 3: ten twenty percent in some stage for big four banks, 83 00:04:00,680 --> 00:04:02,920 Speaker 3: and now they're still seeing so of them, which, of course, 84 00:04:03,360 --> 00:04:05,640 Speaker 3: you're right in the end, You're always right in the end. 85 00:04:05,600 --> 00:04:08,000 Speaker 3: It'll be a stop market crash some day. We're all 86 00:04:08,040 --> 00:04:09,440 Speaker 3: going to be right about that. We just don't know 87 00:04:09,560 --> 00:04:12,200 Speaker 3: when where do we stand now on banks? Do you 88 00:04:12,320 --> 00:04:16,279 Speaker 3: see them they're so important? Do you see them as 89 00:04:16,760 --> 00:04:20,320 Speaker 3: appropriately placed at these levels? 90 00:04:21,640 --> 00:04:24,159 Speaker 1: I'll first say that we didn't sell all our banks, 91 00:04:24,160 --> 00:04:26,200 Speaker 1: that's for sure. We still see there's some pretty good 92 00:04:26,240 --> 00:04:29,360 Speaker 1: dividends out of them, so I suppose we were't overweight, 93 00:04:29,400 --> 00:04:31,320 Speaker 1: but we held a sort of index weight to the banks, 94 00:04:31,320 --> 00:04:34,000 Speaker 1: so we certainly didn't get sucked into the sell them 95 00:04:34,040 --> 00:04:36,160 Speaker 1: all because there's going to be a disaster. But look, 96 00:04:36,200 --> 00:04:38,480 Speaker 1: they're certainly not cheat. You going to mean combacks now 97 00:04:38,520 --> 00:04:41,640 Speaker 1: on a price earnings ratio of twenty four are very 98 00:04:41,839 --> 00:04:42,960 Speaker 1: very low dividend yield. 99 00:04:43,760 --> 00:04:45,280 Speaker 2: They're certainly not cheap, but. 100 00:04:45,480 --> 00:04:48,760 Speaker 1: I would say that they're pretty good quality. I might 101 00:04:48,800 --> 00:04:51,440 Speaker 1: get myself into trouble here, but i'd call it a cozyologopoly. 102 00:04:51,480 --> 00:04:53,679 Speaker 1: You've got the big four banks, there's not a huge 103 00:04:53,680 --> 00:04:57,560 Speaker 1: amount of competition, they're well capitalized, they haven't got any 104 00:04:57,600 --> 00:05:00,120 Speaker 1: bad debts. So I think that the issue was go 105 00:05:00,200 --> 00:05:02,240 Speaker 1: back eighteen months ago, there was a lot of scare 106 00:05:02,320 --> 00:05:05,640 Speaker 1: mongering and people, a lot of strategists and as you said, 107 00:05:05,640 --> 00:05:08,440 Speaker 1: some of the institutional bank analysts were very negative on 108 00:05:08,560 --> 00:05:12,400 Speaker 1: banks and thought that'd have huge bad debts and it 109 00:05:12,440 --> 00:05:16,160 Speaker 1: hasn't eventuated because infrat rates haven't risen much. More Over, 110 00:05:16,200 --> 00:05:18,799 Speaker 1: they'd be pretty stable. Over the last twelve to eighteen months, 111 00:05:18,800 --> 00:05:21,599 Speaker 1: house prices have generally gone up for it. A couple 112 00:05:21,640 --> 00:05:24,080 Speaker 1: of markets have gone down a little bit, but not much. 113 00:05:24,360 --> 00:05:26,400 Speaker 1: And if you think about it, banks are a leveraged 114 00:05:26,680 --> 00:05:30,440 Speaker 1: quay on Australian property because most of their loans now 115 00:05:30,880 --> 00:05:33,240 Speaker 1: are mortgage loans and if they out in Australian housing 116 00:05:33,279 --> 00:05:36,279 Speaker 1: market is solid, then there won't be bad deads and 117 00:05:36,320 --> 00:05:39,000 Speaker 1: that's what's happened. So and I think the outlook is 118 00:05:39,040 --> 00:05:42,080 Speaker 1: still pretty good so Australian property. So I think the 119 00:05:42,080 --> 00:05:44,320 Speaker 1: Australian Bank's still pretty good. But you are paying a 120 00:05:44,360 --> 00:05:46,159 Speaker 1: lot for them. I suppose that is the issue. 121 00:05:46,320 --> 00:05:48,080 Speaker 4: Okay, very good, but take a short break. We'll be 122 00:05:48,120 --> 00:05:48,719 Speaker 4: back in a moment. 123 00:05:55,720 --> 00:05:58,840 Speaker 3: Hello, Welcome back to the Australians Money Positive podcast. I'm 124 00:05:58,920 --> 00:06:01,880 Speaker 3: James Kirby. I'm talking to doctor Don Hamson of the 125 00:06:01,920 --> 00:06:06,120 Speaker 3: Pedal Investment Management. They have a variety of funds. The 126 00:06:06,240 --> 00:06:09,599 Speaker 3: fund in particular that has triggered the invitation. You know 127 00:06:09,640 --> 00:06:12,640 Speaker 3: what I mean for Don, is there flagship fund which is. 128 00:06:12,640 --> 00:06:17,520 Speaker 1: Called a steep Place Australian Chairs Income Fund, our. 129 00:06:17,800 --> 00:06:22,080 Speaker 3: Reats, real estate investment trusts, property trusts are they included? 130 00:06:22,960 --> 00:06:26,560 Speaker 3: They're technically not shares there. Realestate trust Are they included 131 00:06:26,600 --> 00:06:27,839 Speaker 3: in your basket. 132 00:06:27,720 --> 00:06:33,040 Speaker 1: Of Yes they are because they're listed, they pay cash. 133 00:06:33,240 --> 00:06:36,320 Speaker 1: It might not be called it's called the distribution, but 134 00:06:36,360 --> 00:06:39,360 Speaker 1: it's still essentially cash being paid out. So yes, they're 135 00:06:39,400 --> 00:06:42,080 Speaker 1: in the our universe there and we have some of 136 00:06:42,160 --> 00:06:45,720 Speaker 1: them in our fund. But what they don't have generally 137 00:06:45,839 --> 00:06:49,160 Speaker 1: is freaking credits and should One of the icing on 138 00:06:49,200 --> 00:06:54,200 Speaker 1: the cake of dividends in from companies in Australia is 139 00:06:54,240 --> 00:06:57,440 Speaker 1: you get these tax credits called freaking credits, and they're 140 00:06:57,480 --> 00:06:59,599 Speaker 1: quite valuable and you don't get them with reats. 141 00:07:00,320 --> 00:07:02,960 Speaker 3: So I expect the read the property trust has to 142 00:07:03,000 --> 00:07:05,440 Speaker 3: be better basically if they like for light than the 143 00:07:05,600 --> 00:07:08,479 Speaker 3: share to get into your portfolio because it doesn't have 144 00:07:08,520 --> 00:07:10,200 Speaker 3: the franking are there? 145 00:07:10,560 --> 00:07:11,600 Speaker 4: How do you see reads right now? 146 00:07:11,640 --> 00:07:14,840 Speaker 3: Because they they're very beaten up right, everything went wrong, 147 00:07:15,600 --> 00:07:19,000 Speaker 3: everyone working from home and the interest rate's going the 148 00:07:19,040 --> 00:07:20,480 Speaker 3: wrong way on them. 149 00:07:20,600 --> 00:07:22,280 Speaker 4: So they must be promising? 150 00:07:22,440 --> 00:07:23,840 Speaker 2: Are they? At the moment? 151 00:07:24,120 --> 00:07:27,080 Speaker 4: As a sector they're starting to look good value? 152 00:07:27,120 --> 00:07:31,720 Speaker 1: That's correct, But I think COVID has still changed the world. 153 00:07:31,760 --> 00:07:34,760 Speaker 1: If I work in the center of Sydney, you're in 154 00:07:34,800 --> 00:07:38,680 Speaker 1: Melbourne and the Mondays and Fridays, it's still pretty quiet 155 00:07:38,720 --> 00:07:41,920 Speaker 1: in Sydney and Melbourne. That whether you're a coffee shop 156 00:07:41,920 --> 00:07:44,640 Speaker 1: owner or you're a building owner. If you haven't got 157 00:07:44,680 --> 00:07:47,760 Speaker 1: a lot of customers for two out of five days, 158 00:07:47,920 --> 00:07:50,000 Speaker 1: it's going to be tough to make ends meet. It's 159 00:07:50,040 --> 00:07:52,400 Speaker 1: going to be tough to charge your coffee shop at 160 00:07:52,440 --> 00:07:55,560 Speaker 1: huge rental, those sorts of things. So a lot of 161 00:07:55,560 --> 00:07:58,120 Speaker 1: people say working from home, they're hot desking, et cetera. 162 00:07:58,240 --> 00:08:00,559 Speaker 1: So what a group two don't have as much demand 163 00:08:00,640 --> 00:08:04,800 Speaker 1: for space, So that trend like it's slowly working its 164 00:08:04,800 --> 00:08:07,320 Speaker 1: way back, but there's some groups to talking it up 165 00:08:07,320 --> 00:08:09,240 Speaker 1: that they want people in five days a week, but 166 00:08:09,240 --> 00:08:12,040 Speaker 1: there's still a huge number that are probably more like 167 00:08:12,120 --> 00:08:14,520 Speaker 1: two to three days a week. And so I think 168 00:08:14,520 --> 00:08:17,280 Speaker 1: it's particularly the office area is pretty soft. Some of 169 00:08:17,320 --> 00:08:21,960 Speaker 1: the in the suburbs. In retail is looking better, but 170 00:08:22,080 --> 00:08:25,320 Speaker 1: you know, reats have been a fairly soft area. One 171 00:08:25,320 --> 00:08:26,960 Speaker 1: of the areas of one of the companies we've liked, 172 00:08:27,000 --> 00:08:30,400 Speaker 1: US has been good in group because they've they're really 173 00:08:30,480 --> 00:08:32,880 Speaker 1: a developer more than anything else, but they've called the 174 00:08:33,600 --> 00:08:36,640 Speaker 1: cycle very well and they're they're almost an AI play 175 00:08:36,679 --> 00:08:40,240 Speaker 1: in Australia because they're developing data centers around the world 176 00:08:40,320 --> 00:08:42,480 Speaker 1: and doing that very well. They've got their footprints on 177 00:08:42,520 --> 00:08:45,000 Speaker 1: it that before that they were ahead of the pack 178 00:08:45,160 --> 00:08:49,520 Speaker 1: building distribution centers for deliveries, et cetera. So they've called 179 00:08:49,559 --> 00:08:52,200 Speaker 1: it very well and from a totally termed point of view, 180 00:08:52,200 --> 00:08:54,319 Speaker 1: have been great. But they're not good from an income 181 00:08:54,360 --> 00:08:54,880 Speaker 1: point of view. 182 00:08:55,800 --> 00:09:00,320 Speaker 3: Yes, because they're so highly priced, because they're so been 183 00:09:00,320 --> 00:09:04,360 Speaker 3: so impressive for so long. Amazing company. Absolutely, Larry Goodman. 184 00:09:04,480 --> 00:09:07,480 Speaker 3: Greg Goodman has managed to not just write out all 185 00:09:07,600 --> 00:09:11,000 Speaker 3: the times of trouble in property market, but it's that 186 00:09:11,120 --> 00:09:14,000 Speaker 3: amazing thing where he seems to be able to strategically 187 00:09:14,040 --> 00:09:16,920 Speaker 3: look ahead and then execute on that and get it right. 188 00:09:17,360 --> 00:09:20,920 Speaker 3: And if you get the strategy right on very big companies, 189 00:09:20,920 --> 00:09:22,320 Speaker 3: as we all know, you can get a lot of 190 00:09:22,320 --> 00:09:25,440 Speaker 3: things wrong if you get the strategy right. So just 191 00:09:25,440 --> 00:09:27,640 Speaker 3: one last thing on the property trust and it sounds 192 00:09:27,679 --> 00:09:30,600 Speaker 3: to me like you're not exactly scooping them up as 193 00:09:30,679 --> 00:09:35,959 Speaker 3: bargains out there. I mean, Goodman, as you say, is exceptional. 194 00:09:36,000 --> 00:09:40,720 Speaker 1: Really yeah, No, we're not significantly increasing our exposure, that's 195 00:09:40,720 --> 00:09:43,040 Speaker 1: for sure there. And as the fact that they don't 196 00:09:43,040 --> 00:09:45,920 Speaker 1: have Frankie means they're sort of unattractive from a your 197 00:09:46,000 --> 00:09:48,240 Speaker 1: point of view. And that's an interesting thing is that 198 00:09:48,440 --> 00:09:50,840 Speaker 1: whilst our fund is called an income fund, we also 199 00:09:50,960 --> 00:09:53,800 Speaker 1: try it out for so it's not all about income. 200 00:09:53,840 --> 00:09:56,440 Speaker 1: And as I mentioned before, if I think most people 201 00:09:56,520 --> 00:09:58,679 Speaker 1: as health CBA stock are very happy, that's training one 202 00:09:58,720 --> 00:10:01,120 Speaker 1: hundred and thirty five dollars. The yields stay down a bit, 203 00:10:01,160 --> 00:10:04,000 Speaker 1: but tighter return terms. You've actually done very well out 204 00:10:04,040 --> 00:10:06,880 Speaker 1: of the last twelve months out of a the banks. 205 00:10:06,960 --> 00:10:08,480 Speaker 4: Really all right, Look, we take a break. 206 00:10:08,520 --> 00:10:11,080 Speaker 3: We's got some great questions off which are very suitable 207 00:10:11,440 --> 00:10:13,840 Speaker 3: she rates, especially for you. So we'll be back in 208 00:10:13,840 --> 00:10:22,679 Speaker 3: a moment. Hello, Welcome back to the Australian's Money Puzzle podcast. 209 00:10:22,840 --> 00:10:26,040 Speaker 3: James Kirvey here with Don Hampson of the Plato Group, 210 00:10:26,040 --> 00:10:30,000 Speaker 3: and we're talking all things dividends and income on the 211 00:10:30,040 --> 00:10:33,920 Speaker 3: Australian market, which as I say, is so important on 212 00:10:33,960 --> 00:10:39,040 Speaker 3: the Australian market because we have franking credits, which means 213 00:10:39,080 --> 00:10:42,880 Speaker 3: that your income is always better than it seems. And 214 00:10:43,000 --> 00:10:47,040 Speaker 3: if your bank pays four percent, in fact in reality 215 00:10:47,160 --> 00:10:49,760 Speaker 3: it's probably five or six percent to you. If you're retired, 216 00:10:49,760 --> 00:10:51,960 Speaker 3: it's even higher. I remember, the less tax you pay them, 217 00:10:52,000 --> 00:10:56,120 Speaker 3: the better they are, which was a point great, a 218 00:10:56,120 --> 00:10:59,520 Speaker 3: point of big contention recent election, but I think everyone 219 00:10:59,600 --> 00:11:03,200 Speaker 3: learned from that about franking credits and how they were Now. 220 00:11:03,520 --> 00:11:06,959 Speaker 3: The first question is from ran Jan and he says, 221 00:11:07,320 --> 00:11:11,800 Speaker 3: I like this question. There are often reports about meetings 222 00:11:11,840 --> 00:11:16,640 Speaker 3: between analysts and management of listed companies, and after these meetings, 223 00:11:16,679 --> 00:11:20,080 Speaker 3: the analysts publish their notes to their clients. The notes 224 00:11:20,160 --> 00:11:23,960 Speaker 3: are picked up by the media, and small investors like 225 00:11:24,040 --> 00:11:30,920 Speaker 3: me do not get such access, and he wonders, basically, 226 00:11:30,960 --> 00:11:33,320 Speaker 3: do this is this reflected in this share price? And 227 00:11:33,360 --> 00:11:35,680 Speaker 3: this is the whole thing fair. He also mentions the 228 00:11:35,679 --> 00:11:38,400 Speaker 3: fact that he does podcast while he's ironing. I will 229 00:11:38,440 --> 00:11:40,400 Speaker 3: be got lots of ironing to do, rand Jan, because 230 00:11:40,400 --> 00:11:42,719 Speaker 3: it's a half an hour long podcastle I used to 231 00:11:42,720 --> 00:11:45,160 Speaker 3: make out that it was about three minutes per shirt. 232 00:11:45,559 --> 00:11:48,560 Speaker 3: That was always my ruler on the ironing. We were 233 00:11:48,559 --> 00:11:50,480 Speaker 3: always asking people, don't what they do when they're listening? 234 00:11:50,480 --> 00:11:52,760 Speaker 3: You see so so rad John studs out. We haven't 235 00:11:52,760 --> 00:11:55,280 Speaker 3: had someone say they do their ironing before. Tell me 236 00:11:55,559 --> 00:11:59,240 Speaker 3: about that privileged access. It must be somewhere in the 237 00:11:59,240 --> 00:12:01,320 Speaker 3: middle there. We saw major bank recent the I mean 238 00:12:01,360 --> 00:12:04,240 Speaker 3: a big four bank banned from RBA meetings if you 239 00:12:04,240 --> 00:12:07,920 Speaker 3: don't mind, if you don't mind, because of the exact 240 00:12:08,040 --> 00:12:12,480 Speaker 3: issues like does it matter to you, professional investor, how 241 00:12:12,559 --> 00:12:13,800 Speaker 3: much have you got under management? 242 00:12:14,040 --> 00:12:17,040 Speaker 1: Ah, we're approximately seventeen billions. 243 00:12:17,400 --> 00:12:19,920 Speaker 3: Seventeen billion, that is, that is a big amount of 244 00:12:19,920 --> 00:12:22,840 Speaker 3: money under management. Do you get invited to everything you 245 00:12:23,000 --> 00:12:27,520 Speaker 3: want to In the way of these press briefings, we. 246 00:12:27,559 --> 00:12:30,079 Speaker 1: Tend to, well, it goes too many of them, actually, 247 00:12:30,160 --> 00:12:32,839 Speaker 1: because look, I think this is where the world has 248 00:12:32,920 --> 00:12:35,520 Speaker 1: changed many years ago. But in the good old days, 249 00:12:35,760 --> 00:12:38,200 Speaker 1: the view was you would go to company management, you'd 250 00:12:38,200 --> 00:12:39,720 Speaker 1: have a chat with them, and they would tell you 251 00:12:39,800 --> 00:12:42,200 Speaker 1: things that are not on the public record, and you 252 00:12:42,200 --> 00:12:46,320 Speaker 1: could get virtually access to inside information. But that's definitely 253 00:12:46,760 --> 00:12:49,160 Speaker 1: these days and as it does crack down on that, 254 00:12:49,320 --> 00:12:52,600 Speaker 1: and so there's not there shouldn't be as well, this way, 255 00:12:52,640 --> 00:12:56,360 Speaker 1: there shouldn't be any information that's sort of inside that 256 00:12:56,360 --> 00:13:00,920 Speaker 1: it's releasing. Those analyst meetings, et cetera. Would I've been 257 00:13:00,960 --> 00:13:02,680 Speaker 1: to quite a few in the past, and most of 258 00:13:02,679 --> 00:13:06,120 Speaker 1: them it's management just blowing their own trumpet to some extent, so. 259 00:13:06,200 --> 00:13:09,520 Speaker 4: Telling you how great everything is going. Yes, that's right, Yeah, 260 00:13:09,679 --> 00:13:10,720 Speaker 4: I know all too well. 261 00:13:10,920 --> 00:13:15,120 Speaker 1: Yeah, so we don't tend to spend a lot of 262 00:13:15,120 --> 00:13:18,559 Speaker 1: time there, but Ooka, I don't think it's a big 263 00:13:18,600 --> 00:13:22,320 Speaker 1: deal these days. I think maybe twenty thirty years ago 264 00:13:22,480 --> 00:13:25,920 Speaker 1: that was definitely a concern and that's why asks you 265 00:13:26,400 --> 00:13:29,280 Speaker 1: pushed the companies and made sure that they aren't disposing it. 266 00:13:29,320 --> 00:13:31,800 Speaker 1: But occasionally there might be something let's let's slip it. 267 00:13:31,840 --> 00:13:35,679 Speaker 1: If a company does do that, they should technically immediately 268 00:13:35,760 --> 00:13:38,520 Speaker 1: announce it to the market that they've said something that's. 269 00:13:39,200 --> 00:13:43,000 Speaker 3: I imagine Ranjan and all listeners. It's more an issue 270 00:13:43,040 --> 00:13:47,400 Speaker 3: with small small caps because still things are tight and 271 00:13:47,559 --> 00:13:49,920 Speaker 3: maybe not many people turn up to their briefings anyway, 272 00:13:50,080 --> 00:13:53,319 Speaker 3: they're so delighted that someone actually arrives they probably tell 273 00:13:53,360 --> 00:13:55,080 Speaker 3: the broken more than they should. That's one thing, But 274 00:13:55,080 --> 00:13:57,120 Speaker 3: then at the other level, it's stunning really that the 275 00:13:57,280 --> 00:14:01,079 Speaker 3: RBA have had issues with major banks and their briefings, 276 00:14:01,400 --> 00:14:04,160 Speaker 3: and there's always issues around that. How do you communicate 277 00:14:04,200 --> 00:14:07,760 Speaker 3: effectively to the market without giving someone privileged over another 278 00:14:08,160 --> 00:14:11,840 Speaker 3: don Is there some AI software something that you guys 279 00:14:11,840 --> 00:14:14,960 Speaker 3: can use to tune into some of these often terribly 280 00:14:15,000 --> 00:14:17,480 Speaker 3: boring three things and pick up matters. 281 00:14:18,800 --> 00:14:22,560 Speaker 1: There is, actually, yes, we do use artificial intelligence to 282 00:14:22,640 --> 00:14:27,160 Speaker 1: actually read our management transcripts to try and pick. 283 00:14:26,960 --> 00:14:28,200 Speaker 2: Out the toad all it. 284 00:14:28,400 --> 00:14:31,360 Speaker 1: But remember that and because the problem is in Australia 285 00:14:31,360 --> 00:14:34,200 Speaker 1: there are three hundred companies and we also manage global 286 00:14:34,400 --> 00:14:37,680 Speaker 1: equities as well, and they're literally that we track about 287 00:14:37,680 --> 00:14:40,920 Speaker 1: ten thousand, so there's no way anyone has a team 288 00:14:40,960 --> 00:14:42,840 Speaker 1: big enough to be able to read all of those, 289 00:14:42,960 --> 00:14:47,560 Speaker 1: and so we do our use AI techniques but also targeted. 290 00:14:47,640 --> 00:14:51,480 Speaker 1: So for instance, we'll be looking at keywords around dividends 291 00:14:51,560 --> 00:14:55,720 Speaker 1: because we are very income focused at franking credits. Right, nice, 292 00:14:56,360 --> 00:14:58,960 Speaker 1: but yeah, look at these and we've been doing this 293 00:14:59,040 --> 00:15:01,080 Speaker 1: for a number of years. This isn't something that's like 294 00:15:01,240 --> 00:15:03,280 Speaker 1: just Johnny come lately in the last twelve months when 295 00:15:03,320 --> 00:15:07,520 Speaker 1: everybody gets hyped about. We've been using these sorts of 296 00:15:07,520 --> 00:15:10,160 Speaker 1: techniques for quite a while to find out little bits 297 00:15:10,160 --> 00:15:12,480 Speaker 1: of information that might be hidden somewhere. 298 00:15:12,120 --> 00:15:13,080 Speaker 4: And that's fascinating. 299 00:15:13,400 --> 00:15:16,800 Speaker 3: It's take an enhancement of control F on the BDF 300 00:15:17,080 --> 00:15:19,320 Speaker 3: if you're looking for it for dividend. I know when 301 00:15:19,360 --> 00:15:22,120 Speaker 3: I go into the budget, I do control F super 302 00:15:22,640 --> 00:15:25,280 Speaker 3: et cetera. So okay, just one nice te on that 303 00:15:25,840 --> 00:15:28,320 Speaker 3: is it morthat is it. Do you think it's an 304 00:15:28,400 --> 00:15:31,520 Speaker 3: enhancement to your actual effectiveness. 305 00:15:32,960 --> 00:15:36,520 Speaker 1: Look, it is marginally beneficial, but I wouldn't say that 306 00:15:36,800 --> 00:15:39,440 Speaker 1: it's changing the world dramatically. And I think this is 307 00:15:39,440 --> 00:15:41,480 Speaker 1: where there's a lot of hype about AI and it's 308 00:15:41,520 --> 00:15:42,960 Speaker 1: going to make no one's going to have a job 309 00:15:43,000 --> 00:15:44,600 Speaker 1: and all that sort of stuff. But the reality is 310 00:15:44,800 --> 00:15:46,760 Speaker 1: you need to be very cautious the way you use it, 311 00:15:47,280 --> 00:15:50,400 Speaker 1: and I think the benefits are still relatively marginal. 312 00:15:50,440 --> 00:15:52,360 Speaker 2: Now maybe over time. 313 00:15:52,280 --> 00:15:55,480 Speaker 1: I'll definitely get better and etcetera. But you need to 314 00:15:55,520 --> 00:15:58,480 Speaker 1: be very careful how you use it, and at the 315 00:15:58,520 --> 00:16:02,920 Speaker 1: moment the results, yeah, marginal. There's a benefit in doing it, 316 00:16:02,960 --> 00:16:04,960 Speaker 1: but it's not chalk and cheese. 317 00:16:05,800 --> 00:16:06,520 Speaker 4: Very interesting. 318 00:16:06,640 --> 00:16:08,680 Speaker 3: I read a terrific piece in the Wall Street Journal 319 00:16:08,920 --> 00:16:13,920 Speaker 3: last weekend where one of the chiefs of AI at Meta, 320 00:16:14,520 --> 00:16:17,720 Speaker 3: who is also a famous economist in his own right, 321 00:16:18,440 --> 00:16:22,200 Speaker 3: said that AI that at the current levels of AI 322 00:16:22,800 --> 00:16:26,320 Speaker 3: were no more intelligent than the average housecat, which was 323 00:16:26,320 --> 00:16:29,359 Speaker 3: an extraordinary thing to say for someone who was in 324 00:16:29,400 --> 00:16:31,800 Speaker 3: the head of AI at Meta. Now that's as simple 325 00:16:31,840 --> 00:16:34,280 Speaker 3: as it sounds, but he was making the point that 326 00:16:34,360 --> 00:16:38,240 Speaker 3: many were overestimating its impact and if he's right. If 327 00:16:38,240 --> 00:16:41,000 Speaker 3: he's right, of course, then you got to question a 328 00:16:41,000 --> 00:16:44,800 Speaker 3: lot of the heat around AI stocks in Nvidia or 329 00:16:44,840 --> 00:16:48,160 Speaker 3: even you just mentioned Goodman or next D seats, et cetera. 330 00:16:48,240 --> 00:16:50,600 Speaker 3: But we'll come to that another time because we've had 331 00:16:50,600 --> 00:16:53,360 Speaker 3: some specialists on AI. All right, thank you for the question, 332 00:16:53,400 --> 00:16:56,760 Speaker 3: manj and really good topic there. And this is in 333 00:16:56,760 --> 00:16:59,840 Speaker 3: information only. Everybody you know that it's not advice. Okay, 334 00:17:00,000 --> 00:17:03,920 Speaker 3: scific question from Josh. Is there growth left in Transurban 335 00:17:04,080 --> 00:17:09,560 Speaker 3: over five years? It's down eight percent? Small dividend. Interesting question, Josh. Now, 336 00:17:09,560 --> 00:17:12,919 Speaker 3: Transurban was very much one of the very much like 337 00:17:13,119 --> 00:17:17,440 Speaker 3: basically the banks, the two supermarket groups if you were 338 00:17:17,440 --> 00:17:20,880 Speaker 3: so inclined and prepared for the cyclicality, the two big miners, 339 00:17:21,320 --> 00:17:24,720 Speaker 3: and then Transurban. They really were the backbone for dividend 340 00:17:24,720 --> 00:17:28,440 Speaker 3: players in the share market. Transurbent, I look at the 341 00:17:28,480 --> 00:17:30,520 Speaker 3: stock and I see it's been doing nothing for years. 342 00:17:30,520 --> 00:17:32,280 Speaker 3: I see that it was a fabulous stock for a 343 00:17:32,320 --> 00:17:32,720 Speaker 3: long time. 344 00:17:33,440 --> 00:17:34,080 Speaker 4: It's differ in. 345 00:17:34,119 --> 00:17:37,439 Speaker 3: Deed as I recall, it's about four it's actually more 346 00:17:37,520 --> 00:17:39,840 Speaker 3: or less the same as the market, So there's nothing 347 00:17:39,840 --> 00:17:40,800 Speaker 3: particularly wrong with it. 348 00:17:41,280 --> 00:17:42,400 Speaker 4: Have you any view on it? 349 00:17:42,960 --> 00:17:44,199 Speaker 2: Done well? 350 00:17:44,240 --> 00:17:47,360 Speaker 1: Again, it doesn't have franking, so that makes it less 351 00:17:47,359 --> 00:17:48,280 Speaker 1: attractive for us. 352 00:17:48,480 --> 00:17:49,679 Speaker 2: I mean, you look at it, it's. 353 00:17:50,119 --> 00:17:53,360 Speaker 1: Essentially owns to roads and so what you need is 354 00:17:53,560 --> 00:17:55,439 Speaker 1: either more cars on the road or they need to 355 00:17:55,480 --> 00:17:59,119 Speaker 1: lift their prices in their Yeah, those process generally a 356 00:17:59,200 --> 00:18:01,720 Speaker 1: link to inflation in some of their roads. 357 00:18:01,480 --> 00:18:03,840 Speaker 2: To have a bit more ability to do it. 358 00:18:04,240 --> 00:18:06,560 Speaker 1: But I think COVID, now it's four and a half 359 00:18:06,640 --> 00:18:09,520 Speaker 1: years ago, but showed that at least thing the safe, 360 00:18:09,560 --> 00:18:10,720 Speaker 1: as safe as gold. 361 00:18:10,920 --> 00:18:14,480 Speaker 2: It's demand can change, and maybe. 362 00:18:14,240 --> 00:18:16,080 Speaker 1: It's still a long way away, but if we have 363 00:18:16,119 --> 00:18:19,040 Speaker 1: self driving cars or other things, maybe there'll be more 364 00:18:19,040 --> 00:18:19,560 Speaker 1: cars on the road. 365 00:18:19,600 --> 00:18:20,920 Speaker 2: Maybe it'll be less cars on the road. 366 00:18:21,000 --> 00:18:23,240 Speaker 4: So if he knows what, it's very interesting. 367 00:18:23,680 --> 00:18:26,200 Speaker 3: So so it sounds that it's not. 368 00:18:26,200 --> 00:18:26,960 Speaker 4: The stock it was. 369 00:18:29,080 --> 00:18:31,199 Speaker 1: Yeah, I think, to be honest, we've never been a 370 00:18:31,200 --> 00:18:33,520 Speaker 1: big fan because it does over the Frankie. It's not 371 00:18:33,720 --> 00:18:37,199 Speaker 1: you know, it's not as I yield. So it's relatively safe. 372 00:18:37,240 --> 00:18:39,760 Speaker 1: But safe stocks can get hurt when you have a 373 00:18:39,800 --> 00:18:40,679 Speaker 1: COVID event. 374 00:18:41,359 --> 00:18:41,720 Speaker 2: Just like you. 375 00:18:41,760 --> 00:18:44,680 Speaker 3: We're talking about that the cities on Mondays and Fridays. 376 00:18:44,760 --> 00:18:48,359 Speaker 3: I still I am still even now amazed I can 377 00:18:48,440 --> 00:18:51,720 Speaker 3: drive home on a Friday afternoons so easily. It used 378 00:18:51,720 --> 00:18:55,120 Speaker 3: to be hell and I just cruise home every Friday afternoons, 379 00:18:55,160 --> 00:18:57,520 Speaker 3: which tells me that I am among along the minority 380 00:18:57,560 --> 00:19:00,240 Speaker 3: that's in the city. All right, Nick, it's in the 381 00:19:00,240 --> 00:19:03,520 Speaker 3: turbulent start of the year for minreys mineral resources, one 382 00:19:03,520 --> 00:19:06,560 Speaker 3: of the big lithium players. Huge price drop followed by 383 00:19:06,640 --> 00:19:12,280 Speaker 3: mixed headlines. Do you see bride prospects from minrays and lithium? Well, 384 00:19:13,200 --> 00:19:15,960 Speaker 3: Rio Tinto certainly see bright prospects. And they just paid 385 00:19:16,000 --> 00:19:19,160 Speaker 3: a hell of a lot for the Arcadian lithium operation. 386 00:19:19,280 --> 00:19:21,080 Speaker 3: I mean a lot more than anyone thought it was worth. 387 00:19:21,680 --> 00:19:24,320 Speaker 3: It's obviously worth a lot to Rio because they can 388 00:19:24,440 --> 00:19:28,160 Speaker 3: kno get into the sixtra ordinary fantastic in the global 389 00:19:28,520 --> 00:19:32,439 Speaker 3: mining compendium of resources that they have. Where are you 390 00:19:32,440 --> 00:19:34,600 Speaker 3: on the miners, I know they're sickrely go when they're good. 391 00:19:34,600 --> 00:19:37,800 Speaker 3: They're really good, aren't they? As dividend pairs? And then 392 00:19:38,000 --> 00:19:41,040 Speaker 3: they really topple over. What do you what's your views? 393 00:19:43,160 --> 00:19:45,600 Speaker 1: Well, what'll be flipping answer a bit. I mean mine 394 00:19:45,680 --> 00:19:47,520 Speaker 1: is already gonna be as good as the one of 395 00:19:47,520 --> 00:19:50,840 Speaker 1: the processes that they are. And in the last twelve 396 00:19:50,920 --> 00:19:53,480 Speaker 1: to eighteen months has been a big fall lithium process 397 00:19:53,560 --> 00:19:57,800 Speaker 1: because evs haven't Demand hasn't been as strong as people thought. 398 00:19:57,920 --> 00:19:59,240 Speaker 2: Aubrids are actually become. 399 00:19:59,119 --> 00:20:03,040 Speaker 1: More think more in vogue than evs, and there's been 400 00:20:03,080 --> 00:20:04,840 Speaker 1: a lot of supply because there is a lot of 401 00:20:04,840 --> 00:20:07,880 Speaker 1: lithium around the world. They also have iron oreso iron 402 00:20:07,880 --> 00:20:10,800 Speaker 1: ore prices are also down, so there are two main 403 00:20:10,920 --> 00:20:14,560 Speaker 1: commodities are going against them. I'm probably more bullish in 404 00:20:14,600 --> 00:20:18,000 Speaker 1: the longer term because I think we will eventually get 405 00:20:18,080 --> 00:20:21,720 Speaker 1: to a worded world of electric cars and pat Memal 406 00:20:21,800 --> 00:20:23,960 Speaker 1: Resources itself is going to electrify a lot of its 407 00:20:24,000 --> 00:20:27,840 Speaker 1: operations and reduce submissions. I think iron ore prices probably 408 00:20:27,880 --> 00:20:30,679 Speaker 1: will come back in the longer term because it's not 409 00:20:30,720 --> 00:20:34,520 Speaker 1: all about China. I think the prospects for I'm talking 410 00:20:34,560 --> 00:20:38,040 Speaker 1: the very long term here is India, but there might 411 00:20:38,080 --> 00:20:41,199 Speaker 1: be so many years before India sort of the demand 412 00:20:41,200 --> 00:20:45,400 Speaker 1: from India ossets potentially softer demand from China below. China 413 00:20:45,440 --> 00:20:48,160 Speaker 1: has been doing a few things to increase their their 414 00:20:48,160 --> 00:20:49,720 Speaker 1: GDP recently. 415 00:20:50,160 --> 00:20:51,760 Speaker 4: Yes, yeah, absolutely, all right. 416 00:20:52,359 --> 00:20:55,800 Speaker 3: One last question from Michael, and it's about ETFs, which 417 00:20:55,880 --> 00:20:58,320 Speaker 3: I imagine you hear a lot of both done as it 418 00:20:58,400 --> 00:21:03,120 Speaker 3: used of ETFs though Jack Bogel's books, Jeff Bogel being 419 00:21:03,160 --> 00:21:06,919 Speaker 3: the original of the species here, he basically created the 420 00:21:06,920 --> 00:21:09,800 Speaker 3: index fund and then created Vanguard, which is by the way, 421 00:21:09,840 --> 00:21:13,320 Speaker 3: I'm mutual. I always said, that's amazing. It's not as 422 00:21:13,320 --> 00:21:18,439 Speaker 3: a mutualized operation. Okay, So here's his point. What I 423 00:21:18,480 --> 00:21:22,520 Speaker 3: find amazing is commentators keep preferring to buying index funds 424 00:21:22,560 --> 00:21:24,920 Speaker 3: as a way of getting average returns. But in Jeff 425 00:21:24,920 --> 00:21:28,520 Speaker 3: Bogel's words, it's not delivering average returns. If you're investing 426 00:21:28,560 --> 00:21:30,840 Speaker 3: for ten years, you're guaranteeing yourself to be in the 427 00:21:30,840 --> 00:21:34,720 Speaker 3: top fifteen percent of returns. It's a really compelling message. 428 00:21:34,960 --> 00:21:39,840 Speaker 3: So many plusses about ETFs, and we met regularly mentioned 429 00:21:39,880 --> 00:21:42,920 Speaker 3: them on the show. So many negatives too, which don't 430 00:21:42,960 --> 00:21:45,680 Speaker 3: get mentioned on generally, but they get mentioned on this show. 431 00:21:46,040 --> 00:21:48,159 Speaker 3: Among the fact that you're buying all the rubbish and 432 00:21:48,200 --> 00:21:51,480 Speaker 3: all the dross on every market, Among the fact that 433 00:21:51,520 --> 00:21:55,960 Speaker 3: you're ethically oblivious to what you're buying, Among the fact 434 00:21:55,960 --> 00:21:58,800 Speaker 3: that you're buying the stock that's completely widely overpriced. You 435 00:21:58,880 --> 00:22:01,080 Speaker 3: got to keep buying it because the ETF must do 436 00:22:01,119 --> 00:22:03,840 Speaker 3: it because it must reflect the index. There are weaknesses 437 00:22:03,880 --> 00:22:09,439 Speaker 3: there with ETFs. When someone says to you, I like 438 00:22:09,520 --> 00:22:12,800 Speaker 3: your idea. I love this idea of you focusing in 439 00:22:12,840 --> 00:22:15,080 Speaker 3: an expert way with an expert team behind you on 440 00:22:15,440 --> 00:22:19,240 Speaker 3: Australian high dividend shares. When someone says, why don't I 441 00:22:19,320 --> 00:22:23,439 Speaker 3: just buy a dividend DTF, what is your well rehearsed 442 00:22:23,480 --> 00:22:24,720 Speaker 3: response to that DN. 443 00:22:26,720 --> 00:22:30,200 Speaker 1: Well, maybe we're in the top fifteen percent ourselves because 444 00:22:30,240 --> 00:22:34,000 Speaker 1: we've out formed the index over the thirteen years since 445 00:22:34,160 --> 00:22:37,840 Speaker 1: they've played our stranger's income funders being willing after fees. 446 00:22:38,000 --> 00:22:40,199 Speaker 1: So we've bet an index. But I would say that 447 00:22:40,800 --> 00:22:44,000 Speaker 1: includes the franking. But we compare ourselves with an index 448 00:22:44,040 --> 00:22:46,520 Speaker 1: that obviously includes franking as well, so that it's apples 449 00:22:46,520 --> 00:22:49,879 Speaker 1: with apples. Of course, I think a lot of the 450 00:22:49,920 --> 00:22:51,520 Speaker 1: other thing I would say is I think a lot 451 00:22:51,560 --> 00:22:55,520 Speaker 1: of that Jack Bogel stuff is based on US share markets, 452 00:22:55,600 --> 00:22:58,480 Speaker 1: where I think it is tougher to app form the 453 00:22:58,520 --> 00:23:01,679 Speaker 1: index for active managers, where particularly if you look at 454 00:23:01,680 --> 00:23:04,480 Speaker 1: the wholesale surveys in Australia, there's quite a few a 455 00:23:04,520 --> 00:23:08,959 Speaker 1: lot of Australian chair managers have actually outperformed. 456 00:23:08,320 --> 00:23:09,320 Speaker 2: Over the longer term. 457 00:23:09,760 --> 00:23:12,760 Speaker 1: Those are before fees though, so fees are very important. 458 00:23:12,920 --> 00:23:15,440 Speaker 1: So if you think you're investing acive manager, but they've 459 00:23:15,440 --> 00:23:18,439 Speaker 1: got egreges fees and performance fees and other things on 460 00:23:18,480 --> 00:23:20,239 Speaker 1: top of that, you want to be careful about how 461 00:23:20,280 --> 00:23:21,040 Speaker 1: much they're charging. 462 00:23:21,720 --> 00:23:24,879 Speaker 3: Okay, very good, terrific. Look, thank you very much for 463 00:23:24,920 --> 00:23:26,440 Speaker 3: being on the show. I know it would be good 464 00:23:26,480 --> 00:23:30,159 Speaker 3: and we had a great discussion on this issue. The 465 00:23:30,200 --> 00:23:35,080 Speaker 3: dividend picture is changing. It's a paradox maybe that it's 466 00:23:35,160 --> 00:23:38,399 Speaker 3: changing because the share prices of the banks have finally 467 00:23:38,400 --> 00:23:42,360 Speaker 3: lifted after many years ago doing nothing. But it creates 468 00:23:42,400 --> 00:23:44,480 Speaker 3: new issues and it was great to talk. 469 00:23:44,359 --> 00:23:48,080 Speaker 4: About that today. Thank you, Don Thank you James. Love 470 00:23:48,240 --> 00:23:48,760 Speaker 4: to have you on. 471 00:23:48,840 --> 00:23:52,480 Speaker 3: All right, folks, keep those emails running. I could do 472 00:23:52,600 --> 00:23:55,200 Speaker 3: with some more questions. It comes in waves. I had 473 00:23:55,240 --> 00:23:57,920 Speaker 3: too many. Now I have some spared capacities, so let's 474 00:23:57,920 --> 00:24:04,160 Speaker 3: have them. The money Puzzle Australian dot com dot au. Questions, comments, observations, 475 00:24:04,440 --> 00:24:08,920 Speaker 3: even complaints all welcome. And as I said, next week, 476 00:24:08,960 --> 00:24:11,320 Speaker 3: I'm going to have a bit of frank with Alex 477 00:24:11,560 --> 00:24:16,200 Speaker 3: Moffatt because he was on the desk the day the 478 00:24:16,240 --> 00:24:19,439 Speaker 3: Australians woke up in October nineteen eighty seventy here that 479 00:24:19,520 --> 00:24:24,359 Speaker 3: the share markets had fallen twenty five percent overnight. That 480 00:24:24,680 --> 00:24:27,640 Speaker 3: is something that a lot of people can't even imagine. 481 00:24:27,680 --> 00:24:29,359 Speaker 4: We're going to talk about that next week. Talk to 482 00:24:29,400 --> 00:24:29,760 Speaker 4: you soon.